[00:00] <ScottK2> awen_: Would you be up for looking into Bug #202867?  I'm still focused on trying to get displayconfig to survive with systems that don't need an xorg.conf.
[00:00] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 202867 in kde-guidance "Battery is "not present" in Hardy on hp6720s" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/202867
[00:03] <awen_> ScottK2: not tonight... but i've assigned it to me, and will try to look into it tomorrow
[00:05] <ScottK2> awen_: Great.  Thanks.  It look like a good bug report and a good thing to fix.  I just don't have time.
[00:06] <awen_> ScottK2: yep... and I'm already getting into how g-p-m works internally :)
[00:07] <ScottK2> awen_: Perfect.  I'm sufficiently confused by the displaymanager, I'm glad to have you minding after that.  Please ping me if you have patches to upload.
[00:08] <awen_> ScottK2: I will :)
[00:09] <awen_> ScottK2: and say if you need some testing of the no xorg.conf thing
[00:09] <awen_> (on a system with an xorg.conf ;) )
[00:09] <ScottK2> Will do.
[00:12] <awen_> goodnight people ... needing a restart to test, this must be a hint for shutting down
[02:22] <nixternal> Konsole + amd64 == weird behavior big time
[02:22] <nixternal> I just reinstalled Hardy and it still does the weirdness
[02:22] <daSKreech_> try quadkonsole :)
[02:23] <nixternal> sudo apt-get upgrade
[02:23] <nosrednaekim> in 4.0.2?
[02:23] <nixternal> and konsole will skip lines and hten all of a sudden go in to downloading packages w/o me saying y/n
[02:23] <nixternal> kde 3
[02:23] <nixternal> in Konsole-kde4 works great
[02:30]  * nixternal really likes the new wallypaper in kubuntu-kde3
[02:35] <daSKreech_> which?
[02:37] <nixternal> the new one
[02:37] <nixternal> would be nice to add "Log out and then back in for desktop effects to work correctly" to the Desktop Effects app
[02:39]  * nixternal awaits another dashstar in #kde-devel
[02:39] <nosrednaekim> nixternal: it doesn't automatically start compiz?
[02:40] <nixternal> nosrednaekim: you have to log out and then back in
[02:40] <nosrednaekim> nixternal: could you run it from a konsole? I thought I had told it to start compiz when you select one of the options
[02:41] <nixternal> sure
[02:41] <nixternal> what is the filename before I log back into this box?
[02:41] <nosrednaekim> desktop-effects-kde
[02:41] <nixternal> interesting
[02:41] <nixternal> I have desktop-effects-kde4
[02:42] <nixternal> and I don't even have kde4 installed
[02:42] <nixternal> wow
[02:42] <nixternal> this is weird
[02:43] <nosrednaekim> oh.. ok, that may be what the executable is named
[02:43] <nixternal> nosrednaekim: it worked this time, but the initial setup didn't work
[02:44] <nixternal> getting mad compiz erros though
[02:44] <daSKreech_> dashstar?
[02:44] <nosrednaekim> initial setup?
[02:45] <nixternal> initial being the first time I ran it
[02:45] <nosrednaekim> and do please pastebin the errors.
[02:45] <nixternal> one step ahead of you
[02:46] <nixternal> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/59890
[02:47] <nosrednaekim> thank you.
[02:47] <nixternal> no prob
[02:48] <nixternal> what do I have to install in order to do the custom settings?
[02:48] <nixternal> I forget what they are called
[02:48] <nosrednaekim> nixternal: those are pretty normal errors
[02:48] <nixternal> ok
[02:48] <nixternal> the dbus one didn't look nice
[02:49] <nosrednaekim> nixternal: just punch "ccsm" into a terminal and it will tell you ;)
[02:49] <nosrednaekim> I should put that in the GUI though
[02:49] <nixternal> stupid kwin crashed with compiz
[02:50] <nosrednaekim> oh... you can't close that terminal window...
[02:50] <nixternal> compiz + kde are doing much better together these days
[02:50] <nixternal> it makes kde 3 look that much better
[02:53] <nixternal> do I have to install emerald if I want to change compiz theme(s)?
[02:53] <nosrednaekim> yeah
[02:54] <nosrednaekim> otherwise it just uses the kwin theme
[03:01] <daSKreech_> nixternal: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_VJyTk0G7w
[03:02] <daSKreech_> I installed compiz on hardy to show off to some students and when I put kwin back I couldn't alt+tab
[03:08] <nixternal> ahh, the idiot Bill Hilf
[03:09] <nixternal> he was at UIC last year for Microsoft Days or whatever it was called
[03:09] <nixternal> he said the whole Linux thing because the LUG showed up with a penguin suit, CDs and flyers
[03:13] <daSKreech_> ha ha
[03:14] <daSKreech_> Should have had Migurl there to negotiate
[04:03] <nixternal> alrighty, I am ready for a KDE 3 bug squashing spree!
[04:04] <CheGuevara> :P
[06:09] <CheGuevara> It's been decided that Ubuntu 8.04 will not be deemed an LTS release until the first point release, to allow additional time for bugfixing and polish. Can this please be changed to say "8.04" instead for now?
[06:09] <CheGuevara> huh
[06:38] <nixternal> Jucato: how do you do it? it is 104/105 F in Manila right now
[06:38] <nixternal> jeesh
[06:40] <nixternal> CheGuevara: where did you read that?
[08:06] <Tonio_> hi there
[08:06] <jpatrick> jour Tonio_, Lure
[08:07] <Lure> hello jpatrick & Tonio_!
[10:33] <Nightrose> morning :)
[10:33] <jpatrick> morgen
[10:34] <jussi01> heya Nightrose
[11:43] <_StefanS_> hey all
[11:43] <Nightrose> heya
[11:43] <nosrednaekim> hi guys
[11:44] <Jucato> hi
[11:44] <Jucato> (who's next?)
[12:00] <CheGuevara> nixternal, this bug, not sure which one now
[12:11] <CheGuevara> jpatrick, updated package now in repos, thanks :P
[12:17] <_StefanS_> Tonio_, Riddell: I was wondering if gtk-style-qtcurve shouldn't be accompanied by gtk2-engines-qtcurve, so we'll have the same theme in gtk apps
[12:18] <_StefanS_> thats sort of the way the previous themes worked
[12:19] <Riddell> the gtk-qt engine seems to work
[12:25] <_StefanS_> Riddell: uhm, but does it look like the qtcurve theme?
[12:26] <_StefanS_> I'm not on my laptop right now
[12:29] <Riddell> _StefanS_: sure, that's the whole point.  it also applies kde icons where sensible
[12:30] <_StefanS_> Riddell: ok, no problem then. I just didn't know it worked with qtcurve
[12:44] <jpatrick> CheGuevara: yay!
[12:46] <jpatrick> CheGuevara: seen the changelog? :)
[12:47] <Riddell> _StefanS_: a bug for you :) http://launchpadlibrarian.net/12668995/moire.jpg
[12:47] <Riddell> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kubuntu-default-settings/+bug/201886
[12:47] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 201886 in kubuntu-default-settings "[KDE4] The background-picture of the login in Hardy contains moiré-like patterns" [Medium,Triaged]
[12:56] <_StefanS_> Riddell: already asked the author of the picture, and he couldn't see where those moire patterns should be
[12:56] <_StefanS_> Riddell: so thats probably what the bug will be closed as. I can replicate either on any of my displays
[13:02] <Riddell> _StefanS_: I think the reporter is just seeing something that isn't a problem
[13:02] <Riddell> and is actually quite deliberate
[13:03] <_StefanS_> probably; I will comment on the bug
[13:05] <ScottK> Riddell: At one resolution, I'm still seeing the old artwork.
[13:05] <ScottK> I assume that's not deliberate.
[13:06] <ScottK> At 1024 X 768 and I'll have to log out and log in to see which one.
[13:07] <Riddell> ScottK: there's only one background image
[13:07] <Riddell> wouldn't be resolution dependant
[13:07] <ScottK> OK.
[13:08] <ScottK> The screen that comes up with initializing system services ... still has the dark artwork for me.
[13:15] <Riddell> ScottK: that's ksplash, it has a cache
[13:15] <Riddell> ~/.kde/share/apps/ksplash/cache/Moodin/kubuntu/1024x768/
[13:15] <ScottK> So it's a feature, not a bug?
[13:15] <Riddell> well, both
[13:15] <Riddell> its a feature in that is saves a small amount of time when logging in, its a bug that it doesn't remake the cache when there's a new wallpaper
[13:16] <Riddell> bonus points for fixing that
[13:16] <Riddell> although we don't actually have the splash on the CDs any more
[13:16] <Riddell> _StefanS_: I think I want to set toolbars to flat and menus to colouration background in qtcurve
[13:17] <ScottK> I'm afraid teaching guidance to misbehave at least slightly less it taking all the time I've got available ATM.
[13:17] <jjesse> if i was going to reload my laptop and load up hardy kde4 would it be best to use the kubuntu kde4 alpha6 or the daily live?
[13:19] <Riddell> ScottK: and we love you for it
[13:20] <Riddell> jjesse: kde 4 daily live should be fine
[13:20] <ScottK> Removing those files definitely solved it though.
[13:20] <ScottK> Maybe that would be worth a release not if no one changes it as upgrader would (I assume) have the same problem.
[14:06] <_StefanS_> Riddell: thats fine with me
[14:07] <Riddell> trouble is I don't know how to do it :)
[14:08] <_StefanS_> Riddell: err well, change the configuration, select export from the menu in the bottom right
[14:08] <_StefanS_> Riddell: should give you a config to send off to Tonio_
[14:11] <_StefanS_> gotta run
[14:19] <jpatrick> Riddell: what was the ratione behind removing the wallpaper from Vladstudio?
[14:47] <smarter> jpatrick: not everybody liked it
[14:47] <jpatrick> smarter: ...
[14:48] <jpatrick> smarter: it _rocked_
[14:48] <smarter> it's a default wallpaper, it must be neutral :P
[14:48] <jpatrick> smarter: you obviously didn't see the negative talk about the new one in -offtopic days ago
[14:48] <Riddell> jpatrick: people complainted it was too busy and distracting
[14:49] <jpatrick> Riddell: aww, ah well
[14:50] <NthDegree> I somewhat agree with -offtopic
[14:50] <NthDegree> Gutsy's default artwork on kdm and the wallpaper is cleaner than what I have seen on the Hardy Alpha's
[14:51] <Riddell> sounds like you disagree :)
[14:58] <nareshov> the vladstudio wallpaper rocked :|
[14:58] <Artemis_Fowl> which wallpaper replaced it?
[14:59] <jpatrick> Artemis_Fowl: http://djmattricks.deviantart.com/art/Aquapattern-46516380
[15:00] <Artemis_Fowl> *TOO* neutral
[15:00] <Artemis_Fowl> I didn't really like the other wallpaper but to my humble opinion this one is worse :(
[15:00] <Artemis_Fowl> too neutral I find
[15:04] <nareshov> because the vladstudio wallpaper had patterns the plainer windows stood out
[15:04] <nareshov> ya, the aquapattern looks dumb ;p
[15:06] <seele> nareshov: agree
[15:59] <CheGuevara> jpatrick, what about it
[15:59] <CheGuevara> Riddell, ping
[16:01] <Riddell> hi CheGuevara
[16:01] <CheGuevara> hey Riddell
[16:01] <jpatrick> CheGuevara: nm
[16:01] <CheGuevara> Riddell: wanted to ping you about the kde 4 meta package
[16:01] <CheGuevara> it doesn't include an openoffice.org-kde dependency
[16:01] <CheGuevara> which makes openoffice have no icons
[16:02] <Riddell> none at all?
[16:02] <Riddell> does it depend on openoffice at all?
[16:02] <CheGuevara> the default kde 4 kubuntu installation installs the openoffice components
[16:02] <Riddell> are you talking about kde4-core or kubuntu-kde4-desktop ?
[16:02] <CheGuevara> yeah none at all because they are in a separate package
[16:03] <CheGuevara> kubuntu-kde4-desktop
[16:04] <CheGuevara> the icons are in openoffice.org-style-crystal
[16:05] <Riddell> right, but crystal is the KDE 3 style, and this isn't KDE 3
[16:05] <CheGuevara> which openoffice.org-kde depends on and provides other integration stuff
[16:05] <CheGuevara> yeah
[16:05] <CheGuevara> but we still have no icons :P
[16:05] <CheGuevara> so it has to be soem style
[16:05] <Riddell> so question is do we want KDE 3 style or default openoffice style
[16:05] <CheGuevara> we can have tango
[16:05] <Riddell> ug
[16:05] <CheGuevara> though that would probably look out of place as well
[16:05] <CheGuevara> *though
[16:06] <CheGuevara> actually openoffice.org-style-human is installed
[16:06] <CheGuevara> but it doesn't seem to do anything
[16:07] <Riddell> hmm, that andromeda isn't too pretty
[16:08] <CheGuevara> http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/819/snapshot2cg1.png
[16:08] <CheGuevara> here's what mine looks like :P
[16:09] <jpatrick> CheGuevara: "The boy is turning 19" ?
[16:09] <CheGuevara> my friend's msn name :P
[16:09] <CheGuevara> his bday in 2 days
[16:10] <jpatrick> arg, /me hates msn names
[16:11] <CheGuevara> heh
[16:12]  * jpatrick waves at warren_ 
[16:12] <warren_> hi
[16:12] <CheGuevara> i think crystal will look best Riddell imho
[16:13] <warren_> so can someone look at this very annoying bug? (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdebi/+bug/203199)
[16:13] <CheGuevara> another qustion is do we want kde 3 style menus or gtk ones
[16:13] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 203199 in gdebi "Gdebi(-Kde) can't install any package!" [Undecided,New]
[16:13] <CheGuevara> not even gtk
[16:13] <CheGuevara> java ones
[16:13] <Riddell> kwwii: got an opinion on which icon set to use with openoffice on the kde 4 CD?
[16:14] <warren_> so can someone look at this very annoying bug? (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdebi/+bug/203199)
[16:14] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 203199 in gdebi "Gdebi(-Kde) can't install any package!" [Undecided,New]
[16:14] <jpatrick> warren_: you said :)
[16:15] <warren_> someonr knows if it is fixed for hardy?
[16:15] <CheGuevara> this is bug #197920 btw Riddell
[16:15] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 197920 in kubuntu-kde4-meta "Missing dependencies: openoffice.org-kde" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/197920
[16:15] <ScottK> warren_: How much ram/swap in the machine that does that?
[16:16] <warren_> erm
[16:16] <warren_> ram : 1024
[16:16] <warren_> swap : 256
[16:16] <warren_> but it isn't the memory bug
[16:17] <ScottK> Just checking as there have beein forking issues with low memory systems in the past.
[16:17] <ScottK> warren_: Best check with mhb when he's online.
[16:17] <warren_> ok
[16:17] <warren_> who is it?
[16:17] <warren_> but as reported in english environment it works, not in french kd
[16:17] <warren_> kde*
[16:18] <warren_> livecd kde in english installs, livecd kde in french crashes :(
[16:18] <ScottK> warren_: mhb is his IRC nick.
[16:18] <warren_> ok
[16:18] <warren_> don't you think it is important to have this working in hardy?
[16:18] <ScottK> He's czech so probably knows something about non-English locales.
[16:19] <warren_> but there's not really an error about locales
[16:19] <ScottK> warren_: Personally I'm not a big fan of gdebi, but I understand why other people like it.
[16:19] <warren_> :)
[16:19] <warren_> but even a geek can like gdebi ;)
[16:19] <ScottK> It goes with my distaste for installing things from other than the official repositories.
[16:20] <ScottK> mhb wrote the kde port for gdebi, so he's really your best bet.
[16:20] <warren_> yeah but a simple example : mandvd is a good dvd authoring prog, but is only on getdeb :)
[16:20] <warren_> ok
[16:20] <warren_> will wait until he's only
[16:20] <warren_> but i have to go now
[16:20] <ScottK> warren_: Do you know why it's not in Ubuntu?
[16:20] <warren_> nope
[16:20] <warren_> why?
[16:21] <ScottK> I don't either.
[16:21] <warren_> lol
[16:21] <warren_> because it nobody cared to include it :p
[16:23] <Riddell> CheGuevara: if I install openoffice.org-kde it pics up the crystal icons but not the kde 3 widget style
[16:23] <CheGuevara> Riddell, but do save as
[16:23] <CheGuevara> you'll see a kde 3 file save dialog
[16:25] <Riddell> CheGuevara: not here
[16:25] <Riddell> (on the live CD)
[16:25] <CheGuevara> well thats weird
[16:25] <CheGuevara> sec
[16:26] <CheGuevara> Riddell, http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/7599/snapshot3sb8.png
[16:27] <CheGuevara> thats what mine looks like after installing the package
[16:44] <Riddell> CheGuevara: I've added openoffice.org-kde to the seed, we'll see what happens in the next CD build
[16:48] <kwwii> Riddell: sorry, sick today....I guess it would be best to use crystal for now
[16:48] <CheGuevara> cool thanks
[16:49] <Riddell> kwwii: get well soon
[17:37] <Riddell> apachelogger: did you decide about kdm for kde 4?
[17:43] <ScottK> Riddell: Is it severely evil to assume that if there is no xorg.conf at all and I need to make one it should go in /etx/X11?
[17:43] <Riddell> ScottK: that seems like the only place for it to me
[17:44] <ScottK> Riddell: OK.  Thanks.
[17:44]  * ScottK goes back to klugdes R us.
[18:31] <ScottK> Riddell: I think I'm close to having displayconfig as good as it's going to get.  Two questions: 1.  Do you want me to do another PPA upload and you test it or upload directly?  2.  What do you think about the patches in Bug #149793?  They look sane.  Assuming they test out do you want them for Beta or for the release?
[18:31] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 149793 in displayconfig-gtk "driver list doesn't contain "via" driver" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/149793
[18:33] <ScottK> The bug says gtk, but the first patch at least is in the backend.
[19:13] <ScottK> Riddell: I think I can't make it crash anymore due to lack of xorg.conf.  We can now trade crashing and useless for first time you run displayconfig it'll mess you up.  Pick your monitor, logout, login, and run displayconfig again.  Then it'll work.
[19:13] <Riddell> awooga
[19:14] <ScottK> So I'm gonna upload that and then look at the driver thing and maybe retrieving the monitor config from somewhere after the beta.  Sound good?
[19:14] <ScottK> Riddell: ^^^
[19:15] <Riddell> driver thing?
[19:15] <ScottK> Bug 149793
[19:15] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 149793 in displayconfig-gtk "driver list doesn't contain "via" driver" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/149793
[19:15] <ScottK> Riddell: ^^
[19:15] <ScottK> It looks like a sane way to work.
[19:15] <ScottK> Just need to test it and make sure.  The less we have hard coded in and the more we discover from the system the better in my book.
[19:17] <Riddell> yep
[20:16] <ScottK> Riddell: kde-guidance uploaded.  Should I ask slangesek to accept it or do you want to handle it?
[20:17] <ScottK> nixternal: Are you coordinating beta release notes?
[20:41] <_StefanS_> oh my ... another tough day
[20:41]  * _StefanS_ likes the visual fsck in hardy
[20:41] <_StefanS_> Tonio_: hey
[20:42] <_StefanS_> hey ScottK
[20:43] <ScottK> Hey _StefanS_
[20:43] <_StefanS_> ScottK: pretending to be working again ? :)
[20:43] <ScottK> Yes
[20:44] <ScottK> Although now that I've done another kde-guidance upload I really need to get some actual work done.
[20:45] <_StefanS_> ScottK: I saw some messages on kde-guidance, its displayconfig you've been fixing stuff in ?
[20:45] <ScottK> Mostly.
[20:45] <ScottK> Generally just trying to teach it not to crash.
[20:46] <ScottK> It seems to generally do the right thing if it can just avoid the crash.
[20:46] <ScottK> The biggest thing is trying to survive when there is no xorg.conf because X auto configured.
[20:47] <_StefanS_> ScottK: is it python ?
[20:48] <_StefanS_> the day we can have an empty xorg.conf, is going to be a good day :D
[20:48] <_StefanS_> but it has slimmed alot the past years
[20:48] <ScottK> _StefanS_: Yes.  It's python.
[20:48] <nareshov> _StefanS_: empty xorg.conf - sounds like FreeBSD ;p
[20:49] <ScottK> _StefanS_: For some systems it's apparently empty now, but to deal with it properly would take some significant re-engineering of displayconfig.
[20:49] <_StefanS_> nareshov: does it attempt to autoconfigure each time ?
[20:49]  * ScottK is doing gross hacks to get us to release.
[20:50] <nareshov> _StefanS_: I'm not sure
[20:50] <_StefanS_> ScottK: well good luck with hacking it :)
[20:51] <ScottK> _StefanS_: Do you have some experience with it?
[20:52] <_StefanS_> ScottK: none whatsoever.. only general Xorg understanding
[20:52] <ScottK> OK.  Well that's more than I know about xorg.
[20:52]  * ScottK is pretty sure about that.
[20:52] <_StefanS_> heh
[20:53] <_StefanS_> ScottK: is there something specific you need help on ?
[20:53] <ScottK> My approach is very simplistic.  Crash == Bad.  Not Crash == Good.
[20:53]  * _StefanS_ turns on di.fm
[20:53] <_StefanS_> ScottK: thats called bruteforce.
[20:53] <_StefanS_> or trial and error, depending on the level of attemps ;)
[20:53] <_StefanS_> attempts
[20:53] <ScottK> Not right now.  I need to pick through the displayconfig code some more and figure out how to teach it to extract a monitor configuration to stuff in the new xorg.conf I create.
[20:54] <_StefanS_> ScottK: well let me know.. you can always email me
[20:54] <ScottK> Sure thing.  Thanks.
[20:54] <_StefanS_> ScottK: if I'm not here that is ;)
[20:54] <ScottK> Right
[20:56] <_StefanS_> ah hell I need to do some paid work..
[20:57] <glatzor> ScottK: what is your current problem?
[20:59] <ScottK> glatzor: Currently I patched xorgconfig.py to create an xorg.conf if one is missing.  With this, displayconfig doesn't crash, you select your monitor, restart X, and then set yourself up and it works from there.
[20:59] <ScottK> glatzor: Clearly this is a suboptimal user experience (but better than crashing all the time).
[21:00] <ScottK> glatzor: So the next tset would be for me to patch it to discover the current monitor settings and use those.
[21:00] <glatzor> ScottK: are you using the Debian scripts?
[21:00] <ScottK> tset/step
[21:00] <ScottK> glatzor: No.  I patched xorgconf.py.
[21:03] <glatzor> ScottK: you could call the former autodetection scripts from Debian
[21:03] <glatzor> ScottK: that was my plan some months ago
[21:04] <ScottK> glatzor: OK.  Thanks for the hint.
[21:04] <glatzor> ScottK: Bryce could help you on this.
[21:05] <etretyak> ScottK: or just look at /etc/gdm/failsafeDexconf
[21:05] <ScottK> glatzor: Thanks.  I'll ask him once I'm ready to take the next step.
[21:05] <ScottK> etretyak: Thanks.
[21:27] <daSKreech_> hunger: ping
[21:30] <hunger> daSKreech: pong.
[21:35] <daSKreech_> hunger: saw the mailing list?
[21:36] <hunger> daSKreech: Which one?
[21:36] <daSKreech_> SoC one
[21:36] <jpatrick> #gsoc
[21:36] <hunger> daSKreech: That's grundleborg.
[21:37] <nosrednaekim> ha... the IRC channel is crazy.... odd that ubuntu didn't apply though
[21:37] <daSKreech_> He wants to store the presence info in akonadi?
[21:37] <awen_> smarter: ping?
[21:37] <hunger> daSKreech: Yeap. That was the plan all along.
[21:37] <daSKreech_> I thought that is what decibel does
[21:37] <daSKreech_> decibel does notifications and connections?
[21:38] <hunger> daSKreech: Not yet.
[21:38] <daSKreech_> I meant what's the focus of decibel
[21:38] <daSKreech_> I thought it would keep things like last time logged in and length of time logged in
[21:38] <daSKreech_> why is that in akonadi?
[21:39] <daSKreech_> that makes no sense to me
[21:39] <hunger> daSKreech: Breaking the core logic out of a communication app so that it is easy to provide communication services.
[21:39] <hunger> daSKreech: Akonadi has all the contact data and everything. What sense is there in duplicating that info?
[21:40] <daSKreech_> No
[21:40] <hunger> daSKreech: Decibel connects the presence info, akonadi stores it. It is a PIM data storage engine after all. PIM apps get the presence info along with all the other data.
[21:40] <daSKreech_> I can see it having the contact data
[21:41] <daSKreech_> I don't see the point of it having the presence data
[21:42] <hunger> daSKreech: Akonadi is designed to aggregate "long-term" data and "short term" data. So why write a new storage engine?
[21:42] <daSKreech_> oh
[21:42] <daSKreech_> hmm
[21:42] <daSKreech_> wasn't aware it had a long term focus
[21:42] <daSKreech_> like stats?
[21:42] <awen_> is anyone up for some screen-brightness testing? ... kde-guidance-powermanager package (i386) avaible at http://awen.dk/packages ; I'm interested in knowing if I am the only one, where the popup only appears on using brightness down key but not up
[21:42] <hunger> daSKreech: It won't get pushed into LDAP or anything... it will just live in the local akonadi "cache" or whatever it is called.
[21:43] <ScottK> awen_: I just uploaded a new version.  The one in my PPA is the same (module the top changelog entry) as is waiting for release manager acceptance.  You migh want to work off that.
[21:43]  * ScottK needs to go, so see you all later.
[21:43] <hunger> daSKreech: No, presence is "short term" only. We will probably need to store some data long-term to find a good connection later.
[21:44] <awen_> ScottK: okay, thanks... I'll go get that one instead
[21:44] <daSKreech_> hunger: Ok again confused :)
[21:44] <daSKreech_> I though that Decibel would facilitate things like nepomuk being able to tell you the time you are most likely to find a contact online
[21:45] <hunger> daSKreech: Anyway: IMHO presence needs to go together with contact data. That is what apps use and if we want to get the apps developers to include presence, etc. then we need to make it as easy as possible for them to get the info.
[21:45] <daSKreech_> or the IRC chan they share with you the most
[21:45] <hunger> daSKreech: That is why presence should go into akonadi IMHO.
[21:46] <hunger> daSKreech: A unrelated issue is that decibel needs to find the best way to connect to somebody.
[21:47] <hunger> daSKreech: To do that we will need some info like that guy is online there or is using jabber more often than MSN.
[21:50] <hunger> daSKreech: Need to catch some sleep. See you around.
[21:50] <daSKreech_> hunger: Hmm ok I need to rethink what I thought of decibel then. I knew about the connection manager I just thought it was more central than that
[21:50] <daSKreech_> Night man
[21:53] <smarter> awen_: pong
[21:54] <smarter> awen_: you want me to test your package?
[21:55] <awen_> smarter: it's the same as yesterday... just wanted to know, how it turned out? "I'm interested in knowing if I am the only one, where the popup only appears on using brightness down key but not up"
[21:57] <smarter> awen_: the brightness keys work but the popup still doesn't appear
[21:58] <smarter> the dcop calls work fine(popup + percentage change) but it doesn't change brightness
[21:59] <awen_> smarter: if you go into system settings > keyboard shortcuts is it then to use the brightness keys as a shortcut key?
[22:00] <awen_> s/then to/then possible to/
[22:04] <smarter> there's no shortcut related to brightness here
[22:04] <smarter> must be an acpi thing
[22:05] <awen_> smarter: there is no shortcut, no... but if you randomly choose an event on the list, can you then assign your brightness keys to that event?
[22:06] <smarter> no
[22:07] <smarter> but it even works at grub prompt, so there must be some black acpi magic behind that
[22:07] <awen_> smarter: okay... then it's your brightness keys not getting detected at all; bad test-case for this purpose :)
[22:08] <awen_> smarter: it't probably done in hardware ;)
[22:09] <Riddell> ScottK: dpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/python-qt-dev_3.17.4-1ubuntu3_all.deb (--unpack): trying to overwrite `/usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/pyqtconfig.py', which is also in package python-qt3
[22:09] <Riddell> when trying to test your guidance upload
[22:09] <ScottK> Weird
[22:10] <ScottK> Riddell: I undid the move of pyqtconfig to python-qt3 from python-qt-dev, but that was over a week ago.
[22:11] <Riddell> ScottK: right, but you didn't add a conflict/replace
[22:11] <ScottK> Urgh.
[22:11] <ScottK> Yeah.
[22:11]  * Riddell adds one
[22:12] <ScottK> Thanks.  Sorry about that.
[22:14]  * awen_ re-uploaded the kde-guidance-powermanager based on ScottK's newest package: http://awen.dk/packages ... if anyone is on a laptop, i would really appreciate a test if it works for none/one/both brightness keys
[22:20] <Riddell> awen_: let me look
[22:26] <awen_> Riddell: thanks... installing the package and restarting g-p-m is sufficient
[22:30] <ScottK> Riddell: python-kde3 is going to have the same problem as python-qt3 re conflicts/replaces (double urg - I can fix it in ~4 hours or so).
[22:39] <Riddell> awen_: makes no difference to my problem (won't raise brightness)
[22:40] <awen_> Riddell: it will only decrease brightness, right?
[22:40] <Riddell> awen_: yes, but you don't have that problem?
[22:41] <awen_> Riddell: no, but only 'cause my PC does the decrease in hardware
[22:41] <awen_> Riddell: try starting kdcop and using the guidance-xxxx > brightnessUp function... dows that work?
[22:41] <Riddell> yep
[22:42] <Riddell> and xev does show it making XF86LaunchE
[22:42] <Riddell> which is the key kmilo uses to call dcop
[22:43] <awen_> Riddell: exactly... for some reason kmilo doesn't pick up the XF86LaunchE
[22:43] <Riddell> maybe something else is trying to?
[22:43] <Riddell> anyway, I've uploaded your guidance awen_
[22:45] <awen_> Riddell: that was my thought too... but I haven't been able to find any reference to that in any of kdelibs, kdeutils, kdebase
[22:45] <awen_> Riddell: thanks :)
[22:46]  * awen_ wonders if there is any other source making sense to look into
[22:52] <ScottK> Riddell: Was there something you didn't like in my kde-guidance upload (I just got a reject notification)?
[22:53] <Riddell> ScottK: yeah, I perferred awen's :)
[22:53] <ScottK> Riddell: OK.  So that's his fixes plus mine then?
[22:53] <awen_> ScottK: it is :)
[22:53] <ScottK> Great.  Thanks .
[22:57] <Riddell> ScottK: the only change in python-kde3 is "Remove build-dep on python-qt3", no files got moved
[23:23] <ScottK> Ah.  Nevermind then.
[23:23]  * ScottK blames the flu I'm still recovering from.
[23:34] <nixternal> ScottK: ya, I am going to start working on the release notes shortly
[23:34] <apachelogger> Riddell: yeah, kdm-kde4 is ready, also looks better than kdm-kde3 ;-)
[23:35] <Riddell> seele: seen https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuDefaultSettings ?
[23:36] <Riddell> apachelogger: thanks
[23:37] <nixternal> bah, I hate getting sick