[00:05] <emgent> \sh_away: ping
[00:09] <calc> anyone familiar with app-installer?
[00:09] <calc> bug 113358
[00:09] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 113358 in openoffice.org "[Ubuntu] [hardy] openoffice.org-math missing in gnome-app-installer and not installed with OpenOffice Writer" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/113358
[00:09] <calc> i did what colin suggested but it didn't help
[00:17] <ScottK> slangasek: Do you recall the Postfix backports problem with Soyuz having grown the 'feature' of not looking into Universe for build-deps in backports?  Well postgres 8.3.1 is now hung up on the same problem.
[00:20] <mattismyname> So, I'm trying to build a package of a library (my first try...).  This library can make use of other libraries if they exist on the system, but it does not require they be present (libtiff, libpng).  My question is...should I include these on the Build-Depends: line in the package control file?
[00:23] <RAOF> mattismyname: Probably better answered in #ubuntu-motu
[00:24] <jdong> mattismyname: if you feel that the functionality provided by building with such libraries present would be desired by users, it's probably a good idea to put them as build depends.
[00:25] <mattismyname> RAOF, jdong: thanks
[00:27] <mattismyname> More than likely, the users would want this additional library support so I will add it.  Will check w/ #ubuntu-motu as well.
[00:31] <TheMuso> 5~/c
[00:31] <RAOF> TheMuso: Good morning :)
[00:32] <TheMuso> Hey RAOF. How goes it?
[00:33] <RAOF> TheMuso: Eh, pretty well.  I'm being forced to get up early, though :)
[00:33] <RAOF> TheMuso: How be your fine self?
[00:33] <TheMuso> RAOF: Busy, but well thanks.
[00:34] <RAOF> Eeexcellent.
[01:29] <twb`> Is this the most appropriate channel for discussing the guts of the python-launchpad-bugs package?
[01:30] <lifeless> I suspect so
[01:30] <lifeless> here or #ubuntu-bugs, but I would say here
[01:31] <twb`> Righto.  I want to extend reportbug so that, out of the box on Ubuntu systems, it talks to launchpad rather than a subscriber-only mailing list (which is what it does currently).
[01:32] <twb> Or at least better understand how to programmatically query and modify launchpad's BTS subsystem.
[01:49] <lifeless> There will be a short interruption to bazaar.launchpad.net and the ubuntu wiki to deploy a fix for the performance problems.
[02:06] <calc> doko: ping
[03:42] <calc> mjg59`: what will you be doing at redhat (if its not NDA/secret)?
[03:49] <mweichert> hey guys, anyone know how to get unicode support in bash? I'm trying to paste a unicode-type string but any character outside ISO-8859-1 is not displayed
[03:51] <twb> mweichert: that could be a problem with the app you're copying from, your terminal emulator, or your locale setting.
[03:51] <twb> mweichert: regardless, this channel is probably not the appropriate place to discuss it.
[03:52] <mweichert> twb: okay, sorry... do you know where I might ask?
[03:52] <twb> mweichert: are you using Ubuntu Gutsy?
[03:53] <mweichert> twb: yes
[03:53] <twb> mweichert: #ubuntu, if you can handle the very high traffic.
[03:53] <twb> mweichert: what terminal emulator are you using?
[03:54] <mweichert> twb: mac os x terminal ssh'd on to a gutsy vps
[03:54] <twb> Oh.  Then you should ask ##macosx, since this is very likely to be a problem on the OS X side.
[03:54] <twb> But make sure the `locales' package is installed on the VPS.
[03:55] <mweichert> twb: okay, thanks for your help. The locates packages is installed but locale -a produces C and  POSIX.
[03:56] <mweichert> I think I should have UTF-8 in there, no?
[03:56] <mweichert> looking at my terminal settings too, I have the charset set to UTF-8
[03:56] <twb> mweichert: yes, try dpkg-reconfigure -plow locales.  I'll say no more on this here, since it's off-topic and I've talked too much already.
[03:56] <mweichert> twb: okay, thanks again
[04:10] <JohnPhys> My apologies if this is off-topic, but what are the plans for Firefox 3 upgrades with respect to Hardy?  Specifically, when FF3 is released in June, are there plans to upload that to the repositories, or will FF3 be "frozen" at the version included in the repos at release time?
[04:13] <twb> IIUC the standard policy is that only critical upgrades (e.g. security fixes) enter a released version.  I don't know if a release (i.e. not beta) Firefox 3 would count as a critical upgrade, but I doubt it.
[04:13] <twb> I expect a post-beta firefox 3 would be added to the standard hardy-backports repository.
[04:14] <ScottK> I've heard, but am not certain that they will update it to final.
[04:14] <RAOF> Firefox is a pretty special case.  We seem to be adding new stable releases of ff2 to -updates.  Unless I'm imagining that.
[04:15] <ScottK> We are because that's how we get security fixes.
[04:15] <twb> Haha
[04:15] <protonchris> ScottK: I noticed that wxglade was uploaded.  Thanks.  For some reason, LP didn't mark it fix release.  Should I go ahead and mark it fixed?
[04:15] <RAOF> I suspected as much.
[04:16] <ScottK> protonchris: I didn't actually upload it, so no thanks needed here.  If it's definitely uploaded, then yes.
[04:16] <protonchris> ScottK: ok.
[04:17] <JohnPhys> Thanks for the info.  I wasn't sure if FF3b4 -> rc's -> final was similar to a 2.0.0.x -> 2.0.0.(x+1) release, or the 1.5 -> 2.0 release in dapper, where the package wasn't updated because too many other things depended on the rendering engine and such (iirc).
[06:11] <warp10> Good morning
[06:30] <geser> good morning
[06:40] <JohnPhys> Why the gnome-system-tools package not installed in Hardy beta by default?  Is there another way to use a gui to set up smb/nfs file shares?  I tried searching the forums, bugs, blueprints, and answers, and didn't see anything obvious.  Thanks for your time (and the great distro!)
[06:44] <dholbach> good morning
[06:51] <JohnPhys> good evening
[06:52] <twb> JohnPhys: that question may be more appropriate for #ubuntu+1.
[06:52] <JohnPhys> twb:  thanks, I'll post it there.
[07:01] <pitti> Good morning
[07:04] <geser> Guten Morgen pitti
[07:36] <dieman> cjwatson: heh, just saw your updates come through on my bug, thanks!
[07:36] <dieman> cjwatson: im no longer working where I maintain a ton of ubuntu boxes, but i let the guy who took over for me know he gets to make 2 less hacks to the initrd
[07:37] <dieman> well, to the packages, rather
[07:37] <dieman> anyhow
[08:07] <Hobbsee> evening
[08:07] <soren> No, it's not.
[08:11] <Hobbsee> morning for you backwards people, then.
[08:12] <soren> Rather backwards than upside down. :p
[08:15] <Hobbsee> depends.  you are behind, timewise
[08:21] <Hobbsee> dholbach: when's the next CC meeting?
[08:22] <mdke> we haven't set one yet. We should though
[08:22] <Hobbsee> looks like we've got a few people for your loving care and attention.
[08:22] <mdke> we really need the regional membership boards up and running too
[08:23] <Hobbsee> yes, i thought that was supposed to be done ages ago?
[08:23] <mdke> yeah
[08:23]  * Hobbsee looks at the CC agenda.
[08:24] <Hobbsee> most of this should get thrown out, lacking proof.  excellent.
[08:25] <Hobbsee> mdke: holy hell.  you'll enjoy dealing with all of that.
[08:26] <mdke> blimey. I wonder if that is the same chap who has been emailing us
[08:27] <Hobbsee> mdke: likely.
[08:29] <orbisvicis> have any of the ubuntu patches on autoconf/automake affected mkdir_p vs MKDIR_P ?
[09:16] <saispo> hi, anydebconf expert here ?
[09:16] <saispo> any debconf, sorry
[09:17] <james_w> saispo: do you have a specific question?
[09:17] <saispo> yes but i found the answer, excuse me :)
[09:17] <james_w> no problem
[09:17] <saispo> i just want to hide critical question and i found DEBCONF_FRONTEND=noninteractive solve my question :)
[09:21] <orbisvicis> anyone find issues with autotools and mkdir_p vs MKDIR_P ?
[09:51] <cjwatson> dieman: you're welcome - sorry it took a while
[09:52] <ion_> Hi cjwatson
[09:53] <ion_> cjwatson: I modified the compcache packaging to use debconf for the cache size setting. Should be possible to preseed the value to something bigger on a live-/install-CD considering that there may be no swap partitions.
[09:54] <cjwatson> ion_: sounds good
[10:33] <seb128> carlos: hey
[10:33] <seb128> carlos: could you approve the nautilus-share template if that has not been done yet?
[10:36] <carlos> seb128: let me check...
[10:36] <seb128> carlos: it has been promoted some days ago and uploaded on saturday
[10:37] <carlos> seb128: approved
[10:37] <seb128> carlos: thanks
[10:38] <carlos> np
[11:10] <warp10> Hi all!
[11:36] <siretart> could someone from the release team please comment on bug #204557? - security fixes are pending here...
[11:36] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 204557 in xine-lib "Freeze exception for xine-lib 1.1.11" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204557
[11:48]  * pitti builds new -base langpacks for hardy
[11:56] <seb128> pitti: will you have nautilus-share in those?
[11:56] <seb128> pitti: it has been accepted only this morning in rosetta
[11:56] <pitti> seb128: no, the tarball is from March 26
[11:56] <pitti> I don't know why they lag so badly, it was generated last night
[11:56] <seb128> ok
[11:57] <pitti> seb128: after that I'll reenable the automatic semiweekly uploads (I disabled the cron for the -base refresh)
[11:57] <seb128> ok
[11:59] <pitti> siretart: I added a comment to the bug; please go ahead
[12:00] <siretart> pitti: oh, the update from 1.1.10 to 1.1.11 isn't bugfix only. still, I'm very much in favor of doing it anyways!
[12:01] <pitti> siretart: hm, it says so in the bug report
[12:02] <siretart> the bug says: "in the mean time, a bugfix only release (1.1.11.1) has been uploaded to debian".. - I was adding a comment in the bug that I propose to integrate that bugfix only update as well
[12:02] <siretart> still, the update from 1.1.10 to 1.1.11 wasn't approved yet
[12:04] <pitti> siretart: the description says "I propose to merge the new debian upload of xine-lib 1.1.11.
[12:04] <pitti> It consist of security updates and bugfixes. No new features have been added."
[12:05] <pitti> siretart: so is that a different bug# then?
[12:07] <siretart> pitti: I'm sorry that wasn't really clear. There have been no real new features and only bugfixes, but the diff is still rather large
[12:07] <siretart> I wasn't sure if you're comment referred only to my last comment or to the whole bug. Now it is clear
[12:07] <siretart> thanks!
[12:08] <pitti> siretart: right; but I guess you tested them, and verified the changelog, so it should be oke
[12:08] <pitti> s/oke/ok/
[12:08] <frandavid100> hiya
[12:08] <siretart> pitti: not yet the very latest version, which I'm testing this afternoon
[12:09] <siretart> but the diffs looks pretty sane, so I'm confident (will still testbuild/test)
[12:10]  * pitti hugs siretart
[12:10]  * siretart hugs back :)
[12:21] <Hobbsee> mdke: can you make sure you give us (irc council and related people) notice, when you decide on a date for the next CC meeting please?
[12:26] <kwwii> anyone know how to set the Xephyr size so that I can get a screenshot of gdmthemetester for the gdm theme?
[12:48] <Riddell> ArneGoetje: any idea why qt 4 might use Nimbus over Deja?  bug 209358
[12:48] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 209358 in qt4-x11 "fonts in Qt4 look ugly because it uses Nimbus Sans L instead of Deja Vu Sans for Sans-Serif" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/209358
[12:48] <jc-denton> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/209632
[12:48] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 209632 in ubuntu "[Hardy] CPU freq scaling does not work anymore with the newest kernel" [Undecided,New]
[12:48] <jc-denton> can anybody confirm this?
[13:24] <Ng> seb128: re bug 198857, is it likely that we can get something in hardy to turn previously mounted shares into bookmarks? I don't so much care about the aspect of the bug with the desktop icons not being around anymore. i can tell users to go into Places->Bookmarks, but I'd prefer not to have them set up the shares again
[13:24] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 198857 in nautilus "gnome-vfs network servers are not migrated to gvfs on upgrade" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/198857
[13:25] <seb128> Ng: if you send a patch yes, otherwise not likely no
[13:25] <Ng> ok
[13:25] <seb128> Ng: there was no mounts in gnomevfs, those were sort of bookmarks
[13:26] <Ng> yes sorry, "mounts" is poor wording. "server connections" or something maybe
[13:27] <seb128> do you think it's important to migrate those?
[13:28] <Ng> seb128: for users like me? not at all, I can recreate them in seconds. however, I suspect it's more likely that features like that are used by less technical users (e.g. most of our business folk use them and set them up by following screenshots)
[13:29] <Ng> but I'm not even sure where gvfs/nautilus stores the new stuff, so I have no idea how hard it would be to migrate them
[13:29] <Ng> obviously we're a bit late in the game now
[13:29] <emgent> hello people
[13:29] <zorglu_> q. im looking for Jorge Castro on irc, i cant find him. anybody knows if he is on irc ?
[13:29] <seb128> Ng: there is no such servers now, gvfs does automatic mounting when accessing the share
[13:30] <Ng> zorglu_: see jcastro
[13:30] <zorglu_> Ng: thanks
[13:30] <seb128> Ng: they would need to be added to .gtk-bookmarks
[13:31] <Ng> seb128: aha. is there any mechamism for doing upgrade related tasks on the first login after upgrading?
[13:31] <chand> jc-denton: perhaps there is a link between  209632 ansd
[13:31] <chand> jc-denton: perhaps there is a link between  209632 and https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.22/+bug/183033
[13:31] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 183033 in linux-source-2.6.22 "Intel Core 2 Duo - Resume from suspend, CPU Frequency Scaling is gone on CPU1" [Undecided,Confirmed]
[13:31] <jc-denton> chand: i had this problem before
[13:32] <jc-denton> all i had to do was changing the governer back to powersave
[13:33] <seb128> Ng: no, but we could add an autostart entry comparing versions and doing that
[13:34] <Riddell> ArneGoetje: ubiquity doesn't launch on the kubuntu-kde4 CD, it says "scim-bridge: Cannot establish the socket connection" in syslog
[13:34] <_MMA_> seb128: This "automounting" is giving me issues. I gotta figure out whats going on. I use the "crossmnt" option on my NFS server and its mounting one of those subfolders as if it were the main share.
[13:35] <seb128> no idea what crossmnt is and what main share means in this context
[13:36] <ogra_cmpc> i guess he means the exported dir with "main share"
[13:36] <seb128> slangasek: could we have a 8.04.1 milestone on launchpad?
[13:36] <_MMA_> seb128: Sure. I guess you would need to be familiar with the various NFS options. :P
[13:36] <ogra_cmpc> nfs usually allows you to mount everything as you like below an export, so that no surprise
[13:36] <seb128> ogra_cmpc: no idea what it means, for me mounts have a mount points and that's all
[13:36] <ogra_cmpc> *tahts
[13:37]  * ogra_cmpc curses his typoing 
[13:37] <ogra_cmpc> i want a brain to kbd interface, damned
[13:38] <theunixgeek> Would anybody like to test a program? :)
[13:38] <_MMA_> ogra_cmpc: I couldn't mount some of the subfolders without defining them in the exports file. I also needed the "nohide" (deprecated) or "crossmnt" option to see some subfolders.
[13:38] <ogra_cmpc> seb128, i dont have a clue what crossmnt is or does either, i want just antig to point out that such behavior is totally fine from an nfs POV
[13:38]  * ogra_cmpc sighs
[13:38] <ogra_cmpc> * was just wanting to point out
[13:39] <seb128> _MMA_: open a bug with a description explain what the issue is in a non too technical wording with a simple testcase, what it does and what else you expect
[13:40] <ogra_cmpc> _MMA_, ltsp uses /opt/ltsp in /etc/exports ... the clients usually mount /opt/ltsp/$arch for example ... NFS allows everything below the exported dir to be mounted as you like
[13:40] <seb128> _MMA_: because right now I don't understand what you are asking
[13:40] <_MMA_> seb128: Sure. Plan for today was to look over it more then do just that. Ill add screenshots as well.
[13:40] <seb128> there is already some bugs about automount and nfs
[13:41] <seb128> make sure your issue is not a duplicate if you can
[13:41] <_MMA_> Sure.
[13:41] <seb128> thanks
[13:41] <kwwii> ogra_cmpc: you might want to look into the human icon theme .links file and add the symlinks to gartoon
[13:41] <phaidros> any hints on hardy nvidia+compiz on a dualhead, which often does not refresh the upper .. uhm .. fifth of the screen?
[13:41] <ogra_cmpc> kwwii, oh, more links ?
[13:42] <ogra_cmpc> i r4ecently added a bunch already
[13:42] <ogra_cmpc> kwwii, thanks for the heads up
[13:45] <kwwii> ogra_cmpc: glad to be of help :-)
[13:45] <ogra_cmpc> kwwii, is that uploaded already ? the package i get from the archive doesnt seem to have a .links file
[13:46] <ogra_cmpc> human-icon-theme-0.24
[13:46] <kwwii> ogra_cmpc: I just commited half an hour ago or so
[13:46] <ogra_cmpc> ah, k
[13:51] <_MMA_> ogra_cmpc: Sorry. I PMed by you're not identified.
[13:51] <ogra_cmpc> right
[13:51] <_MMA_> s/by/but
[13:51] <ogra_cmpc> just wanted to mention that :)
[13:52] <_MMA_> :P
[13:52] <ogra_cmpc> in any case nfs behaves correctly here according to your description in the pm
[13:53] <ogra_cmpc> gvfs might notice that the subfolders are actual devices on the server (even though i wouldnt know how it would do that)
[13:53] <ogra_cmpc> so it mounts them like extra devices
[13:53] <_MMA_> ogra_cmpc: On my Gutsy boxes yes. The 2 hardy ones, not for me. I'll file a bug and see how it goes.
[13:54] <ogra_cmpc> right
[13:54] <ogra_cmpc> gutsy doesnt use gvfs
[13:54] <ogra_cmpc> it uses gnome-vfs
[13:54] <_MMA_> But yes. It mounts a subfolder like an extra devise.
[13:54] <_MMA_> *device
[13:59] <tjaalton> Riddell: there's bashism in desktop-effects-kde: 25enable-compiz. I get "[[: not found"
[14:00] <Riddell> tjaalton: do you know what the fix it?
[14:00] <Riddell> is?
[14:01] <tjaalton> Riddell: yes, use single brackets
[14:01] <Ng> http://wooledge.org:8000/BashPitfalls#head-ad3f850ae3fdcf9751b0eef6451b92ee1d040bef :)
[14:03] <Riddell> tjaalton: thanks, fixing
[14:03] <tjaalton> Riddell: thanks
[14:06] <jc-denton> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/209632
[14:06] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 209632 in ubuntu "[Hardy] CPU freq scaling does not work anymore with the newest kernel" [Undecided,New]
[14:06] <jc-denton> any ideas?
[14:17] <pitti> zul: how is debian bug 365097 solved in hardy?
[14:17] <ubotu> Debian bug 365097 in bacula-common "bacula-common: Uses the same passwords on every Debian installation" [Important,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/365097
[14:18] <zul> pitti: we include a gawk script that messes with the catalog
[14:18] <pitti> zul: do we have a debconf question for the password, or something such?
[14:19] <zul> pitti: kind of, I forget how it works now but that problem has been fixed
[14:20] <pitti> zul: ok, thank you
[14:20] <zul> pitti: np
[14:20] <pitti> zul: can you please add that to the MIR? looks kinda scary ATM :)
[14:20] <zul> pitti: sure :)
[14:21]  * warp10 hugs (and thanks) pitti
[14:21] <pitti> hi warp10
[14:24] <pitti> zul: looks like it: "db_input critical bacula/dba_password"
[14:24] <pitti> zul: I checked the mysql postinst, it uses that apparently
[14:24] <zul> pitti: yep I was going to put that in the MIR report.
[14:27] <zul> pitti: done
[14:27] <pitti> zul: thank you
[14:27] <zul> er you get the email never mind ;)
[14:35] <pitti> zul: promoted, see bug
[14:35] <zul> pitti: sweet..
[14:43] <asac> siretart: fyi, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6260/ ... thats what was needed to make wpasupplicant bring up the global control socket again.
[14:43] <asac> siretart: but i guess its fixed in 0.6.x
[14:44] <siretart> asac: oh, interesting.
[14:45] <siretart> nm unlinks the supplicant control socket?!
[14:46] <asac> siretart: yes. and i need SIGKILL as well
[14:47] <asac> otherwise it looks like it cannot acquire the control socket on every second startup here
[14:51] <siretart> I can feel your antipathy regarding wpasupplicant :)
[15:00] <jdong> HOLY CRAP update-manager just gave me a 20-digit ETA!
[15:01]  * mvo coughs
[15:01] <mvo> jdong: during download or install (or both)?
[15:01] <jdong> mvo: during download; my wifi lost association for around 15s
[15:02] <jdong> when it came back, update-manager must've gotten spooked :D
[15:10] <ScottK> jdong: The Main/Universe issue is still a problem for backports.  postgres 8.3.1 is currently hung up on it.
[15:14] <pitti> ScottK: hm?
[15:15] <nxvl> how is that the update-manager notifications works?
[15:16] <nxvl> i mean the "restart $application" notifications
[15:16] <ScottK> pitti: It's depwait in feisty and gutsy backports due to one needed bit (I'll look which) being in Universe
[15:16] <pitti> ScottK: ah, libuuid-dev, I bet
[15:16] <ScottK> Yes.
[15:16] <nxvl> the on in charge to make this notification is $application or update-manager?
[15:17] <ScottK> pitti: It'd have been much more convenient if Launchpad hadn't grown the 'feature' of caring about Main/Universe for backports.
[15:17] <nxvl> s/on/one
[15:17] <pitti> ScottK: oh, did it do that?
[15:17] <ScottK> Yep.
[15:17] <pitti> ScottK: I would have assumed it always did
[15:17] <jdong> ScottK: *sigh* dammit
[15:17] <jdong> pitti: it was turned off by infinity like 2 years ago...
[15:17] <ScottK> pitti: Nope.  Otherwise backports from Main would be almost impossible.
[15:18] <ScottK> pitti: I first discovered this when my latest Postfix backport got borked.
[15:18] <mvo> nxvl: it uses https://wiki.ubuntu.com/InteractiveUpgradeHooks
[15:18]  * nxvl HUGS mvo 
[15:18] <ScottK> slangasek tortured postfix for dapper-backports into Universe somehow, but that's not really a scalable solution.
[15:19] <lamont> slangasek not scalable.  film at 11
[15:19] <pitti> ScottK: given that backports are already unsupported, I don't see much value in that check either
[15:19] <ScottK> pitti: And if it's not reverted, then you'll need to do MIR processing for backports or some such.
[15:19] <pitti> well, FSVO unsupported, you know what I mean
[15:20] <ScottK> pitti: "Not commercially supported by Canonical" - Understand.
[15:24] <ogra_cmpc> ScottK, thats beyond any commercial aspect, we never agreed on supporting upgrading of systems using backports as a developer team and nobody ever tests that
[15:24] <ScottK> ogra_cmpc: True.
[15:25] <Hobbsee> crackports, you mean.
[15:26] <ogra_cmpc> i bet our genious  mvo could solve it if we'd clone him and he had the double amount of time per day to work on it though :)
[15:26]  * pitti hugs mvo
[15:26] <ScottK> The server stuff I backport all gets upgrade testing because it's running on my test server when I upgrade it.
[15:26] <ScottK> Dunno about jdong's crack though.
[15:28] <ogra_cmpc> well, the thing with dapper is for example that a backport could come from hardy ... if you'd upgrade dapper->edgy that package would simply be left out because of the higher upstream version
[15:28] <mvo> we could add a automatic test for system with -backports, the problem is currently mostly lack of cpu/io/diskspace, but if somebody is interessted, all it requires is a cpu that supports kvm and some spare cycles
[15:30] <ScottK> ogra_cmpc: That's true which is why I try to hit all the releases when I backport.
[15:31] <ScottK> mvo: I haven't seen problems with this so far.  I wouldn't think it's a priority at this point.
[15:31] <jdong> ScottK / ogra_cmpc: I do test my crack too
[15:31] <jdong> :D
[15:31] <afflux> pitti: could we have apport adding retraces stacktraces even if the bug was detected as duplicate? Use cases: bug 145360 is quite old. I reported it upstream yesterday and I wanted to attach a stacktrace with linenumbers matching to the newest upstream versions. The new duplicates (from the new versions) have no retraced stacktraces.
[15:32] <ubotwo> Launchpad bug 145360 in compiz "compiz.real crashed with SIGSEGV" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/145360
[15:32] <pitti> afflux: hmm; just recently I fixed a bug asking to *not* attach stack traces for dups, since they generate bugmail spam :)
[15:33] <afflux> grrr :)
[15:33] <afflux> I've another example, give me a second
[15:36] <afflux> pitti: I may be wrong, but somehow whe thought bug 151200 had no complete stacktraces, but apport added some duplicates. We hoped to get more complete traces with them... ;)
[15:36] <ubotwo> Launchpad bug 151200 in compiz "compiz.real crashed with SIGSEGV" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/151200
[15:36] <afflux> (It may be that the trace is perfectly alright, it just looks... short :))
[15:50] <ogra_cmpc> tjaalton, bryce, could it be that the via/openchrome driver and vt8623fb disagree bout video ram ? i had some reports that break with "memory size detection failed", which seems to come from the vt8623fb module
[15:56] <tjaalton> ogra_cmpc: no idea..
[16:07] <mvo> Riddell: if you have a moment, could you please have a look at bug #208390 ? I can not reproduce it and it looks a bit strange, but maybe you have a idea what goes wrong there
[16:07] <ubotwo> Launchpad bug 208390 in update-manager "upgrading gutsy to hardy BUG" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208390
[16:12] <Riddell> mvo: mm, any idea what language he was using?
[16:15] <mvo> Riddell: unfortunately not, I wonder if the following might be enough: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6264
[16:16] <Riddell> mvo: could be, I'll try and do some testing shotrly
[16:16] <Riddell> mvo: bug 204818 is nasty, might it be caused by the lack of a proper terminal?
[16:16] <ubotwo> Launchpad bug 204818 in update-manager "update manager crashed upgrading 'libc6' package." [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204818
[16:17] <mvo> Riddell: let me check
[16:17] <mvo> Riddell: I will commit the utf8() change in translate_widget (if you don't mind) - it should do no harm and may cure it if the translation file is not in utf8() for some reason
[16:18] <Riddell> mvo: yeah go ahead
[16:19] <mvo> Riddell: yeah, 204818 is evil. I think its not terminal releated, but it might be that the lack of proper terminal triggers the bug.
[16:31] <ArneGoetje> Riddell: For bug 209358 I have also no idea why qt3 gets it right and qt4 wrong...
[16:31] <ubotwo> Launchpad bug 209358 in qt4-x11 "fonts in Qt4 look ugly because it uses Nimbus Sans L instead of Deja Vu Sans for Sans-Serif" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/209358
[16:40] <ArneGoetje> Riddell: regarding scim-bridge on kde4: which image are you using?
[16:41] <Riddell> ArneGoetje: today's daily
[16:48] <ArneGoetje> Riddell: will download
[16:55] <sroecker> what's up with ubuntu.com, all the graphics look pixelish
[16:56] <Nafallo> no?
[16:56] <Pici> Looks fine here..
[16:56] <sroecker> hmm
[16:56] <Pici> I even put my face up to the monitor
[16:56] <jdong> is someone playing with compiz zoom? :D
[16:57] <sroecker> hehe, don't have compiz enabled
[16:57] <sroecker> strange
[16:57] <jdong> even on Hardy with Firefox 3's WONDERFUL and INTELLIGENT dpi and scaling detection abilities, ubuntu.com looks normal
[16:57] <jdong> ;-)
[16:58]  * ogra_cmpc can only agree on that looking at a scaled down ff3 on 800x480
[16:58] <jdong> ogra_cmpc: aww you poor thing
[16:59] <Amaranth> jdong: isn't the problem with that it now uses what X says the dpi is instead of a hardcoded value?
[16:59] <jdong> Amaranth: I have no idea :)
[16:59] <Ng> that's a good thing, surely?
[16:59] <ogra_cmpc> jdong, i started to like it over time ...
[16:59] <Amaranth> but if it's using pango it should match the rest of gnome with gnome's DPI setting
[16:59] <Amaranth> unless they don't use that part of pango
[16:59] <jdong> ogra_cmpc: yeah I had a low-res monitor for the longest time
[17:00] <ogra_cmpc> jdong, on 7" thats just perfect and crisp ...
[17:00] <jdong> ogra_cmpc: yeah, the eeepc is at that resolution and seems just fine to me
[17:01] <ArneGoetje> Riddell: what's the rsync command to download the daily? iso.qa.stgraber.org is not reachable from here, so I cannot lookup the link... :(
[17:01] <ogra_cmpc> jdong, right, on the classmate i'm using since some months as my main work environment as well
[17:01] <Riddell> ArneGoetje: rsync -CvzapP --stats rsync://cdimage.ubuntu.com/cdimage/kubuntu-kde4/daily-live/current/hardy-desktop-i386.iso .
[17:02] <ArneGoetje> Riddell: thanks :)
[17:03] <sroecker> jdong, http://img523.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bildschirmfotorq3.png
[17:03] <Amaranth> sroecker: you're zoomed in, i guess
[17:04] <sroecker> Amaranth, doh, you are right :/
[17:04] <jdong> yeah, I was surprised at first too when I realized FF3 actually zooms
[17:04] <Amaranth> fullpage zoom that remembers your zoom level for certain pages can sometimes be annoying
[17:07] <cjwatson> Keybuk: I recently changed openssh-server to adjust the OOM-killer priority for sshd, which you can do by poking numbers into /proc/PID/oom_adj. This works but is a bit fiddly. Do you think upstart jobs could have a neat way to do that?
[17:08] <elmo> cjwatson: \o/
[17:10] <Keybuk> cjwatson: probably, are the numbers meaningful?
[17:13] <cjwatson> Keybuk: -17 => disable, -16 through +15 => various priorities
[17:13]  * cjwatson blames the kernel :-/
[17:22] <slangasek> seb128: AFAIK I don't have access to create the milestones
[17:22] <calc> asac: have you heard of any issues with ipw3945 not coming back after a suspend/resume cycle?
[17:23] <calc> asac: mine worked until sometime recently
[17:23] <elmo> yeah, mine is fucked
[17:23] <elmo> + too
[17:23] <elmo> I'm pretty sure it worked when I first dist-upgraded too
[17:23] <asac> elmo: only after susped/resume?
[17:23] <elmo> asac: yes; if I reboot -> fine again
[17:23] <calc> yea i have to reboot to fix it
[17:24] <asac> does NM crash?
[17:24] <calc> there isn't a daemon any longer, not sure if that is an issue
[17:24] <asac> or do you see anything in syslog that suspicious?
[17:24] <calc> asac: not sure, i do know nm-applet is still there, next time i will check nm the daemon as well
[17:24] <seb128> slangasek: do you know who has?
[17:24] <asac> calc: look in syslog please too
[17:24] <calc> asac: actually i can go over to my desktop machine and cause it to happen on my laptop and tell you right now
[17:25] <asac> calc: cool
[17:25] <seb128> cjwatson, Keybuk, mdz: could one of you add a 8.04.1 milestone on launchpad?
[17:25] <elmo> asac: nothing suspicious for me, FWIW
[17:25] <calc> ok, now i'm on my desktop :)
[17:26] <asac> elmo: when did it start breaking?
[17:26] <elmo> asac: sorry, I'm not 100% sure, but I think no earlier than Friday
[17:26] <calc> i think a few days ago, but i can't pinpoint it either
[17:26] <asac> elmo: ok ... you probably track hardy for quite some time, right?
[17:26] <mdz> seb128: slangasek should be the one to do that; he should have privileges now (and if not, let's fix that instead)
[17:27] <calc> asac: i have tracked hardy for months also
[17:27] <seb128> mdz: <slangasek> seb128: AFAIK I don't have access to create the milestones
[17:27] <mdz> slangasek: have you tried?
[17:27] <mdz> slangasek: you're in ubuntu-drivers, which should confer  that
[17:27] <mdz> slangasek: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+addmilestone
[17:28] <slangasek> checking
[17:28] <slangasek> ok, I do have access now
[17:28] <calc> ok its not coming back, looking in logs
[17:29] <asac> calc: maybe paste your syslog
[17:29] <calc> ok i see it
[17:29] <calc> well i think i do
[17:29] <asac> ?
[17:29] <calc> Error getting killswitch power: org.freedesktop.org.Hal.Device.KillSwitch.NotSupported - hal-ipw-killswitch-linux returned 255
[17:29] <calc> i can copy them and then reboot so i don't have to type them verbatim ;)
[17:30] <asac> ok
[17:30] <calc> asac: only need syslog?
[17:30] <asac> yes
[17:30] <calc> ok
[17:30] <asac> i didn't change anything killswitch related in recent uploads. so either that message is not related or something else broke it (hal, driver update)?
[17:31] <calc> maybe so
[17:31] <calc> brb
[17:31] <slangasek> seb128, mdz: 8.04.1 milestone added
[17:31] <seb128> slangasek: thanks!
[17:35] <tkamppeter> pitti, hi
[17:39] <calc> asac: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6266/
[17:39] <asac> calc: that stops when resume is finished?
[17:39] <Keybuk> cjwatson: would something like oom adjust disable or oom adjust -16..+15 be sufficient?
[17:39] <asac> does nothing happen afterwards?
[17:40] <cjwatson> Keybuk: sounds plausible to me
[17:40] <calc> asac: wireless doesn't seem to ever come back until i reboot
[17:41] <Keybuk> cjwatson: it'd get applied to all of the scripts as well as the main executable, that's ok I guess?
[17:41] <Keybuk> what's oom_score ?
[17:46] <asac> calc: lshal -u /org/freedesktop/Hal/devices/net_00_19_d2_8a_0c_19
[17:47] <asac> (after and maybe before resume)
[17:47] <cjwatson> Keybuk: oom_score is output from the OOM scoring algorithm, I think
[17:47] <cjwatson> Keybuk: hmm, would really prefer just the main sshd executable if possible
[17:53] <calc> asac: be back in a few, will have to reboot after suspend/resume cycle
[17:57] <pitti> hi tkamppeter
[17:57] <jwendell> asac, did you upload liferea-ubuntu4? I only see -3
[17:59] <tkamppeter> pitti, I have opened a dialog ...
[18:00] <pitti> tkamppeter: you need to register first
[18:00] <calc> asac: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6267/
[18:11] <asac> jwendell: yeah sorry. ubuntu3 is the latest
[18:12] <jwendell> asac, ok, will try
[18:12] <asac> calc: and there are no more messages from networkmanager after resume?
[18:13] <calc> asac: no more
[18:13] <calc> asac: i went back and looked at my syslog just a min ago
[18:13] <calc> Mar 31 11:28:06 laptop-c2d NetworkManager: <debug> [1206980886.432324] nm_hal_device_added(): New device added (hal udi is '/org/freedesktop/Hal/devices/usb_device_4f2_b008_SN0001_if1').
[18:13] <calc> Mar 31 11:28:08 laptop-c2d gnome-power-manager: (ccheney) Resuming computer
[18:13] <calc> Mar 31 11:31:02 laptop-c2d init: tty4 main process (4628) killed by TERM signal
[18:13] <calc> that was the way the log looked for the first test
[18:14] <calc> at least in syslog
[18:14] <asac> calc: ok.
[18:15] <calc> its possible its a driver bug, i don't know when/if it got updated
[18:15] <calc> BenC: ping
[18:15] <asac> please try the latest branch which should add a bit more stability
[18:15] <asac> sudo apt-get build-dep network-manager
[18:15] <asac> bzr branch https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/network-manager/ubuntu.0.6.x
[18:15] <calc> ok
[18:15] <asac> and just debuild
[18:17] <calc> ok downloading now
[18:19] <BenC> calc: ?
[18:20] <asac> calc: the info.category should be just net.80211 ... not net.80211control
[18:21] <asac> calc: you sure it works before suspent :)?
[18:21] <calc> asac: yea
[18:21] <calc> BenC: has any changes been made to the ipw3945 driver in the past couple weeks?
[18:21] <asac> iwl3945 that is i guess
[18:21] <calc> BenC: elmo and I are having trouble after resume it never comes back
[18:22] <calc> yea maybe iwl3945 (the intel wireless 3945 driver)
[18:22] <calc> btw the daemon is still in /etc/modprobe.d/ipw3945 file but doesn't seem to actually exist in /sbin
[18:22] <asac> calc: whats loaded?
[18:23] <calc> iwl3945
[18:23] <calc> iwlwifi_mac80211
[18:23] <asac> right
[18:23] <BenC> calc: ipw3945 is the one you want to use, if at all possible
[18:24] <asac> BenC: i think iwl is used by default in hardy though, isn't it?
[18:24] <calc> BenC: hmm why does it automatically use the other one then? and is that a bug?
[18:24] <BenC> because of a booger in our prep scripts
[18:25] <BenC> ipw3945 should be default, so try blacklisting iwl3945 in the meantime
[18:25] <calc> i don't see ipw3945 under /lib/modules/2.4.24-12-generic is it somewhere else?
[18:25] <calc> also the daemon it tries to load isn't in /sbin
[18:25] <asac> BenC: will you switch to ipw3945 by default even though we don't have any feedback on that for quite some time?
[18:25] <calc> find /lib/modules/2.6.24-12-generic -iname "*3945*"
[18:25] <calc> /lib/modules/2.6.24-12-generic/ubuntu/wireless/iwlwifi/iwlwifi/compatible/iwl3945.ko
[18:26] <BenC> asac: Yes, since it's roughly the same as in gutsy anyway
[18:26] <calc> the /etc/modprobe.d/ipw3945 file is there but the driver and daemon look missing (at least to me)
[18:26] <asac> BenC: well ... could you please try to think about network manager when doing such kind of things in future? would be really helpful
[18:26] <BenC> hmm
[18:27] <BenC> asac: not sure what you mean
[18:27] <calc> ah i see there is -13 kernel now
[18:27] <BenC> calc: it's not in the kernel..it's in lum...or should be
[18:27] <calc> BenC: ah
[18:27] <asac> BenC: well ... whenever you change modules and things like that i need to make sure that network manager works with that.
[18:27] <BenC> asac: hasn't network manager always worked with ipw3945?
[18:28] <BenC> asac: and can't it work with them at the same time, regardless of switching back and forth?
[18:28] <BenC> it does query the driver name before acting on things, right?
[18:28] <asac> no ... we had issues in gutsy that required tweaks
[18:28] <calc> BenC: its not there but the microcode is
[18:28] <BenC> were the tweaks dropped?
[18:28] <asac> BenC: we have 0.6.6 now so things might be different.
[18:28] <calc> i did a dpkg -L and there is no ipw3945.ko
[18:29] <BenC> calc: talking to rtg now
[18:29] <calc> BenC: ok
[18:29] <calc> if its in the package and not on my machine somewhere weird happened
[18:29] <asac> i don't say that it will not work, but i'd rather want the most important drivers in the archive well ahead of release
[18:29] <calc> er something :-)
[18:29] <mjg59`> BenC: http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=ubuntu/ubuntu-hardy-lum.git;a=commitdiff;h=ceca971c63ec135e0f01453ff3d527be493d915b
[18:29] <BenC> mjg59`: thanks
[18:30] <BenC> we should remove all traces of it then
[18:30] <BenC> there's still microcode and modprobe.d files laying around
[18:30] <mjg59`> BenC: The modprobe.d file is a conffile. I'm not sure there's a huge benefit in removing it.
[18:30] <calc> so if we aren't actually supposed to be using ipw3945 then the iwl3945 should work, i assume ;)
[18:31] <BenC> calc: right, it should
[18:31] <BenC> mjg59`: only harm I can think of is conflicts with manual installs
[18:32] <calc> ok well i'll try the new nm and see if it helps any
[18:34] <BenC> calc: alternative is to use the upcoming lbm, which has a newer (non-branded) 1.2.25 iwlwifi
[18:36] <compbrain> Anyone know if you can run the installer without the curses frontend?
[18:37] <cjwatson> compbrain: and with what in its place?
[18:38] <compbrain> Some scrolly text, from vc3 or 4. I'm capturing install logs over serial, lots of pretty ncurses scroll in the logs right now
[18:40] <TomaszD> pitti, what happened with langpacks twice a week? It's been two weeks... :( the date of last langpack is 20080317 :(
[18:41] <TomaszD> carlos, care to shed any light on this?
[18:41] <carlos> TomaszD: I don't control it. However I know pitti did an upload today
[18:42] <carlos> TomaszD: with the 'I don't control it' I mean that I'm not helpful on that...
[18:42] <TomaszD> carlos, ok thanks :] do you know why the langpack uploads don't appear on the hardy-changes list? Is there a list to track this?
[18:43] <carlos> TomaszD: no idea, I don't know the details about the packages when it moves to .deb ones...
[18:44] <TomaszD> ok
[18:45] <pochu> seeds' recommended packages are installed by default, right?
[18:48] <calc> BenC: when will that be uploaded?
[18:48] <BenC> calc: before RC
[18:48] <calc> BenC: ok
[18:51] <cjwatson> compbrain: there's the teletype frontend
[18:51] <cjwatson> compbrain: boot with DEBIAN_FRONTEND=text
[18:52] <cjwatson> compbrain: the installation guide recommends that for serial installs
[18:52] <compbrain> ah, glorious. Thanks :)
[18:52] <carlos> TomaszD: I think I found an explanation, Martin did a full language pack update, that takes more time to prepare and test, so I guess that's the reason we didn't get so often updates last week
[18:53] <TomaszD> carlos, ok, fair enough then :]
[18:56] <collusion> Hi, I'm DebuggingKernelSuspend on an IBM X40 and I got a hash match from /sys/power/pm_trace for ptyq9.  What's the next step I should take?
[18:57] <mjg59`> collusion: Try linux-image-2.6.24-13-generic
[18:58] <collusion> mjg59: is that out? i didn't see any kernel upgrades when i just apt-get update/upgraded.
[18:59] <mjg59> collusion: Yes, but there's no lum or lrm yet
[18:59] <collusion> mjg59: er, sorry, what's lum/lrm?
[19:00] <mjg59> linux-ubuntu-modules and linux-restricted-modules
[19:01] <slangasek> ummmm, so we're switching back from iwl3945 to ipw3945 two weeks before RC, after spending the entire release cycle using iwl3945?
[19:01] <mjg59> slangasek: I don't think that was the conclusion
[19:01] <collusion> oic, the package exists and can be explicitly installed... so i should manually install that and see if it fixes suspend? alright, giving it a try.
[19:02] <slangasek> mjg59: what is the conclusion then?
[19:03] <calc> ok got it built will test it out now
[19:05] <mjg59> slangasek: Uhm. I /think/ that nothing would change.
[19:05] <mjg59> Maybe I'm misreading this.
[19:06] <slangasek> ok, I like that conclusion better :)
[19:16] <collusion> mjg59: the 2.6.24-13-generic kernel does suspend properly.  but i'll need lum to get my wireless working unfortunately.  when is that scheduled to be released?
[19:22] <calc> asac: the new version didn't fix the problem
[19:22] <calc> asac: i can show syslog output if that is useful
[19:25] <asac> calc: unfortunate. only thing you could try for me is to see if downgrading NM helps
[19:25] <asac> otherwise its not a regression by nm i guess
[19:30] <calc> asac: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6273/
[19:30] <calc> asac: ok
[19:31] <calc> asac: i'll downgrade to 0.6.6-0ubuntu1 and see if it works there and then upgrade
[19:32] <calc> asac: how do i get old debs out of launchpad, i forgot
[19:32] <calc> asac: i know how to get old source but that wouldn't be binary identical
[19:33] <\sh> Hobbsee: hmm...who removed the ban from u-m for kmos?
[19:33] <slangasek> interesting to find my name in an upstream changelog that I'm reviewing for an FFe when it's an upstream I've never had any direct interaction with
[19:34] <asac> calc: you go to the release and find the resulting binary on the left
[19:34] <asac> calc: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/0.6.6-0ubuntu1/+build/534632
[19:35] <asac> thats for i386
[19:35] <\sh> slangasek: which one?
[19:35] <slangasek> \sh: nfs-utils
[19:36] <slangasek> (it's entirely valid, but still surprising)
[19:37] <\sh> slangasek: you mean the sign off message? :)
[19:37] <slangasek> yes
[19:38] <calc> asac: ok
[19:38] <\sh> slangasek: well, it's always surprising when you find your name inside upstream changelog...
[19:38] <jdstrand> hi slangasek! can you look at bug #209845 ? What is your opinion-- bug fix or feature (I thought fix)?
[19:38] <\sh> but now I wonder why my hardy-amd64-source chroot disappeared suddenly from schroot.conf
[19:39] <\sh> more strange, I build something this afternoon with it...and now it's just gone
[19:39]  * jdstrand finds it to be a fine line sometimes
[19:39] <slangasek> jdstrand: definitely a feature, but probably one that would be accepted if the diff was reasonable
[19:39] <\sh> well, not exactly the chroot but the LVM device for it
[19:40] <mjg59> collusion: Should be shortly
[19:40] <jdstrand> slangasek: ok.  the diff to program is reasonable, the diff to the test suite is large (to verify correctness)
[19:40] <\sh> cjwatson: thx for the gpt patch :)
[19:41] <cjwatson> \sh: no problem; does it work for you?
[19:41] <collusion> mjg59: ok, i'm eagerly awaiting.  thanks for the help.
[19:41] <jdstrand> slangasek: I'll prepare the upload and you (or whoever) can ping me if there are questions
[19:41] <\sh> cjwatson: tomorrow I'll test it with a areca raid storage server...
[19:42] <\sh> cjwatson: the schedule was very good :)
[19:42] <slangasek> jdstrand: ok. I agree that the program diff should be reasonable in size, but I'd prefer to see it anyway before upload, to assure myself that the implementation doesn't paint us into a corner somehow :)
[19:44] <cjwatson> \sh: heh
[19:44] <slangasek> mvo_: that's a whole lot of foo in that python-support changelog ;)
[19:45] <\sh> grmpf...what can cause the disappearance of a logical volume? even if it's displayed by lvdisplay?
[19:46] <slangasek> volume gnomes
[19:46] <\sh> hmm...
[19:47] <\sh> no it can't be gnomes fault ;)
[19:48] <\sh> -ESTRANGE...it isn't even listed in /dev/bs01/* which is my lvm device here
[19:51] <\sh> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6276/ this is the output if lvscan and ls -la /dev/bs01/* and now tell me what's wrong here
[19:52] <\sh> looks like I should test the windows way now...reboot is goot..
[19:54] <jdstrand> slangasek: I did not mean to suggest accepting the upload on my word :)
[19:55] <jdstrand> slangasek: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~jamie-strandboge/ufw/trunk/revision/138
[19:55] <ArneGoetje> Riddell: scim support on the current Kubuntu-KDE4 image is incomplete.
[19:55] <\sh> looks like that it has something to do with the non forced fsck
[19:56] <ArneGoetje> Riddell: the following packages and their dependencies need to be installed for scim to work: scim, scim-bridge-agent, scim-bridge-client-qt, scim-bridge-client-qt4, im-switch
[19:57]  * \sh reboots
[20:00] <jdstrand> slangasek: the non-test file in question is src/ufw
[20:03] <calc> asac: it worked on the 20080318.1 cd so i am going to download some others and verify it doesn't work when booted off them versus using my system
[20:03] <asac> calc: ok
[20:09] <jdstrand> slangasek: I should also mention that a) this is against trunk, and I am going to cherrypick this patch for hardy, b) I plan to also cherrypick r135 and r136 for bugs #209709 and #207156
[20:10] <jdstrand> (no code changes-- just adjusting logging for INVALID packets and noisy services
[20:10] <jdstrand> )
[20:12] <calc> too bad cdimage doesn't have enough space to hold daily's back to the previous release (in this case beta)
[20:12] <calc> there are only dailys for yesterday and today
[20:14] <asac> calc: there are not many updates that might have caused this
[20:14] <calc> asac: ah ok
[20:14] <asac> try hal
[20:14] <calc> asac: once i verify that the new daily doesn't work i will generate a package version diff and try hal first
[20:14] <asac> sounds good
[20:15] <calc> will be about an hour before its done downloading
[20:23] <sroecker> does hardy has this new /dev/mem protection?
[20:25] <calc> asac: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/udev/+bug/208103
[20:25] <calc> asac: i think this is my problem (maybe?)
[20:26] <calc> ubuntuforums probably solves my problem :)
[20:26] <calc> now i just should try moving that file and see what happens
[20:26] <jdong> sroecker: yes
[20:28] <sjoerd> thee
[20:28] <sjoerd> woops wrong window
[20:32] <calc> asac: yep that fixed it
[20:32] <calc> asac: its a problem with that file
[20:33] <asac> calc: good. can you take care that this gets fixed somehow?
[20:34] <slangasek> jdstrand: would it be possible for you to open a bug report for an FFe about this, including the full package diff (== upstream diff, for a native package..) of what you plan to upload?
[20:34] <calc> asac: i'm swamped with OOo stuff right now, but if it doesn't get fixed in the next few days I'll try to look into getting it done
[20:34] <jdstrand> slangasek: sure, no problem
[20:34] <calc> asac: i'm not sure what the proper solution should be, unless we just rm a conffile(?)
[20:37] <slangasek> calc: 70-persistent-net.rules isn't a conffile
[20:37] <slangasek> I think ideally we would have udev edit that file on upgrade if the attributes are missing
[20:37] <slangasek> but I'm not sure if adding these two new fields is *always* the right thing
[20:37] <slangasek> Keybuk: ^^ ?
[20:38] <Keybuk> it's not always the right thing
[20:38] <Keybuk> that's the problem
[20:38] <slangasek> is it possible to detect when it's the right thing?
[20:39] <Keybuk> not once you've booted with the broken file
[20:39] <Keybuk> it's possible to migrate people when they are running gutsy
[20:39] <Keybuk> fix the file
[20:39] <Keybuk> so that when they boot into hardy, it works
[20:39] <Keybuk> I have that working for upload this week
[20:39] <Keybuk> once you've rebooted with the broken file, it's damned hard to sort out
[20:40] <slangasek> hmm, ok
[20:40] <slangasek> but at least in theory it's fixable for people who have not yet upgraded to hardy
[20:40] <Keybuk> yes
[20:40]  * slangasek nods and leaves it in your hands :)
[20:41] <mvo_> slangasek: yeah, I guess I should have explained it on the sepolgen and python-sepolgen example :)
[20:41] <Keybuk> it's maybe fixable for others too
[20:41] <Keybuk> I'm working on it
[20:42]  * \sh has the bugger...superblock was corrupted on the ext3 partitions of his lvm schroot devices......after all, removed all schroot lvms, updated mk-sbuild-lv to format with xfs, recreated all schroots ... ready for work
[20:44] <calc> just deleting the file (i guess if the user doesn't modify it) fixes the problem also
[20:44] <calc> or does that not work in some cases?
[20:44] <slangasek> ... so your answer for an ext3 superblock corruption is to switch to a filesystem that likes to eat individual files instead?
[20:44] <slangasek> calc: it means that on next reboot, the devices are not guaranteed to come up with the same name mapping
[20:44] <Keybuk> calc: that will randomly rename your network interfaces
[20:44] <Keybuk> many might consider this pessimal behaviour
[20:44] <slangasek> (also, this file might have been customized by the user in the corner case)
[20:46] <calc> slangasek: ah yea
[20:46] <calc> Keybuk: yea that would be very bad for servers, probably not a big deal for desktop users
[20:46] <mvo_> Keybuk: do you have a opinion on bug #209347 ? I was wondering if the conversion should be moved back to udevs postinst or if it should just run on new installs of volumeid too (might confuse the installer?)
[20:46] <Keybuk> calc: unfortunately we also install udev on servers :)
[20:46] <calc> Keybuk: yea :)
[20:47] <Keybuk> mvo_: err, the conversion has never been in udev's postinst?
[20:47] <Keybuk> (it can't go there for various reasons)
[20:50] <calc> elmo: see scrollback to fix your wireless issue
[20:50] <mvo_> Keybuk: hm, there goes my nice theory about the bug. I will look closer
[20:50] <Keybuk> didn't we add it in edgy?
[20:51] <Keybuk> I can't remember
[20:52] <mvo_> Keybuk: yeah, its available since edgy (according to packages.ubuntu.com)
[20:52] <Seveas> Keybuk, hmm, that may be why ubotu is down -- didn't come up after dapper->harder upgrade :)
[20:52] <Hydrant> calc: Hey, I found a bug in OO for Ubuntu you might want
[20:53] <calc> Hydrant: what is that?
[20:53] <Keybuk> mvo_: I'm trying to remember how this may have worked
[20:53] <crimsun> Keybuk: what about checking the return value of, say, `ps -C nm-applet >/dev/null' and acting accordingly?
[20:53] <Keybuk> crimsun: removing that file is *always* wrong
[20:53] <Hydrant>  /usr/lib/openoffice/sdk/linux/bin/regcomp is a posix script file
[20:53] <crimsun> (obviously that's not a comprehensive solution)
[20:54] <Hydrant> ... regcomp isn't working on a .so file in my cwd unless I add "." to LD_LIBRARY_PATH in that script
[20:54] <Keybuk> mvo_: ah
[20:54] <Keybuk>  * Ship the UUID migration script as a separate executable, called by
[20:54] <Keybuk>     volumeid's postinst; also ensure we don't call it when installing the
[20:54] <Keybuk>     base system on the LiveCD (oops!)
[20:54] <calc> Hydrant: ah yea i have a bug open about that i think
[20:54] <Hydrant> calc: otherwise I'd have to copy the .so file to $OO/program
[20:55] <mvo_> Keybuk: aha! so it is probably safe to remove the [ -n "$2 ] bit from it, because the livecd diverts it?
[20:55] <calc> Hydrant: oh nm that isn't the same bug, please report it
[20:55] <Keybuk> mvo_: does it?
[20:55] <Hydrant> calc: where do I file a report ?
[20:55] <Keybuk> mvo_: the [ -n ] is there to protect the Live CD creation process
[20:55] <calc> Hydrant: launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openoffice.org/
[20:55] <crimsun> Keybuk: I don't remove it locally.  One option I'm considering is checking for loaded modules that are in a whitelist and removing the lines from that file.
[20:56] <Hydrant> calc: thx... how is your OO'ing going
[20:56] <Keybuk> crimsun: removing the lines is always wrong
[20:56] <Keybuk> the only correct solution is to add ATTR{type}=="1" for the individual entries that need it
[20:56] <mario_limonciell> Keybuk, ping (once you are done with the above conv).  wanted to follow up on the thinkfinger stuff.  It looks like everything is in main now, so just that last piece for enabling it in pam is necessary, right?
[20:56] <mvo_> Keybuk: hm, currently on dapper->hardy the -n test will fail because there is no volumeid in dapper yet
[20:57] <Keybuk> mario_limonciell: right
[20:57] <Keybuk> mvo_: indeed
[20:57] <mario_limonciell> Keybuk, which package's postinst was going to enable it?
[20:57] <calc> Hydrant: just waiting on some changes from doko then i will be uploading a first pass of 2.4.0 final
[20:57] <crimsun> Keybuk: when I get back, I'll show you an entry that will fail, since the entry that is created is bunk.  i.e., it's the MAC of the wifi iface prepended to a broadcast address.
[20:57] <Keybuk> mario_limonciell: no postinst will do it
[20:57] <calc> Hydrant: may have another upload before RC next week though
[20:57] <Keybuk> I still think that's wrong
[20:58] <mario_limonciell> Keybuk, oh.
[20:58] <Keybuk> it'll break upgrades, etc.
[20:58] <Keybuk> crimsun: ?
[20:59] <slangasek> Keybuk: trying to understand your comment above - is the plan to enable thinkfinger by default only on new installs or somethinG?
[20:59] <crimsun> Keybuk: on a dist-upgrade from gutsy, the generated entry for b43 (vice bcm43xx) had the MAC prepended to the broadcast address.
[20:59] <Keybuk> crimsun: that I don't know about
[20:59] <Keybuk> slangasek: we shouldn't ever enable thinkfinger by default
[20:59] <Keybuk> it has too many issues
[20:59] <slangasek> ok
[20:59] <slangasek> just making sure I understood
[21:00] <Keybuk> crimsun: if new lines are being generated wrong, that's a different bug
[21:00] <slangasek> whereas I am pondering enabling smbpasswd by default yet, and may need to rely on other people to check my sanity in this regard...
[21:00] <crimsun> Keybuk: understood.
[21:06] <Hydrant> calc: I've completely messed up my OO install with my development... I tried dpkg -l openoffice | grep openoffice and doing an apt-get remove for each followed by dpkg --purge, but my install is still messed up
[21:07] <Hydrant> calc: any suggestions for purging everything?
[21:09] <theunixgeek> How do I get my app to appear in the desktop menu after installation? Is there a shell script?
[21:09] <calc> Hydrant: | dpkg -l | grep (oo full version number) | cut -f 3 -d " " | xargs dpkg --purge --force-depends
[21:10] <calc> er get rid of that first |
[21:10] <calc> Hydrant: if that doesn't work you really screwed up something, since that will uninstall all of openoffice
[21:11] <calc> Hydrant: removing ~/.openoffice.org2 may help in some cases
[21:12] <seb128> slangasek: what timezone do you use to get bug #208598? The bug is not here using a french one for example
[21:13] <Hydrant> calc: thanks...yeah I got rid of ~/.openoffice..
[21:13] <Hydrant> calc: thx
[21:15] <Hydrant> calc: I don't see a meta package for OO, is there a quick way to put it back on
[21:15] <slangasek> seb128: America/Los_Angeles.
[21:24] <calc> Hydrant: openoffice.org
[21:24] <calc> Hydrant: that is the meta-package
[21:33] <seb128> mdke: around?
[21:33] <mdke> seb128: (In case I'm not around at the moment, please provide a bit of information about what you want and I will respond when I get back)
[21:33] <mdke> seb128: yeah
[21:33] <seb128> mdke: is smb file sharing described in the ubuntu documentation?
[21:34] <seb128> mdke: we just switched to nautilus-share which is a bit of sucking situation
[21:35] <seb128> shares-admin was requiring command line use and not allowing to use anonymous shares
[21:35] <seb128> so the change should be useful but it's late
[21:35] <Hydrant> calc: thx
[21:36] <mdke> seb128: looking
[21:40] <mdke> damn, Ctrl Z sucks
[21:40] <Nafallo> does it?
[21:40] <mdke> seb128: yes, it is documented in the "Internet" section - file:///usr/share/gnome/help/internet/C/internet.xml#networking-shares
[21:42] <seb128> mdke: hum, I don't like late changes
[21:43] <mdke> seb128: what would change from the user's POC?
[21:43] <seb128> mdke: no tools to do the shares, only right click on a folder from nautilus
[21:44] <seb128> mdke: so the first list of steps would need to be changed to that
[21:44] <seb128> mdke: the new dialog installs smb too if not installed and allow anonymous sharing
[21:44] <seb128> mdke: the part about setting the smb passwd is still true and the debugging one too
[21:46] <mdke> seb128: so basically the first section would be simplified?
[21:47] <seb128> mdke: yes
[21:47] <seb128> mdke: do you use hardy?
[21:47] <mdke> seb128: yes
[21:47] <seb128> mdke: it's, basically right clik on a folder in nautilus, select Sharing Options
[21:47] <jdstrand> slangasek: bug #209897
[21:48] <jdstrand> where's ubotu today?
[21:48] <seb128> mdke: and then you can describe the read only, anonymous and comment fields if you want
[21:48] <jdstrand> slangasek: that's the FFe for ufw
[21:48] <Nafallo> bug 209897
[21:48] <mdke> seb128: I'll upgrade now
[21:48] <Nafallo> hmm
[21:48] <seb128> mdke: thanks!
[21:49] <mdke> seb128: it sounds like it will be easy to change the documentation. But I'm more concerned about the translations of the documentation - quite a few languages are pretty advanced on translating that document. If the advantages of the change are pretty big, then we should try and go for it, I think - and warn the translators
[21:50] <seb128> mdke: I'll warn them
[21:51] <seb128> mdke: we will update the translations after stable and ship 8.04.1 cds, etc with updated packages when it'll be available
[21:52] <seb128> mdke: well, the new tool allow anonymous sharing which was not possible before which is a good thing ;-)
[21:52] <mdke> seb128: well, ubuntu-docs translations are done manually, although we will try to do that if the timeline for the point release is documented
[21:53] <mdke> seb128: can shares-admin and the new tool exist together? Or are they basically different?
[21:54] <seb128> mdke: they can exist together, though we removed shares-admin for now
[21:54] <seb128> I'm considering adding it back it a limited form though
[21:55] <seb128> ie, removing the nautilus integration and masking the menu item
[21:55] <mdke> that sounds pretty uncomfortable
[21:55] <seb128> what do you mean?
[21:56] <mdke> well, more work for you :)
[21:57] <mdke> anyway, that solution would answer require amendment to the docs
[21:57] <mdke> I'll see what I can do to amend it tonight, although if it will take a long time or access to a windows network, I will struggle...
[21:59] <mdke> seb128: I don't have a "Sharing Options" in my nautilus, although i just upgraded. What do I need?
[22:01] <slangasek> seb128: why would you add shares-admin back?
[22:03] <seb128> mdke: nautilus-share
[22:03] <seb128> slangasek: people complaining loud about late change, no way to modify their shares and nfs, no transition plan, etc ... though I think they are vocal minority as usual
[22:04] <slangasek> "shares and nfs"?
[22:04] <seb128> slangasek: I'm wondering if having only the capplet available and not listed in the menus would be a compromise to make them happy
[22:04] <mdke> never underestimate the vocal minority :)
[22:04] <mdke> seb128: thanks
[22:04] <slangasek> shares-admin did NFS management?
[22:04] <mdke> that looks neat
[22:04] <seb128> slangasek: yes
[22:04] <TameLion> Laney: Now all I need is a bot which responds to !cheek-seeker
[22:04] <slangasek> hmm, ok
[22:04] <TameLion> Hello all..
[22:05] <seb128> slangasek: but we don't think that's something desktop user are using
[22:05] <TameLion> I just really really need to say a huge THANK YOU! Hardy beta is the easiest install ever!
[22:05] <mdke> seb128: isn't it something that we should encourage desktop users to use over smb though?
[22:05] <slangasek> seb128: I for one wasn't even aware of it
[22:05] <seb128> slangasek: and I'm not really sure it was working, so far nobody complained about that, it seems they are just trying to argue
[22:06] <seb128> mdke: nfs? I don't think so
[22:06] <seb128> I think we should install gnome-user-share next cycle
[22:06] <slangasek> mdke: no, because user-based NFS auth is not straightforward to configure yet
[22:06] <seb128> it does webdav sharing using apache
[22:06] <slangasek> (prerequisites include Kerberos, and... 5 years experience administering Kerberos)
[22:07] <slangasek> seb128: and drop the samba sharing altogether, or..?
[22:07] <seb128> slangasek: no, samba sharing is the only thing which integrates to windows networks
[22:07] <mdke> slangasek: fair enough
[22:07] <seb128> webdav advertised over avahi is neat between linux boxes
[22:07] <seb128> but win doesn't list those
[22:08] <slangasek> gar why is ucf hanging on my Debian unstable dist-upgrade, that makes it harder for me to test the bzr 1.3 packages :P
[22:13] <Hydrant> calc: I think I really messed up my install
[22:13] <calc> Hydrant: what did you do to mess it up?
[22:13] <asac> slangasek: nm 0.6.6-0ubuntu5 upload ... all hidden network issues known so far fixed \o/
[22:14] <Hydrant> calc: I'm really not sure
[22:14] <calc> Hydrant: what are the symptoms?
[22:14] <Hydrant> calc: I've been working on my own modules for OO...
[22:14] <Hydrant> calc: The icons are all missing, OO looks like win95
[22:14] <Hydrant> calc: Also when I type "=" into OO Calc it crashes
[22:14] <calc> wow = crashes OO sounds bad
[22:15] <asac> lets hope that the next driver round doesn't break all these :)
[22:15] <calc> the icon issue may be related to the fallback not working, if you aren't using human theme
[22:15] <calc> but the = crashes oocalc isn't
[22:15] <Hydrant> calc: yeah, the = thing is likely me
[22:15] <mathiaz> slangasek: I'm trying to figure out how to add the default feisty smb.conf to allow for a smooth upgrade to hardy - I was wondering why do you use 3.0.26a-1 in the postinst script ?
[22:16] <Hydrant> calc: I'll have to so some slocating and hope to find something remaining
[22:16] <slangasek> mathiaz: version number from gutsy; split upgrade handling between gutsy and dapper
[22:17] <slangasek> mathiaz: so to handle the possibility of one of a number of different configs having been the initial version, we'd want to loop through a copy of the default configs for each release, debconfize them, and check which one is "closest"
[22:30] <mdke> seb128: neat tool. I've written the instructions and will upload a new pot template now to Rosetta, and post to -translators
[22:30] <seb128> mdke: thanks!
[22:32] <mdke> seb128: if you fancy checking the instructions, see http://mdke.org/tmp/smb.png
[22:33] <Daviey> mdke: gah, i tried to use the scrollbar in the pic..
[22:33] <seb128> mdke: looks good!
[22:34] <mdke> Daviey: ;)
[22:35] <tjaalton> slangasek: nfs-utils> you mentioned about some breakage in the build-deps?
[22:35] <mdke> seb128: cool. presumably nautilus-share will be installed by default, right?
[22:37] <seb128> mdke: yes, it is already if you try a daily CD
[22:38] <mdke> seb128: fine, guess that hasn't filtered through to my install yet
[22:39] <seb128> mdke: how do you update?
[22:39] <seb128> mdke: it's only a recommends and apt doesn't install those by default in ubuntu
[22:40] <mdke> seb128: update-manager
[22:40] <mdke> seb128: if not all users will have the package, we may have to add another line to document that! But shouldn't it be a dependency of ubuntu-desktop?
[22:43] <seb128> mdke: ubuntu-desktop recommends are installed by default and it let the choice to the user to uninstall
[22:44] <slangasek> tjaalton: yes, the change I cited was not a change that should've been made to nfs-utils, this was actually a bug in libnfsidmap-dev
[22:44] <mdke> seb128: hmm. Strange I didn't get it then
[22:45] <slangasek> tjaalton: it's a minor blemish, but since you weren't aware that it was an error, I wanted to make sure that you've tested this package in other respects :)
[22:45] <seb128> mdke: I don't think update-manager install those
[22:45] <seb128> mdke: new install and people using the dist-upgrader will have it though
[22:46] <tjaalton> slangasek: ah, yes. I've been running it on a couple of clients for a few days. Note that many of the upstream commits were already in the old package
[22:46] <mdke> seb128: ok, that may be enough. We don't really have a policy on whether our docs should take into account those who have tracked the development version
[22:47] <slangasek> tjaalton: yep, I see that
[22:47] <tjaalton> slangasek: -2 is mostly cleanup, but why not merge with it while fixing the build-deps?-)
[22:47] <seb128> mdke: well, those know what they are doing usually and should read the upgrade notes if they don't
[22:48] <seb128> mdke: but right, that's worth discussing at some point, nautilus-share is not the only package concerned by such situations
[22:48] <tjaalton> slangasek: so our libnfsidmap is safe since it's rebuilt against the new libldap2-dev?
[22:49] <mdke> seb128: agreed.
[22:49] <slangasek> tjaalton: our libnfsidmap is also broken; it's supposed to have a dependency on libldap2-dev and doesn't
[22:50] <slangasek> tjaalton: so even though I've highlighted that change as an error, it can't be dropped from nfs-utils without also making changes to libnfsidmap :/
[22:50] <tjaalton> slangasek: ah right, libnfsidmap-dev doesn't depend on libldap2-dev, gotcha
[22:52] <tjaalton> heh, there's already a bug filed about that on b.d.o
[22:52]  * lamont wonders if the gnome-equiv of jpilot has ever learned that more than one category exists in phone lists
[22:53] <slangasek> tjaalton: I think so; but perhaps not, since it was one of the nfs-utils comaintainers who brought it to my attention
[22:53] <slangasek> lamont: what's the gnome equiv of jpilot? :/
[22:54] <lamont> slangasek: ISTR evo was pretending to be that back then
[22:54] <tjaalton> slangasek: sesse is also a comaintainer of libnfsidmap, and filed the bug :)
[22:54] <lamont> but only believed in one category of phone contacts, so happy merge-o-rama
[22:54] <lamont> slangasek: more to the point, where did /usr/bin/dund move, I wonder?
[22:54] <slangasek> tjaalton: right, that would be the one :)
[22:55] <slangasek> lamont: I don't know what that is, so couldn't say
[22:55] <lamont> it's the implementation of MS DUN (ppp over bluetooth)
[22:56] <lamont> and was in bluez-utils in gutsy
[22:56] <lamont> and isn't in Contents-i386.gz for hardy...
[22:56] <lamont> loss
[22:57] <lamont> it's how one does bluetooth palm-sync with jpilot, you see....  no BT sync,  so we just do network sync over bluetooth networking.  win.
[22:58] <lamont> so... WTF dropped the --enable-dund from bluez-utils debian/rules invocation of configure, I wonder...
[22:59] <lamont> ah.  iz new config options
[22:59]  * lamont files a bug
[23:00] <kirkland> lamont: see Bug #191704
[23:00] <slangasek> lamont: ah, ick
[23:01] <kirkland> lamont: I think that bug is related to your discussion with slangasek
[23:03] <lamont> that'd be the same family
[23:06] <lamont> hrm... so who do we slap around for getting BT network back, I wonder?
[23:06] <lamont> I mean, I could just do the upload, I suppose... but someone would probably squawk
[23:09] <slangasek> lamont: looks like a plain regression halfway through the release cycle with no rationale, consider yourself freeze-blessed if that's the concern
[23:09] <lamont> slangasek: woot!
[23:09]  * lamont will compare the gutsy binary list until it's "right" then. "-)
[23:10] <slangasek> lamont: oh, but before you do, maybe this says the binary is no longer needed?: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez-utils/+bug/191704/comments/16
[23:10] <lamont> well, for things that it supports...
[23:11] <slangasek> right; so is dund the only bit really still missing?
[23:12] <lamont> show me network over BT :-(
[23:12] <lamont> and that was more someone saying "my keyboard/mouse work now", not that they were involved in dropping it...
[23:12] <lamont> there might be other stuff that still needs hidd... not sure
[23:12] <lamont> dund, hidd, pand, and passkey-agent are the dropped binaries...
[23:12] <slangasek> well, my understanding is that the standalone daemons are supposed to be replaced by these "service" records that DTRT
[23:12] <lamont> not sure why, though...
[23:13] <slangasek> so we now have bluetoothd-service-{input,network,serial}
[23:13] <slangasek> but I'm not sure that any of those map correctly to dund
[23:13] <slangasek> (whereas -input == hidd, and -network == pand)
[23:13] <lamont> well, I just know I broke my desktop when I upgraded to hardy...
[23:14] <lamont> so it sure as hell wasn't transparent...
[23:14] <slangasek> wrt which service?
[23:14] <lamont> (the DTRT that is)
[23:14] <lamont> syncing my palm
[23:14] <slangasek> so dund
[23:14] <lamont> right
[23:14] <slangasek> which is the one I'm not sure how it's mapped to the new services
[23:14] <lamont> so you want I should just enable that one?
[23:15] <slangasek> that seems the least disruptive change, anwyay
[23:15] <lamont> or should I wait until morning and have a flamefest^Wdebugging session with someone european?
[23:16] <slangasek> well, I'm less sure now that the dropping was unintentional... it may be that these daemons are no longer even provided upstream...?
[23:16] <lamont> hrm... stevenk and Mithrandir
[23:16] <lamont> dund is in the source still
[23:16] <slangasek> ok
[23:16] <lamont>   --enable-hidd           install HID daemon
[23:16] <lamont>   --enable-pand           install PAN daemon
[23:16] <lamont>   --enable-dund           install DUN daemon
[23:16] <lamont> from configure
[23:16] <slangasek> StevenK: you're not European
[23:17] <lamont> those names were from the blamelog^wchangelog
[23:17] <slangasek> yes
[23:18] <kirkland> lamont: slangasek: i know that the helper scripts that I use in gutsy to do dial up networking and syncing my palm, broke when I upgraded to hardy due to a missing dund (see comment #19 in that bug).  there was something about "dbus" providing that functionality now, but i have yet to figure out how
[23:19] <lamont> kirkland: right - it's either broken by not being there, or broken by not being transparent
[23:19] <lamont> since delivering /usr/bin/dund should make it just work again
[23:19] <xivulon> slangasek, would you agree with the proposal in my last comment of #140458 to provide wubi-specific metalink url?
[23:25] <kirkland> lamont: i'll gladly test, if you build a package with dund
[23:25] <lamont> kirkland: yeah - it's on my list for tonight, I think
[23:25] <kirkland> lamont: usb syncing sucks ;-)
[23:25] <lamont> esp if StevenK shows up...
[23:25] <lamont> kirkland: and big time
[23:25] <lamont> anyway, afk for a bit
[23:28] <slangase`> lamont, kirkland: you have the bluetooth-gnome stuff installed?  Icon in the panel?
[23:30] <kirkland> slangasek: yes
[23:31] <slangasek> kirkland: right-click, preferences, services: enable the serial service (or network service, according to your needs)?
[23:31] <kirkland> slangasek: I tried those, it didn't work for me
[23:32] <slangasek> is your device listed under 'bonded devices' in the adapter paneL?
[23:32] <slangasek> s/panel/tab/
[23:33] <kirkland> slangasek: yep
[23:38] <kirkland> slangasek: is there more you wanted me to try?
[23:38] <slangasek> kirkland: not that I know of at this point :)
[23:38] <kirkland> slangasek: ah, okay...  i was on the edge of my seat :-)
[23:45] <elmo> calc: err, summarize, pls?
[23:48] <calc> elmo: /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistent-net.rules is broken, remove or move it and it is likely to work
[23:48] <elmo> calc: right, sorry, just managed to fish that out of scroll back
[23:48] <calc> elmo: keybuk has more details about the problem, but apparently its hard or maybe impossible to fix for people who tracked hardy without removing the file or manually modifying it
[23:48] <elmo> calc: (and keybuk/slangasek) thanks
[23:49] <calc> elmo: no problem :)
[23:58] <slangasek> kirkland: heh, well, /usr/share/doc/bluez-utils/README.Debian.gz still talks about pand and dund, so I'm at a loss
[23:58] <slangasek> I think this may be in the category of "things the bluez developers know and google does not" :)
[23:59] <kirkland> slangasek: yup.  i've scoured the documentation looking for the newfangled way of doing what I had become accustomed to with dund.  and i'd gladly write a wiki page if i figured it out.