[00:55] <fetova> @now
[00:57]  * pleia2 waves to fetova 
[00:57] <fetova> :D
[00:57] <fetova> hi!
[00:58] <pleia2> glad you could make it
[00:58] <fetova> thanks! I hope so
[00:59]  * chuckf is here
[01:00] <pleia2> welomce chuckf
[01:00] <pleia2> ok, americas council folks?
[01:00] <RoAkSoAx> @schedule lima
[01:00] <chuckf> how are you doing liz?
[01:00] <fetova> yup
[01:01] <pleia2> chuckf: good good :)
[01:01] <fetova> I'm nervious
[01:01] <fetova> :P
[01:01] <pwnguin> its good to be nervous
[01:01] <pleia2> no need to be, we're all friends here :)
[01:01] <fetova> lol
[01:01] <pleia2> effie_jayx?
[01:01] <fetova> it's true
[01:02] <effie_jayx> pleia2,  pong?
[01:02] <pleia2> effie_jayx: meeting time!
[01:02] <effie_jayx> :D
[01:02] <fetova> hi effie_jayx ! :D
[01:02] <effie_jayx> just in time
[01:02] <fetova> :p
[01:03] <chuckf> I heard the radio show you were on, good stuff
[01:03] <pleia2> thank you :)
[01:03] <pleia2> nixternal: you about?
[01:03] <fetova> nice :)
[01:04] <pleia2> encryptz?
[01:04] <chuckf> this is the right day?
[01:04] <pleia2> yep
[01:05] <fetova> I have to thank for people of ubuntu-mx... if don't ask this morning... i don't be here now... :P
[01:06] <fetova> i was thinking it's the thursday... why? i don't know :P
[01:06] <chuckf> I had tomorrow stuck in my head for this
[01:06] <Technoviking> sorry I'm late
[01:06] <fetova> xD
[01:07] <vorian> excellent
[01:07] <pleia2> ok, 4 of us here, that's enough to start :)
[01:07] <pwnguin> heh
[01:07] <chuckf> yay
[01:07] <pleia2> chuckf: go ahead
[01:08] <chuckf> well I'm Chuck and I started the MD ubuntu loco team
[01:08] <chuckf> that's my main contribution to the project
[01:08] <chuckf> I'm around on IRC every so often and help where i can
[01:09] <chuckf> I've been using Ubuntu for a while now as my main system and been playing with linux for over a decade
[01:09] <chuckf> not sure what else you need/want to know
[01:10] <vorian> chuckf: wiki page perhaps?
[01:10] <pleia2> can you discuss some of the work the MD LoCo has been doing?
[01:10] <vorian> :)
[01:10] <chuckf> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ChuckFrain
[01:10] <chuckf> sorry, it was linked from the meeting page and I thought you had it
[01:11] <chuckf> well we've had an inperson meeting every month since being founded last march
[01:11] <chuckf> we've done two install fests, several gatherings
[01:11] <chuckf> we've done a presentation to a windows group
[01:11] <chuckf> a few members have done individual projects using ubuntu
[01:12] <chuckf> we're gearing up to do a usabitily study with Celeste next month
[01:12] <pleia2> have a bugjam planned?
[01:12] <pleia2> oh cool
[01:12] <chuckf> We have a field trip to the NSA museum and gpg keysigning while there in conjunction with a local lug
[01:12] <chuckf> bugjam is planned
[01:12] <pleia2> excellent
[01:12] <chuckf> we have the space and time set
[01:13] <pleia2> and you want to get more into bugs? (I see you have done some work with them already)
[01:13] <chuckf> working on the 'this is what to do with bugs' presentation
[01:13] <effie_jayx> pleia2,  did i JUST MISS THE MEEINTG?
[01:13] <effie_jayx> sorry aout the caps
[01:13] <chuckf> I do QA for a living so yeah, I'll be moving towards that
[01:13] <chuckf> and getting the bugjam stuff set will help with that
[01:14] <chuckf> I'll be setting up a 5-a-day for the md team
[01:14] <chuckf> then we have the SFD stuff in progress as well
[01:14] <pleia2> nice
[01:15] <chuckf> We're doing a presentatin with a local lug next month on GPG then our regular meeting for the loco will be a tutoiral sesstion
[01:15] <chuckf> I think that's about it for the team and what is in progress
[01:16] <chuckf> Oh and the howard county library where we meet
[01:16] <chuckf> they've reached out to us and want to see if we can do some cross promotion
[01:16] <pwnguin> How far do most people travel to make it to meetings?
[01:16] <chuckf> so I'm thinking of finally finishing a project I started a month or so back for a trifold handout
[01:17] <chuckf> We've had people travel about 45 minutes
[01:17] <chuckf> I live about 35 minutes from where the meetings are held, but work in the area
[01:17] <vorian> happy to give a +1, good work chuckf :)
[01:17] <chuckf> thanks!
[01:17] <Technoviking> +1 for me
[01:17] <pleia2> good job chuckf, +1
[01:17] <pleia2> effie_jayx?
[01:18] <chuckf> our library is also featured in the example docs on the Hardy release:)
[01:18] <pleia2> nice
[01:18] <pwnguin> neat
[01:19] <effie_jayx> +1
[01:19] <pleia2> woo, congrats chuckf! :)
[01:19] <vorian> :)
[01:19] <chuckf> yay!
[01:19] <vorian> welcome chuckf :)
[01:20]  * chuckf basks in the approval!
[01:20] <fetova> congrats chuckf :D
[01:20] <pleia2> fetova: you're up, go ahead :)
[01:20] <chuckf> thanks all!
[01:20] <fetova> help!!! xD
[01:20] <fetova> here im go :P
[01:20] <fetova> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FedericoTorres
[01:20] <fetova> my wikipage
[01:21] <fetova> I'm the team leader an contact of ubuntu-mx
[01:21] <fetova> a moderator on #ubuntu-es
[01:21] <fetova> and co-admin the cupie project
[01:21] <fetova> with meisok
[01:22] <fetova> mmm...
[01:22] <fetova> i don't know what to say :P
[01:22] <fetova> better ask :)
[01:22] <pleia2> can you discuss some of the work the Mexican LoCo has been doing? and has planned?
[01:22] <fetova> well...
[01:23] <fetova> we have a own forum, a channel irc, mailing list...
[01:23] <fetova> we give support
[01:23] <fetova> we give two talks on the flisol
[01:23] <fetova> and the consol
[01:24] <fetova> a free software local conference
[01:24] <keffie_jayx> I can attest of his work in the mexican team he is a very  integrating factor in the latin american community
[01:24] <vorian> any plans on fixing the dead links on the Mexican LoCo wiki?
[01:24] <fetova> we are beggining a mentoring program
[01:25] <fetova> vorian, lol
[01:25] <fetova> we have to fill it
[01:25] <vorian> excellent!
[01:25] <fetova> we are planning to be approved
[01:25] <fetova> this sunday are ameeting
[01:25] <marianom> Hi Mariano here, loco team contact for Argentina and ubuntu member since september last year: just wanna say to you guys I know fetova and he works hard not only with the mexican team but he was a great help in Argentina Team too since the beginning
[01:26] <fetova> and one point it's the approving the LoCO
[01:26] <pleia2> marianom: great to know!
[01:26] <fetova> marianom, :D
[01:26] <pleia2> fetova: aside from Argentina, have you mentored other teams as well?
[01:26] <vorian> thanks for that marianom. fetova, any other supporters here?
[01:27] <fetova> pleia2, i begin there :P
[01:27] <fetova> they give me the support to get in on the mexican community
[01:27] <fetova> beuno, marianom, L1pe, some of them
[01:27] <pleia2> fetova: as far as your future goals are concerned, have you made any steps toward starting them?
[01:28] <fetova> yes
[01:28] <fetova> the mexican LoCo... that i comment it before
[01:29] <fetova> the ubuntu distributor... i can now by giving the cd's that i ask for shipping
[01:29] <keffie_jayx> How are you promoting more participation fetova?
[01:29] <fetova> for the ubuntu on my school...
[01:30] <fetova> talking with the persons who I know and annimate them
[01:30] <fetova> giving a nice place to share
[01:31] <fetova> as good as i can
[01:31] <vorian> +1 from me based on solid loco leadership
[01:31] <pleia2> good job fetova, great loco work and mentoring, +1
[01:31] <fetova> thanks vorian :D
[01:31] <fetova> pleia2, :D
[01:32] <Technoviking> +1 here
[01:32] <keffie_jayx> +1
[01:32] <pleia2> congrats fetova!
[01:32] <vorian> congratulations and welcome fetova :)
[01:32] <fetova> Technoviking, keffie_jayx :D
[01:32] <fetova> :D
[01:32] <chuckf> yay fetova!!
[01:32] <marianom> fetova: \0/
[01:32]  * fetova scream!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[01:32] <meisok> fetova: enhorabuena !! ;)
[01:32] <pleia2> SEJeff doesn't appear to be here
[01:32] <pwnguin> It's a bit unfair to ask people to ensure they can make it to a meeting before adding themselves to the agenda, and then only giving them three days notice (beneath a sign saying "Beware of Leopard"). That might explain SEJeff's dissapparance :(
[01:32] <fetova> gracias marianom y meisok :D
[01:33] <pleia2> pwnguin: we don't require attendence
[01:33] <pleia2> pwnguin: if you miss, you just get the next meeting :)
[01:33] <pleia2> anyway
[01:33] <pleia2> pwnguin: you're up!
[01:33] <pwnguin> sure
[01:33] <pwnguin> My name is Justin Dugger and I've been helping Ubuntu for two years now.
[01:33] <pwnguin> I participate in testing, xorg bug triage and the toshiba-tablet team. I also keep a blog on technical subjects related to Ubuntu. My wiki (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JustinDugger) and LP page (https://edge.launchpad.net/~jldugger) have a detail on my contributions to Ubuntu.
[01:33] <Technoviking> pwnguin: I change the wiki 4 days ago I believe
[01:33] <pwnguin> I just edited my wiki page at :25 after to fix some LP links, so you might want to reload.
[01:34] <pwnguin> Technoviking: sure, but when I ask people to appear on my behalf, it's a bit nerve wrecking to tell them to reschedule
[01:34] <pwnguin> also, though I doubt it counts for much, I am the author of #22 on bash.org --> http://bash.org/?22
[01:34] <pwnguin> :)
[01:34] <pwnguin> I've asked Bryce Herrington to speak on behalf of my contributions.
[01:34] <pwnguin> bryce?
[01:34] <pleia2> pwnguin: what's your launchpad link?
[01:35] <pwnguin> doh
[01:35] <pwnguin> I've asked Bryce Herrington to speak on behalf of my contributions.
[01:35] <pwnguin> arg paste
[01:35] <pwnguin> https://launchpad.net/~jldugger
[01:35]  * pwnguin shakes fist at LP url redirection
[01:35] <bryce> hi
[01:36] <bryce> pwnguin has been a very valuable participant in the ubuntu-x team, and I would heartily recommend him for membership
[01:36] <pleia2> bryce: ubuntu-x ?
[01:37] <bryce> pleia2: the Xorg maintenance community
[01:37] <pleia2> gotcha
[01:37] <bryce> pwnguin helps with bug triage, answering user questions, and so on, which helps a great deal
[01:37] <pwnguin> i also fire up gdb on occasion
[01:38] <pwnguin> but i find that the xorg guys know more about the byzantine depths of xkb than i problably ever will
[01:38] <pleia2> pwnguin: your wiki page doesn't list any future plans, what do you have in store?
[01:38] <pwnguin> well, in the future I'd like to continue my work with toshiba-tablet
[01:38] <pwnguin> as well as bug triage
[01:39] <pwnguin> tablet and wacom support is critical to getting more artists involved with ubuntu, I think
[01:40] <pleia2> pwnguin: how long have you been working with ubuntu?
[01:40] <pwnguin> lets see, i think the laptop testing page i maintain was started in october of 2006
[01:41] <pwnguin> reporting bugs, probably a bit older
[01:41] <pwnguin> my first ubuntu install was in 2005
[01:41] <pwnguin> i used debian before that :)
[01:41]  * pleia2 nods
[01:41] <pleia2> ever contribute to debian?
[01:41] <pwnguin> on occasion
[01:41] <pwnguin> i subscribe to the FingerForce debian team
[01:42] <pwnguin> but since i dont have a debian install, i dont think its wise to send bug reports to them
[01:42] <pleia2> well keep up the good work, it's great to see someone so active it bugs with an intention of doing more :) +1 from me
[01:43] <vorian> I'm happy to +1, based on great feedback and good work
[01:43] <pwnguin> i did try sending some patches to the debian thinkfinger maintainer, but he was a bit less ... pragmatic
[01:43] <pleia2> pwnguin: heh, yeah, I know how that can go
[01:43] <keffie_jayx> +1 great bug and x work
[01:44] <Technoviking> +1 from me
[01:44] <pleia2> congrats pwnguin!
[01:44] <vorian> welcome pwnguin :)
[01:44] <pwnguin> thank you everyone. If I might make a request to the council, going forward can we please establish a 7 day head notice on meetings?
[01:44] <vorian> hmm
[01:44] <vorian> -1
[01:44] <chuckf> yay pwnguin!!!!
[01:44] <pwnguin> heh
[01:44] <fetova> :O
[01:45] <pleia2> pwnguin: we'll consider it, given people's schedules
[01:45] <pleia2> pwnguin: thanks for your suggestion
[01:45] <vorian> :)
[01:45] <pleia2> ok, meeting over
[01:45] <pleia2> thanks everyone :)
[01:45] <chuckf> or recommend subscribing to the page to keep up with changes
[01:45] <pwnguin> pleia2: sure. i like to see teams flow smoothly :)
[01:45] <vorian> pwnguin: sorry if it was an inconvenience for you to get 4 of us together on one night.
[01:46] <pwnguin> well hey, im not inconvinenced
[01:46] <vorian> then why complain?
[01:46] <vorian> who's next? :)
[01:46] <pleia2> that's it!
[01:47] <pwnguin> but you know, i dont like telling core devs to show up and waste time. its not about me, but about improving how ubuntu works :P
[01:47] <Technoviking> night all
[01:47] <pwnguin> just a suggestion
[01:47] <pleia2> pwnguin: thanks :)
[01:47]  * pleia2 remebers what a chore it was when she got approved
[01:47] <pleia2> and then they almost stopped the meeting right before me! :O
[01:48] <pwnguin> hahgah
[01:48] <pleia2> it wasn't funny! I was so nervous!
[01:48] <pleia2> hehe
[01:48]  * chuckf missed several meetings that were scheduled the same day
[01:48] <pleia2> anyway, off to dinner
[01:48] <pleia2> thanks everyone, congrats again chuckf, fetova and pwnguin!
[01:48] <pwnguin> i just figured since it's a new process, feedback was welcome
[01:48] <fetova> :D
[01:48] <pleia2> pwnguin: it is, thanks :)
[01:48] <pwnguin> i guess i was wrong (vorian :P)
[01:48] <chuckf> thanks liz
[01:48] <fetova> thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
[01:48] <fetova> :D
[01:49]  * fetova wants to flood with ":D"
[01:49] <fetova> :p
[01:49] <chuckf> heh
[01:49] <fetova> chuckf, :D
[01:49] <pwnguin> again, thanks everyone and good luck in the future!
[01:50] <fetova> same!!!!!!
[04:58] <ApOgEE-> greetings all
[17:58]  * pedro_ waves
[17:58] <ara> :-)
[17:58] <ara> hey
[17:58] <pedro_> hi heno, ara
[17:58] <heno> hey ara, pedro_ :)
[17:58] <pedro_> ehhe
[17:59] <heno> bdmurray, sbeattie ping?
[17:59] <davmor2> evening everybody :)
[17:59] <bdmurray> Hello all
[18:00] <sbeattie> Hey
[18:00] <heno> I've pinged cgregan
[18:00] <heno> let's give him a minute
[18:02] <Flare183> There his is
[18:02] <pedro_> oops split
[18:02] <Flare183> pedro_: yeap
[18:02] <ara> oops
[18:02] <Flare183> he*
[18:02] <heno> ok, we can start
[18:02] <heno> #startmeeting
[18:03] <pedro_> no bot?
[18:03]  * davmor2 hit's bot with big hammer
[18:03] <heno> [TOPIC]: Outstanding items from last meeting.
[18:03] <heno> always a good agenda item - but we should also start keeping a list :)
[18:04]  * stgraber waves
[18:05] <Flare183> another netsplit
[18:05] <heno> "In a few minutes I'm going to be rebooting one of our main us hubs. This will mean some splitting, but things should come back together rather quickly. Thank you for your patience, and thank you for using freenode!" -- apparently
[18:05] <ogra> it was announced
[18:06] <heno> let's take 5 minutes to read the log from the last meeting in the meantime
[18:10] <davmor2> yay bot is back and everyone else too :)
[18:11] <heno> ok, cool
[18:11] <heno> let's try to continue
[18:11] <heno> #startmeeting
[18:12] <nickellery> @schedule Vancouver
[18:12] <heno> not quite :)
[18:12]  * pedro_ kicks the bot
[18:12] <heno> #startmeeting
[18:12] <heno> ...
[18:12] <stgraber> the meeting bot isn't here
[18:12] <heno> topic: Outstanding items from last meeting
[18:13] <heno> meh :(
[18:13] <heno> I don't see any major outstanding issues
[18:14] <davmor2> see pedro_ that's what happens when you kick the bot :)
[18:14] <heno> mgunes has posted in the forums about SRU testing
[18:14] <pedro_> davmor2: haha, see it works better than your hammer :-P
[18:14] <heno> topic: New starter Ara Pulido
[18:14] <heno> everyone welcome ara
[18:14] <davmor2> welcome Ara
[18:14]  * cgregan waves to Ara
[18:15] <pedro_> welcome ara!
[18:15]  * pedro_ hugs ara
[18:15] <heno> who will be working on desktop test automation
[18:15] <ara> thanks
[18:15] <stgraber> welcome ara
[18:15] <sbeattie> welcome ara! \o/
[18:16] <heno> I'm sure we'l see interesting testing projects evolving in the next few weeks and months
[18:16] <heno> We are focusing on LTSP scripting this time
[18:17] <ara> LDTP?
[18:17]  * ogra listens up
[18:17] <stgraber> s/LTSP/LDTP/ imho
[18:17] <heno> contributions are also very welcome once we have a few basics in place
[18:17] <ogra> :)
[18:17] <davmor2> I was beginning to wonder :)
[18:17] <stgraber> even if having more coders for LTSP would be interesting too :)
[18:17] <heno> ara, stgraber: just testing :)
[18:17] <ogra> yea :)
[18:17] <ara> haha
[18:18] <heno> btw, stgraber is our local LTSP expert along with ogra
[18:18] <heno> moving on
[18:18] <heno> topic: 8.04.1 status
[18:18] <heno> according to http://people.ubuntu.com/~sbeattie/sru_todo.html we are down to 21 targets now
[18:19] <heno> only one appears to be hw-specific, which is good
[18:19] <sbeattie> nss and nspr are actually false positives, I believe.
[18:19] <heno> ok
[18:19] <davmor2> heno: wubi is getting some love too so hopefully that should work better for .1
[18:19] <ara> when is the point release?
[18:20] <pedro_> middle of july?
[18:20] <heno> sbeattie: you want to give a 2-line update from your POV?
[18:20] <sbeattie> davmor2: yeah, thanks for Wubi testing!
[18:20] <heno> I think we are aiming for early July
[18:21] <davmor2> sbeattie: It's what I do :)
[18:21] <sbeattie> Summary: SRU validation seems to be going along pretty well, made good progress with SRU Bug Hud day yesterday.
[18:21] <sbeattie> Thanks to all who participated!
[18:21] <pedro_> ara: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IntrepidReleaseSchedule
[18:21] <heno> I don't think we have committed to a date, but before the sprint AFAIU
[18:21] <sbeattie> July 3rd was the last date I heard.
[18:21] <heno> right
[18:21] <sbeattie> Which is coming up fast.
[18:22] <heno> that's the target
[18:22] <pedro_> we have a different one on the QA Schedule btw
[18:22] <heno> we'll see how that goes
[18:22] <sbeattie> right.
[18:22] <heno> oh?
[18:22] <pedro_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/IntrepidSchedule <- points to be July 10th
[18:22] <heno> As the QA team we should have a clear view on whether it's ready
[18:23] <davmor2> it ain't ready ;)
[18:23] <sbeattie> pedro_: ah, yeah, the alpha2 and 8.04.1 switching weeks with other has not been reflected there.
[18:23] <heno> and if we feel elements are not we should advocate a) a delay or b) they some updates are left out
[18:23] <davmor2> I think the 10th will be more realistic
[18:23] <bdmurray> cjwatson swapped alpha 2 and 8.04.1 on the 18th
[18:24] <bdmurray> I'll subscribe to main release schedule and update the QA team one as necessary
[18:24] <heno> it would of course be good if the process were not blocked on us at that point ;)
[18:24] <davmor2> I won't be here blame sbeattie ;)
[18:24] <heno> thanks sbeattie for the summary
[18:25] <heno> next
[18:25] <heno> topic: Evaluation and Future of Hug Days
[18:25] <heno> the activity seems to have slowed down a bit the past few weeks
[18:25] <sbeattie> summer lull?
[18:25] <pedro_> sbeattie: seems so
[18:26] <heno> which I think is mainly due to it being summer
[18:26] <heno> so I suggest we scale back to one day for now
[18:26] <heno> when should we aim to resume 2? just after the bug jam or Septemberish?
[18:27] <ara> bug jam?
[18:27] <bdmurray> I think after the global bug jam would be good
[18:27] <heno> Feature Freeze is Aug 28th
[18:28] <davmor2> After feature freeze is good less major changes
[18:28] <heno> ara: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GlobalBugJam
[18:28] <pedro_> yup that's a good date
[18:28] <ara> ta
[18:28] <heno> pedro_: which? bj or ff?
[18:28] <stgraber> after FF sounds good
[18:29] <pedro_> heno: after FF
[18:30] <heno> ok let's aim for after FF - with the option of picking it up after the BJ if there is a surge in interest
[18:30] <heno> any other topics today?
[18:30] <bdmurray> which day for the one a week bug day?
[18:30] <pedro_> not from me
[18:31] <heno> I would prefer Thursdays
[18:31] <ara> can anyone point me to the wiki page where bug days have their schedule?
[18:31] <heno> as I have a ton of meetings on tuesdays
[18:31] <heno> but I'm not fussed
[18:32] <pedro_> yeah i tend to be a bit swamped the first days of the week (lot of bugmail to read)
[18:32] <pedro_> Thursdays are also good for me
[18:32] <bdmurray> Thursday is fine with me
[18:32] <sbeattie> works for me.
[18:32] <heno> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay is the main bug day page, but it has no schedule
[18:33] <cgregan> Between 12 and 3 I am booked solid, but other than that
[18:33] <heno> it has tended to be every tues and thurs
[18:33] <cgregan> EST
[18:33] <davmor2> the wiki has been updated for mobile-builder
[18:33] <heno> it has the next day listed though
[18:34] <heno> but is out of date :)
[18:34] <pedro_> do you think it would be a good idea to start asking for help on setting up the hug day page at the bugsquad list or in the bugcontrol one?
[18:34] <pedro_> for having more participation from the community
[18:34] <heno> so a QA team meeting page type schedule would be good on that page
[18:35] <pedro_> otherwise some of them didn't even noticed that there's a hug day
[18:35] <ara> yes, that would be helpful
[18:35] <bdmurray> I've asked in the past, I think the last sprint, and no one was interested
[18:35] <heno> should we just ask a few individuals directly?
[18:35] <cgregan> davmor2: :-)
[18:36] <davmor2> cgregan: KVM build mean 1 line to build :)
[18:36] <pedro_> heno: yep that would work better, we have a few core members that we can ask for help
[18:36] <davmor2> add the ppa to the repos and then add the app:)
[18:37] <heno> pedro_: will you take an action to try that?
[18:37] <pedro_> heno: sure, i'll do it
[18:37] <heno> ok great
[18:37] <heno> any further topics?
[18:38] <bdmurray> I've been working on the wiki a fair bit and my .moin_aliases file is quite long now.  Would anyone be interested in sharing these somehow?
[18:38] <heno> bdmurray: what does that do exactly?
[18:39] <bdmurray> a moin_aliases file is just shortcuts to wiki pages
[18:39]  * heno should probably know having helped set up the Ubuntu wiki
[18:39] <sbeattie> that'd be useful.
[18:39] <bdmurray> so you can use editmoin debug-usplash
[18:39] <heno> ok
[18:39] <bdmurray> and it'll expand to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingUsplash
[18:39] <ara> that is helpful :-)
[18:40] <sbeattie> bdmurray: though perhaps you're the biggest/sole user of ~/.moin_aliases, apparentl7.
[18:40] <heno> should we set up a bzr branch?
[18:40] <davmor2> bdmurray: I didn't get chance to play with any images in the end :(
[18:40] <bdmurray> It seems silly for one file but the best idea at the same time
[18:41] <sbeattie> well, should we have a bzr branch for generally useful qa things?
[18:41] <sbeattie> (not sure what else should go in that yet)
[18:41] <bdmurray> leann and I set one up for canonical specific things, however a general bugsquad one might be good too
[18:42] <heno> that could include the vim bug day script too
[18:42] <bdmurray> Throwing in the bugs mailing list scripts might be good too
[18:42] <davmor2> sbeattie: it could include the script for dl-ing the isos
[18:42] <davmor2> too
[18:42] <heno> and greasemonkey scripts perhaps
[18:42] <sbeattie> davmor2: excellent suggestion!
[18:42] <ara> cool, that would save a lot of time to new starters ;-)
[18:42] <heno> oh, lots of good ideas :)
[18:42] <bdmurray> the greasemonkey scripts are a separate project, which I really think is best
[18:43] <bdmurray> As thought might want to be used by other launchpad projects
[18:43] <heno> bdmurray: can you organise this?
[18:43] <ara> i can imagine myself trying to do something and after a couple of hours someone saying "but we already have a script for that"
[18:43] <ara> :D
[18:43] <bdmurray> heno: sure
[18:43] <davmor2> ara: we did say just ask ;)
[18:43] <heno> perhaps we should also set up an ubuntu-qa LP team again so devs can find us
[18:44] <sbeattie> Oh, as an aside, I should mention laserjock/Jordan Mantha and I have set up an sru-tools project: https://launchpad.net/sru-tools
[18:44] <heno> I was in a motu sru meeting where several people claimed that Ubuntu QA did not exist because we were not in LP :)
[18:44] <sbeattie> heno: agreed, or rename canonical-qa LP team
[18:45] <heno> sbeattie: canonical-qa has a separate function
[18:45] <heno> relating to bugs escalated from support etc
[18:45] <davmor2> heno: there you go the second tier to iso testers :)
[18:45] <sbeattie> heno: Oh! Makes sense. And now I understand the bugs I get being subscribed to that team. :-)
[18:46] <bdmurray> lol
[18:46] <heno> should we make it hierarchical or just an umbrella team?
[18:46] <pedro_> haha
[18:46] <heno> heh
[18:46] <pedro_> an umbrella is ok
[18:46] <heno> so people in bug control and testing are members - bugsquad too?
[18:47] <pedro_> yup, they're part of the ubuntu-qa ;-)
[18:47] <bdmurray> Hrm, bug control would be every developer then
[18:47] <heno> hm, so perhaps only bugsquad?
[18:47] <ara> i am not in any of those teams yet
[18:47] <bdmurray> heno: what is the point of the team again?
[18:48] <heno> bdmurray: to raise our visibility as a QA team in he dev community and host common tools like that bzr branch
[18:49] <persia> I'd suggest including bugcontrol won't hurt.  It might be nice if more developers were reminded that they are also QA.
[18:49] <davmor2> ara: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Isoscript
[18:49] <davmor2> for the dl script :)
[18:50] <ara> :-) thanks davmor2
[18:51] <sbeattie> Perhaps related, are there other things we should be doing to raise our visibility and encourage more community participation?
[18:51] <heno> will this cause lots of spam if people start assigning/subscribing bugs to ubuntu-qa?
[18:51] <heno> which will happen
[18:51] <persia> Only if there isn't also an ubuntu-qa mailing list.
[18:52] <heno> which we don't really want to flood with bugmail
[18:52] <persia> For Ubuntu Universe Sponsors we created a mailing list, with optional subscription.  Those members who like bugmail subscribe, and those that consider it spam don't.
[18:52] <persia> Could be ubuntu-qa-bugs...
[18:52] <bdmurray> persia: is than an lp mailing list or not?
[18:53] <persia> bdmurray: For UUS, it's an ubuntuwire list (UUS predates LP MLs)
[18:53] <heno> though that makes it seem like we _want_ people assigning/subscribing bugs to ubuntu-qa :)
[18:53] <heno> and we haven't defined the purpose of that yet
[18:54] <persia> It will happen anyway (currently happens for MOTU), but can be discouraged.  Active people will learn, and the rest will go away.
[18:55] <heno> cgregan: you've set up a bunch of LP teams recently; could you look into possible structures for this and their implications?
[18:55] <heno> then we can consider a few options at the next meeting (and whether we need this at all)
[18:56] <cgregan> heno: sure
[18:56] <heno> thanks
[18:56] <persia> I think it has PR value, even if it's essentially useless for coordination.
[18:56] <heno> could well be
[18:56] <heno> #endmeeting
[18:56] <heno> thanks everyone
[18:57] <pedro_> thanks!
[18:57] <sbeattie> thanks!
[18:57] <ara> thanks!
[18:57] <davmor2> thanks back :)
[18:57] <stgraber> thanks!
[22:59] <calc> hello
[22:59] <TheMuso> greetings folks.
[22:59] <bryce> heya all
[23:00] <liw> blessings be on this channel
[23:00] <james_w> hi all
[23:00] <cjwatson> dia duit
[23:00]  * ogra waves
[23:00] <evand> hi
[23:01]  * asac arrives 
[23:01] <asac> victory ;)
[23:01] <cjwatson> so, sorry for the lack of agenda this week; I have been rather busy with belated reviews and such, as some of you have noticed ;-)
[23:02] <slangasek> :)
[23:02] <calc> heh
[23:02] <james_w> I wonder if doko will be late due to celebrating his goal.
[23:02] <asac> his goal?
[23:02] <cjwatson> I haven't normally done a roll-call for these meetings, but I thought it might be worth asking if there are other folks around here who want to register themselves as present for the platform meeting; this isn't intended to be a closed meeting
[23:02] <doko> heh, stopped the turks before the gates of Vienna, again ;-)
[23:03] <james_w> yeah, M. Klose scored the second.
[23:03]  * asac hugs doko
[23:03] <asac> hehe
[23:03] <cjwatson> ArneGoetje: around?
[23:03] <doko> don't expect me to be sober ...
[23:04] <asac> doko: i know what you mean ;)
[23:04]  * ajmitch is present but lurking at work :)
[23:05] <ArneGoetje> cjwatson: here
[23:05] <cjwatson> ok, great
[23:05] <doko> so it looks like we won't finish the merges in time
[23:06] <cjwatson> that was in fact the only thing I had to discuss
[23:06]  * ogra cant look at hotkey-setup anymore but will finish it tomorrow
[23:06] <cjwatson> there are 49 remaining main merges
[23:06] <liw> I have been very bad at helping with merges :(
[23:06] <slangasek> I have been very bad at sponsoring the merges liw helped with
[23:06] <cjwatson> many of which are "assigned" to people here
[23:06] <liw> cjwatson, subtract procps
[23:06] <bryce> slangasek mentioned that we're in freeze for alpha1 now, though?
[23:06] <cjwatson> noted
[23:07]  * TheMuso is almost done with the initramfs-tools merge. Should have it done by the end of this morning my time.
[23:07] <cjwatson> slangasek: we probably ought to resolve that conflict ...
[23:07] <ogra> if i ever get over th ehotkey stuff i'll grab some more tomorrow
[23:08] <cjwatson> is there anyone here who has merges assigned to them that they feel they cannot do in time?
[23:08] <cjwatson> if not, we can parcel out the others
[23:08] <liw> I have nothing assigned to me, I've looked at low-hanging fruit today (devscripts and debiantuils seems simple)
[23:09] <asac> cjwatson: i wont do enigmail now as i have to do the latest upstream releases in debian first.
[23:09] <liw> I'll work on those and more tomorrow, assuming there's still time
[23:09] <slangasek> if folks can squeeze in some ISO testing today, we ought to be able to get alpha1 out the door in < 24h and let the merges through right behind?
[23:09] <cjwatson> asac: how about epiphany-extensions and network-manager-applet?
[23:09] <slangasek> (for whatever value of "today" fits your timezone)
[23:09] <james_w> lvm2 is still on my plate, no reaction from the maintainer, so I guess it's time to package the new upstream directly.
[23:09] <calc> slangasek: is vmware testing useful, or do you want mostly bare metal?
[23:09] <asac> nm-applet will go for 0.7 so i skipped it
[23:09] <cjwatson> slangasek: a bit of a sprint, but I suppose that's theoretically doable
[23:10] <slangasek> calc: vmware is perfectly fine
[23:10] <doko> hmm, didn't notice the alpha freeze; please don't accept gpm from NEW before alpha1 is released
[23:10] <calc> slangasek: ok i'll take a look at some after dinner tonight, setting up downloads now :)
[23:10] <cjwatson> slangasek: I didn't think we wanted to freeze in Launchpad for the milestone, though?
[23:10] <slangasek> cjwatson: well, we know we're not releasing desktop images, and I think we can also forego DVDs, which cuts our image set by more than 50%
[23:10] <asac> cjwatson: ephy + extensions will receive multiple upstream uploads this release too. i can do them, though i dont think its really worthwhile
[23:11] <cjwatson> asac: ok
[23:11] <slangasek> cjwatson: the "freeze" I mentioned to bryce was solely that I asked him kindly to not make xserver-xorg-video-all depend on any more new packages in universe ;)
[23:11] <liw> ISO testing... I know how to do that!
[23:12] <cjwatson> slangasek: right, just that without that we simply get to assume that merges will be safe or that the images we already have will be OK; we can't really do a "let merges through" process without a technical freeze
[23:12] <asac> slangasek: i looked at ncurses. would you mind if i take that merge from you?
[23:12] <cjwatson> now, that may actually be OK
[23:12] <slangasek> cjwatson: right; I didn't mean to imply a technical freeze actually
[23:12] <liw> so, should we do merges, ISO testing, or both? (/me is a Developer with a Very Small Brain)
[23:13] <slangasek> asac: you're welcome to it
[23:13] <slangasek> liw: you're well-positioned to do ISO testing, as I recall :)
[23:13] <liw> slangasek, yes
[23:13] <cjwatson> speaking personally, I plan to do both
[23:13] <calc> also if anyone can help bryce and I track down 185311 feel free :)
[23:14] <asac> bug 185311
[23:14] <TheMuso> slangasek: I think we can safely say studio is nowhere nearly ready for any alpha, due to linux-rt breakaage on our disks.
[23:14] <calc> i have tried to reproduce the bug on both of my machines and in vmware and can't
[23:14] <cjwatson> ISO testing (particularly alternate/server) is feasible to do in the background
[23:14] <cjwatson> particularly if you're doing it in qemu as I will be, since kvm is busted for intrepid right now ... takes forever
[23:14] <TheMuso> cjwatson: Busted on the guest side, or the host side?
[23:14] <slangasek> TheMuso: ok; I'd be happy to work with you guys to get studio straightened out if you thought it was possible, but I'll also admit I'm relieved if I don't have to for this round
[23:15] <cjwatson> TheMuso: guest side, my host hasn't changed
[23:15] <bryce> calc: I have a package pending to just revert the XCB support from libx11; I'm wondering if that may let us work around the issue sufficiently?
[23:15]  * ogra will do the alternate ltsp tests as usual
[23:15] <TheMuso> cjwatson: Damn, I was going to use it also. :)
[23:15] <calc> the openoffice.org related part of the bug seems to happen for a user on their main account but if they create a new one it doesn't happen in that one
[23:15] <cjwatson> slangasek: I think we should go for Ubuntu plus whatever else happens to work, and not worry about stragglers
[23:15] <calc> bryce: hopefully :)
[23:15] <slangasek> cjwatson: <nod>
[23:15] <cjwatson> it's only alpha-1, and since desktop CDs won't work anyway ...
[23:15] <TheMuso> slangasek: Well its to do with the big kernel shakeup thats going on, I'm not sure where RT fits into it yet.
[23:15] <calc> bryce: the bug is really strange from what i have been able to confirm from people who see it happen
[23:15] <slangasek> TheMuso: ah, if it's that level of breakage, then yeah
[23:16] <bryce> calc, it'd be really helpful if we could get someone to test the libx11 packages I did
[23:16] <cjwatson> so, re merges, I'm going to assume that desktop team members will get theirs sorted (and check up on that tomorrow)
[23:16] <cjwatson> I'm also going to ask StevenK about his
[23:16] <bryce> calc, http://people.ubuntu.com/~bryce/Testing/libx11/
[23:16] <calc> bryce: i think there was mention of someone testing some packages plus intrepid in LP
[23:16] <calc> bryce: not sure if they are the new ones
[23:17] <ogra> cjwatson, i pinged him already but he ignored me being busy with image builder stuff  :)
[23:17] <calc> bryce: maybe try contacting the person who did the full set of tests to try the new debs
[23:17] <bryce> calc, ok we can discuss more on #ubuntu-devel post-meeting
[23:17] <ogra> same for agolivera
[23:17] <calc> bryce: ok
[23:18] <cjwatson> that leaves: libselinux, libsepol, backuppc, cdrkit, emacs22, git-core, gnome-desktop-sharp2, gnome-user-docs, gnumeric, goffice, kernel-wedge, libx86, lockfile-progs, lynx, mono-tools, netcat-openbsd, openoffice.org-en-au, multipath-tools
[23:18] <ogra> MacSlow seemsd to be on gnumeric and goffice
[23:18] <cjwatson> kernel-wedge has slipped cycles before and it won't kill us for it to happen again; it's more important for the kernel guys to have a vague idea of what's going on
[23:19] <asac> cjwatson: i
[23:19] <ogra> but i'm not sure if he gave up
[23:19] <cjwatson> emacs22 is packaged independently, as I recall
[23:19] <asac> looked at git-core, it fails in some git-svn tests
[23:19] <asac> didnt have time to look
[23:19] <doko> I'll look at cdrkit
[23:19] <liw> cjwatson, I've filed a sync request for lockfile-progs
[23:19] <doko> and lynx
[23:19] <cjwatson> doko: you're off tomorrow, aren't you?
[23:19] <asac> anyone knows about problems of perl svn bindings?
[23:19] <cjwatson> liw: I don't see it - is it waiting for sponsorship?
[23:20] <doko> cjwatson: I'm leaving at 8am, there's plenty of time =)
[23:20] <slangasek> lockfile-progs appears to be awaiting sponsorship
[23:20] <slangasek> from me
[23:20] <liw> cjwatson, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lockfile-progs/+bug/243075
[23:20] <cjwatson> liw: did you see bug 242086?
[23:20] <doko> however I still don't understand the scrollkeeper build failure
[23:20] <cjwatson> seemed to suggest it needed a new change in order to build
[23:21] <liw> cjwatson, hm, no, I didn't
[23:21] <cjwatson> gnome-desktop-sharp2 and gnome-user-docs should be left to the desktop guys, and might fall under the gnome exception?
[23:21] <liw> my launchpad search-fu needs updating
[23:22] <slangasek> liw, cjwatson: I'll take care of resolving lockfile-progs then
[23:22] <liw> slangasek, cool
[23:22] <james_w> I can take netcat-openbsd if no-one else has done it, seem straightforward.
[23:22] <slangasek> I wonder if ScottK was interested in taking care of the selinux merges?
[23:23] <ogra> he's in -server atm
[23:24] <cjwatson> calc: can you sort out openoffice.org-en-au?
[23:24] <calc> cjwatson: yea will take a look at it and the other ooo packages
[23:24] <cjwatson> that leaves: backuppc, libx86, mono-tools, multipath-tools
[23:24] <cjwatson> I'll take libx86
[23:24] <calc> cjwatson: iirc i still need to sort out some of the other language related packages for their dependencies
[23:24] <ogra> slangasek, <ScottK> ogra: If I do it I only promise a minimal diff from Debian.  I don't know enough to get them working.
[23:24] <calc> eg not properly falling back to language-support-*
[23:24] <cjwatson> calc: yes, you do
[23:25] <cjwatson> (I poked a bug about that earlier today IIRC)
[23:25] <calc> ah ok
[23:25] <asac> cjwatson: unless something unexpected happens with regards to this weeks ffox updates, i can take mono-tools
[23:25] <slangasek> ogra: coreutils links against them, I think he'll succeed in getting them "working" ;)
[23:25] <james_w> I can take backuppc as well I think
[23:26] <ogra> heh
[23:26] <cjwatson> I'll bug soren about multipath-tools and his other merges
[23:26] <calc> i'm not sure if it is just my connection but cdimage.u.c seems really slow right now
[23:26] <james_w> mono-tools too
[23:26] <asac> james_w: ok go ahead then with mono-tools ;)
[23:27] <cjwatson> calc: it is often thus, yes, I'm afraid
[23:27] <cjwatson> one of the things on my list is to talk with elmo about breaking up cdimage
[23:27] <calc> ok
[23:27] <calc> i'm only getting ~ 32KB/s right now, so i am not sure if it will be done in time to do iso testing today
[23:28] <cjwatson> I can imagine hacks such as fetching it DC-locally to chinstrap and scping from there
[23:28] <cjwatson> although I couldn't possibly recommend that
[23:28] <calc> lol
[23:28] <cjwatson> (this is on the assumption that DC-local will be faster ...)
[23:29] <calc> a lot faster
[23:29] <liw> torrents would sort-of be an automatic solution...
[23:29] <doko> calc: we need to come up with a list of OOo issues that we would see being addressed with the next upstream. next week there's the next ESC meeting
[23:29] <cjwatson> we ought to have torrents for those already?
[23:30] <calc> of course scp from chinstrap is also slow :-\]
[23:30] <cjwatson> doko, calc: can you two set up a phone call to talk about that, maybe?
[23:30] <calc> doko: ok will do, what day is the meeting?
[23:30] <liw> cjwatson, I thought cdimage images didn't have torrent, just rsync and http
[23:30] <cjwatson> liw: they *ought* to have torrent but sometimes it requires IS to go and kick the tracker
[23:31] <cjwatson> err, maybe I'm on crack / out of date
[23:31] <slangasek> mm, we had discussed turning off torrents for dailies because they don't seed fast enough to be a win
[23:31] <calc> ah my connection to chinstrap sped up finally
[23:31] <slangasek> so that might be done
[23:31] <cjwatson> revno: 669
[23:31] <cjwatson> committer: Steve Langasek <steve.langasek@canonical.com>
[23:31] <cjwatson> branch nick: cdimage.vorlon
[23:31] <cjwatson> timestamp: Thu 2008-03-20 02:05:00 -0700
[23:31] <cjwatson> message:
[23:31] <cjwatson>   Drop torrents for daily images; the window when these are usable does not
[23:31] <cjwatson>   warrant the load on the torrent tracker.
[23:31] <liw> that's not what I heard in the qa team, but my memory has more holes than swiss cheese, so...
[23:31] <cjwatson> yeah, you're right, I had forgotten
[23:32] <cjwatson> unfortunately the torrent tracker is a big pile of pants
[23:32] <doko> cjwatson, calc: yes, that should work; we should do that on Fri around 16:00 UTC, if that doesn't work, maybe on Sat
[23:32] <TheMuso> I'll always favour rsync over other methods for daily images anyway.
[23:32] <TheMuso> Personally at least.
[23:32] <calc> doko: ok
[23:32] <cjwatson> jigdo is also workable given a more-local mirror, especially for alternate/server images
[23:32] <cjwatson> in fact, for this case, it might be the best answer
[23:33] <ogra> TheMuso, ++
[23:33] <cjwatson> jigdo-lite http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/current/intrepid-alternate-i386.jigdo and give it the path to a nearby mirror when requested
[23:33] <calc> or filling up chinstrap's disk works as well ;-)
[23:33] <liw> . o O (I wrote a (configurable) script to keep dailies updated from cdimage.u.c, that should perhaps be taught to do jigdo)
[23:33] <TheMuso> liw: So did I, although mine is a little more hard-coded.
[23:33]  * cjwatson keeps a local mirror, so jigdo is especially efficient
[23:34] <cjwatson> but it can't work for desktop CDs
[23:34] <TheMuso> One day I'll make it more flexible. :p
[23:34] <ogra> or take the CDrom you grabbed at UDS, dd it to an iso file and rsync on top of that
[23:34] <liw> TheMuso, mine should be generic and usable for everyone, sbeattie maintains it now
[23:34]  * calc needs to free another 100gb or so he can create a local mirror
[23:34]  * TheMuso has recently set up a local mirror, so of course jigdo makes sense.
[23:35] <calc> TheMuso: how much space does your mirror take?
[23:35] <TheMuso> calc: One second.
[23:35] <liw> calc, mine takes 184 GiB
[23:35] <calc> ah ok i should have enough room soon :)
[23:35] <TheMuso> calc: 123GB, and thats source, i386, amd64, and PowerPC.
[23:36] <liw> that's with dapper, feisty, gutsy, hardy, and intrepid; source, i386, amd64
[23:36] <asac> TheMuso: just a snapshot or even with some history?
[23:36] <TheMuso> calc: 87GB for amd64/i386/source.
[23:36] <calc> ok
[23:36] <TheMuso> calc: Pretty much the latest of whats on archive.ubuntu.com
[23:36] <TheMuso> Oh yeah and mine is hardy and intrepid.
[23:36] <TheMuso> with -proposed and -updates.
[23:36] <TheMuso> and -security
[23:37] <cjwatson> mine is 27GB, source/i386/amd64, hardy/intrepid, main/restricted
[23:37] <cjwatson> universe/multiverse aren't needed for Ubuntu CDs so I find this a good compromise
[23:37] <TheMuso> Ah, I also have universe.
[23:37] <slangasek> (jigdoing DVD images is fun)
[23:37] <slangasek> (especially DVD images with a 1.1GB livefs on them)
[23:37] <TheMuso> slagnheh
[23:37] <TheMuso> slangasek: heh
[23:38] <liw> how rsyncable is the livefs image?
[23:38] <cjwatson> doko: meeting> that should be fine for me, subject to a phone call David wants me and quite possibly you in (will follow up separately)
[23:38] <ogra> slangasek, cat'ing a desktop CD on top of alternate and then rsyncing the DVD on top saves a lot i found
[23:38] <cjwatson> liw: quite reasonably
[23:39] <slangasek> ogra: er... did you find this to be true before, or after, we added the much larger livefs?
[23:39] <calc> cjwatson: we can shuffle the time around, but i would prefer if it is at least 13:00UTC
[23:39] <cjwatson> calc: 1600 UTC is probably fine
[23:39] <ogra> oh, i used it from hoary to gutsy ... but dont have DVDs for edubuntu anymore sicne hardy
[23:39] <doko> cjwatson, calc: ohh, I see, I have to leave at 16:00 UTC on Friday, so maybe we could start earlier?
[23:40] <calc> doko: that will be fine
[23:40] <cjwatson> doko: if you have to leave at 1600, won't we need to have the call before that? :)
[23:41] <doko> calc, cjwatson: 15:15 UTC?
[23:41] <calc> doko: ok
[23:41] <cjwatson> fine
[23:41] <cjwatson> any other business?
[23:42] <doko> no, things will normalize after Sunday =)
[23:43] <asac> victory!
[23:43] <asac> ;)
[23:43] <ogra> heh
[23:43] <asac> sorry, i dont ment to offend anyone
[23:43] <asac> :-P
[23:43]  * calc assumes the references are to FIFA?
[23:43] <cjwatson> doko: normal == you will have other business? :-)
[23:44] <asac> calc: EURO ;)
[23:44] <slangasek> I'm just offended that it's not called the DollarCup
[23:44] <calc> asac: ah
[23:44] <liw> are you people talking about sports cups?
[23:44] <doko> cjwatson: I'm not living in this country, where people tend to go to the carribbean during the EURO for other things ;-p
[23:44] <cjwatson> heh
[23:46] <cjwatson> I think we're done, then
[23:46] <cjwatson> thanks everyone
[23:47] <doko> ok, heading to bed
[23:47]  * TheMuso gets breakfast.
[23:47] <ArneGoetje> thanks
[23:47] <calc> goodnight
[23:47] <TheMuso> thanks folks
[23:47] <liw> tackar och bockar
[23:47] <james_w> thanks, night all
[23:47] <evand> thanks
[23:47] <bryce> night
[23:48] <bryce> I'll have the minutes up later; multitasking heavily atm
[23:48] <slangasek> thanks, all :)