[00:04] <TheMuso> crimsun: http://www.pastebin.ca/1007528 for esdctl attempting to cache the startup sound.
[00:05] <crimsun> TheMuso: nice, thanks!
[00:08] <TheMuso> crimsun: np.
[00:08] <TheMuso> esdctl should return a slot number, and a name to use to play the cached sample.
[00:08] <TheMuso> Which doesn't occur.
[00:08] <crimsun> right
[00:10]  * ajmitch is glad that he's only had one audio app causing no end of problems, rather than several
[00:16] <Mez> \sh, xdebug now in debian - do you wanna have a looksie see if it
[00:16] <Mez> s ok to just overwrite on Intrepid>?
[00:26] <ffm> Is this http://scratch.mit.edu/pages/source DFSG compliant?
[00:41] <RAOF> ffm: I'm not #debian-legal, but it looks DFSG non-free to me.
[00:42] <i4x> I made it!! I made my first package!.. it works and finally finished the project!! thank you guys for the wikis.. but now I'll sleep!... (it's getting late!)
[00:42] <RAOF> ffm: The 'non-commercial' certainly smacks of DFSG #6 non-freeness.
[00:42] <RAOF> ffm: http://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines
[00:45] <i4x> wow.. and it seems I've found an error/bug/whatever while printing!! where do I report this problem?
[00:46] <i4x> is there any specific site/channel/blog for printing problems??
[00:47] <RAOF> i4x: There's always launchpad.net :)
[00:47] <i4x> hm, fine!!
[00:48] <i4x> well, c yall!!
[01:06] <bbyever> hi
[01:06] <bbyever> im trying to build audacity after a merge but it gives me this http://paste.ubuntu.com/10117/ any ideas?
[01:07] <zul> do you have cdbs installed
[01:08] <bbyever> no
[01:08] <zul> try installing cdbs then
[01:08] <bbyever> ok
[01:08] <bbyever> thanks
[01:14] <nxvl> RoAkSoAx: ping
[01:18] <RAOF> Ah, x86-64.  An extra 32bits you need to try _really hard_ to make work.
[01:28] <danielm> hi all, when i work on update a package to a new upstream version, i need to provide a get-orig-source rule, right?
[01:28] <RAOF> That would be nice, but not 100% necessary. (yet)
[01:28] <danielm> ok :)
[01:29] <RAOF> At this point in time, you should also be very much working with the Debian maintainer to get whatever it is in Debian, too.
[01:53] <emgent> crimsun: i go to sleep, night and big thanks :)
[02:21] <RAOF> Things I didn't know before today: fedora's base install includes latex.
[02:23] <jdong> RAOF: gotta stay protected man
[02:25] <bddebian> Heya gang
[02:25] <RAOF> jdong: >.<
[02:25] <RAOF> Yo!  bddebian!
[02:25] <bddebian> Hi RAOF
[02:46] <RoAkSoAx> nxvl, pong
[03:18] <LaserJock> RAOF: I think Ubuntu's base install includes some elements of tex at least
[03:18] <LaserJock> not sure about latex specifically
[03:21] <LaserJock> anybody know if the intrepid debootsrap just does a simlink like Hardy?
[03:24] <jdong> LaserJock: the changelog hints so
[03:24] <LaserJock> I might just do it locally
[03:24] <jdong>   * Add (Ubuntu) intrepid as a symlink to gutsy.
[03:25] <LaserJock> I'm trying to figure out how to do an intrepid chroot for sbuild/LVM
[03:26] <LaserJock> I might be able to name it intrepid but have it build a hardy chroot
[03:26] <LaserJock> then I can dist-upgrade it
[03:28] <LaserJock> seems to be working
[03:29]  * TheMuso duplicated his hardy chroot and dist-upgraded, although I do intend to create fresh chroots in the coming days.
[03:29] <bitbuzter> hello. I've a question, when packaging a new upstream release, i have to attach the diff.gz, or a debdiff?
[03:29] <LaserJock> I'm not very good with the LVM foo so I let kees do it for me ;-)
[03:30] <LaserJock> bitbuzter: diff.gz
[03:30] <LaserJock> I believe
[03:33] <LaserJock> jdong: what do you think of an SRU fixing a .menu file?
[03:34] <jdong> LaserJock: what was wrong with the file before?
[03:34] <LaserJock> jdong: since we don't use the Debian menu by default I can't imagine why it'd be very important
[03:34]  * persia notes that the default install set doesn't even change the interface based on a menu file
[03:34] <LaserJock> jdong: it was missing a
[03:34] <LaserJock> "\"
[03:34] <ajmitch> sounds like a serious bug
[03:35] <LaserJock> it is broken, but I really don't think we need an SRU for a .menu file
[03:35] <jdong> LaserJock: does it make the menu file unusable for people who do use the Debian menu?
[03:35] <persia> Actually, it might be, if it blocked the menufile parser on installation.  Can the package be installed?
[03:35] <bitbuzter> LaserJock: thanks, the diff.gz that is created when i build the package, right?
[03:35] <LaserJock> jdong: it does
[03:35] <jdong> LaserJock: I can't see the regression potential of fixing it....
[03:35] <LaserJock> persia: yes, it can be installed, it just won't run
[03:35] <persia> LaserJock: There's no .desktop file they can use as an alternative?
[03:35] <persia> And it will run, just not from the menu.
[03:35] <ajmitch> it's a fairly non-invasive change to upload
[03:36] <LaserJock> oh wait
[03:36] <LaserJock> persia: I don't think that's the point
[03:36] <LaserJock> this is important though:
[03:36] <LaserJock> "The bug manifests itself by making sure no applications installed after
[03:36] <LaserJock> this package appear in the Applications menu."
[03:36] <LaserJock> so apparently it screws up the Debian menu
[03:36] <jdong> LaserJock: that's pretty rough
[03:36] <jdong> yeah, let's fix that
[03:37] <LaserJock> rightio
[03:37] <persia> Ah, yes, that's a parser issue, in which case it deserves an SRU.  Be better to make the menu parser more robust, but...
[03:37] <LaserJock> rexbron: ping?
[03:37]  * ajmitch thinks that the bar should be fairly low for hardy fixes anyway
[03:37] <ajmitch> though my opinion is worth little
[03:37]  * jdong agrees with ajmitch at least until 8.04.1
[03:37] <LaserJock> well
[03:37] <persia> ajmitch: Why low for hardy as opposed to something else?
[03:38] <LaserJock> I agree it should be low
[03:38] <LaserJock> but I also don't want a -proposed full of fixes nobody is going to test or care about
[03:38] <persia> I'm not arguing for hardy being high, just for consistency in the application of policy
[03:38] <ajmitch> persia: mainly because of the LTS thing, and that people have a higher expectation for hardy
[03:38] <jdong> persia: up until 8.04.1 I think we should treat it as a RC-freeze w/ no upstream version clause....
[03:38] <ajmitch> either way, it's not up to me
[03:39] <jdong> persia: I think it's important for our LTS that we make a continual effort to "get it right" and more polished
[03:39] <persia> jdong: That'd be very different: in that case, why shouldn't anything RC-freeze acceptable go to any release?
[03:39] <jdong> persia: though if the effort pays off in a positive way,we can consider using it as a precedent for future releases
[03:39] <persia> jdong: I disagree.  I would be happy with a policy that said for all releases we made a continual effort to "get it right", but don't think LTS is sufficiently special.
[03:40] <LaserJock> in policy I don't think it should really be any different
[03:40] <LaserJock> in practice everybody is more focused on hardy
[03:40] <jdong> no no in policy it should be the exact same
[03:40] <jdong> but I honestly don't think we "made a continual effort to get it right" in previous releases
[03:40] <LaserJock> so they are more likely to file/look at/fix bugs
[03:40] <persia> ajmitch: While it may not be up to you, 40% of the people to whom it is up are present, so it's a good place to make your arguments :)
[03:40] <jdong> to be honest
[03:41] <persia> LaserJock: That's fine.  Any SRU policy is tempered by the interest of those preparing patches.
[03:41] <jdong> we can do better and here's a good chance for us to prove that
[03:41] <ajmitch> persia: I have no arguments to make, only uninformed opinions
[03:41] <persia> s/uninformed/informed/
[03:43]  * jdong just noticed his GNOME weather applet said "Sky: Broken clouds"
[03:43] <jdong> that doesn't sound like the right way of wording it
[03:44] <LaserJock> somebody gonna patch it?
[03:44]  * LaserJock files an SRU on jdong's weather
[03:44] <jdong> LaserJock: I think there's too many patches already ;-)
[03:44] <jdong> </pun hell>
[03:44] <LaserJock> hmm
[03:44]  * LaserJock ponders "Broken clouds" and "Patchy weather"
[03:45] <jdong> even patchy clouds sounds better than broken clouds
[03:52] <persia> Isn't that string pulled from the updating service, rather than encoded in the applet?  It might be hard to change.
[03:53]  * ajmitch doesn't understand why it's considered wrong
[03:55] <jdong> broken clouds simply sounds awkward
[03:55] <LaserJock> it's not wrong it just maybe sounds funny
[03:55] <ajmitch> it's a common description
[03:55] <persia> I'm not sure.  The phrase "A break in the clouds" has a long history.  "Broken clouds" typically means patches of blue whilst mostly overcast.  "Patchy clouds" would be the inverse.  Either works for 50% coverage.
[04:04] <ScottK> jdong: Persia's right.  Broken (and partly broken) clouds are standard weather terms.
[06:37] <dholbach> good morning
[06:38] <RoAkSoAx> good night :)
[06:38] <dholbach> sleep tight RoAkSoAx
[06:39] <RoAkSoAx> thanks dholbach, you have a nice day =)
[06:39] <dholbach> thanks a lot :)
[06:43] <nixternal> hrmm, anyone else having problems building their intrepid pbuilder due to libc6?
[06:43] <nixternal> mornin' dholbach
[06:44] <RAOF> nixternal: Yup.
[06:44] <dholbach> hiya nixternal
[06:44] <nixternal> OK, so it isn't just me then
[06:44]  * nixternal does a dput and pray for Intrepid then :p
[06:44] <nixternal> I gotta catch up on my 5-a-days
[06:44] <nixternal> should be 2 to 4 or more 'really fix its' fixed
[06:45]  * nixternal does one more Hardy backport before calling it a night
[06:49] <nxvl> dholbach: guten nacht!
[06:49] <nxvl> dholbach: is monday already in there?
[06:49] <dholbach> hehe... sleep tight nxvl
[06:49] <dholbach> nxvl: yes, it's 7:49
[06:49] <TheMuso> nxvl: Its 15:49 here on Monday.
[06:49]  * dholbach hugs nixternal
[06:50] <nxvl> TheMuso: where do you live?
[06:50] <nxvl> here is still sunday
[06:50] <nxvl> well
[06:50] <nxvl> monday already
[06:50] <nxvl> 00:50
[06:50] <TheMuso> nxvl: Sydney, Australia.
[06:50] <nxvl> oh!
[06:50] <nxvl> nice!
[06:51]  * nxvl want's to visit Australian Waves some day
[06:52] <tbielawa> Wow, this makes me feel good about myself. some one commented on my progress on a simple bug I was working on and said they learned from it
[06:52] <tbielawa> :)
[06:52] <tbielawa> And this is only my first week contributing :D
[06:53] <dholbach> tbielawa: excellent! keep it up! :)
[06:56] <Syntux> Morning
[06:56] <tbielawa> thanks
[06:56] <tbielawa> Morning
[06:57] <nxvl> well
[06:57] <nxvl> time to sleep
[06:57] <dholbach> good night
[06:57] <nxvl> see you all later (tomorrow for me )
[06:57]  * nxvl HUGS everyone
[06:57]  * tbielawa waves
[06:57] <RoAkSoAx> im not tired.. cant sleep :P
[06:57]  * Syntux hugs back
[06:58] <TheMuso> c/c
[07:01] <RoAkSoAx> dholbach, can i ask you a favor? i did my first merge... could you check it? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/blam/+bug/226670
[07:01] <geser> good morning
[07:02] <dholbach> hi geser
[07:03] <dholbach> RoAkSoAx: it's in the sponsoring queue - once I've caught up with my mail backlog I'll dive into sponsoring head-first
[07:05] <warp10> Good morning
[07:06] <dholbach> hi warp10
[07:06] <RoAkSoAx> dholbach, yep i uploaded it to u-u-s as stated by nxvl, thanks for checking it :)
[07:06] <warp10> hey dholbach!
[07:07] <nixternal> I need a pbuilder for intrepid!!! hopefully I don't wake up to any FTBFS in the morning
[07:08] <RAOF> nixternal: Eh.  Make the archive your build experiment!
[07:08] <nixternal> been there, done that...thus far I have been lucky
[07:08] <nixternal> at least I built and tested all of my backports for Hardy :)
[07:12] <nixternal> g'nite all!
[07:14] <tbielawa> byeeee
[07:14] <tbielawa> So has anyone gotten a working intrepid pbuilder set up?
[07:15] <tbielawa> I've seen that topic come up a few times in here over the past few days
[07:18] <tbielawa> actually, i have a more pressing concern. my lintian check on revu is upset about a missing .orig.tar.gz
[07:18] <tbielawa> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=bibus
[07:19] <tbielawa> even when I rename the source gz to the correct name and rebuild the source package it only wants to reference and create the tar.gz with the original name scheme: bibus_1.4.2-1.tar.gz
[07:19] <geser> tbielawa: I have copied my hardy base.tgz and upgraded it to intrepid (a few days ago)
[07:20] <tbielawa> geser: I attempted the upgrade method. My attempt failed due to unmet build dependencies. It seemed wrong because apt-cache search had results for each failed dep with the >= the min version required
[07:21] <jdong> last night debootstrap worked for intrepid
[07:21] <jdong> idn if that's still the case now
[07:21] <jdong> murphy's law says no
[07:21] <tbielawa> I was chroot'd into the hardy environment when I ran the search with an updated source.list
[07:21] <tbielawa> jdong: ya, no joke there :(
[07:22] <geser> tbielawa: I did the upgrade a few days ago and I got some unmet deps today when I tried to update it
[07:22] <geser> tbielawa: how did you name your .orig.tar.gz?
[07:23] <tbielawa> apt-get source from the upstream repo (hack through sf.net) privides bibus_1.4.2-1.tar.gz. it came debianized but needed updating
[07:24] <tbielawa> I renamed the tarball with a proper .orig.tar.gz and went into the decompresed source dir and did a source build of the original source so I had a dsc
[07:24] <tbielawa> it insisted on recreating the tarball with the bibus_1.4.2-1.tar.gz format, even in the dsc "Files: " log
[07:25] <geser> have you tried to rename the the tar.gz to bibus_1.4.2.orig.tar.gz?
[07:25] <tbielawa> geser: Yes I did
[07:25] <geser> hmm
[07:26] <tbielawa> I thought that if I took the source and rebuild the original source (unmodified) to produce a dsc and had a properly named *orig.tar.gz in the ../ from the source dir it would reference that in the new dsc.
[07:26] <DreadKnight> hello
[07:27] <DreadKnight> will somebody fix the plone mess in the repository?
[07:27] <tbielawa> then my thoughts were, make changes and dch for the ubuntu1 release so I'd get a fancy diff.gz, but it failed at recognizing I even had a orig.tar.gz!
[07:27] <DreadKnight> i think there are 2 instances of the old plone... and zope-plone3 is like missing or something
[07:28] <DreadKnight> i'm talking about www.plone.org .. the cms
[07:29] <tbielawa> no luck with intrepid pbuilder today :(
[07:35] <geser> tbielawa: I fetched your package from revu, renamed bibus_1.4.2-1ubuntu1.tar.gz to bibus_1.4.2.orig.tar.gz and run debuild -S (inside bibus-1.4.2) to build a new source package and got a diff.gz
[07:36] <geser> and empty one because the debian dir is already in your .orig.tar.gz
[07:37] <tbielawa> the gz you got is after I made changes (update fsf address in all files, etc).  Should there be a diff generated from upstream to the ubuntu1 versions then?
[07:39] <tbielawa> let me know if it's not clear what I'm trying to express
[07:44] <geser> tbielawa: yes, if you can take a .orig.tar.gz without the debian/ dir as .orig.tar.gz so the contents from debian/ will end in the .diff.gz
[07:48] <tbielawa> ok
[07:48] <tbielawa> what can I do to fix the lintian error?
[07:49] <geser> you mean the native-package-with-dash-version
[07:49] <geser> error ?
[07:50] <geser> it should vanished if you have a proper .orig.tar.gz
[07:52] <tbielawa> Would that mean taking the debian/ dir out of the upstream tar.gz and recompressing it at .orig.tar.gz then applying all my changes (put back in debian/) into the now un-debianized folder?
[07:54] <geser> yes
[07:55] <geser> tbielawa: I've to run now but I hope someone else will pick up and help you further
[07:55] <tbielawa> geser: thanks for being helpful. This process is pretty new to me still, thanks for your patience too
[07:55] <tbielawa> alright, bye, thanks again
[08:03] <\sh> grmpf
[08:04] <\sh> did anyone succeed in creating a chroot for intrepid?
[08:05] <soren> Sure.
[08:11] <\sh> soren, hmm...W: Failure trying to run: chroot /home/shermann/intrepid_chroot dpkg --force-depends --install var/cache/apt/archives/libc6_2.7-10ubuntu3_amd64.deb <-- bad
[08:11] <\sh> soren, using a.u.c. and local mirror...
[08:12] <soren> What's the error?
[08:12] <\sh> soren, what I pasted...it can#t install libc6
[08:13] <soren> *shrug* It worked for me.
[08:13] <\sh> soren, could you try again? :)
[08:13] <soren> sure
[08:13] <RAOF> \sh: Doesn't work for me, either.
[08:14] <\sh> after I resolved my "dear wife, why did you label my cds, and if so, why did you label them totally wrong?"
[08:14] <\sh> I thought I'm done with the errors ;)
[08:22] <soren> Ah, I know what's going on.
[08:23] <soren> Gimme a minute.
[08:25] <\sh> soren, go for it :)
[08:45] <soren> \sh: For now, adding "--add perl-modules" to debootstrap's command line should fix it.
[08:47] <\sh> soren, hmm..if it works, ok...but why? :)
[08:47] <BunnyRevolution> as i recall, motu's "package" *buntu deb's for *buntu distrobutions
[08:47] <BunnyRevolution> correct?
[08:48] <soren> \sh: libc6's postinst uses debconf, which ends up requiring a file from perl-modules, but perl-modules is priority: standard, so debootstrap doesn't pull it in.
[08:48] <soren> BunnyRevolution: Er... Something like that.
[08:49] <BunnyRevolution> the packaging guide would tell me the information i need to know for packaging, correct?
[08:49] <soren> That's the intent, yes.
[08:50] <\sh> soren, is it new? and if so, the fix is only a matter of time, right?
[08:50] <soren> \sh: Yes.
[08:50] <soren> \sh: and yes.
[08:51] <BunnyRevolution> thank you soren
[08:51] <\sh> soren, --add or --include?
[08:52] <\sh> i guess it's --include
[08:52] <soren> Oh, right.
[08:53] <\sh> soren, but it doesn't work actually..perl-modules is getting included...but the same error occurs
[08:53] <\sh> ah damn
[08:53] <\sh> perl-modules included, but isn't extracted before libc6
[08:53] <soren> \sh: Try reexecuting the command line.
[08:53] <soren> \sh: Oh.
[08:54]  * soren kicks debootstrap
[08:54] <\sh> hehe
[08:54] <\sh> well, perl-base is the only perl package which is extracted..but not perl-modules
[08:54] <soren> WEll, you *could* add perl-modules to $base in /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts/intrepid
[08:55] <soren> ..if you're in a hurry.
[08:55] <\sh> soren, yes..that's what's next on my list
[09:01] <\sh> soren, $base doesn't help...
[09:01] <\sh> soren, imho $required is better
[09:02] <\sh> soren, but doesn't solve it ;)
[09:05] <\sh> now it's mawk
[09:05] <\sh> which pre-depends on -> voila libc6
[09:11] <Hobbsee> bah, sebner isn't here.
[09:12] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: give the bugsquad a list about bugs that they really should just leave alone?
[09:12] <Hobbsee> LaserJock: i've suggested that in my current mail to them
[09:13] <Hobbsee> ScottK: people who assign MOTU to a bug to get it fixed faster only do so once, though....
[09:13] <Hobbsee> and, if done well enough, tell their friends, so they don't make the same mistake
[09:15] <Hobbsee> ScottK: ditto those who do the entire ~ubuntu-dev
[09:15] <\sh> damnit...working on hardy sbuild...better then nothing
[09:20] <white> /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts/intrepid is empty on my debian system :/
[09:20] <\sh> white, ln -s gutsy intrepid ;)
[09:21] <white> :)
[09:21] <white> i'll see, if it works now
[09:21] <white> i am using cowbuilder, so --include does not really work
[09:22] <white> E: Couldn't find these debs: zlib1g,
[09:22] <white> bah, i only want a base.cow here :/
[09:29] <dholbach> hum, can we change the icon of revu-uploaders to be less similar to ubuntu-core-dev? :)
[09:29] <\sh> white, forget it...it's a perl pkg bug...see #ubuntu-devel
[09:30] <\sh> white, soren determined it, and hopefully is fixing it ;)
[09:31] <\sh> ScottK, claws-mail* <--- should we drop the old sylpheed-* transitional packages now for intrepid?
[09:35] <wgrant> \sh: Unless we had the old packages in Hardy, we don't need them any more.
[09:35] <\sh> wgrant, ok...so we can hopefully sync it from debian now...
[09:37] <wgrant> \sh: We'll be able to sync a lot of stuff again now that Dapper isn't relevant.
[09:41] <\sh> wgrant, sure
[09:52] <tjaalton> hm, shouldn't audacious default to pulseaudio in hardy? now it uses alsa
[09:52] <wgrant> tjaalton: I smell an SRU.
[09:53] <tjaalton> wgrant: yep, me too
[09:53] <tjaalton> and it doesn't seem to have a systemwide config to set it in the meantime
[10:14] <jpatrick> morning norsetto
[10:14] <norsetto> jpatrick: hi there
[10:26] <rexbron> I have question regarding getting a fix into both intrepid and an as an SRU. Will the same debdiff be used  and just uploaded to different archives or do I need to prepare different debdiffs?
[10:27] <\sh> hmmm
[10:28] <wgrant> rexbron: The latter.
[10:28] <wgrant> The versioning is different.
[10:28] <rexbron> ok, one should be versioned -0ubuntu2.1 and the other (for intrepid) be -0ubuntu3, even though they are the same?
[10:28] <wgrant> That's right.
[10:29] <rexbron> ok
[10:42] <tjaalton> wgrant: audacious fixed :)
[10:44] <wgrant> tjaalton: What did you have to do?
[10:44] <tjaalton> wgrant: patch bmp_default_config
[10:44] <wgrant> Aha.
[10:45] <tjaalton> like patch 003 does
[10:45] <tjaalton> changes the theme
[10:56] <emgent> morning
[11:16] <tseliot> emgent: good morning to you ;)
[11:18] <emgent> heya tseliot :P
[11:20] <LucidFox> dholbach, I'm not sure how I should handle debian/changelog for -proposed updates
[11:21] <Hobbsee> LucidFox: stick it as hardy-proposed, iirc.
[11:21] <Hobbsee> as the target
[11:21] <LucidFox> Yes, I know, but I'm modifying a version that is already in hardy-proposed
[11:21] <LucidFox> should I increment the version number?
[11:21] <Hobbsee> i expect so - else it won't get accepted
[11:22] <LucidFox> then dholbach is right, my debian/changelog _is_ incorrect
[11:32] <LucidFox> On an unrelated note, I posted a Debian bug about old FSF address in debian/copyright, but the maintainer is reluctant to change it until upstream does
[11:33] <LucidFox> does it have merit?
[11:34] <broonie> LucidFox: Technically but it's not really worth worrying about.
[11:34] <norsetto> lucidfox: personally, I think it makes sense
[12:05] <ex1stenz> http://www.colectionarul.com/existenz1.html
[12:06] <Hobbsee> ex1stenz: ?
[12:11] <ex1stenz> http://www.colectionarul.com/existenz1.html
[12:11] <megabyte405> ex1stenz: That looks like spam to me.
[12:12] <slytherin> has revu opened for intrepid? is anyone planning to package jmeter?
[12:18] <ScottK> \sh: Yes (drop the transitional packages).
[12:30] <jpatrick> Hobbsee: random..
[12:34] <ScottK> persia: Unison backport is done (IIRC it was you that had some interest in this).
[12:39] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Thanks for the support on bugsquad.
[12:40] <Hobbsee> ScottK: NP - but us adding to their documentation of bugs not to touch might be a good idea.
[12:40] <persia> ScottK: I felt some responsibility, and wanted to see it to avoid as much noise as fedora got, but I'm not a user.
[12:40] <persia> What's the next step: does it need testing or something?
[12:40] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Agreed.  I discussed it with bdmurray and I'd thought he was going to do it.
[12:41] <ScottK> persia: At this point it'll still be building and such.  I'd suggest leave it for a bit and see if there's a user push for it.  Personally I'm not in a rush since a lot of people are still using older Ubuntu versions.
[12:42] <persia> ScottK: That mirrors my thoughts on the matter.  I just didn't want to miss a process step if there was something pending which required action.
[12:43] <ScottK> The way Unison tends to break on the wire between versions is a definite problem with Unison.  One in release and one in backports isn't so bad.
[12:43] <ScottK> persia: OK.  Thanks for looking after it.
[12:44] <persia> Sure.  We ought have the new one for intrepid, and so with the backport for hardy be covered until the next thesis, unless someone really wants to push an SRU.
[12:49] <ScottK> Whoever was looking after pulse by default issues ( TheMuso, was that you) might be interested in http://nenoblog.net/?p=4
[12:50] <ogra> ScottK, i think the proposed solution is now to use nspluginwrapper even in i386 and let libflashsupport return
[12:50] <ogra> (the issues were mainly flash/firefox related)
[12:51] <persia> nenolod: Is there a bug for that?
[12:51] <nenolod> there is no bug (yet)
[12:51] <ogra> (and keep pulse as is)
[12:51] <nenolod> the issue is that the patch is not guaranteed to work in the future
[12:52] <persia> nenolod: Ah.  It'd probably be accepted :)
[12:52] <nenolod> and .. i mean it's an ugly hack!
[12:52] <persia> heh.
[12:52] <nenolod> then again, so is the "appease josselin mouette" hack
[12:52] <nenolod> which is admittedly done the same way, and by me
[12:52] <wgrant> nenolod: I'm failing to see why a blog post is better than filing a bug.
[12:53] <nenolod> wgrant, i'm failing to see how the patch was accepted in the first place
[12:53] <broonie> wgrant: There's a process issue here as well as a technical issue with the patch.
[12:53] <nenolod> wgrant, it is clearly wrong
[12:54] <persia> broonie: Surely, but nenolod is about a lot, and active enough to know the right people to poke.
[12:54] <ScottK> Nether of which are best addressed by an "Ubuntu sucks" blog post.
[12:54] <nenolod> ScottK, it's not a ubuntu sucks blog post
[12:54] <ScottK> Nether/Neither
[12:54] <wgrant> "Yay! Ubuntu patches my code horribly wrong! And I don't even bother to tell them!"
[12:54] <nenolod> it's a "this person made an ubuntu patch, it was horribly wrong and it ticked me off" post
[12:54] <ScottK> nenolod: OK.  If you say so.  Maybe it was an "Ubuntu developers are idiots" blog post then.
[12:55] <nenolod> wgrant, they could have easily done about 2 seconds of clicking around on launchpad, saw that i was on IRC, and then went "hey is this a good way to do it"
[12:55] <nenolod> and then i would have gone, "fix PLUGIN_FILENAME() and use my previous patch, as that will always work"
[12:55] <ScottK> nenolod: I dispute its possible to find anything useful in Launchpad in 2 seconds.
[12:56] <nenolod> haha
[12:57] <nenolod> ScottK, well, i was more annoyed that nobody actually poked me before uploading such a hideous patch
[12:57] <nenolod> i would have been happy to ensure it is done correctly
[12:57] <nenolod> which i will get around to doing
[12:57]  * norsetto wonders since when ubuntu-motu has become a support list
[12:57] <nenolod> but i should have been to bed about 3 hours ago :p
[13:00] <Hobbsee> norsetto: it's not, but people don't read list descriptions.
[13:00] <Hobbsee> norsetto: and probably since some of the MOTU's stupidly started to answer them.
[13:00] <wgrant> Hobbsee: Oh, you mean launchpad-users isn't for requesting CDs? Damn.
[13:00]  * Hobbsee beats wgrant
[13:01] <Hobbsee> clearly those people don't work enough retail - in retail, you learn to not let the stupids get away with things, because it'll encourage them to keep trying.  There are definite parallels with the MOTU ML.
[13:01] <Hobbsee> (not saying that the MOTU ML people who ask support questions are stupid, but...)
[13:02] <wgrant> Hobbsee: Exactly. Same with people who answer support queries in #ubuntu-devel - they're just encouraging.
[13:02] <wgrant> *encouraging it.
[13:02] <Hobbsee> wgrant: exactly.
[13:02] <Hobbsee> wgrant: better to send them away, so they don't try it again, for their next question.
[13:02] <wgrant> Mhm.
[13:02] <Hobbsee> same with hardy stuff in #ubuntu+1, too.   Topics are hard.
[13:04] <ScottK> Previously I thought #ubuntu+1 redirected to #ubuntu until later in the release cycle.
[13:04] <ScottK> I'd hate to have any end users thinking running Intrepid is a sane thing they can do and get help with.
[13:04] <Hobbsee> ScottK: it usually does.
[13:05] <Hobbsee> ScottK: Amaranth whined repeatedly, until they reopened it when intrepid's archives were open for proper development.
[13:06] <ScottK> Hobbsee: OK.  I don't see the sense in it, but whatever.  It sounds like inducement to idiocy to me, but who knows.
[13:06] <Hobbsee> ScottK: as for how that will make the quality of the end users better, i've no idea.
[13:06] <Hobbsee> and their feedback
[13:07] <ScottK> IMO if you know enough to provide useful feedback at this point, you don't need #ubuntu+1
[13:07] <Hobbsee> ScottK: well, that was my thought on it too, but if that's the way they want it, then that's how they can have it, as long as they're doing the moderating, and not me.
[13:07] <ScottK> Right.
[13:07] <\sh> ScottK, sync requested :)
[13:07] <ScottK> \sh: Great.
[13:07] <emgent> heya \sh :)
[13:07] <Hobbsee> ScottK: then again, if circumstances regarding the irc ops team were different, i probably wouldn't be saying that.
[13:09] <\sh> hey ember
[13:09] <\sh> aeh emgent
[13:09] <\sh> ScottK, I compiled new claws as well for hardy...you could start to deal with backports for it :)
[13:09] <emgent> :)
[13:10] <ScottK> \sh: File a hardy-backports bug, say it builds, installs, and runs and then ping me.
[13:10] <emgent> \sh: when you have time see query
[13:11] <nenolod> that patch will make audacious segfault at exit too
[13:11]  * nenolod headdesks
[13:12] <nenolod> what's the procedure for recalling that upload?
[13:13] <nenolod> i've commented on the bug, hopefully someone will read and deny that upload for inclusion in 8.04.1
[13:14] <ScottK> nenolod: It needs an SRU to fix it.
[13:14] <ScottK> !sru | nenolod
[13:14] <persia> nenolod: I don't think it can be recalled at this point: more likely updated with a new upload
[13:14] <nenolod> which will of course be denied
[13:14] <nenolod> thanks :P
[13:14] <nenolod> persia, bummer. good thing nobody is using intrepid at this point
[13:14] <persia> Why would it be denied?  Segfault at exit is pretty critical, and the SRU team has been talking about making it easier to fix bugs in hardy anyway
[13:14] <sebner> mok0: around?
[13:15] <mok0> sebner: yeah
[13:15] <nenolod> persia, the patch causes the segfault
[13:15] <nenolod> persia, :)
[13:15] <ScottK> nenolod: The people who decide stuff on SRUs are different than the one that uploaded it.
[13:15] <nenolod> persia, it also causes potential doublefree
[13:15] <mok0> sebner: wassup
[13:15] <persia> nenolod: Right, which means there needs to be a new patch that doesn't segfault uploaded to hardy
[13:15] <sebner> mok0: Maybe ScottK already told you. I took over the courier merge. I suppose it's ok for you?
[13:15] <mok0> sebner: oh, that's fine, np
[13:15] <ScottK> mok0: I asked him to look into it.
[13:16] <nenolod> strings in the cfg object are supposed to be strdup'd. the only exception is the skin path, which is leaked so that vendors can rebrand the player easily
[13:16] <mok0> ScottK: It's in good hands then :-)
[13:16] <mok0> I'm kinda busy with other stuff at the moment
[13:16] <sebner> mok0: Well at least I have 1 question.  "- Removed trailing whitespace everywhere." Would you mind explaining that to me?
[13:17] <mok0> sebner: in the debian/ directory...
[13:17] <mok0> sebner: or rather, in FILES in debian/ :-)
[13:18] <sebner> mok0: an what whitespaces do they have?
[13:18] <mok0> sebner: white space at the end of the line _______
[13:18] <nenolod> really though ubuntu should push mudkip-player over audacious
[13:18] <nenolod> audacious is this audiophile thing
[13:19] <nenolod> mudkip-player uses gstreamer and looks exactly like XMMS
[13:19] <nenolod> although i haven't released it yet :)
[13:19] <sebner> mok0: in every file?
[13:19] <persia> nenolod: That's likely too late for hardy, but we'd welcome it in intrepid.
[13:20] <mok0> sebner: actually you shouldn't repeat that, if you're doing a merge
[13:20] <nenolod> well, audacious has it's place too, but "XMMS replacement saviour" isn't it
[13:20] <nenolod> audacious2 doesn't even load winamp skins :D
[13:20] <persia> It seemed the best option at the time.
[13:20] <sebner> persia: I don't want to be too annoying, really, but any news on my application?
[13:20] <persia> sebner: Best not to ask.  Anyway, all application processing is public on the mailing list.
[13:21] <sebner> persia: I know, just wondering if that was an official vote the MC has 48 hours to vote IIRC. :)
[13:21] <mok0> sebner: it just makes the diff bigger and more unmaintainable.
[13:21] <nenolod> persia, it is the best option at the moment, but i believe there is a better solution for that kind of user (e.g. who uses it because it looks like winamp, and doesn't care about anything technical about it)
[13:21] <persia> sebner: Well, someone put that on the wiki.  I can't remember the last time all voting was complete in 48 hours, especially when it crossed a weekend.
[13:21] <sebner> mok0: kk, btw. Thanks for your nice comment :)
[13:21] <mok0> sebner: Sure :-)
[13:21] <sebner> persia: ^^. nvm
[13:22] <persia> nenolod: That matches my understanding.  Of course, I'm not that familiar with the codebase, and so welcome a better solution :)
[13:22] <ScottK> sebner: Remember that the contributors/member thing is new, so be patient.
[13:23] <sebner> ScottK: Yeah, I know. sorry :) btw, what about a shiny icon for the group. revu-uploaders also have one
[13:23] <ScottK> Dunno if there is one or not.  Maybe someon should develop one.
[13:24] <mok0> sebner: you can find trailing spaces by: grep ' $' *
[13:24] <persia> An icon would be very welcome.  If someone has a candidate, sending it to ubuntu-motu@ for comment would likely be a good path towards acceptance.
[13:25] <sebner> mok0: cool, thanks :)
[13:25]  * persia notes that grep -e '\s$' also finds trailing tabs
[13:25] <mok0> persia: sorry i can't find it in the scrollback, an icon for what?
[13:25] <ScottK> sebner: Don't remove the trailing spaces.  It's no worth the trouble.
[13:25] <ScottK> mok0: The new contributors team
[13:25] <persia> mok0: https://launchpad.net/~universe-contributors
[13:26]  * mok0 looks
[13:26] <mok0> Ah cool
[13:26] <sebner> ScottK: ah ok then
[13:27] <ffm> Hey, anyone in the mood for a package REVU?
[13:27] <ScottK> sebner: Why did I tell you it's not worth the trouble?
[13:27] <sebner> ScottK: maybe because whitespaces are not that important and the debdiff is already big enough?
[13:28] <ScottK> Maybe.
[13:28]  * mok0 cheers
[13:28] <ScottK> sebner: What is the impact of the spaces on the end of the lines?
[13:29] <slytherin> anyone already working on packaging jmeter? If not I will start sometime tomorrow.
[13:29] <sebner> ScottK: bigger debdiffs? I once had whitespaces in debian/control. Took me some time to discover that -.-
[13:30] <ScottK> sebner: What else?
[13:30] <ScottK> slytherin: Is there a needs packaging bug in Ubuntu or a Debian ITP?
[13:30] <sebner> ScottK: in generel or in case of courier?
[13:31] <ScottK> sebner: That's the impact of changing the package to remove the spaces.  What's the impact of leaving then?
[13:31] <ScottK> In general.
[13:31] <slytherin> ScottK: Not in Debian. Havne't checked launchpad. But I would like to see the package in Ubuntu.
[13:31] <sebner> ScottK: don't make the delta to debian even bigger?
[13:31] <ScottK> slytherin: OK.  Just suggesting that's the best way to find the answer to your question.
[13:32] <ScottK> sebner: Debian has the spaces (in this case).  What if we just leave them?
[13:32] <sebner> ScottK: they don't do anything, except take up space
[13:32] <ScottK> sebner: Yes.  Exactly.
[13:33] <ScottK> sebner: So that's why it's not worth maintaining a bigger diff with Debian over.
[13:33] <ScottK> sebner: Additionally, it's hard to see and so it makes for a hard debdiff to review.
[13:33]  * sebner sucks somehow on answering questions but thinks it's funny that ScottK is the only one asking =)
[13:33] <Amaranth> Hobbsee: _I_ wanted to wait until the start of UDS
[13:34] <ScottK> sebner: It's OK.  This is one way to learn.
[13:34]  * mok0 once had a package rejected in revu because of trailing spaces... :-/
[13:34] <sebner> ScottK: It's not negative. As I said it's somehow nice
[13:34] <slytherin> ScottK: FYI ... It is java based load testing tool for web applications and web services. Not sure how many use it but it is 'the best' free tool available for load testing.
[13:34] <ScottK> mok0: That's different.  There's no downside associated with making you fix it.  I had the same thing happen to me in Debian.
[13:35] <ScottK> slytherin: As soon as you use the "J" word, I know I'm not the guy.
[13:35] <persia> Regarding extraneous whitespace: it's messy.  It should be fixed.  It isn't worth a patch except to the originating source, which might be upstream, Debian, or REVU.
[13:35] <mok0> ScottK, sebner, I certainly would not bother with trailing spaces anymore. Can't remember why I did it back then, probably didn't consider the consequences
[13:35] <\sh> slytherin, load testing tool?
[13:36] <slytherin> ScottK: I know. I will probably have to poke doko.
[13:36] <broonie> sebner: Easiest thing to do with something like that is get the change made in Debian.
[13:36] <persia> slytherin: jmeter would be great, but do check for ITP or needs-packaging first, and maybe file them if they don't exist.
[13:36] <Hobbsee> Amaranth: hmmm, must have gotten the voices confused then.  i knew you were one of the severe advocators for it
[13:36] <slytherin> \sh: yes, why? Is the term load testing/ stress testing not familiar?
[13:36] <ScottK> broonie: The courier maintainer has not, historically, be what I would call responsive.
[13:36] <sebner> broonie: well if the debian maintainer is willing :\
[13:37] <ScottK> Generally broonie is right however.
[13:37] <mok0> broonie: yeah, except you could be viewed as something of a nitpicker if you file a bug "please remove trailing spaces in debian/"
[13:37] <Amaranth> Hobbsee: Right, but then we seemed to compromise on start of UDS instead of me saying when the archive opens and you saying alpha4
[13:37] <broonie> ScottK: Well, IIRC that's idiomatic given courier upstream :)
[13:37] <broonie> mok0: Oh, you *totally* would.
[13:37] <persia> mok0: As long as it's "Severity: wishlist", nitpicking is usually acceptable.
[13:37] <ScottK> Yeah.  That too.
[13:37]  * sebner is asking himself if ScottK or mok0 should review the debdiff then =)
[13:37] <slytherin> persia: there are none. I will file bug for Ubuntu. But will do for debian only when my package is in shape.
[13:37] <ScottK> sebner: I'll review it.
[13:38] <mok0> sebner: you're in boot-camp now
[13:38] <ScottK> slytherin: You ought to go ahead and file the ITP to avoid duplicate work.
[13:38]  * broonie also notes that doing such a change in the Ubuntu package is only going to annoy anyone trying to find changes from Debian.
[13:38] <slytherin> ScottK: ok
[13:38] <sebner> ScottK: hihi. I would have choosen you since we learn from mistakes :)
[13:38] <ffm> So, what should I do to ask for a package review?
[13:38] <persia> slytherin: I tend to recommend filing both if you're doing it right away, just because not everyone checks both places, and it tells people you're working on it.  No issue with having an open ITP for a while whilst you get reviews, etc.
[13:38] <ffm> s/ask/get/
[13:38] <Hobbsee> Amaranth: mmm.  i gave in, there was no point in arguing.
[13:38] <ScottK> slytherin: That way even if your package isn't done, if someone in Debian is interested, they should contact you.
[13:39] <\sh> slytherin, no because there is another java based (including jython driven) load testing tool available ;)
[13:39] <ScottK> ffm: Patience.  Asking once or twice a day is OK.
[13:39] <slytherin> persia: ScottK: Will file both bugs tonight.
[13:39] <slytherin> \sh: which one?
[13:39] <\sh> slytherin, grinder its the name
[13:39] <\sh> slytherin, also possible to have it on different servers and controlled by one instance on your WS
[13:39] <ScottK> slytherin: Also Debian ITP's go to debian-devel and you can get good feedback on package name/description too.
[13:40] <slytherin> \sh: same with jmeter. Will have to check what is the difference. :-)
[13:41] <slytherin> \sh: found the main difference, grinder has its own scripting. jmeter has a nice GUI with lots of D&D :-D
[13:41] <ScottK> lucas: When you have a moment, I'd like to discuss my libdb4.6-ruby ITP with you.
[13:42] <\sh> slytherin, yes...grinder has jython as scripting engine in its back
[13:42] <\sh> slytherin, for load testing a better alternative then d&d ;) because people who are using it, they are doing all strange things to those tools (at least me) ;))
[13:44] <slytherin> \sh: since I have used loadrunner at some point of time I feel the jmeter approach is better. Let's see, I will finish jmeter first. :-)
[13:44] <\sh> slytherin, kk...
[14:02] <ffm> ack, spam!
[14:04]  * nenolod spams ffm
[14:21] <white> \sh: still around?
[14:23] <\sh> white, always...but sometimes busy and not at my place ;)
[14:24] <white> \sh: how again can i get my base.cow now with cowbuilder --create for sid? :)
[14:24] <white> both cdebootstrap and debootstrap are failing (i assume due to the perl-modules bug)
[14:26] <\sh> white, in this moment, it's not possible...even upgrading from hardy to intrepid fails
[14:30] <\sh> white, adding perl-modules as required packages to debootstrap forces mawk to be pulled in, and that pre-depends on libc6...not really nice and doesn't work actually
[14:31] <white> bah
[14:31] <white> i hope it is getting fixed soon then
[14:31] <\sh> white, what I'm doing now, since the changes between hardy and intrepid are not soo much, I'll testbuild with hardy....and hopefully it builds somehow in intrepid...if not, the fix comes later ,-)
[14:32] <\sh> white, the bug is also in debian, so it should be fixed soon...
[14:32] <\sh> bah...emacs21 still build-deps on old libungif4-dev
[14:32] <white> i am not using ubuntu, so i just need something for sid :)
[14:33] <\sh> white, try with deboostrap etch etch_chroot -> enter chroot and upgrade to sid manually?
[14:33] <\sh> white, for ubuntu it doesn't work from hardy to intrepid, as I said
[14:33] <white> yeah, will do that tomorrow probably, thanks
[14:50] <slytherin> can anyone please point to how to do merges with help of MOM?
[15:01] <mruiz> hi all
[15:06] <highvoltage> norsetto: I caught you. You *do* have a sense of humour!!!
[15:07] <highvoltage> norsetto: "Cesare (the real one)" :)
[15:07] <norsetto> highvoltage: I deny with all my strength!
[15:15] <Ward1983> how do i need to remove gnash? sorry if its considered offtpic but i dont find how to get it done
[15:16] <jpatrick> Ward1983: sudo apt-get remove gnash?
[15:16] <Ward1983> jpatrick, in your dreams that might work :p
[15:16] <azeem> if you're asking off-topic questions, at least supply necessary information along
[15:19] <Ward1983> azeem, i uninstall gnash, then i install flash-nonfree with forefox, then it acts like its not installed, so i click install plugin again
[15:19] <Ward1983> then it tells me its allready installed
[15:19] <azeem> what does that have todo with gnash?
[15:20] <Ward1983> azeem, whateverit is, i dont like it one bit
[15:21] <Ward1983> if ubuntu renders me unable to install simple plugins like flash i think its best i change distros
[15:21] <jpatrick> Ward1983: restarted firefox?
[15:21] <RainCT> jpatrick: was about to ask the same :)
[15:22] <Ward1983> just a sec i deinstalled again
[15:22] <jcastro> sudo update-alternatives --config xulrunner-addons-flashplugin
[15:22] <jcastro> and pick the adobe player
[15:22] <Ward1983> im pretty sure i tried that too some time ago, i have this problem for months now
[15:22] <Ward1983> but ill try again to make sure
[15:22] <Ward1983> i hope thats the problem
[15:22] <Lamego> Ward1983, btw, the support channel is #ubuntu, in case you don't know it :P
[15:23] <Ward1983> Lamego, will do, thought it wqs some pqckaging problem
[15:23] <Ward1983> someone else has the exact same problem
[15:23] <azeem> Ward1983: this channel is for solving packaging problems, not for reporting them
[15:23] <ScottK> Ward1983: That's what Launchpad is for.
[15:23] <bobbo> RainCT: mind if i try the guarddog merge? You were the last uploader.
[15:24] <ScottK> jpatrick: Answering such questions just encourages them.
[15:24] <Ward1983> azeem, ScottK i have no knowledge to determine what kind of problem it is
[15:25] <RainCT> bobbo: I think I already started that one
[15:25] <azeem> Ward1983: so that means you're in the wrong chan
[15:25] <Ward1983> so only one thing left for me to do, leave
[15:25] <ScottK> Ward1983: Then just report the bug (what you are experiencing).
[15:25] <bobbo> RainCT: ok no problem :)
[15:25] <Ward1983> azeem, i was still typing...
[15:26] <Ward1983> ScottK, i'll just get debian, im tired of these retarded problems i never have had with debian
[15:26] <jcastro> man dude, I told you how to fix the problem
[15:26] <Ward1983> thanx to the people who wanted to help
[15:26] <Ward1983> byebye
[15:26] <jpatrick> well..
[15:27] <ScottK> If he's happier with Debian, he should use that.
[15:33] <wgrant> What a nice guy.
[15:34] <ScottK> I always get some humor value out of users who say "Pay attention to $MYPETPROBLEM or I'll go use X instead".
[15:35] <ScottK> I always translate that as "Please ignore any request I make".
[15:35] <laga> "i demand that my feature request is implemented". :(
[15:40] <\sh> wtf was that?
[15:40] <Hobbsee> laga: "pay up"
[15:40] <sebner> Hey folks. What can we do if a uploader forgot to upload .orig.tar.gz and so it FTBFS (in hardy)
[15:40] <Hobbsee> :)
[15:41] <\sh> sebner, hmmm?
[15:41] <wgrant> sebner: That's impossible.
[15:41] <wgrant> It will be rejected, so will never even have builds attempted.
[15:41] <sebner> \sh: months ago I did a merge and the sponsor forgot to upload the orig.tar.gz
[15:42] <sebner> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qmail/1.03-45ubuntu1
[15:42] <\sh> sebner, .dsc + .diff.gz needs a version + deb rev , if version of .dsc/diff.gz is not matching with available orig.tar.gz it won't even build..but will be not accepted from our buildd system
[15:42] <RainCT> sebner: there is a .orig.tar.gz
[15:43] <sebner> true
[15:43] <sebner> but the build log says
[15:43] <sebner> Error: ../qmail_1.03.orig.tar.gz missing
[15:43] <\sh> sebner, hehehe...
[15:43] <Hobbsee> sebner: then the build is broken.
[15:43] <wgrant> Uh.
[15:43] <wgrant> WTF.
[15:43] <wgrant> Big WTF.
[15:43] <sebner> Hobbsee: would you mind doing a give back?
[15:43] <wgrant> Oh.
[15:44] <wgrant> No, that's not what it looks like.
[15:44] <wgrant> It's a tar within a tar.
[15:44] <RainCT> sebner: seems like debian/rules tries to access a .orig.tar.gz
[15:44] <RainCT> well I'm away
[15:44] <wgrant> That's a legitimate bug in your packaging.
[15:44] <RainCT> bbl
[15:44] <sebner> RainCT: cya
[15:44] <Hobbsee> wgrant: yes, exactly.
[15:44] <Hobbsee> wgrant: ie, not likely to have been test built.
[15:45] <\sh> binary-src: checkdir debian/control \
[15:45] <\sh> ../$(PACKAGE)_$(PKG_UPVER).orig.tar.gz \
[15:45] <\sh> ../$(PACKAGE)_$(PKG_VER).dsc ../$(PACKAGE)_$(PKG_VER).diff.gz
[15:45] <sebner> well this was months ago and yes I didn't testbuild it but also not the sponsor
[15:45] <Hobbsee> .....
[15:45] <Hobbsee> ......
[15:45] <Hobbsee> .....
[15:46] <Hobbsee> sebner: here is the riot act:
[15:46] <Hobbsee> unless anyone else wants to give it?
[15:46] <\sh> sebner, the debian/rules file is totally fcked up
[15:46] <\sh> sebner, it will never build...
[15:46] <sebner> strange since the only debian change was "* Updated prerm to remove dependancy on update-inetd"
[15:46] <sebner> and the old version built
[15:46] <Hobbsee> sebner: you must test build *everything* before you upload it, or get it uploaded.  People won't do uploads for you if they know you have a history of uploading broken stuff.
[15:47] <Hobbsee> sebner: tarball version changed?
[15:47] <ScottK> Note for those reading the riot act is that qmail has historically be shipped as source only.
[15:47] <\sh> Hobbsee, no
[15:47] <sebner> Hobbsee: yeah I know it. This was really at the very beginning of my contributions
[15:47] <Hobbsee> sebner: right.
[15:47] <\sh> actually it builds in a normal sbuild / pbuilder environment
[15:47] <Hobbsee> ScottK: granted.  but stuff that builds, no matter how it does, is usually good.
[15:47] <\sh> it won't build hopefully in a XEN environment
[15:48] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Agreed, but lack of building isn't actually a regression.
[15:48] <Hobbsee> ScottK: my objection was more to the point that he didn't test build it, to see if it built or not, before asking for sponsorship.
[15:48] <wgrant> ScottK: It built a qmail-source package, didn't it?
[15:48] <Hobbsee> that's just wasting people's time.
[15:48] <ScottK> Agreed.
[15:49] <\sh> wgrant, yes...no....
[15:49] <\sh> dpkg-gencontrol -isp -pqmail-src -Pdebian/tmp-src
[15:49] <\sh> fakeroot chown -R root.root debian/tmp-src
[15:49] <\sh> fakeroot: FAKEROOTKEY set to 164044714
[15:49] <\sh> fakeroot: nested operation not yet supported
[15:49] <\sh> make: *** [binary-src] Error 1
[15:49] <\sh> sry for pasting this
[15:49] <Hobbsee> ScottK: whether it builds on some funky combo of pbuilder but not sbuild, or something, is immaterial if he didn't test it, on any useful environment, in the first place.
[15:50] <ScottK> Hobbsee: I agree.  I just think the impact in this particular case is lower than usual.  He still should have done it.
[15:50] <Hobbsee> oh, indeed.
[15:50]  * Hobbsee wasn't talking impacts, and such, nor possible solutions.
[15:51] <Hobbsee> ooh!   my tute will actually submit this week!
[15:54] <sebner> ehm. So what can we do now? Fixing in hardy isn't worth it. but for intrepid?
[15:55]  * DktrKranz2 notes fixing FTBFS is usually worth a SRU upload
[15:58] <ScottK> DktrKranz2: Generally, but in this case it's not really a regression.
[16:00] <\sh> the rpoblem is known since feisty
[16:00] <\sh> and there are only two bugs...one because of this ftbfs and the other as pkg request
[16:02] <\sh> so I think right now, postfix and exim4 and sendmail are ruling our universe
[16:04] <gnomefreak> is anyone having issues with hal on Hardy? problem upgrading
[16:07] <ogra> gnomefreak, to the version in -proposed ?
[16:07] <ogra> works fine here
[16:07] <gnomefreak> 0.5.11~rc2-1ubuntu8
[16:08] <gnomefreak> i have someone getting polkit errros about auth.
[16:08] <gnomefreak> polkit-read-auth-helper: needs to be setgid polkituser
[16:08] <ogra> yup, thats what i got
[16:08] <gnomefreak> that might mean its his system with messed up permissions
[16:08] <laga> upgrading in the chroot?
[16:09] <laga> never mind, i was having a completely different set of packages
[16:11] <gnomefreak> ogra: thanks im having him reinstall it maybe it will help
[16:46] <blueyed> Am I right that I should upload a new virtualbox-ose-modules source package for the new kernel ABI to hardy-proposed? Does this need some ACK or something?
[16:47] <ogra> that needs an SRU i guess
[16:47] <ogra> ask pitti in -devel
[16:52] <ScottK> blueyed: Read the SRU wiki page.
[16:54] <ogra> blueyed, since i suspect its only a rebuild you can probably get around the SRU if pitti acks it
[16:54] <blueyed> ScottK: I know about SRU. But shouldn't all kernel module packages get an Auto-ACK if the kernel ABI gets bumped?
[16:54] <Hobbsee> it's something we have to have....
[16:54] <blueyed> ogra: ok, will ask.
[16:55] <blueyed> Another related issue: a lot of users pick the from virtualbox-modules package (e.g. -386 although they would need -generic).
[16:55] <ScottK> blueyed: There's nothing in the process about certain stuff being automagically OK.  It used to be everything was up to a MOTU to decide, but now it's not.
[16:55] <blueyed> This causes a lot of breakage (no working sound, graphic etc after reboot), because modules are missing.
[16:56] <ScottK> blueyed: I think having a set of automatically OK criteria is a good idea.
[16:56] <blueyed> So, I'm thinking about removing the dependency on the kernel-image from the virtualbox-ose-modules packages. (i.e. Depends => Recommends). This would at least only make virtualbox non-working, but not break the whole system.
[16:58] <ScottK> blueyed: Don't do that in an SRU.
[16:58] <ScottK> Save that kind of thing for Intrepid.
[16:59] <ogra> blueyed, see -devel ;)
[17:00] <blueyed> ogra: thanks. I'm test-building already.
[17:01] <blueyed> ScottK: well.. it's a major issue after all.. I'll put the info together in a bug report and get it through the SRU process then. If it does not get acked, ok, but I want to try.
[17:01] <ScottK> blueyed: First rule of SRU is fix in the development release first.  I think that's particularly good for this one.
[17:03] <blueyed> ScottK: yes. I don't see it happening for the kernel though.. which makes it kind of difficult. The package in Intrepid would have that change then but the lower kernel dependency. But I'm find with uploading it to Intrepid first.
[17:03] <ScottK> If you are making changes to package relationships it really ought to get tested out in the development release first.
[17:04] <ScottK> But I'm not motu-sru.  They may feel differently.
[17:05] <Hobbsee> ScottK: most stuff in intrepid doesn't build atm, due to the libtools stuff.
[17:05] <Hobbsee> so i don't know how he'd test it there
[17:05] <Hobbsee> and most people aren't running it
[17:05] <ScottK> Well the package relationship stuff isn't urgent.
[17:05] <ScottK> IMO.
[17:06] <ScottK> My thought would be do an SRU for the kernel update and deal with packaging changes in a later SRU.
[17:06] <jdong> *sigh* that virtualbox-ose-modules architecture is a big bloddy carcass
[17:06] <jdong> Ubuntu really needs to streamline the packaging policy for kernel modules
[17:06] <ScottK> And the carcass should be recarved and split in the development release.
[17:07] <jdong> I don't like the idea of packaging changes for it
[17:07] <jdong> in Hardy that is
[17:10] <blueyed> bug 226960
[17:10] <blueyed> jdong: it should get included in linux-ubuntu-modules, for Intrepid.
[17:11] <blueyed> It was too late, when I realized that already.
[17:12] <jdong> blueyed: IMO the fix at this stage should be v-o-m-$FLAVOR pulls in linux-$FLAVOR instead of linux-image-$ABI-$FLAVOR
[17:12] <jdong> as a depends
[17:13] <blueyed> jdong: well, that would work, too, yes. Except that it's not what the user really wants.. (and I cannot see a reason for a Depends here, strictly speaking)
[17:13] <jdong> demoting the same package to a recommends makes no sense
[17:15] <jdong> blueyed: sorry lost my wifi link
[17:16] <jdong> blueyed: what I meant to say, is if a user sees the recommend for l-i-$ABI-$FLAVOR, the next lgoical step is to mark it for install too
[17:16] <jdong> blueyed: in which case we're back at square one
[17:16] <jdong> blueyed: ideally we should depend on the linux-$FLAVOR metapackages for whatever kernel we want
[17:16] <jdong> blueyed: or recommend them
[17:17] <jdong> blueyed: recommends IMO is inappropriate because vbox is nonfunctional without it.
[17:17] <blueyed> jdong: yes. I would be fine with changing the depends to the meta package.
[17:19] <jdong> blueyed: at this point, Depends: linux-$FLAVOR1 | linux-$FLAVOR2 | ..... $FLAVOR_N is most appropriate IMO
[17:19] <jdong> blueyed: with generic in the front
[17:19] <jdong> err what am I saying
[17:19] <jdong> blueyed: I mean vbox-ose-modules-$FLAVOR1...
[17:19] <jdong> I did find it odd that it suggests -386 first
[17:22] <blueyed> jdong: the dependency is through virtualbox-ose-modules-$ABI-$FLAVOR - currently on linux-image-$ABI-$FLAVOR, but should be linux-$FLAVOR instead then.
[17:23] <blueyed> jdong: virtualbox-ose itself only recommends virtualbox-ose-modules (which is a policy violation btw.. it should also depend on a real package)
[17:23] <blueyed> "-386 first" comes from apt.
[17:28] <blueyed> Strictly speaking, depending on linux-$FLAVOR does not make sure that the ABI matches (and the module will work - so that it's functional).
[17:33] <blueyed> jdong: IMHO recommending linux-$FLAVOR seems to be the safest thing..?
[17:38] <bddebian> Heya gang
[17:39] <norsetto> oh no! bddebian!
[17:39] <geser> Hi bddebian
[17:39] <bddebian> Hi norsetto, geser
[17:41]  * RoAkSoAx hi all!
[17:51] <blueyed> jdong: I'll upload the module for the new ABI first. Would be nice, if you could follow up on the dependency issue.
[17:52] <blueyed> Something else: any idea why "depmod" would search in /lib/modules/2.6.24-12-386, when on a -generic system? (bug 210127)
[17:52] <LaserJock> norsetto: ping
[17:53] <norsetto> LaserJock: pong
[17:54] <LaserJock> norsetto: SRUs don't have to wait 7 days in -proposed
[17:54] <LaserJock> they just need 2 positive acks with 0 negatives
[17:54] <norsetto> LaserJock: ah, so it was changed
[17:55] <norsetto> LaserJock: good to know
[17:55] <LaserJock> I think soonish I'm gonna send out a "SRU refresher" email for people :-)
[17:55] <LaserJock> since the policy has changed quite a bit over the years
[17:56] <DktrKranz2> LaserJock: is minimun aging period still in place (at least for archive-admins) ?
[17:57] <jdong> DktrKranz2: it's a side effect of archive admin latency
[17:57] <jdong> ;-)
[17:57] <nxvl> 4/me waves
[17:57]  * nxvl 
[17:57] <laga> they need to be uploaded to -proposed first ;) can anyone from motu-sru can take a look at bug #221921 and bug #220087? thanks!
[17:58] <DktrKranz2> jdong: mh... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArchiveAdministration#head-1f27dc12ab1558ec21b31ac44e4c86a87a4cd053
[17:58] <LaserJock> ah hah
[17:59] <LaserJock> I wondered
[17:59] <LaserJock> we need to resolve those then
[17:59] <jdong> DktrKranz2: ah :)
[17:59] <LaserJock> SRU policy has no such requirement
[17:59] <DktrKranz2> yes
[17:59] <jdong> laga: ok the first one (mcc) looks good
[17:59] <DktrKranz2> probably aging period is a common practice
[18:00] <LaserJock> DktrKranz2: it used to be the SRU policy
[18:00] <LaserJock> the archive admin page just isn't up-to-date
[18:00] <DktrKranz2> ah, cool then :)
[18:01] <jdong> laga: please use 0ubuntu2.1, not ~hardy1
[18:01] <jdong> laga: the only time it's possibly appropriate to use ~hardy1 is when introducing a new upstream version as a SRU
[18:01] <jdong> laga: most of the time it's old_ubuntu_revision.1
[18:01]  * DktrKranz2 leaves
[18:16] <norsetto> is anyone on i386 willing to do a short test (install)?
[18:16] <norsetto> i386 hardy
[18:17] <tacone> if you don't need someone particulary experienced i may do it
[18:18] <rexbron> hello, I just got an ack on an sru (bug 221518), would someone be able to upload it to hardy-proposed for me?
[18:19] <norsetto> tacone: just need someone to try installing a package
[18:19] <tacone> norsetto: no problem, let's do it.
[18:20] <norsetto> tacone: in hardy, just do an "apt-get install no-ip"
[18:20] <tacone> ok
[18:21] <norsetto> tacone: you should be asked some questions, try to give some sensible answers
[18:21] <tacone> The following NEW packages will be installed no-ip noip2
[18:21] <norsetto> tacone: so far so good
[18:22] <tacone> ok
[18:22] <tacone> I did it.
[18:23] <tacone> beware, I have no no-ip accounts :)
[18:23] <norsetto> tacone: no problem experienced?
[18:23] <tacone> You have entered an incorrect username -or - an incorrect password for this username.
[18:23] <tacone> the first is true, I have no account
[18:23] <tacone> Starting dynamic address update: Can't locate configuration file /var/lib/noip2/noip2.conf. (Try -c). Ending!
[18:24] <norsetto> tacone: right, but the install was ok and it did not fail
[18:24] <tacone> no, it didn't fail.
[18:24] <norsetto> tacone: good, thx, appreciate your help
[18:24] <tacone> autoconfiguration failed, for obvious reasons.
[18:25] <tacone> also noip2.conf was not found. don't know whether this is normal or not.
[18:25] <norsetto> tacone: yes, thats ok
[18:26] <tacone> ok, good work.
[18:27] <norsetto> tacone: if you don't want that just remove with an "apt-get remove --purge no-ip noip2"
[18:27] <tacone> I already did, but thank you anyway :)
[18:27] <norsetto> tacone: no, thank YOU ;-)
[18:28] <bbyever> hi
[18:28] <bbyever> when building bygfoot it gives me this error
[18:28] <bbyever>  fakeroot debian/rules clean
[18:28] <bbyever> debian/rules:11: *** missing separator.  Stop.
[18:28] <bbyever> debuild: fatal error at line 1247:
[18:28] <bbyever> fakeroot debian/rules clean failed
[18:29] <bbyever> this is the debian/rules http://paste.ubuntu.com/10291/
[18:31] <bbyever> could somone help me, please?
[18:31] <tacone> is it allowed to ask questions about packaging on this channel ? (keep in mind I am currently not involved with motus). If the answer is "no", is there a channel where could  I ask ?
[18:32] <RoAkSoAx> tacone, you are allowed to ask for question related to packaging
[18:33] <rexbron> bbyever: the debian/rules file looks like it is been merged (Where did you get the sources?) and you will need to manually fix conflits in the file
[18:33] <bbyever>  ﻿rexbron: from dad http://dad.dunnewind.net/bygfoot/
[18:33] <rexbron> conflicts rather
[18:33] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: the report said something about conflicts, but i dont know how to handle them
[18:33] <rexbron> bbyever: then you definately need to finish the merge
[18:34] <rexbron> bbyever: look for merge information on the wiki first
[18:34] <rexbron> bbyever: if you still have questions, don't hesitate to ask
[18:34] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: ok, thanks
[18:35] <tacone> general question: digging the docs I rode that setting up a chroot environment is usually preferred. I could chroot easily, but I don't like particulary the idea of messing up with fstab and would preferer setting up a virtual machine (I have a fat computer, so performance is not a problem). Could a VM be acceptable or is it a bad practice for some reason I overlooked ?
[18:36] <norsetto> bbyever: all you wanted to know about merging and never dared to ask: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
[18:36] <bbyever> ﻿norsetto: thanks
[18:37] <norsetto> tacone: you mainly need a clean environment which you are not afraid to mess with build-depends, and that it gives you the possibility of checking log files produced during build
[18:40] <norsetto> tacone: also, you could have unexpected results if you have other packages installed beside the minimal set needed for build, or could miss some vital build-deps
[18:41] <tacone> norsetto: thank you I was just going to ask about having more than minimal set.
[18:41] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: so which part in debian/rules is making the conflict?
[18:42] <rexbron> bbyever: look at the parts between the >>>>s and the <<<<<s
[18:42] <rexbron> they are seperated by a [18:43] <laga> jdong: thanks, much appreciated. (re the mythbuntu-control-centre SRU)
[18:43] <norsetto> tacone: personally, I use pbuilder, it gives me all I need, others swear by schroot or similar. Why would a chroot mess up your fstab?
[18:44] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: yes
[18:45] <jdong> tacone: there's nothing wrong about using a VM, but a pbuilder is much easier and does most of what you want it to do
[18:45] <tacone> norsetto: ok, I'll check pbuilder. on wiki I primarly saw schroot or (!) dchroot. never mind about fstab, beginner doubts (you need to bind some dirs)
[18:46] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: but i woulnt know how to fix the problem. i dont know what those things do
[18:46] <tacone> thanks jdong.
[18:46] <rexbron> bbyever: then why are you trying to perform a merge?
[18:46] <jdong> tacone: yeah don't look at dchroot/schroot for a beginner's setup
[18:47] <jdong> tacone: those are nice for doing a massive number of builds (more efficient) but pbuilder is a lot easier to get going
[18:47] <tacone> jdong: what then ? pbuilder ?
[18:47] <jdong> no fstab modification
[18:47] <tacone> oh, nice. ok.
[18:47] <jdong> tacone: ubuntu-dev-tools has a frontend called "pbuilder-dist"
[18:47] <DreadKnight> hello
[18:47] <jdong> for maintaining multiple pbuilders (i.e. Hardy and Intrepid) more easily
[18:48] <tacone> jdong:  very nice.  installing right now
[18:48] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: warp10 told me i should do a few and this one seemes easy. besides, i want to know how to merge packages that have conflicts
[18:49] <rexbron> bbyever: ok, read up on the wiki and look at bazaar-vcs.org on the section about resolving conflicts in three-way mergers
[18:49] <DreadKnight> any MOTUs around?
[18:49] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: ok, thanks
[18:51] <ScottK> DreadKnight: Yes.
[18:53] <DreadKnight> ScottK: would be cool if anyone would fix up the plone mess from ubuntu repository...
[18:53] <DreadKnight> i'm talking about the plone cms   www.plone.org
[18:54] <ScottK> DreadKnight: I'm familiar with, but don't use plone.
[18:54] <ScottK> DreadKnight: Guidance in the form of bugs with patches/suggestions would be really helpful.
[18:55] <DreadKnight> im sure other people complained already on LP a while ago
[18:55]  * ScottK hasn't particularly looked.
[18:55] <DreadKnight> recently i can see a package zone-plone3 .. but it says is missing when i try installing it
[18:55] <DreadKnight> zope-plone3 *
[18:55] <ScottK> "Please fix this mess" doesn't really give us a lot to go on.
[18:56] <DreadKnight> there are 2 old packages in the repository, with an old version nobody would use
[18:56] <ScottK> DreadKnight: Please remember that virtually all MOTU are volunteers, so we are limited in our ability to deal with all the packages in the repository.
[18:56] <DreadKnight> i know
[18:56] <DreadKnight> this is the latest plone https://edge.launchpad.net/plone/3.1/3.1.1
[18:57] <DreadKnight> it's a goal for me for this year to become MOTU ^^
[18:57] <ScottK> Great.
[18:57] <DreadKnight> still working on it
[18:57] <coppro> what do you do about an upstream library without a SONAME
[18:57] <coppro> do I have to add one myself?
[18:57] <ScottK> DreadKnight: If you can figure solutions to getting plone is shape for Intrepid, you can get them sponsored and that will help.
[18:58] <DreadKnight> ScottK: a resync with debian will do it anyway xD
[18:59] <ScottK> Perfect. Then the next question is how to get Hardy fixed.
[18:59] <durapraxis> Hi, everyone. Can anyone please tell me how can I store symbolic links in a .deb package?
[19:00] <coppro> use dh_link in your rules file
[19:02] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: uhh im not understanding anything, i think i'll just wait till warp10 get online to ask him...
[19:02] <rexbron> bbyever: you understand the concept of a merge correct?
[19:02] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: yes
[19:03] <rexbron> bbyever: then what part are you having difficulty with?
[19:04] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: fixing the conflicts. i dont understand how its making a conflict nor how to fix it
[19:04] <blueyed> I've accidently uploaded version 24.1 to intrepid instead of hardy-proposed. Should I use 24.0.1 for the correct upload (to -proposed)? Or 24.1~hardy1?
[19:05] <ScottK> blue
[19:05] <ScottK> blueyed: 24.0.1.
[19:06] <ScottK> blueyed: The ~hardy1 versioning would be appropriate for backports.
[19:06] <durapraxis> coppro: tks. When I do it with dh_link, are they actually created on my build directory, or just created on the binary .deb file, when I do the package?
[19:06] <blueyed> Thanks, ScottK
[19:15] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: ok so i just commented all the lines with >>>>> <<<<< [19:16] <rexbron> bbyever: that is not correct, you need to resolve the conflict by choosing one or the other based on looking at the changelog to see why there was a change
[19:18] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: ah ok
[19:19] <rexbron> bbyever: if there is a good reason for ubuntu making a change, you "merge it" by manually incorperating the change into the new ubuntu package
[19:19] <rexbron> by the change I mean the new debian version
[19:21] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: ah ok, i understand now
[19:21] <rexbron> :)
[19:24] <bbyever> ﻿rexbron: thanks!
[19:25] <rexbron> bbyever: no problem, if you have any other questions, don't be afraid to just ask them in the channel. Any idling motus will pick it up
[19:25] <bbyever> ok
[19:42] <slytherin> Hi all, need an advice. I had uploaded a package to revu in hardy cycle but didn't work on it much after December. I am now finishing it for intrepid and will be changing name of source package to match the upstream tarball. How can I ask to discard old package on revu?
[19:43] <ScottK> slytherin: Just archive it and don't worry.
[19:44] <slytherin> ScottK: I think it is already archived. If I upload the package bu changing source name it will be a separate package right?
[19:44] <RainCT> slytherin: yes
[19:45] <slytherin> thanks
[20:08] <slytherin> is there any documentation about merge-o-matic. I mean how can we do merges with help of MOM?
[20:08] <bbyever> ﻿slytherin: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
[20:17] <kirkland> zul: I'm working on merging php5...  is it correct for me to create a bug in launchpad to associate with this work?
[20:18] <zul> what do you mean?
[20:18] <kirkland> zul: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
[20:18] <kirkland> zul: "File a merge bug"
[20:18] <zul> kirkland: nah...its the begining of the release dont worry about it
[20:18] <kirkland> zul: k
[20:22] <RainCT> kirkland: leave a comment on DaD saying that you're working on it, though
[20:23] <ScottK> kirkland: php5 is in Main, right?
[20:23] <LaserJock> when are DaD and MoM getting merged?
[20:23] <ScottK> LaserJock: I understand it's being worked on now.  No idea of schedule.
[20:23] <RainCT> LaserJock: it's in progress :P
[20:24] <LaserJock> so RSN .. :-)
[20:26] <kirkland> ScottK: yes, main.
[20:26] <kirkland> RainCT: okay
[20:27] <ScottK> kirkland: Most core-dev's don't look at DaD, so a commet there won't help much.
[20:33] <Adri2000> LaserJock: when Keybuk merges the patches :)
[20:33] <LaserJock> so it's set to go?
[20:33] <Adri2000> yeah, the patch have been ready for a while now, they just need to be reviewed and committed to trunk
[20:34] <Adri2000> patches*
[20:37] <RainCT> Adri2000: well, the redesign isn't finished yet
[20:40] <Adri2000> sure, but I think that once the comments feature is in MoM, we don't have any strong reason to keep DaD running. even if the new design comes a bit later
[20:41] <RainCT> Adri2000: true :)
[20:41] <RainCT> Adri2000: (just wanted to ensure that you know that it's not ready.. although you probably already knew that)
[20:41] <Adri2000> yep :)
[20:55] <slytherin> when I do grab-merge.sh lucene2, why does it create a source directory lucene2-2.3.1+ds1-1ubuntu1? Shouldn't it be lucene2-2.3.1+ds1?
[20:56] <RoAkSoAx> slytherin, i believe it create it like that because you are going to merge the from debian and you will create an ubuntu source after making the changes
[20:57] <ScottK> slytherin: IIRC it does that whenever a merge has confilcts.
[20:57] <slytherin> ScottK: What should be next step once I resolved all conflicts and updated changelog accordingly? should I rename the directory and then do debuild -S -sa?
[21:01] <RoAkSoAx> slytherin, i think you just do debuild -S .. then the .dsc will be generated and you will have to create the debdiff between the newer debian version (lucene2-2.3.1+ds1.dsc) and the just generated ubuntu version (lucene2-2.3.1+ds1-1ubuntu1.dsc)...
[21:03] <bbyever> ﻿slytherin: you also need one between old ubuntu and new ubuntu, afaik
[21:03] <slytherin> hmm, let's see what happens
[21:08] <Adri2000> a debian current / ubuntu candidate debdiff is enough
[21:11] <RoAkSoAx> nxvl, help me with virt-viewer
[21:11] <RoAkSoAx> my new debian/control http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10317/
[21:11] <RoAkSoAx> and my changelog  http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10316/
[21:11] <rexbron> Hey, if it has not been do so already (and I don't think it has as I did not get a responce on my last request), could I get someone to do an upload to hardy-proposed. Already have the SRU ack. Bug 221518
[21:12] <nxvl> RoAkSoAx: please include the changelos from last merge until the new one
[21:12] <RoAkSoAx> nxvl, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10318/
[21:14] <nxvl> rexbron: suscribe motu-sru and universe sponsors to the bug report
[21:14] <nxvl> soren: around?
[21:14] <rexbron> motu-sru has already been subscribed, so I'll add uus
[21:16] <soren> nxvl: Yup.
[21:16] <nxvl> soren: can you help RoAkSoAx merging virt-viewer please
[21:16] <nxvl> soren: maybe you have some plans for it
[21:16] <soren> Not in particular.
[21:16] <soren> That's the problem?
[21:16] <soren> Er..
[21:17] <soren> I mean: What's the problem?
[21:17] <nxvl> RoAkSoAx: soren is the virtualization guru
[21:17] <RoAkSoAx> hi soren i tried to merge it and this would be my changelog: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10318/ and this my new debian/control: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10317/...
[21:17] <RoAkSoAx> is it ok?
[21:17] <RoAkSoAx> ok thanks nxvl :D
[21:18]  * soren looks
[21:20] <soren> RoAkSoAx: And the rest of the merge is still fine?
[21:20] <RoAkSoAx> soren, seems like, the REPORT file only showed my conflicts in debian/control
[21:20] <soren> RoAkSoAx: I mean... The rest of what MoM did works as intended?
[21:21] <RoAkSoAx> soren, MoM REPORT only showed conflict there in debian/control
[21:22] <soren> RoAkSoAx: That doesn't mean that the package will build correctly.
[21:22] <kirkland> zul: okay, i've got php5 merged, build succeeded, ready for your review/sponsorship
[21:22] <soren> RoAkSoAx: Did you build the package?
[21:23] <RoAkSoAx> soren, not yet should I do it now?
[21:23] <RoAkSoAx> (i'm just learning by the way =) )
[21:23] <soren> RoAkSoAx: Yes. That should be the first thing you try when you think you've finished the merge.
[21:24] <RoAkSoAx> soren, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10321/
[21:26] <nxvl> soren: did you know what graphical libraries uses virt-manager?
[21:26] <nxvl> soren: as in qt, gtk, etc..
[21:26] <soren> RoAkSoAx: debuild -S only builds the source package.
[21:27] <soren> RoAkSoAx: What you want to do is try to build the binary package.
[21:27] <soren> RoAkSoAx: Preferably in a clean environment (using either pbuilder or sbuild).
[21:27] <nxvl> soren: yep, but with the source package you can use pbuilder or a chroot environment, to use intrepid's build-deps
[21:28] <RoAkSoAx> like this?: sudo pbuilder build virt-viewer_0.0.3-2ubuntu1.dsc
[21:28] <soren> RoAkSoAx: If you already have pbuilder set up, then yes, that looks about right :)
[21:28] <nxvl> RoAkSoAx: use pbuilder-dist
[21:28] <nxvl> RoAkSoAx: first pbuilder-dist intrepid create
[21:28] <soren> nxvl: virt-manager used gtk indirectly. All of its interface is done using glade.
[21:29] <soren> Ah, right.
[21:29] <soren> I've not used pbuilder for a while :/
[21:29] <nxvl> soren: sbuild?
[21:29] <RoAkSoAx> i created it with: sudo pbuilder create --distribution intrepid --othermirror "deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu intrepid universe multiverse"
[21:30] <nxvl> mmm
[21:30] <nxvl> that will work
[21:30] <nxvl> but with pbuilder it's easy to manage several distributions
[21:30] <soren> nxvl: The same system as the buildd's use. It's kind of like pbuilder, just different :)
[21:31] <RoAkSoAx> yeah i created it the other day, how to clean it?? or should i upgrade it first?
[21:32] <nxvl> soren: heh, i know it, i was asking if you use sbuild
[21:32] <nxvl> soren: since you said you don't use pbuilder
[21:33] <soren> nxvl: Oh, right. :)
[21:33] <soren> nxvl: I somehow thought that I had said "I use sbuild instead of pbuilder" or something. I must be tired. :)
[21:34] <nxvl> heh
[21:34] <RoAkSoAx> soren, nxvl : seems it is ok: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10322/
[21:34] <nxvl> soren: some time it happend
[21:34] <nxvl> soren: it is 10 pm out there, isn't it?
[21:34] <RoAkSoAx> now it is downloading the required packages
[21:34] <nxvl> heh
[21:35] <nxvl> Y and wait
[21:35] <nxvl> :D
[21:35] <soren> nxvl: 22:35 now.
[21:35] <RoAkSoAx> here it's 3.35
[21:35] <nxvl> yep, 7 hours more than here
[21:36] <nxvl> soren: so you wont have the timezone choke in Prague
[21:36] <nxvl> shock*
[21:36] <soren> nxvl: I don't get that anyway.
[21:36] <nxvl> soren: huh?
[21:37] <soren> nxvl: My body just somehow doesn't give a hoot which timezone it's in.
[21:37] <nxvl> oh! ok
[21:38] <nxvl> i haven't been in a tz change before
[21:38] <geser> soren: nice feature :)
[21:38] <nxvl> and my body lives in the oposite tz, so i don't think i will have any problem
[21:38] <nxvl> :P
[21:38] <RoAkSoAx> nxvl, you will be sleepy during the UDS :P
[21:38] <soren> nxvl: I went to Bali last Autumn. That's a 13 hours difference. No problem. When I came back, I think I went to bed a bit early the first night, but that might just as well have been from traveling fro 20 hours.
[21:39] <nxvl> soren: yes, the long trip helps
[21:39] <nxvl> i will arrive Prague at night
[21:39] <nxvl> so, i will go to have some beers and then to sleep
[21:39] <nxvl> :P
[21:39] <nxvl> soren: are you going for FOSS Camp?
[21:42] <soren> nxvl: Yeah.
[21:42] <nxvl> soren: when are you going to arrive?
[21:42] <soren> nxvl: May 15th 14:50.
[21:43] <nxvl> i will arrive May 15th at night
[21:44] <nxvl> so wait meto start with the beers!
[21:44] <nxvl> or leave a note on the hotel so i can find you
[21:44] <nxvl> :D
[21:44] <soren> nxvl: :) We'll figure it out.
[21:44] <soren> RoAkSoAx: Any luck?
[21:46] <RoAkSoAx> soren, still downloading the required packages
[21:47] <soren> RoAkSoAx: Ok :)
[21:47] <nxvl> soren: the bandwith in Peru isn't the best it could
[21:47] <nxvl> :P
[21:48] <soren> nxvl: I can imagine. :) How much bandwidth do you usually get?
[21:49] <RoAkSoAx> soren, for 500kbps it is like 40 USD
[21:49] <soren> :(
[21:49] <nxvl> here i have 1.5 Mbps
[21:49] <nxvl> at home 1 Mbps
[21:50] <nxvl> RoAkSoAx: call you ISP, i pay 30 - 35 $ for 1Mbps
[21:50] <RoAkSoAx> nxvl, really?? Telmex??
[21:51] <nxvl> nop
[21:51] <nxvl> tdp
[21:52] <RoAkSoAx> tdp for 500kbps is S/110 almost 40USD
[21:53] <nxvl> oh yes!
[21:53] <nxvl> :P
[21:53] <nxvl> i pay 50 $, you are right
[21:53] <nxvl> :P
[22:02] <RoAkSoAx> soren, seems it has build successfully
[22:04] <RoAkSoAx> soren, this is the end of the building process: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10337/
[22:11] <soren> RoAkSoAx: Great.
[22:12] <RoAkSoAx> soren, so i just file the bug in LP and create the debdiff?
[22:12] <soren> RoAkSoAx: Have you had merges..
[22:12] <soren> Right, that was exactly what I was going to ask you to do :)
[22:12] <RoAkSoAx> soren, should i suscribe it to u-u-s?
[22:13] <RoAkSoAx> too?
[22:13]  * ajmitch should learn how to do merges again
[22:13] <nxvl> ajmitch: merges is the funniest and easy part of UD
[22:14] <RoAkSoAx> nxvl, not the first merge :P
[22:15] <nxvl> RoAkSoAx: heh, not, the firsts ones not
[22:15] <nxvl> :P
[22:16] <RoAkSoAx> nxvl, but they are addicting :P
[22:17] <nxvl> yep
[22:17] <nxvl> thay are
[22:17] <nxvl> as i always said
[22:17] <nxvl> FOSS is like drugs
[22:17] <nxvl> once you get in, yo don't stop until you can't go out
[22:17] <nxvl> :D
[22:17] <RainCT> good night
[22:18] <ajmitch> nxvl: oh it's not that hard to escape
[22:19] <nxvl> ajmitch: if you try to escape, you always want to came back again
[22:19] <zul> kirkland: cool put it up somewhere so I can have a look and Ill do it when my son goes to sleep
[22:19] <kirkland> zul: what do you want?  just the debdiff btw the .dsc's?
[22:19] <kirkland> zul: or do you want my whole tree?
[22:20] <zul> debdiff would be good but the whole tree would be better so I can upload it
[22:21] <kirkland> zul: okay, i'm sanity checking the debdiff at the moment
[22:21] <zul> ok
[22:25] <RoAkSoAx> soren, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/virt-viewer/+bug/227073 . Should i change the status to "confirmed" and suscribe it to u-u-s?
[22:27] <nxvl> RoAkSoAx: yup
[22:36] <tacone> how long should pbuilder take to create a basic env ? it's taking ages (1 hour at least)
[22:36] <kirkland> zul: chinstrap:~kirkland/php5.intrepid/
[22:39] <skorgu> Hey the gmetad package recommends ganglia-webfrontend which doesn't exist afaics. There doesn't seem to be a package for the php parts of ganglia at all. Hardy, I checked i386 and x86_64.
[22:43] <LaserJock> tacone: might depend on how hard hit the archive is
[22:43] <LaserJock> tacone: what release are you building a pbuilder for?
[22:44] <tacone> LaserJock: nice point. I guess it's sinking in the deeps then :)
[22:44] <tacone> LaserJock: I am following a wiki page. I did  sudo pbuilder create
[22:45] <POX_> does the dak equivalent in Ubuntu support bz2 in .debs ?
[22:46] <POX_> my jinja package was just rejected and I don't know why (it wasn't even me who uploaded it, it was sparc build daemon)
[22:47] <ScottK> POX_: No.  It doesn't.
[22:47] <POX_> can you upgrate to new dak or are you using something else?
[22:48] <POX_> upgrade
[22:48] <tacone> LaserJock: anyway it's building hardy.
[22:48] <ScottK> POX_: No.  It's part of Launchpad.  The only think still using dak in Ubuntu is -security.
[22:48] <LaserJock> tacone: yeah, it can take quite some time. I'm currently doing Intrepid and it's also taking forever
[22:48] <POX_> almost all of my packages are now compressed with bz2
[22:49] <ScottK> POX_: Was this a sync from Debian that blew up?
[22:49] <ajmitch> ScottK: I'm fairly sure they migrated that as well, and that soyuz supports bzip2 compression on binary packages
[22:49] <POX_> I thnink so, ues
[22:49] <POX_> yes
[22:49] <ajmitch> not so sure on bzip2 for source
[22:49] <ScottK> ajmitch: OK.  So maybe I'm wrong then.
[22:49] <tacone> LaserJock: ok, TheMuso
[22:49] <tacone> err
[22:49] <tacone> ok, thanks.
[22:49] <ScottK> wgrant: ^^^ ?
[22:50] <ScottK> wgrant: Is soyuz working with .bz2 compressed source packages these days?
[22:50] <wgrant> Mm?
[22:50] <wgrant> Ah.
[22:50] <wgrant> No.
[22:50] <POX_> rejection message could be a little bit more verbose (I have "None" :)
[22:50] <wgrant> POX_: File a bug. It might be fixed at some point.
[22:51] <POX_> wgrant, ScottK: not source packages, binary ones
[22:53] <crimsun> LaserJock: creation will likely fail due to base-files, e2fsprogs, and util-linux.
[22:53] <POX_> I will upload lzma source packages after Lenny release
[22:53] <ajmitch> crimsun: even of hardy?
[22:53] <LaserJock> crimsun: I saw reports that it was working so I thought I'd give it a shot
[22:54] <crimsun> ajmitch: no, just referring to his intrepid bit
[22:54] <LaserJock> I can't do a dist-upgrade so might as well try something else
[22:54] <crimsun> LaserJock: I've not tried massaging it, so it may well be forceable.
[22:54] <wgrant> POX_: Oh, Soyuz does do lzma for binaries.
[22:54]  * ajmitch hasn't even touched intrepid yet
[22:54] <wgrant> So I presume it does bz2.
[22:55] <crimsun> bah, the great soname bump love.  yay, alsa-lib.  :-(
[22:55] <POX_> ok, so what does "Rejected: None" mean?
[22:55] <LaserJock> it handles bz2 binaries I"m pretty sure
[22:55] <ajmitch> POX_: it means that soyuz is being funny & that you should probably file a bug on it
[22:55] <LaserJock> as the ubuntu-docs package builds bz2 .debs I'm pretty sure
[22:56] <ajmitch> probably launchpad.net/soyuz/+bugs
[22:58] <sebner> gn8 folks
[23:08] <mtaylor> hey all - I'm looking for someone from motu-sru who can give me an opinion on if something is a "severe regression" or not
[23:08] <LaserJock> mtaylor: what bug?
[23:08] <wgrant> !ask
[23:08] <mtaylor> LaserJock: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/debian/+source/genshi/+bug/226285
[23:09] <ajmitch> hm
[23:09] <mtaylor> LaserJock: it was due to a dpatch added upstream by debian - I've got the patch reverted upstream
[23:10] <ajmitch> if it completely breaks genshi as you say, then I'd say it's a severe enough regression
[23:10] <LaserJock> mtaylor: off-hand it certainly looks SRU-worthy
[23:11] <mtaylor> LaserJock, ajmitch: ok... I think that's enough at least to start it through the SRU process
[23:11] <LaserJock> mtaylor: I'll need a test case that shows how to test that it breaks/works
[23:11] <mtaylor> LaserJock: ok. will do
[23:12] <LaserJock> mtaylor: thanks for working on it
[23:12] <mtaylor> LaserJock: my pleasure!
[23:33] <LaserJock> anybody know of a good way to find out what packages are installed by default on a server install?
[23:35] <mathiaz> LaserJock: a server install pulls in ubuntu-standard.
[23:35] <mathiaz> LaserJock: it uses -server as the kernel flavour and won't install any langage pack.
[23:36] <LaserJock> yeah
[23:36] <crimsun> http://releases.ubuntu.com/8.04/ubuntu-8.04-server-i386.list ?
[23:36] <LaserJock> what I'm trying to do is "roll back" to a basically fresh install
[23:36] <LaserJock> I installed xubuntu-desktop to get some setup tools
[23:36] <LaserJock> but I'd like to try to go back a bit
[23:37] <mathiaz> LaserJock: if you remove xubuntu-desktop and then autoremove, you should get what you want
[23:37] <LaserJock> well, it didn't quite work that way
[23:37] <LaserJock> I can't remember what all I did though
[23:39] <LaserJock> apt-get remove libgnome2-0 gets rid of a lot
[23:41] <mtaylor> LaserJock: you could debootstrap into a chroot, then do dpkg --get-selections in the chroot
[23:41] <mtaylor> and dpkg --set-selections outside of the chroot
[23:42] <mtaylor> then apt-get dselect-upgrade
[23:42] <LaserJock> yeah, that's probably more than what I want to do
[23:42] <LaserJock> but I might end up doing that