[02:19] <lymeca> Will Kubuntu Intrepid ship with KDE 4.1.x?
[02:25] <rsk> we will see
[02:36] <lymeca> What's in it now?
[02:36] <lymeca> 3.5.9?
[02:42] <guy_> do kubuntu 8.10 questions fit here? or is there another channel for that?
[02:44] <JontheEchidna> lymeca: 4.0.83 (4.1 beta2)
[02:44] <JontheEchidna> guy_: I believe this is suitable for both
[02:45] <lymeca> JontheEchidna: So if KDE 4.1 beta is already in there, then wouldn't the default KDE version for Kubuntu 8.10 pesumably be the latest in the 4.1.x series instead of 3.5.x?
[02:46] <JontheEchidna> lymeca: Yes
[02:46] <lymeca> Okay thank you
[02:47] <guy_> Ok.  I guess the main problems I have are that X doesn't work on a "normal" boot - I have to select the recovery option and have it try to reconfigure the xserver.  After that it boots, but I dont have sound.
[02:48] <guy_> This is a laptop with intel 915 video, and I also can't seem to find the drivers like I could with Hardy and previous.
[02:48] <guy_> Is there a way to find them?
[02:54] <RAOF> guy_: How did you find drivers with Hardy.  Alternatively, what drivers are you talking about?
[02:58] <guy_> I think the i915 driver came up with adept/synaptic.  There isn't any "i915" driver that I can find with Intrepid.
[02:58] <guy_> However, my screen resolution is 1280x800 - which is what is should be....
[02:59] <guy_> It's like X is working like it should upon a recovery boot, but fails with a normal boot.
[03:00] <guy_> the xorg.conf file is very sparse - so I don't know where the settings are being kept.
[03:00] <coir-intrepid> Anyone using VMWare to install Intrepid? I had to go into failsafe terminal and do an upgrade to get Intrepid to boot.
[03:00] <coir-intrepid> Properly, anyway
[03:01] <coir-intrepid> GNOME wouldn't start-up. Not sure if that is report-worthy or anything.
[03:01] <RAOF> guy_: Check /var/log/Xorg.0.log -
[03:01] <RAOF> guy_: That'll tell you what driver is being used (and, failing problems at your end, it'll be the intel driver).
[03:02] <RAOF> They're installed by default, of course, and X now autodetects the correct driver, so we don't specify it in xorg.conf.
[03:12] <guy_> the xorg.log looks like it found all of the intel chipset - 945GM chipset, using i915_dri.so and screen set to 1280x800.  Anything else that could cause X to lock up?
[03:14] <guy_> By lock up, I mean that when I do a normal boot [using the non-recovery entry for the 2.6.26 kernel in grub], the boot goes normal up until it tries X, and then everything stops.  I can't even get terminals with F1, etc.  It just hangs everything.
[03:21] <RAOF> That seems odd, and I'm not entirely sure how you'd go about debugging it.
[03:22] <derekS> is webboard broken for everyone? Its the applet that posts to pastebin.... seems that it doesn't work for any pastebins (i think it sends the wrong posts)
[04:19] <bazhang> derekS, you mean pastebinit?
[04:25] <bazhang> !info pastebinit
[06:35] <DanaG> argh, I curse PulseAudio and GStreamer... or rather, the way they don't play well together.
[06:35] <RAOF> Really?
[06:35] <DanaG> Pausing gstreamer apps makes the Pulse server eat CPU... and if I don't disable the cpulimiter in PulseAudio, then it KILLS the pulseaudio server.
[06:36] <DanaG> Try playing an MP3 file, or something, with totem.  When it finishes, it sometimes goes into that state (even though that's not even "paused"!
[06:36] <DanaG> s/!/)!/
[06:36] <DanaG> Same with quodlibet.
[06:36] <DanaG> I have to actually QUIT the media player app, because I can't use pause.
[06:37] <RAOF> Not for me.
[06:37] <DanaG> Odd.
[06:37] <RAOF> At least with either banshee or rhthmbox.
[06:37] <DanaG> Try other apps, then.  Totem and Quodlibet, for example.
[06:38] <RAOF> Nope, not totem.
[06:39] <RAOF> Although the music does go a bit wierd for a second after resuming playback.
[06:39] <RAOF> (ie: it changes pitch)
[06:39] <DanaG> Odd.
[06:39] <DanaG> I wonder why it doesn't eat CPU for you.
[06:40] <RAOF> Because I am the Gnome masta!
[06:40] <RAOF> Gnome loves me, KDE breaks as soon as I look at it.
[06:41] <DanaG> Hmm, I was thinking it might be an issue with the codec... but nope, both mp3 and ogg do it.
[06:41] <Hobbsee> RAOF: i keep getting the opposite :(
[06:41] <Hobbsee> it's depressiong
[06:41] <Hobbsee> -o
[06:41] <RAOF> Hobbsee: Have you tried KDE4 with two screens?
[06:41] <Hobbsee> although, i don't think the installer died this time when installing ubuntu, so...
[06:42] <Hobbsee> RAOF: nope - i try not to use my old laptop.
[06:42] <RAOF> It's so broken I don't know where to start reporting bugs.
[06:42] <DanaG>  default-sample-channels = 6
[06:42] <DanaG> That's one difference I have set.
[06:42] <RAOF> Mayhap.
[06:43] <DanaG> Oh yeah, I swapped the login and logout sounds, so I get only the "short" sound on hotplug, not the long sound (that interrupts music).
[06:43] <RAOF> I use two screens by default, and KDE4 really doesn't handle that at all.  Pretty much everything from the desktop plasmoid to the panel to the display capplet doesn't like dual-head :).
[06:44] <DanaG> On a positive note... ALSA capture on my onboard audio chip somehow unbroke with the new kernel.
[06:44] <RAOF> Wooo!
[06:45] <DanaG> And I have a stereo mic jack... woot.
[06:45] <DanaG> So I can switch between line-in and headset-mic without changing any switches or anything.
[06:46] <DanaG> If Valve would make native Linux versions of their games (with surround sound support!), I could just about ditch Windows, actually.
[06:47] <DanaG> In fact, I've taken to watching my stuff under Linux, even if it doesn't have hardware H.264 acceleration.
[06:47] <DanaG> My CPU is fast enough to do it (at least for 720P), and no Windows apps I have will use acceleration anyway.
[06:48] <DanaG> And in Windows apps, I have to manually specify whether to downmix to stereo or leave as surround.
[06:48]  * RAOF gets better quality video scaling under linux (than he would under Windows).
[06:48] <DanaG> When in Linux, PulseAudio does it automatically.
[06:49] <DanaG> One bummer: Audigy2 can't do 24-bit 96-khz audio in Linux.
[06:50] <DanaG> At least, not on the surround51 device.
[06:50] <RAOF> On the off chance you're a bat, and can tell the difference between 44.1 and 96KHz :P
[06:52] <RAOF> I'm not so sure about 16bit vs 24bit, though.
[06:53] <DanaG> My onboard audio chip can actually do 24-192, even on capture.
[06:53] <DanaG> Audigy2 can only do 96KHz on capture.
[06:54] <RAOF> On the other hand, the onboard chip is likely to be poorly shielded.
[06:55] <Hobbsee> RAOF: i just don't like the themes of kde4 :(
[06:55] <Hobbsee> it looks very much unlike gnome now, too
[06:56] <RAOF> Hobbsee: I find it a pitty that KDE4 is so broken; while fiddling around there are definitely some nice touches, and I quite like the visual style.
[07:00] <RAOF> Hm.  I should probably contact the screensaver-settings author.  It might be nice to have it in Intrepid, but it'll require a new release.
[07:04] <RAOF> It'd be nice to have a way to edit screensaver themes.
[07:05] <emma> I think I will install intrepid pretty soon.
[07:05] <emma> I might as well since I am in this channel and I will be here forever. *smiles*
[07:06] <Hobbsee> RAOF: before ffe?  yeah, that might be an idea.
[07:06] <emma> :)
[07:06] <Hobbsee> emma: i hope you know what you're doing, then - seeing as base-level support usually isn't provided...
[07:06] <RAOF> Yeah.  I'm doing some code gardening on it now.  At some point I'll need to get a global understanding, but there's plenty to do with only local changes ;).
[07:07]  * Hobbsee should stop being lazy and write some emails.
[07:08] <RAOF> Intriguing.  How does one get in contact with someone with no public email address?
[07:09] <jbroome> staple your thesis to their door
[07:09] <Hobbsee> irc?
[07:11] <DanaG> Oh yeah, I wish somebody would fix the rss-glx presets.
[07:11] <RAOF> DanaG: The power is _yours_! </planet>
[07:12] <RAOF> Seriously.  Grab the source, patch the .desktops, submit the debdiff.
[07:12] <DanaG> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rss-glx/+bug/129142
[07:13] <DanaG> Oh yeah, and the "Jiggly" preset in solarwinds... should be disabled.
[07:14] <RAOF> DanaG: These are all really simple tasks an interested layman could perform ;)
[07:14] <DanaG> It's actually physiologically dangerous, I'd say -- it somehow manages to accomplish the rare achievement of being both siezure-inducing AND nauseating at the same time.
[07:15] <DanaG> Give it a try some time =þ
[07:15] <DanaG> As long as you're not epileptic, that is.
[07:15] <DanaG> Bonus points for running it at unbounded frame rate.
[07:15]  * Hobbsee kicks her proxy
[07:24] <Hobbsee> now, whatever that did...it wasn't nice.
[07:24] <Hobbsee> anyone getting interesting problems with gnome-panel?
[07:24] <Hobbsee> it only partially generating, or not coming back for 1+ mins after you kill it?
[08:11] <hyperair> i've just upgraded from hardy to intrepid, and now i can't start x, or modprobe nvidia
[08:11] <hyperair> what happened to /sbin/lrm-video?
[08:11] <hyperair> it seems to have disappeared completely
[08:16] <RAOF> Yup.
[08:16] <RAOF> There isn't any nvidia driver at the moment.  Welcome to Alpha 1.
[08:17] <RAOF> The way the nvidia (and fglrx) driver(s) are packaged is going to change, IIUC.
[08:17] <hyperair> i see
[08:18] <hyperair> so until then i can't use intrepid eh
[08:18] <hyperair> or stick to the nv driver
[08:18] <RAOF> Or nouveau :)
[08:18] <hyperair> what?
[08:18] <hyperair> nouveau eh
[08:19] <RAOF> Indeed, nouveau.
[08:19] <pheeror> pff, nvidia  ...
[08:20] <DanaG> My next laptop is going to be ATI.
[08:21] <DanaG> I'm sick and tired of my nvidia, for sure.
[08:22] <RAOF> !nouveau | hyperair, if you're interested:
[08:25] <hyperair> it's in intrepid?
[08:25] <hyperair> imo lrm-video should be kept around until they're ready to push out the change
[08:27] <TheInfinity> interesting project after nvidia said that they will never open specs ...
[08:34] <RAOF> TheInfinity: It's been going on for some time.  Which particular "we won't release specs" are you thinking of? :)
[08:36] <TheInfinity> dont know the interview, was an interview where nvidia said that they will code their own css drivers in future, not supporting any oss driver
[08:39] <pheeror> their bad
[11:32] <dv_> i tried to upgrade, but it failed. something about libghc6-cairo-dev failing to install
[11:33] <dv_> it installed all the packages, then dumped me back on the desktop. i rebooted and it mostly works, except there don't seem to be any nvidia drivers (?) so for the moment i'm stuck at 800x600
[13:01] <MaximLevitsky> Are bugreports for Interpid ok for now?
[13:02] <MaximLevitsky> I noticed that latest initramfs-update update broke usplash
[13:03] <MaximLevitsky> It seens that something sets console to text mode (I use framebuffer)
[13:03] <MaximLevitsky> Reverted back, and it work again
[13:06] <napsy_> how to tell diff to recirsively check dir1 and dir2 but only .c and .h files?
[14:14] <wers> is this officially the new official human theme? http://arstechnica.com/news.media/ub3.png
[14:14] <pheeror> official? no idea, it's the theme in intrepid
[14:14] <pheeror> hope, it will be changed :-)
[14:14] <lamalex> thank god
[14:15] <pheeror> at first, i thought the theme mechanism went off, sorry ...
[14:15] <lamalex> Why are they designing dark themes? This is 2008, Light and clean is what is in right now
[14:15] <Pici> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid has more info
[14:15] <Pici> lamalex: Perhaps, but dark themes have worked poorly in gnome before, especially when using Fierfox.
[14:16] <lamalex> Pici: even more reason /not/ to use one
[14:17] <pheeror> further more, it looks ugly with web pages - because most of them are in light colors
[14:18] <pheeror> it can be a nice theme though, but making it default one is risky imo
[14:19] <hyperair> i wish they'd get lrm up and working
[14:20] <hyperair> i thought i could switch back to ubuntu from archlinux, then everything began malfunctioning because hardy is a few versions back from archlinux in terms of quite a number of software
[14:20] <hyperair> and then
[14:20] <hyperair> i upgrade to intrepid
[14:20] <hyperair> and i see a wonderful black screen
[14:20] <hyperair> woo hoo
[14:21] <pheeror> stay with arch then
[14:21] <pheeror> ubuntu isn't bleeding edge distro
[14:22] <hyperair> well usually ubuntu+1 is
[14:22] <Hobbsee> with a bit too much blood atm, apparently
[14:23] <wers> hmm. how do l install the theme on hardy? (for testing purposes :D)
[14:23] <pheeror> see the link above
[14:24] <pheeror> and checkout https://launchpad.net/~kwwii/+archive
[14:24] <hyperair> Hobbsee: yeah very true
[14:25] <lamalex> Is there a bleeding edge Ubuntu derivative?
[14:26] <lamalex> I know there isn't an official one
[14:26] <lamalex> but is there a sid of the ubuntu world?
[14:26] <rsk> lamalex, come to #ubuntu+1
[14:26] <hyperair> that would be nice
[14:26] <rsk> ops.
[14:26] <hyperair> aren't we already in #ubuntu+1?
[14:26] <lamalex> haha yes
[14:26] <rsk> no there isn't
[14:26] <rsk> only alpha>beta>rc>final
[14:26] <Hobbsee> lamalex: i don't think so.
[14:26] <hyperair> meh. imo sid is more stable than ubuntu+1
[14:26] <rsk> and new cycle every 6 months
[14:27] <rsk> hyperair: then use sid
[14:27] <hyperair> lazy to install it
[14:42] <BUGabundo_work> hi there
[14:43] <BUGabundo_work> anybody knows how I can get my nVidia card to work with 2.6.26.2 ??
[14:44] <rsk> use the nv driver
[14:44] <Laney> Does the alpha fail to boot for anyone else in qemu/kvm?
[14:44] <BUGabundo_work> rsk: why won't the proprietary work?
[14:44] <Laney> (installer)
[14:45] <BUGabundo_work> it tried to build the modules....
[14:45] <rsk> it dosen't suppory 2.6.26 yet afaik
[14:45] <rsk> support
[14:45] <BUGabundo_work> they say they do
[14:45] <pheeror> because linux kernel doesn't have stable abi? just a guess
[14:45] <rsk> well something else then
[14:45] <pheeror> where did you get 2.6.26.2 btw?
[14:46] <rsk> im guessing ibex
[14:46] <BUGabundo_work> "Added preliminary support for Linux 2.6.26."
[14:46] <pheeror> hmm ... 2.6.26-rc8
[14:46] <BUGabundo_work> pheeror: using 8.10 here
[14:46] <pheeror> don't mind me
[14:47] <BUGabundo_work> so, I can't use the card ?
[14:47] <BUGabundo_work> just with the open source driver?
[14:47] <pheeror> I just want my 2.6.26 to boot, so i hoped there is a newer version
[14:47] <pheeror> yes
[14:47] <BUGabundo_work> shouldn't the 2.6.24.18 kernel work ?
[14:48] <BUGabundo_work> even sound won't work on 2.6.26
[14:48] <BUGabundo_work> no restrited module build yet
[14:48] <pheeror> I also have to use the 2.6.24 kernel in intrepid
[14:49] <pheeror> but no idea if there are nvidia drivers for 2.6.24 in intrepid
[14:49] <pheeror> at least, you can use their crappy installer
[14:49] <Pici> Wasnt someone saying something about LRM not being in or not working for intrepid currently?
[14:49] <BUGabundo_work> I did, pheeror
[14:49] <pheeror> with 2.6.24 kernel
[14:49] <BUGabundo_work> it build everything from scrach for the kernel
[14:50] <BUGabundo_work> ahh . I meant for .26
[14:50] <BUGabundo_work> but after the boot X didn't like it, and left me with 800x600
[14:50] <pheeror> did it work (for .26)?
[14:50] <BUGabundo_work> selecting NV got me 1280x800 back
[14:50] <pheeror> ;-)
[14:50] <BUGabundo_work> I can't be sure, since X won't run any higher then 800px
[14:51] <BUGabundo_work> can't use it like that
[14:51] <pheeror> i'm glad I have intel gpu
[14:51] <BUGabundo_work> even displayconfig-gtk has some trouble allowing me to select the driver
[14:51] <BUGabundo_work> like it won't find it
[14:51] <BUGabundo_work> I HAD and intel, and upgraded to nVidia
[14:52] <BUGabundo_work> Intel GPU suck, but at least it would stand anytjhing I did with X11
[14:52] <BUGabundo_work> lousy 2 monitor, no TV out
[14:52] <BUGabundo_work> bah
[14:52] <BUGabundo_work> humm is 8.10 alpha1 bootble via HTTP (inetboot) ?
[14:53] <BUGabundo_work> its an alternate CD so I'm not sure
[14:55] <pheeror> compiz working out of the box (even in livecd) and good 2d perforemence, lot of us don't need anything more from a gpu
[14:55] <pheeror> that's why i'm really happy with intel open-source attitude
[14:56] <pheeror> whatever
[15:10] <hyperair> except that compiz doesn't work out of the box because of nvidia
[15:10] <derekS> hyperair: compiz doesn't work because of nvidia? really?
[15:11] <hyperair> eh yes
[15:11] <hyperair> because nvidia isn't open?
[15:11] <hyperair> so it can't be included in the livecd?
[15:12] <derekS> oh, just on the live cd
[15:12] <derekS> :)
[15:14] <hyperair> well it's not enabled out of the box either
[15:14] <hyperair> because it'll piss off some open source zealots
[15:14] <bazhang> not the actual reason
[15:15] <hyperair> oh isit?
[15:15] <hyperair> then what's the actual reason
[15:15] <bazhang> the same reason codecs are not included.
[15:15] <pheeror> gpl license ?
[15:16] <bazhang> software patents in some regions (ie lawsuits)
[15:16] <hyperair> ah right
[15:16] <hyperair> annoying patents
[15:16] <bazhang> but the zealotry is a good reason too :)
[15:18] <joaopinto> hum. isn't the nvidia binary driver freely redistributable ?
[15:18] <bazhang> is it gpl'd?
[15:18] <derekS> does compiz work with any vid cards out of the box?
[15:19] <bazhang> derekS, the basic stuff yes
[15:19] <derekS> bazhang: what do you mean?
[15:19] <bazhang> wobbly windows
[15:19] <derekS> oh gotcha
[15:20] <joaopinto> it is not GPL, but there is no strict requirement to be, in order to be distributed with other GPL soft
[15:25] <joaopinto> bazhang, the nvidia driver is freely distribution, your comparison with the codecs which are illegal in some countires is not valid, for the nvidia case it is an open source policy decision
[15:26]  * bazhang heads to #ubuntu-offtopic
[15:58] <ASULutzy> So I'm sure this question gets asked 100 times a day in here, anyone have a link for the Intrepid alpha image?
[15:58] <pheeror> yeah, but it's kinda secret
[15:59] <pheeror> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/intrepid/alpha-1/
[15:59] <pheeror> sorry ;-)
[15:59] <ASULutzy> ;) thanks
[16:14] <BUGabundo_work> pheeror: you forgot to tell him, that there is only for alternate cd lol
[16:14] <BUGabundo_work> and he can always use the daily
[17:29] <verb3k> My alpha installation boots up correctly, but the screen is missed up. It's like 8 screens intersecting in each other, what could be the problem?
[19:37] <Ergo^> hllo
[19:39] <Ergo^> how usable is interpid atm ?
[19:39] <pheeror> depends
[19:39] <pheeror> mostly problems with nvidia blob
[19:40] <Ergo^> well i dont want to compare it to debian lenny, but i was thinking how it would perform on desktop
[19:41] <pheeror> works perfectly on my laptop
[19:41] <pheeror> ok, 2.6.26 kernel doesn't boot ;-)
[19:41] <Ergo^> can you specify what problems with nvidia there  are ? i actually have one of those ;P
[19:41] <Ergo^> LOL
[19:41] <Ergo^> :D
[19:42]  * Ergo^ wishies ubuntu unstables would be as stable as debian oned
[19:42] <Ergo^> s/oned/ones
[19:42] <pheeror> i don't know much about the nvidia problem
[19:44] <Ergo^> hmm, cant find anything about new kernel not booting....
[19:44] <pheeror> it's my personal problem
[20:43] <jonpackard> Hello. Is anybody else getting kernel panics booting Intrepid as a guest in virtualbox-ose? It will boot but sometimes takes a few tries.
[20:45] <jonpackard> I get: Kernel panic - not syncing: Fatal exception in interrupt... BUG: unable to handle kernel
[20:50] <jonpackard> Has anybody been able to install virtualbox guest additions successfully? I can't get the kernel module to compile.
[20:57] <jonpackard> Does anybody have an opinion on the new human theme in Intrepid? I like the way that it looks but I have trouble reading it.. I'm colorblind though so don't mind me. =)
[23:07] <RAdams> howdy. Would adding the intrepid repos give me access to the .25 kernel?
[23:08] <RAOF> No.
[23:09] <RAOF> You'd get a .26 kernel, but likely break all sorts of stuff.
[23:10] <RAdams> RAOF: So installing the .26 kernel would likely break a lot of things even if I didn't boot into it from GRUB?
[23:10] <RAOF> No, but adding the Intrepid repos likely would.
[23:13] <RAdams> RAOF: Well... here's the main thing... I use the b43 proprietary driver for my wlan... I believe there's a fix to the module in the .25 and higher kernels... I compared the code side by side and it seems the bug which is causing me panics is resolved in these higher kernels. I was thinking of adding the intrepid repos to get the ubuntu-rolled kernel. What do you recommend?
[23:14] <RAOF> RAdams: Adding anything from intrepid to fix a bug is like pouring petrol on a fire to put it out :)
[23:15] <RAdams> haha, point well taken
[23:15] <RAOF> That said... if you were to download the linux-image-2.6.26-2-generic and l-r-m packages from packages.ubuntu.com, you could try it.
[23:15] <RAdams> I was running gutsy from close to this stage in development, mainly because I had the time.. it was an adventure.
[23:15] <RAdams> oh, I'll try that
[23:16] <RAOF> But if you're looking to provide enough information to fix the bug, you probably want to build the kernel from git.
[23:16] <RAOF> That way you can also test candidate patches, etc.
[23:17] <RAOF> There's a page on wiki.ubuntu.com describing this; I think it's KernelGitGuide
[23:17] <RAdams> ok, I'll check that out :)
[23:41] <DanaG> Odd... rt2500pci has the device ID for my wireless card... but rt2x00 does not!
[23:42] <DanaG> ANybody know how to manually bind a driver to a device?
[23:58] <DanaG> Oh, I see... rt2x00pci is not the actual driver's name!
[23:58] <RAOF> Heh.