[03:28] <cruiseoveride> what is the difference between Menlow and McCaslin?
[05:11] <persia> cxo: Different chipsets (including the processor, graphics, IO, etc.).
[05:11] <persia> In terms of Ubuntu Mobile images, mostly just different settings, defaults, and drivers.
[05:12] <cxo> are they the same arch?
[05:13] <persia> Both are arch: lpia, if that is what you mean.
[05:14] <cxo> is that x86?
[05:23] <persia> Somewhat.  It's IA32, but a different architecture in the control files.
[05:24] <cxo> the kvm image available on the site, can i boot that on a p2 
[05:27] <persia> No idea.  You could try it.  There was a report recently that the lpia kernel didn't book on a C7-M, so I'm not very confident it would work.
[05:28] <cxo> what version of glibc is on the image, i have a kernel handy i can use
[05:29] <cxo> i basically just want to check out the userspace stuff
[05:32] <persia> It's the same version of glibc in the rest of Ubuntu, just compiled for arch:lpia.  You can look at the source for Ubuntu Hardy glibc to see the specific differences.
[05:32] <cxo> it
[05:33] <cxo> it'l probably work
[06:04] <cxo> persia, it worked
[06:05] <cxo> i used vanilla-2.6.25.9
[06:05] <cxo> whats the root password?
[06:07] <persia> cxo: There isn't one.  Which image are you using?  The KVM image?
[06:12] <cxo> yes
[06:12] <cxo> i've never used ubuntu before.. but its trying to fsck the fs
[06:12] <cxo> which is shouldnt do, how do i tell it not to
[06:13] <cxo> cos, i'm pxe'ing it and the rootfs is nfs
[06:14] <cxo> persia, the lpia kernel even booted nicely on the p2
[06:14] <cxo> but i'm not using it cos it doesnt have nfsroot support
[06:21] <persia> Check /etc/fstab.  I think for no fsck, you want "0 0" in the last two columns.  Beyond that, I'm a little stuck, and would suggest asking on #ubuntu
[06:21] <persia> Also, thanks for the report that the lpia kernel booted cleanly on the P2.  I wonder why it didn't work on the C7-M.
[06:23] <persia> Oh, and for passwords: I think you want user "ume" and password "ubuntu" for the KVM image.
[06:23] <cxo> i shorted it out by replacing fsck with a shell script
[06:23] <persia> Well, that's one way to do it :)
[06:23] <cxo> it hangs on "Starting .... hald"
[06:24] <persia> Anything useful in /var/log?  How about dmesg?
[06:25] <cxo> hmm, ive got netconsole, let me reboot and try again
[06:25] <cxo> the fs is on my machine, /var/log/messages looks good
[06:25] <cxo> Jun 19 10:04:27 ubuntu -- MARK -
[06:25] <cxo> last msg
[06:25] <cxo> oh shit Ubuntu has NetworkManager as well
[06:26]  * cxo can't seem to get away from that
[06:26] <cxo> i hate fedora for such shit software, and its on ubuntu too!?
[06:27] <cxo> were would hald log to?
[06:28] <cxo> hmm i think the dhcpd is actually killing it (the service before hald)
[06:28] <cxo> its breaking the connection of the nfsroot
[06:28] <persia> I think hal mostly puts the interesting bits in /var/log/syslog.
[06:28] <persia> Lots of people run Ubuntu without NetworkManager installed, it's just installed by default.
[06:29] <cxo> whats chkconfig on ubuntu?
[06:29] <cxo> i chroot'ed into the rootfs from my machine
[06:30] <persia> chkconfig?
[06:31] <cxo> its not in PATH
[06:32] <persia> It's not present.  What is it supposed to do?
[06:32] <cxo> oh
[06:32] <cxo> turn off/on services at startup
[06:33] <persia> Ah.  I think you want "update-rc.d", although there is an effort to move more stuff to upstart, so this won't work for services in /etc/event.d
[06:34] <persia> That said, you may also want to look at the various files in /etc/default, depending on your goal.
[06:35] <cxo> i shorted, /etc/init.d/dhcbd|hal and ive got a console now
[06:35] <persia> Be warned that a running hal is an expectation of a few things: I suspect most of the HW related stuff just won't work.
[06:36] <cxo> the screen keeps blinking
[06:36] <cxo> i thought hald was just for information?
[06:36] <cxo> i didnt know it did any configuration
[06:36] <persia> It's the mechanism by which most software gets information about the hardware.
[06:37] <persia> Does it look like X is trying to come up and failing?
[06:37] <cxo> yeah sort of
[06:37] <persia> You may need to alter /etc/event.d/session to use a different xorg.conf
[06:37] <cxo> i cant type on the keyboard because of that
[06:37] <persia> Right.  You'll want to edit that in the chroot, and then re-PXE the device.
[06:37] <cxo> ume/password didnt work
[06:38] <cxo> i chrooted from my host, and passwd -d root, and logged in, and init 4, and the screen stopped blinking
[06:38] <persia> These images are fairly heavily customised for the target environments, and not yet generic enough to work cleanly on most hardware.  Part of why it was called a "developer" release.
[06:38] <persia> ume/ubuntu?
[06:38] <cxo> oh woops
[06:38] <cxo> doesnt matter now
[06:39] <persia> Well, except that there's an expectation you won't be running as root.  I do suggest you set a ume password, and use that.
[06:41] <cxo> alright, i just reboot after fixing xorg.conf
[06:41] <cxo> lets see what happens
[06:42] <cxo> oh sweet i got to the desktop
[06:42] <cxo> very nice
[06:42] <cxo> argh.. i dont have a rat
[06:43] <cxo> So Intel is planning to compete with Symbian with Ubuntu MID?
[06:45] <cxo> wtf is wrong with vi....
[06:45] <cxo> "the command is not available in this version"? what "version" of vi is this?
[06:46] <persia> Try vim.  I can't speak for any corporate intent for Ubuntu MID, but I personally find it more dynamic than the Qtopia environment I've been using.
[06:47] <persia> I also like the integration with Ubuntu Desktop: it ought be a lot easier to enable various file sharing and mobile/workstation integration features.
[06:47] <cxo> but its too heavy for a phone
[06:47] <cxo> maybe a 1ghz pda or something
[06:48] <cxo> my p2 is struggling with it
[06:48] <cxo> and i have 384mb of ram in it
[06:49] <cxo> and 8mb ati rage
[06:49] <persia> It's not really desgined for a phone: it's more for the 4-6" handheld segment.
[06:50] <persia> I have a phone that is mostly a computer (3.5" 852x480), and I find it exceedingly frustrating to use as a phone because I need to dial like a computer, yet frustrating as a computer because it's a little too small (I prefer my 4" handheld).
[06:50] <cxo> i love the desktop, i would use this on my pc
[06:51] <persia> Makes sense.  I tend to not like full-screen everything on my workstation, but I have a large screen.
[06:51] <persia> Anyway, must run.  Good luck with your project, and please file bugs if you find something doesn't work right.
[06:52] <cxo> not a project, just trying it out, liked the screenshots on phoronix.com
[06:52] <cxo> or .net cant remember
[06:53] <cxo> not bad, i extracted the root.raw, and dd'ed out partion1, net booted it, and got it to the desktop with internet access in less than 2hrs
[06:55] <cxo> Suggestion, throw Songbird into the rootfs
[06:55] <cxo> its a wikid app
[06:55] <cxo> and great for MIDs
[11:41] <jimcooncat> Is the Samsung Q1 Ultra the only device this runs on? $1,170 US = ouch!
[12:07] <quirky-mo> Hey all, I'm wondering if anyone here can give me a quick bit of advice wuth UME
[13:33] <persia> jimcooncat: It can run on lots of devices: I use a Kohjinsha SR8.  That said, the image available online is optimised for the Samsun Q1U: for anything else, you'll need to do some local optimisation.
[13:34] <persia> quirky-mo: What sort of advice do you need?
[13:35] <quirky-mo> well i have it up and running on my eeePC
[13:35] <persia> quirky-mo: You do?  Did you need to do anything special to make it work?
[13:35] <quirky-mo> but i'm having trouble figuring how to get the clutter interface up and runng
[13:36] <persia> Clutter?  Are you sure you installed Ubuntu MID Edition?
[13:37] <quirky-mo> well i have it installed on top of JeOS with ubuntu-mobile package installed from lauchpad.net repos
[13:38] <persia> quirky-mo: Aha.  Which architecture?
[13:39] <quirky-mo> i386
[13:39] <quirky-mo> i can actuall give you a link to the exact steps ive taken so far
[13:39] <quirky-mo> http://wiki.tenmilesout.net/index.php?title=Ubuntu_Mobile_Edition_-_Base_Installation_-_Eee_PC_Specific_Kernel
[13:40] <persia> quirky-mo: I'm not sure how to get clutter working, Ubuntu Mobile is mostly based on hildon.  That said, many applications are only hildonised for lpia, so you may find it a little hard to get it working under i386.
[13:42] <persia> Reading your instructions, that really ought to work.
[13:42] <persia> Unfortunately, ubuntu-mobile wasn't really complete or well tested for architectures other than lpia for hardy.
[13:42] <quirky-mo> I just have it up and runng to have the basic interface running but not able to figure out how to get clutter running
[13:43] <persia> One of the goals for intrepid is to try to get the ubuntu-mobile metapackage to do the right thing, but for now you may find you need to adjust several more things (although you've already listed a lot).
[13:43] <persia> You have a hildon desktop running?
[13:45] <quirky-mo> yes the mobilebasic hildon is working: basically this one http://ubuntista.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/ubuntu-mobile.jpg
[13:45] <quirky-mo> works very well tho
[13:45] <persia> That's good to know.  I thought it would have issues on i386.  I'm glad to hear I'm wrong.
[13:46] <ogra> lpia should work on everything that 686
[13:46] <persia> I see a libclutter-0.6.0 in the repos, but not a lot of rdepends.  Looking upstream, it seems to be a library interface, which may need application targeting.  You'll probably do better with the upstream information.
[13:47] <ogra> (and will likely be faster than -386)
[13:47] <persia> ogra: We had a report yesterday that lpia wouldn't boot on a C7-M, although that might be a pathological case.
[13:47] <ogra> well, C7 isnt 686
[13:47] <ogra> that needs the 586 instructions
[13:47] <persia> Ah.  That explains it.  I thought everything was 686 these days.
[13:47] <ogra> which lpia doesnt provide ...
[13:48] <ogra> nah, many of the geode shipsets, the embedded SiS CPUs and some of the VIAs arent 
[13:48] <persia> Hmm.  I wonder if we still ought have the special i686 stuff in the i386 flavour: might it make sense for any i686 people to run lpia, even for Ubuntu Desktop?
[13:48] <ogra> we had that prob in ltsp before when -generic didnt do 586
[13:49] <quirky-mo> lpia kernel doesnt boot on eeepc, (celeron m 900)
[13:49] <persia> -generic didn't do 586!  I thought -generic was supposed to work even on 486.
[13:49] <ogra> whats the error you get ? 
[13:49] <ogra> not back soem releases ago 
[13:49] <ogra> there -386 was 486 and 586 ... -generic was 686
[13:50] <ogra> -generic was then switched to support 586 
[13:50] <persia> NO specific error was reported.
[13:51]  * ogra notes that the eeepc might have one of the realtek NICs that prevented booting before the -18 kernel update ....
[13:52] <ogra> (just a guess, i dont have an eee here ... but had a similar prob on the classmate PC)
[13:54] <jimcooncat> persia, sorry not to respond. thanks for your comment
[13:54] <quirky-mo> aetheros NIC, and its a pain, cos I have to pact the Madwifi drivers every kernel update
[13:58] <persia> ogra: Hmm.  Anyway, while having proper support for 586 (and maybe even 486) in i386 makes sense, the architecture oughtn't matter so much.  It's unfortunate that one needs to run lpia userspace for best results.
[14:00] <ogra> yeah
[14:00] <ogra> quirky-mo, i'm not talking about wireless
[14:02] <ogra> there was a massive breakage with a relatively new rtl81XX something chipset of wired NICs that puzzled the whole PCI id matching and made the kernel just explde on boot
[14:12] <quirky-mo> sorry its aetheros again for wired, and yes the Madwifi runs the wired
[17:04] <Tamagotono> I am wanting to install this on my Nokia N800.  Can anyone point me in the right direction for how to do this please?
[17:25] <cxo> how does it work? do you have access to the hard drive/flash bootloader?
[21:29] <samphippen> can i install ubuntu mobile on eeepc?
[21:33] <cxo> yes
[21:34] <samphippen> when?
[21:34] <cxo> it will also run on a Pentium 
[21:34] <cxo> when?
[21:34] <cxo> what do you mean when?
[21:35] <samphippen> when will i be able to install it on eeepc
[21:35] <cxo> how should i know, whenever you have free time?
[21:36] <cxo> you can install it whenever you want
[22:44] <cxo> How do i shutdown MID?
[22:44] <cxo> i see no shutdown button
[23:59] <persia> cxo: There are two ways I use: first is Ctrl-Alt-Delete & power-cycle at BIOS, the second is `shutdown -h now` from the Terminal.