[00:00] argg, still not working [00:00] persia, can I merge criticalmass? I saw you're the last uploader [00:02] sistpoty: you built these packages on intrepid? [00:03] LaserJock: yes === gnomefre1k is now known as gnomefreak [00:03] LaserJock: that is... partly... I build them using an intrepid pbuilder [00:03] k [00:03] (though I'm behind one day or so, due to the mirror) [00:05] * norsetto thinks he will call it a day [00:06] sbuild doesn't like them (doesn't look specific to the packages though) [00:06] I'll try with pbuilder [00:06] no0tic: persia is in Japan, so he might not be on line right now [00:07] g'night all [00:07] norsetto, night [00:11] sistpoty: Saw you core-dev application. Good for you. It's about time. [00:11] thanks ScottK [00:12] sistpoty: huh, works with pbuilder [00:12] :) [00:12] sistpoty: You might want to point at an update to your wiki page that describes all the cool stuff you've done. While I'm sure the MC members know a lot about it, the tech board may not. [00:12] I'm not sure if it's some sort of weirdness with intrepid right now or what [00:13] ScottK: I deliberatly didn't do this... as my rationale is basically, that I don't intend to fix main stuff (unless, it's broken, and once again core-devs did not a job as good as I expect them to do) [00:14] sistpoty: OK. [00:14] (which really concerns me recently) [00:14] sistpoty: You didn't ask for endorsements, but I intend to give you one. [00:15] ScottK: that would be nice. thanks! :) [00:15] sistpoty: so basically Main QA? [00:15] LaserJock: not really, I rather believe that there have been too many packages included into main, which shouldn't be there in the first place [00:16] So I was at the Apple store tonight buying my wife her Mother's Day present (she has a Mac) and I think I talked the guy at the store into trying out dual booting to Ubuntu. [00:16] LaserJock: it somehow overlaps with the fact, that main packages aren't necessarily covered by canonical support [00:16] ScottK: cool, congrats :) [00:18] * sistpoty admits a big failure of ubuntu: I didn't manage to get the beamer to work under kde during the conference I visited this week :( [00:18] sistpoty: what kind of packages do you think shouldn't be in Main? [00:19] LaserJock: that's a tough question... let me check a few instances [00:19] sistpoty: btw, did you know the two copies of smburi.py are not the same? there is a small diff [00:19] sistpoty: Laptops, projection screens, and Kubunty Hardy are problematic. See the release notes about dual screen operations. The best I've done so far is to hard lock the machine. [00:21] LaserJock: didn't check this actually... thanks for the note [00:23] LaserJock: for example, I guess that there's no reason for libsdl1.2 to be in main (and its rdepends). As it has many rdepends, I'm not entirely sure though. Of course there are other libs which used to live in universe and have got adapted to main later one, but shouldn't be there as well imho [00:25] sistpoty: pitti did a whole lot of work to get uneeded stuff out of Main [00:25] for hardy [00:25] LaserJock: smbury.py diff seems to be ok for me (afaict it drops "smb://" when it hits it) [00:26] sistpoty: so it's good like it is then? [00:26] LaserJock: imho yes... at least it will install then, so it's better than the current state [00:27] LaserJock: I haven't checked though, if system-config-printer-kde still finds smburi.py [00:27] (wouldn't know how to do that right now) === kitterma is now known as ScottK2 [00:35] sistpoty: uploaded, thanks [00:35] thanks LaserJock! [00:45] sistpoty: That's a failure of Kubuntu, not Ubuntu. xrandr works really, really well normally. [00:46] wgrant: most probably, yes [00:46] sistpoty: He's right. Our KDE3 displayconfig doesn't use xrandr. [00:47] Rather unfortunate that it wasn't convinced to :( [00:47] Not crashing routinely was major progress. [00:47] We did achieve that, so it's at least reasonably functional with a single screen. [00:47] it didn't help me when I needed to present s.th. on a recent conference (whith an ubuntu sticker on the laptop *g*) [00:48] We do intend to have it taken out and shot for Intrepid. [00:48] sistpoty: The release notes have some useful hints. [00:48] ScottK2: yes, of course :) [00:48] * sistpoty needs to go to bed now... cya [01:09] tbielawa_dinner: did you updated the FSF address in the bibus files? [01:09] *update [01:09] Ok. Why does the compiz application switcher leave my windows slightly blurred? :) [01:31] RAOF: I had that for a short while after Hardy released. Some update seems to have fixed it now though. [01:32] I worried that my eyes were going for a bit [01:34] hmm. the mythbuntu theme is pretty nice, exept for the tri-color gnome-panel [01:36] Let's see how it compares to my current chocolate nodoka theme. [01:40] pwnguin: It should go all the way with the dark theme. The light-grey dropdowns from the black panel looks silly, IMO. [01:40] yea [01:40] but you can fix that [01:41] change to shiny-black ;) [01:44] You know, I could learn to love Debian pink. [01:46] ... [01:46] I always thought those colors were chosen to look good on a twenty year old CGA monitor or solaris workstation or something [01:46] It goes quite nicely in the mythbuntu theme with darklooks everywhere else. [01:47] pochu: ping [01:48] darklooks is too flat [01:49] Agreed. [01:49] Nodoka does reasonable dark themes. [01:49] (Gah! Still need to write that RFS) [01:50] nodoka? [01:50] Yeah; fedora's gtk engine/theme. [01:53] Any distro that picks brown as it's primary theme color really has no place to pick about other's choices. [01:53] who's picking? [01:53] "I always thought those colors were chosen to look good on a twenty year old CGA monitor or solaris workstation or something" didn't sound like a compliment to me? [01:53] oh right [01:53] So that would be you. [01:54] debian magenta i think is worse than orange :P [01:54] Dunno. All my desktops are a nice pretty blue color. [01:55] besides, dark orange is a fairly unique and identifying color [01:55] its usually pretty simple to pick out an ubuntu screenshot ;) [01:55] I quite like our orange. [01:55] It's better than OldHuman brown. [01:55] It's definitely unique. I won't argue that. [01:56] superm1: You around? [01:56] superm1: Never mind. Got my derivates mixed up. [01:57] he is the mythbuntu guy, no? [01:57] He is. [01:57] I want an Ubuntu Studio guy. [01:57] oh. (i orginally brought up the mythbuntu theme) [01:57] Right. This is a different topic. [02:00] I like the browns [02:01] I'm not fond of the heavy blue and greens [02:02] the problem with dark themes I think is the web [02:05] pwnguin: how so? [02:07] I think the problem with themes period is my teenage children come up with stuff that makes my eyes hurt. [02:07] hmm [02:08] I like dark colors [02:08] I prefer black/grey backgrounds [02:08] dark colors are not good for our eyes xD :) [02:08] they aren't? [02:08] LaserJock: Because the web is uniformly black-on-white, so looks outrageously bright in a dark theme? [02:09] RAOF: why would they depend on the theme? [02:09] LaserJock: They don't; that's the problem. [02:09] really? [02:09] When the rest of the theme is light-background, dark text, it's not a huge contrast. [02:10] When the theme is dark background, light text, the black-on-white web looks insanely bright. [02:10] I guess when I switch from FF which is black-on-white to my terminal which is white-on-black it's a big change [02:10] but that doesn't really depend on the theme [02:11] the theme really only affects the window title/border [02:15] so is white-on-black or black-on-white better for your eyes? [02:16] it is better to use light colors [02:16] LaserJock: like RAOF says, the rest of the desktop is fairly dark, so a huge white WWW canvas is way brighter than the rest of the screen [02:16] i've had dark colored themes... and my eyes got tired more often [02:16] than when using light colors [02:17] hmm [02:17] well, I guess maybe my problem is "rest of the desktop" [02:17] believe me i spend almost like 16 hours a day in front of a computer :D [02:17] I run all my windows maximized [02:17] right, so when you alt tab, it's huge [02:18] so if I'm looking at FF it's all white [02:18] RoAkSoAx: as do I [02:18] Jazzva: pong [02:18] but I haven't figured out a good combination [02:18] LaserJock, do you use glasses?? [02:18] tab or switch virt desktops and bam, sore irises [02:18] RoAkSoAx: contacts, yeah [02:18] i coud imagine this making your eyes sore after a few hours [02:18] LaserJock, that's why you don't feel it.. i don't use any kind of glasses [02:18] hmm [02:19] esp with the monitor as the only light source in the room [02:19] RoAkSoAx: well, my eyes are read and kill me [02:19] sebner: No reason to restrict yourself to a MOTU for gmsh. Any coordination is good, and if you can't get anywhere, we can also merge it next time. [02:19] I just haven't figured out how to make it better [02:19] no0tic: If you haven't already, please feel free to merge criticalmass [02:19] LaserJock, same as mine.. but everytime i had dark colored themes... my eyes got more tired and red [02:19] hmm [02:19] maybe I should change my terminal then [02:21] LaserJock, the only thing i use in black*/white combination is my terminal === tbielawa_dinner is now known as tbielawa [02:21] evening [02:21] pochu: I did a test-build of tracker, and cleaned it after... the diff between that and the original from mom shows that ./src/libtracker/tracker-client.h is removed. But, if I don't build it and clean it, the file stays there. It is auto-generated, on the other hand.. [02:21] and my theme is the uUbuntu default [02:21] RoAkSoAx: well, that's what I spend most of my day using [02:21] pochu: Any ideas? Is that ok? [02:21] so wouldn't I want it black-on-white? [02:22] Jazzva: will it be generated on build? [02:22] tbielawa: hi, did you see my question fro a while ago? [02:22] pochu: I'm building it again, to check... I suppose it is [02:22] LaserJock: no I did not, please ask it again [02:22] Jazzva: if so, that's alright, yes. It shouldn't be there in the first place but that's an upstream thing and it's ok [02:22] tbielawa: did you modify all the FSF addresses? [02:23] LaserJock, if for example you have the screen all black with white letters... wont affect [02:23] LaserJock: yes I did [02:23] Is there any way to know what packages build-depend on another one? [02:23] tbielawa: I'd suggest doing it as a patch [02:23] but if you have a theme that has combination of black colored and maybe some light colors it will affect [02:23] pochu: Ok, thanks... I'll submit a debdiff for tracker soon. [02:23] something like 'apt-cache rbuilddepends ' would rock :) [02:23] RoAkSoAx: well, what do you mean by "theme" here? [02:23] Jazzva: ok, thanks! [02:24] no prob :) [02:24] pochu: grep-dctrl -FBuild-Depends,Build-Depends-Indep,Depends -s Package libclamav-dev -n /var/lib/apt/lists/*_Sources [02:24] pochu: look in ubuntu-dev-tools, I seem to remember there being such a script [02:24] LaserJock, let me take a screenshot :) [02:24] LaserJock: I can include the patch I generated and mailed upstream. Proper procedure would be creating a debian/patches dir and adding an action in rules? [02:24] pochu: Just put the package you're interested in where I had libclamav-dev [02:25] tbielawa: yeah, I'd suggest using dpatch for it [02:25] LaserJock: thanks for the guidance, I'll read up on dpatch === roaksoax_ is now known as RoAk [02:26] tbielawa: if you need help ping me [02:27] LaserJock, this is my laptop's desktop, and is a bad combination of colors: http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/1779/screenshotot5.png [02:27] ScottK2, LaserJock: thank you! [02:28] RoAk: ok [02:28] RoAk: teh contrast! it burns us! [02:28] ScottK2, LaserJock: there's /usr/bin/reverse-build-depends from ubuntu-dev-tools too :) [02:28] RoAk: I would probably do something like that [02:28] ScottK2: which does exactly your magic, but it's easier to remember ;) [02:29] LaserJock, yeah i like dark colors too but i really hurts eyes more than having a lighter colored theme... [02:30] I ran a dark theme with some custom default CSS for a while, but websites really don't like it. [02:30] RoAk: rounded edges shouldn't round on fullscreen =/ [02:30] pwnguin, it ain't full screen :) [02:31] LaserJock, it is because of the combination of dark and light colors what affects your eyes.. it is better not to use such combination [02:32] but if you use glasses... you might not feel the difference.. since i don't i do feel it =( [02:33] RoAk: here's my current screenshot:http://laserjock.us/files/snapshot1.png [02:33] sort of the opposite of yours [02:34] somewhere i have a shot where i made wip3out the default font [02:34] argh wine has no sound unless I kill whatever's using alsa [02:34] it looks neat in places, but irc aint one [02:34] bluefoxicy: s/alsa/PulseAudio/ [02:34] bluefoxicy: isn't that sorta how alsa works? [02:34] wgrant: I killed pulse [02:34] it's still not working. [02:34] RoAk: so should I rather use white-on-black for my terminal so everything is light? [02:35] LaserJock, maybe not... but i would change the white messages to a more grey than white color... [02:36] LaserJock, i also use black terminal... it does not hurt me... what it does is everything else.. as my screenshot of xchat [02:37] I can't stand white terminals. [02:38] * tbielawa runs translucent white on black terminals [02:38] wgrant, me neither [02:39] * pwnguin runs green on black [02:39] RoAk: so is the white of the xchat the problem in your screenshot or is it the black everywhere else? [02:39] pwnguin: ewww, I can't do that [02:39] I tried and it gives me bad eye strain [02:40] works great on my 2001FP [02:41] LaserJock, the black makes the white appear more brigth than usual... and since i have that combination is like if i was looking to directle to a flash light in the complete darkness [02:41] *looking directly to a flash light in the complete darkness [02:42] http://csee.wvu.edu/~tbielawa/screentoday.jpg [02:43] figured i'd follow suit since we [02:43] tbielawa: that's similar to the kind of thing I'd do [02:43] 're all showing off our screens :) [02:43] although I like more solid backgrounds [02:43] I just bought a sub to digitalblasphemy and I think that background's my favorite so far [02:44] you know, I found a wiki article on how to make those with gimp [02:45] I very rarely see my background. All my windows are fullscreen most of the time (probably from using ion3 for a significant period) [02:46] wgrant: same here, from primarily using laptops with crummy resolution [02:47] both my laptop and desktop computers terminals look like this though: http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/5781/screenshotlh1.png [02:47] http://gentoo-wiki.com/TIP_GIMP_Fractal_Backgrounds [02:48] That's a few temperature sensors. [02:49] http://jldugger.deviantart.com/art/Dualism-Ubuntu-79575306 [02:50] wgrant, my sensors you mean? [02:50] RAOF: Yes. [02:50] Er, RoAkSoAx. [02:50] wgrant, yeah.. my mainboard does not support my processor officially so i have to monitor how it goes :D [02:50] aha, found it [02:51] http://people.cis.ksu.edu/~jld5445/wipeout.png [02:51] wgrant, check the volts http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6415/screenshot1an6.png [02:51] that terminal just killed me, I think. [02:53] yea, it was ... unusable [02:54] yeah [02:54] pwnguin: was that even english?! [02:54] i think it was old egipcians language :P xD [02:55] gerogliphics? (i'm not sure if that is the word nor even the correct spelling ) [02:56] pwnguin: That's almost as hard to read as what my teenager's come up with (although for the 14 year old pink is much more prominent). [02:56] OMG PONIEZ [02:57] it's not fair to tease like that, wgrant [02:59] wgrant: I didn't show her the Kubuntu April Fools release for a reason. [02:59] RoAkSoAx: You'll want to change the password in that screen shot. [03:00] ScottK, which one? [03:00] RoAkSoAx: Kidding. There isn't one. [03:01] ScottK, ahah phew.. you worried me :P [03:01] ;-) [03:01] you had me searching [03:01] tbielawa, yeah i was searching too... lol [03:09] So if I have a package that uses quilt, why is removing an un-needed patch and removing the patch name from series not sufficient to get the patch not used to build the package? [03:17] decisions... sit at home drinking alone, or drink alone at the bar [03:17] ? [03:17] tbielawa, go to the bar and look for someone to make you company : [03:17] RoAkSoAx: :) [03:18] that's what i'm going to do anyways xD [03:18] nice [03:19] There's a CD release show for a local band @ my favorite venue + watering hole, I think I'll check it out [03:20] here is the same thing as every saturday.. hang out in multiple bars :D [03:21] We need a good west virginia ubuntu gathering [03:22] get everyone to come to morgntown, have a grand ol' time [03:22] tbielawa, how is WVU, good place to study? [03:23] RoAkSoAx: I don't feel very challenged but our engineering college is ABET accredited. [03:23] The famed couch burnings of the past don't happen as much anymore. but if you're looking for a party scene, we got that too [03:23] tbielawa, cuz i might be doing a Masters Degree in the US and i'm between IIT, WVU and FIU [03:24] RoAkSoAx: in what field, CS? [03:24] tbielawa, yep [03:24] pochu: Uploaded debdiffs for tracker, bug 229146 [03:24] Launchpad bug 229146 in tracker "Please merge tracker 0.6.6-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/229146 [03:24] tbielawa, if i choose FIU i might go for Telecommunications and Networking [03:25] WVUs got a talked up Masters of Software Engineering Path [03:25] I'd say its worth checking out for sure [03:26] we have professors from a wide range of disciplins int he cs field as well. we've got a lot of ground breaking stuff going on for a cozey mountain town :) [03:26] tbielawa, i really don't like software engineering path.. i preffer telecom & networking [03:27] i would be an International Student [03:27] I don't know off hand anyone in our department that specialized in those fields [03:27] we have plenty of international students, especially at the graduate level [03:28] tbielawa, yeah i've seen that CS masters there are not related to telecom & networking, but IIT and FIU are... [03:28] what is FIU? [03:28] tbielawa, yeah.. i have to apply for an schoolarship too [03:28] Florida International University [03:29] oh god -- florida *vomit* sorry... I moved out of that state as quick as I could, you may end up loving it if you attend university there [03:30] tbielawa, i was on vacation there winter 2007... (january trough february) and i really liked it... lots of party... and since i have family there.. might choose FIU [03:30] awesome [03:30] well folks, I'm heading out. time to check out the venue === tbielawa is now known as tbielawa_venuing [03:31] have fun tbielawa === santiago-php is now known as santiago-ve === gnomefre1k is now known as gnomefreak === nenolod is now known as happinessturtle === wolfger__ is now known as wolfger === tbielawa_venuing is now known as tbielawa === nenolod is now known as happinessturtle [06:49] O_o [06:49] its strange to me that this room is never under 180 participants, yet I can identify the.... 15 people who speak regularly [06:50] tbielawa, werent you going to a bar_ [06:50] ? [06:50] RoAkSoAx: how'd your night go? Is it even night to you? [06:50] tbielawa, yeah 12:50 [06:51] how about you? [06:51] oh wow, so you're on central time (or something close). I just got back! The three bands just stopped playing. [06:51] I had a good time [06:51] im at utc -5 ... should be close to Central time but without daylight saving [06:52] My typing is impared. I've never typed drnka on a ergonomic keyboard before [06:52] and rock on... i didn't go out cuz i remembered that i have examen tomorrow 8am [06:53] RoAkSoAx: I went out because I had my _last_ exam today :) Wound up talking to my manager at the bar/venue for a few hours. Good conversation was had [06:54] he mentioned grootboot. My mission tomorrow is to find out what it is and does [06:54] cool!! i have a CCNA Module 1 exam.... so i decided not to go out [06:54] CCNA exam [06:54] yep, module 1 [06:54] You made the intelligent decision [06:55] RoAkSoAx: what does your handle even mean? [06:55] tbielawa, handle?? my nickname you mean? [06:55] Yes [06:55] nothing at all [06:55] it just came to my mind once [06:56] oh [06:56] Mine's short for "Timothy Bielawa" quite original don't you think? :p [06:56] yep, i used to be ^4nDr3s but i stayed with this [06:56] ahaha [06:56] yeah lot's of people do that... [06:57] some take it as an standard for user control in organizations [06:57] dholbach comes to mind [06:57] emails, user accs. etc... [06:57] ya. that's what we do for user accounts @ work to [06:57] *too' [06:57] yep, it's kind of and standard [06:58] so, you studying CS? [06:58] if you search teh intertubes for 'zokosiman' or 'zoko siman' you might dig up stuff I've done in years past. [06:59] RoAkSoAx: ya. I'm a CS and mathematics dual major. I added Math this last semester. [06:59] Undergrad? [06:59] And you? [06:59] Yes. Undergrad, going for B.S. [06:59] cool.. i obtained my BS in Systems Engineering (Which would be equivalent to CS in Peru) [07:00] on january [07:00] systems engineering == CS? [07:00] so now i'm finishing my thesis.. and they apply for an schoolarship in the US :D [07:01] pwnguin, in Peru... Systems Engineering would be the equivalent to CS in the US [07:01] so systems engineers in peru study compilers and Big O notation [07:01] huh [07:02] Systems engineering != CS, no [07:02] pwnguin: you ain't gonna reduce us CS'ers to compilers and big-O, are you? [07:02] pwnguin: we might be the worst at achieving the big O ;-) [07:02] jdong: i think theres a common experience around such things [07:02] RoAkSoAx: You would loooooooove my job at the university [07:02] cs is theory and that's the theory ;) [07:02] i've seen the Masters Curricula in FIU for CS, and its very similar to mine in Peru [07:03] tbielawa, what do you do? [07:03] RoAkSoAx: Put briefly, I'm a system administrator for the computer science department. [07:03] cool [07:03] jdong: laugh all you want, but any presentation of software in a journal would be remiss if it doesn't analyze the runtime [07:04] tbielawa, yeah i would love your job [07:04] But the part you would enjoy is beyond that. hold on for a minute and I'll get a URL for you [07:04] tbielawa, i don't wanna work just yet until i get my thesis done... but i was working last year developing software for a financial institution in my city [07:05] pwnguin: I'm here limboing 6-2 (EE+CS)... consider me an onlooker ;-) [07:05] systems engineering is a very broad term, practiced by many disciplines, including degreed engineers [07:05] tritium, it is a broad tearm, but in peru it's realted to informatics (software development, AI, and networking) [07:06] We're developing a infrastructure platform. The senior design group this year demonstrated the first implementation of it: https://launchpad.net/loud-platform [07:06] RoAkSoAx: really, it goes beyond just informatics, and involves the integration of subsystems, requirements management, etc. [07:06] depends on the university... but it is pretty much similar to CS [07:07] mok0 is details exactly what we're developing https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MortenKjeldgaard [07:07] It is similar to CS, but not identical. It is utilized on mechanical systems, electrical systems, electromechanical systems, etc. Much more than just software systems. [07:07] i think you two are talking about different things [07:07] tritium, yes, it does, the term does... but as i'm saying... in Peru.. they use it for all the related to CS [07:08] RoAkSoAx: I understand what you're saying [07:08] his degree and "Systems Engineering as practiced in the US" [07:08] my point is simply that what's important to a CS degree is computation theory [07:08] tritium, in peru there's one only university that use CS as the name of the carreer... few use Informatics Engineering.. and most of Universities use it as Systems Engineering [07:08] pwnguin: international, really: http://www.incose.org/practice/whatissystemseng.aspx [07:09] tritium: i'm only familiar with the US =| [07:09] * jdong personally thinks CE/IT/SE are distinct from CS [07:09] then again I'm also thinking from a US perspective [07:09] * tbielawa nods at jdong [07:09] Wikipedia's Systems engineering page isn't bad either [07:10] software engineering, at least at my university, is sort of a weaker "we program but dont think as hard about it" deal [07:10] pwnguin: nah I wouldn't say that much [07:10] jdong, i do too that-s why i think it should be renamed to CS, but they put it in Peru like Sys.. ENgine.. because it was "more commercial" [07:10] whatever that means [07:10] pwnguin: CS just looks at it from a more theoretical point of view [07:10] we have 'information systems' in the WVU business college [07:10] pwnguin: while SE tries to approach a "real world working solution ASAP" way [07:11] pwnguin: actually.... 6.005 (my SE course) is approaching it from a "let's make all the students commit suicide" way. [07:11] heh [07:11] 0_o [07:11] and it's working. [07:11] oh my [07:11] the last weekly project took me 40 hours to complete [07:11] we run the operating systems class that way [07:11] and I consider myself to be a fairly experienced coder [07:11] lots of kids were spending significantly longer [07:11] * tbielawa is glad he's not a business school manager [07:12] one property of MIT computer labs.... you will notice starting from 5PM people bringing sleeping bagsi nto the lab. [07:12] * RoAkSoAx is glad he want's to be a sysadmin and networkadmin :D [07:12] that was one of the weirdest sights during my first term [07:12] but we don't work our students on the thesis that they're MIT students dedicated and super intelligent [07:12] jdong: 2 things: (1) you're in MIT? (2) you'd work in it/cs there? [07:13] tbielawa: (1) yeah, I'm a 2nd year undergrad in EECS (2) I do work as a sysadmin of 50 or so Ubuntu laptops for our intro to EECS course [07:14] jdong: i sorta take issue with the entire OO design. programs are a set of instructions for a computer, not a collection of things. OO (which I hereby equate with Software Engineering) seems very database centric =( [07:14] jdong: speaking frankly, I think that's badass :) [07:15] I'm not a big fan of the title "software engineer," as so many who claim that title are not degreed engineers. [07:15] jdong, how much did you obtain in your GRE to get accepted there? [07:15] wtf [07:15] I think pwnguin just openened a box that shouldn't have been [07:15] undergrads aren't grads [07:15] grads take the gre [07:15] RoAkSoAx: undergraduate, no GRE [07:15] tbielawa: thanks, I'm flattered :) [07:16] jdong, oh right, so in STA's? [07:16] pwnguin: well OO is not the buzzword anymore... [07:16] SAT's* [07:16] RoAkSoAx: my standardized test scores, I can only say are average [07:16] I think my best set of SAT scores were the low 2300's/ high 2200's [07:16] jdong, i see.. here they say that if i get a really hi GRE score i could get to MIT [07:16] wasnt 1600 a top score? [07:17] pwnguin: yes [07:17] pwnguin: it's 2400 now, They moved the SAT II WRiting test into the main SAT [07:17] fun [07:17] pwnguin: so we can lurn our grammarz and stuff [07:18]