[00:03] <fdoving> it is so stupid to have separate channels.
[00:56] <apachelogger> jussio1: because?
[00:58] <jussio1> apachelogger: often people working on the packages understand well how they work, as well as how to use them, thus bein able to offer valuable help to others if they have time :)
[00:58] <apachelogger> good point
[00:59] <apachelogger> though, if one needs a pro to understand the packages, there is something wrong usababilitywise IMHO
[01:00] <jussio1> true.
[01:19] <seele> if you ahve to understand the packages to use kde4 there is a problem
[01:28] <nixternal> heh, for having such a small community, we have 4 IRC channels
[01:28] <nixternal> 5
[01:28] <jussio1> whats the fifth?
[01:29] <nixternal> #kubuntu, #kubuntu-offtopic, #kubuntu-kde4, #kubuntu-testers, #kubuntu-devel
[01:29] <jussio1> kubuntu -devel -offtopic -kde4 and ??
[01:29] <jussio1> ahh, testers
[01:29] <nixternal> I forgot all about #kubuntu-kde4
[01:30] <jussio1> just testing there were you nixternal? :P
[01:31] <nixternal> no, I ran the wrong command to join the channel
[01:32] <jussio1> heh
[01:32]  * nixternal removes that ancient script
[01:32] <seele> what is kubuntu-offtopic?
[01:32] <nixternal> If I type /jo and hit tab to complete, it will do /joinopped
[01:33] <nixternal> seele: just a channel for offtopic talk
[01:33] <nixternal> rather boring actually
[01:33]  * seele looks around
[01:33] <jussio1> ahh
[01:33] <jussio1> seele: somewhere to just chat about whatever
[01:33] <seele> ah
[01:45] <jussio1> Alrighty then, Im off to bed.
[01:45] <jussio1> bye all
[02:21] <CheGuevara> Riddell, can you take a look at bugs 204848 and 199287 please
[02:21] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 204848 in meta-kde4 "[Hardy] KDE4 Konqueror and System Settings complain about missing shared library" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204848
[02:21] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 199287 in kubuntu-kde4-meta "File Associations Settings Module Broken Under KDE4 (Hardy)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/199287
[02:21] <ScottK2> CheGuevara: Riddell's not around this weekend I don't think.
[02:21] <nosrednaekim> Riddell away till tomorrow night
[02:22] <CheGuevara> oh
[02:22] <CheGuevara> may be he'll see it when he wakes up
[02:22] <CheGuevara> anyone else who can deal with the meta seed can take a look as well :P
[03:05] <CheGuevara> sleep time
[03:05] <CheGuevara> good night
[06:02] <druke> greetings, Druke here from the bug team, I jsut wanted to know the best way to triage https://launchpad.net/bugs/205418 this for you guys since we're not getting alot of kubuntu response on launchpad
[06:02] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 205418 in kubuntu-kde4-meta "many libraries and programs in KDE4 missing - should include the metapackage "kde4" as dependency" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[14:41] <nareshov> Does anyone have the earlier vladstudio wallpaper of hardy?
[14:41] <nareshov> I upgraded and lost it :<
[15:13] <jussio1> nareshov: I think its available from the vladstudio site
[15:19]  * nareshov seeks the wallpaper
[15:44] <etretyak_> nareshov: try to download prev version of kubuntu-default-settings
[15:45] <etretyak_> nareshov: or where is it located (i mean wallpaper)
[15:50] <nareshov> etretyak_: I got http://www.apple.com/downloads/macosx/icons_screensavers/vladstudiowallpapersetvolume8.html instead ;p
[15:52] <etretyak_> nareshov: is it with vladstudio (c) in bottom right corner?
[15:52] <nareshov> it does has vladstudio written down there. :|
[15:59] <etretyak_> nareshov: https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/kubuntu-default-settings/1:8.04-9/+files/kubuntu-default-settings_8.04-9.tar.gz
[16:00] <etretyak_> nareshov: look in artwork/kubuntu-wallpaper.jpg ;-)
[16:01]  * nareshov *drools*
[16:17] <fdoving>  where is the scaling_governor set/reset on suspend/resume? - mine always is set to performance after resuming. and it's not the stuff one would expect, in /etc/acpi/
[16:22] <apachelogger> txwikinger: doesn't triaged mean a bug has a solution and therefore is ready to be fixed by a dev?
[16:23] <txwikinger> apachelogger: That is the general aim, yes
[16:23] <txwikinger> well, one of the three outcomes
[16:24] <txwikinger> it could also be rejected, because of duplication or not a bug etc.
[16:24] <apachelogger> bug #189920 was just wasting my time then :P
[16:24] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 189920 in kdebase "Google reader don't work wery well with kde4's konqueror" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/189920
[16:25] <txwikinger> Well, why?
[16:25] <apachelogger> because we have to wait for upstream
[16:26] <txwikinger> well.. aren't you upstream too?
[16:26] <txwikinger> :D
[16:26] <apachelogger> uhh KDE is not only khtml :P
[16:27] <txwikinger> Well the bug is reported and confirmed in the KDE bugtracker
[16:27] <txwikinger> So I would hope they fix it
[16:27] <txwikinger> And due to the low severity, I do not think there is any reason for a kubuntu specific patch
[16:28] <apachelogger> I doubt they will do it
[16:28] <apachelogger> google breaks their stuff every once in a while
[16:28] <apachelogger> I think you need a full time employed dev to keep up with all the changes in google's sites
[16:29] <nareshov> hehe
[16:29] <txwikinger> well.. we could also decide not to fix it then.
[16:29] <txwikinger> However, I don't want to make that decision by myself... but I would support it for this report
[16:30] <apachelogger> just mark it confirmed so I don't look at it the next 5 times I upload a new base :P
[16:30] <apachelogger> anyway
[16:30] <txwikinger> Do we have any meeting/panel/council to make such deicion?
[16:30] <txwikinger> ok.. I will
[16:30] <apachelogger> http://suseforums.net/index.php?showtopic=39593 sounds rather strange  which is what https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdebase-kde4/+bug/183289 is about
[16:30] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 183289 in kdeutils-kde4 "Superkaramba-kde4 is not able to run some themes" [Low,Confirmed]
[16:31] <apachelogger> txwikinger: in my most humble opinion we should just forward upstream bug reports and close the bug in launchpad
[16:31] <apachelogger> I don't see much need for us to track such bugs since we are certainly not patching such a fix in our packages
[16:31] <nosrednaekim> how well does superkaramba-kde4 work?
[16:31] <txwikinger> well.. I think we should have a status .. forwarded
[16:32] <txwikinger> it should be closed when the fix is synced
[16:32] <apachelogger> nosrednaekim: I have no idea
[16:32] <apachelogger> txwikinger: as long as it doesn't flood the open bugs list anymore I am happy
[16:32] <txwikinger> otherwise it is more difficult to search for duplicates
[16:33]  * nosrednaekim apt-get installs it
[16:33] <txwikinger> well.. how about a filter confirmed|triaged with no forwarding
[16:34] <apachelogger> nosrednaekim: please also install kdeutils-dbg-kde4 and see whether you can gather some information why liquid weather fails to run
[16:35] <nosrednaekim> alright... I'll see how bug that is
[16:35] <nosrednaekim> *big
[16:36] <txwikinger> apachelogger: Did you see this one? Bug #205517
[16:36] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 205517 in dolphin "[hardy] Problem launching Kate by choosing a textfile from Dolphin" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/205517
[16:36] <txwikinger> I think I should forward that one, or does it have something to do with the kubuntu environment?
[16:36] <apachelogger> well
[16:37] <apachelogger> 1. is that kate 3?
[16:37] <apachelogger> 2. if so, it is a common issue
[16:37] <apachelogger> 3. I have no idea why this happens and last time I checked back with some devs they weren't very willing to investigate
[16:37] <txwikinger> It is Kate 4
[16:37] <apachelogger> ok
[16:37] <apachelogger> then it should not happen
[16:38] <txwikinger> My question is, does it only occur on Kubuntu, or also on other KDE installations
[16:39] <txwikinger> I guess I will have a search in the KDE bugtracker
[16:39] <nosrednaekim> apachelogger: well, just tried loading all three of my superkaramba themes and they are all complaining about KROSS stuff.... I should probably install the kde3 version of superkaramba
[16:39] <apachelogger> I dunno
[16:39] <fdoving> is kate the default editor?
[16:39] <apachelogger> txwikinger: btw, it is caused by kdeinit AFAIK
[16:39] <apachelogger> fdoving: no
[16:39] <fdoving> ok.
[16:40] <txwikinger> I open with "open with"
[16:40] <apachelogger> nosrednaekim: did you install the dbg package? if so, start skaramba from konsole and paste the output
[16:40] <apachelogger> txwikinger: oha!
[16:40] <txwikinger> kdeinit is kdebase?
[16:40] <apachelogger> that is nifty
[16:40] <apachelogger> txwikinger: libs I think
[16:40] <apachelogger> hm
[16:40] <apachelogger> there it is
[16:40] <apachelogger> god, I hate that bug
[16:41] <txwikinger> Don't complain.. fix it :D
[16:41] <nosrednaekim> BBIAB, lunch
[16:42] <apachelogger> txwikinger: that is an awful amount of work
[16:42] <apachelogger> especially since the new attitude in all KDE projects seems to be 'cut-the-debug-output'
[16:42] <txwikinger> well.. less partying for you then ;)
[16:42] <apachelogger> I had to add 30 debug messages to track a bug in amarok's media detection
[16:43] <apachelogger> hm
[16:43] <apachelogger> here is my thought about superkaramba + kross: our kross is missing stuff
[16:44] <txwikinger> Nothing in the kde bugtracker yet
[16:44] <apachelogger> I only see kross core stuff in our packages but not the actual language libs
[16:46] <txwikinger> well.. there is an old bug on 3.2.0
[16:47] <druke> did you guys get my message about Bug #205418
[16:47] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 205418 in kubuntu-kde4-meta "many libraries and programs in KDE4 missing - should include the metapackage "kde4" as dependency" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/205418
[16:47]  * apachelogger starts smashing his head
[16:47] <apachelogger> kdeutils-dbg-kde4 depends kdelibs-dbg-kde4 which is actually kde4libs
[16:47] <apachelogger> that makes me cry
[16:47] <apachelogger> really
[16:47] <apachelogger> can't get unified package naming ... once
[16:48] <apachelogger> hm, leaving is always a good idea :P
[16:49] <nosrednaekim> <_<
[16:49] <txwikinger> do we have already a proper liveCD for KDE4?
[16:49] <cheguevara_> ooh apachelogger more dependency hell :P
[16:49] <cheguevara_> txwikinger, yes
[16:49] <apachelogger> proper is a dangerous word
[16:50] <txwikinger> No.. not the word... the confirmation is :D
[16:50] <apachelogger> cheguevara_: one day....
[16:50] <apachelogger> btw
[16:50] <apachelogger> I have the most awesome solution for the konqueror kcm issue
[16:50] <apachelogger> we just move all the konqueror/html related stuff in the konqueror package
[16:50] <apachelogger> actually I think it's the same way in KDE 3
[16:51] <cheguevara_> what about big meta from debian?
[16:51] <cheguevara_> or is that irrelevant
[16:52] <apachelogger> ahhhh
[16:52] <apachelogger> cheguevara_: metas don't fix dependencies
[16:52] <apachelogger> they make them even worse
[16:52] <apachelogger> because it takes longer to spot the issues
[16:52] <apachelogger> ha!
[16:52] <apachelogger> I found kross
[16:52] <apachelogger> http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/KDE/kdebindings/ruby/krossruby/
[16:52] <cheguevara_> i made diff
[16:52] <cheguevara_> not meta
[16:52] <cheguevara_> don't know where meta came from :P
[16:52] <cheguevara_> arrgh
[16:52] <cheguevara_> s/made/meant
[16:54] <apachelogger> well, since debian caused the issue... :P
[16:54] <cheguevara_> lol
[16:54] <cheguevara_> may be something to bring up in #debian-qt-kde
[16:56] <apachelogger> yeah, just not by me as I am a foulish ubuntu dude :P
[16:56] <apachelogger> anyway
[16:56] <apachelogger> http://packages.ubuntu.com/source/hardy/kdebindings-kde4
[16:56] <apachelogger> why does that package not create packages?
[16:56] <nosrednaekim> apachelogger: kdeutils-dbg-kde4: Depends: kdelibs-dbg-kde4 (>= 4:4.0.0) but it is not installable
[16:57] <apachelogger> nosrednaekim: I saied that earlier
[16:57] <apachelogger> omg
[16:57] <apachelogger> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6021/
[16:57] <apachelogger> rofl
[16:57] <apachelogger> :D
[16:58] <nosrednaekim> apachelogger: ah.. is that what all that was about :p
[16:58] <apachelogger> I always like a good copyright file
[16:58] <apachelogger> nosrednaekim: yeah
[16:58]  * apachelogger is braindumping right now
[16:59] <Riddell> hi all, what did I miss?
[16:59] <apachelogger> Oo
[17:00] <apachelogger> ha! just in time
[17:00] <apachelogger> wb Riddell
[17:00]  * apachelogger gives Riddell the award for the strangest package ever seen
[17:00] <apachelogger> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdebindings-kde4/4:4.0.2-0ubuntu1
[17:01] <nosrednaekim> hey Riddell :)
[17:01] <apachelogger> kross supports 4 or 5 languages
[17:01] <apachelogger> and we have packaged ... one
[17:01] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: apparently apachelogger had too much coffee....
[17:02] <apachelogger> only 2
[17:02] <apachelogger> though, I just wanted to improve the base-kde4 packaging and meanwhile read like 20 bug reports and investigated on 3 more packages... that is not going to end well
[17:03] <nixternal> how many of these changes will be overwritten with changes when kde 4.0.3 is released in a couple of weeks?
[17:04] <Riddell> apachelogger: kdebindings is very incomplete
[17:05] <Riddell> the debian maintainer of qtruby is supposed to be doing that side but hasn't
[17:05] <Riddell> I should add qyoto to it but havn't
[17:05]  * apachelogger nods
[17:05] <Riddell> and pykde is now made by a separate package
[17:05] <Riddell> so infact its not used at all currently
[17:06] <apachelogger> well, superkarmba does
[17:06] <apachelogger> bug #183289
[17:06] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 183289 in kdeutils-kde4 "Superkaramba-kde4 is not able to run some themes" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/183289
[17:07] <apachelogger> Riddell: so, should I improve the kdebindings-kde4 package or leave it rotten?
[17:09] <Riddell> apachelogger: if you want to add ruby and c# support to it that could be great
[17:09] <Riddell> not sure if there's other languages in it
[17:10] <Riddell> also comment out pykde until it gets synced with Jim's version
[17:10] <apachelogger> ok
[17:13] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: nothing on the kde-print mailing list BTW...
[17:14] <apachelogger> Riddell: oh, if you have time... gtk-qt-engine-kde4 is waiting in the hardy queue
[17:14] <Riddell> nosrednaekim: hopefully that means everyone agrees :)
[17:15] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: :) won't that nasty Oxygen problem need to get fixed first?
[17:16] <Riddell> nosrednaekim: it would be nice, but I don't think its a requirement
[17:21] <mhb> good evening my friends
[17:21] <fdoving> evening mhb
[17:26] <nixternal> interesting...someone decided to continue syncing smb4k incorporating the super old releases which allow it to totally muck up your sudoers file
[17:26] <fdoving> nice feature :)
[17:26] <nixternal> I had the fix cherry picked at one point, but that has since been removed
[17:27] <nixternal> ScottK2: can I FFe smb4k from 0.8.6 to 0.9.3 to fix a critical bug or do I have to cherry pick through the code again?
[17:28] <mhb> hmm, a bit more people than yesterday, so I'll ask again: what's your opinion on PolicyKit? Is Kubuntu planning to embrace it because our Ubuntu friends did? Do you think it's a neat idea?
[17:30] <Riddell> mhb: yes but its an upstream issue
[17:30] <mhb> hrm.
[17:30] <mhb> okay
[17:30] <fdoving> what is it?
[17:30] <nixternal> if we don't implement it, we would be the only distro not doing so it seems now
[17:30] <fdoving> i already hate apparmor.
[17:30] <mhb> I guess I'm the only unix loving person around :o)
[17:31] <txwikinger> Happy Easter folks
[17:31] <nixternal> happy easter to you too txwikinger
[17:31] <ScottK2> nixternal: What all uses it?  If it's just used by KDE4, then I'd go FFe.
[17:31] <nixternal> smb4k is a kde3 apps
[17:31] <nixternal> a fairly popular one
[17:31] <ScottK2> OK.
[17:31] <nixternal> if I can just ffe it that is great, otherwise I have to do the entire security route and cherry pick through the repos
[17:31] <mhb> happy easter
[17:31] <ScottK2> nixternal: Apply engineering judgement and look at the risk.
[17:32] <ScottK2> happy Easter mhb
[17:32] <nixternal> that's what I am doing now
[17:32] <ScottK2> nixternal: You tell me what the best answer is.  If there are regressions are you up for chasing them?
[17:33] <mhb> fdoving: it somehow elevates an applications privileges using the panacea of the day, D-Bus
[17:35] <mhb> fdoving: which I'm sure will complicate code and slow down the system so we can have this nice unlocking like OS X does
[17:36] <mhb> fdoving: all above personal opinions of a person sceptical of most of the "wow" technologies Ubuntu is adapting
[17:36] <fdoving> it most certainly is better than kdesudo anyway. so if keeping that is an option  i'll vote for policykit-integration :)
[17:37] <mhb> why so?
[17:37] <fdoving> kdesudo sucks.
[17:37] <mhb> you mean the concept is better than sudoing?
[17:37] <mhb> or
[17:37] <mhb> the app is not good
[17:37] <mhb> two different things, I think
[17:38] <fdoving> or the app is not good. a complete rewrite to use policykit would probably be a good thing :)
[17:38] <mhb> you mean rewriting ALL the apps that want more privileges is better?
[17:38] <nixternal> ScottK2: you want to know who did the sync request that killed my changes in smb4k?
[17:38] <nixternal> a cookie if you can guess :)
[17:39] <mhb> nixternal: I'd say it was me, but I wasn't, so I blame you
[17:39] <Riddell> apachelogger: accepted gtk-qt-engine-kde4
[17:39] <fdoving> mhb: not unless upstream starts depending on it. we can't rewrite KDE to work with it.
[17:40] <mhb> I still think we're doing too many "wow! New dbus thing, let's adopt it!" decisions
[17:40] <mhb> we as in both Kubuntu and KDE
[17:41] <Riddell> I'd say not enough
[17:41] <fdoving> kde already use dbus everywhere. dbus is nice.
[17:41] <mhb> Riddell: when last we have decided something that speeds the system up, that simplifies code?
[17:41]  * mhb doesn't remember
[17:42] <fdoving> using something else to do that kind of stuff is just plain stupid.
[17:42] <mhb> sure, this whole rights concept in UNIX never worked
[17:42] <mhb> let's abandon it
[17:42] <apachelogger> Riddell: thanks :)
[17:42] <fdoving> what happens with ubuntu is that their upstream, gnome relies on policykit. they can't ignore it.
[17:43] <mhb> fdoving: so I guess I should shut up and not ignore it, too?
[17:44] <fdoving> mhb: my opinion is that this is a kde issue. discuss it there. send a i-dont-ever-want-policykit-support mail to kde-core-devel
[17:45] <mhb> ah, I forgot, this is not a discussion channel
[17:45] <Riddell> mhb: kde 4
[17:46] <apachelogger> the need for discussion is a usability issue IMO
[17:47] <fdoving> i didn't mean that we shouldn't discuiss it. but i don't think it makes sense for kubuntu to implement policykit in kde. also if kde starts depending on policykit we can't remove it.
[17:49]  * mhb gets back to CS theory, where elegant solutions are appreciated
[17:51] <mhb> fdoving: I'm afraid I'm not on the right secret MLs, so I tend to discuss stuff here.
[17:53] <fdoving> brb. move to the correct gate.
[17:55] <mhb> it's totally offtopic, but I'm feeling more and more detached from KDE (and GNOME) because of the decisions the project make
[17:56] <mhb> what I think is that they're trading old and very functional concepts for bling
[17:56] <mhb> and they're not looking into the future much
[17:57] <mhb> I'm fairly sure PolicyKit will be replaced by yet another concept in KDE 5
[17:57] <mhb> because why not? It'll get rewritten anyway
[17:58] <Riddell> KDE doesn't have any secret technical mailing lists
[18:03] <mhb> Riddell: I'm sure they're just talking about the philosophy of life there, nothing techinical :o) What I mean is, every decision related to KDE is technical to an extent, and there are secret mailing lists where those are being made
[18:04] <mhb> Riddell: it's all about how you treat the people - if they treat me as second class, as a non-member, I'm not willing to promote them.
[18:07] <Nightrose> mhb: what stops you from getting in?
[18:09] <Riddell> that's quite a serious acusation, and i can assure you it's not true
[18:10] <mhb> Riddell: so you say nothing techical whatsoever is discussed there?
[18:11] <Riddell> mhb: correct, the e.v. list is quite strictly controlled for that
[18:12] <mhb> Riddell: good
[18:13] <mhb> although I'd prefer if there was a way I could see for myself
[18:13] <mhb> and not just me, everyone
[18:14] <Riddell> you want to see what e.v. discuss?  here http://ev.kde.org/reports/2006.php
[18:15] <Riddell> http://ev.kde.org/reports/2007.php
[18:15] <mhb> and that's certainly all of it
[18:15] <mhb> no other discussions were there
[18:16] <mhb> nah, I'm fairly sure there were other ones, even if it were "unimportant", I still can't see for myself
[18:16] <Riddell> that's all that was discussed at those meetings
[18:17] <mhb> see for oneself means seeing without having to trust an insider
[18:17] <mhb> forget it
[18:18] <mhb> it's just my personal definition of "free software" as in "uncensored"
[18:19] <fdoving> nice, dbus-daemon segfaulted.
[18:20] <mhb> Riddell: also, I don't think KDE 4 is any faster than KDE 3, perhaps by a small constant
[18:21] <mhb> Riddell: but forget that as well
[18:21] <mhb> it's just me
[19:34] <mhb> have I ruined your mood or something? :o)
[19:41] <Riddell> moi?  I'm in bed with a beautiful girl, my mood is good
[19:42]  * yuriy wonders why/how he's on irc if that's so
[19:42] <nixternal> Riddell: simmer down!
[19:42] <jussio1> Riddell: your laptop? :P
[19:43] <Riddell> beautiful girl and laptop and I just killed ktip
[19:43]  * ScottK2 wonders if the laptop has a camera.
[19:43] <Riddell> my mood is good
[19:44] <nixternal> hahaha, buhbye ktip!
[19:44]  * jussio1 leaves...
[19:45] <Riddell> no camera
[19:46] <Riddell> krissy would dump me if i did
[19:46] <nixternal> hahahaha
[19:46] <Riddell> shes lovely
[19:46] <nixternal> I haven't heard the word "dump" in reference to ending a relationship since high school :p
[19:46] <nixternal> Riddell: you been drinkin' the Irn again?
[19:46] <Riddell> krissy wrote it
[19:47] <nixternal> Riddell: you are so KDE it isn't even funny, your girlfriend's name even starts with a K :)
[19:48] <mhb> ah, the mood's up again :o)
[19:48] <Riddell> shes ery proud of that
[19:48] <Riddell> very
[19:48] <nixternal> hehe, groovy
[19:49] <nixternal> haha, my x calls my daughter vivi, so we were just chatting and it hit me, so I started calling her emacs...my daughter didn't get it but my x did
[19:50] <nosrednaekim> ^_^
[19:50] <nixternal> I would call her Kate, but that is my other x's name, and my other x, whom I am working at reconciling with, would kill me
[19:51] <nosrednaekim> heh
[19:51] <mhb> too many variables :o)
[19:51] <mhb> label the other one y
[19:51] <mhb> so we know which is which .o)
[19:51] <nixternal> hahahaha
[19:51] <nosrednaekim> y should x be named y?
[19:51] <mhb> or perhaps indexes
[19:52] <mhb> the relationship is a complex equation, after all
[19:52] <ScottK2> Riddell: I'm testing the updated kdebase with cjwatson's man page change now.  I'll likely upload it later today.
[19:52] <Riddell> ScottK2: great
[19:52] <mhb> but luckily, there's always a solution
[19:52] <mhb> the fundamental theorem of relationships guarantees that
[19:53] <nosrednaekim> mhb: women == sqrt(evil)?
[19:54] <mhb> nosrednaekim: like that one too
[19:55] <nixternal> mhb: you just expressed a new level of geek, when you request variables for relationships :p
[19:57] <nosrednaekim> nixternal: you running hardy? how do the ati drivers work with suspend?
[19:57] <nixternal> ati/radeon or fglrx?
[19:57] <nosrednaekim> fglrx
[19:58] <nixternal> fglrx sucks so I don't use it
[19:58] <nixternal> never tested suspend
[19:58] <nixternal> fglrx + KDE 4 + compositing == freezes for me
[19:58] <nixternal> that is on amd64 though
[19:59] <nosrednaekim> are we releaseing a beta close to april 1st?
[20:00] <nixternal> why, you have a good joke to go with it?
[20:00] <nosrednaekim> yeah....
[20:00] <nixternal> I am already planning on "Microsoft chooses GPL" one
[20:01] <nosrednaekim> turn the whole KDE4 CD into "OMG PONIES" and pink fluffy bunny theme XD
[20:01] <nixternal> nice
[20:01] <nixternal> that is a good one...didn't we do that for one release before?
[20:01] <nosrednaekim> not while I have been around
[20:01] <nosrednaekim> ~2 years
[20:02] <nixternal> maybe that was the naked people one or something I am thinking of
[20:03] <nosrednaekim> since the communtiy CD is user supported and all, does it fall victim to the UI freeze?
[20:05] <nixternal> not if it is a joke I wouldn't think
[20:05] <nixternal> though we just did some UI changes which totally hozed all of our documentation, and there is nothing that can be done to fix it
[20:05]  * nosrednaekim goes to check out the release schedult
[20:05] <nixternal> ^^ that was a joke btw
[20:05] <nosrednaekim> :)
[20:07] <nosrednaekim> it doesn't say when the next RC/beta is coming
[20:09] <nosrednaekim> who would I have to ask to do a thing like that?
[20:10] <ScottK2> kdebase uploaded.
[20:10]  * ScottK2 crosses fingers ...
[20:27] <Riddell> nosrednaekim: ubuntu?
[20:27] <Riddell> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/HardyReleaseSchedule
[20:27] <Riddell>    April 17th
[20:27] <Riddell> ReleaseCandidate,
[20:28] <Riddell>  
[20:28] <Riddell>    April 24th  FinalRelease
[20:30] <apachelogger> Riddell: the ruby bindings have no soversions, though the libs' name changed from korundum.rb to korundum4.rb ... should I name the package libkorundum4-ruby1.8?
[20:31] <apachelogger> or libkorundum4-0-ruby1.8 ... woah that looks awful
[20:33] <Riddell> apachelogger: dunno, is there a Debian Ruby policy?
[20:34] <apachelogger> hm
[20:34] <apachelogger> there is really a policy for everything :D
[20:36] <dasKreech> Is there a policy for exceptions to policy making?
[20:39] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: ah, ok, I was looking at a ubuntu page an it was a bit old
[20:40] <apachelogger> hm
[20:41] <apachelogger> apparently libkorundum0-ruby1.8 shouldn't have been named libkorundum0 but libkorundum-ruby1.8
[20:41] <apachelogger> this is all going to end in one big mess
[20:43] <apachelogger> well, there is the problem -.-
[20:44] <Riddell> apachelogger: if its messy just leave it as it is and let the Debian maintainer sort it out
[20:44] <apachelogger> :P
[20:44] <Riddell> else we risk messing it up the wrong way
[20:44] <apachelogger> Riddell: ultimately I make everything explode, so nothing to worry about
[20:44] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: so, I guess if there isn't going to be a beta released then, it be kinda hard to do a april fool's release?
[20:45] <Riddell> nosrednaekim: if you have a comedy april 1st joke we can upload that easily enough
[20:50] <Riddell> nosrednaekim: did you fix anything in system-config-priner-applet-kde?
[20:52] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: yeah, I did, as well as added a feature commit. you can now pause jobs that are being "processed"
[20:52] <Riddell> rdieter: has fedora packaged python-kde4?
[20:53] <Riddell> nosrednaekim: you set APPDIR="/home/michael/kubuntu/kde-port", do you know why you had to do that, didn't if os.path.exists("system-config-printer.ui"): APPDIR="."  work?
[20:54] <rdieter> Riddell: python-kde4?  Is that kdebindings and/or PyKDE4 or something else?
[20:54] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: ah,ok, I was just going to change around the Kde4 theme to being Pink and all...I guess I can just send someone a modified kubuntu-default-settings (or is there an equivalient package for kde4?
[20:54] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: no, it didn't...
[20:54] <Riddell> rdieter: its in kdebindings yes
[20:55] <nosrednaekim> oh wait... maybe it would have if I would of commented out your line...
[20:55] <rdieter> Riddell: then, yes.
[20:55] <rdieter> Riddell: for system-config-printer-applet-kde ?  :)
[20:55] <Riddell> rdieter: yes, I want to put it into KDE 4.1 and I'm wondering if its a good idea to make it a pykde app or keep it pyqt
[20:56] <rdieter> Riddell: for kde-4.1 would be fabulous (imo).
[20:57] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: oh, the one thing I added was "--show" so that I wouldn't have to start a print job to see the GUI. It would be better if I could make a dbus call to pop up a already running instance, I guess and I'll look into that.
[20:58] <rdieter> if so, makes sense to go pykde... I assume that pykde would buy you some nice features and other benefits than sticking with pyqt.
[20:59] <rdieter> Riddell: for me, I'd be happy either way.
[21:01] <Riddell> nosrednaekim: I've merged trunk from your branch
[21:04] <nosrednaekim> Riddell: uhh, let me disable something before you package it up. I have a Printer pptions tab now that really doesn't do anything (and all the widgets on it are disabled) I should probably hide it for the time being.
[21:04] <dasKreech> nosrednaekim: Put up a theme that looks like Luna :)
[21:04] <nosrednaekim> dasKreech: nah...M$ jokes are kinda old...
[21:05] <nosrednaekim> i'm gonna do the "Hippy Horse" release.... OMG ponies and fluffy bunny plasma theme :)
[21:05] <Riddell> nosrednaekim: I'm just looking at the applet today
[21:05] <nosrednaekim> oh, alright.
[21:05] <Riddell> nosrednaekim: but do let me know when its ready for a package update
[21:06] <yuriy> i feel like pink and fluffy bunnies has already been overdone on planetkde
[21:06] <nosrednaekim> ok, should be soon.
[21:07] <nosrednaekim> yuriy: I semi-agree....but not everyone reads planetKDE
[21:07] <Riddell> pink and fluffy is good, but we've yet to successfully package a pre-configured plasma theme
[21:08] <Riddell> actually, maybe I'm wrong, apachelogger did have that in the first version of kde4 k-d-s
[21:08] <apachelogger> Riddell: wasn't working
[21:09] <apachelogger> the problem is that one has to create a fullfeatured plasmarc and unfortunately plasmarc holds quite static position values of the applets
[21:09] <nosrednaekim> :(... I didnt think of that....
[21:09] <apachelogger> s/plasmarc/plasma-appletsrc
[21:09] <apachelogger> but theming works :D
[21:16] <apachelogger> Riddell: which name to use for the Qt C# bindings?
[21:16] <apachelogger> qyoto? kdebindings-kde4-qyoto?
[21:16] <apachelogger> libqyoto?... again I can't find a soversion
[21:20] <Riddell> apachelogger: same as currently, libqyoto4.3-cil
[21:20] <Riddell> apachelogger: and obviously copy as much as you can from the current qyoto packaging
[21:21] <apachelogger> ah, there is already a qyoto package :D
[21:22] <Riddell> apachelogger: yes, sorry thought you knew
[21:22] <apachelogger> Riddell: thanks
[21:24] <apachelogger> Riddell: so the kdebindings should superseed the current package?
[21:26] <Riddell> apachelogger: yes, qyoto doesn't make releases any more it seems other than kdebindings
[21:26] <Riddell> which is how it should be, not all confusing like pykde
[21:26] <apachelogger> :)
[21:33] <dasKreech> !info hello hardy
[21:33] <ubotu> hello (source: hello): The classic greeting, and a good example. In component main, is optional. Version 2.2-2 (hardy), package size 19 kB, installed size 584 kB
[21:42] <jjesse> afternoon
[21:42] <jjesse> happy easter for those that celebrate
[21:43] <jussio1> hrm, saw on the release notes that there was some compiz settings manager. I dont seem to have it...
[21:43] <jussio1> happy easter jjesse
[21:44] <jjesse> thanks and you to jussio1
[21:44] <jussio1> :)
[21:47] <Riddell> jussio1: desktop-effects-kde
[21:48] <Riddell> hi jjesse, sorry about the book issues, unfortunately last minute changes are the nature of this cycle :(
[21:48] <jussio1> Riddell: curious, its the newest already.. am I missing something?
[21:48] <jussio1> :/
[21:49] <Riddell> jussio1: is it in your kmenu->System menu?
[21:50] <jussio1> ahh, yeah, should it not be in system settings though?
[21:52] <jjesse> Riddell: no problems, i didn't want to sound like i was complaining about how kde4 works and looks
[21:52] <jjesse> i love it
[21:52] <jjesse> just a little frustrated about having to redo it
[21:56] <Riddell> jussio1: ideally yes
[21:58] <jussio1> Riddell: ok. is that planned? is there something I can do to help it along?
[22:01] <Riddell> jussio1: can't be done in kde 3 (the app is written in qt 4), doing it in kde 4 would need a libpythonise port
[22:01] <jussio1> oh. ok :(
[22:09] <dasKreech> jjesse: What happened with the book?
[22:09] <dasKreech> KDE4 changes?
[22:10] <jjesse> dasKreech: yeah.... long story need to redo what i did
[22:10]  * dasKreech nods
[22:14] <Riddell> oh well, can't use KApplication, it loads QtDbus which breaks when python-dbus is loaded
[22:23] <travlr> Hi all. Question: Is Hardy-beta mostly stable ... no real problems to speak of?
[22:23] <Riddell> travlr: yes
[22:23] <dasKreech> travlr: For today :)
[22:24] <travlr> thank you
[22:25] <travlr> dasKreech: und danka zu dich.
[22:30] <travlr> Another Question: Is deb packaging using CMake now for KDE4, or is it still based on autoconf, etc. blah?
[22:31] <dasKreech> welkomm
[22:35] <travlr> Ok, I see something mentioned in the PackageingGuide about CMake now, but no CDBS yet? Is all the info in the KubuntuPackagingGuide up to date?
[22:36] <Riddell> travlr: KDE 4 uses CMake, KubuntuPackagingGuide is obsolete
[22:37] <travlr> Where to go for up to date info. if any?
[22:37] <travlr> debian dev pages?
[22:37] <jussio1> !packaging
[22:37] <ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
[22:40] <travlr> ubotu: thanks. is it up to date for KDE4 though?
[22:40] <Riddell> ide/KDE
[22:42] <Riddell> travlr: KubuntuPackagingGuide is a redirect to PackagingGuide/KDE and its not badly up to date
[22:42] <Riddell> " You can get a suitable kde.mk by downloading the source for kde4libs and copying debian/cdbs."
[22:43] <travlr> Ridell: ok thank you I want to start packaging all my local source builds if CMake is being used now. I never did want to learn autoconf blah.
[22:47] <jeroen-> is Keep still the default installed backup tool?
[22:47] <jeroen-> in Hardy?
[22:48] <Riddell> jeroen-: in kde3 kubuntu yes
[22:48] <jeroen-> Riddell: thanks
[22:48] <jeroen-> I was just wondering, because it wasnt a new version
[22:50] <yuriy> shall i fix the LTS typo in UWN?
[22:51] <seele> anyone here do anything with amarok (besides use it)
[22:55] <Riddell> yuriy: what's the typo?
[22:55] <Riddell> seele: apachelogger, Nightrose
[22:55] <seele> Riddell: yeah, got Nightrose's attention but thanks
[22:55] <yuriy> Riddell: that it says Kubuntu 8.04 LTS Beta release
[22:55] <yuriy> as somebody pointed out on the ml
[22:56] <Riddell> yuriy: go ahead
[22:56] <yuriy> just making sure some crazy magic didn't in fact just happen
[23:09] <nosrednaekim> whats the "default settings" in hardy for kde4?
[23:09] <nosrednaekim> the default settings package that is
[23:10] <apachelogger> same as for KDE 3
[23:11] <nosrednaekim> same package?
[23:11] <apachelogger> yes
[23:11] <nosrednaekim> ok
[23:14] <nixternal> OK, where are my python mastahs?
[23:14]  * Riddell hides
[23:14] <nosrednaekim> i'm not a master... but maybe I can help
[23:14] <nixternal> hehe
[23:15] <nixternal> http://www.nixternal.com/~rj/lpgpg
[23:15] <nixternal> take a look at that and provide feedback...
[23:15] <nixternal> just a script to download gpg keys and install them from whatever team you provide as an argument
[23:15] <nixternal> messing around with urllib
[23:15] <nosrednaekim> I thought you had given up on python
[23:16] <dasKreech> he likes to wrangle
[23:16] <nixternal> hehe
[23:16] <nosrednaekim> oh... nice! embedded kate in konqueror4....
[23:17] <nosrednaekim> beautiful syntax coloring...
[23:17] <nixternal> when it works it is nice :)
[23:17] <dasKreech> didn't we have that in kde3 ?
[23:17] <nixternal> ya
[23:17] <dasKreech> oh what happened to kwrite?
[23:18] <nosrednaekim> yeah..... well I hated konq3 for web
[23:18] <dasKreech> it's all pow-wah-ful and sexy
[23:20] <nosrednaekim> nixternal: you don't really need the __name__ ==__main__  part, but other wise it looks nice a slick :)
[23:20] <nixternal> trying not to do C/C++ stuff was a bit tricky in there...but I did that w/o using a book or the internet...just using the api docs
[23:22] <nosrednaekim> looks nice, but instead of telling the person to run that command, you COULD just run it yourself.
[23:28] <nixternal> well, now what I am going to do is play with created a gui and what not for it...probably not distribution worthy anyways