[00:01] gregbrady: http://www.naomifilter.org/ <- maybe that's something for ya [00:02] let me check, thanks [00:02] although i wonder if that will work on linux.. there are some links to other filters, though [00:06] i know someone had a dansguardian replacement project in LP, cant remember how far it had got though [00:14] Kamping_Kaiser, you have both given me great links to start with. [00:18] Does edubuntu not come with a software package? [00:19] gregbrady, OOTB? not that i'm aware of [00:19] my school installed a great filtering system which blocked lots of useful sites. yay. :/ [00:20] most tend to do that. [00:20] yeah, I can understand that.....filtering is a tough thing to do. [00:21] yup. those "one size fits all" systems don't work well in a school where you people as young as 10 and as old as 20 [00:21] i wodner if they still have those win98 workstations. i'd love to deploy LTSP there [00:22] I wish LTSP would work over a wireless network [00:22] it does. you just have to have the kernel on a pen drive/cd rom on the client.. [00:22] yes, but what about the server? [00:23] the server is connected to the wireless network? [00:23] Yes, all servers and clients are wireless. Nothing wired. [00:23] i'm not sure if desktop latency will be great over a wireless link, though. it should be ok for one client.. [00:24] gregbrady: as long as there is a network connection you should be OK. [00:24] note: i'm not saying it's very practical.. i'm just saying it can be done :) [00:24] you will need an additional which brings up the network interface before the client boots [00:24] laga, nope, didn't work. I gave it a shot. Apparently the server must be wired. [00:26] gregbrady: you probably didn't have the initramfs script which connects the wireless interface to the network before the client boots [00:26] that's the essential part [00:27] laga, that could very well be the case....I only tried it once. [00:27] gregbrady: it's not terribly useful, imho. nothing to worry about. :) [00:27] I will try it again when I have enough of a free time block to allow it. [00:28] For now, it is more important to be able to control my son's internet access. I want to make sure he has access, but not to the stuff that he stumbled upon today. [00:36] So, if I set up a proxy, then the proxy machine must always be running with a static IP? I have 5 machines here in the house where everyone has access and one main machine acting as a sort of server. [00:47] any good online guides to setting up a proxy server? [01:00] theres an edubuntu proxy guide in the wiki [03:17] Hello - I've install edubuntu on a ThinkPad T40 but I can't get the splashscreen or fbdev support to work [03:17] you might get more help in #ubuntu [03:17] ok thanks johnny === mario_ is now known as pygi [12:00] who's around and awake? :) [12:01] highvoltage, what ya need? === jono is now known as highvoltage === spacey_ is now known as spacey [16:18] hi [16:18] can someone tell me [16:19] the desktop version is for my clients? [16:19] right? [16:19] and the Classroom server CD [16:19] will be the terminal server [16:20] and the Classroom server add-on CD is just for the server [16:20] if you want diskless clients you don't need to install anything on your clients [16:21] like no hard drives at all? on the clients [16:21] is that what you mean? [16:22] I was thinking if the clients did have hard drives... [16:22] it would thak some of the load off the server [16:22] well, you're going to build a termianl server, right? so all applications are running on the server anyways [16:23] s/termianl/terminal/ [16:23] how powerfull a server will I need? [16:24] I think ther might be 30 PCs in a room [16:24] I think there might be 30 PCs in a room [16:24] i'm not sure, i've never deployed LTSP in a real world situation.. i'm sure someone in here knows, though [16:26] im new to this as well!!! but I do have linux experience [16:26] at the moment I just put edubuntu on the clients [16:27] and I dont use a server [16:28] where might I find some example setups documentation [16:28] www.edubuntu.org might be a good starting point.. and their wiki [16:29] ok Ta [16:31] JDme, there's the outdated Handbook which can give you info about server requirements [16:31] sample at least [16:34] yea Ive just found this EdubuntuCookbook [16:34] JDme, yea, that info can also be found there [16:37] ah this is what I was looking for....:) [16:37] http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/ServerSizing [16:40] JDme: I use LTSP in a real world situation, we have 60 workstations [16:40] about 150 people use those, and there is one server [16:40] specs for the server need to be relatively high... must be at least dual core 2 [16:41] and how much RAM is in the server? [16:41] most important thing though is the infrastructure, you really must have gigabit switches, or things can be very slow when people start using video, java or flash content [16:42] are the clients resonable new? [16:42] yeah, ram is teh other part... for the 60 stations we have I have 8 gigs in the server [16:42] wohhhh that a lot or ram!!! [16:43] wohhhh thats a lot of ram!!! [16:43] the clients are not important, you can put anything u want on the other end, I've had some excellent results from old pentium 3 based machines in the 400-800 mhz range [16:43] makes no difference if the machine is the latest core 2 duo, or an old piece of junk, everything happens on the server [16:44] and there is nothing installed onthe clients hard drives?? [16:44] 8 gigs may seem like a lot, but its shared by all 60 clients [16:44] nope, an image is server from the server via the network [16:44] imagine like a live cd image, but through the network instead [16:45] the thing is I have loads of clients ( mostely refurbished PCs ) [16:46] yeah ok, sounds like my situation [16:46] with mostely 256mb ram and 100MB nics [16:47] In my case, our computer lab was furnished with dual core 2 ati based laptops, 21 of them, so I built an image that runs local applications on the workstations in question [16:47] local ram, local apps, local cpu power, this works quite well [16:48] and is most of the daily administration around the server? [16:48] the clients look after them selves? [16:48] one administers the images from teh server [16:49] you can go into a specific area of the server which is the client environment, where you can modify what teh image should do [16:49] or, if you are just using thin clients, you simply add the application on the server, and its automatically available to all the clients [16:49] very little /nothing is done on the clients themselves [16:50] if I use thin clients.... [16:50] does the server have to be more powerful [16:51] yeah, the more powerful the better [16:52] the server can never really be too powerful [16:52] in my setup I run a dual core xeon based system [16:52] sure but then they get expensive!!! [16:52] yeah, you put all the money into the server, not the clients [16:53] the difference is you have all the clients running at the speed of the server [16:53] what do you think of an old dell 6400 server [16:53] it has 4 cpus and 2GB ram [16:54] * Nubae is looing at dell's site [16:54] and scsi 10000rpm raid [16:54] sounds excellent [16:54] has it got 2 nics? [16:55] em no just one 100mb [16:55] why? [16:55] yeah, you really need 2 nics [16:55] or it might be 1000mb [16:55] and must be 1000 mb [16:56] but the clients only have 100mb nics [16:58] what is the second nic for? [16:58] still, the server hands out more bandwidth than you'd think [16:58] especially in this case where the drives are pretty fast [16:59] one nic connects to your lan/router the other to the internal thin client network [17:00] doesn't have to be like that, but its the way its setup up out of the box [17:00] the nic on the thin client lan side really should be 1000mb connected to a gigabit switch [17:01] even if the computers only have 100mb cards, thats ok, bandwidth is still dsitributed from the server, so teh server needs a bigger connection to handle all teh requests coming from the clients [17:01] most of the clients I get are donated [17:02] what spec? [17:02] so I just scrub them clean [17:02] could be anything from p2 to p4s [17:03] usually at least three years old ( and there the newer ones!!! ) [17:03] right, well, I'd seperate them out, take anything under 1.5 ghz aside and set up as thin clients [17:03] the others though, are being wasted as just pure thin clients, you can set up a full diskless workstation on them [17:03] called low fat client [17:04] that means apps, ram and cpu is run locally [17:04] hehe low fat client!!!! [17:04] it also means you dont need such a powerful server [17:04] :-) yeah the name was coined by edubuntu users I believe [17:04] heh [17:05] ok lets say I had a P4 with 512 RAM and 80GB sata hd.. [17:05] would that cut it as a server? [17:05] for say 25 cllow fat clients [17:05] for say 25 low fat clients [17:05] low fat, maybe yeah [17:06] the server in this case is only handling the connections really [17:07] bascially I would build the servers from the best donations [17:07] there is another possibility if you can't get your hands on a high spec server, which is to create a cluster [17:08] clusters oh dear!!! sound very technical!!! [17:08] but thats a different story, think it requires a lot of knowledge [17:08] also the recipents of the clients and the servers (the LTSP server ) [17:08] wasn't openmosix discontinued recently? [17:09] yeah it would combine the power of several computers together, like they do in the film indsutry [17:09] will have very little knowledge [17:09] nevermind me ;) [17:10] yeah only recently too [17:10] they are called server farms I think [17:10] maybe not worth it anymore [17:11] Nubae: i think you can do loadbalancing with LTSP, eg clustering in userspace ;) [17:11] I remember reading about them being called beowulf clusters [17:11] laga: isn't that supposed to be built into hardy now? [17:11] i don't know [17:12] i don't use LTSP as intended [17:12] think I read it in the release logs [17:12] * highvoltage catches up with this conversation [17:12] it looks like jdme has the unusual sitatuion of having relatively high spec clients [17:12] no server as of yet [17:13] and is looking to use one of the high spec clients as possible server [17:13] how many clients are you looking at setting up? [17:13] just 25? [17:14] well Im not really sure but thats about a good starting figure 25 clients [17:14] it could go up to 50 === juliux__ is now known as juliux [17:15] but it depends if I can get the server end sorted! [17:15] the calculations for ram are relatively simple... 256mb for every client [17:15] on the server that is [17:15] that sounds very high! [17:15] to acheive [17:15] you could set up 2 smaller ltsp servers with loadbalancing [17:16] sounds like its your best option, put the high end clients on one network subnet, the low end on the other [17:17] then you can decide to go full LTSP and loadbalance or set up low fat on the high end client subnet [17:17] what about switches and nics? can u get those donated? I recently got some donated from some banks [17:18] so I could use the P4s with 512 RAM and 80GB sata hd.. as the server for say every 10 to 15 low fat clients? [17:18] yeah that'd work, but I'd try to set up full thin client to begin with [17:18] yes the is a charity that will sell me 24 port switches for a very good price! [17:18] on the older equipment [17:18] yes there is a charity that will sell me 24 port switches for a very good price! [17:19] but there only 100mb [17:19] try and get gigabit switches, its where you'll notice the difference [17:19] 25 sounds doable but not 50 [17:20] so the idea was to create one server and one switch with 23 clients as a package [17:20] and redistrubuit them like that [17:20] try it, the 25 clients are never all used concurrently right? [17:21] well the might be... they will end up in a class room [17:22] hmmm, all I can tell you is from my experience, running 40 concurrently takes up close to 6 gigs of ram and the cpu time usage goes up to about 30% [17:22] ok I understand what your getting at [17:23] anyway, for the low fat alternative look here: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPFatClients [17:23] well I had better go and look around for some specs [17:24] Thanks to all for your help and time :) [17:24] I have a much better idea of what I might need to do! [17:25] good luck [17:26] Ta [17:44] hello, I had to excahnge the -i386 kernel of my ltsp client with a generic one. [17:45] after running ltsp-update-kernels I only land at a busy box terminal === juliux__ is now known as juliux [18:25] L a s e r J o c k [18:26] * LaserJock runs [18:27] :) === sudobash is now known as bashsudo === bashsudo is now known as baneva === baneva is now known as banevade [22:04] join #xubuntu