[15:00] <barry> #startmeeting
[15:00] <MootBot> Meeting started at 16:00. The chair is barry.
[15:00] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[15:00] <barry> hello everyone and welcome to this week's ameu reviewer's meeting
[15:00] <barry> who's here today?
[15:00] <sinzui> me, myself, and I
[15:00] <kiko> me
[15:00] <schwuk> me
[15:00] <statik> me
[15:00] <gmb_> me
[15:00] <bac> em
[15:00] <bac> me
[15:00] <intellectronica> me
[15:01] <allenap> me
[15:01] <salgado> me
[15:01] <jtv> me
[15:02] <bigjools> me
[15:02] <barry> great!
[15:03] <barry> [TOPIC] next meeting
[15:03] <MootBot> New Topic:  next meeting
[15:03] <barry> same time and place?  anybody know they won't be here or if that time is bad?
[15:03] <flacoste> me
[15:03] <flacoste> time isn't bad, i'm just late :-)
[15:03] <barry> flacoste: not as bad as me with the last asiapac meeting ;)
[15:04] <barry> great, next week, same time and place
[15:04] <barry> [TOPIC] action items
[15:04] <MootBot> New Topic:  action items
[15:04] <barry>  * gmb to add lpreview to sourcecode and hack rf-setup to link it in
[15:04] <barry> gmb: didn't i see some updates to that on the ml today?
[15:04] <gmb> So.
[15:04] <gmb> I've got a patch for rf-setup.
[15:06] <barry> gmb's got some freenode connectivity problems
[15:06] <gmb_> Oy.
[15:06] <gmb_> Which are hopefully resolved.
[15:07] <barry> gmb: np, if you want we can move on?
[15:07] <gmb_> barry:  did you see any of my messages about getting lpreview into sourcecode?
[15:07] <barry> gmb: no, last thing you said was:
 I've got a patch for rf-setup.
[15:07] <gmb_> Ah, right.
[15:07] <gmb_> So.
[15:08] <gmb_>  I finally remembered to contact mthaddon about getting it into sourcecode
[15:08] <gmb_> But he's having problems pulling the branch from devpad (specifically bug 217701)
[15:08] <gmb_> So I don't know when this is going to be complete.
[15:08] <gmb_> I'll keep on top of it though.
[15:08] <barry> gmb: thanks!  do you want me to keep this action item on the list until it's completed?
[15:09] <gmb_> barry: Please.
[15:09] <barry> gmb: cool, thanks
[15:09] <gmb_> There's nothing like a looming action item to remind me :)
[15:09] <barry> speaking of which...
[15:09] <barry>  * barry to email about submit_branch vs public_branch
[15:09] <barry> done.  just. :)
[15:10] <barry> we can discuss that one further on the ml
[15:10] <barry>  * allenap to update PR and communicate to team new rejection policy
[15:10] <allenap> I think I did that.
[15:10] <barry> allenap: i think you did too!  thanks
[15:10] <barry> btw, i brought this up at the last asiapac meeting and everyone thought it was a good idea too
[15:10] <barry> allenap: so thanks!
[15:10] <allenap> Great.
[15:11] <barry>  * bigjools to take brace closing policy to ml
[15:11] <barry> which was done too
[15:11] <bigjools> done, but sorry I've not pushed to a resolution yet
[15:11] <barry> leading to an action item for me:
[15:11] <flacoste> bikeshedding is going on
[15:11] <barry>  * bigjools to take brace closing policy to ml
[15:11]  * bigjools gets deja vu
[15:11] <barry> flacoste: you read the asiapac notes, didn't you? :)
[15:11] <gmb_> flacoste: That means something different to me than it does to you, I hope...
[15:11] <flacoste> barry:  indeed :-)
[15:11] <barry> :-D
[15:12] <sinzui> I liked the colours
[15:12]  * bigjools also wonders what bikeshedding is
[15:12] <flacoste> bigjools: http://pink.bikeshed.org/
[15:12] <barry> flacoste: no, he wants http://mediumorchid.bikeshed.org/
[15:13] <bigjools> ah
[15:13] <barry> anyway, i will try to drive us to a decision this week and we'll codify it in our style guide
[15:13] <barry> bigjools: thanks, i'm marking your action item as done!
[15:13] <barry>  * bac to (re-)email the list about his PendingReviews notifier cronscript
[15:13] <bac> done
[15:13] <bigjools> PEP8 is generally "bikeshedding" in that case :)
[15:14] <flacoste> bigjools: actually, that has a better explanation: http://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/faq/misc.html#BIKESHED-PAINTING
[15:14] <barry> bac: yep, thanks!  i tried it but i'm not getting the emails when run under cron so i have to figure out what's going on.  but when run from hand, it worked just fine
[15:14] <sinzui> barry I thought https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/private/launchpad/2008-April/027347.html was your final opinion on the closing brace.
[15:15] <barry> sinzui: i'm happy to call the discussion over then :)
[15:15] <barry> will follow up on the ml
[15:15] <barry> [TOPIC] queue status
[15:15] <MootBot> New Topic:  queue status
[15:16] <barry> i know there were 12 branches on PR when i finished my OCR.  thanks everyone for cranking away on these
[15:16] <barry> i think we're largely caught up?
[15:16] <intellectronica> completely
[15:16] <barry> you guys totally rock
[15:17] <schwuk> barry: the only problem was you put four branches on my queue on Monday, and I was out until today.
[15:17] <barry> schwuk: sorry about that.  didn't realize you were out. :(
[15:17] <schwuk> Two went to on-call, one is done and one is in progress, so they're caught up with.
[15:17] <barry> btw, my apologies to the mentorees.  i loaded you guys up :)
[15:17] <flacoste> schwuk: actually, you should put a note in your queue when not avqailable
[15:18] <flacoste> that applies to everybody, btw ^^^
[15:18] <barry> flacoste: +1
[15:18] <schwuk> flacoste: I know - I realised afterwards. However the canonicaladmin and the team calendar was updated.
[15:18] <bigjools> can I put a note in saying that soyuz is destroying my social life? :)
[15:18] <allenap> No worries barry, you gave me two of my own branches, which meant I had an opportunity to try out the new rejection policy :)
[15:18] <flacoste> lol
[15:19] <barry> allenap: i did that on purpose then :)
[15:19] <barry> allenap: yeah, sorry about that
[15:19] <barry> anything else on the queue?
[15:19] <allenap> barry: It was fine, I noticed it pretty soon, so they didn't get old.
[15:20] <barry> allenap: great.  and the rejection policy worked out okay?
[15:20] <allenap> barry: I can confirm that it went smoothly and according to expectations.
[15:20] <barry> allenap: fantastic
[15:20] <barry> 5
[15:20] <schwuk> barry: I've got a number of merge-approved branches in my queue from Friday. Can I just remove them, or wait for the owners to cleanup?
[15:21] <barry> schwuk: the owners are supposed to clean them up, but i've found that often doesn't happen.  if they're still in your queue after they land, you can delete them yourself
[15:21] <bigjools> we should send an email to remind people to clean up PR when their branch lands - again
[15:21] <schwuk> bigjools: +1
[15:21] <sinzui> schwuk: I often remove landed branches
[15:22] <bigjools> it wastes my time to find out if they landed or not
[15:22] <barry> bigjools: good idea.  btw, pending-reviews will tell you if they've landed because the branch will have a strike-thru
[15:22] <barry> bigjools: but i agree, owners should clean up after themselves.  will you send that email?
[15:22] <bigjools> sure
[15:23]  * schwuk nudges gmb_ intellectronica, cprov, BjornT, and bigjools to clean up their branches in his queue
[15:23] <barry> [ACTION] bigjools to email list about curbing your branches
[15:23] <MootBot> ACTION received:  bigjools to email list about curbing your branches
[15:23] <bigjools> mine's not landed yet :p
[15:23] <intellectronica> schwuk: be my guest, you can clean them yourself ;)
[15:24] <schwuk> bigjools: fair enough
[15:24] <bigjools> of course it would have if PQM had not gone fubar yesterday
[15:25] <barry> [TOPIC]   * Mentoring update
[15:25] <MootBot> New Topic:    * Mentoring update
[15:25] <sinzui> Schwuk has kept me very bussy
[15:25] <gmb_> schwuk: Done
[15:25] <barry> any thing on this topic?  just a reminder that i'll solicit for graduations and new recruits after week 4
[15:26] <schwuk> sinzui: Don't want you getting bored :)
[15:26]  * sinzui hacks on launchpad when he is board
[15:26] <sinzui> or bored
[15:26] <sinzui> or boared
[15:26]  * jtv doesn't want to know about that bit...
[15:27] <sinzui> boring
[15:27]  * gmb_ resists a "squeal piggy" joke
[15:27]  * sinzui was thinking of Oblix
[15:27] <barry> [TOPIC]  * Review process
[15:27] <MootBot> New Topic:   * Review process
[15:28] <barry> i have nothing on this topic, so i'll throw it open to the floor
[15:28]  * barry hears crickets
[15:28] <barry> 5
[15:28] <barry> 4
[15:28] <intellectronica> ehm
[15:29] <intellectronica> some folks can't use the review plugin
[15:29] <intellectronica> we should try to get it sorted, since using the review plugin is now mandatory
[15:29] <bac> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bzr-lpreview/+bug/195217
[15:29] <intellectronica> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bzr-lpreview/+bug/195217
[15:29] <ubotu> Launchpad bug 195217 in bzr-lpreview "ReadOnly error when running bzr review-submit" [Undecided,New]
[15:29] <intellectronica> bac, you win
[15:30] <barry> i think i had that once, but i "fixed" it by blowing away my rf working tree and re-branching it
[15:30] <gmb_> I suspect that there aren't that many eyeballs on the lpreview bugs.
[15:30] <gmb_> I know I haven't had much chance to look at them recently.
[15:31] <gmb_> And I suspect that mwhudson_ is in the same kind of position (or worse)
[15:31] <barry> yeah, we should all chip in on this
[15:31] <gmb_> +1
[15:32] <intellectronica> barry: wow, could you comment in the bug. that's a bit brute force, but if it works...
[15:32] <bac> intellectronica suggested we get abel to do more experimentation and add info to the bug report, since he can reproduce it.
[15:32] <barry> [AGREED] we should all chip in on watching lpreview bugs
[15:32] <MootBot> AGREED received:  we should all chip in on watching lpreview bugs
[15:32] <barry> intellectronica: will do
[15:32] <bac> i'll contact abel to ask him for more info
[15:32] <gmb_> barry: Could you add an action item for me to prod mwh about the 800-line limit patch I did?
[15:33] <gmb_> I know he had some concerns about it but I haven't heard from him since, so I need to chase it up.
[15:33] <barry> [ACTION] gmb to prod mwh again about the 800-line limit patch
[15:33] <MootBot> ACTION received:  gmb to prod mwh again about the 800-line limit patch
[15:34] <gmb_> Ta
[15:34] <barry> we have some time left; does anybody have anything else not on the agenda?
[15:34] <barry> 5
[15:34] <sinzui> I was wondering if we all feel comfortable reviewing Javascript?
[15:35] <gmb_> Hmm.
[15:35] <barry> sinzui: and css
[15:35] <allenap> Do we have JS coding standards?
[15:35] <gmb_> It's not really my forte certainly.
[15:35] <intellectronica> allenap: sort of, yes
[15:35] <barry> who are our js experts?
[15:35] <flacoste> intellectronica
[15:35] <flacoste> SteveA
[15:35] <intellectronica> there's a wiki page, and we try to update it when we can
[15:36] <flacoste> any one else?
[15:36] <allenap> I'm not bad at js.
[15:36] <flacoste> probably sinzui
[15:36] <sinzui> I was reviewing one of bigjools's branches. I knew several ways of doing something, but I decided to confer with intellectronica because we do not have a lot of rulings about how we write code.
[15:36] <intellectronica> i'm always happy to give advice if someone reviews js code and they aren't sure
[15:37]  * bigjools 's js came from Google, it must have been perfect already
[15:37] <intellectronica> and if, like sinzui did, this results in a nice addition to the coding standards wiki page, even better
[15:37] <barry> intellectronica: can you add a link to the js styleguide on this page: https://launchpad.canonical.com/TipsForReviewers
[15:37] <intellectronica> barry: sure thing
[15:38] <barry> [ACTION] intellectronica to add js styleguide link to TipsForReviewers
[15:38] <MootBot> ACTION received:  intellectronica to add js styleguide link to TipsForReviewers
[15:38] <barry> intellectronica: thanks
[15:39] <barry> intellectronica, SteveA, sinzui can you put together some resources or ideas for helping others on the team get more proficient at reviewing js?
[15:39] <sinzui> barry: I have some I can add.
[15:39] <barry> i think this would also help us as devs as we start incorporating more js onto the site
[15:39]  * sinzui may want css in there too since they are connected in the browser engines.
[15:39] <barry> sinzui: awesome, thanks.  add it to the js styleguide i think
[15:39] <barry> sinzui: yes, definitely
[15:40] <barry> i don't think we have a css styleguide, so i think it makes sense to combine the two, do you?
[15:40] <intellectronica> i don't think css and js should be together
[15:41] <sinzui> barry: The style object in JS depends a lot on the CSS engine. You cannot make assumptions when working with that, but that is the only intersection.
[15:41] <intellectronica> and i think we should ask mpt to own the css guide, because he's probably the most knowledgable about it
[15:41] <barry> fair enough
[15:41] <barry> [ACTION] sinzui to update js styleguide page with helpful resources
[15:41] <MootBot> ACTION received:  sinzui to update js styleguide page with helpful resources
[15:42] <barry> okay, 3 minutes left.  anything else?
[15:43] <mpt> #1 on the CSS style guide: Stop ordering the style sheet chronologically!
[15:44] <sinzui> Oh, that would be bad
[15:44] <barry> mpt!  is there a css styleguide and if not can you put one together?
[15:44] <intellectronica> mpt: how should we order them, then?
[15:45] <mpt> barry, no, and yes, in my copious spare time
[15:45] <barry> mpt ;)
[15:45] <mpt> intellectronica, for starters, there are sections in the style sheet for each application
[15:46] <barry> okay, we're out of time
[15:46] <sinzui> nearest to the subject matter (related selectors) to take precedence without stealing precedence for other rules.
[15:46] <mpt> Code, Bugs, Blueprints, etc
[15:46] <barry> #endmeeting
[15:46] <mpt> So one very helpful step would be putting app-specific styles in their proper sections.
[15:46] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 16:46.
[15:46] <barry> thanks everyone
[15:46] <intellectronica> thanks barry