[00:09] <wolfger> question: Is "centered maxpect" scheduled for re-inclusion in KDE with 4.1?
[00:09] <wolfger> I miss that rather strongly
[01:59] <DaSkReech> stdin: ping
[02:16] <nixternal> yay, power is back on!
[02:17] <DaSkReech> Ha ha I just saw you login too. I was going to bother you but ...
[02:18] <DaSkReech> snow storm?
[02:34] <nixternal> who knows what happened...it seems one of the power transformers blew up down the street
[02:34] <DaSkReech> oh you heard it?
[02:35]  * ScottK cautions nixternal about Chicago and fires.
[02:36] <DaSkReech> :-D
[02:38] <DaSkReech> great debian doesn't seem o have any .71 packages :-(
[02:47] <nixternal> DaSkReech: nah, didn't hear it, I don't think...I heard popping but I can't be certain it was the transformer
[02:48] <nixternal> DaSkReech: debian has .71 packages, I have been watching the Debian Installer notices
[02:48] <nixternal> but those won't do you any good as their structure would destroy us
[02:49] <DaSkReech> heh/me blins
[02:49]  * DaSkReech blinks too
[02:49] <DaSkReech> what do you mean?
[02:49] <nixternal> it would overwrite our KDE 3 packages
[02:50] <DaSkReech> well can't we patch that out
[02:50] <nixternal> kdebase-workspace_4.0.72-1_multi.changes uploaded successfully to localhost
[02:50] <nixternal> along with the files:
[02:51] <nixternal> DaSkReech: use our packages that are already there
[02:51] <nixternal> if you went the debian route, you would have to change cdbs/*, control, *.post*, *.pre*, and *.install
[02:52] <DaSkReech> ok
[02:52] <DaSkReech> packages.ubuntu.com it is then
[02:52] <nixternal> I am trying to find a nice messenger bag...anyone have any recommendations?
[02:52] <nixternal> I know about Tom Bihn and Chrome bags already
[02:53] <DaSkReech> My friend was doing deep investigation of those the other day
[02:53] <nixternal> I would use the Ubuntu Ogio bag, but they don't sell it anymore, and plus for me to buy it, I would have to refinance my house since they rip you off for US purchases
[02:53] <ScottK> nixternal: We need to switch and base off of Debian for Intrepid at some point.
[02:54] <DaSkReech> Well p.u.c has intrepid up already :)
[02:54] <nixternal> ScottK: of course for Intrepid
[02:55] <nixternal> but for Hardy, no way jose
[02:55] <ScottK> Agreed.
[02:55] <nixternal> DaSkReech: if you did Debian packages, you couldn't never show your face out in public again...people would hunt you for blood! :)
[02:55] <nixternal> couldn't never?
[02:55] <nixternal> wow do I sound like an idiot from Chicago
[02:56] <nixternal> oh wait, I am...sorry
[02:56]  * DaSkReech thinks there may be a reason for that
[02:56] <DaSkReech> I could be wrong though
[02:58] <DaSkReech> Ok is there a ubuntu.com/pool ?
[02:58] <DaSkReech> I'm looking for the source packages
[02:58] <DaSkReech> since p.u.c doesn't know about kdelibs5 :-P
[02:59] <DaSkReech> ah /source :) never mind
[03:06] <DaSkReech> tell canonical the servers suck
[03:06] <DaSkReech> i'm pulling at single digit k
[03:09] <vorian> man!
[03:09] <nosrednaekim> vorian: you have called? :)
[03:09] <vorian> kde4 comes in cheezy cd sleves
[03:10] <vorian> lol, howdy!
[03:10] <vorian> I got my CD's today
[03:10] <nosrednaekim> :)
[03:10] <nosrednaekim> from shipit?
[03:10] <vorian> the kde4 cd's came in white cd sleves from officemax
[03:10] <vorian> nosrednaekim: yep
[03:11] <DaSkReech> nixternal: Did I ention a typo on the 8.04 release notes ?
[03:11] <nosrednaekim> lol
[03:11] <vorian> but, the disk is rockin'
[03:13] <DaSkReech> nixternal: also do you always put the string ", and " ?
[03:19] <jjesse> evening :)
[03:21] <DaSkReech> hi
[03:21] <jjesse> how are you DaSkReech?
[03:21] <nosrednaekim> bloody good observation there jjesse
[03:21] <DaSkReech> bloody tired and trying to start building KDE 4.1
[03:22] <nosrednaekim> DaSkReech: with packaging?
[03:22] <jjesse> grin thanks nosrednaekim
[03:22] <DaSkReech> nosrednaekim: that' the ida
[03:22] <DaSkReech> but the ubuntu servers are slooooooooow
[03:24] <nosrednaekim> DaSkReech: try the US mirror
[03:26] <Hobbsee> apachelogger: can you update it on LP from tomorrow?
[03:26] <jjesse> us mirrors aren't faster :)
[03:26] <jjesse> hello Hobbsee
[03:27]  * jjesse hugs Hobbsee
[03:27]  * Hobbsee hugs jjesse
[03:27] <jjesse> wow us.archive.ubuntu.com is slow :(
[03:27] <DaSkReech> nixternal: ping
[03:27] <jjesse> i think he's busy on the gnome channels now
[03:27] <DaSkReech> troll
[03:27] <DaSkReech> I mean
[03:27] <DaSkReech> Gnome
[03:28]  * jjesse ducks
[03:28]  * DaSkReech blames Hobbsee
[03:28] <jjesse> haha
[03:29] <DaSkReech> Hey Hobbsee
[03:29] <DaSkReech> I could see your house from there :)
[03:29] <Hobbsee> :P
[03:29] <DaSkReech> how are you Hobbsee?
[03:29]  * Hobbsee is fighting finite state acceptors
[03:30] <DaSkReech> don't fight them love them
[03:30] <jjesse> ls
[03:30] <jjesse> doh
[03:30] <jjesse> :)
[03:32] <DaSkReech> better than that guy who posted his crash log for mplayer with his goat pr0n
[03:32] <jjesse> that's awesome
[03:33] <DaSkReech> Of course I can't show it to you anymore :(
[03:33] <DaSkReech> Let me try grab it
[03:35] <DaSkReech> Haha no Gnome expunged it
[03:35] <DaSkReech> trying to see it at all redirects you to Gnome front page
[03:37] <jjesse> hah thats funny
[03:37] <jjesse> ok this is annoying me i need to configure filesharing but can't do a kdesudo kcmshell4 fileshare (
[03:38] <Hobbsee> DaSkReech: do you happen to know much about them?
[03:38] <DaSkReech> possibly
[03:38] <DaSkReech> but I'm propping my self up with a pillow right now waiting on nixternal to answer me
[03:46] <jjesse> grumble grumble
[03:46] <Hobbsee> DaSkReech: bah.  you'res supposed to help me with this stuff.
[03:51] <nixternal> woohoo, just finished chewing out the LUG adviser and all university staff in a single email! god I love that feeling!
[03:53] <jjesse> ok so how do configure my box to share between my kubuntu and windows box without being able to access the filesharing portion of things?
[04:13] <crimsun> nixternal: beware, that'll probably be you in some years :-)
[04:17] <jjesse> it shouldn't be snowing in april, almost may
[04:17] <nixternal> it is snowing there right nwo?
[04:17] <nixternal> we had snow the other night, today was nice
[04:17] <nixternal> tomorrow and friday is supposed to be severe weather
[04:17] <crimsun> I love it!
[04:17] <jjesse> almost good thing i'm not flying through chicago on friday :)
[04:17] <nixternal> hehe
[04:17] <jjesse> denver -> grand rapids
[04:21] <jjesse> yay finally configured my system to share things
[04:22] <jjesse> silly kcscmshell4 network-filesharing still doesn't work right :(
[04:22] <jjesse> boo on kdesude
[04:22] <jjesse> kdesudo
[05:07] <nixternal> seele: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9r9LKiwXicQ  <- Jono said he enjoyed your talk the most at SCaLE6X...w00t!
[05:11] <jjesse> yay?
[05:15] <seele> nixternal: hmm.. that was nice of him
[05:15] <seele> it was the first time presenting that material so it was a little rough
[05:22] <nixternal> did it get on video at all?
[05:25] <DaSkReech> Hobbsee: Sorry
[05:36] <DaSkReech> nixternal: ping
[05:36] <nixternal> yo
[05:41] <DaSkReech> ok Pulled the tarball for kdelibs5
[05:41] <DaSkReech> what am I looking for?
[05:43] <DaSkReech> nixternal: A debian dir?
[05:46] <nixternal> you need to either a) create the package from scratch, which isn't logical, or b) apt-get source the package you want to update to the alpha release
[05:46] <nixternal> word of the wise, the alpha release is quite buggy
[05:49] <jcastro> seele: palmers ftw.
[05:50] <jcastro> nixternal: did you get decent spillage from your chat into here?
[05:51] <DaSkReech> nixternal: I'm trying to pacakage *
[05:52] <DaSkReech> and I'm wobbling here
[05:52] <DaSkReech> ok I'm going to try and do my mom's resume and tackle this tomorrow night
[06:05] <nixternal> jcastro: we got a little spillage, but once again, about 10 pm's
[06:05] <jcastro> nixternal: that's good!
[06:06] <jcastro> nixternal: I didn't see too much upstream participation
[06:08] <nixternal> they were there
[06:08] <nixternal> about 5 or so in total
[06:09] <nixternal> they were fielding stuff in the -chat room
[06:09] <jcastro> oh ok
[06:09] <nixternal> someone called me Ballmer
[06:09] <jcastro> nah dude, you're way thinner
[06:09] <nixternal> haha
[06:09] <nixternal> and less sweaty
[06:10] <DaSkReech> and more chair respecting
[06:10] <nixternal> heh
[06:10] <jcastro> nixternal: do you know them well?
[06:10] <nixternal> washing laundry, otherwise I was going to the Qt seminar in the morning dirty
[06:11] <nixternal> jcastro: know who? those calling me ballmer or upstream?
[06:11] <jcastro> nixternal: my main poc for kde has been aseigo but he doesn't respond well to mails from me for some reason
[06:11] <jcastro> nixternal: upstream!
[06:11] <nixternal> ya, I know some of those well that were present
[06:11] <jcastro> nixternal: feel free to send them my way
[06:12] <nixternal> I will see what I can do for ya
[06:12] <DaSkReech> nixternal: once I apt-get source from debian what do I do?
[06:13] <nixternal> not from Debian, from ubuntu
[06:15] <DaSkReech> I'm trying to make the packages for ubuntu
[06:15] <DaSkReech> for 4.0.71
[06:15] <DaSkReech> so grab the ones for 4.0.3 ?
[06:18] <nixternal> yup
[06:18] <DaSkReech> right
[06:18] <DaSkReech> and I need something from that to make the 4.0.71 ?
[06:27] <nixternal> you need the debian/ directory and need to tweak the .install files more than likely
[06:29] <DaSkReech> I must be really tired
[06:29] <DaSkReech> I don't see it
[06:29] <nixternal> I know I am..I am waiting for the laundry to dry so I can crash
[06:30] <DaSkReech> nixternal: can you confirm that there is a source package for kdelibs4
[06:31] <DaSkReech> kdelibs5 sorry
[06:34] <nixternal> there is, and it is 11.1MB
[06:36] <nixternal> alrighty, going to bed
[06:36] <nixternal> g'nite
[06:36] <DaSkReech> night
[06:36] <DaSkReech> nixternal:
[06:36] <DaSkReech> what do I do with the debian dir
[06:36] <DaSkReech>  add it to teh tarball I grabbed from kde.org ?
[06:46] <DaSkReech> hooray got it
[06:46]  * DaSkReech falls over and snores
[09:57] <DarkMageZ> any kde 4.1 alpha 1 repositories yet? ^-^
[09:58] <Riddell> no, I'm waiting for intrepid to open
[10:09] <DarkMageZ> then i can just backport everything i need to hardy. cool. (yes, i know that includes QT4 & the breakage it could theoretically cause)
[10:10] <Riddell> backports we'll need to think about, intrepid will use /usr, hardy backports should probably use /usr/lib/kde4
[10:11] <Riddell> but not necessarily, they could just come with a very large warning
[10:16] <DarkMageZ> local backport, not official backport :P
[10:37] <seaLne> hmm even though there is now kdebase 7.1 kmplayer-konq-plugins konq-plugins konqueror konqueror-nsplugins kubuntu-desktop still want removed due to the kded loop package weird
[10:39] <Riddell> let met try
[10:40] <Riddell> works for me
[10:40] <Riddell> The following packages will be upgraded: kcontrol kdebase-bin kdebase-kio-plugins kdesktop kdm kfind konqueror
[10:40] <seaLne> dist-upgrade won't run and apt-get -f install wants to remove the above
[10:40] <Riddell> apt-cache policy konqueror  does that know about 7.1 ?
[10:41] <seaLne> ah still showing 7, i'd noticed 7.1 in -changes maybe not there yet?
[10:41] <seaLne> hmm that was yesterday morning tho
[10:42] <Riddell> sure you have -propsed enabled in sources.list?
[10:42] <Riddell> I have   deb http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ hardy-proposed main restricted
[10:42] <Riddell> so is on the gb. mirror
[10:43] <seaLne> ah its stuck in -proposed
[10:44] <Riddell> will be for another week
[10:44] <seaLne> k that fixed it
[11:27] <Riddell> fdoving: your patch seems to make kio_umountwrapper run indefinately
[11:59] <Amarilis> hi guys. this is my problem: i booted the last version of ubuntu/kubuntu from the live cd (normal mode), but when it's time to load gnome/kde what i see are only stripes. i rebooted and i selected safe mode. this time i was able to see the desktop
[12:00] <ubunturos> Amarilis: you need to post this to #kubuntu for help
[12:01] <Amarilis> i did. but i didnt received an answer to my question
[12:02] <ubunturos> Amarilis: may be those who are logged on, don't know the answer. You might have to wait a while for it, may be.
[12:02] <hads> You could try a forum or mailing list too.
[12:02] <Amarilis> ok
[12:02] <ubunturos> Amarilis: BTW, which graphic card / motherboard
[12:24] <Serega> I bet $10 ATI :)
[12:49] <DarkMageZ> now now... no need to pick on ati, it could have just as easily been any of the other crackfilled xorg drivers or something else entirely.
[12:52]  * Serega have much hope on radeonhd foss driver
[12:53]  * Serega for now uses nvidia :)
[14:02] <seele> are there no meetings this week because of open week?
[14:02] <seele> or did i screw up utc again
[14:05] <Riddell> there's no desktop meeting, it's a holiday in many european countries, they're all on strike to start the revolution
[14:07] <seele> hmm?
[14:07] <seele> which holiday is it?
[14:08] <Riddell> May Day
[14:08] <seele> on a thursday?
[14:08] <Riddell> the revolution does not wait
[14:08] <seele> hum.. i guess we're really the only ones who push our holidays to monday for extended weekends..
[14:08] <Riddell> except in britain when we move such holidays to mondays
[14:09] <seele> long weekends > *!
[14:12]  * Hobbsee gets no holiday :(
[14:22] <jaldhar> sorry if its a FAQ but will there be 4.1alpha .debs for hardy?
[14:29] <Riddell> one day, but not imminantly
[14:43] <Riddell> hmm, what to do with kde 4.0.4?
[14:44] <Riddell> backports I suppose
[14:56] <jaldhar> Riddell: thanks.  If I can manage to clear up enough diskspace I'll try building them myself and see about contributing them.
[15:08] <Riddell> motu needed for testing
[15:08] <Riddell> who's a motu?
[15:08] <Riddell> and not a core-dev
[15:09] <Riddell> please upload something to hardy-backports, we want to see if it'll get rejected
[15:13] <Riddell> apachelogger?
[16:27] <Riddell> ask mark in #ubuntu-classroom
[16:40] <mhb> good afternoon
[17:03] <SiNiESTrO> hi
[17:03] <Riddell> hi SiNiESTrO, mhb
[17:03] <Riddell> bddebian: you're a motu
[17:03] <nosrednaekim> hello mhb...
[17:04] <bddebian> Riddell: Well I'm supposed to be
[17:04] <bddebian> I've done a pretty crappy job for the Hardy cycle :-(
[17:05] <Riddell> bddebian: could you upload a package to hardy-backports, anything will do, we just want to check if motu can
[17:05] <SiNiESTrO> oh Riddell! do you remember Bardinux? I'm part of actual developer's team
[17:05] <SiNiESTrO> :P
[17:06] <SiNiESTrO> Riddell: how are you?
[17:06] <Riddell> SiNiESTrO: muchos bienos
[17:06] <Riddell> I'm all good
[17:06] <bddebian> Riddell: Hmm, do you need it right now?  I'm at work :-(
[17:06] <Riddell> bddebian: not at all
[17:06] <bddebian> OK
[17:06] <Riddell> maybe blueyed_ could
[17:09] <SiNiESTrO> I'm finding the way of configure or modify adept_updater (¿?) to prevent that external repositories disappear on dist-upgrades...
[17:09] <SiNiESTrO> any suggests?
[17:10] <SiNiESTrO> my english is very poor... I hope that you understand me
[17:13] <guaqua> they don't disappear for me
[17:13] <guaqua> though i do major updates from the command line and edit sources.list by hand
[17:13] <guaqua> having other repos active during update might break stuff
[17:14] <Riddell> SiNiESTrO: hmm, that gets done by the dist upgrade tool
[17:14] <SiNiESTrO> oh, i'm sorry... I mean that they are disabled
[17:15] <Riddell> SiNiESTrO: I'm afraid the person who maintains the dist upgrade tool is on holiday today
[17:15] <Riddell> SiNiESTrO: try e-mailing him at michael.vogt@ubuntu. com  and CC me if you want, jriddell@ ubuntu.com
[17:15] <SiNiESTrO> ok, thanks
[17:16]  * nixternal tries to stay awake during seminar
[17:17] <Riddell> ooh, nixternal, you're a motu, could you upload a random package to hardy-backports
[17:19] <SiNiESTrO> third sources are very important in kubuntu derivated distributions... they can't stay disabled
[17:20] <SiNiESTrO> on dist-upgrades, artwork and other features say "bye, bye!"
[17:20] <SiNiESTrO> :P
[17:20] <nixternal> Riddell: I could, but I am currently in a seminar with less than acceptible wifi connection
[17:21] <nixternal> oooh, learning Qt race conditions and locks....so much fun
[17:22] <nixternal> I need a smaller laptop
[17:22] <Riddell> SiNiESTrO: the code that does it is in DistUpgradeController.py in update-manager, but I don't see a way to work around it (although there may well be)
[17:24] <SiNiESTrO> oh, python! i will try
[17:24] <SiNiESTrO> thanks Riddell
[17:42] <Riddell> so, who fancies packaging 4.0.4?
[17:42] <Riddell> nixternal?  stdin?
[17:42] <nixternal> Riddell: I will work on it tonight->weekend
[17:43] <nixternal> where is it getting uploaded to?
[17:43] <nixternal> PPA? Kubuntu.org/
[17:43] <Riddell> -backports ideally
[17:43] <nixternal> lovely, so you want the paperwork then :)
[17:44] <Riddell> should be just some accept commands
[17:44] <Riddell> the other problem being low build priority
[17:44] <Riddell> but since nothing is building currently that ought to be ok
[17:45] <jjesse> morning
[17:45] <Riddell> hi jjesse
[17:46] <jjesse> hello Riddell
[17:46] <nixternal> so we could file the bug report, and as soon as it is approved upload right away to -backports?
[17:46] <nixternal> or should we wait until Sunday/Monday for uploading?
[17:47] <nixternal> Riddell: would it be possible to get a kde 4 wide ack for -backports instead of filing the necessary bug reports for each uploaded item?
[17:48] <Riddell> nixternal: oh don't both with bug reports
[17:48] <Riddell> just upload and I'll let it through at the appropriate time
[17:48] <Riddell> ScottK won't mind :)
[17:48] <nixternal> hehe
[17:48] <nixternal> if I have YOUR word, then OK
[17:49] <ScottK> Except it takes a core-dev to upload source to backports pockets.
[17:49] <nixternal> we have a new package with 4.0.4 as well - skanlite
[17:50]  * nixternal is liking the PPA idea right now for Hardy
[17:51] <Riddell> ScottK: well, this is what I've been trying to work out
[17:51] <Riddell> ScottK: I'm told that motu should be able to
[17:51] <nixternal> ditto
[17:51] <ScottK> OK.  Maybe it's changed.
[17:51] <nixternal> hrmm, with KDE 4 moving to main for Intrepid, something tells me I should start thinking about core-dev
[17:52] <nixternal> nah, I will just bug ScottK and Riddell until they hate me!
[17:52] <Riddell> ScottK: we don't know until we find someone to test it
[17:52] <ScottK> ... hate me/get upset enough to file piles of bugs against kubuntu-docs
[17:52] <nixternal> heh
[17:52] <ScottK> Right.
[17:53] <nixternal> oh man, would you really do that?
[17:53] <ScottK> Can't hurt for him to try it.
[17:53] <nixternal> I will subscribe jjesse to all of them, so go ahead :p
[17:53] <nixternal> I can't right now though, this hotel connection is horrid
[17:53] <nixternal> knemo keeps bouncing
[17:54] <nixternal> Trolltech does up a great lunch spread though!
[17:54] <ScottK> nixternal: I got annoyed at ubuntu-dev-tools developers a could of months ago and file 11 bugs in about an hour.
[17:54] <ScottK> All valid.
[17:54] <nixternal> hahahahaha
[17:54] <ScottK> could/couple in any case.
[17:54] <nixternal> you my friend, just might be a bigger arse than I :)
[17:55] <ScottK> Nah.  Not possible.
[17:55] <nixternal> didn't think that was possible, but I forgot you live on the east coast :p
[17:55] <ScottK> ;-)
[17:55] <ScottK> I was trying to make the point that they needed a little more care in what they were uploading.
[17:55] <ScottK> It seems to have got their attention.
[17:57] <nixternal> ScottK and Riddell: if either of you have any pointers for core-dev, fill me in because I am seriously thinking about it due to KDE 4 going into main eventually
[17:59] <nixternal> I have a guy in front of me that is a Gtk dev on the Winblows platform, and he is driving me up a wall constantly laughing at stuff
[18:00] <nixternal> he leans back and spills my coffee again, the CoC is out the window :p
[18:00] <nixternal> OK, time for lunch....bbiab
[18:00] <guaqua> you might have to accidentally spill the coffee
[18:00] <nixternal> haha, it isn't hot enough
[18:01] <nixternal> ooh, gotta wait for lunch, they are going to give us Qt 4.4 final release!
[18:01] <guaqua> it still sucks to have coffee all over you ;)
[18:01] <nixternal> true
[18:02] <nixternal> k, battery dying now...bbiab
[18:03] <Riddell> nixternal: yes, I think core-dev is a very good idea
[18:03] <Riddell> nixternal: I presume the process is still to turn up at a tech board meeting and ask
[18:03] <ScottK> nixternal: It's pretty much like going for MOTU, but you have to show up at a tech board meeting and answer questions.
[18:03] <ScottK> It seemed pretty benign to me.
[18:04] <Riddell> nixternal: to be a core-dev you need to show you want to work on the major areas of the distro, and packaging KDE will be there
[18:12] <jjesse> yay for nixternal and core-dev :)
[18:46] <blueyed> Riddell: I'll upload hello to hardy-backports, ok? I assume you'll reject it then?
[18:47] <Riddell> blueyed: yes, thanks
[18:53] <ryanakca> Where can I find the branch for the dist-upgrade tool? *found a bug...* Should be "Upgrading to Kubuntu version 8.04" and not "Upgrading to Kubuntu version 8.04 LTS" in the title, correct?
[18:54] <Riddell> it's update-manager in launchpad
[18:54] <Riddell> but it's too late to change that, i18n freeze
[18:54] <ryanakca> Ah, bummer.
[18:55] <Riddell> blueyed: not seeing anything, did you upload?  get a reject message?
[18:56] <blueyed> Riddell: yes, rejected ("Signer is not permitted to upload to the component 'main' of file 'hello_2.2-2ubuntu1.dsc'"). I'll try again with a universe package.
[19:00] <blueyed> Riddell: "jedit waiting for approval"
[19:03] <Riddell> right, that makes sense I guess
[19:03] <Riddell> so nixternal or stdin or whoever can upload kde into backports
[19:03] <Riddell> well, not stdin, we need to get him into motu :)
[19:07] <jjesse> i though stdin was already in motu
[19:09] <Riddell> no, but you would imagine it wouldn't you
[19:09]  * stdin get's back and reads backlog
[19:10] <jjesse> yes yes i would imagine it
[19:11] <stdin> I can probably start on 4.0.4 tonight
[19:11] <stdin> and I should probably do something about getting into motu soon
[19:11] <stdin> it's been on my "should do" list for a while now
[19:14] <jjesse> those darn should do list
[19:14] <jjesse> my should do list is getting longer every da7y not shorter
[19:15] <stdin> I think my "should do" list is also on my "to do" list :p
[19:20] <Riddell> I can't find anything on the wiki for how to become a motu
[19:37] <jjesse> its magical
[19:38] <jjesse> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Mentoring
[19:38] <jjesse> and i'm sure its under https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU someplace?
[19:39] <jjesse> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
[19:42] <ScottK> Riddell: I can't find anything on the wiki since dholbach reorganized it.
[19:43] <ScottK> jjesse: Did you see the blog link I left you the other day on multiple screen configurations?
[19:43] <jjesse> ScottK: yes i did
[19:43] <jjesse> thanks
[19:44] <ScottK> Great.  We'll get you off Windows yet.
[19:44] <jjesse> #wftlchat
[19:44] <jjesse> doh
[19:44] <jjesse> ScottK: i totally doubt i will be completly off windows
[19:45] <jjesse> kind of hard when the program i consult on runs under windows :P
[19:45] <ScottK> Ah.  Well then how does it work on WINE?
[19:46] <jjesse> well its a server product, runs with .NET and MS SQL connections
[19:46] <jjesse> ScottK: www.altiris.com
[19:46]  * ScottK looks
[19:46] <jjesse> now owned by symantec
[20:41] <gribelu> is there a date scheduled for starting Intrepid development? i'm more anxious about KDE 4.1 official snapshots actually but i guess you'll be doing that quite a bit for Intrepid :)
[20:43] <stdin> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IntrepidReleaseSchedule
[20:44] <gribelu> ah
[20:44] <gribelu> didn't catch that
[20:44] <gribelu> lots of work/time ahead it seems
[20:45] <gribelu> are you planning to start building 4.1 after the beta surfaces?
[20:45] <gribelu> and the hard feature freeze..
[20:46]  * nixternal grabs 4.0.4 tarballs
[20:46] <stdin> plans for exactly when 4.1 will be packaged aren't finalised yet
[20:46] <stdin> *packaged for II
[20:48] <nixternal> I would say possible on a 4.1 beta... 4.1 alpha is a mess....it crashes quite well
[20:48] <gribelu> yeah i noticed
[20:48] <gribelu> plasma :/
[20:48] <nixternal> that's because of the huge plasma rewrite
[20:48] <nixternal> if you aren't using plasma, then it tends to be fine :p
[20:49] <JontheEchidna> SVN is already re-stabalized, for the most part.
[20:49] <gribelu> not too long till the beta though.. everything should be pretty nice after that
[20:49] <nixternal> there is still a bit of plasma`esque issues
[20:49] <nixternal> we are less than 3 months for the 4.1 release now...man that is awesome, it comes out on my birthday...I am going to party hardcore!
[20:49] <gribelu> 4.0.x is stupid at this point anyway.. mostly worse than the 4.1 head
[20:49] <JontheEchidna> heh
[20:50] <JontheEchidna> Well, I had some bugfixes that I really enjoyed with the 4.0.x releases
[20:50] <nixternal> I think thus far, 4.0.0 and 4.0.3 were the worst releases...it was funny, 4.0.2 was damn stable for me
[20:50] <JontheEchidna> but then they had to go and introduce more bugs iwth plasma backports :/
[20:50] <nixternal> hoping 4.0.4 brings that back
[20:51] <gribelu> nixternal: i don't think there's too much work going into 4.0.4 .. the SVN shows that plenty
[20:51] <JontheEchidna> I've not had Plasma crash since 4.0.1, unless it was from a buggy 3rd party plasmoid
[20:51] <JontheEchidna> Like the Amar4k controller on KDE look
[20:51] <gribelu> with more development on 4.1, less can be backported to 4.0
[20:51] <gribelu> lots of stuff changed
[20:51] <seele> all that time to ask a question and he doesn't really even answer it.. oh well
[20:51] <gribelu> qt for one
[20:52] <nixternal> seele: what question/answer, and which he? :)
[20:53] <seele> i asked about how the Desktop Team was planning on working on the "experiences" they keep talking about and how contributors can help
[20:53] <nixternal> oh, other chan
[20:53]  * nixternal looks
[20:53] <seele> basically he said come to UDS and attend Desktop Meetings -- which i am already doing..
[20:54] <seele> plus it doesnt really help anyone else not already involved to know how to get involved
[20:54] <seele> it would be nice to figure out how they plan to solve these problems
[20:54] <seele> everything is either in the dark or they really have no clue yet
[20:54] <nixternal> I will choose the latter :)
[21:00] <fdoving> Riddell: around? - made a new patch to the eject_error case. bug 222041 - still not tested, i don't have time. sorry. :|
[21:02] <mhb> seele: that's what people who have no clue do say
[21:07] <mhb> seele: I've learned that Ask Mark sessions are full of those
[21:07] <jjesse> people who have no clue what to say?
[21:07] <seele> we'll see what happens at UDS then
[21:07] <jjesse> or just people who have no clue?
[21:07] <seele> these desktop experiences have existed since the last UDS but nothing has come from them yet
[21:08] <nixternal> but Mark is a super hero, he can tell 99% of the people who ask a question that dirty diapers rock, and people will go out and buy diapers, and dirty them up
[21:08]  * jjesse is bummed that he can't come to UDS this time around
[21:08] <nixternal> jjesse: you and I both
[21:08] <nixternal> the Prague labeled me as a terrorist and I am not allowed in :p
[21:08] <seele> nixternal: seriously?
[21:08]  * nixternal waits....
[21:08] <seele> lol
[21:08] <jjesse> lol
[21:09] <jjesse> my wife is due w/ firts child the week after UDS
[21:09] <nixternal> nah, I was waiting for mhb to say something, cuz the US told him "NO! YOU CANNOT ENTER!" for the last UDS
[21:09] <nixternal> jjesse: congrats man!
[21:09] <jjesse> nixternal thanks
[21:09] <seele> yeah, but that was because he is a student, wasn't it?
[21:09] <nixternal> I love how you don't tell anyone until a month prior :p
[21:10] <nixternal> seele: no idea, but it was fun playing the terrorist card with him :)
[21:10] <jjesse> seriously i thought more knew
[21:10] <mhb> seele: that sounds almost racist :-)
[21:10] <nixternal> hahahahaha
[21:10] <jjesse> i thought i mentioned it on my blog that i wasn't able to come to UDS because of my wife supposed to be giving b9rth
[21:10] <nixternal> mhb: since when is "student" racist?
[21:10] <seele> mhb: student's aren't a protected class in the U.S.
[21:10] <nixternal> I know plenty of people here in Chicago that would rather be called student then what they are typically called
[21:10] <seele> mhb: (housing discrimination is one of the most common discriminations against students)
[21:11] <mhb> nixternal: not sure, ask seele :-) it really sounds like "no wonder, he's a student, the lower type of people"
[21:11] <seele> nixternal: you mean a bum?
[21:11] <jjesse> ah just mentioned family reasons
[21:11] <nixternal> I noticed that when I decided to go back to school...I was going to move into a condo but they didn't like the "student" status so they denied me
[21:11] <seele> mhb: no, they just think you're going to try and come to the U.S. to get a job and not go back
[21:11] <nixternal> so I said foo on you and moved in to the closet at the other end of my parents house
[21:11] <nixternal> FREE!
[21:11] <nixternal> which is perfect, cuz I am absolutely broke right now
[21:13] <mhb> seele: right, it's my fault
[21:13] <JontheEchidna> anybody got a good python tutorial?
[21:13] <seele> mhb: yeah -- why the hell would you want to earn american dollars anyway? :)
[21:15] <mhb> well, thanks for bringing it up
[21:16] <seele> mhb: have you been to the U.S. before (recently?) or was that the first time you tried to get a visa while you were a student?
[21:18] <mhb> seele: the first time
[21:18] <mhb> and for the foreseeable future, the last
[21:18] <seele> hehe
[21:19] <seele> stupid state department
[21:23] <mhb> hm
[21:29] <nixternal> speaking of the state department, them, homeland security, and INS just did a sweep of a local commercial area nabbing over 100 "illegal aliens"....I love how they call others "aliens", what morons
[21:31] <mhb> nixternal: on the plus side, you could be travelling to Mars this month!
[21:31] <nixternal> ya, but my rover battery died
[21:39] <mhb> hmm, I still don't see what are we going to discuss at UDS :o) I expect it to be like "we would do this if we had 10 active developers, which we all know we haven't got"
[21:40] <jjesse> you mean kde wise?
[21:40] <jjesse> in boston it seemed like the kde people were myself and Riddell
[21:40] <mhb> us as in Kubuntu
[21:40] <jjesse> and i don't do any development
[21:40] <seele> jjesse: i was there during fosscamp
[21:41] <mhb> well I couldn't be there for reasons well discussed before
[21:41] <jjesse> nixternal instead of aliens what would you call people who were there and they sholdn't be
[21:41] <seele> mhb: i think one of the big agenda topics is figuring out if we are syncing to the kde release schedule and if we are going with 4.1
[21:41] <jjesse> seele didn't make it in time for fosscamp
[21:42] <nixternal> jjesse: trespassers
[21:42] <mhb> seele: hmm, I wonder how that would be possible, given that there is only one repository at the moment
[21:42] <seele> nixternal: tourists? :)
[21:42] <nixternal> or that :)
[21:42] <seele> mhb: dunno.. i just know it's on the list :)
[21:42] <nixternal> hah, I have always called "tourists", "terrorists", and it recently got me in a bit of trouble at the airport
[21:42] <mhb> seele: we can't influence all the command-line tools and all the libraries we rely on
[21:44] <nixternal> if we sync to KDE, people will complain, if we don't sync to KDE people will complain, if KDE syncs with us people will complain
[21:44] <mhb> KDE4 is boring anyway :-) who needs plasma? who needs Mac OS X widgets? :-)
[21:44] <seele> kde isnt' going to sync to us
[21:44] <nixternal> if we don't provide kde 3, people will complain, if we don't provide kde 4.1, people will complain
[21:44] <mhb> who needs Konqueror with its stubborn developers? :o)
[21:44] <nixternal> so I say at UDS, everyone just complain! prepare for what's going to come with the 8.10 release :p
[21:44] <nixternal> mhb: konqi devs are stubborn, khtml devs maybe :)
[21:45] <nixternal> s/are/aren't
[21:45] <mhb> right
[21:45] <nixternal> as long as the kde webkit plugin is rockin', that's fine with me
[21:45] <mhb> Konqueror is dead anyway, like I said when Dolphin first came out
[21:45] <nixternal> that way there I can use webkit when looking at websites such as....well I don't go to gmail.com, so I don't need it I guess :)
[21:45] <mhb> give me a fast and lightweight KDE browser and I'll trash it anytime :o)
[21:46] <nixternal> the only thing I would ever consider replacing konqi with, is Opera, if and only if they opened it up
[21:46] <nixternal> I hate firefox with a passion, and this ff3 beta crap we got in 8.04 is horrid
[21:46] <mhb> I'll replace it with anything gladly
[21:46] <seele> why they shipped a beta product in a release is beyond me
[21:46] <nosrednaekim> thatnkfully we can blame that on ubuntu, not us :P
[21:46] <nixternal> I have used Konqi pretty much since day 1, I love it and will continue doing so
[21:46] <mhb> in fact, I don't use it anymore because of the silly way they display warning messages when changing from/to SSL
[21:47] <mhb> and you can't hide them like you can in your hated Firefox :o)
[21:47] <nosrednaekim> yeah.... firefox3 made me go to Konqueror4
[21:47] <nixternal> is that the popups people are complaining about mhb?
[21:47] <mhb> nixternal: I dunno
[21:47] <nixternal> I have been seeing complaints about some security related popups in ff3 or something
[21:47] <mhb> nixternal: I know firefox3 is having trouble with SSL, and I know konqueror had these annoying popups too
[21:47] <smarter> firefox3 has some really nice features
[21:47] <nixternal> konqi 4 still has thise problems
[21:47] <nixternal> even in trunk
[21:48] <mhb> no wonder
[21:48] <nixternal> https in konqi 4 == popup hell
[21:48] <mhb> no wonder I dislike it with a passion :o)
[21:48] <mhb> perhaps this Qt demo browser will turn good
[21:48] <nixternal> click OK, click this session only, pray it doesn't start over and go surfing
[21:48] <nixternal> we played with the qt demo browser today...it is damn close to epiphany actually
[21:49] <nixternal> that's what it reminds me off...very lightweight and fast
[21:49] <fdoving> that's a site-problem, proper https sites with signed certificates works just fine in konq4.
[21:49] <nixternal> is that what it is? ya, I don't think any of the *buntu.com site cause the popup
[21:49] <mhb> hmm
[21:49] <fdoving> if the certificates are selfsigned or broken in any other way the browser complains.
[21:49] <mhb> we do have a saying here
[21:50] <fdoving> if it doesn't its broken.
[21:50] <nixternal> hey, I just found a shortcut that kills the computer in kde 4, but don't ask me to find it again :p
[21:50] <mhb> it says "the wiser one backs down"
[21:51] <nosrednaekim> nixternal: does it have something to do with sysreq?
[21:51] <mhb> meaning that two stubborn (and not wise) people will keep on blaming each other, but a smart guy will fix stuff even though it's not his fault
[21:51] <mhb> that's what should be done here
[21:52] <fdoving> mhb: so you prefer a broken browser that doesn't tell you when something bad happens? - or do you just want an option to make it not ask again?
[21:52] <mhb> I mean you don't say I'm an incompetent fool just because my English is not Standard XEnglish 1.1 Strict, right?
[21:52] <fdoving> no, but https is entirely different.
[21:52] <fdoving> it relies on trust.
[21:53] <fdoving> that's why they are signed.
[21:53] <fdoving> the idea is to make it secure.
[21:53] <fdoving> to some degree.
[21:53] <mhb> right, so I could argue that https itself is based on a really weak precondition - that you have to trust a third party
[21:54] <fdoving> ok, let's redesign the internet.
[21:54] <mhb> :o)
[21:54] <mhb> OR, make our apps behave like it should, not blaming the Internet, even though we know it's not our fault
[21:55] <mhb> and make Fascist Mode available for the ultra paranoid among us
[21:55] <mhb> (do they still keep the name in the OpenSSH configs?)
[21:55] <fdoving> i think konqueror behaves correnctly when it comes to https. I use it to manage my money online-bank-thing. no issues with https. popups appear when it needs to tell me something.
[21:56] <fdoving> MiM attacks would be waaay to easy if we just removed that popup.
[21:57] <fdoving> even if people just click continue anyway.
[21:58] <mhb> how many of those have you encountered yet<
[21:58] <mhb> ?
[21:58] <fdoving> using a secure protocol should atleast be as secure as the protocol can be, not false-secure, like https with selfsigned certs usually is.
[21:58] <mhb> I dunno.
[21:59] <mhb> I really believe in the "no popups unless user input required" thing
[21:59] <fdoving> I haven't encountered any, but it's a fact that they happen every day somewhere on the internet. it's what all those nice spammers out there wants to trick us into to make our machines zombies or spam-senders or whatnot.
[22:00] <fdoving> I belive in that too, but this one is among the important ones, not useless at all.
[22:01] <fdoving> having a hidden option to 'dont-ever-warn-me-of-anything-ever-again' would of course be nice for those who don't care.
[22:01] <smarter> if you try to access wiki.kubuntu.com page, it shows a "server not found"-like page, just because the certificate is for kubuntu.org
[22:01] <yuriy> there's a kubuntu.com?
[22:02] <smarter> yep
[22:02] <yuriy> hmm both konq4 and firefox display it without complaining here
[22:03] <fdoving> smarter: that is -exactly- the reason we have certificates in https.
[22:03] <fdoving> smarter: myhackedbank.com is different from myregularbank.com
[22:03] <nixternal> time to head to school...see ya'll later!
[22:03] <fdoving> bye nixternal.
[22:04] <fdoving> are there browsers out there that supports https but does not complain about these things?
[22:05] <smarter> yuriy: http://wiki.kubuntu.com redirects to kubuntu.org, but https://wiki.kubuntu.org don't
[22:06] <yuriy> smarter: ah
[22:06] <Riddell> fdoving: hmm, with that updated patch i don't see the kio_umountwrapper dialogue at all
[22:07] <mhb> any tips on what I should be involved in for Intrepid?
[22:07] <mhb> this release cycle I want to do something fun
[22:08] <fdoving> Riddell: hum.
[22:08] <mhb> writing KDE UIs for GTK apps can be boring sometimes
[22:09] <fdoving> Riddell: sounds strange. does it unmount?
[22:09] <Riddell> fdoving: yep
[22:10] <fdoving> Riddell: that sounds weird, kio_umountwrapper is the one invoking the safely-remove so it needs to be executed.
[22:11] <fdoving> the new ::exit(0); is inside ejectFinished() - so i don't understand this.
[22:11] <mhb> ah yes, again mumbling for myself. good night, folks.
[22:11] <yuriy> mhb: write a d-bus based opengl accelerated policykit packagekit SVG themable SSL service that does many functions
[22:11] <fdoving> nite mhb.
[22:11] <mhb> yuriy: right, that's fun :o)
[22:12] <mhb> you read 20 posts about how Kubuntu is inferior to Ubuntu and OpenSUSE and everything and you'd be as grumpy as me :o)
[22:13] <mhb> the KDE frontend for jockey didn't end up in the default install, did it?
[22:14] <fdoving> Riddell: can i please have your kio_media_mounthelper binary please? - i don't have things setup to compile qt3-things.
[22:14] <fdoving> Riddell: the one with the most recent patch applied.
[22:15] <mhb> Riddell: that was a question for you, I guess...
[22:15] <Riddell> fdoving: http://kubuntu.org/~jriddell/tmp/kio_media_mounthelper
[22:15] <mhb> you should know
[22:16] <Riddell> mhb: yes, it did
[22:16] <Riddell> even worked for me, once I fixed the bugs in the backend
[22:16] <mhb> hmm
[22:16] <mhb> I wonder why it was not mentioned anywhere
[22:17] <Riddell> probably not sufficiently different than restricted-manager
[22:17] <mhb> okay
[22:17] <yuriy> how is it different and why is there a new program?
[22:18] <fdoving> Riddell: where do you safely remove from ?
[22:18] <mhb> yuriy: the difference is that I made a Qt4 frontend and I wasn't paid for it! would you believe it
[22:18] <fdoving> Riddell: try 'kio_umountwrapper /mount/point' - i suspect it's the .desktop file for the safely remove action that is not updated to use kio_umountwrapper.
[22:18] <mhb> yuriy: the real difference is in the backend
[22:19] <mhb> yuriy: so unnoticable for the user
[22:19] <mhb> yuriy: except that it's gone from systemsettings
[22:19] <mhb> nobody bothered to write a link to it
[22:20] <mhb> that's why it stinks
[22:20] <mhb> the kcontrol stuff is so overengineered that it's too hard to create a simple link for systemsettings to another app
[22:20] <mhb> but we all love and adore kde, don't we
[22:21] <mhb> so I better shut up.
[22:22] <yuriy> hehe, good night mhb
[22:22] <Riddell> fdoving: that works, which .desktop file?
[22:22]  * mhb has grumpy moods these days a lot
[22:23] <fdoving> Riddell: where are you unmounting from? - dolphin or konqueror or kdesktop?
[22:23] <Riddell> fdoving: konqueror
[22:23] <fdoving> Riddell: the kio-umountwrapper package tries to divert those .desktop files.
[22:24] <fdoving> Riddell: /usr/share/apps/konqueror/servicemenus/media_safelyremove.desktop
[22:24] <Riddell> fdoving: ooh
[22:24] <Riddell> and I just compiled kdebase by hand and installed the original .desktop file over the diverted one
[22:25] <fdoving> Riddell: that's what causes it then :) atleast the patch now works :)
[22:25] <fdoving> it needs to use Exec=kio_umountwrapper %u
[22:25] <Riddell> well, hang on, let me test with kio-umountwrappre from konqueror
[22:25] <Riddell> it works
[22:25] <Riddell> genius
[22:26] <fdoving> the design of that should probably be changed. kio-umountwrapper should instead divert kio_media_mounthelper - and know it's new name to use internally.
[22:26] <fdoving> that way the desktopfiles never needed to change.
[22:26] <smarter_> +1
[22:27] <fdoving> but, not tonight.
[22:27] <fdoving> nite.
[22:46] <jjesse> its funny how this channel can go so long with nothing happening in it and sometimes i can hardly keep up wit hthe scroll
[22:49] <nosrednaekim> sssh! :)
[22:56]  * Serega says "knite friends"
[23:13] <SiNiESTrO> hi
[23:15] <nosrednaekim> hello SiNiESTrO
[23:54] <JontheEchidna> nixternal: When you package 4.0.4 tonight, could you take a look at bug 225123?
[23:54] <JontheEchidna> oops
[23:54] <JontheEchidna> wrong bug
[23:55] <JontheEchidna> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdeartwork-kde4/+bug/225213
[23:56] <JontheEchidna> ^The wallpapers aren't wrong, per se, but the package description would have you think that the other wallpapers released with KDE 4.0 were included in kdewallpapers-kde4 rather than kdebase-workspace-wallpapers