[00:35] essial: Welcome! [00:35] Hello again [00:36] i've been using linux since the early 90's, and now I think I have enough experience to be a good contributor to Ubuntu, since it seems to be one of the best distros out there [00:36] Have you seen... [00:36] !contribute [00:36] To contribute and help out with Ubuntu, see http://www.ubuntu.com/community/participate [00:37] ? [00:37] i've been traversing through it [00:37] been going in circles though :) [00:37] Right :). Do you have some idea of where you'd like to help? [00:37] my main thing is, at work, and most of my experience is with windows, and also with non-dist (aka, os development itself) [00:38] but i'm moderately familiar with linux, as it has been my only OS for a few years now, and I've done work with Gtk, LibSDL, and have been practicing writing makefiles both manually and with autotools [00:38] Right. So, if you're comfortable coding & debugging, taking some of the apport backtraces on Launchpad and figuring out patches would be awesome. [00:38] I know just about every language (with the exception of perl)... and to answer your question, No specific area [00:39] see, thats why I need help, I have 0 experience 'debugging' in linux, I do it all the time in windows [00:39] Failing that, much of the actual writing of _code_ happens upstream. [00:39] Aaaah, right. [00:39] but [00:39] I don't mind doing anything really, I just want to help contribute in the most effective way possible [00:39] even if it is not specifically code [00:40] since I will need someone to help, if only a little, to get me started, I figure it best not to waste their time putting me in with an overcrowded group [00:40] RAOF: Are you a MOTU already? Sorry for interrupting the conversation [00:40] no problem lmr_ [00:40] Hm. So, I find that the easiest way to contribute is to (1) Use Ubuntu, (2) find something that doesn't work like you'd like it to, (3) fix it ;) [00:40] lmr_: Yup. [00:41] I work better with lists :) Ubuntu is a large collection of things [00:41] RAOF: essial: I've been trying to find out some time to help, I'd love to start packaging software for ubuntu [00:41] How does one request a sync (from Debian unstable) for a package which has Ubuntu modifications that need to remain there? [00:41] requestsync asks for a reason to remove the Ubuntu modifications... [00:42] fmarier: If the differences need to remain, it's a merge, not a sync [00:42] fmarier: One doesn't. One instead merges the Ubuntu changes into the new debian revision. [00:42] RAOF: see things like that throw me off right now, so I need to be eased into the linux way of things :) [00:42] essial: You can pick a package or group of packages that you're interested in and check out the bugs in Launchpad. [00:42] so I guess step one is to create a user in launchpad, brb [00:42] Or, you can find a specific upstream project that you're interested in, and join up. [00:42] fmarier: Prepare a debdiff from the new Debian revision to the needed Ubuntu revision attach that to a bug and subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors [00:43] ScottK2: ok, I'll do that. thanks [00:43] RAOF: I was thinking, since I work mainly with open source testing and I already contribute with an upstream test project, maybe there's a Ubuntu quality assurance/test team where my skills can be better used [00:43] lmr_: Of course, at the moment what really needs to be done is to fix packages already in Ubuntu. [00:44] perhaps help make rhythymbox not suck so much, as it seems to be what ubuntu thinks is the replacement for the superior xmms [00:44] RAOF: Sure, that's what I meant, taking maintainership of software that's already packaged (orphaned maybe) would be great [00:44] even though once it drops a stream, you have to restart it [00:45] lmr_: I believe there is such a group, but I don't know for sure. You could also help the iso testing team test the releases (alpha X, etc) [00:45] and has no support for easy codecs, or whatever its called [00:45] essial: If you're interested in coding, that'd probably be a nice patch to ease your way in :) [00:46] Or were you describing xmms? It's been some time since I've had to install any codecs :) [00:46] the hard part is finding someone over there to help pull me in, well first things first, gotta find the project source page :) [00:46] brb [00:46] RAOF: Yeah, we do distro testing (the underlying system, kernel, filesystems, network) and have quite a bit of work on test automation [00:47] RAOF: Which packages you take care as a MOTU? What other groups you're involved with? [00:47] lmr_: I *know* that people do that for Ubuntu. If you're capable of helping in that, which would be awesome, maybe you should hit the ubuntu-devel mailinglist. [00:48] RAOF: Right, I see [00:48] lmr_: We don't really have maintainers as such in Ubuntu. I tend to fix up stuff that's broken for me. I've also been lumbered with the Miro package, kinda by default. [00:48] lmr_: have you checked out the ServerTestingTeam ? [00:49] lmr_: since you've got some experience with automated testing, we'd love to know wheter the latest development version of ubuntu runs on different hardware [00:49] mathiaz: No, I didn't. I suppose this is the page on the ubuntu wiki [00:49] lmr_: as RAOF mentionned, there is the iso testing team [00:50] lmr_: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTestingTeam [00:50] gah [00:50] rhythmbox is inside the gnomeSVN [00:50] that'd explain why its still 0.11 :) [00:50] Yes, but don't worry. You can use bzr to work with it :) [00:51] and hasn't had an update since december 21, 2007 [00:51] Really? Wow. [00:51] http://www.gnome.org/projects/rhythmbox/news.html [00:51] lmr_: you should also get in touch with the Ubuntu QA team - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam [00:52] essial: Oh, right. Hasn't seen a _release_ since the end of last year. I suppose that is quite a while ago. [00:52] If you're interested in C# and mono and such, banshee-trunk should be getting a preview release, and is a different media player thing, perhaps a bit more like iTunes. [00:53] mathiaz: I've looked at the page. Do you have any idea where this server hardware comes from? [00:53] mathiaz: Unfortunately the hardware I can't provide [00:53] so is a seemingly desolate project a good place to start then? [00:53] mathiaz: :D [00:53] you talking to me RAOF about banshee [00:53] mathiaz: In my case, all the hardware I use (power machines) comes from my employer [00:53] lmr_: this is hardware that people have access to [00:54] lmr_: most of them are through their employer I guess [00:54] mathiaz: Hmmm, I see [00:54] lmr_: they can probably have access to them for a couple of hours to do some testing [00:54] essial: I don't think rhythmbox is desolate in any way. And, yes, I was talking to you about banshee. [00:55] honestly they look very similar [00:55] lmr_: if you're interested in testing, we run iso tests before we release [00:55] though functionality wise, banshee seems to be much further [00:55] lmr_: this is part of the iso testing team. [00:55] will ubuntu even include that as a normal player you think? [00:55] sorry for the questions but i'm starting with no knowledge of whats going on :) [00:55] essial: Part of the thing is that rhythmbox is fairly stable. It's in no way unmaintained, though; there've been plenty of recent commits :) [00:56] mathiaz: Right, I'm checking where I would fit better [00:56] ( See: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~vcs-imports/rhythmbox/main/changes for such things ) [00:56] lmr_: well - if you want to leverage your testing experience, the QA team is probably eager to hear from you [00:57] lmr_: lars is working on some automated testing of desktop application IIRC [00:58] mathiaz: Sure, I'll be glad to help. [00:58] mathiaz: We don't do much GUI testing, we do more kernel layer/command line user space utilities [00:58] ok here's a good general question. Lets say I want to help develop banshee, so i go to the banshee page, click "developers" [00:59] i see where to go to grab the source with svn [00:59] lmr_: that works also [00:59] lmr_: the server team would be a good place to start then [00:59] lmr_: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam [00:59] do i then just click on "all current banshee bugs" and work on them? [00:59] and what If I want to add new things, where would I post that? [01:00] essial: Aaah, right. Sorry, it's been a while since I needed to learn this sort of culture :) [01:01] mathiaz: Thank you very much for your patience man ;) I'll get in touch with those guys [01:01] essial: So, things that I would do: I'd subscribe to the banshee mailing list, possibly reading a bit of the archives too. [01:01] lmr_: great - I'm one of those guys - so you should hang out in #ubuntu-server [01:01] mathiaz: Oh really? :) Nice [01:01] yeah i'm subscribing to their list in a moment [01:02] i just gotta get used to svn again... starteam made me lazy :) [01:02] essial: You probably don't need to get used to svn if you don't want to. bzr-svn should work nicely :) [01:02] Of course, that requires you to learn the bzr VCS :) [01:03] Heya gang [01:03] essial: svn is pretty easy to get started with, don't worry [01:03] essial: Then, I'd checkout the list of open bugs, yeah. Probably starting with a gnome-love (one with a heart next to it) bug would be good. [01:03] yeah i've read up on gnome-love [01:03] Bye the time bzr finishes downloading you could learn svn ;-P [01:03] should i use rapidsvn, or just svn [01:03] essial: If you want, I can send you a quick reference that I put on my desk [01:04] lmr_: Yeah. It's _using_ svn to do non-trivial things that's hard :P [01:04] bddebian: Hush! [01:04] :-) [01:04] bddebian: bzr is love! [01:04] RAOF: I got your point, but the good thing is that we don't have to do non-trivial things frequently [01:05] essial: There's also a banshee IRC channel. Popping up in there might be a good idea, too. [01:05] wee console scrolly [01:05] popping [01:05] Hmm. Could someone explain how to interpret the "MoM" page? What are the colors? What is "Outstanding" vs. "Updated" merges? [01:05] done grabbing svn [01:05] er banshee [01:06] * RAOF has basically given up on any VCS that he can't make local commits in. [01:08] now to figure out how to install it [01:08] er compile it [01:09] Yup. Since we have a banshee package, pulling all the build-dependencies is (mostly) easy: you can run "sudo apt-get build-dep banshee" to install all the packages (our) banshee (package) needs to build. [01:09] RAOF: Which leaves git, bzr and svn? [01:09] mok0: the colors are related to the last time a merge has been done [01:10] its like i need to install autotools and run autogen [01:10] mok0: Outstanding means that the package hasn't been merge during this release cycle. [01:10] StevenK: Which leaves git, bzr, mercurial. [01:10] mathiaz: ah, ok, because they are behind, too [01:10] mok0: Updated means that the package has already been merge at least once during this release cycle [01:10] RAOF: I thought svn could do --local for commits [01:10] Oh, maybe it can. [01:11] mok0: we try to merge each package at least once during the release cycle [01:11] RAOF: were you talking to me about banshee? [01:11] essial: Yes :) [01:11] i don't want to much up my package tree too bad [01:11] what is build-dep for [01:11] * mok0 thinks the key to the colors should be listed on MoM's web page [01:11] mathiaz: thanks [01:11] StevenK: If you can, then "svn help commit" doesn't know about it. [01:12] RAOF: I might not be remembering correctly [01:12] i see the "configure build-dependencies for source packages" but does that mean downloading all .dev's? [01:13] nice aparently i need 114 new packages :) [01:14] essial: you need to create a pbuilder [01:14] meaning? [01:14] mok0: Not for local development. [01:14] RAOF: if he want's to avoid installing 114 packages on his own system [01:15] i don't mind as long as it doesn't bomb my dist [01:15] essial: pbuilder is a tool which creates a clean build environment to build Ubuntu packages in. If you're doing upstream development, it's probably more hassle than its worth. [01:15] i have a very fast pc and connection [01:15] i just don't want to reinstall ubuntu to update my packages :) [01:15] The only thing that -dev packages use is disc space, which is cheap. [01:16] i have over 1tb so [01:16] i'll live [01:17] aparently its done [01:17] nice it took mono 4 seconds to crash on me :) [01:19] Always fun. [01:21] of course not a damn thing compiles :) [01:21] i have more luck with C than C#, and thats scary *sighs* [01:22] could have something to do with the error: Files in variable ASSEMBLY_CSFILES contains variables which cannot be parsed without path to the configure.in being set. ignoring such files [01:24] Pastebinning the full output of autogen is likely to be helpful. [01:24] !pastebin | essial [01:24] essial: pastebin is a service to post multiple-lined texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic) [01:25] thats most likely the problem, i didn't run autogen, just loaded the project [01:28] essial: Ah, right. The autotools foo is more likely to be buildable at any one time than the monodevelop project. :) [01:29] and I hit my usual hurdle with trying to help.. version problems where it requires a version i cannot get without source [01:29] ndesk-dbus must be >= 0.5, i have 0.4.2 [01:29] so tell me code gurus, how do I resolve without breaking my package tree [01:29] :) [01:31] Aaah. ndesk-dbus 0.6.0 is in Hardy. You are presumably using Gutsy. [01:31] yup [01:31] essial: Work in a chroot. [01:31] so what do I need to do in order to compile [01:31] essial: you need to create a pbuilder ;-) [01:31] ScottK2: That's an excellent idea. [01:32] so i gotta clone an entire system to compile a project? [01:32] essial: it takes about 3 minutes [01:32] allright, well i'm assuming i will just create a folder and chroot into it [01:32] !pbuilder [01:32] pbuilder is a system to easily build packages in a clean chroot environment. To get started with PBuilder, see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto [01:33] reading, thanks! [01:33] essial: you've been "using linux since the early 90's", but never compiled a project? [01:33] mono is evil [01:33] essial: Such is the way with developmnet code - particularly long-term development branches such as banshee-trunk. [01:33] azeem: sure have [01:33] mono is evil and should be avoided [01:34] mok0: If you think that, just wait until you see moonlight [01:34] ./configure --prefix = /usr/bin && make && make install works like a charm 99% of the time [01:34] moonlight is also evil [01:34] mok0: Mono seems to be the thing most likely to allow me to, in some glorious future, not need to care that there's a C library for what I want but not a $LANGUAGE_OF_CHOICE library. [01:34] Imaging when M$ pulls the carpet and we have 1000 mission critical applications.... [01:35] Imagine [01:35] anyway, i'm not frustrated, i'll read the wiki and follow it [01:35] mok0: No one seems to have convincing evidonce that this carpet exists. [01:35] It does [01:35] They've told us [01:36] They've said "linux infringes patents" (which I assume is what you're referring to). This is undobtedly the case. [01:36] RAOF: At the very least they've announced they have carpets that they won't say what it affects. [01:37] There's probably a second 'u' in "undoubtedly". :) [01:37] oh goody here it goes [01:37] Believing that none of those carpets affect Mono is an exercise in optimism at best. [01:37] ScottK2: they are patiently waiting [01:37] Sure [01:37] That's my expectation too. [01:38] gnome used to be a very nice C based system. [01:38] mok0: Incidentally, http://people.freedesktop.org/~racarr/ms.gif [01:38] But C is a crap language to write UIs in. [01:39] haskell FTW [01:39] Yeah! [01:39] RAOF: :-D [01:39] I'm not saying that C is inherently bad, just that it's good at things which are nearly pointless on the desktop. [01:39] C is good at starting words for example [01:39] very bad at ending them [01:40] coc [01:40] exactly [01:40] RAOF: Anyway, Miguel himself seems to have come to the conclusion that it might not have been a very good idea to introduce mono in gnome... [01:41] As far as I'm aware, the only mono-dependency in Gnome is tomboy? [01:42] There's a couple more, can't remember which [01:42] fspot, beagle, banshee, off the top of my head. None of which are actually a part of Gnome. [01:42] ok, yeah those are the ones. [01:43] Oh, it's used in serpentine, that I have been merging [01:44] Oh, really? Wow. [01:44] or rather, a plugin, which creates a .dll [01:44] You can write serpentine plugins in CIL? Wow. [01:45] should i do the pbuilder create --debootstrapopts --variant=buildd [01:45] essial: You don't really need the buildd variant. But something like that, yes. [01:46] i'm still not quite sure what pbuilder does yet so :) [01:46] essial: basically, it creates a tarball of a system [01:47] essial: when building, it will unpack the tar ball in a chroot, copy the source package to it, and download the build-depends [01:48] essial: For you, the interesting part is that you'll have a minimal Hardy system in a tarball. [01:48] is hardy the codename for the dev of ubuntu, or just the name of the next version [01:49] essial, the tar ball will be ~80Mb [01:50] essial: Hardy is code name for the next version. [01:50] essial: Unlike Debian, where sid is always in development. [01:51] ok i created the pbuilder environment, and added the hardy sources to the list [01:51] now its saying apt-get source bc (which i'm assuming should be apt-get source get banshee) [01:51] it doesn't say anything about chroot [01:52] essial: are you building your package? [01:52] I'll have to compile it so I assume so === lakin__ is now known as lakin [01:53] essial: No get, 'apt-get source banshee' [01:53] essial: did you do "pbuilder --build ? [01:53] all i've done thus far is pbuilder create .... [01:53] and added the entry to my deb-src list [01:53] essial: it doesn't do the chroot when it creates [01:53] i did it in my normal environment [01:54] so i'm assuming i need to chroot before making that mod [01:54] essial, pbuilder --login [01:54] mok0: He's not actually building a package. He's trying to do some upstream banshee development :) [01:55] Aha [01:55] and learning everything on the way up [01:55] In other words, having fun :-) [01:55] ok i sudo pbuilder --login, it extracted the tarball and i'm assuming now i'm sitting at the chroot i just built [01:55] Yup. [01:55] so NOW i add that line to the sources and apt-get the source [01:55] essial: you might want a --save-after-login switch on there too [01:56] what does that switch mean [01:56] keep any file changes i presume [01:56] essial: because the normal behaviour is to zap the chroot [01:56] essial: yes [01:57] ok so I understand the basics of pbuilder, it lets you compile without fscking up your current system with beta packages [01:57] correct? [01:57] yes [01:57] see, i'm learning :) [01:57] cool, huh? [01:57] yeah that makes sense [01:57] can you move files in and out of the chroot [01:57] (into the host environment) [01:57] essial: ... and install all the build-depends [01:58] (it does that automagically) [01:58] essial: You can, yes. You can mount /home in your pbuilder chroot. [01:59] I forget quite how to do that, though. There's some configuration as to what you actually want mounted inside the chroot. [01:59] changing packages to hardy [01:59] essial: didn't you create the pbuilder from hardy packages? [01:59] i guess not [01:59] remember i've never heard of pbuilder until 15 minutes ago [02:00] --variant=hardy ? [02:01] ah [02:01] --distribution=hardy [02:01] or not [02:02] essial: yes, yes [02:02] * essial sighs.. not working [02:02] sorry I know i'm being a pain [02:02] sudo pbuilder create --debootstrapopts --distrobution=hardypbuilder remove [02:03] er -remove [02:04] pbuilder --create --distribution=hardy [02:04] pbuilder --update --distribution=hardy --override-config [02:06] ah the = was throwing it off [02:06] next question, is it always only one pbuilder environment or do you ever want more than one normally [02:07] essial: you can have as many as you want, but you need to set up the .pbuilderrc file to handle it sensibly [02:08] Which channel the best place to ask about the ubuntu-release team? [02:09] essial: there's also a script called pbuilder-dist that can help you with having several pbuilders [02:09] ok well pbuilder is up and running, gotta find the name of the hyena package now [02:10] essiel, there's a bunch of useful stuff in ubuntu-dev-tools [02:11] Well, time to go to bed for me. See you later guys! [02:12] aparently banshee isn't in the normal sources === bmk789_ is now known as bmk789_sleep [02:16] ok i'm getting the hang of it [02:17] essial: Hm. Banshee is in Universe. I'm not sure if that's enabled in a default pbuilder setup. [02:17] i'm testing building gedit since i know that will be simple to do [02:17] then i'll add universe [02:17] Right, that might be a good idea :) [02:17] apt-get build-dep gedit worked :) [02:18] and apt-get source gedit pulled the sources into home so [02:19] heres my question RAOF: is the apt-get source getting the latest source dist, NOT the svn dist? [02:19] i'm assuming so [02:19] in other words should i only apt-get build-dep gedit, THEN just svn gedit [02:21] Yes. [02:21] well i compiled gedit, jsut can't run it for obvious reasons :) [02:21] apt-get source gets the "source package" for the package in the repositories - the upstream tarball that is the code + some metadata about how to build it & such. [02:22] last question: i just complied gedit in a pbuilder console [02:22] how am I supposed to test it? [02:22] just copy it over to a local dir? [02:22] or is there some way to run a shell X in a window [02:23] You should be able to get X in the pbuilder environment, but I'm not sure how. [02:23] * essial sighs [02:23] copying .Xauthority in there, iirc [02:24] See! People who know more than me :) [02:24] so should I just install a hardy live install then? [02:24] because it doesn't even have X or gnome in the chroot [02:24] i'd have to re-get all of those packages [02:25] it'd be just as quit to re-install with hardy and have it just work :) [02:25] *easy [02:25] If Hobbsee is right, copying the .Xauthority file from your home directory should allow apps to run on your X server. [02:27] Other options include running Hardy in a VM, or having a full hardy install. [02:27] or just xhost +, DISPLAY=:0 app [02:28] Sorry, it seems that Banshee wasn't such a good starting point! [02:40] essial: you can also install the needed libraries in a folder and set some environment variables so it is found [02:41] I'm just not sure what env variables, at least PKG_CONFIG_PATH and LD_LIBRARY_PATH [02:41] xauth is generally preferable to xhost. [02:42] or, ssh -Y [02:42] heya crimsun :) [02:42] hi emgent :) [02:45] but for the purposes of a pbuilder for someone new, it's simplicity [03:10] hey wouldn't it be just as easy to install a full dist inside of vmware? [03:12] It might be, yes. [03:13] If you happen to already have vmware (or some other virtualisation jobby) set up. [03:13] is there a hardy cd or should i just base install and enable hardy sources [03:13] You can do either [03:14] One advantage of the pbuilder approach is you always know you are starting with a clean chroot. You can do that in a virtual environment, but you do need to rememberto do it. [03:14] i can just save a copy of the built system [03:14] but then x and everything runs out of the box [03:15] Yes. You can [03:15] cool well that will make things much nicer [03:15] do you guys run hardy for your main system? === vorian is now known as vorian_ [03:16] and to answer your question RAOF: yes, I have vmware as I do os development from time to time [03:17] essial: I've got several machines. The one that runs Hardy is just for development and testing. [03:18] torrents are awsome :) its only pulling 500kb/sec but thats better than the 90 the server was doing [03:19] I do use hardy as my main system. [03:20] It means that I hit bugs more often, so I'm more motivated to fix them ;) [03:20] perhaps i should do so too then [03:20] It'll *certainly* force you to learn about apt ;) [03:20] that would allow me to easily develop native right? [03:20] i know how to use apt-get and such [03:21] i'm not afraid of the console, believe me [03:21] i just have to learn the new stuff.. i use to use emerge and friends [03:21] Running hardy is an exercise in being certain that the packages apt wants to remove won't seriously annoy you. [03:21] it was always funny getting the base system running, then calling "emerge gnome" and watching it compile like 350 packages [03:22] what do you mean RAOF [03:22] Fujitsu, ping [03:23] essial: Well, packages don't necessarily build in the right order, so new packages appear with unmet dependencies, which apt will then want to uninstall on dist-upgrade, or suchlike. [03:23] so can't I just go to package manager and just update individual packages? [03:24] with "mark all upgrades" [03:25] Fujitsu, why you dont use patch system in bug #191488 ? [03:25] Launchpad bug 191488 in mplayer "[mplayer] [DSA-1496-1] several buffer overflows" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191488 [03:25] It's just a bit more hit-and miss. [03:25] can i work on this bug for add patches with patch system? [03:25] essial: With sufficient caution and a fair knowledge of the internals Hardy will only be unusable a couple of days in the dev cycle, give or take. [03:26] emgent: Only Dapper has a patch system. Feisty and Gutsy are maintained in bzr. [03:26] 760kb/sec.. [03:27] RAOF: when the new ubuntu version is completed, do old versions upgrade easily, or must you download and install the new iso [03:27] uhm ok Fujitsu [03:27] essial: Upgrades are supported. See, for example... [03:27] !upgrade > essial [03:28] emgent: Do not upload a new debdiff for feisty or gutsy unless you also have a bzr branch with those changes. [03:29] Fujitsu, sure np [03:29] they really should make contributing to linux a lot less painful :) [03:30] i guess thats one weakness to a package-tree style system [03:30] essial: I'm not sure that it's actually painful, it's just a different culture. [03:30] well I guess i need to buy some gloves and grow my chin hair out more [03:30] :) [03:30] * RAOF suggests white kid gloves. [03:30] i'll figure it out, i really do want to contribute [03:31] 80% on the cd [03:31] i'm just going to nuke my install, its no big deal [03:31] * essial has three hard drives, one for windows, one for data, and one for linux [03:32] I must say though, I am impressed with how far wine is progressing [03:32] I poped in the orange box cd, ran the setup, installed steam and the games, downloaded the updates, and everything ran with 0 problems [04:27] is there any good tool for tracking memory leaks? [04:27] valgrind [04:29] As long as it doesn't SIGILL on AMD64 :) [04:29] hey [04:29] hmm, I'm not sure how to find what app to run valgrind on [04:29] I'm on the beta now, it looks awsome, but now i get "Error: aclocal version 1.9 or better is required to configure banshee" :( [04:30] my laptop's just using too much memory [04:30] but I can't pinpoint an app that's doing it [04:31] essial: You probably need to install automake? [04:32] LaserJock: Can't top/htop/gnome-system-monitor help there? [04:32] they don't seem to [04:32] it seems like the sum of the apps mem usage doesn't agree with the total used [04:32]