[00:03] <pwnguin> does ati actually work with 3d yet?
[00:04] <pwnguin> tretle: I'm not sure gilouche is right for Ubuntu. my suspicion is that it's less usable
[00:05] <pwnguin> It looks neat in a screenshot, certainy
[00:05] <pwnguin> certainly
[00:05] <DanaG> My current theme: http://picpaste.com/pics/screenshot-orange-nodoka.1213694702.png
[00:05] <tretle> just using the widow border, hows it less usable?
[00:05] <pwnguin> tretle: how do i know where the button boundaries stop for minimize, maximize and close?
[00:05] <pwnguin> DanaG: fail
[00:06] <DanaG> why?
[00:06] <tretle> 404 - no pic here?
[00:06] <DanaG> aah
[00:06] <tretle> why do you need to know that?
[00:06] <DanaG> Aah, expired.
[00:07] <DanaG> er, pic expired from the site.
[00:07] <pwnguin> tretle: because thats how I know how to use it?
[00:07] <tretle> the tooltip will say minimize, close, maximize
[00:07] <DanaG> http://picpaste.com/screenshot-orange-nodoka.png
[00:07] <pwnguin> sorry, that wasnt helpful of me
[00:07] <pwnguin> tretle: because thats how I know where to click
[00:08] <pwnguin> additionally, the button design helps point out that they're clickable
[00:08] <tretle> so the tooltips x, box and undersore icons dont give you proper instruction?
[00:08] <tretle> *underscore
[00:09] <tretle> I think you are dumbing down users too much, lol
[00:09] <pwnguin> they might not; it's really important that such claims be tested. this is just a hunch
[00:09] <tretle> its used in opensuse, lol
[00:09] <pwnguin> i think you're eliminating too much information
[00:10] <pwnguin> its like the difference between architecture and engineering
[00:10] <pwnguin> architecture people love big empty spaces, and neat looking buildings.
[00:10] <pwnguin> engineers like stuff that works
[00:11] <tretle> gilouche works
[00:11] <tretle> people will not look at the window border and say how do i close this
[00:11] <pwnguin> DanaG: what's with the openGL fish?
[00:12] <pwnguin> tretle: sufficiently advanced users are going to change the defaults anyways
[00:13] <tretle> thats not a very good reason for dismissing it
[00:13] <tretle> if thats the case why have a new theme at all
[00:13] <pwnguin> well in my lone opinion, to fix the remaining usability problems
[00:15] <pwnguin> you can probably get more opinions on the mailing list
[00:16] <DanaG> Atlantis2.
[00:16] <DanaG> Fun.
[00:17] <DanaG> Especially in the sky above the bridge.
[02:47] <nothlit> cody-somerville: did you get my xubuntu logo mockups?
[02:50] <cody-somerville> nothlit, no, sorry. link? :)
[02:52] <nothlit> 07:22:57 < nothlit> cody-somerville: http://core.joejaxx.net/~nothlit/xubuntu/ the .xcf is new stuff, open in gimp-- the pngs are the sketches i showed you @ the airport and paintovers so you can see how they look  simplified... make  sure you're zoomed out
[02:57] <cody-somerville> neat :)
[02:57] <pwnguin> i wish i could find a good video of a mouse on a treadmill
[02:59] <nothlit> anyways if you don't like those i can do a new set of sketches, or stop, otherwise I can see about making a preliminary svg
[02:59] <pwnguin> http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6653451215387750571&q=mouse+treadmill&ei=M-xmSIu2D5Xk4ALhs-HOAg
[03:00] <cody-somerville> nothlit, I want to show this to Jim. I'll get back to you soon, okay? :)
[03:01] <pwnguin> if you ask nicely they might send you a high quality video on dvd ;)
[03:04] <nothlit> cody-somerville: np take as long as you need
[07:58] <DanaG> Heh, this is random, but moderately amusing: http://wincustomize.com/zoom.aspx?skinid=1702&libid=2   -- wooden icon theme.
[07:58] <DanaG> I wouldn't use it.. but it does still give me a bit of a laugh.