LaserJockwho do we talk to about wiki spam?00:50
mdkeLaserJock: you get the account disabled in #launchpad08:09
mdkeMadpilot: right08:11
LhademmorHi all, I've just created a patch for bug 185892 , but since I still consider myself a newcomer, could someone please comment on it? :)12:05
ubotuLaunchpad bug 185892 in ubuntu-docs "instructions how to paste commands incorrect" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/18589212:05
=== jono is now known as severedfifth
=== severedfifth is now known as jono
mdkeevening all20:41
LaserJockhi mdke20:42
nixternalold school documentors reunite!21:04
* LaserJock ^5s nixternal 21:05
nixternalwasabi LaserJock and mdke!?!21:05
LaserJockouch, think I trhew out my shoulder21:05
* LaserJock runs for the Bengay21:05
nixternalcome on, icey hot is way better21:06
jjesseafternoon all21:13
LaserJockjjesse: wow, you must have offended nixternal :-)21:18
jjesseLaserJock: i thought it was you21:19
LaserJockoh, that could be21:19
LaserJockmust've been the Bengay vs Icey Hot comment :-)21:19
mdkewhoops, sorry. Hi LaserJock, nixternal21:52
mdkehi jjesse too21:52
jjessehello mdke21:52
LaserJockmdke: so lifeless suggested starting from scratch for Intrepid?21:52
mdkeI've created the branches now, and pushed them to launchpad21:53
mdkeit takes like 2 minutes to get one from scratch21:53
LaserJockand they are the newer format?21:55
mdkeLaserJock: yes21:56
mdkeLaserJock: which means you can't download them into a shared repo with the old format... but I'm hoping to upgrade all the branches shortly21:57
jjessei branched my own intrepid last night :)21:57
mdkejjesse: from the launchpad one?21:58
jjessemdke: yeah did a bzr branch to get it locally and then i'll push to the shared branch21:58
mdkeeverything work ok?22:00
LaserJockmdke: the old branche could go into a shared repo anyway, from what I understnd22:00
jjessemdke: yeah they did22:00
jjesseit was super quick i didn't know what to do ;)22:00
mdkeLaserJock: the non-intrepid branches are all the same format, so they can go into a shared repo with that format22:00
mdkeLaserJock: the new one is a different format, so it can only go into shared repos with the new format22:01
LaserJockmdke: but I was told that their format wasn't supported by shared repos22:01
mdkeLaserJock: which format?22:01
mdkeold or new?22:01
LaserJockbah, I can't remember it exactly22:01
mdkesure they can. I've had one since we started using bzr22:02
LaserJockok, #bzr told me I had to convert them before I could use them in a shared repo22:02
mdkemaybe you mean that Launchpad doesn't support shared repos on the server-side?22:02
mdkewell, that is definitely wrong :)22:02
LaserJockok then22:03
LaserJockno biggie, other than I spent like 1.5hrs converting branches the other day to get a shared repo :/22:03
mdkeLaserJock: the shared repo instructions have been on our wiki page since we started22:04
mdkebut anyway, there is value in converting your branches :)22:04
mdkeyou get the new format22:05
mdkeso you upgraded with bzr upgrade?22:05
LaserJockwell, I haven't used bzr much with the doc team22:05
LaserJockunfortunately edubuntu-docs is ... slow going22:06
LaserJockwhat I did was create a shared repo22:06
LaserJockthen I branched my local branch into it22:06
LaserJockwhich did the conversion22:06
mdkeah, that's what I did too22:06
mdkeI've been a bit worried about trying the upgrade on our lp branches, in case something breaks22:07
LaserJockit seems from hanging out in #bzr that upgrading formats should be pretty safe22:07
LaserJockbut to be honest, I don't like how bzr keeps changing22:08
LaserJockit makes me feel like git is safer and more friendly :-)22:08
mdkeit's a bit odd, yeah22:08
LaserJockit seems like I'm always in a "corner case" or something22:09
mdkewhat really has been a pita for us has been the bzr-svn import22:10
mdkebecause bzr-svn forces you to use a non-default format22:10
mdkedue to something to do with how svn works, dunno what22:10
LaserJockI wish they would have done a bit more work with us on that22:10
mdkeI don't think there is a way around it22:11
LaserJockwell, converting it to a good format would have helped22:11
mdkethe new format didn't exist at the time22:12
mdkeours *was* the good format, I think22:12
LaserJockbut there was a standard "old" for mat22:12
LaserJockwell, #bzr told me that it was an experimental format22:12
mdkeright, which couldn't be used because we used bzr-svn to import the repo22:13
LaserJockbut we could have had it converted22:13
mdkeapparently not22:13
LaserJockfrom the bzr-svn import format to a standard knit format22:13
mdkeyou can't convert in that direction, apparently22:13
LaserJockto me that's why this stuff is less than ideal22:14
LaserJockbut oh well, that's water under the bridge22:14
LaserJockwith fresh branches we could do this "student branchs" thing22:15
LaserJockwithout it being a big ordeal22:15
mdkewell, I still have the same concerns about that22:16
mdkesingle branches, sure, but a team branch, little bit more cautious22:16
LaserJocksure sure22:16
LaserJockthat's what I meant22:16
mdkeif a student undertakes a biggish project, a separate branch would work22:16
LaserJockI just couldn't imagine students pushing these hug branches around for a patch22:16
* mdke nods22:17
mdkea patch is much easier22:17
LaserJockI still don't get the distributed VCS stuff, tbh22:18
LaserJockI like being able to work offline22:18
LaserJockbut it still seems like sending a patch to a list is the way to go22:18
LaserJockas opposed to merging branches all the time22:18
mdkeI think for bigger things, I can see how it would work22:19
mdkebut for small things, no22:19
LaserJockmdke: oh dude, while you are here :-)22:21
LaserJockmdke: I would like to have the LTSP information that was in the Edubuntu Handbook transferred to ubuntu-intrepid22:21
LaserJockI'm not so sure it would fit in very well with TBH22:22
LaserJockwe could trying to make it suitable or we could do a LTSP Guide22:23
LaserJockdo you have an opinion?22:23
mdkeLaserJock: I don't think the average desktop user will use that material, so I wonder if it wouldn't work better as a separate package?22:23
LaserJockI was gonna say we could put it in the Server Guide22:24
LaserJockbut that's not right either22:24
mdkeLaserJock: or move it to the wiki, it really depends on when it is used22:24
LaserJockwell, we will probably have a online version on edubuntu.org22:24
mdkewhat's wrong with it in edubuntu?22:24
LaserJockit's not in Edubuntu anymore22:24
LaserJockLTSP is a part of Ubuntu22:25
LaserJockso it would be more logical to have it in Ubuntu22:25
mdkeah, I'm a bit hampered by not knowing what LTSP is22:26
LaserJockI guess a separate packages might work, though I'd probably want to build it out of ubuntu-docs rather than edubuntu-docs22:26
mdkeI thought edubuntu was built on it22:26
LaserJockit is22:26
LaserJockbut Edubuntu is now an addon CD22:26
LaserJockLTSP is server stuff22:26
LaserJockthat is now in the Ubuntu Alternate CD22:26
LaserJockso that's why it's all confusing22:27
LaserJockit's mostly used by Edubuntu users at this point, but it's not edubuntu-specific22:27
LaserJockI guess we could ditch it altogether :/22:28
LaserJockit's been an almost 2 year project though, I hate to just get rid of it22:28
* mdke head swims22:29
mdkelet's keep it around and decide what to do with it22:29
mdkebut I don't think I can help much with that decision ;)22:29
* mdke is busy smashing up the ubuntu-intrepid layout22:30
LaserJockwell, I just wonder if you'd be opposed to having another "Guide" in ubuntu-docs22:30
mdkeLaserJock: no, not in principle, at all22:30
LaserJockmdke: do you want me to smash edubuntu-docs after you're done?22:31
mdkeit's quite fun...22:31
mdkebut I won't be done fixing it for a while :)22:31
LaserJockI wondered if we could use prefixes for stuff in the common areas that are derivative-specfic22:32
mdkeyou mean derivative specific individual files?22:32
mdkethey should definitely have unique names22:33
LaserJockthe only thing I might have a conflict with is maybe gnome-menus-C.ent from libs/22:34
mdkebut isn't it good to be able to merge the bits you want and keep the bits you don't separate?22:35
LaserJockactually nope22:35
LaserJockI have edubuntu-menus-C.ent22:35
LaserJockhow do you mean exactly?22:35
LaserJockI don't plan on doing any merging22:35
LaserJocklet me think about this22:36
LaserJockI just don't see how this would work other than having all the contents of the derivatives in ubuntu-*22:37
LaserJockthese are divergent branches I think22:37
mdkeyay, revision 2 pushed up22:38
LaserJockso a merge would cause me to get anything else that had changed in ubuntu-*22:38
mdkeI don't follow22:38
LaserJockhow would I merge changes to libs/ into edubuntu-22:39
LaserJockI would have to merge each individual revision22:39
LaserJockand they would have to not touch anything but libs/22:39
LaserJockotherwise I'm going to get all the other stuff and the merge will fail22:40
mdkecan't you merge from a specific location?22:41
LaserJockonly a branch22:41
mdkei thought you could merge a specific file, I'm sure I've done that before22:41
LaserJockwell hmm22:41
mdkewell, you should be able to!22:42
mdkewe will demand that it be implemented :)22:42
LaserJockI swear #bzr told me you couldn't but they eventually wanted to be able to do that22:42
LaserJockbut now that I think about it, that seems a bit nuts22:42
mdkelet's try22:42
mdkeman that sucks22:43
LaserJockdidn't work?22:44
LaserJockdoes it tell you they are divergent branches?22:44
mdke"no common ancestor"22:44
mdkeanyway, you can do it on the revision number22:45
LaserJockso like I said, we'd need to make sure that we only touch libs/ when we are making a change22:45
LaserJockand the derivates will need to do each revision individually22:46
mdkeyes, but small commits are good anyway22:46
LaserJockwich isn't horrible, but not exactly trivial either22:46
mdkebut in the future...22:49
mdkewe can try nesting a common branch in each of our derivative branches22:49
mdkeand just updating that22:49
mdkethe benefit of having this format22:49
LaserJockthis way isn't too bad as long as everybody know about it22:50
LaserJocklibs/ change rarely22:50
mdkeok, time for bed22:52
mdkenice to chat! cya22:53
LaserJockmdke: cya22:53

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