[09:41] <GPenguin> popey: so you want the entire story to be repeated on this channel?
[09:41] <popey> I kickbanned GPenguin because I believe him to be Patrick Frank
[09:42] <popey> from #ubuntu-uk that is
[09:42] <popey> if he has a problem with that, then he should take it up with the people who run this channel
[09:42] <popey> I am not willing to discuss it further until someone else steps in
[09:42] <GPenguin> [10:39] <GPenguin> popey: and then you seriously wonder why people react in a rude way to such violent attitude?
[09:42] <GPenguin> [10:40] <popey> GPenguin is I believe a certain patrick frank
[09:42] <GPenguin> [10:40] <popey> I kickbanned him from #ubuntu-uk
[09:42] <GPenguin> [10:40] <GPenguin> popey: you make up wild guesses about my real name and take violent action based on wild assumptions while there was no need to be massive
[09:42] <GPenguin> [10:40] <GPenguin> popey: thats not just unhealthy attitude, thats abusive
[09:42] <GPenguin> [10:41] <popey> raise it with the irc ops if you have an issue with me
[09:42] <GPenguin> [10:41] <GPenguin> popey: and the irony is that you claim Patrick Frank was rude because of such abuse
[09:42] <GPenguin> [10:41] <tonyyarusso> popey: loco stuff is handled in #ubuntu-irc now - this channel is just for #ubuntu, #kubuntu, et al and their offtopics
[09:42] <GPenguin> [10:41] <popey> oh ok
[09:42] <GPenguin> [10:41] <GPenguin> popey: why would i be interested in further escalation? i follow your invite to this channel to talk to you after you banned me without any reason
[09:42] <GPenguin> [10:41] <popey> GPenguin: take it to #ubuntu-irc :)
[09:43] <GPenguin> so the case is open
[09:45] <GPenguin> popey: are you at least aware that _you_ are escalating a peaceful situation?
[09:45] <Tm_T> hm?
[09:45] <Tm_T> GPenguin: peaceful situation and kickban doesn't fit
[09:45] <GPenguin> Tm_T: whats your role in the ubuntu community, please?
[09:46] <Tm_T> GPenguin: I'm the Overseer, but that doesn't matter
[09:46] <GPenguin> i was having peaceful smalltalk on #ubuntu-uk and popey banned me with the comment "i suspect you are Patrick Frank". then invited me to #ubuntu-ops where he told he wont discuss. then invited me to #ubuntu-irc
[09:47] <Tm_T> yes
[09:47] <GPenguin> Tm_T: it does matter if i talk to the right person or some random popey fanboy
[09:47] <Tm_T> no, I'm not any fanboy, sorry
[09:47] <GPenguin> good. so there is a chance that you manage this situation in a professional way
[09:48] <GPenguin> and to make this clear from the beginning. i am not claiming the right to be on #ubuntu-uk. since popey shows this hostile attitude i dont care to be there. what i care about is the abusive attitude
[09:48] <Tm_T> GPenguin: anyway, if popey or other ops in this channel discuss this matter with you, then do, if not, I can't help you other than point you to ubuntu irc council
[09:49] <GPenguin> Tm_T: so you want me to spend time and efforts outside of IRC to deal with some abusive jerk on IRC?
[09:50] <GPenguin> Tm_T: the behaviour of popey meets the classic "harassment policy"
[09:50] <Daviey> GPenguin: Please refrain from calling -uk operators jerks
[09:50] <GPenguin> Tm_T: and i expect this to be fixed where the problem occurs
[09:50] <Tm_T> GPenguin: unfortunately I can't help you other way, as I don't have nor like to have powers to "fix them"
[09:51] <GPenguin> Tm_T: i have seen network operators who k-line for the behaviour what popey did
[09:51] <Tm_T> GPenguin: then talk to them?
[09:51] <Daviey> GPenguin: if you are infact Patrick Frank - you are supposed to be on a kline
[09:51] <GPenguin> Tm_T: simple question: what is the purpose of this channel here?
[09:51] <GPenguin> Daviey: says who?
[09:52] <Tm_T> GPenguin: talk and collaboration between irc operators of loco channels
[09:52] <GPenguin> Tm_T: why was i invited to
[09:52] <Tm_T> GPenguin: we don't hold power over each other usually
[09:52] <GPenguin> Tm_T: why was i invited to #
[09:52] <Daviey> oh come on, you know as well as the rest of us that you are supposed to be klined
[09:52] <Daviey> Shall we ask freenode staff?
[09:52] <GPenguin> Tm_T: why was i invited to #ubuntu-ops first and then taken from there to this channel then?
[09:52] <Tm_T> GPenguin: to discuss this matte
[09:52] <popey> actually i asked him to come here to _escalate_ the matter
[09:52] <Tm_T> Daviey: please do if needed :))
[09:52] <GPenguin> Tm_T: and the discussion is where?
[09:52] <popey> I do _not_ want to discuss it and I'd rather the other -uk ops didnt either
[09:53] <popey> its a monumental waste of time
[09:53] <popey> but your time, so up to you
[09:53] <Daviey> Tm_T: asked one staffer
[09:53] <Tm_T> GPenguin: like to discuss it now? ok, first calm down
[09:53] <Tm_T> popey: I'll try :))
[09:53] <GPenguin> popey: right. you are intriguing to see a person k-lined. thats pretty weak ethics to be honest
[09:53] <GPenguin> Tm_T: calm down if somebody behaves like a jerk?
[09:53] <Tm_T> GPenguin: yes
[09:54] <GPenguin> popey: what do you think the community says about your ethics?
[09:54] <Tm_T> GPenguin: because if you do not, you might end up being a jerk yourself, I'm not qualified to say are you already
[09:54] <GPenguin> popey: do you think your ethics meet the Ubuntu Code of Conduct?
[09:54] <GPenguin> popey: or are you that much of a celebrity these days that such a Code of Conduct does not apply to you anymore?
[09:55] <GPenguin> popey: you say you want escalation?
[09:55] <Tm_T> since when popey has become celebrity? =)
[09:55] <GPenguin> popey: you want me to pick up this challenge?
[09:55] <GPenguin> popey: you want escalation so you can cry later that i was escalating a harmless situation?
[09:55] <Tm_T> GPenguin: anyway, thus far you have only tried to make huge fight rather than discuss
[09:55] <popey> GPenguin: I have already suggested what I think you should do
[09:56] <GPenguin> Tm_T: i tried to fight or popey?
[09:56] <popey> take it to the irc council GPenguin
[09:56] <Tm_T> GPenguin: you, calm down, son
[09:56] <GPenguin> popey: so you are actively provoking a mud fight on the council mailing lists?
[09:56] <popey> no, i am asking you to take it to the irc council
[09:56] <Tm_T> GPenguin: no, he is not asking any mud fighting
[09:56] <GPenguin> popey: again - how does that fit the Code of Conduct what you do here?
[09:57] <popey> as I have said many times, I am not willing to discuss it until you escalate it
[09:57] <popey> I believe I am too close to the issue to be impartial
[09:57] <Tm_T> GPenguin: calm down, I think I said it before already
[09:57] <GPenguin> popey: psycho logical explained what you do is begging for a punch in the face while there is no need
[09:58] <GPenguin> popey: and now think back how the situation was before you turned abusive. there was a random person on #ubuntu-uk having small talk in a friendly and peaceful way
[09:58] <Tm_T> bahhhhh
[09:58] <Tm_T> stupid borky scripts
[09:59] <popey> sorry everyone
[09:59] <Tm_T>  /remove GPenguin I said calm down
[09:59] <Tm_T> popey: thanks :))
[09:59] <Tm_T> popey: had fun for a moment there
[09:59] <Tm_T> tomaw: hi hi welcome
[09:59] <Daviey> tomaw: missed the fun :(
[10:00] <GPenguin> Ubuntu Developers invite people to #ubuntu-irc after they abused them, so other Ubuntu Developers can abuse them, too? is that the master plan? and the complaint was what again? that i turn violent on such input?
[10:00] <tomaw> hi
[10:00] <Tm_T> tomaw: ^^
[10:00] <Tm_T> GPenguin: no, no plan to abuse
[10:00] <GPenguin> tomaw: is that the deal here?
[10:00] <GPenguin> Tm_T: double check your behaviour
[10:00] <Tm_T> GPenguin: honestly, calm down, as long as you are raging around you can't discuss
[10:01] <tomaw> GPenguin: I have only just joined
[10:01] <Tm_T> GPenguin: I do my job, no abuse there
[10:01] <GPenguin> Tm_T: i am calm. even after your abusive behaviour
[10:01] <Tm_T> GPenguin: good then
[10:01] <GPenguin> Tm_T: no you dont do your job.
[10:01] <Tm_T> interesting
[10:01] <GPenguin> Tm_T: you are having ban fun like popey. and this abuse brought me to this channel
[10:02] <Tm_T> GPenguin: no, I am not having ban fun
[10:02] <GPenguin> Tm_T: i dont care that you dont value the Code of Conduct that you signed when becoming an Ubuntu Developer. i care about people who abuse me. do you get it?
[10:02] <Tm_T> GPenguin: hmm, you do make hard accusations, son :)
[10:02] <Tm_T> without any arguments
[10:03] <GPenguin> Tm_T: a start would be that you stop flooding me with crap like "calm down" while i am calm
[10:03] <Tm_T> GPenguin: good, good
[10:03] <GPenguin> Tm_T: the next step is that you dont look at me with the eyes of a ban happy jerk when i try to explain a problem
[10:03] <Tm_T> GPenguin: yes son
[10:04] <GPenguin> Tm_T: the third step is that you learn about respect and stop calling me "son", so i dont have to insult you
[10:04] <Tm_T> son, I do respect you, no need to insult
[10:04] <GPenguin> Tm_T: the basic principle about de-escalation. you play the access dude, then you should know about it
[10:04] <Daviey> GPenguin: I believe you are Paddy Frank also - for this reason i don't want you unbanned from -uk anytime soon.
[10:05] <GPenguin> Daviey: keep out of this at this point. thank you
[10:05] <GPenguin> i am sure Tm_T is mature enough to handle this on his own without support
[10:05] <Daviey> GPenguin: Would be good if you did also.
[10:05] <GPenguin> Daviey: remember - i was invited to this place after i was abused by popey
[10:06] <GPenguin> and the bottom line was "i suspect this person is Patrick Frank who was rude some months ago. so i must ban him now without cause"
[10:06] <GPenguin> do you get this so far?
[10:07] <Tm_T> GPenguin: I need some prove for this, as I can't see inside popeys head
[10:07] <GPenguin> Tm_T: ask popey to provide you a log then
[10:07] <GPenguin> i will take a break now so you have enough time to _think_ how to proceed
[10:07] <GPenguin> but be warned. i am not taking anymore abuse from anybody
[10:08] <popey> http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/2008/02/20/%23ubuntu-uk.html
[10:09] <GPenguin> post the Ubuntu Code of Conduct, too please. so all of you can re-read before you say _anything_
[10:09] <popey> I dont need to read it, I already did that.
[10:10] <Tm_T> GPenguin: ok, now I have seen this situation for some depth
[10:10] <Tm_T> GPenguin: any comments about this matter?
[10:15] <Tm_T> GPenguin: ok, I'll make some hot chocolate in the meantime
[10:15] <GPenguin> is it on me now to comment, or is the situation right now that popey has to justify, why he takes violent action based on wild assumptions?
[10:16] <Daviey> answer a question with a question?
[10:16] <GPenguin> i hope we are past the ethics of the old wild wild west days where you fire and forget
[10:17] <popey> GPenguin: what _exactly_ do you want to happen now?
[10:17] <GPenguin> the first step is that popey justifies his actions, then i will comment
[10:17] <popey> ok, here goes.
[10:17]  * Tm_T sips
[10:17] <popey> I believe that you are someone who has in the past been k-lined from freenode. I also believe that you are Paddy Frank. a) ban evasion. b) unsavoury person who makes threats to people.
[10:17] <GPenguin> popey: and try to avoid throwing mud and digging up old gossip. stick to facts
[10:18] <popey> ergo, I don't want you in the channel
[10:18] <popey> ^^ facts
[10:18] <GPenguin> yes, that is your assumption
[10:18] <popey> s/assumption/belief
[10:18]  * Daviey agrees with said belif
[10:18] <Daviey> belief*
[10:18] <GPenguin> and your IRC ethics are, that you take violent action based on assumption and belief?
[10:18] <popey> s/vilolent/appropriate
[10:18] <popey> yes
[10:19] <Tm_T> GPenguin: can you prove you are not this person they are talking about?
[10:19] <popey> i gave you an opportunity to say you were not paddy frank
[10:19] <popey> (although given you are him [IMO] that's tricky)
[10:19] <GPenguin> popey: my next question is - are you aware that _this_ is not acceptable regarding the Freenode Guidelines?
[10:19] <Daviey> and evading a k-line is?!
[10:19] <GPenguin> Tm_T: i dont have to prove anything. we are not in front of court.
[10:19] <popey> umm, you beat me - you broke guidelines by evading a kline
[10:19] <GPenguin> popey: assumption
[10:19] <Seeker`> what is "this"?
[10:20] <GPenguin> can you prove it?
[10:20] <popey> can I prove what?
[10:20] <GPenguin> and take note: i have to deal with 3 people the same time which is causing stress
[10:20] <popey> i can prove that you are paddy frank "beyond reasonable doubt" yes
[10:20] <popey> this conversation is pretty much proof
[10:20] <popey> IMO
[10:20] <Tm_T> GPenguin: if you don't have to prove, why popey have to prove? anyway, you are just attacking atm
[10:21] <popey> to be clear. I don't believe I broke the CoC, I dont believe I have gone against freenode guidelines.
[10:21] <GPenguin> popey: you dont even know the difference between assumption and proof, but you are responsible for wife and kids. and you seriously wonder that i react to such people like you with patience, politeness and non-violent communication?
[10:21] <popey> ergo, we have a difference of opinion
[10:22] <GPenguin> popey: i believe that you have to learn a lot about social ethics before you carry on playing the Free Software Developer
[10:22] <popey> take it to the irc council please
[10:22] <popey> I am done here
[10:22] <GPenguin> popey: no thanks
[10:22] <Tm_T> GPenguin: you are still just attacking, son :(
[10:22] <popey> stop wasting my time then
[10:22] <GPenguin> popey: i have better things to do than playing the mud fights low life suckers like you bring up
[10:22] <Tm_T> that is not sensible way to discuss, GPenguin
[10:23] <GPenguin> popey: and now have fun on #ubuntu-uk as the jerk that you are :-)
[10:23] <Tm_T> tomaw: isn't he lovely?
[10:23] <GPenguin> Tm_T: dont worry. i am done
[10:23] <popey> have a nice day
[10:23] <Tm_T> GPenguin: shame :(
[10:23] <GPenguin> popey: you too, sweetheart
[10:23] <popey> mwah!
[10:23] <GPenguin> popey: and never forget: the color pink is with you
[10:23] <popey> I am more of a blue person myself
[10:24] <Tm_T> he couldn't back up his words I notice, so time to retreat
[10:24] <Tm_T> anyway, to me it's look like ban-on-sight now on
[10:26] <Tm_T> why people can't sit down and talk like adults, instead of trolling and attacking untill get kille
[10:27] <Tm_T> d
[10:27] <popey> he is a special case
[10:28] <Tm_T> aren't they all? ;--P
[10:29] <Tm_T> glad I'm not a human
[10:29] <popey> :)
[10:29] <popey> hahah
[10:34] <Tm_T> what we should do to him in -classroom channels?
[10:35] <Seeker`> kick him?
[10:35] <Seeker`> he clearly isn't pleasent
[10:35] <Tm_T> who wants to do it? ;)
[10:36] <Tm_T> Seeker`: go ahead :)
[10:36] <Seeker`> ban as well?
[10:36] <Tm_T> why not
[10:36] <Seeker`> you sure?
[10:36] <Tm_T> he will come around soon enough but why not
[10:37] <Tm_T> lovely
[10:37] <popey> bah, i dont have ops in #ubuntu-doc
[10:37] <Tm_T> me neither
[10:41] <Seeker`> -10:39:06- GPenguin: more escalation that is absolutely not necessary
[10:41] <Seeker`> -10:39:18- GPenguin: you fail in understanding the Freenode Guidelines
[10:41] <Seeker`> -10:40:59- GPenguin: maybe what you do is useful to come closer to a friendship with popey
[10:41] <Seeker`> -10:41:17- GPenguin: but your behaviour creates any enemy as tradeoff
[10:42] <Seeker`> -10:41:36- GPenguin: thats not just weak ethics, thats dumb
[10:43] <Seeker`> I haven;t replied to him
[10:44] <Tm_T> nor need to
[11:40] <elektronik123> hello
[11:41] <elektronik123> halllo
[11:57] <elektronik123> hallo
[12:01] <jussi01> Hi
[12:01] <jussi01> elektronik123: you need to ask your question
[12:10] <elektronik123> i can`t join to #ubuntu-pl
[12:14] <Mez> elektronik123, you need to speak to pressenter who is the person that set your ban
[12:14] <Mez> there unfortunately is no bantracker for that channel, so I cant find out why this happened
[15:41] <jpatrick> LjL: oh, lord, no, Crysis is at it again
[15:42] <jpatrick> at least I think it's Crysis, same real name..
[15:46] <Pici> jpatrick: set a realname ban then?
[15:47] <jpatrick> Pici: don't worry, I've kicked him out and told him what he did wrong
[17:11] <Azag> ok
[17:11] <jpatrick> Azag: cuando te expulsaron?
[17:12] <jpatrick> no veo nada en el backlog..
[17:12] <Azag> hoy
[17:12] <Azag> hace 1 hora, o algo asi
[17:12] <Azag> si expulsan a alguien q usa la misma conexion me expulsan a mi?
[17:13] <jpatrick> ahhh
[17:13] <jpatrick> eso lo explica
[17:13] <jpatrick> TipXxi [n=xxy@190.160.242.238] has left #ubuntu-es [requested by jpatrick: "no spam"]
[17:14] <Azag> TipXxi es un vecino qu se cuelga de mi Wifi
[17:14] <Azag> :(
[17:14] <jpatrick> Azag: lo siento no lo quieria hacer para ti, por no se premite spam en los canales de #ubuntu*
[17:14] <jpatrick> Azag: te quito el ban ahora
[17:14] <Azag> ok, thnx
[17:14] <Azag> le voy a decir, q pare el spam, y q deje de usar mi conexion...
[17:14] <Darksiteevil> mas bien protejela
[17:15] <jpatrick> Azag: ya esta, puedes entrar en el canal
[17:15] <Azag> gracias
[17:15] <Azag> :)
[17:15] <jpatrick> lo siento por las molestias
[17:16] <Azag> ningun problema
[17:17] <Azag> gracias y nos vemos en ubuntu-es
[18:47] <no0tic> question of the day: I banned an IP. Can a cloaked user join if he connects with that iP?
[19:02] <nalioth> no0tic: no
[19:03] <no0tic> thanks
[20:11] <Myrtti> boing
[20:12] <erUSUL> Myrtti: boing www.boingboing.net home of Doctorow XD
[20:31] <LjL> no0tic: if you ban the host, yes, if you actually ban the numeric address, no
[21:17]  * P3L|C4N0 saludos