| spiv | I know it used to come up frequently, this is the first report I've seen in a while. | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| beuno | oh, could be | 00:02 |
| beuno | time is a very slippery thing lately | 00:02 |
| seydar | how does bazaar compare to git? | 00:47 |
| seydar | seriously, i have only used git, but bazaar has a cooler name | 00:47 |
| jdong | lol | 00:47 |
| fullermd | It's less salty, with more bite. | 00:47 |
| jdong | I find bzr's interface much easier to use, much more friendly | 00:47 |
| seydar | i want to name some project 'balthazaar' | 00:47 |
| jdong | it feels more high-level than git IMO | 00:47 |
| jdong | though the performance in my experience isn't as great | 00:48 |
| beuno | seydar, maybe something like this will help: http://bazaar-vcs.org/BzrVsGit | 00:48 |
| seydar | is there a sample session online? | 00:48 |
| seydar | ooh windows support. i'm not too fond of supporting windows ;-) | 00:48 |
| spiv | seydar: http://doc.bazaar-vcs.org/latest/en/mini-tutorial/index.html | 00:48 |
| spiv | seydar: that's a tutorial called "Bazaar in five minutes" | 00:48 |
| jdong | I really disliked git's way of committing things before I expected it to commit | 00:49 |
| spiv | seydar: there's other documentation at http://doc.bazaar-vcs.org/latest/ | 00:49 |
| jdong | I've recently started using git for dealing with subversion... I've found its performance to be more acceptable when paired with svn versus bzr-svn | 00:49 |
| jdong | but at the same time, I grumble about git's UI every 5 minutes | 00:49 |
| seydar | does bazaar have a witty hat, like | 00:50 |
| seydar | 'git 'er done' from larry the cable guy? | 00:50 |
| jdong | I believe they do sell t-shirts like that :) | 00:50 |
| jdong | and what's up with git's refusal to acknowledge empty directories exist? :) | 00:51 |
| seydar | i saw linus torvalds in one | 00:51 |
| * beuno wonders if igc will take the bzr tshirts to the sprint | 00:51 | |
| seydar | ok. so bazaar it is | 00:51 |
| fullermd | I think it's a side effect of refusing to acknowledge directories exist. | 00:51 |
| jdong | lol | 00:52 |
| jdong | as I said, I've been looking at git lately for my subversion interactions with large svn repos | 00:52 |
| fullermd | Actually, who DOES treat directories directly as entities? bzr does, mtn does... I don't think hg does... | 00:52 |
| bob2 | also file identity | 00:52 |
| jdong | but only because I'm kinda forced to | 00:52 |
| seydar | balthazar is such a badass name | 00:53 |
| seydar | whats mtn? | 00:53 |
| igc | beuno: igc has no idea re tshirts sorry | 00:53 |
| jdong | monotone I believe | 00:54 |
| bob2 | seydar: monotone (venge.net) | 00:54 |
| * fullermd nods. | 00:54 | |
| jdong | seydar: btw, you do acknowledge the implications of asking #bzr whether to use bzr or git, right? :D | 00:54 |
| seydar | totally | 00:55 |
| jdong | but I really do think we're giving an objective opinion, if there is ever such a thing | 00:55 |
| fullermd | Which there isn't, on most things (especially UI), because they're inherently subjective. | 00:56 |
| fullermd | I mean, Tom Lord probably thinks arch has an easy and intuitive UI ;) | 00:56 |
| jdong | haha | 00:56 |
| jdong | though I find that hard to believe! | 00:56 |
| fullermd | And he'd be right, for him. | 00:56 |
| fullermd | And most people would probably hate my GUI setup... but it's perfect for me. | 00:57 |
| bob2 | oh, and arch had directories as entities | 00:58 |
| seydar | thanks guys | 01:01 |
| === jelmer_ is now known as jelmer | ||
| beuno | igc, didn't you send an email a few months ago to send bzr tshirts for contributors? | 01:04 |
| fullermd | That was poolie I think. | 01:05 |
| igc | beuno: probably. If so, I did it on behalf of poolie | 01:05 |
| beuno | right, it was poolie. | 01:05 |
| beuno | not sure why I was convinced it was you | 01:06 |
| jelmer | it was poolie | 01:06 |
| === _Verterok_ is now known as Verterok | ||
| Peng | Right, hg doesn't version directories. | 01:45 |
| * Peng wanders off. | 01:45 | |
| awmcclain | What's the name of the other bzr GUI that isn't qbzr? wildfire or something? | 02:12 |
| spiv | wildcat, IIRC | 02:12 |
| beuno | awmcclain, or bzr-gtk? | 02:13 |
| awmcclain | wildcat! | 02:13 |
| * igc lunch | 02:26 | |
| awmcclain | Hrm. I'm guessing wildcat doesn't work with 1.2.0... I get a "file not locked" exception when I try to diff. | 03:31 |
| beuno | awmcclain, I think it's a very alpha sort-of-thing at the moment | 03:32 |
| awmcclain | And bzr-gtk is x11, right? | 03:40 |
| Verterok | awmcclain: yes | 03:41 |
| spiv | awmcclain: it should work on any platform where pygtk works | 03:41 |
| spiv | Which includes win32 I believe. | 03:41 |
| awmcclain | I'm running os x but I'm not a huge fan of the x11 emulation. :) | 03:41 |
| spiv | (Although installing it might be a bit of a hassle) | 03:41 |
| awmcclain | So... it looks like i'll have to brave pyqt | 03:42 |
| RAOF | awmcclain: There's the native OS X gtk now, right? | 03:42 |
| awmcclain | RAOF: o really? | 03:43 |
| RAOF | If you don't mind less than fully tested code. http://developer.imendio.com/projects/gtk-macosx/ is one google hit. | 03:43 |
| RAOF | I recently saw a blog post with native mac gtk screenshots, which is why I have any idea about this :). | 03:44 |
| === fullermd_ is now known as fullermd | ||
| carnage4ever | is there anyone around? | 04:46 |
| spiv | carnage4ever: yes | 04:50 |
| carnage4ever | spiv: trying to somehow get bzr to run a precommit shell script BEFORE commiting files... | 05:03 |
| carnage4ever | is that possible? | 05:03 |
| spiv | carnage4ever: it is, although you need a python plugin to do it. | 05:07 |
| spiv | carnage4ever: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/bazaar/2008q1/036955.html may help | 05:10 |
| === bigdo1 is now known as bigdog | ||
| ubotu | New bug: #196881 in bzr "Exception redirecting merge output to a file" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/196881 | 05:56 |
| === [1]carnage4ever is now known as carnage4ever | ||
| === [1]carnage4ever is now known as carnage4ever | ||
| spiv | The protocol-v3 branch is ready for dogfooding. | 08:33 |
| lifeless | cool | 08:36 |
| dholbach | heya | 08:37 |
| dholbach | what answer is there to something like http://pastebin.ca/923001 and http://rafb.net/p/6xkuJL96.html ? | 08:37 |
| spiv | dholbach: looks like a possible launchpad bug | 08:44 |
| dholbach | spiv: oh? how so? | 08:44 |
| spiv | dholbach: or maybe a bug in the launchpad plugin for the client | 08:45 |
| dholbach | is there any information I should try to get for it? | 08:46 |
| spiv | dholbach: but IIRC "lp--NNNN:..." URLs are a server-side implementation detail. | 08:46 |
| spiv | dholbach: "bzr info -v", and the actual bzr commands being run by that script | 08:46 |
| dholbach | bzr update; bzr commit -m "something" is what the script runs | 08:47 |
| dholbach | let me get the version | 08:47 |
| dholbach | spiv: http://rafb.net/p/LKucRO74.html | 08:48 |
| spiv | dholbach: yeah, I'm pretty sure it's a launchpad bug. File it against launchpad-bazaar. | 08:51 |
| spiv | dholbach: as a workaround, hobbsee should be able to "bzr switch sftp://hobbsee@bazaar.launchpad.net/%7E5-a-day/5-a-day-data/main/" | 08:52 |
| dholbach | spiv: thanks a lot | 08:54 |
| dholbach | https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad-bazaar/+bug/196913 | 08:54 |
| ubotu | Launchpad bug 196913 in launchpad-bazaar "Cannot lock LockDir(lp--1218658708:///~5-a-day/5-a-day-data/main/.bzr/branchlock): Transport operation not possible: readonly transport" [Undecided,New] | 08:54 |
| spiv | dholbach: thanks for the bug report | 08:54 |
| dholbach | de rien | 08:54 |
| spiv | dholbach: if you can get the particular bzr command that triggers the error in the bug report, that'd be good. | 08:55 |
| spiv | dholbach: or link to the add-5-a-day script | 08:56 |
| dholbach | done, thanks | 08:57 |
| lifeless | abentley: ping | 09:15 |
| lifeless | http://bundlebuggy.aaronbentley.com/request/<1203467195.15574.136.camel@lifeless-64> | 09:15 |
| lifeless | abentley: I think you had partially reviewed this | 09:15 |
| lifeless | dholbach: 5-a-day stuff should be faster now; we had some supermirror issues | 09:16 |
| dholbach | lifeless: rock and roll | 09:19 |
| dholbach | you guys kick ass | 09:19 |
| dholbach | lifeless (and others): do you think it's worth splitting up the branch into per-people-branches? (less possible locking issues)? we're at 53 committers now | 09:22 |
| lifeless | dholbach: are you having locking issues? | 09:22 |
| dholbach | lifeless: some people run into this every now and then (not that often yet, but I expect the project to grow) | 09:23 |
| lifeless | dholbach: bzr should handle it | 09:23 |
| dholbach | OK | 09:23 |
| lifeless | if it becomes a problem, then sure | 09:23 |
| dholbach | I'll keep you in the loop :) | 09:23 |
| lifeless | nag me to do 5 a day :) | 09:23 |
| dholbach | 5-a-day keeps the doctor away! :) | 09:23 |
| dholbach | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/5-A-Day#Log :) | 09:24 |
| dato | jelmer: hi. I've found the -r option for replay a tad confusing. its docs say "see help revisionspec", so I assumed it'd work as in merge, so that `replay -r 372..373` would replay just 373, but it replays both 372 and 373. -r 373 does what I want, but that's not how merge behaves. it does what -c 373 would do, but -c is not available in replay. | 09:47 |
| dato | jelmer: do you see what I mean? | 09:47 |
| lifeless | sounds cnfusing | 09:49 |
| lifeless | dato: send a patch :] | 09:49 |
| Peng | Hmm, looks like svn-import is up to something now. | 09:56 |
| * Peng wanders off, nervous of swapping to death suddenly. | 09:57 | |
| * dato wonders if --overwrite will work well when pushing to svn. | 10:06 | |
| * Peng wonders if converting 60k revisions with about 400 MB of free RAM is a good idea. | 10:08 | |
| Peng | jelmer: Man, svn-import is way too verbose. It's averaging almost one line of output per day! | 10:09 |
| dato | revno: 371 | 10:18 |
| dato | revision-id:dato@net.com.org.es-20080228115922-wi3npwo1rnfmilbg | 10:18 |
| dato | parent: dato@net.com.org.es-20080222115116-62obf3ebstr8l3lh | 10:18 |
| dato | a space has been lost after revision-id? | 10:18 |
| dato | jelmer: (also, any plans for a new bzr-svn in unstable? bzr can't migrate to testing without it) | 10:19 |
| jelmer | dato, this weekend | 10:34 |
| dato | ok | 10:35 |
| dato | jelmer: do you have a sec to tell me how/if I can solve this bzr-svn problem? | 10:35 |
| jelmer | dato: sure | 10:37 |
| dato | I had a bzr branch synced with a svn branch. my replay went bad (see above), and I replayed one more revision than desired. sadly, I pushed that to svn. | 10:38 |
| dato | so I replayed well in a copy of the bzr branch, and tried to push that (expecting to get the "branches have diverged" message), but it's just taking ages to do anything | 10:39 |
| dato | should I try with --overwrite directly, or... maybe svn rm, + svn cp -r $HEAD-2 ? | 10:40 |
| jelmer | dato: The argument to replay is a range of revisions and supporting -r272..273 to mean [272,273] makes sense to me | 10:41 |
| jelmer | dato: Patches for improvements are welcome though | 10:41 |
| jelmer | dato: It should just work | 10:41 |
| dato | what should work, sorry? | 10:41 |
| jelmer | dato: The push giving "Diverged Branches" | 10:43 |
| dato | and with --overwrite? | 10:43 |
| lifeless | jelmer: we use [from, to) for nearly everything else in bzrlib though | 10:46 |
| lifeless | jelmer: or (from, to] perhaps I should say | 10:46 |
| lifeless | jelmer: I think, that 'diff -r x..y' should show the aggreate changes that reply -r x..y will aply. | 10:46 |
| jelmer | lifeless: Yeah, consistency is also nice, indeed | 10:48 |
| === cprov-out is now known as cprov | ||
| === [1]carnage4ever is now known as carnage4ever | ||
| === [1]carnage4ever is now known as carnage4ever | ||
| === mrevell is now known as mrevell-lunch | ||
| === mrevell-lunch is now known as mrevell | ||
| === `6og is now known as Kamping_Kaiser | ||
| asabil | is it normal that bzr-bookmarks doesn't work with bzr pull ? | 14:15 |
| lifeless | I don't know, what is bzr-bookmarks? | 14:16 |
| asabil | a bzr plugin | 14:18 |
| asabil | to have bookmarks | 14:18 |
| asabil | lifeless: also the launchpad plugin doesn't work with bzr pull | 14:18 |
| asabil | bzr pull lp:~easy-radio/easy-radio/bargraph | 14:18 |
| asabil | bzr: ERROR: Not a branch: "/home/asabil/Devel/INSA/5IF/OT/easy-radio/trunk/lp:~easy-radio/easy-radio/bargraph/" | 14:18 |
| lifeless | asabil: you are missing the required dependencies for sftp for bzr | 14:41 |
| asabil | lifeless: ??? why ? I use the sftp transport all the time ? | 14:42 |
| asabil | python-paramiko is installed | 14:42 |
| lifeless | asabil: huh, interesting | 14:44 |
| lifeless | asabil: what does 'bzr plugins' list ? | 14:44 |
| asabil | svn, multiparent, launchpad, rebase, gtk, record, bzrtools, xmloutput, bookmarks | 14:45 |
| lifeless | asabil: this is very interesting. I think something is buggering up pull :) | 14:48 |
| asabil | let me disable xmloutput | 14:49 |
| asabil | no, that's not the cultpit | 14:50 |
| lifeless | bookmarks sounds like something inclined to diddle with pull | 14:51 |
| TFKyle | lifeless: there's a bug about it reported on lp iirc, pull doesn't like lp: uris | 14:52 |
| TFKyle | https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/181945 if you havn't seen it yet | 14:53 |
| ubotu | Launchpad bug 181945 in bzr "bzr pull lp:upstart fails" [High,Confirmed] | 14:53 |
| asabil | lifeless: the bug was there before I installed bookmarks | 14:53 |
| lifeless | asabil: ah, interesting | 14:57 |
| lifeless | TFKyle: thanks | 14:57 |
| lifeless | seems to be pull not handling redirects | 14:58 |
| asabil | now it seems like lp's server is stalled or something :/ | 14:59 |
| asabil | am unable to push | 15:00 |
| lifeless | asabil: checking | 15:01 |
| asabil | thanks | 15:02 |
| lifeless | asabil: yes, rogue process, fixing in a couple of minutes | 15:04 |
| lifeless | your lilnk may get bounced | 15:04 |
| asabil | oki | 15:04 |
| asabil | I interrupted already | 15:04 |
| lifeless | \asait should be faster now | 15:31 |
| Lo-lan-do | Hmmm. "bzr pack" seems to make "bzr status" *slower*. | 15:36 |
| Lo-lan-do | Not much, but a bit. | 15:37 |
| poolie | Lo-lan-do: it may be forcing things out of memory? | 15:38 |
| Lo-lan-do | I ran it several times in a row :-) | 15:38 |
| Lo-lan-do | Both before and after the pack. | 15:38 |
| Lo-lan-do | It took about 0.58s before the pack, and it now takes 0.61s. | 15:39 |
| lifeless | Lo-lan-do: pack and status use dufferent data; its almost certainly just measurement noise | 15:40 |
| lifeless | Lo-lan-do: specifically status won't read data from the repository | 15:40 |
| Lo-lan-do | Hm. Okay :-) | 15:40 |
| mvo | bazaar.launchpad.net is refusing connections for me, does anyone else sees this too? | 15:41 |
| poolie | yes | 15:41 |
| poolie | we're working on it urgently | 15:41 |
| mvo | ok, thanks | 15:42 |
| poolie | bazaar.launchpad.net is down; it's being addressed urgently | 15:42 |
| poolie | sorry, paste error | 15:42 |
| lifeless | its back now | 15:48 |
| poolie | pqm.bazaar-vcs.org's invalid https cert looks worse under ff3 | 15:59 |
| lifeless | poolie: yes it does :) | 16:03 |
| Verterok | awilkins: just to let you know, I pushed a BazaarClient with some fixes and command syntax updated to bzr-1.2 | 17:16 |
| === BasicMac is now known as BasicOSX | ||
| === doko_ is now known as doko | ||
| === gotgenes is now known as gotgenes|away | ||
| jdong | jelmer: have you considered upgrading or at least making available a packs version of bzr-svn's branch? :D | 18:02 |
| jdong | I'm in a low-patience branching mood today | 18:02 |
| === mw is now known as mw|food | ||
| poolie | night all | 18:58 |
| james_w | night poolie | 18:58 |
| james_w | have a safe journey | 18:58 |
| lifeless | night all | 19:03 |
| lifeless | james_w: we're in London now | 19:03 |
| james_w | ah, welcome. | 19:03 |
| thumper | what does: "899.934 not updating child fraction" in the .bzr.log file? | 19:19 |
| abentley | It's related to progress bars. The details escape me. | 19:34 |
| === mw|food is now known as mw | ||
| jelmer | jdong: heh | 19:54 |
| jelmer | yeah, I guess it's about time to upgrade | 19:54 |
| jelmer | jdong: please note that it is *not* advised to use the 0.4 branch of bzr-svn atm | 19:56 |
| jdong | jelmer: ah, ok. Also, are there any known issues between bzr-svn and subversion 1.5.x/1.6.x? | 20:17 |
| jdong | jelmer: I recall trying it earlier and getting something along the lines of a mismatched # of arguments traceback | 20:17 |
| jelmer | jdong: I haven't tried 1.6.x, 1.5.x should work fine | 20:17 |
| jdong | jelmer: ok, just an FYI the ForeignBranches howto says to branch subversion trunk which is apparently "1.6.x" now | 20:18 |
| jelmer | jdong: Can you be more specific ? :-) | 20:18 |
| jdong | jelmer: *grumble* let me reproduce it ;-) | 20:18 |
| jdong | return apply(_ra.svn_ra_do_update, args) | 20:20 |
| jdong | TypeError: add_nodes() takes exactly 2 arguments (4 given) | 20:20 |
| jdong | jelmer: ^^. Lemme know if that's totally wack. I did really mutilate the svn stack to get it to build in this RHEL4 env | 20:21 |
| jelmer | jdong: That looks like a python-subversion issue | 20:21 |
| jdong | jelmer: this is subversion branches/1.5.x IIRC.... | 20:22 |
| jdong | jelmer: wait is bzr-svn 0.4.7 supposed to work against bzr 1.2.0? | 20:23 |
| jelmer | jdong: Something funky is happening at your side | 20:23 |
| jelmer | jdong: There is no symbol add_nodes in either bzr-svn or python-subversion | 20:23 |
| jdong | /mit/jdong/.local/lib/python2.5/site-packages/bzrlib/index.py: def add_nodes(self, nodes): | 20:24 |
| jdong | it seems to be in bzrlib? | 20:24 |
| jelmer | any chance you can post the full backtrace somewhere? | 20:24 |
| jdong | O_O | 20:25 |
| jdong | oh | 20:25 |
| jdong | wow | 20:25 |
| jdong | lol that was confusing | 20:25 |
| jdong | so I post this traceback to Ubuntu pastebin... | 20:25 |
| jdong | and Ubuntu pastebin HAPPENED to spit back a CGI error in the form of a python traceback | 20:26 |
| jelmer | heh | 20:26 |
| jdong | and all I could think is "hey that's not the one I put in" | 20:26 |
| jdong | lol lemme find another pastebin | 20:26 |
| jelmer | (-: | 20:26 |
| jdong | http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/57869/ | 20:26 |
| piedoggie | the more I work with svn, the more I love bzr. thanks folks for making bzr real. | 20:27 |
| jdong | WELL I guess the selftest segfaulting is a good sign that I did something idiotic compiling svn. | 20:31 |
| beuno | lifeless, ping | 20:43 |
| === gotgenes|away is now known as gotgenes | ||
| mdke | I'd like to merge changes from a branch into another one but only in relation to one file - can I do that? | 20:49 |
| mdke | "bzr merge branch filename" doesn't seem to work | 20:49 |
| jdong | jelmer: any hints on the backtrace? | 20:50 |
| jdong | mdke: the only way I know of is to merge the branch, then revert all but that one file | 20:50 |
| beuno | mdke, AFAIK, cherrypicking is not supported yet | 20:50 |
| jelmer | jdong: Whoops, sorry | 20:50 |
| mdke | jdong, beuno: ok, shame. Thanks | 20:51 |
| === jkakar_ is now known as jkakar | ||
| mdke | cp it is then :) | 20:51 |
| jdong | spoken almost like a git developer :) | 20:51 |
| beuno | mdke, old n' trusty :p | 20:51 |
| jelmer | jdong: Doesn't make an awful lot of sense | 20:52 |
| mdke | yes, cp seems to work | 20:52 |
| fullermd | No, you can bzr merge /some/branch/some/file | 20:52 |
| jelmer | jdong: I guess the backtrace gets messed up by the python subversion bindings | 20:52 |
| mdke | fullermd: doesn't seem to work with a remote branch on launchpad at least | 20:53 |
| fullermd | (it doesn't record anything of course, just like cherrypicking revs, but it works) | 20:53 |
| beuno | ah I guess that would be bug #81758 then | 20:53 |
| ubotu | Launchpad bug 81758 in bzr "'bzr help merge' should describe merging a single file" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/81758 | 20:53 |
| jdong | jelmer: well, I can tell these RHEL4 servers hate me | 20:53 |
| jelmer | it may actually be a core bzr bug | 20:53 |
| jelmer | but it's hard to tell without a proper traceback :-/ | 20:53 |
| jdong | jelmer: confusing why a nearly identical setup on ubuntu doesn't err out | 20:54 |
| jelmer | jdong: Does "bzr selftest svn" pass? | 20:54 |
| jdong | jelmer: no, it.... segfaults.... | 20:54 |
| jdong | which is another worrisome sign | 20:54 |
| jelmer | uhm, yes :-) | 20:54 |
| * jdong nukes his ~/.local and starts over | 20:55 | |
| jdong | when in doubt..... wipe ito ut. | 20:55 |
| jdong | spoken in the true voice of American diplomacy. | 20:55 |
| jelmer | (-: | 20:55 |
| jdong | ok, let's try just installing bzr and running its selftest first... | 20:57 |
| benjaminpeterson | has anyone used bzr-lomb? | 22:02 |
| makko | hi, I'm running bzr on Mac (Leopard OS X) and I don't know why, but when I run a commit or branch, it just hangs... I've left it running overnight and it still doesn't finish. Any ideas/pointers? | 22:08 |
| beuno | makko, maybe take a look at ~/.bzr.log? | 22:11 |
| poolfoo1 | Does any one know of a nice (aka TortousCVS) graphical interface to bazarr on OSX? | 22:11 |
| makko | beuno: I did. For example, I just wanted to get the latest bzr.dev (as in the user manual), and it just hangs. My bzr.log says: 396.636 creating branch <bzrlib.branch.BzrBranchFormat6 object at 0x1326d10> in file:///Users/normsu/root/bzr/bzr.dev/.bzr/ ... | 22:12 |
| beuno | makko, what version of bzr would that be? | 22:13 |
| makko | beuno: I got bzr from macports (1.2.0) and I'm trying to fetch bzr.dev with "bzr branch -v http://bazaar-vcs.org/bzr/bzr.dev" | 22:13 |
| benjaminpeterson | poolfool: have you seen QBzr | 22:14 |
| beuno | makko, can you report a bug with the contents of your .bzr.log? | 22:15 |
| makko | beuno: OK, I just wasn't sure if this was an actual bug or something kooky with my own setup/environment. | 22:16 |
| beuno | makko, thanks. I'm sure someone else will help you debug it | 22:17 |
| makko | beuno: OK, thanks for your kind assistance I'll try your suggestion. | 22:18 |
| beuno | makko, np. good luck :D | 22:18 |
| === asak_ is now known as asak | ||
| poolfoo1 | benjaminpeterson: No ... sorry ... but I guess I was looking for something a little more tied into finder. | 22:34 |
| poolfoo1 | I am kind of new to OSX (1 month new), and I mostly use the console ... but at work I use TortoiseCVS and it gets kind of addicting. | 22:35 |
| poolfoo1 | benjaminpeterson: Quit a nick by the way ... hurts to type ... almost | 22:35 |
| benjaminpeterson | poolfool: Hmm, I don't actually know of any applications that interface with the MacOS finder. Is that possible? (Are their APIs?) | 22:37 |
| poolfoo1 | benjaminpeterson: I would guess not ... Apple kind of sucks that way ... but I figured I would throw the question out any ways. | 22:38 |
| === benjaminpeterson is now known as bpeterson | ||
| poolfoo1 | bpeterson: Much easier ... are you a Mac OSX guy? | 22:39 |
| bpeterson | poolfool: I switch between KDE and Mac | 22:40 |
| bpeterson | poolfool: I agree that Apple should make this possible. Some cool things could be done... | 22:40 |
| jdong | maybe I'm crazy, nerdy, and so on... but am I the only one to prefer working with a textmode VCS? | 22:46 |
| jdong | I mean, I've used Subclipse, TortoiseSVN, bzr-gtk, etc all before, and find them more cumbersome than their command line counterparts | 22:46 |
| jdong | with the sole exception of bzr visualize and similar tools | 22:47 |
| jdong | ancenstry is more clear in a GUI form | 22:47 |
| bpeterson | jdong: I love textmode | 22:48 |
| bpeterson | jdong: I typically use a simple editor with syntax highlighting and perform all my other operations with bash | 22:49 |
| poolfoo1 | I like gui for the quick clues that a file may be out of date (icon overlay in Microsoft Windows with Tortoise), but commits, diff, log generation for reports are much easier text based. | 22:49 |
| bpeterson | bzr missing | 22:50 |
| poolfoo1 | That said, I just seem to live via gui. That is kind of why I was looking for something that might tie into finder ... not yet another graphic program to learn. | 22:50 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: interesting... I find bzr diff, bzr log, bzr status easier by commandline | 22:50 |
| poolfoo1 | jdong: sorry, maybe I didn't read/write that just write. I agree that diff, log and status are much easier from command line\text. | 22:51 |
| fullermd | A GUI is a way to get LOTS of command lines at once :) | 22:52 |
| poolfoo1 | What about web interface (bzrweb?) to revision control? I like the bonsai/ViewVC interface a lot for a while. | 22:53 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: seems like loggerhead is the preferred one nowadays | 22:53 |
| jdong | launchpad has a demo of it | 22:54 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~bzr/bzr/trunk/files | 22:54 |
| jdong | I still like bzr-serve or whatever that other older one is called | 22:54 |
| jdong | because you can start it on some arbitrary port on a single command | 22:54 |
| poolfoo1 | loggerhead (the last time I played with it) was a whole suite of power tools just ready to rip an finger/arm/leg off. I like the small light weight ability of bzweb for small projects/groups or single use as a simple gui. | 22:54 |
| poolfoo1 | loggerhead would be much better for something like launchpad/sorceforge/... | 22:55 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: yeah the older one was easier for personal use | 22:55 |
| bpeterson | i like to know what my computer is doing, so bash gives the most control and detail | 22:56 |
| jdong | I find commandline easiest for stuff I know how to do, and GUI's easier for, frankly, BS-ing my way along when I really don't know what I'm doing. | 22:59 |
| jdong | again, personal opinion. | 22:59 |
| bpeterson | it is more intuitive | 22:59 |
| poolfoo1 | What is the craziest/coolest use of bazaar to date? I heard someone ( lifeless ) suggest using bzrlib for a wiki ... sounded pretty cool to me. | 22:59 |
| jdong | if you *know* what you want to do, it's much easier to express it in a CLI | 22:59 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: benjamin mako hill is doing a bzr wiki for his doctoral thesis | 22:59 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: I wrote a ruby+bzr TODO list program a few weeks ago | 23:00 |
| jdong | so I can operate disconnectedly | 23:00 |
| poolfoo1 | jdong: do you have the link? ... but what about a revision controlled filesystem ... something more complex then the Linux COW patch. | 23:00 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: I also use bzr heavily while doing Ubuntu package development or packaging. It helps me keep track of my current changes a lot better | 23:00 |
| bpeterson | i suppose you can bumble around in GUI with out causing horrible damage | 23:00 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: I don't have a link handy, no | 23:00 |
| jdong | bpeterson: well a GUI's beter at answering "Hmm, what can I do?" | 23:01 |
| jdong | i.e. poking around a new program | 23:01 |
| jdong | I found git extremely bewildering on day one | 23:01 |
| jdong | IMO it's approaching arch fame :) | 23:01 |
| jdong | but once I kinda knew what I was doing, it was pretty easy to use | 23:01 |
| poolfoo1 | jdong: when you use it for ubuntu you are using it as a RCS? ... how about using it somewhere that is revision control (wiki/apple time machine/... ) but you just don't realise or think of it that way. | 23:01 |
| bpeterson | jdong: when you don't want to look through the docs :) | 23:01 |
| bpeterson | jdong: is git really as fast as Linus says | 23:06 |
| ubotu | New bug: #197125 in bzr "bzr hangs on Mac OS X Leopard (10.5.2)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/197125 | 23:11 |
| mkanat | Is there any way to make bzr ignore permission changes on files, for a checkin? | 23:14 |
| jdong | bpeterson: git is fast indeed, impressively so | 23:15 |
| jdong | bpeterson: something like "git log > /dev/null" for 500,000 revisions happens nearly instantly | 23:16 |
| jdong | i.e. complete in 0.5 seconds | 23:16 |
| jdong | bpeterson: but personally I don't think most sized projects benefit from that speed | 23:16 |
| jdong | bpeterson: git has been much slower for me because in the time it takes me to answer "What the hell is git pull . refs:master/trunk?", bzr could've done the operation 10 times :) | 23:17 |
| poolfoo1 | jdong: Have you tried git on Microsoft Windows recently? Is there a not cygwin version? | 23:18 |
| poolfoo1 | My big selling point for bazaar is Win32 at work, Linux & MacOSX at home ... no problems to date ... <knock on wood> | 23:19 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: AFAIK all the git-on-windows implementations are either quirky or very slow | 23:19 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: bzr is definitely much much more portable | 23:19 |
| poolfoo1 | Which would be my big selling point .... | 23:20 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: for me, that and (2) simplicity (3) outstanding support for dumb protocols | 23:21 |
| jdong | those two are things that most VCSes lack IMO | 23:22 |
| poolfoo1 | jdong: you mean the fact that bzr can checkout over http/scp/ssh ? | 23:23 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: right. The fact that bzr works just fine over standard protocols like SFTP, HTTP, FTP and so on without the need for anything special on the remote end | 23:24 |
| jdong | Git can read over HTTP, but that's it | 23:24 |
| jdong | if you want to push, you can't do that over FTP. You can only do it over SSH if git were installed on the remote machine | 23:24 |
| poolfoo1 | jdong: so the purpose of a dedicated bzr protocol and server? speed ... but I am just looking to get info. | 23:24 |
| === mw is now known as mw|out | ||
| jdong | poolfoo1: right, the smart server tends to be faster | 23:25 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: rather, has more potential to be faster | 23:25 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: though the recent "packs" storage format evened the playing field a lot | 23:25 |
| poolfoo1 | jdong: potential ... yea .... about that ... | 23:25 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: branching a large packs-format repo over http maxes out my connection at 8MB/s | 23:25 |
| jdong | for the most part | 23:25 |
| jdong | which is as good performance as one can hope for, right? :) | 23:26 |
| poolfoo1 | Wow ... 8MB/s ... that's a lot better then any connection I have had in a long while; at work Dual T1 with poor load balance right now and CrapCast (ComCast) at home. | 23:29 |
| jdong | poolfoo1: well I'm glad my $40,000 tuition allows MIT to buy me some pretty decent internet :) | 23:30 |
| mkanat | I've bursted almost that high on Comcast. | 23:30 |
| mkanat | jdong: Hahahaa, ahh, the days of school internet... | 23:30 |
| jdong | indeed :) | 23:30 |
| jdong | I'll miss my 18.0.0.0/8 subnet too | 23:30 |
| poolfoo1 | Aaaahh yes ... the last time I had decent net speed I was at Colorado State University (CSU) .... the good old days. | 23:30 |
| jdong | where everything from the printer next to me to my iPod Touch has a public IP | 23:31 |
| mkanat | jdong: In a sense that's a little frightening, though. :-) | 23:32 |
| damageboy | can anyone explain how to write a pre-commit hook script with Bzr 1.2? | 23:32 |
| jdong | mkanat: :) access control should be strong enough to withstand that anyway :) | 23:32 |
| poolfoo1 | damageboy: http://doc.bazaar-vcs.org/bzr.dev/en/user-reference/bzr_man.html#hooks | 23:33 |
| poolfoo1 | Is there some place for good bzr scripts? | 23:35 |
| mkanat | jdong: I hope so! :-) | 23:36 |
| damageboy | Can I run a bash script that changes the files I'm about to commit (potentially even creates more changes...)? | 23:36 |
| damageboy | From the pre_commit hook that is...? | 23:36 |
| bpeterson | damageboy: I dont't believe so. Bazaar has already calculated the changes to commit. | 23:44 |
| awilkins | damageboy: I'm not sure, but I'd imaging that would work, unlike on SVN | 23:57 |
| awilkins | damageboy: I think I might want to try that myself, I have some reasons to do it in my present project :-) | 23:58 |
| awilkins | Anyway, time for bed. | 23:58 |
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