[01:59] what is UME going to do for a gps app? === asac_ is now known as asac [07:42] good morning [07:46] morning [07:46] hi lool [07:52] morning === alek_desk_ is now known as alek_desk === alek_desk_ is now known as alek_desk [09:54] lool: for ubuntu-mobile image, should I use more than "http://ppa.lp.net/ubuntu-mobile/ubuntu hardy main" and the regular hardy archive on ports.u.c? [10:00] mvo: Hmm theoritically this is pulled if you use a MIC platform [10:00] mvo: If you don't, then you should probably include the ppa; yes [10:01] mvo: Also, we'll move to a different archive soon [10:01] mvo: Technically, the releases we have been doing were not based on ports + ppa, but on a snapshot of these hosted on snapshot.u.c [10:02] lool when is the plan to move to the new archives? [10:03] lool: ok, thanks - I was playing with simple-mobile-builder today again and with davmor2 we fixed some issue, it should be pretty good now. did the release include virtual images too? [10:03] * mvo wonders if it is worth building new ones based on the snapshot.u.c sources.list entries [10:04] might be for RC2 [10:04] * theseinfeld wonders on davmor2 [10:05] theseinfeld: when it's in place :) [10:05] any ~ deadline? [10:05] mvo: We didn't release vm images until now [10:05] I actually made some vm images [10:05] :) [10:06] you need to do some hacking with the initram to get it working based on the project chrooted directory, other than that, it is quite straight forward [10:06] mvo: I'd suggest you only care about a single config in smb, or use the MIC provided configs -- all supported MIC configs could be made available with the config copying machinery I added [10:06] mvo: For the single default config, I'd recommend hardy+ppa for now and mobile archive afterwards [10:07] you mean s/hardy/ports/ right? [10:07] mvo: BTW I chatted with persia on the topic, and he was tempted to hack on MIC to add vm creation support from it [10:08] mvo: he mentionned concerns of bug-to-bug compatibility between MIC and u-v-b [10:08] I've since been convinced that this wouldn't be beneficial. [10:08] theseinfeld: It's the same thing [10:08] lool that would be cool :) [10:08] theseinfeld: hardy is a dist/suite; ports.u.c is where we host binaries for non-official architectures [10:08] As much as getting exactly the right set of packages together is desired, we can probably do that by abusing --add-pkg in u-v-m [10:08] theseinfeld: archive.ubuntu.com where we host source in all cases and binaries for supported arches [10:09] persia: This is implemented already :) [10:09] lool: Completely? Last time I has slightly different results, but I've not tried the latest simple-mobile-builder. [10:09] mvo: Is your goal to spend time on it so that it's ready for release? Otherwise, I'd suggest we work together after the release [10:10] persia: Well it's fully implemented, but some things differ [10:10] persia: There are currently some bugs and also s-m-b adds a fixed set of packages to the list of pkgs to isntall [10:11] persia: Also, config is copied manually instead of being provided by an ume-config-vm package [10:11] lool: after release is fine for me, I just tweaked it a bit for davmor2 (he found some bugs) [10:11] lool: It's the differences that worried me. The argument that convinced me not to make a VM platform for MIC was that we weren't likely to do lots of VM testing of the final release, and should look at how we want to VM-test for intrepid instead. [10:11] mvo: Ok; cool [10:12] mvo: I have a bunch of bugs/changes I'd like to fix, I mentionned them to you shortly, but generally speaking I think it's quite good already; I just didn't have much time since UDS to work on it [10:12] and I found that neverball starts :) its just painfully slow, but other stuff like frozen-bubbles or gnash seems to be pretty usable [10:12] mvo: rev10 is much better menu is correct etc. I'll play around with it and make up a quick wiki page on the testing section [10:12] sure, I understand that, there is a rleease to make :) [10:13] persia: Apart of squashfs and initramfs, I think the differences were globally minimal with this approach [10:15] lool: Yes, although I find that the way the filesystems work for the MIC images can be part of some of the differences we see with our testing. Depends on the test goal. [10:15] I'll take another look at simple-mobile-builder with the new updates: maybe my opinion is outdated. [10:16] persia: Exactly, it depends on what you want to test [10:16] That's true too :) [10:16] persia: lool: As a tester using MIC I spent most of the day confirming if it was a bug or an issue with MIC. Using the kvm image I lose the majority of that. [10:16] persia: Arguably we could as well use released images for cdrom or USB in vms, but these wouldn't work [10:17] (and we could make these work too IMO) [10:17] lool: Let's make the daily images work for VM for intrepid, for wider (safe) testing. For now, the small differences are probably acceptable. [10:18] davmor2: Certainly we need to fix MIC issues for this release, but do we want to spend time creating vms which allow us to diagnose MIC bugs if they are only 10% of the bugs and we wont mainly use MIC in intrepid? [10:18] Or do we want vms which reproduce 90% of the bugs by allowing us to run the same packaged apps? [10:19] persia: I think I could argue that there are hardware bugs which you can't reproduce in vms anyway, so we wont ever reproduce it in full [10:20] lool: You don't have to argue. I've already ceased efforts to make MIC do VMs :) [10:20] persia: Perhaps if we had a more layered approach (probably non-MIC) we could try reproducing more of the current build layout (squashfs and initramfs) [10:20] For example, if MIC initramfs was properly packaged, such as casper, it would be trivial to include it in vms [10:21] lool: true but then most of the apps don't run in mic which is the issue. They are running in kvm version and finally it enables me to test UME again which then helps confirm issues with cgregan. I have noticed issues that he hadn't and visa versa. That currently isn't workable in MIC [10:22] davmor2: I understand your point, but I don't understand what you're arguing for/against [10:22] davmor2: There's two separate issues: one is VM vs. Xephyr. I think we all agree VM is the solution. The other is MIC vs. something else. I think we ought use the same tool for everything, but can wait for intrepid. [10:24] Okay cool :) Just making the point rather than arguing though. [10:26] The only thing I'm arguing against is spending too much times on vms (for example by spinning them from MIC) at this point; simple vm builds are a good start already :) [10:28] Four people. Four different goals. None at odds. Discussion is good :) [10:30] * lool would just like to avoid waste of efforts; who am I to prevent people to work on something they'd like to do? :-) [10:32] so, in the future there might be no MIC? [10:32] long time future :) [11:02] persia: happy now? :D [11:04] jussi01: Thanks. I can now point at things like bug #217838 and get a response :) [11:04] Launchpad bug 217838 in ubuntu-mobile "sd8686 and sd8688 SDIO WLAN adapter cannot be detected WLAN adapter does not show up on the network manager." [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/217838 [11:04] :) === Moot2 is now known as MootBot [11:21] Guys on date and time if you change manual to ntp are you able to install the ntp packages? [11:22] manual to automatic sorry [11:29] Installing packages is a little tricky: there's no GUI for this by default. [11:30] what do you do with the default action then ? time-admin tries to pop up the installation dialog [11:31] and then crashes :) [11:31] hmm, it surely shouldnt crash blindly [11:32] * persia tests to try to find a way to not crash [11:33] probably linking the app its trying to call to /bin/true or so might help [11:33] ogra: it does throw up a polite message [11:33] ah, k [11:33] davmor2: I can't get a crash, although it's not currently useful. [11:34] persia: might be an issue with vm [11:35] davmor2: Maybe, but that's not the sort of thing I'd expect for VM vs MIC images. [11:36] sorry not a crash it just flashes like it has crashed and then puts up a you can't do this message [11:36] davmor2: Ah. Yes. That's exactly my experience. [11:37] I'm glad to know we see the same thing: it makes it easier to be sure of any fix :) [11:37] that's why I assumed it had crashed [11:38] davmor2: I define "crash" as when the tool goes away completely (or worse, the windowing system goes away). [11:38] And "hang" as when it stops accepting any input. [11:38] okay we'll all get on the same page :) [11:41] can anyone tell me what the differences will be between ubuntu-mobile created by the image creator vs a normal install on a computer with the ubuntu-mobile pakcage [11:42] dns53: There are some setup differences, and differences in how the initial base files are created. [11:43] Also, if you previously installed a different sort of Ubuntu, you may end up with a different set of applications. [11:43] Further, ubuntu-mobile wasn't quite ready for hardy, so there are some packages that are a little different. [11:43] I seem to remember a couple outstanding bugs on the meta-package as well, perhaps masked because we tend to use MIC. [11:44] Yes, for example the terminal.desktop file is shipped by mobile-basic-flash [11:44] well there is no entry in gdm, i created one and runs the script in the wiki [11:45] dns53: We don't use gdm in UME [11:48] dns53: This would be one of the cases where your package selection was different :) [11:49] dns53: If you want to test, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Cases/UMEinstall-kvm was recently published, if that helps. It may change over time (it's new), so be warned. [11:49] i've tried the image-creator a few times but nothing has booted of my eeepc yet [11:52] dns53: Which platform did you select in MIC? [11:54] micassin is suppose to work but the images created when booting of a usb drive fail on boot, not sure if it is the kernel, init, mounting the root file system [11:58] dns53: Hrm. I'm not sure then. The McCaslin images work for me, but I have different hardware. [11:59] dns53, you could try if the classmate image works for you ... its pretty HW specific though, you likely need additional stuff [11:59] http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/classmate/images/hardy/ [12:00] (and not (yet) based on mobile) [12:23] I'm still having issues with midbrowser open oo-trig.xls in OO.o. But on a plus side ODR does open it now although it does look hideous. [12:51] davmor2: Having Time&Date install the NTP software depends on having a working synaptic, which isn't in -mobile. We could likely hack something more directly using libapt, but it wouldn't be quick. I think I'd rather it didn't work than possibly crashing without the nice user message, etc. [12:52] I would suggest using the update-manager backend code, it should be trivial to extend for this purpose [12:52] (probably not hardy though) [12:52] mvo: Calling python from C? [12:52] IIRC time-admin just does a system() or exec() so that should be ok [12:52] it does not link against libapt [12:52] Or calling some special update-manager call that allows for arbitrary new package installation? [12:53] yes, that is what I was thinking [12:54] mvo: Could be. How about a call into gnome-app-install? Is UpdateManager much better? [12:55] * persia hasn't looked at gnome-app-install other than the .desktop files [12:55] persia: A simpler fix for now might be to put a warning in place and then add at the bottom open terminal and type sudo apt-get install ntp [12:55] persia, note that unionfs tears down the performance massively for g-a-i [12:55] and put in a better fix for intrepid [12:55] ogra: True. [12:56] how about gdebi ? [12:56] you could just mae a call to gdebi-gtk [12:56] *make [12:56] Doesn't gdebi expect a local .deb? [12:56] (and pull the package in advance somehow) [12:56] righ [12:56] t [12:57] Could seed the ntp package, but it's a very, very ugly hack. [12:57] (where "seed" means putting in place in advance: not adding to the seed) [12:57] if you have apturl installed, just system("apturl apt:ntp") [12:57] apt-get -d ntp && gdebi-gtk /var/cache/apt/archives/ntp*.deb or so [12:58] but iirc it uses synaptic as its backend too, so please ignore that last suggestion [12:58] ogra: Right. That's still dirty for both gst-package and gst-time [12:58] right [12:58] I'm happy to make a mode for gdebi (if you instal lthat) and/or update-manager, that is trivial [12:58] do you need it for hardy-final-lipa? [12:58] lool? [12:59] mvo: Really, it's not that I dislike synaptic, it's just that it's not there, and it wanted hildonmm :) [13:00] it would help me on the classmate as well [13:00] (to have a gdebi mode that pulls from the archive) [13:00] it does not need hildonmm [13:00] the gui uses plain gtk [13:00] no gtkmm [13:00] even though on the cmpc g-a-i is a requirement anyway [13:01] so i have to keep /var on a separate partition anyway and dont run into the performance probs here [13:01] dinner time talk to you latter === davmor2 is now known as davmor2_dinner [13:13] synaptic is 25MB on-disk, including additional dependencies. [13:13] Unfortunately, a simple install didn't fix Time&Date. [13:13] do you really have ot care fo diskspace in UME = [13:13] ? [13:13] *to care for [13:13] ogra: There's talk of 2GB devices. [13:14] My MID is 4GB, but the sales people try to sell at 512MB (but that's not linux) [13:14] ah, well, dont let them do that ... i know how painful it is :) [13:14] It needs a bit of time. [13:14] 2G are mean, not fish nor meat [13:15] 4G are just perfect [13:15] I think once storage gets a little cheaper, and more people use these things, it won't matter so much. [13:15] Currently, to get to a price point where people != me want to buy them, they need to cut features. In six months/a year it won't matter so much. [13:26] yeah [13:27] sadly we need to solve todays probs today :) [13:27] my minimal spec for cmpc *is* 2G 256M [13:27] which makes me cry every time i type it [13:28] ogra: Wow! My 3.5" is bigger than that. I'm guessing the 256 is harder than the 2? [13:29] yeah [13:29] Is the 2G at least fast-access, or filtered through a low-speed channel? [13:29] the 2G is fine with the new ATA devices ... the former cmpc model had the dusk on usb ... combined with no L2 cache and 256M thats just pain [13:29] *disk [13:35] ogra: fortunately you didn't have to use FF2 with that :) [13:36] i did [13:36] for the gutsy image :) [13:36] which was a PITA [13:36] did you put a mention "do not try to open a second tab as it'd likely crash your system (or make it so slow that you think it crashed)" [13:38] nah, gutsy was proof of concept [13:38] * stgraber still remembers of the localapps try we did with scottie :) we opened youtube, it went fine for a while and then ... no firefox :) [13:38] nobody expected it to actually work properly [13:39] cmpc 2g + intrepid should rock with that swap-in-ram thing and other improvments (and fast I/O too :)) [13:40] well, lets see ... i need to build on the netbook image in the future [13:40] thats likely less highly optimized for the HW than my personal image was [13:42] ogra: I thought you had a plan to base on -desktop? [13:42] well, netbook will be based on -desktop anyway [13:42] at least thats what i was told yet [13:42] i hope the meeting today can clearify a bit more [13:42] ogra: Are you basing on netbook-remix, or a different netbook? [13:43] * ogra doesnt even know who produces the current image [13:43] netbook-remix afaik [13:43] ogra: There's a hardy remix with code at https://launchpad.net/~netbook-remix-team/+archive [13:43] persia, i was suggesting to use gnome for ume :) netbook will be -desktop anyway with a different launcher/desktop [13:44] I hear it might not be getting updated for intrepid. [13:44] right, that means i need a lot of ppa stuff :/ [13:45] ogra: Why PPA stuff? Can't it be done as a flavour? [13:45] well, i will still be bound to hardy as releasename [13:46] i.e. my patches have to be against the hardy kernel ... my apps have o be synced with hardy instead of intrepid etc [13:47] i cant create a flavour in the hardy archive :) [13:47] ogra: Ah. Retrospective images. I see. [13:47] :( [13:48] and that at least until january for four different classmate arches :/ [13:50] urgh [13:50] netbook remix uses gpl3 ? [13:52] mvo, persia: while playing with in on menlow, I noticed update-manager will say "all updates" installed when there's no network [13:52] Yes, and it doesn't keep track of the last update. [13:56] what is UME going to do for a gps app? [13:59] tripzero: No selection has been made. Have you had success with any of the various GPS apps in Ubuntu? [13:59] have you looked into navit? [13:59] http://navit-project.org === mboman_ is now known as mboman [14:00] My hardware doesn't have GPS. [14:00] it's a little rough, but it's gtk, and it's maturing a lot [14:00] Is it in Ubuntu? [14:01] no [14:01] someone should packge it then :) [14:01] the only one that is in ubuntu is gpsdrive, and it's not very good [14:02] tripzero: That's likely a first requirement to get stuff into Ubuntu-Mobile. You might want to try to get the app packaged first. [14:02] persia, i've got an older version of it packaged [14:02] i'll see if I can get it updated [14:02] tripzero: That's probably a good first step. You might work with the team in #ubuntu-motu to get the latest version packaged and on REVU for review. [14:03] They likely won't do the packaging, but they can provide advice and help (as many people in that channel are also packaging things) [14:04] persia: i'll get with the navit folks and get it packaged up then [14:04] do you know if UME has selected a media player interface yet? [14:04] tripzero: Thanks. Having it in Ubuntu, and some reports on how well it works with the Ubuntu-Mobile environment would be the cleanest path to getting it in by default. [14:09] hi, anybody as a detailed roadmap for ubuntu mobile please ? [14:09] i'm interested for an htc shift [14:10] DNis: How do you mean? There's some test images available. [14:11] More than that is really what gets put into Ubuntu for the target architectures for the next release, and what is in the seeds. [14:11] For the most part, we're likely to have something based on GNOME to some degree. [14:11] persia : i mean a release date for an release candidate for example and release, and if there is test images for this device. [14:12] DNis: There are no special test-images for that device. Do you know what chip it runs? [14:12] htc shift run on an intel maccaslin platform, like teh samsung q1 ultra [14:13] with intel a110 processor [14:13] persia: do you know if UME has selected a media player interface yet? [14:13] DNis: There are some McCaslin images for testing, which might work for that. They aren't quite perfect for my McCaslin (SR8), but they work. [14:14] persia: it's in the roadmap for first ubuntu mobile release but i wished i could test it :-) [14:14] DNis: Take a look at cdimages.ubuntu.com [14:14] persia: thx i will take a look at it [14:14] http://cdimages.ubuntu.com/moblin/releases/hardy/rc/ [14:15] persia: is it simple to install ? [14:16] DNis: Burn the image to USB, and boot off USB [14:19] persia: it install a grub boot loader ? we can make multi-boot ? [14:22] DNis: I think so, but I've not tried a dual-boot configuration. [14:24] persia: ok thx for your answers [14:24] persia: it's in rc state so the release is very soon ? [14:25] DNis: As soon as possible. Still a few things to fix. [14:28] persia: ok thx a lot again [14:29] DNis: Does it work? Please share your experience, so we can update the wiki if the HTC Shift supported. [14:32] persia: mine is not already in my hand but shipping. but i will do if you want as soon as i have it [14:36] DNis: Excellent. Thanks. [14:37] persia: you are a developer on the project ? [14:37] DNis: Yes, although that doesn't necessarily mean I'm right about everything :) [14:39] persia: ok ;-) [14:53] mvo: No need to build a special mode for UpdateManager in a hurry. synaptic will be fine (although thanks for all your help not using synaptic for update-manager) [15:00] mvo: I don't think we need any changes from you right now; we'll just call as a backend [15:00] (like persia just said) [15:01] (sorry just got to the backlog of this afternoon) [15:01] :) [15:01] ok [15:23] Does anyone know where the path is getting set in the UME session? [15:23] if its like in desktop it should come from /etc/environment [15:24] ogra: That's what I thought, but it doesn't. There's a hack somewhere, which needs elimination. [15:24] yeah, sounds like [15:25] any ~/.*rc files [15:25] ? [15:25] That's why time-admin can't install even when it has it's dependencies. [15:25] Nope. Not in ~/.?* [15:25] gnomerc is a typical desktop ENV mangling file [15:26] /etc/bash.bashrc ? [15:27] ogra: It's not in one of the standard places. This is a hack :) [15:27] meh [15:28] Unfortunately, unlike many hacks, `grep PATH $(dpkg -L ume-config-common)` doesn't help :( [15:28] grep -r PATH /etc/* [15:28] ? [15:31] ogra: Thanks for pushing me to the simple, instead of my chasing the complex for hours :) [15:31] :) [15:50] cgregan: What's the boot time constraint again? [15:51] is it possible to run ubuntu-mobile on via epia ? [15:51] lool: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/astoria/+spec/3.3.7-performance [15:52] cgregan: So we're slightly above with -18 [15:52] http://people.ubuntu.com/~lool/bootcharts/crownbeach/hardy-20080605-1.png [15:52] Let me grab -19 [15:52] amitk: No meta for -19 yet? [15:53] lool: in the new queue [15:54] stgraber: thanks [15:55] cgregan: NB this is with HT [15:55] cgregan: It's probably worse without [16:05] cgregan: Check the -3 png, it's with -19 [16:06] 32 seconds. [16:06] that's pretty good === cgregan is now known as cgregan_ === cgregan_ is now known as cgregan [16:35] mvo: I tracked down the larger issue with gst-package and synaptic. [16:36] When the user is logged in normally, they get ENV_PATH from /etc/login.defs. [16:36] This becomes ENV_SUPATH when they use sudo or gksu. [16:36] Since moving to policyKit for g-s-t, /usr/sbin isn't in the path, so it doesn't find synaptic. [16:37] I suspect other synaptic-callers might have the same issue, although I've not looked at them all. [16:37] /usr/sbin should always be in the path ... thats not polkit specific [16:38] ogra: It's not defined in ENV_PATH in login.defs even on a standard Ubuntu Desktop install. [16:38] Only for ENV_SUPATH. [16:38] I thought the path came from /etc/environment, but appaprently that's not always so. [16:39] $PATH will override that [16:39] and its usually in environment ... [16:39] just add the proper one there and it should work [16:39] else you have deeper probs [16:39] ogra: At what point? PATH isn't force defined anywhere in the login sequence, and login assigns either ENV_PATH or ENV_SUPATH depending on the login. [16:40] I think there are deeper issues, as I can replicate the confusion on my desktop [16:40] well, just add the ubuntu standard value to /etc/environment [16:41] ogra: It's already there [16:41] (note also that /etc/environment only gets read at boot) [16:41] re-login wont help [16:41] Yeah, but it was there from image-creation time. [16:41] hmm [16:41] weird [16:42] You're sure it's not with the switch to polkit? With sudo and gksu I get the right path. [16:42] s/with/related to/ [16:43] well, i can call all apps with gksu here [16:43] I can call all apps with gksu on my image, just not as the default user. [16:43] (not using gksu). [16:43] When the app doesn't use policyKit, that works great. [16:43] do you have polkit installed ? [16:44] When the app does use PolicyKit, policyKit can't get the session, and so doesn't authenticat. [16:44] i remember you guys adding suport for consolekit [16:44] Hmm. I thought so. I can at least authenticate properly. [16:44] do you see an active session with ck-list-sessions ? [16:45] Yep. libpolkit2 & friends are installed, and ck-list-sessions shows a session. [16:45] active = TRUE [16:45] ? [16:45] Yes. [16:46] and a proper x11-display-device pointing to a tty ? [16:46] else polkit wont accept it as authenticated [16:46] /dev/tty7 [16:47] hmm, looks ok [16:47] http://paste.ubuntu.com/17252/ [16:47] my session for coparison [16:47] polkit seems to work, except that I don't get switched to ENV_SUPATH [16:48] Only differences are that I don't have a real name, and I've been logged in 11 hours less. [16:48] are you in the admin group with that user ? [16:48] (i would assume so since gksu works) [16:48] Yep. [16:50] grep polkituser /etc/passwd ? [16:51] (should be created by the postinst ... pulling straws here) [16:52] polkituser:x:105:109:PolicyKit,,,:/var/tun/PolicyKit:/bin/false [16:52] /var/*tun*? [16:52] So typed out by hand [16:52] /var/run (I'm not using IRC from that device, and copy&paste doesn't work there very well anyway) [16:52] Nah, it's correct onmy desktop [16:52] looks right to me [16:54] ogra@osiris:~$ /usr/bin/polkit-auth|grep systemtools [16:54] org.freedesktop.systemtoolsbackends.set [16:54] do you get that value ? [16:54] Everything looks fine. stracing time-admin shows it to be only checking ENV_PATH and not ENV_SUPATH before reporting that it can't find synaptic, and telling the user it can't install the packages. [16:55] No! It's empty. That's likely it. [16:55] What's supposed to set that, and how? [16:58] so strace time-admin wasnt a good idea :P [16:58] Ah. It does show with --show-obtainable though :( === ogra_ is now known as ogra [16:59] And once obtained, it shows in the grep. [17:00] ogra: strace told me why it couldn't run synaptic (shortened PATH), but not why the PATH was only ENV_PATH. [17:00] I blame policykit, but that might be unfair. [17:00] right, sicne it works here [17:00] #startmeeting [17:00] Meeting started at 11:02. The chair is lool. [17:00] Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] [17:00] it might be that gdm sets up something you dont have [17:00] ogra: Later, and I'll look at it. [17:01] right [17:01] No items from last week, moving to this week [17:01] [topic] * [17:01] [topic] netbook image classmate PC relation (who is resonsible for what, who builds which parts etc) OliverGrawert [17:01] New Topic: * [17:01] New Topic: netbook image classmate PC relation (who is resonsible for what, who builds which parts etc) OliverGrawert [17:01] ogra: floor is yours :) [17:01] well, intel constantly asks me about specs etc in the conf calls [17:02] i tried to actually find out which team is responsible over the last days and seem to run in circles [17:02] Which specs? [17:02] ogra: You aways look like that :) [17:02] been pointed to ume first ... then to lexington and they pointed me to -desktop [17:02] who pointed you for what at where? :) [17:03] lool, i.e. they were told at computex that the netbook iage will only exist for LTS not for later releases [17:03] adam le from intel was told that, dont ask me by whom [17:03] so he forwarded that to me [17:03] The netbook-remix-image being worked on by that team is only targeted at LTS. [17:03] imho it would be really unfortunate to stick with hardy here [17:04] No reason someone can't leverage that and track it for other releases. [17:04] well, that gets me into maitaining half of the cmpc software stack for 3 years in a ppa [17:04] ogra: Well that's what we do so far; if however we have room for a customer interesting in intrepid support, I guess this could be discussed [17:04] persia, my prob is that i need to start development now ... [17:04] but need to know my build target [17:05] and i actually need an image and hardware to run it on ... but thats another story :) [17:05] Aha [17:05] HW shoudl come next week ... one atom cmpc reserved for you guys [17:05] ogra: Shouldn't this question be resolved by your management or canonical management in general rather than Ubuntu specs assignments? [17:06] (currently tareted to go to david, not sure thats the best though) [17:06] lool, well, i want to have a direct connection to my counterpart doing the lowlevel netbook stuff [17:06] for tech work [17:06] but i cant find that counterpart anywhere [17:06] thats the point of my agenda item :) [17:07] Ok; I don't have the answer [17:07] well, that got clear to me when i ran through the supposedly involved teams :) [17:07] nobody seems to have an answer [17:08] ogra: Raise it to management would be my personal recommendation [17:08] i.e. i dont even know if the actual netbook HW spec we agree on matches the minimal cmpc spec [17:08] Dunno, I have seen neither :) [17:08] right, i was hoping rich would be here as well [17:09] well, cmpc is 2G disk, 256M ram [17:09] so you know 50% :) [17:09] I'd be happy to discuss a technical decision, but I feel like you're the only one in touch with the problem at hand [17:09] but well, the topic cant go anywhere ... [17:09] Perhaps it's too early for other UME people to understand the questions at hand? [17:10]