[00:08] <RainCT> good night
[00:16] <SolarWar> is it possible to upload a new orig.tar.gz file to your launchpad ppa?
[00:17] <wgrant> SolarWar: Only if you increment the version.
[00:17] <wgrant> Same as any other repository with any sanity checks.
[00:17] <SolarWar> increment the ppa version you mean?
[00:17] <SolarWar> or the source version?
[00:17] <SolarWar> or the ubuntu version?
[00:17] <SolarWar> haha :)
[00:20] <wgrant> SolarWar: The source version.
[00:20] <wgrant> The bit before the final hyphen is the orig.tar.gz version.
[00:29] <SolarWar> ohh
[01:29] <anteaya> how do learn what dev tool has a file called mkmf?
[01:31] <azeem> xmkmf?
[01:31] <anteaya> d
[01:31] <azeem> d?
[01:31] <anteaya> i will look
[01:31] <anteaya> thanks
[01:32] <anteaya> my synaptic couldn't find a package entitled xmkmf
[01:33] <azeem> I didn't say there was
[01:33] <anteaya> might it be called anything else?
[01:33] <anteaya> oh
[01:33] <anteaya> i mis understood you
[01:33] <azeem> anteaya: packages.ubuntu.com has a search for that
[01:33] <Laney> anteaya: You can search for files on packages.ubuntu.com or use apt-file
[01:33] <anteaya> okay thank you
[01:33] <anteaya> thank you both
[01:33] <anteaya> i will try that
[02:04] <anteaya> i found the file i was looking for mkmf.rb.  it is in the directory that i placed the compressed app prior to installing it.  It does seem to have made it into the installation.  How do I get it where it needs to go?
[02:12] <cambridgecow> so if I'm running an apt-repo and people install debs from my repo, will they get an automatic updates popup when I update my debs to newer versions?
[02:20] <Bodsda> hi guys, i was reffered here by someone as  a bug i made on launchpad hasnt been addressed, i wondered if someone could take a look for me -- https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/224424
[02:20] <ubott2> Launchpad bug 224424 in ubuntu "wifi/internet lags system" [Undecided,New]
[02:37] <ScottK> Bodsda: I think it's much more likely that #ubuntu-bugs is the channel you want.
[02:38] <Bodsda> ScottK, apologies, thanks
[02:39] <ScottK> No problem.
[03:06] <ScottK> siretart: Since you are our designated Launchpad rep, I guess I'll complain to you.
[03:06] <ScottK> Reading the blog, http://news.launchpad.net/cool-new-stuff/simpler-interface - I'm supposed to just suck up the pain.
[03:07] <ScottK> So that we can have things like "Link a related branch" (which I have never ever used once) smack in the middle of the U/I where most of the action happens.
[03:08] <ScottK> Launchpad: Getting in user's way in 2004.
[04:01] <emgent> morning
[06:13] <persia> Who wants some simple packaging work?
[06:13] <bliZZardz> persia : me :)
[06:13] <Bodsda> me, if you teach me how ;~)
[06:14] <persia> Bodsda: Sure.  First, visit http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/no_watch.html and pick a package.
[06:14] <bliZZardz> persia : you dont have to teach me , i will try and revert to you if i need your help
[06:14] <Bodsda> persia, done
[06:14] <persia> bliZZardz: Since I'll be explaining to Bosda anyway, you can follow along.
[06:15] <persia> Just to make sure there are no conflicts, which packages did you select?
[06:15]  * persia encourages more people to play: lots of packages to choose from
[06:15] <Bodsda> 'spong'
[06:15] <bliZZardz> persia : cool... do all those require erpackaging?
[06:15] <bliZZardz> *repackaging?
[06:15] <persia> bliZZardz: Nope, they all need a watch file.
[06:15] <persia> bliZZardz: Which is your package?
[06:15] <bliZZardz> persia : what is a watch file?
[06:16] <Bodsda> good question
[06:16] <persia> A watch file is a specially formatted file that lets us check for new upstream versions automatically.
[06:16] <bliZZardz> persia : gcal
[06:16] <persia> This is a list of packages that are missing watch files and don't have maintainers in Debian, so it's our job to make sure they have watch files and get them up to date for Ubuntu.
[06:17] <Bodsda> persia, shouldnt the package maintainer be doing this?
[06:17] <persia> The first step is to make sure we have the right environment to make changes.  Do both of you have an intrepid build environment?
[06:17] <Bodsda> persia, ah, not for the next few hours
[06:17] <bliZZardz> persia : i need to get it.
[06:18] <persia> Bodsda: Where there is a maintainer, yes.  For these packages, there is usually no maintainer (although there might be an Ubuntu maintainer who needs help).
[06:18] <bliZZardz> can the Ibex build env be run from older versions?
[06:18] <bliZZardz> older versions of U
[06:18] <Bodsda> sorry, i dont no much about this motu business persia, im downloading intrepid alternate iso atm
[06:18] <persia> bliZZardz: Yes, you can run a build environment on hardy (or even Dapper).
[06:19] <Bodsda> oh, how?
[06:19] <persia> Well, there are two commonly recommended ways to set up the build environment.  pbuilder and sbuild.  Do either of you use LVM?
[06:19]  * Bodsda wonders what LVM is
[06:19] <Bodsda> sorry, total n00b to this
[06:20] <bliZZardz> i know pbuilder a lil.
[06:20] <bliZZardz> need to try out LVM
[06:20] <persia> Bodsda: It's the Logical Volume Manager.  If you don't know, we won't do it now.
[06:20] <Bodsda> ok
[06:20] <Bodsda> where can i learn about all this?
[06:20] <persia> OK.  You'll both want to set up pbuilder then.
[06:20] <persia> !pbuilder
[06:20] <Bodsda> bots on holiday
[06:20] <persia> Right.
[06:20] <bliZZardz> persia : does LVM always require a different /home?
[06:21] <Flannel> No, just a /boot that's off LVM
[06:21] <persia> bliZZardz: Nope.  I only use LVM on about 20GB of my disks.
[06:21] <Bodsda> Flannel, a seperate /boot partition? or just the folder?
[06:22] <Bodsda> i hate grub so seperate /boot = trouble
[06:22] <Flannel> Bodsda: well, it winds up being a separate boot partition
[06:22] <Bodsda> damn, ok
[06:22] <bliZZardz> Bodsa : some basics : http://www.debuntu.org/how-to-install-ubuntu-over-lvm-filesystem
[06:22] <persia> pbuilder information is available from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
[06:22] <persia> You may need to get the debootstrap from backports to be able to build an intrepid target.
[06:22] <Bodsda> cheers bliZZardz
[06:23] <bliZZardz> persia : i would like to take up some more packages from there - based on my workload and the 'interestigness' of the package..
[06:23] <bliZZardz> Bodsa : guess we are sailing in the same boat..hence always there to help :)
[06:24] <Bodsda> persia, i have a wifi bug so im gonna lag to hell while i install these
[06:24] <bliZZardz> persia : quick comment : the Xorg/nvidia driver seems to crash whenever i do an upgrade of teh restricted packages...it is so frustrating.. i have to reinstall it again and again
[06:25] <Bodsda> ty bliZZardz im new to this packaging thing, but am interested in helping so im here to learn (and teach what i learn)
[06:25] <persia> bliZZardz: Works for me, so I can't help there.  Did you file a bug?
[06:25] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, drop to shell just for the package install?
[06:26] <Bodsda> persia, ok, got pbuilder debootstrap and devscripts
[06:26] <bliZZardz> persia : am trying to debug it , if dont succeed then will file a bug
[06:26] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide
[06:27] <Bodsda> major bookmarking going on here
[06:28] <bliZZardz> :)
[06:30] <persia> Bodsda: Did you set up pbuilder for intrepid based on the wiki yet?
[06:31] <persia> bliZZardz: How is your effort to get an intrepid pbuilder going?
[06:31] <Bodsda> persia, err,,.,. no i was reading all the links on packaging
[06:31] <persia> Bodsda: Once you start the pbuilder setup, it will take a while.  May as well get it started, and read the wiki whilst you wait.
[06:32] <bliZZardz> persia: i guess we can at best start tomorrow. So that Bodsda also gets a feel of it.
[06:32] <Bodsda> persia, ok, 1 question, the 'sudo pbuilder create --debootstrapopts --variant=buildd' command on the wiki, is that the full command or am i meant to substitute anything?
[06:33] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : just try it out - nothing will bomb :)
[06:33] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, k, cool
[06:33] <persia> That looks like the right command.  I think you want to substitute --debootstrapopts, but I forget with what
[06:33]  * persia looks around hopefully for someone familiar with pbuilder to help Bodsda get set up
[06:34] <dholbach> good morning
[06:34] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, persia it seems to be setting up a hardy build environment? -- bod@bodubuntustu:~$ sudo pbuilder create --debootstrapopts --variant=buildd
[06:34] <Bodsda> W: /home/bod/.pbuilderrc does not exist
[06:34] <Bodsda> Distribution is hardy.
[06:34] <Bodsda> Building the build environment
[06:34] <Bodsda>  -> running debootstrap
[06:35] <bliZZardz> persia : Bodsda will learn :) .. we have shown him the door.. let him/her open it
[06:35] <Bodsda> him, and do i need a key?
[06:35] <Bodsda> ;~)
[06:36] <tarheelcoxn> Bodsda: nope. GPL keeps it unlocked
[06:36] <tarheelcoxn> ;)
[06:37] <Bodsda> tarheelcoxn, good ;~)
[06:37] <persia> Err.  Keys are good, although we tend to use them more for signatures, than to lock anything away.
[06:38] <RAOF> From memory, I think you want to copy /etc/pbuilder (possibly .rc?) to ~/.pbuilderrc, and then edit that (it'll include the series you want to target).
[06:38] <Bodsda> just a note, its downloading a load of packages so im lagged out for a bit
[06:39] <Bodsda> RAOF, should i have done that before 'sudo pbuilder create etc etc' ?
[06:39] <persia> Bodsda: Understood: it takes a while the first time.
[06:39] <RAOF> Bodsda: If it's creating a Hardy pbuilder, yes.
[06:39] <Bodsda> RAOF, oops, the wiki didnt mention that
[06:40] <RAOF> Isn't there a nice 'pbuilder-dist' tool lying around somewhere?
[06:40] <RAOF> Bodsda: Sorry, it's been a while since I used pbuilder; sbuild-on-lvm is nice :)
[06:41] <Bodsda> RAOF, n00b here -- will have to be a bit more vivid, sorry
[06:41] <RAOF> Oh, that's just that I haven't used pbuilder for a while, because I like sbuild.
[06:41] <nxvl> dholbach: hi!
[06:42] <Bodsda> ah, ok
[06:42] <persia> There might be a handy tool in ubuntu-dev-tools, but if there is, the wiki ought be updated to instruct how to use it.
[06:44] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : are you trying to create an env?
[06:44] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, i ran -- sudo pbuilder create --debootstrapopts --variant=buildd
[06:44] <Bodsda> its done now
[06:44]  * RAOF is down to only 5000 spam messages to find the ham in.
[06:45] <bliZZardz> Bodsda: then what is the problem? :)
[06:46] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, what problem?
[06:46] <bliZZardz> wow :)
[06:47]  * Bodsda is confused
[06:47] <Bodsda> brb
[06:47] <bliZZardz> Bodsda :  i would strongly suggest you  to read the packaging guide and ask the forum any Qs -only if you have them.
[06:48] <persia> This is a better place to ask questions: someone is likely to be able to answer in realtime.
[06:48] <bliZZardz> persia : which is most suggested approach : pbuilder or SbuildLVM?
[06:49] <RAOF> Pbuilder is much easier to set up.
[06:49] <RAOF> Unless you happen to have some spare space on an lvm-VG anyway...
[06:49] <persia> pbuilder is easier to set up, sbuild tends to be slightly faster.
[06:49] <dholbach> hi nxvl
[06:50] <bliZZardz> persia : you mean sbuild is faster in terms of the instructions/steps?
[06:51] <RAOF> In terms of time to build a package.
[06:51] <persia> bliZZardz: No, it doesn't take as long to run because snapshot is faster than untar and dropping a snapshot is faster than rm.
[06:51] <bliZZardz> ROAF , ok . means the same
[06:51] <persia> bliZZardz: No.  It's faster in machine time, not in human time (they require about the same human time to run)
[06:51] <RAOF> It also is slightly closer to the environment on the buildds, so you'll very occasionally pick up a problem there that you wouldn't in a pbuilder environment.
[06:52] <bliZZardz> RAOF , means that sbuild is better :) - isnt it?
[06:52] <RAOF> Yes.  But not very much better, and if you don't already have some spare LVM space it's a _lot_ more work to set up.
[06:53] <persia> bliZZardz: Well, there are other issues that pbuilder catches that sbuild misses, and ought be fixed.  sbuild also requires more space on one's hard drive, and has more trouble building very large packages.
[06:55]  * bliZZardz pheeeewwww!
[06:56]  * bliZZardz wonders why god gave a choice!
[06:57] <Bodsda> back, needed a coffee ;~)
[06:58] <persia> bliZZardz: Having multiple tools that implement policy helps to ensure that policy is clear and correct.  Without multiple tools, we tend to conform to the tool, rather than the actual policy.
[06:58] <persia> Bodsda: OK.  So, the next step is to get the intrepid source for
[06:58] <bliZZardz> persia : shouldnt the tool reflect the policy?
[06:59] <persia> spong
[06:59] <persia> bliZZardz: Yes, but nobody is a perfect developer, and if policy is unclear, different developers may interpret it differently.
[07:00] <Bodsda> persia, show me the source, how do i get spong?
[07:01] <persia> Bodsda: apt-get source spong
[07:01] <bliZZardz> persia : i dont essentially understand that. For i have seen that w.r.t development having a single policy and having the tools which carry the flavour of the policy helps a lot.
[07:01] <sistpoty|work> hi folks
[07:02] <persia> bliZZardz: It presumes that the tool is a correct implementation of the policy.  I question that assumption, for any tool and any policy.
[07:02] <Bodsda> persia, do i need to cd to somewhere first or anything?
[07:02] <geser> Hi sistpoty|work
[07:02] <sistpoty|work> hi geser
[07:03] <persia> Bodsda: You don't, but you might want to create a working directory.
[07:03] <Bodsda> persia, /home/bod/packaging_stuff be good enough?
[07:03] <nxvl> sistpoty|work: hi!
[07:03] <sistpoty|work> hi nxvl
[07:03] <nxvl> sistpoty|work: upstram already send me the man page missing
[07:04] <nxvl> sistpoty|work: now i only need to take care of rpath
[07:04] <nxvl> :D
[07:04] <sistpoty|work> nxvl: excellent! :)
[07:06] <Bodsda> persia, ok, i have the source for spong
[07:06] <persia> Bodsda: Which version?
[07:07] <Bodsda> persia, 2.7.7
[07:07] <persia> Bodsda: OK.  The next step is to look in debian/copyright to find the upstream homepage.
[07:08] <nxvl> sistpoty|work: also i talked to them about it, and thay are going to take care for the next release (or maybe tomorrow)
[07:08] <sistpoty|work> nxvl: cool, great!
[07:08] <Bodsda> persia, debian/copyright?
[07:09] <persia> Bodsda: When you downloaded the source, it created a directory, right?
[07:09] <persia> You want to cd into that directory, and then look at the debian/copyright file.
[07:10] <Bodsda> persia, Spong was downloaded from http://spong.sourceforge.net
[07:12] <Bodsda> persia, was that what you were after?
[07:13] <persia> Bodsda: That is what you seek :)
[07:14] <persia> Now, go upsteam, and make sure that the download files are also hosted by sourceforge.
[07:14] <Bodsda> persia, ok -- how? just by checking sourceforge for 2.7.7 version?
[07:15] <persia> Bodsda: Somewhere on the upstream homepage should be instructions on how to download it.  You want to see if that is the internal sourceforge system, or external hosting.
[07:16] <Bodsda> persia, sorry, im a bit confused,  i downloaded the source for 2.7.7, spong.sourceforge says 2.8-beta2 is released, and the download page only links to 2.7.6
[07:20] <\sh> moins
[07:21] <nxvl> sistpoty|work: did you have a amd64 machine now?
[07:22] <persia> Bodsda: OK.  You've found a confusing one then.  For the first time, let's try a different package.  Once you've done a couple, you can go back to spong.
[07:22] <Bodsda> persia, haha, trust me,.,.lol, ok
[07:22] <persia> Let me know when you find one with a good upstream page that has links to the newest versions, etc.
[07:22] <sistpoty|work> nxvl: yes
[07:23] <Bodsda> persia, will do
[07:23] <nxvl> sistpoty|work: can you please confirme me if the last version fixes the rpath issue
[07:23] <sistpoty|work> nxvl: will, but only this evening once I'm home
[07:25] <nxvl> sistpoty|work: ok, i will look if someone can test it, to try to fix it before going to sleep
[07:25] <nxvl> :D
[07:25] <Bodsda> persia, found one, walpaper v0.1 (although theres a debian link to v0.1-1)
[07:25] <sistpoty|work> nxvl: heh :)
[07:25] <nxvl> dholbach: you have and amd64, didn't you?
[07:25] <dholbach> nxvl: yep
[07:27] <nxvl> dholbach: can you please build augeas and run lintian on it
[07:27] <nxvl> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=augeas
[07:27] <dholbach> in intrepid or hardy?
[07:28] <nxvl> intrepid please
[07:28] <dholbach> ok
[07:28] <Bodsda> persia, what now?
[07:29]  * nxvl HUGS dholbach 
[07:30]  * nxvl has noticed that metallica makes his development more productive and quick
[07:34] <nxvl> dholbach: please run lintian on the augeas-tool deb
[07:36] <persia> Bodsda: Sorry.  Distracted.  Next step is to construct a watch file.
[07:36] <persia> In preparation, read the manual page for uscan.
[07:36] <Bodsda> persia, ok, will do
[07:37] <Bodsda> persia, ok, so it creates a watch file and updates the package when necessary?
[07:37] <nxvl> dholbach: btw, nice posts! the ones about sponsoring
[07:38] <persia> Bodsda: Almost.  Someone (like yourself) creates the watch file, and uscan helps check to see if the current package is up-to-date.
[07:38] <dholbach> nxvl: http://paste.ubuntu.com/24148
[07:38] <Bodsda> persia, for what purpose, ive already discovered by checking the upstream page that i have the current version?
[07:39] <nxvl> ugh!
[07:39] <nxvl> still there
[07:39] <persia> Bodsda: So that you don't have to do that for each of the 20,000 packages, and we can have a website that lists the ones that are out of date and need updating.
[07:39] <Bodsda> persia, ok, but if i dont need to do it, why did i?
[07:40] <persia> Bodsda: Because this package doesn't have a working watch file yet.  That's what you're going to fix today :)
[07:40] <nxvl> dholbach: con you please run "sed -i -r 's/(hardcode_into_libs==).*$/\1no/' aclocal.m4" and build again
[07:40] <Bodsda> persia, ahh, got ya! so im making a watchfile so others dont have to?
[07:41] <persia> Bodsda: Right.  There's a few hundred packages left without either maintainers or watch files, and we have a hard time being sure they are updated for each release.
[07:42] <persia> Once you create a watch file for this one, we won't have to worry about it until the next upstream release.
[07:42] <Bodsda> persia, is there not some super clever scripter out there who could write a script to do all this?
[07:42] <persia> Bodsda: It typically takes a human to read debian/copyright and click the right links on the upstream website to find the download page.  There is a script, but it's not perfect.
[07:44] <persia> So, the first thing to do is to check to see if the script worked properly (because there is a script).  From http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/no_watch.html, and the wallpaper line, there should be a link labeled "watch".
[07:44] <persia> Try putting the contents of that into debian/watch in the downloaded wallpaper source.
[07:44] <mouz> 08:37 nxvl : dholbach: btw, nice posts! <-- what posts?
[07:44] <Bodsda> persia, version=3
[07:44] <Bodsda> opts=uversionmangle=s/\.(tar.*|tgz|zip|gz|bz2)$//i,dversionmangle=s/[-.+~]?(cvs|svn|git|snapshot|pre|hg)(.*)$//i,pasv \
[07:44] <Bodsda> http://www.cgarbs.de/stuff.en.html (?:.*/)?wallpaper-?_?([\d+\.]+|\d+)\.(tar.*|tgz|zip|gz|bz2|) debian uupdate
[07:45] <persia> Bodsda: Right.  Put that in debian/watch in the package you are editing.
[07:45] <Bodsda> persia, there is no watch file in the source
[07:45] <persia> Exactly, which is the problem :)  Create a new file.
[07:46] <dholbach> mouz: http://daniel.holba.ch/blog/?p=129 and http://daniel.holba.ch/blog/?p=131
[07:48] <nxvl> dholbach: neverming, found the problem, configure and friends are full of --rpath instruccions
[07:48] <nxvl> i will need to work harder on this one
[07:49] <dholbach> nxvl: the output is the same after the sed-ding
[07:49] <nxvl> dholbach: yes, thanks a lot
[07:49] <dholbach> anytime
[07:49] <nxvl> i have just found what the real problem is
[07:49] <Bodsda> persia, ok done.
[07:50] <nxvl> it harder than i thought
[07:50] <persia> Bodsda: Now, run `uscan --report-status` from the package directory to make sure it worked.
[07:51] <Bodsda> persia, uscan: No debian directories found
[07:51] <persia> Really?  In which directory are you?
[07:52] <nxvl> i have a doubt
[07:52] <Bodsda> persia, the same dir as the watchfile
[07:52] <nxvl> when a package is build
[07:52] <persia> Bodsda: Ah.  Go back up a level.
[07:53] <nxvl> it send everything to debian/tmp
[07:53] <Bodsda> watch file should be called 'watchfile' or 'watch' ?
[07:53] <nxvl> didn't it?
[07:53] <persia> watch file should be called "watch".
[07:53] <Bodsda> oops
[07:53] <nxvl> but in what point does it send things to debian/$BINARY_PACKAGE dir?
[07:53] <persia> nxvl: It usually does debian/tmp or debian/$(srcpackage), depending on how you build it.
[07:53] <nxvl> persia: i have it in both of them
[07:54] <Bodsda> persia,  => Package is up to date
[07:54] <persia> nxvl: Does your package build one or many binary packages?
[07:54] <nxvl> many
[07:54] <persia> Bodsda: Excellent, it worked.  Next, check https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wallpaper/ to see if there are any other bugs you can fix at the same time.
[07:54] <persia> nxvl: OK.  Are you using dh_install?
[07:54] <nxvl> yup
[07:55] <persia> nxvl: In that case, it is dh_install that copies from debian/tmp to debian/$(BINARY_PACKAGE)
[07:55] <Bodsda> persia, no bugs
[07:55] <nxvl> persia: thanks!
[07:55] <nxvl> so i was right
[07:55] <nxvl> :D
[07:55]  * nxvl HUGS persia 
[07:55] <persia> Bodsda: That makes it easy then.  The package is up-to-date, and no bugs.  Time to prepare the source for submission.
[07:55] <Bodsda> persia, cool, that was nice and simple
[07:56] <bliZZardz> persia : what happens if there is a bug there?
[07:56] <persia> Bodsda: In your shell call `export DEBEMAIL="Your Name <youremail@hostingprovider.tld>"
[07:56] <persia> bliZZardz: You add that fix to the candidate before you prepare for the upload.
[07:56] <Bodsda> persia, export DEBEMAIL=bodssocks@yahoo.co.uk ?
[07:57] <bliZZardz> persia : you mean fix that bug? if yes, what happens if i dont know the fix?
[07:57] <persia> Bodsda: Almost.  You need your name as well.  `export DEBEMAIL="Your Name <bodssocks@yahoo.co.uk>"
[07:57] <persia> `
[07:57] <Bodsda> persia, export DEBEMAIL=Bod bodssocks@yahoo.co.uk ?
[07:57] <persia> bliZZardz: Ask here for help, and if that doesn't work, check the next bug.
[07:57] <Bodsda> persia, export DEBEMAIL="Bod bodssocks@yahoo.co.uk" ?
[07:58] <nxvl> i have DEBEMAIL and DEBFULLNAME separately
[07:58] <nxvl> :D
[07:58] <persia> Bodsda: Should be both GivenName and Surname.
[07:58] <persia> nxvl: Then you have extra variables :)
[07:58] <Bodsda> persia, why? Bod isnt technically my real name but very (very very) few people know my real name
[07:59] <persia> Bodsda: Because policy says to use real names.
[07:59] <Bodsda> persia, hhmmm,. ok
[08:00] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : anonymity is not always good :)
[08:00] <persia> Bodsda: Note that once you do this a lot, you'll end up needing to put your real name on your GPG key, and using your GPG key to sign the packages, so it won't hide it for long.
[08:01] <siretart> ScottK: morning
[08:01] <Bodsda> its just that ive never been called by my real name (ever since birth) but if its legally required...
[08:01] <persia> It's not legally required, but it's expected.  Maybe someone else has different advice.
[08:02] <RAOF> You're welcome to add a nick to your name.
[08:02] <mouz> GPG key does not need to have real name
[08:02] <persia> mouz: Hard to get cross-signed without it, no?
[08:02] <RAOF> But should you ever want to get your GPG key signed, the name on it will want to match the name on (eg:) your driver's license.
[08:02] <siretart> ScottK: I've been using the new interface on edge.launchpad.net now for a few days when it was previously introduced
[08:03] <Bodsda> ok, il use real name, cheers guys
[08:03] <siretart> ScottK: and TBH, I like the new interface more than the one before. Of course you need to get a bit used to it, but the new interface makes several things instantly more visible, and higlights some previously underused features
[08:03] <Bodsda> persia, ok, the command didnt give any output so i assume everything went well...?
[08:04] <persia> siretart: Note that there's currently no link from +queue to +builds, and a few others are missing (not that many use LP links for navigation).
[08:04] <siretart> ScottK: since you are making a more or less formal request, may I ask you to email me your request? (ideally with a bug reference, but I can also file a bug for you if necessary)
[08:04] <persia> Bodsda: Yep.  Now, call dch -i to launch your editor and update the changelog.
[08:04] <Bodsda> persia, ok, whats dch?
[08:05] <persia> It should automatically set the right version, but you may need to adjust the target from your current release to "intrepid".  After the *, add "Add watch file".
[08:05] <Bodsda> nevermind
[08:05] <persia> Bodsda: It's the command to edit the debian changelog :)
[08:05] <nxvl> siretart: did you know well the rpath issue?
[08:05] <siretart> persia: there was previously? Interesting
[08:05] <siretart> nxvl: I'm not sure what you mean
[08:06] <siretart> persia: do we already have a bug for that missing links?
[08:06] <nxvl> siretart: http://wiki.debian.org/RpathIssue
[08:06] <Bodsda> persia, add watch file / added watch file ?
[08:06] <persia> siretart: I'm not sure.  I only noticed it today, but wasn't very concerned, as I don't tend to use the links.  I'm not sure if it's a bug.
[08:06] <persia> Bodsda: Either works.
[08:06] <Bodsda> persia, ok
[08:07] <persia> Bodsda: Now save the file.
[08:07] <persia> At this point, you're ready to build the package.  Call `debuild -S -us -uc` to build an unsigned source package.
[08:07] <Bodsda> persia, bod@bodubuntustu:~/packaging_stuff/wallpaper-0.1$ sudo dch -i
[08:07] <Bodsda> parsechangelog/debian: warning:     debian/changelog(l4): badly formatted heading line
[08:07] <Bodsda> LINE: Added watch file
[08:07] <bliZZardz> persia : from here , can i guide Bodsda - can you correct me if i am wrong plz?
[08:07] <persia> Bodsda: OK.  Call `dch` again (no -i), and correct it.  You need the text to follow the *
[08:07] <siretart> nxvl: I read about it
[08:08] <persia> bliZZardz: If you like.
[08:08]  * Bodsda feels special with '2' mentors
[08:08] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : me is no mentor ..lol... i just want to try so that persia can correct me :)
[08:08] <nxvl> siretart: ok, thnks :D
[08:08] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, ok cool
[08:09] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, persia -- but first, should i do anything about the badly formatted heading line?
[08:09] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : badly formatted - as in?
[08:10] <Bodsda> wallpaper (0.1-1ubuntu2) intrepid; urgency=low
[08:10] <nxvl> sistpoty|work: in theory "chrpath -d $binary" should fix the problem, didn't it?
[08:10] <bliZZardz> Bodsda , leave it - i dont see a problem.
[08:10] <sistpoty|work> nxvl: in theory rerunning autotools with a debian/ubuntu libtool should fix the problem ;)
[08:10] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, ok
[08:10] <bliZZardz> Bodsda, next try : debuild -S -sa
[08:11] <bliZZardz> this basically creates the source package
[08:11] <Bodsda> problems
[08:11] <nxvl> sistpoty|work: rerunning it on my local repo and repackage it or in debian/rules?
[08:11] <bliZZardz> ?
[08:11] <sistpoty|work> nxvl: whatever you prefer... I think the first one might be easier
[08:12] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, http://paste.ubuntu.com/24153/
[08:12]  * nxvl is starting to hate autotools
[08:12] <nxvl> :D
[08:12] <persia> Um.  No.
[08:12] <persia> It's essential that the changelog parses cleanly.
[08:13] <RAOF> nxvl: Miro uses chrpath to strip the rpath, if you wan an example.
[08:13] <sistpoty|work> nxvl: heh... so do I *g*
[08:13] <nxvl> sistpoty|work: did you know a doc/recipe/howto on how to do it?
[08:13] <persia> Bodsda: Please pastebin the first 10 lines or so of your changelog.
[08:13] <sistpoty|work> nxvl: aclocal; autoconf; libtoolize; automake
[08:13] <nxvl> RAOF: thank!
[08:13] <Bodsda> persia, 'my' chanlog? how do i do that?
[08:13] <Bodsda> wheres the file?
[08:13] <bliZZardz> debian/changelog
[08:13] <Bodsda> oh, got ya
[08:14] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, persia -- http://pastebin.com/f10984fa1
[08:15] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : move Added to the previous line  - along with '*'
[08:15] <bliZZardz> line 4 to line 3.
[08:15] <bliZZardz> persia , am i right?
[08:16] <persia> bliZZardz: Yes.
[08:16] <nxvl> wooho \o/ i have just broke my package
[08:16]  * nxvl officialy hates atutools
[08:16] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, done
[08:16]  * bliZZardz feels elated :)
[08:16] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : try the cmd again
[08:17] <Bodsda> nope, same error
[08:17] <persia> Bodsda: You also want to update the -- root part to be your name & email (I'm not sure why the export didn't take: works for me)
[08:17] <bliZZardz> oh..yea -there it goes
[08:17] <bliZZardz> persia : bug in dch ;)
[08:18] <persia> Looks like http://pastebin.com/m100d4f66 ?
[08:18] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, persia -- better? http://pastebin.com/f341a80e1
[08:19] <persia> Bodsda: Add an extra line between the changelog entry and the signature.  Also, remove the -- root part: it only needs one name & email.
[08:19] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : it should be similar to what persia pastebinn'ed
[08:19] <bliZZardz> "root <root@bodubuntustu>" is not reqd
[08:20] <Bodsda> http://pastebin.com/f4b507d27

[08:20] <bliZZardz> email id within "< >"
[08:20]  * Bodsda bangs head on table
[08:21] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : you want some nails on the table? ;)
[08:21] <Bodsda> http://pastebin.com/f2a53a266
[08:21] <Bodsda> no, im good ta
[08:22] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, persia -- i still get the same error
[08:24] <bliZZardz> persia : ??
[08:24] <persia> Bodsda: Do you maybe have a backup file or anything?  That looks right.  About which line does it complain?
[08:25] <Bodsda> Can't exec "fakeroot": No such file or directory at /usr/bin/dpkg-buildpackage line 477.
[08:25] <Bodsda> debuild: fatal error at line 1329:
[08:25] <bliZZardz> ahh..this error is different
[08:25] <persia> Bodsda: That's a new and different error :)  Install the fakeroot package.
[08:26] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : FYI : fakeroot is a pkg which ..as the name says.. fakes teh root
[08:26] <Bodsda> persia, fakeroot error gone but still - debuild: fatal error at line 1250:
[08:26] <Bodsda> yeah, thought as much
[08:27] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : pastebin the  error trace plz
[08:27] <Bodsda> http://paste.ubuntu.com/24155/
[08:27] <persia> Bodsda: You didn't call `debuild -S -us -uc` :)
[08:28] <bliZZardz> "sudo debuild -S -sa" should do
[08:28] <persia> bliZZardz: Only for new upstream versions, and only when signing them.
[08:28] <persia> For this, no point in signing (not being uploaded directly), and not a new upstream, so -sa isn't required.
[08:28] <bliZZardz> persia : `uc` for?
[08:29] <persia> unsigned changes
[08:29] <Bodsda> dpkg-buildpackage: failure: dpkg-source -b wallpaper-0.1 gave error exit status 13
[08:29] <Bodsda> debuild: fatal error at line 1329:
[08:29] <persia> Bodsda: Please pastebin, nobody has all the lines and error status codes memorised.
[08:30] <Bodsda> persia, pastebin what?
[08:30] <bliZZardz> the error trace
[08:30] <Bodsda> http://paste.ubuntu.com/24156/
[08:32] <persia> Aha!  That's because the package hadn't been modified for Ubuntu previously.
[08:32] <bliZZardz> persia : i dont understand what you just said. Can you please expatiate?
[08:33] <persia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField mandates that we don't claim that a package is maintained by someone in Debian when we change it.
[08:34] <persia> Therefore, we need to edit debian/control, and change "Maintainer:" to "XSBC-Original-Maintainer:".  Then, we need to add "Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>" on the line above the XSBC-Original-Maintainer line.
[08:34] <nxvl> this is going to be a Looooong night
[08:34] <Bodsda> whats a XSBC-Original-Maintainer line?
[08:34] <persia> Bodsda: After making that change, don't forget to update the changelog again.  I usually use "Set Ubuntu Maintainer".
[08:35] <persia> It's the line you create when you change the current "Maintainer" to "XSBC-Original-Maintainer".
[08:35] <Bodsda> persia, erm, im not sure what you want me to do, can you elaborate a little please
[08:35] <persia> Bodsda: OK.  Open debian/control in your editor.
[08:36] <Bodsda> yep
[08:36] <persia> Now, where it says "Maintainer", change that to "XSBC-Original-Maintainer".
[08:37] <Bodsda> done
[08:38] <Bodsda> damn netsplit
[08:38] <bliZZardz> try the cmd again
[08:38] <persia> Bodsda: Now, add a line above that line containing the text "Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>"
[08:39] <bliZZardz> sorry - missed that.
[08:39] <Bodsda> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
[08:39] <Bodsda> Maintainer: XSBC-Original-Maintainer
[08:39] <Bodsda> correct?
[08:40] <nxvl> raphink: already fixed augeas on the 80 characters, i just didn't upload it early :P
[08:40] <persia> Nope.  The first line is perfect.  The second line should read "XSBC-Original-Maintainer: some person <some.email@provider.tld>"
[08:40] <raphink> hi nxvl
[08:40] <raphink> hehe ok :)
[08:40] <raphink> nxvl: well it looks good for me then :)
[08:40] <Bodsda> persia, some person = me?
[08:40] <bliZZardz> yo yo
[08:41] <persia> Bodsda: Nope.  The original maintainer: whatever name used to be in the Maintainer: field before you started editing.
[08:41] <Bodsda> persia, meh, ok
[08:41] <persia> Bodsda: We have to give credit to whoever managed the package previously.
[08:42] <nxvl> raphink: yeah, i just need to get rid of the rpath issue on amd64
[08:42] <Bodsda> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
[08:42] <Bodsda> Maintainer: XSBC-Original-Maintainer: Christian Garbs <debian@cgarbs.de>
[08:42] <Bodsda> better?
[08:42] <raphink> nxvl: yes
[08:43] <raphink> Bodsda: no
[08:43] <raphink> Bodsda: XSBC-Original-Maintainer is the name of the field
[08:43] <nxvl> did someone has a amd64 machine and want's to build a package and run lintian for me?
[08:43] <raphink> not a sub-field of Maintainer
[08:43] <Bodsda> remove Maintainer?
[08:43] <nxvl> please
[08:43] <persia> nxvl: .dsc?
[08:43] <raphink> nxvl: why don't you send it to your ppa for test?
[08:44] <Bodsda> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
[08:44] <Bodsda> XSBC-Original-Maintainer: Christian Garbs <debian@cgarbs.de>
[08:44] <nxvl> persia: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=augeas
[08:44] <Bodsda> better?
[08:44] <raphink> Bodsda: that's it
[08:44] <nxvl> raphink: because it's slow
[08:44] <Bodsda>   cheers raphink
[08:44] <raphink> nxvl: hehe ok
[08:44] <nxvl> raphink: and i need to fight with versioning
[08:44]  * raphink has an amd64 builder, but no intrepid pbuilder on it yet
[08:44] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, persia -- ok, got that file sorted, shall i re run the command?
[08:45] <persia> Bodsda: Not yet, first you need to update the changelog again, as you've made another change to the package.
[08:45]  * raphink is going to create intrepid pbuilders
[08:45] <bliZZardz> changelog edits plz
[08:45] <Bodsda> dch -i ?
[08:45] <nxvl> dch is kewl
[08:45] <nxvl> :D
[08:45]  * nxvl loves dch
[08:45] <persia> Add another line after "  * Added watch file" that says "  * Set Ubuntu maintainer".
[08:46] <persia> You don't need the -i this time.  The -i is to increment the revision number,
[08:46] <bliZZardz> Bodsda  : and that is in a diff 'new' line
[08:46] <nxvl> i don'e need to care about the syntax anymore
[08:46] <persia> You only need -i once each time you update the package.
[08:46] <Bodsda> persia, dch -i doesnt show my original changes, but they are in debian/changelog
[08:46] <slytherin> shouldn't we be recommending update-maintainer script?
[08:46] <persia> Bodsda: Don't save.
[08:46] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : edit debian/changelog and add this entry
[08:46] <persia> Bodsda: Exit your editor, and run just dch
[08:46] <Bodsda> persia, dont save what? i havent done anything yet
[08:46] <persia> slytherin: Maybe.
[08:46] <Bodsda> oh kk
[08:47] <Bodsda> 'Changed maintainer'?
[08:48] <bliZZardz>  "  * Set Ubuntu maintainer".
[08:48] <nxvl> it's fine to make hard things, you learn a lot in the process
[08:48] <nxvl> :D
[08:48] <bliZZardz> all the new lines need to start with '*'
[08:48] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, ok, ty
[08:48] <bliZZardz> syltherin : where is that script?
[08:48] <nxvl> s/fine/fun/g <- i need to sleep
[08:48] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, ok done, now shall i re run command?
[08:49] <slytherin> bliZZardz: it is part of ubuntu-dev-tools package
[08:49] <nxvl> bliZZardz: actually they need to start with "  *"
[08:49] <Bodsda> indents r inportant
[08:49] <persia> Absolutely essential
[08:49] <bliZZardz> nxvl : right.. 'indents' are implied :)
[08:50] <Bodsda> yes, indented and saved
[08:50] <bliZZardz> syltherin : how to use it? link?
[08:50] <nxvl> bliZZardz: try to don;t assume things are implied when helping new contributor, for them things may not be implied
[08:50] <persia> Bodsda: Now you can run debuild -S -us -uc again, and I'll let bliZZardz take over again.
[08:50] <nxvl> :D
[08:50] <slytherin> bliZZardz: install the package, and in the directory of your package simply run the command
[08:50] <bliZZardz> nxvl : cannot but concur :)
[08:50] <Bodsda> haha, errors are fun!!
[08:51] <persia> What did you get this time?
[08:51] <bliZZardz> Bodsda: errors still persist?
[08:51] <Bodsda> the exact same
[08:51] <Bodsda> http://paste.ubuntu.com/24158/
[08:52] <nxvl> tee: ../wallpaper_0.1-1ubuntu1_source.build: Permission denied
[08:52] <nxvl> Bodsda: have you being using sudo?
[08:52] <Bodsda> errors fixed
[08:52] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : ??
[08:53] <Bodsda> my bad, im tired, didnt see perm denied error
[08:53] <nxvl> Bodsda: what is your timezone?
[08:53] <Bodsda> ok, so now the command completed successfully whats the next step
[08:53] <persia> Bodsda: Also, don't forget to delete your backup files (e.g. debian/control~)
[08:53] <Bodsda> nxvl, UTC (London (England))
[08:54] <nxvl> it's not late in there
[08:54] <Bodsda> persia, rm -r ./*~    sufficient?
[08:54] <nxvl> Bodsda: yes, that can work
[08:54] <persia> Bodsda: Well, debian/*~ likely, but yes that ought work.
[08:54] <Bodsda> nxvl, no its 08:54, but i havent slept for 2 days
[08:54] <nxvl> here is almost 3 am
[08:54] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : after removing , move up a dir and build the pkg "sudo pbuilder build  ........dsc"
[08:55] <nxvl> and i haven't slept for 2 months
[08:55] <nxvl> LD
[08:55] <persia> Err.  after removing, rebuild the source package, move up a directory, and l...
[08:55] <bliZZardz> persia: what happens if we dont delete teh control files?
[08:55]  * nxvl doesn's sleep since UDS
[08:55] <persia> bliZZardz: If you don't delete the backup files, they get added to diff.gz, and are confusing for the next person working on the package.
[08:55] <nxvl> and it's augeas fault
[08:55] <bliZZardz> "debuild -S" and then the cd .. and then  "sudo pbuilder build  ........dsc"
[08:56] <bliZZardz> persia : i guess that can be done in a single step  "debuild -S -us -uc"   --- wont this work?
[08:56] <Bodsda> ok all backups removed
[08:57] <raphink> grrr
[08:57] <persia> bliZZardz: debuild -S -us -uc builds a source package.  pbuilder builds a binary package.  These are different.
[08:57] <raphink> it's a mess to create an intrepid pbuilder on etch
[08:57] <raphink> :s
[08:57] <bliZZardz> persia : i was ref to 'debuild -S -us -uc' and 'debuild -S'
[08:57] <bliZZardz> raphink : etch????
[08:57] <persia> raphink: Try creating a sid chroot, and in there creating a hardy chroot, and in there installing the hardy-backports debootstrap...
[08:58] <raphink> persia: that's more or less what I'm doing
[08:58]  * Bodsda *woosh* the sound of things flying over my head
[08:58] <nxvl> bliZZardz: -us -uc are unsigned sources and unsigned changes
[08:58] <bliZZardz> raphink : i was planning for an intrepid from fiesty..hope i dont end up in a mess too
[08:58] <persia> bliZZardz: The difference between those is that without the -us -uc one must have previously set up GPG, and we don't care about signatures for this change.
[08:58] <nxvl> bliZZardz: debuild without -S builds the binary packages
[08:58] <raphink> actually, I logged in into an etch chroot, installed the intrepid version of debootstrap + pbuilder, and am creating the base.tgz to export to my main etch system ;)
[08:59] <nxvl> bliZZardz: but it's prefered to use pbuilder or a chroot environment, to use clean system to build the package
[08:59] <persia> raphink: It's that easy?  I remember doing all sorts of nesting from a hoary box once.
[09:00] <raphink> persia: well so far it seems to work
[09:00] <raphink> persia: I'll let you know if it turns out well :)
[09:00] <nxvl> the key is "so far"
[09:00] <nxvl> it's always the key
[09:00] <raphink> hehe
[09:00] <persia> raphink: Good luck.
[09:00] <raphink> persia: thanks, shouldn't be too long :)
[09:01] <raphink> the machine is my buildd from work, it's fit for the job
[09:01] <raphink> just doesn't have the right distro on it ;)
[09:01] <persia> Nice.
[09:01] <nxvl> persia: did you build the package on amd64?
[09:01] <raphink> (but I'm not the one choosing to use Debian :( )
[09:01] <persia> nxvl: Yes, but I'm still waiting for lintian to finish.
[09:01] <nxvl> :D
[09:01]  * nxvl HUGS persia 
[09:02] <bliZZardz> lintian?
[09:02] <persia> nxvl: Strangely, I've no output, no CPU load, and no IO load, so I'm not sure why it's not doing anything.  I may try again.
[09:02] <nxvl> bliZZardz: yeah, our worst nightmare
[09:02]  * raphink thinks he should update revu-tools someday :s
[09:02] <bliZZardz> nxvl : what is it? i dont know - i would doing something on amd64 for sure...
[09:03]  * bliZZardz scared!
[09:03] <persia> nxvl: http://paste.ubuntu.com/24160/
[09:03] <raphink> bliZZardz: lintian is a script that checks packages against policy
[09:03] <nxvl> ugh, still there
[09:03] <persia> Bodsda: Are you waiting for your build, or for guidance?
[09:04] <bliZZardz> raphink : ok -so that runs from LP?
[09:04] <Bodsda> persia, guidance
[09:04] <nxvl> bliZZardz: nop, on your machine
[09:04] <persia> Bodsda: OK.  You have cleaned up your backups, and regenerated the source package, right?
[09:04] <nxvl> ok, i'm done with augeas for today, i will wait to see if upstream solves the problem tomorrow as they promise
[09:04] <nxvl> read you later!
[09:05] <Bodsda> persia, regenerated the source package?
[09:05] <raphink> bliZZardz: no, it's a CLI tool that you can run yourself
[09:05] <raphink> bliZZardz: it's also ran on REVU when you upload a package
[09:05] <persia> Bodsda: Run debuild -S -us -uc again after your latest cleanup changes.
[09:05] <raphink> persia: base.tgz created successfully
[09:05] <raphink> :)
[09:05] <bliZZardz> raphink : ok . thanks
[09:05] <raphink> persia: I copied the base.tgz to my main etch system and pbuilder update works :)
[09:05] <persia> raphink: Excellent!
[09:05] <Bodsda> persia, done
[09:05] <raphink> now I have to do the same for i386
[09:06] <persia> Bodsda: Great, now change to the parent directory, and look for your new .dsc file (with ubuntu1 in the name)
[09:06] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : "sudo pbuilder build  XX.dsc"
[09:06] <persia> raphink: If you want lots of architectures, you can do lpia as well :)
[09:06] <raphink> so I've got an intrepid pbuilder for i386 & amd64 (with a local full intrepid package mirror) for whoever needs ;)
[09:07] <raphink> persia: except I don't have an lpia machine
[09:07] <bliZZardz> Bodsda : something link this : "wallpaper_0.0.1-0ubuntu1.dsc"
[09:07]  * persia suspects nxvl would have liked to be awake to hear that.
[09:07] <persia> raphink: You can generate an lpia pbuilder on any 686+ machine.
[09:07] <raphink> ah?
[09:07] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, ok, its running
[09:07] <raphink> what is lpia actually?
[09:08] <bliZZardz> that all : )... buy me a beer now ;
[09:08] <persia> single-core low-power 686 with RAM restrictions (max 1GB), and some of the newer optimisation libraries for matrix, floating point, etc.
[09:09] <Bodsda> bliZZardz, finished
[09:09] <raphink> ah ok
[09:09] <bliZZardz> (i dont know what to do after this - persia - all urs)
[09:09]  * Bodsda hands bliZZardz £3 to buy a beer
[09:09] <bliZZardz> is NEWS/configure.in etc required?
[09:10]  * bliZZardz thanks ... not sure whether that would suffice..for persia?
[09:10] <bliZZardz> persia : ...
[09:10] <persia> Bodsda: It built successfully?
[09:11] <Bodsda> persia, no errors, so i assume so
[09:12] <persia> Bodsda: Excellent.  Next step is to generate a patch.  Run debdiff old.dsc new.dsc > some.patch.file
[09:12] <Bodsda> that exact command persia ?
[09:12] <bliZZardz> persia : is NEWS/configure.in etc required?
[09:13] <persia> bliZZardz: It depends hugely on context.
[09:13] <bliZZardz> for this?
[09:13] <persia> Bodsda: Nope.  You need to replace old.dsc with the name of the old .dsc file, new.dsc with the name of the new .dsc file, and some.patch.file with a descriptive name for your patch.
[09:14] <Bodsda> persia, and what is my patch? new watch file?
[09:14] <persia> Bodsda: I usually use a name that matches the new .dsc name, but with "debdiff" in place of "dsc".
[09:16] <Bodsda> persia, whats the new.dsc? there is no extra files
[09:16] <persia> Bodsda: You should have two .dsc files.  One for the original package, and one for your modified package.
[09:17] <persia> If you don't, please pastebin your file list.
[09:17] <Bodsda> 9 files befor 'sudo prebuilder build ...' and 9 files after
[09:17] <persia> "prebuilder" ?!?
[09:17] <Bodsda> pbuilder sorry
[09:17] <Bodsda> http://pastebin.com/f351c7510
[09:18] <persia> I see two .dsc files.  Do you?
[09:18] <raphink> btw
[09:18] <raphink> anyone wants to test a pdebuild-distribution.sh ?
[09:18] <raphink> :)
[09:20] <Bodsda> persia, one with '1ubuntu' and one without?
[09:21] <persia> Bodsda: Precisely.  It's these two that you wish to compare.
[09:21] <persia> The one from 2005 is the old one, and the one from 2008 is the new one.
[09:21] <Bodsda> persia, ok cool
[09:24] <Bodsda> persia, gpg: Can't check signature: public key not found
[09:24] <Bodsda> i think the command was successfull though
[09:25] <persia> Bodsda: Now, inspect your patch file to make sure it only includes the changes you intended to make.
[09:26] <Bodsda> persia, yes it does only consist of my changes.
[09:26] <persia> Bodsda: Excellent.  Sometimes a mistake is made, and the patch shows more stuff.  You have done it perfectly.
[09:27] <persia> Next step is to open a bug against the package in launchpad.  Use a title like "missing watch file".
[09:27] <Bodsda> persia, ok, im not to confident with LP could you be a little more in-depth
[09:27] <Bodsda> please
[09:28] <persia> Bodsda: Visit the LP bugs page for the package (you did that earlier to check for bugs).
[09:28] <persia> Click the "Report a bug" link.
[09:28] <persia> Follow the directions to report that the package is missing a watch file.
[09:29] <Bodsda> Summary = missing watch file?
[09:29]  * raphink adds a B hook to his intrepid pbuilder to launch lintian from within :)
[09:29] <persia> Bodsda: That works.
[09:30] <Bodsda> persia, further info?
[09:30] <persia> Bodsda: Describe why not having a watch file is a bug (about automatic updates, etc).  A sentence or two is sufficient.
[09:31] <Bodsda> Not having a watch file can cause automatic updates to function improperly, which can cause problems with your system.
[09:32] <persia> Bodsda: Well, no.  Not having a watch file can make it difficult for developers to ensure that the latest software is included in each release.
[09:32] <Bodsda> ty, sorry, didnt know what all this was an hour ago
[09:32] <Bodsda> bit hard to call it a bug when i dont fully understand it
[09:32] <Bodsda> but that clarifies things
[09:33] <Bodsda> persia, ok, attatchment?
[09:33] <persia> Bodsda: Attach your patch (but be sure to mention the patch in the description).
[09:34] <Bodsda> persia, the patch being the new *.debdiff file
[09:34] <persia> Alternately, create the bug without an attachment, and then update it with an attachment, and your comment (which is what I do)
[09:34] <persia> Right.
[09:35] <Iulian> Good morning.
[09:36] <Bodsda> persia, hows this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wallpaper/+bug/244454
[09:41] <Bodsda> afk, brb
[09:44] <persia> Bodsda|AFK: The bug looks good.  Next step is to subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors to the bug to request an upload.
[09:45] <persia> Bodsda|AFK: Except your changelog got damaged somehow :(  You'll want to revisit it, trim it to just two lines with *, and have the right name & email at the bottom before you subscribe the sponsors.
[09:48] <raphink> hi allee && dholbach :)
[09:48] <dholbach> hi raphink
[09:48] <raphink> && hi huats :)
[09:48] <raphink> what's up dholbach?
[09:48] <dholbach> drowning in work and email
[09:48] <raphink> hehe
[09:48] <huats> hey raphink and dholbach
[09:49] <raphink> you mean work emails and email works ?
[09:49] <dholbach> lots and lots and lots of emails and lots of tasks I'm behind on
[09:49] <raphink> :(
[09:50] <dholbach> scrambling to get as much done as possible before I leave for holidays
[09:52] <raphink> hehe
[09:52] <raphink> :)
[09:55] <raphink> wb allee
[10:01] <bliZZardz> slytherin, persia : what is the usage of update-maintainer ?
[10:03] <slytherin> bliZZardz: go in the root directory of package and simply execute the command
[10:03] <bliZZardz> as in - how to use it?
[10:03] <bliZZardz> ok
[11:32] <DaveMorris> Hi.  I packaged up OpenSG for Hardy and it got accepted.  Where can I find some information to read about the process of getting it updated with bug fixes and built for interpeid ?
[11:33] <persia> DaveMorris: I don't know of a good reference, but you might search the wiki for "update".
[11:33] <persia> In short, build an updated package, fix all the outstanding bugs, comply with the new policy, and attach the resulting diff.gz to a bug with the "upgrade" tag.  Subscribe the sponsors queue.
[11:34] <DaveMorris> and if there are no changes then nothing needs to be done?
[11:34] <persia> DaveMorris: I presume there are some changes, or you wouldn't ask about updating :)  But yes, if there are no changes, it's already in intrepid.
[11:35] <DaveMorris> I was thinking about the other packages I did which where new for hardy
[11:36] <persia> DaveMorris: They all got copied to intrepid.  Those that have bugs need bugs fixed the normal way.  Packages known to need an update from upstream are listed on http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/no_updated.html
[11:37] <persia> Mind you, some of those (e.g. kompozer) are bugs in the watch files, but it tries to be correct.
[11:38] <DaveMorris> ok thanks, I'll go away and make myself busy then :)
[11:39] <persia> DaveMorris: Thanks.
[11:54] <Laney> persia: Are those packages that aren't in Debian?
[11:56] <DaveMorris> Laney: are you referring to the packages I got accepted into Hardy?
[11:56] <Laney> DaveMorris: No, that ubuntuwire link
[11:56] <Laney> But are yours in Debian?
[11:56] <DaveMorris> nope
[11:56] <persia> Laney: Either not in Debian or orphaned in Debian
[11:56] <Laney> persia: Right
[11:56] <Laney> DaveMorris: You should work with the utnubu team to get them in :)
[11:56] <persia> When a package has a Debian maintainer, it's better to work with them to get the package update, rather than just doing it ourselves.
[11:57]  * directhex is still waiting for his xsp & mod_mono packages to land in debian
[11:58] <persia> directhex: You've put it on mentors, updated the ITP, and contacted the likely interested parties?
[11:59] <directhex> persia, i've poked the package maintainer with the "here are some updated source packages, do something with them damnit" stick
[11:59] <slytherin> directhex: that is not very friendly approach. :-P
[12:00] <directhex> slytherin, it's not got a spike on it. could be worse!
[12:01] <persia> directhex: bribes are key
[12:02] <directhex> persia, agreed. i think "here mister maintainer, i did the annoying bit for you, to help make your packaing group even better" is good bribery for a DD
[12:05] <bliZZardz> persia : today's exercise with Bodsda was good.
[12:06] <persia> bliZZardz: I'm glad you liked it.  Now, go try one yourself :)
[12:08] <bliZZardz> persia : sure. that is the plan. i want to start maintaining some pkgs
[12:10] <RainCT> Should missing dependencies be SRU'ed to Hardy (eg, bug #210556)?
[12:12] <slytherin> RainCT: IMHO, yes. But I am no MOTU.
[12:15] <dushara> n00b here
[12:15] <RainCT> hi
[12:16] <slytherin> dushara: is that a question? :-)
[12:17] <slytherin> dushara: sorry, I mean, state you question.
[12:19] <persia> RainCT: Yep, under the "Completely fail to function" rule: if you can't install a package, you can't use it.
[12:19] <RainCT> persia: it can be installed, but it will crash if the dependency is missing
[12:20] <persia> Ah.  That's a different matter.  How often does it crash, and for what percentage of users?
[12:21] <RainCT> persia: shouldn't be a lot; the missing dependency is "gnome-panel"
[12:21] <persia> RainCT: Right, but how much of the program works without the dependency?  Can users expect to use it at all?
[12:22] <bliZZardz> persia : when would pitti be online? any idea?
[12:23] <slytherin> bliZZardz: try on #ubuntu-devel
[12:23] <persia> bliZZardz: Why ask me?  Also, why ask here?  He's rarely in this channel.
[12:23] <RainCT> persia: yes, but it looses functionality. you can add applets, but no custom launchers
[12:23] <RainCT> (it's funny that a panel dependends on another panel... :P)
[12:24] <persia> RainCT: OK.  Next question: how important are custom launchers to most users of the package?
[12:24] <bliZZardz> persia : asking since you are around here ..quite active. Sorry.
[12:25]  * pochu waves
[12:26]  * RainCT is not sure - I don't have any myself, but most screenshots I've seen have some..
[12:26] <dushara> Can anyone comment the last 2 paras of this email? http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_name=be9ccc720806161838y4c233c84gd05e6c64cb227bdf%40mail.gmail.com
[12:26] <dushara> This is the lanka linux user group tech mailing list
[12:27] <persia> dushara: It's probably a good idea to ask them not to take that approach.  It can make processing Stable Release Updates and Security Updates more difficult.
[12:28] <dushara> We plan to provide updates simultaniously to both distros. Is it not a good idea?
[12:30] <persia> dushara: It doesn't quite work like that.  I'm in a meeting, but would be willing to explain in depth in about 30 minutes.
[12:31] <dushara> persia: Thanks
[12:38] <RainCT> persia: about how many users it affects.. Xubuntu users don't have gnome-panel installed, or?
[12:38] <RainCT> anyway, I'll get it ready and let motu-sru decide.
[12:39] <persia> RainCT: Pretend nobody has gnome-panel installed when making your analysis: it's about what percentage of users would want the broken functionality.
[12:44] <dushara> Are these IRC sessions archived anywhere? (would be easy to refer others if necessary)
[12:44] <persia> irclogs.ubuntu.com
[13:04] <RainCT> persia: OK, the SRU upload is ready... I'll let motu-sru decide wheter it's important enough or not.
[13:04] <persia> RainCT: best choice :)
[13:08] <slytherin> persia: any thoughts for bug 205441 ? The debdiff was for hardy but if we agree that the bug is valid I will update debdiff tonight.
[13:08] <persia> slytherin: I'm caught in time: be warned I will have a delayed response.
[13:09] <persia> dushara: My apologies, but I'm running well over.  I'll ping you when I can, or maybe ask someone else.
[13:10] <dushara> persia: no probs. What hours are you available? Or is there anyone else here you know can help?
[13:12] <persia> Could someone please help dushara understand why it's hard for uptream to have a single native package kept updated for all releases in Debian and Ubuntu?
[13:19] <ScottK> siretart: Bug #244522
[13:19] <ScottK> siretart: So far every time a Launchpad developer tells me don't worry, I'll get used to it, they've been wrong.
[13:20] <glatzor> servus dholbach
[13:20] <glatzor> why is there a postfix package in the universe dapper-backports?
[13:21] <ScottK> glatzor: Because at the time backports was broken in soyuz and the only way to get it to build was to move it to universe.
[13:21] <glatzor> apt seems to get unfused and upgrades to the backports package by default
[13:21] <ScottK> That's normal if you have backports enabled.
[13:24] <glatzor> ScottK, oh I thought the backports would behave like in Debian
[13:24] <glatzor> having a lower priority
[13:25] <ScottK> No.  It's been discussed, but never implemented.
[13:25] <emgent> morning
[13:26] <ScottK> The real answer is to not install from backports by default, but take upgrades from backports once that package has been installed from backports.
[13:40] <persia> dushara: Still about?
[13:51] <siretart> ScottK: thanks for the bug, I'll handle it
[13:59] <ScottK> siretart: Thanks.  Mind you that's the most egregious example, but I don't think a lot of it is that well thought out either.  How often does linking to a CVE really come up.
[14:03] <wgrant> ScottK: For me, very frequently.
[14:04] <ScottK> wgrant: That's true, but you usage is not in the most common pattern.
[14:04] <wgrant> Regrettably/
[14:04] <ScottK> The spot between the description and adding a comment is THE prime real estate on that page and it boggles that the least used features get put there.
[14:14] <slayton> anybody know where gpg --gen-key stores the key pair?
[14:17] <azeem> ~/.gnupg I believe
[14:21] <slayton> ty
[14:31] <nxvl> good morning!
[14:32] <null_vector> morning
[14:32] <raphink> nxvl: hi
[14:32] <raphink> nxvl: did you see my comment?
[14:33] <nxvl> hi raphink
[14:33] <nxvl> now
[14:33] <nxvl> i just woke up
[14:33] <nxvl> so i'm just opening stuff
[14:34] <raphink> take your time to wake up
[14:34] <raphink> life is not (only) about packaging ;)
[14:34] <nxvl> raphink: thanks for the suggestions
[14:34] <nxvl> :D
[14:34] <raphink> I tested it, it works
[14:35] <raphink> do  you see why it couldn't work?
[14:35] <nxvl> well, today i'm sick and not going to work
[14:35] <nxvl> so my day will be about packaging
[14:35] <nxvl> yes
[14:35] <raphink> you'd call that a resting day ;)
[14:35] <nxvl> yesterday i was too sleepy to thing about anything
[14:35] <Riddell> cody-somerville, jdong, TheMuso, DktrKranz, ScottK, \sh: motu-sru dudes, comment on bug 239317 ?
[14:36] <raphink> hi Riddell
[14:36] <Riddell> salut raphink
[14:36] <raphink> how are you doing?
[14:36] <Riddell> raphink: just had an exciting incident involving a stolen safe!
[14:37] <raphink> stolen safe?
[14:37] <raphink> how do you mean?
[14:37] <Riddell> it was a safe and it had been stolen, but they couldn't break into it
[14:37] <Riddell> I found it, called the polis, who turned up 24 hours later by which time it had been stolen again
[14:38] <raphink> oh my
[14:38] <raphink> is the KGB after this safe or so?
[14:38] <raphink> ;)
[14:38] <raphink> I mean, I'm sorry
[14:38] <Riddell> I'll never know now
[14:39] <raphink> you couldn't get into it either, obviously
[14:40] <Riddell> no
[14:40] <raphink> brb
[14:42] <\sh> Riddell: done
[14:44] <slayton> is it possible to compile debian packages on one machine but then sign them on another machine?
[14:46] <nxvl> did someone has an amd64 machine and want to build a package and run lintian for me?
[14:46] <RainCT> slayton: check debsign
[14:47] <slayton> ty
[14:53] <slayton> when I run debuild or dpkg-buildpackage will that generate the .dsc file?
[14:53] <nxvl> yes they will
[14:53] <nxvl> BUT
[14:53] <nxvl> is you want only the .dsc run debuild with -S
[14:53] <nxvl> s/is/if/
[14:54] <slayton> is the .dsc file contained in the .deb or is it generated seperately with you run debuild without any command line args
[14:54] <slayton> sorry for the pedantic questions
[14:54] <slayton> this is my first time building debs
[14:54] <Riddell> ScottK: bug 234516 is waiting for feedback from you
[14:55]  * ScottK looks
[14:55] <Laney> For a new upstream version, I just need to put the .diff.gz, right?
[15:00] <ScottK> Riddell: Ack'ed.  Thanks.  I guess I missed subscribing to that one.
[15:01] <ScottK> Laney: Yes.
[15:01] <Laney> Thanks, /me does
[15:09] <raphink> slayton: the best if you only want the .dsc is to use -S -sa
[15:10] <raphink> so that you generate the .dsc and ensure that you also include the orig source in the changes
[15:12] <slayton> raphink: ok thanks!  Now i've heard that I need to sign packages but somebody told me that its more the repository that needs to be signed... which is it?
[15:12] <raphink> both
[15:12] <raphink> for different reasons ;)
[15:12] <toobaz> hello. I have to archive a package in Revu. The Revu page suggests to do so, but doesn't state _how_. MOTU privilegies are requested? The package in question is gvb
[15:12] <raphink> the repositories are signed, most of the time by password-less keys
[15:12] <raphink> to ensure that no man-in-the-middle attack is possible
[15:13] <slayton> how do you sign a repo?  Do you sign the sources.gz file?
[15:13] <broonie> slayton: Uploads to repositories are usually authenticated by checking signatures on the packages in the upload (roughly).
[15:13] <raphink> slayton: you also have to sign your packages when you want to upload them, because that's how the system authentifies your work
[15:13] <raphink> by signing your package, you ensure that you really are the author of the work and hold the responsibility for it
[15:13] <persia> toobaz: I'll archive that for you.  Why do you need it archived?
[15:13] <toobaz> because I was able to get it accepted in Debian
[15:14] <slayton> right... so my repo is going to be hosted in house... I'm going to be the builder of the debs and host or the repo
[15:14] <toobaz> thank you
[15:14] <slayton> so i'm not going to be "uploading" per se
[15:14] <persia> toobaz: Got it.  archiving now.  Have you already opened the sync bug?
[15:14] <raphink> slayton: if you build your own packages and hosts the repo, you don't need to sign anything
[15:14] <raphink> it's up to you really
[15:14] <raphink> siretart: are you around?
[15:14] <toobaz> mmhhh. you mean the "I want to package that" bug? no
[15:14] <slayton> I don't need to sign even if people are going to be downloading packages from around the country?
[15:14] <toobaz> persia: or what do you mean?
[15:15] <raphink> slayton: it's better if you sign the repository of course
[15:15] <persia> toobaz: You'll want to update the needs-packaging bug to be a sync bug, or it won't be brought to intrepid.
[15:15] <slayton> right so "how" do you sign a repo?  \
[15:15] <raphink> slayton: depending on the size of your repo, some advanced repository management tools will sign them for you
[15:15] <raphink> e.g. falcon or reprepro
[15:15] <Riddell> cody-somerville: bug 220899 has no debdiff.  I would expect it also needs approval from an independent motu-sru although i don't know the normal practice in that case
[15:15] <slayton> the repo is going to be pretty small 4-10 packages
[15:15] <raphink> slayton: it basically consists in signing the Release files into Release.gpg
[15:16] <raphink> with a GPG key
[15:16] <toobaz> persia: I'll just file the sync bug, since I still didn't file no bug. Against what?
[15:16] <raphink> slayton: why don't you use a PPA ?
[15:16] <slayton> PPA?
[15:16] <persia> toobaz: Against ubuntu
[15:17] <RainCT> slayton:
[15:17] <raphink> slayton: PPAs are personal repositories provided by launchpad
[15:18] <raphink> if you have a launchpad account, you can activate them
[15:18] <Laney> This might be a good opportunity for me to solicit reviews of my btnx (and related btnx-config) packages on REVU, if anyone has time.
[15:18] <slayton> hmm.... ok... I'll have to talk to my team about that
[15:18] <toobaz> persia: should have guessed :-) My package is now sponsored and uploaded, but still not in unstable (I'm waiting for ftp-masters processing it); should I wait?
[15:18] <raphink> slayton: is it for a personal/professional repository ?
[15:19] <RainCT> * slayton: https://help.launchpad.net/PPAQuickStart, https://help.launchpad.net/PPA101
[15:19] <slayton> Professional
[15:19] <raphink> slayton: in that case, you could use reprepro to build your repository
[15:19] <persia> toobaz: Good to file the bug now, but wait until it's accepted to subscribe the sponsors team.
[15:19] <raphink> it's quite easy to use
[15:20] <toobaz> persia: ok, thanks
[15:20] <persia> slytherin: I'd say ant should only Recommends java-compiler, as it might be interesting to have it installed alone for certain classes of automation (similar to using make without gcc).
[15:21] <siretart> raphink: sort of, yes
[15:21] <raphink> hehe ok
[15:21] <toobaz> persia: in the bug, "sync" must be a "tag", right?
[15:21] <raphink> siretart: I just noticed I don' thave admin rights on revu anymore
[15:21] <raphink> siretart: where they removed, or just not duplicated when you moved revu to the new machine?
[15:21] <raphink> just wondering
[15:21] <RainCT> toobaz: no.
[15:21] <persia> toobaz: Yes, but it's also usually in the title.
[15:22] <RainCT> persia: uhm.. since when is a tag used?
[15:22] <slytherin> persia: From a point of view of java programmer, I think that people hardly use ant for not doing compilation.
[15:23] <persia> slytherin: I understand.  I find C programmers who don't understand when I use make to automate my daily tasks.
[15:23] <persia> Recommends: will be installed by default for intrepid, so it oughtn't matter except in exceptional cases.
[15:24] <slytherin> persia: in any case, I think 'java-gcj-compat-dev | java-virtual-machine' is wrong. It should be 'java-gcj-compat-dev | java-sdk | java-compiler'
[15:25] <persia> slytherin: I trust you more than I for which are the specific packages :)
[15:25] <persia> Might ask for confirmation from the #ubuntu-java folks, just in case.
[15:26] <slytherin> persia: hm,m I will raise it when we start weekly meetings
[15:26] <persia> Thursday, supposedly.
[15:27] <persia> Plus, no reason to wait: it's a concentration of expertise, and some of the best are there right now.
[15:28] <slytherin> persia: I am about to leave form office. So no discussion now. sorry.
[15:29] <persia> slytherin: No worries.  Have a good afternoon.
[15:29] <slytherin> persia: you mean evening. :-)
[15:30] <persia> slytherin: Yes, one of those time words.  They're hard to keep straight :)
[15:30] <geser> Hi *
[15:33] <amikrop> Hi. Where can I find the Python module gtkmoz?
[15:33] <RainCT> bones dpm :)
[15:34] <siretart> raphink: no idea. I've fixed the db now
[15:34] <raphink> thank you siretart :)
[15:35] <dpm> hola RainCT ;)
[15:37] <sebner> \sh: HA! finally testbuilding claws-mail xD
[15:37] <\sh> sebner: I told emgent to work with you on that actually :)
[15:38] <sebner> \sh: hmm!?
[15:39] <emgent> i'm here
[15:39] <emgent> sorry sebner but today is a very hight day
[15:39] <emgent> sebner: if you like we can review it this night
[15:40] <emgent> \sh: it`s ok ?
[15:40] <sebner> \sh: emgent: I thought I just have to testbuild it and look if it runs on a hardy machine O_o
[15:41] <\sh> sebner: you need to check also the versioning etc. regarding SRU policy :) that's why I send emgent to help :)
[15:42] <sebner> \sh: pfff :P  I set up a hardy vm in vmware specially for you and claws-mail. isn't that enough :P
[15:42] <emgent> sebner: why not chroots
[15:43] <sebner> emgent: we have to run claws-m .. !?
[15:43] <\sh> sebner: that you can do with dchroot as well
[15:43] <sebner> BAH
[15:43] <emgent> sure
[15:44] <sebner> nvm. I plan to upgrade the vm to intrepid xD
[15:45] <Iulian> sebner: Don't you use Hardy? Why did you set up another one?
[15:45] <sebner> Iulian: I use intrepid ;)
[15:47] <Iulian> sebner: You installed Intrepid on your machine already?
[15:47] <RainCT> Iulian: it's sebner ;)
[15:48] <sebner> Iulian: I use intrepid since the repos openend ;)
[15:48] <sebner> Iulian: and yes I only have 1 laptop ^^
[15:48] <sebner> RainCT: bäh :P
[15:50]  * Iulian feels that Intrepid is very very unstable right now.
[15:50]  * ScottK wonders that Iulian is suprised.
[15:50] <sebner> Iulian: I don't think so ^^ (though maybe with the 2.6.26 kernel)
[15:51] <sebner> ubuntu = debian unstable, debian unstable != unstable, ubuntu != unstable!?
[15:51] <sebner> :D xD
[15:52] <Iulian> sebner: The first part isn't true. ubuntu is not debian unstable ;)
[15:53] <Iulian> Anyway, going to eat something.
[15:53] <RainCT> sebner: ja, ja, und 42 :P
[15:55] <sebner> Iulian: ^^, hf
[15:55] <sebner> RainCT: xD
[16:13]  * sistpoty|work heads home
[16:13] <sistpoty|work> cya
[16:14] <jcfp> if you have some time to spare, please review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=sabnzbdplus - thanks
[16:15] <raphink> siretart: was there ever a source package repository set for REVU?
[16:15] <raphink> I don't remember
[16:17] <siretart> raphink: no, not that I knew
[16:17] <raphink> I'm just thinking that I could do that sometime
[16:17] <raphink> shouldn't be too hard to integrate
[16:17] <raphink> :)
[16:19] <raphink> I could add a reprepro hook in the incoming script
[16:24] <siretart> only if you can manage to not have the source packages yet another time on the filesystem. like in maintaining symlinks to the actual locations
[16:24] <siretart> we are short on diskspace on spooky
[16:25] <raphink> ah
[16:25] <raphink> hmm that can be an interesting challenge ;)
[16:25] <raphink> it could also be done the other way though
[16:25] <raphink> as in
[16:25] <raphink> keeping the files in the repository, and pointing revu to the repository
[16:26] <siretart> in principle, yes
[16:27] <raphink> I'll think about it :)
[16:27] <raphink> I don't think reprepro would be content with managing symlinks
[16:28] <siretart> check the code :)
[16:28] <raphink> hehe
[16:28] <raphink> there's some code I can't check
[16:39] <frostburn> How does one find what switches/flags were used on a precompiled binary
[16:46] <directhex> frostburn, check debian/rules, or the build log?
[16:47] <directhex> there's no reliable way to extract the info from the binary itself. it might not even neccessarily have come from a compiler you know of
[16:48] <frostburn> I was afraid of that, I'm trying to determine what modules were compiled in with net-snmp
[17:11] <emgent> RAOF: ping
[17:34] <Festor> 	
[17:34] <Festor> Does anyone know how to install a file schemas from a deb package?
[17:34] <Festor> Let me explain
[17:35] <Festor> I have a file schemas under debian folder
[17:35] <Festor> but I do not know very well that I have to change in rules file
[17:36] <Festor> I use dh_gconf -i in binary-indep
[17:36] <Festor> this is enough?
[17:38] <bddebian> Heya gang
[17:40] <thi> hi all
[17:40] <Laney> hello
[17:43] <Festor> hi? Does anyone know how to install a file schemas from a deb package?
[17:43] <Festor> I use dh_gconf -i in binary-indep
[17:43] <Festor> this is enough?
[17:50] <cody-somerville> Riddell, I wasn't looking for approval from a third-party. ;]
[18:12] <geser> Hi bddebian!
[18:12] <bddebian> Heya geser
[18:12] <geser> long time not seen you
[18:13] <bddebian> Yeah, was on vacation for once :)
[18:13] <geser> a vacation without MOTU?
[18:15] <bddebian> Heh, aye.  Couldn't take you all to Disneyworld :)
[18:21] <slytherin> geser: Can you please verify and ack on bug 244173
[18:23] <geser> slytherin: will do after the meeting I'm currently in
[18:23] <slytherin> geser: sure, thanks
[19:46] <sebner> huhu norsetto
[19:46] <norsetto> hi sebner
[19:49] <nxvl> norsetto: i think i patch al the stuff you point me at
[19:49] <nxvl> norsetto: also i have a doubt
[19:49] <DktrKranz> sebner, today is "new month"
[19:49] <nxvl> norsetto: i have been talking to upstream and they said that 0.2.1 is going to be released today, including some of my suggestions
[19:50] <sebner> DktrKranz: true ;)
[19:50] <nxvl> norsetto: so i need to update it and write a new and clean changelog, or add a new entry?
[19:50] <DktrKranz> so? I already hijacked my script
[19:50] <sebner> geser: RainCT : ping
[19:50] <geser> sebner: pong
[19:50] <norsetto> nxvl: just update it and keep the changelog as is (or actually, as I suggested, make it as clean as possible)
[19:51] <sebner> geser: would you mind giving the screenshot link to DktrKranz?
[19:51] <nxvl> norsetto: yes, about the Makefile thing, i delete the changes by accident
[19:51] <norsetto> nxvl: in principle, for the first release all you need is an entry with (*  First release (LP: xxxxx).) and thats it.
[19:51] <geser> sebner: that one?  http://utils.eurion.net/hosted/bug_sebner.png
[19:52] <nxvl> norsetto: and all the changes made to the original release doesn't need to be tracked
[19:52] <sebner> geser: yes, perfect
[19:52] <sebner> DktrKranz: see link ;)
[19:52] <norsetto> nxvl: why were those changes necessary again? It didn't have any problem
[19:52] <nxvl> norsetto: i think better to document every change done to the original source
[19:52] <nxvl> norsetto: try to build augeas twice in a row using debuild
[19:52] <DktrKranz> sebner, you racist bastard :)
[19:52] <nxvl> or dpkg_*
[19:52] <nxvl> it will fail
[19:52] <norsetto> nxvl: yes, thats the only exception
[19:52] <DktrKranz> (cit.)
[19:53] <norsetto> nxvl: it didn't fail for me
[19:53] <sebner> DktrKranz: reminds me on playing nexuiz today. A player was nicknamed: Achmed the dead terrorist ^^
[19:53] <nxvl> since Makefile's distclean removes the build/ directory, which is need and not generated to build
[19:53] <nxvl> norsetto: because i fix it :D
[19:53] <norsetto> nxvl: I used the unfixed version
[19:53] <nxvl> mmm
[19:53] <DktrKranz> sebner, nice name :D
[19:53] <nxvl> strange
[19:54] <sebner> DktrKranz: hrhr
[19:54] <DktrKranz> sebner, please, call yourself Jeff Dunham
[19:54] <nxvl> i have had a LOT of problems with it
[19:54] <sebner> DktrKranz: hmm?
[19:54] <DktrKranz> sebner, the man behind Achmed
[19:54] <sebner> AH!
[19:54] <nxvl> norsetto: but on todays release the fix is going to be released, so i can strip it out
[19:54] <Jeff_Dunham> DktrKranz: xD
[19:54] <DktrKranz> \o/
[19:55] <Jeff_Dunham> DktrKranz: you racist bastard!
[19:55] <norsetto> nxvl: thats certainly the better solution
[19:55] <DktrKranz> Jeff_Dunham, knock knock
[19:55] <Jeff_Dunham> DktrKranz: yes?
[19:55] <DktrKranz> Jeff_Dunham, it's me, I kill you :D
[19:55] <Jeff_Dunham> hrhr
[19:55] <Jeff_Dunham> xD
[19:55] <nxvl> norsetto: yep, i'm trying to have the upstream leader up to date on the revu process
[19:55] <sebner> DktrKranz: enough OT ;)
[19:55] <nxvl> norsetto: so he can help me to patch things and include them on release
[19:56] <DktrKranz> sebner, indeed
[19:56]  * DktrKranz moves back to Debian work
[19:56] <sebner> DktrKranz: btw, stop annoying me. we have a deal so no need to ask every day :P
[19:57] <DktrKranz> sebner, deals can be torn apart
[19:57] <norsetto> nxvl: about the vcs entry, why would anyone want an upstream vcs entry in  a debain package control file?
[19:57] <sebner> DktrKranz: well, do you want to hear the hard, cruel truth?
[19:57] <nxvl> norsetto: to contribute to upstrea?
[19:57] <nxvl> upstream
[19:58] <norsetto> nxvl: in a debian control file?
[19:58]  * DktrKranz hides
[19:58] <nxvl> :D
[19:58] <sebner> norsetto: Am I ready for applying for MOTU? --> please response to DktrKranz  ;)
[19:58] <nxvl> sebner: so we will have a new MOTU in some days?
[19:59] <nxvl> norsetto: i think i have confuse the entry
[19:59] <norsetto> nxvl: I think so too
[19:59] <sebner> nxvl: nope
[19:59] <nxvl> norsetto: but also, why do i want the "development" state of the packaging stuff
[19:59] <nxvl> oh
[19:59] <DktrKranz> sebner for U.S. president
[19:59] <sebner> DktrKranz: a lot better =)
[19:59] <nxvl> heh, i read i'm already appliying to MOTU
[19:59] <nxvl> :p
[19:59] <nxvl> i need to sleep better
[20:00] <sebner> nxvl: lol
[20:00] <DktrKranz> nxvl, you need to apply too, do not sleep :P
[20:00] <RoAkSoAx> go sebner-bama
[20:00] <RoAkSoAx> or sebner-cain
[20:00] <RoAkSoAx> ? :P xD
[20:00] <nxvl> DktrKranz: i will when i feel ready to it, augeas has make me feel like a new contributor again
[20:01] <sebner> RoAkSoAx: bama :P
[20:01] <sebner> BAH. Pidgin workaround isn't working for me O_o
[20:04] <nxvl> sebner: i love that bug report
[20:04] <sebner> nxvl: and I have icq -.-
[20:06]  * nxvl doesn't use icq since 1998
[20:06] <nxvl> well, need to go buy some stuff for a university project
[20:06] <nxvl> read you later!
[20:07] <nxvl> norsetto: i'm uploading a new version without the Vcs-* things
[20:08] <nxvl> norsetto: please give it a look when you have time
[20:08] <emgent> hello there
[20:09] <nxvl> emgent: you!
[20:09] <emgent> me?
[20:09] <nxvl> emgent: can you please take a look at augeas, and write/start drafting lenses for it please
[20:09] <nxvl> emgent: http://augeas.net/docs/writing-schemas.html
[20:09] <nxvl> emgent: so you can use augeas in rapache
[20:09] <emgent> i dont know nxvl
[20:09] <nxvl> :D
[20:09] <nxvl> :(
[20:10] <emgent> uhm. join #rapache-devel
[20:10] <nxvl> <- unknown random guy
[20:10] <emgent> hahaha
[20:10] <emgent> nxvl: join it
[20:10] <emgent> :)
[20:10] <nxvl> emgent: i'm just going out to buy some things, nut in the night i will
[20:10] <nxvl> :D
[20:10] <emgent> ok nice
[20:10] <nxvl> emgent: but please take a look at the link i have just pasted
[20:11] <emgent> nxvl: try to talk with tacone, him saw augeas
[20:11] <emgent> sure i will do!
[20:11] <emgent> thanks nxvl :)
[20:11] <nxvl> lenses are just regexp in a file
[20:11] <nxvl> not hard
[20:11] <nxvl> augeas work on this lenses
[20:11] <emgent> let me see
[20:11] <nxvl> i was asking it, because the apache lens looks like a nightmare to me
[20:11] <nxvl> and you have already strip it (or something like) for rapache
[20:12] <nxvl> now
[20:12] <emgent> uhm..
[20:12] <nxvl> i'm gone
[20:12] <nxvl> read you later!
[20:12] <emgent> ok bye :)
[20:17] <unohu> Hi...the nvidia kernel module is not included in restricted-modules....is it moved to some other package or will be included later? ...sorry if its the wrong place to ask .... thanks
[20:24] <sebner> BAM! Pidgin is running again =)
[20:27] <RoAkSoAx> lolbama
[20:31] <Kopfgeldjaeger2> sebner: how do you mean? did you compile it with the patch?
[20:31] <sebner> Kopfgeldjaeger2: exactly
[20:32] <Kopfgeldjaeger2> I uploaded a patched package to my PPA minutes ago
[20:32] <sebner> Kopfgeldjaeger2: hardy or intrepid?
[20:32] <Kopfgeldjaeger2> hardy
[20:33] <sebner> Kopfgeldjaeger2: well I have intrepid and the hardy patch isn't working. I took the patch from dev.pidgin
[20:42] <Laney> I thought ICQ had gone away :o
[20:44] <sebner> Laney: not for feisty O_o
[20:44] <sebner> Laney: patch! patch! patch"
[20:44] <Laney> I mean the protocol/site, didn't think anyone used it any more!
[20:44] <Laney> sebner: I want to do the SRU, good experience.... but waiting for an official patch ;)
[20:45] <sebner> Laney: nice
[20:45] <Laney> #pidgin has gone a bit haywire
[20:46] <emgent> hi sebner Laney
[20:46] <Laney> People actually use binaries that are distributed on IRC.. worrying :(
[20:46] <Laney> hi emgent
[20:46] <sebner> emgent: hihu
[20:46] <sebner> Laney: I use binaries builded by me xD
[20:47] <Laney> You brave brave man :O
[20:47] <sebner> lol
[20:47] <sebner> rofl
[20:47] <sebner> *build
[20:47] <sebner> hmm
[20:47] <sebner> *built
[20:47] <sebner> ha!!
[20:47] <Laney> third time lucky
[20:47] <sebner> englisch n00b -.-
[20:48] <Laney> english*
[20:48] <Laney> :{
[20:48] <sebner> Laney: well, I wrote it the german way :P
[20:50] <Laney> sebner: ich habe die meisten meiner deutsch vergessen :(
[20:50] <sebner> Laney: hrhr
[20:50] <Laney> aber jetzt ist es zeit für das abendessen
[20:50] <Laney> brb!
[20:51] <sebner> hf
[20:59] <geser> Laney: that can be changed, we can try to improve your german again :)
[21:00] <sebner> geser: better you help me to improve my english xD
[21:01] <RoAkSoAx> lol
[21:03] <geser> sebner: did nobody told you that you need to speak/write either english or german to become MOTU? :)
[21:04] <sebner> geser: cool, also ab jetzt nur noch deutsch? hrhrh
[21:05] <geser> sebner: ich bin jedesmal überrascht, wieviele Personen hier deutsch verstehen
[21:06] <sebner> geser: wegen den vielen deutschen oder allgemein?
[21:06] <geser> allgemein, ich meine so viele Deutsche sind hier nicht
[21:06] <laga> ey. englisch, bitte. das ist unfair. :)
[21:07] <huats> norsetto: hey
[21:07] <sebner> lol
[21:07] <sebner> geser: naja verstehn wohl besser als selber schreiben :P
[21:07] <mario_limonciell> i must be going crazy.  english is getting harder and harder to read these days
[21:08] <RainCT> rofl
[21:08] <norsetto> mario_limonciell: try italian, at least it tastes better
[21:08] <mario_limonciell> hehe
[21:10] <directhex> mario_limonciell, english is just german with fewer gutteral letter & more spaces anyway
[21:11] <laga> i didn't know letters had any sound to them
[21:11] <laga> okay, i often hear people complain that my typing is too loud
[21:12] <directhex> laga, IS THIS THING ON?
[21:13] <laga> hah. you got me.
[21:13] <directhex> laga, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guttural
[21:14] <laga> directhex: i know. but letters != sounds
[21:14] <laga> directhex: just being a smartass here.
[21:17] <sebner> slomo: is taoframework still interesting for maintaining?
[21:19] <jcfp> standards version must be 3.8.0 now?
[21:19] <sebner> jcfp: exactly
[21:20]  * jcfp still trusts human beings over lintian
[21:20] <sebner> lol
[21:22] <Laney> didn't you hear? lintian passed the turing test
[21:26] <directhex> Laney, liar! you're lintian in disguise, trying to trick us!
[21:28] <Laney> directhex: E: uncovering-true-identity
[21:28]  * Laney runs
[21:28]  * directhex throws a bucket of blootbots at Laney 
[21:43] <slayton> andybody here have experience with falcon
[21:44] <norsetto> slayton: falcon 4.0, the state-of-the-art f16 simulator (est. 1998)?
[21:45] <slayton> no falcon the repository managing software
[21:45] <slayton> sorry
[21:45] <nxvl> norsetto: did you get change to see the last version of augeas?
[21:45] <norsetto> nxvl: what for? You said there is a new upstream version that will make you change your packaging
[21:46] <ScottK> slayton: I know imbrandon uses it.
[21:46] <ScottK> And of course seveas is upstream for it.
[21:47] <nxvl> norsetto: yes, but just minor changes
[21:47] <nxvl> norsetto: it will just make me drop some patches, so the debian/ directory (at least most of it) will be intact
[21:47] <nxvl> i'm more woried about the copyright commends you pointed
[21:48] <norsetto> nxvl: we will see once its there, there is no point to do nugatory work
[21:48] <nxvl> norsetto: ok :D
[21:49] <slayton> ok thanks
[21:49] <norsetto> nxvl: for debian/copyright, just make sure you list all the copyrights (you have to manually scan all sources) and all licenses (again, manually scan all sources, you can also use license-check but its of limited help)
[21:50] <RAOF> emgent: Pong?
[21:51] <norsetto> nxvl: you better do it, otherwise you package risks being rejected from the new queue by the archive
[21:51] <nxvl> 0 have already, but my brain is in reverse mode
[21:51] <nxvl> i don't think anymore since 2 days ago
[21:51] <nxvl> :D
[21:52] <nxvl> so i may make mistakes
[21:52] <norsetto> nxvl: stop living on coke and have a good night of sleep ;-)
[21:52] <emgent> RAOF: there is a big problem in gnome-do and gnome-do-plugins
[21:53] <RAOF> emgent: Gah!  Really?  I'm about to hit it, then.
[21:53] <emgent> gnome-do search plugins in /usr/share/gdm/gnome-do/plugins but do_plugins installed in /usr/share/gnome-do/plugins
[21:54] <norsetto> ScottK: the package in bug 242635 is not meant to solve the removal problem for people that have mistakenly already installed trousers, is only for those that haven't yet, AFAIK there is now way to solve the former problem but hacking the init script (but wouldn't mind to be proven wrong)
[21:54] <RAOF> emgent: gnome-do _should_ search in {~/.local/share/gnome-do/plugins,/usr/share/gdm/gnome-do/plugins,/usr/share/gnome-do/plugins}
[21:54] <emgent> bug isn`t opened yet, I'm reviewing it
[21:54] <emgent> RAOF: are you sure?
[21:54] <ScottK> norsetto: I'm looking at it now.
[21:54] <emgent> RAOF: just a moment
[21:55] <RAOF> emgent: It searches $XDG_DATA_DIRS, $XDG_DATA_HOME.  For some reason we have /usr/share/gdm/ in $XDG_DATA_DIRS
[21:55] <RAOF> Actually, I think there's a closed bug about this :)
[21:55] <emgent> RAOF:
[21:55] <emgent> 01/07/2008 22.55.06 [Info]: Searching for plugins in directory /usr/share/gdm/gnome-do/plugins
[21:55] <emgent> 01/07/2008 22.55.06 [Warn]: Could not read plugins directory /usr/share/gdm/gnome-do/plugins: Directory '/usr/share/gdm/gnome-do/plugins' not found.
[21:55] <RAOF> Yup.  That's normal.
[21:56] <emgent> but gnome-do-plugins make dir in /usr/share/gnome-do/plugins
[21:56] <RAOF> Also, yes.
[21:56] <RAOF> It searches _both_, and prints a warning because there's (unsurprisingly) no /usr/share/gdm/gnome-do/plugins directory.
[21:57] <RAOF> Starting Do with --quiet will silence all these info and warn messages :)
[21:57] <ScottK> norsetto: I think you could change dh_installinit with --error-handler= to catch the error and gracefully stop on removal.  The new prerm will get called if the old one fails, so this should work.
[21:57] <emgent> RAOF: radical method :)
[21:58] <RAOF> emgent: It should warn about that directory, and it should be searching there.
[21:58] <norsetto> ScottK: I don't think it will ever get there, the old prerm will still fail and the new one will not handle this case too
[21:58] <RAOF> emgent: The only thing that's possibly wrong here is: why is /usr/share/gdm in $XDG_DATA_DIRS?
[21:58] <ScottK> norsetto: Once the old prerm fails, it tries the new one.
[21:59] <emgent> RAOF: true
[21:59] <norsetto> ScottK: yes, but why should the new one succeed? Its still the same init file
[21:59] <ScottK> norsetto: Add a function in the new one that just exits.
[22:00] <londar> why
[22:00] <norsetto> ScottK: have you got any example where this is done ?
[22:01] <londar> why
[22:01] <ScottK> norsetto: I do have an example of the new prerm being run.  It's in comment 9 to this very bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/trousers/+bug/242635/comments/9
[22:01] <emgent> so, good night peopale
[22:01] <emgent> i go  to sleep
[22:01] <londar> why
[22:01] <emgent> RAOF: thanks for reply
[22:01] <emgent> night
[22:02] <londar> why
[22:02] <norsetto> ScottK: yes, I know, I mean an example where --error-handler is used
[22:02] <londar> poor norsetto
[22:02] <McPeter> ...
[22:02] <ScottK> norsetto: No.  Sorry.
[22:02] <londar> poor ScottK
[22:02] <ScottK> It looks, from the man page, like it should work.
[22:03] <norsetto> ScottK: np, thanks for the tip, I will try to make it work
[22:03] <ScottK> londar: Say something useful or please don't take up space on my screen.
[22:03] <ScottK> norsetto: Great.  Good luck.
[22:03] <londar> scottK sucks
[22:03] <norsetto> ScottK: be warned, if it does, you have to ack the upload ;-)
[22:04] <ScottK> !ops
[22:04] <McPeter> ScottK, +1
[22:04] <McPeter> he is banned from #ubuntu-fr just before
[22:04] <ScottK> norsetto: Yes.  I will.
[22:08] <ScottK> Problem solved.
[22:08] <McPeter> :)
[22:09] <Festor> ScottK, Why are so important aMule bugs in launchpad?
[22:09] <McPeter> bye :)
[22:09] <ScottK> Because we have criteria for SRU that are based on problems solved.
[22:10] <Festor> In aMule forum there are also many reported bugs
[22:10] <ScottK> But which ones are fixed?
[22:10] <ScottK> Festor: The criteria are here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates?action=show#head-9bac29d96da353649a97b4b1918c0b382b79a000
[22:11] <Festor> but this bugs are of people with the svn snapshot
[22:11] <Festor> sorry for my bad English
[22:11] <ScottK> No problem.  Your English is fine.
[22:12] <Festor> I cant say if these bugs wil be solved
[22:12] <ScottK> But forum posts are not bugs in the bug tracking system.
[22:12] <ScottK> That's what needs to be checked is are there bugs that are solved.
[22:12] <Festor> with aMule 2.2.1 in proposed at least we can test
[22:13] <ScottK> Someone could upload it to a PPA and get people to test from there.
[22:13] <Festor> ScottK, https://launchpad.net/~festor90/+archive
[22:13] <ScottK> -proposed is for verification prior to copying to -updates and giving to everyone, not figuring out if it's a good idea or not.
[22:15] <Festor> All those who have tried this repository have had better results than with the svn
[22:15] <neversfelde> hi, where can I find a sample debian/rules without cdbs for python packages?
[22:15] <ScottK> Right, but better needs to be in terms of bugs fixed, not just 'better'.
[22:15] <Festor> In addition, we will maintain a svn snapshoot for 3 years?
[22:16] <ScottK> neversfelde: Grab the stepic package and look at it's debian/rules.
[22:16] <ScottK> Festor: Unless someone comes up with a good reason to change it, yes.
[22:16] <Festor> O.o
[22:17] <Festor> of Kry aMule developer
[22:17] <Festor> "that the February-2.2.1 Kademlia 2.2.1 is fully implemented, so that a svn of February muchisima lacks functionality, and also are arranged serious bugs in the process of the network also Kad"
[22:17] <norsetto> ScottK: it works!
[22:17] <ScottK> Sorry.  That's how it works Festor.
[22:17] <ScottK> norsetto: ;-)
[22:18] <Festor> Ok, give me some time to find more accurately bugs
[22:18] <ScottK> Festor: No rush.  Just comment in the bug that you are researching details so other motu-sru members know you are working on it.
[22:18] <neversfelde> ScottK: thanks
[22:19] <Festor> ScottK, ok but for curiosity, you've read the whole post?
[22:20] <Festor> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/amule/+bug/244670
[22:20] <ScottK> Festor: I did.
[22:20] <Festor> guau...
[22:20] <Festor> Is that you answered very quickly
[22:21] <ScottK> There is a strong presumption that we don't change stuff after release.  Most of what you have there are forums links which aren't particularly relevant to the question.
[22:21] <ScottK> Plus I read quickly.
[22:23] <neversfelde> ScottK: thanks
[22:23] <ScottK> neversfelde: That's what you were loooking for?
[22:24] <norsetto> ScottK: please, feel free to check bug 242635 if and when you have time
[22:24] <ScottK> norsetto: You've tested it, right?
[22:25] <norsetto> ScottK: yes, testlog in bug report
[22:25] <ScottK> norsetto: That will do the same if it fails in postinst.  Is that what we want?
[22:26] <Kry> ScottK, I understand that you're the person that was talking to Festor about his request to update aMule in hardy to 2.2.1?
[22:27] <norsetto> ScottK: it won't fail in postinst if driver is not there, the init script is ok for that, is just the prerm one that won't work
[22:27] <ScottK> norsetto: OK.  Ack to upload then.
[22:27] <ScottK> Kry: Yes.
[22:27] <Kry> and the decision is not to update it, I reckon?
[22:27] <norsetto> ScottK: okki, thanks
[22:28] <ScottK> Kry: No.  The suggestion was to document what bugs get fixed.
[22:28] <ScottK> That's not a No.  It's a document that it meets the rules for post-release update.
[22:28] <neversfelde> ScottK: I think so, dpkg-buildpackage worked now. I will try and come back for more questions ;)
[22:28] <Kry> What kind of bugs? Launchpad bugs?
[22:29] <Kry> Or are you, specifically, willing for Festor/upstream to document to you, step by step, all the bugs solved in the svn revision since february to the actual release of the program in a neat list?
[22:29] <ScottK> Yes.  That's most preferred, but upstream bugs can count too if they can are applicable to Ubuntu.
[22:29] <Kry> upstream bugs are always applicable to ubuntu. It's the same program, as far as I know.
[22:30] <ScottK> Kry: The criteria are here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates?action=show#head-9bac29d96da353649a97b4b1918c0b382b79a000
[22:30] <ScottK> Not every piece of code in a package is exercised the same way in different software environments.
[22:31] <ScottK> motu-sru need to be convinced that it fixes SRU worthy bugs and there isn't a narrower patch set that could reasonably achieve the same fixes at lower risk.
[22:31] <Kry> while that is true, aMule's code works over the wxWidgets library as a framework, so it's very much platform independant mostly.
[22:31] <ScottK> I'm almost certain these are both true, but I'm not willing to assume the requirements away.
[22:32] <Kry> the fact that upstream believes that the version ubuntu has is a) SVN b) incomplete, by definition and c) unstable and harmful to the networks the application works with, while the release version is, of course, what upstream considers stable and proper to distribute, should be very much a valid point.
[22:34] <joaopinto> Ubuntu vs Upstream (watching) :P
[22:34] <Kry> joaopinto, this hasn't even become a ubuntu vs upstream discussion, I haven't begun flaming ;)
[22:34] <joaopinto> eheh
[22:35] <dushara> persia: Are you busy right now?
[22:36] <ScottK> Kry: All I'm asking is a little research to detail the facts.
[22:36] <Kry> there are more than 700 svn revisions between that svn version and the upstream release. Who are you asking to do that research over those 700 changes, and what should that research show?
[22:37] <Festor> 	
[22:37] <Festor> I am in it but I do not know if I get enough of the bugs Launchpad
[22:37] <dushara> Can anyone comment on the last 2 paras of http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_name=be9ccc720806161838y4c233c84gd05e6c64cb227bdf%40mail.gmail.com?
[22:38] <ScottK> Kry: The research should show that things that were broken before are not broken now and that things that worked before work now.
[22:38] <Kry> to what extent? Do you want to see code patches?
[22:39] <Kry> Upstream is actually telling you that things were broken before, and are not broken now
[22:39] <Kry> you want upstream to detail to you what they have done in their application?
[22:39] <ScottK> Kry: No.  Not to that extent.  I'd be happy with a list of here are the bugs that are fixed that meet SRU criteria and we've tested that by ...
[22:40] <Kry> maybe upstream should consider becoming commertial software and becoming a ubuntu partner, as as I read those new versions qualify inmediatly.
[22:40] <Kry> joaopinto, see this is more like it.
[22:40] <RAOF> dushara: What is the actual software they're packaging?  My intitial thought is "damn, I'd need to repack the tarball to remove their debian/ dir".
[22:40] <joaopinto> Kry, well, I was just previewing :P
[22:40] <nxvl> norsetto: we have 0.2.1 already i will uploda it in some minutes
[22:40] <ScottK> But if they want a native package, they can.
[22:41] <norsetto> kry: all this just shows that the mistake was to approve an FFe, which was approved on the ground "it fixes bugs and add uPnP support"
[22:41] <dushara> RAOF: Language related stuff. SCIM keyboard engines, fonts and related stuff.
[22:41] <RAOF> dushara: In what way is that Debian native?
[22:41] <ScottK> Kry: As someone who approved that feature freeze exception, I'll be certain to be much more careful next time.
[22:41] <pochu> norsetto: actually upstream told me svn was way better than 2.1.3
[22:41] <Kry> norsetto, well, it more shows that the mistake was to put that in a stable release.
[22:41] <RAOF> dushara: I think the answer is: It isn't, so they should be building a non-native package.
[22:42] <norsetto> pochu, kry: yes, we all agree then
[22:42] <ScottK> Kry: Yes.  We leave the old stuff in.  We could also upload the old stable version with a new number too.
[22:42] <dushara> RAOF: I'm a n00b to packaging. But Anuradha, explains what he means by deb native in that email. (I'm nidujay in that list)
[22:42] <Kry> don't get me wrong - I know upstream hadn't released in like forever by the time hardy was out. But between the svn ubuntu has and 2.2.1, there are actually fixes that solve not only grave functionality bugs, but also stability problems.
[22:43] <ScottK> Kry: There are ~20,000 packages in the Universe repository with upstreams of widely varying capability and reliability.  We need to have rules to deal with all of them.
[22:43] <ScottK> So just work with us a bit here and help out with some documentation.
[22:43] <dushara> RAOF: he's replying to my question in the end of this: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/message.php?msg_name=47c391870806161603i42edbaa9ra0f077ee77b4a04f%40mail.gmail.com
[22:43] <Festor> The first bug package
[22:43] <Festor> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/amule/+bug/244670/comments/5
[22:44] <pochu> Kry: I think updating to 2.2.1 is the way to go, but I don't think just saying "update it because I'm saying it" is the right way to go. We need to make sure it doesn't break in a stable release, so testing it (the Ubuntu package specifically) and checking that there are no obvious regressions, and that severe bugs (e.g. amulegui not starting at all) are fixed is likely better IMHO
[22:44] <Kry> I am not saying it.
[22:44] <Kry> I am very much not imposing anything on anyone.
[22:44] <sebner> gn8 folks =)
[22:44] <ScottK> That's certainly what it sounds like at this end of the table.
[22:44] <norsetto> kry:  yes, its frustrating but thats the way distro work. We do have backports, so, consider that option, or hand pick appropriate fixes and we will update the package with those
[22:45] <RAOF> dushara: I know what Debian native means, I just don't see why that package should be debian native.
[22:45] <Kry> if that is how it sounds, then I'm sorry for it.
[22:46] <ScottK> RAOF: It's suboptimal, but it's not prohibited.
[22:46] <RAOF> dushara: Packages should be debian native if they're only ever going to be interesting to Debian (canonical example: dpkg, or apt-get).  SCIM modules are useful everywhere, not just Debian, so shouldn't be in a native package.
[22:46] <norsetto> RAOF: canonical examples !? :)
[22:46] <pochu> Kry: then we are all good. what ScottK said in the bug wasn't a "No", it was a "can you tell something more about the update, does it fix bugs, what bugs, anything important we should know about?...", or does how I see it
[22:46] <Kry> What I am pointing out is that if you trust upstream code to actually have a package of their application, you (in my opinion) should trust upstream when they say that a new stable release, versus a svn release that is not only unstable, but has a gigantic warning about it that ubuntu removed when uploading it, fixed grave functionality bugs without the need for upstream, or whoever does it, to actually spend long time trying to
[22:46] <Kry> document that to you.
[22:46] <ScottK> That was certainly my intent.
[22:46] <pochu> he's responsible for updates in stable releases, so it is his work to be sure the update will be good before approving it
[22:47] <Kry> indeed, I am not trying to be inflamatory
[22:47] <Kry> I am trying to save you and me a lot of work.
[22:47] <Kry> of course, this being me, it will only sound inflamatory, and you know it pochu ;)
[22:47] <RAOF> norsetto: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/canonical :)
[22:48] <norsetto> Kry: flame away, we have asbestos suits and skin that elephants envy us
[22:48] <Kry> so do I, no worries.
[22:48] <pochu> so e.g. a changelog diff which will show the bugs fixed since the hardy package, a comment saying what was tested and is working correctly (e.g. the main client, amulegui, amuled...). I don't think that's a lot of work, and that's something to be done by downstream, we are not requesting upstream to test our packages :)
[22:49] <pochu> Kry: sure, we also want the best for the end users, so it's good you came and tell us :)
[22:49] <ScottK> Kry: There are 34 open bugs against amule and ~half are crashers just from looking at the titles.  How may of the crashes are fixed?
[22:49] <RAOF> norsetto: Being a mathematician, I'm using meaning 4 ;)
[22:49] <Kry> ScottK, we really shouldn't enter the "crashes on lanchpad" territory
[22:50] <Kry> I am avoiding it on purpose
[22:50] <norsetto> raof: well, you should have explicitely said so :-P
[22:50] <ScottK> Why?
[22:50] <pochu> Kry: for any reason in particular?
[22:50] <norsetto> raof: QED ;-)
[22:50] <Kry> pochu, a changelog diff is not possibly, due to the fact that ustream only builds changelogs before relases.
[22:50] <nxvl> norsetto: 0.2.1 is already in revu :D
[22:50] <RAOF> norsetto: What?  _Everyone_ isn't a mathematician? :P
[22:51] <norsetto> raof: 2 persons out of 3 don't know what a fraction is
[22:51] <pochu> Kry: the hardy package has docs/Changelog
[22:51] <lifeless> we so have to start calling company shirts canonicals
[22:51] <norsetto> raof: which is milder that the real one: "Three out of two people have difficulties with fractions."
[22:52] <lifeless> norsetto: thats still a fine fraction :)
[22:52] <norsetto> lifeless: get a life :-)
[22:53] <frostburn> RAOF, I am
[22:53] <lifeless> norsetto: there are some debates you don't want to enter in a channel full of programmers
[22:53] <ScottK> We can discuss the difference between one and one and only one if you want.
[22:55] <Kry> sorry, I was trying to get a frog from under the bed.
[22:55] <lifeless> ScottK: if and only if you feel its relevant
[22:55] <Kry> no kidding.
[22:55] <Kry> never get a cat.
[22:55] <RAOF> Kry: Cool!
[22:55] <norsetto> nxvl: why don't you just take it easy, doing things in a rush its not getting us anywhere. We have until August to upload this ...
[22:55] <norsetto> kry: don't t tell me
[22:56] <ScottK> ;-)
[22:56] <nxvl> norsetto: i'm just exited about the new release
[22:56] <nxvl> :D
[22:56] <Kry> ScottK /  pochu: since the Dawn of Time, crahes reported bu ubuntu users have been, 99% of the times, solved by telling the users to recompile wx and aMule themselves.
[22:57] <Kry> there is something about the patches ubuntu applied in the past to wxWidgets, or posibily other packages, that causes crashes that are not related to aMule, but we're the ones getting those.
[22:57] <ScottK> Kry: OK.  Why is this?  Is there a bug in the packaging we need to fix?
[22:57] <Kry> I have no idea, to be honest.
[22:57] <ScottK> OK.  That's definitely worth dealing with.
[22:57] <norsetto> nxvl: don't, think about augeas upstream coming here and flaming us because we ruined his beatiful software
[22:57] <dushara> RAOF: I've been asked to maintain the deb repos for the plgs developed by the lanka linux group. Anuradha is the debian maintainer. I think someone else is working on RPMs, what would be the issues if we try to maintain them as native to each distro?
[22:57] <dushara> pkgs not plgs :-)
[22:58] <Kry> now, on the subject of 2.2.1, the extended version of the Kademlia network, Kad2, wasn't complete in the svn ubuntu has. That was Bad (tm), to the extent of damaginig the network, especially when dealing with firewalled users, but also when indexing files >4GB.
[22:58] <Kry> that's serious, from the ntework perspective.
[22:58] <ScottK> dushara: It can be done, but it can be challenging.  Each time you make a change in the debian packages, then you have to do a new release.
[22:59] <ScottK> Kry: That's the kind of thing we'd want to do an update for.
[22:59] <Kry> also the new network code reinforces the security of the network about attacks to its nodes, and it's important not to have old clients around.
[23:00] <Festor> Kry, ScottK https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/amule/+bug/206648/comments/7
[23:00] <Kry> and that's just an example, really
[23:00] <ScottK> Kry: If you can put some detail behind those two ideas along with some statements about regression testing, that'd be very good.
[23:00] <nxvl> norsetto: :(
[23:00] <Kry> .. sigh.
[23:00] <Kry> sec.
[23:01] <Festor> "For release versions, we don't want to allow connections from any arbitrary SVN client."
[23:01] <ScottK> Festor: That's a good one too.
[23:01] <ScottK> So we'll patch the svn version in a more sneaky way next time.  BTW, no one mentioned that when they asked to have the svn snapshot uploaded.
[23:02] <Kry> well, there is a //#define SVN in the sourcecode
[23:02] <ScottK> Kry and Festor: I'm convinced we should do this.  Please mark that stuff in the request bug.
[23:02] <Kry> with a big comment about commenting it out in release versions
[23:02] <Kry> just saying.
[23:02] <ScottK> Right.  I didn't package the snapshot.
[23:02] <ScottK> Of course I could fix that particular bug with a very small diff then.
[23:02]  * norsetto will remember to be more carefull when granting FFe based on svn snapshots
[23:03] <Kry> it's partially my fault, when asked if it was ok to upload that svn as a package for ubuntu I said yes, so we're all to blame
[23:03] <Kry> I just didn't expect it going past unstable releases
[23:03] <Kry> (I'm obviously a debian user)
[23:04] <ScottK> In Ubuntu we deliver every 6 months ready or not.  Sometimes that's good.  Sometimes it's not.
[23:04] <Kry> I'll let festor deal with things from now on... I really have to scold a cat.
[23:04] <Festor> ok, thanks for all
[23:04] <Festor> :D
[23:04] <Kry> and sorry if I sound inflamatory.
[23:04] <Kry> c'ya
[23:04] <dushara> ScottK: I think that's the idea. LKLUG is a centralised development 'forum' and the plan is to release a pkg to debian and ubuntu every time bugs are fixed. I'm not sure, but it looks like this avenue has already been decided upon. That's why I'm trying to work out if I can still do it without breaking any Ubuntu packaging guidlines.
[23:04] <sebner> ScottK: ready or not ^^
[23:05] <ScottK> dushara: If you want to get stuff into the Ubuntu repositories, please do NOT package them native.
[23:07] <dushara> ScottK: cool. thanks for the info.
[23:09] <ScottK> dushara: Here is how I do it: http://www.openspf.org/Software I don't include the debian packaging in the tarball, but point to where it's kept in svn.
[23:11] <RAOF> Hey, is apport turned on in Intrepid?
[23:40] <persia> dushara: Sorry: was away again.  I hope some of your question was answered above, but try again if not.
[23:41] <pochu> any idea why sugar-base source is at 0.81.1-2 and was built on June 22, but the hardy repos don't have the binaries?
[23:42] <pochu> sugar-base |      0.3-1 | http://archive.ubuntu.com intrepid/universe Packages
[23:42] <pochu> sugar-base |   0.81.1-2 | http://archive.ubuntu.com intrepid/universe Sources
[23:43] <persia> pochu: Have you checked tbe build records on LP?
[23:44] <pochu> persia: yes, it built fine: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar-base/0.81.1-2
[23:45] <pochu> persia: oh, found it
[23:45] <pochu> the new version builds python-sugar and not sugar-base
[23:45] <pochu> python-sugar |   0.81.1-2 | http://archive.ubuntu.com intrepid/universe Packages
[23:46] <persia> Heh.  There you go.
[23:46] <persia> sugar-base will likely disappear as soon as sugar and sugar-datastore are updated.
[23:47] <devfil> hi pochu, persia :)
[23:47] <pochu> ok. I was just looking at packages depending on libffi4 unnecessarily though, and sugar-base was one of them :)
[23:47] <emgent> do to sleep devfil :)
[23:47] <pochu> hey devfil
[23:47] <emgent> s/do/go/
[23:47] <devfil> emgent: lol
[23:48] <emgent> hi emilio
[23:48]  * pochu wants to go to sleep :)
[23:48] <pochu> hey emgent :)
[23:48] <persia> pochu: Recurse in NBS :)  Update sugar and sugar-datastore, and it drops sugar-base, which drops the dependency on libffi4
[23:48] <devfil> pochu: then go to sleep! what are you doing here? :)
[23:50] <pochu> persia: hmm... I'm tempted to leave that to Jani :)
[23:50] <pochu> what is sugar, BTW?
[23:50] <pochu> heh
[23:50] <persia> pochu: It's just an NBS rebuild.  I can't imagine anyone minding a quick update, as the package otherwise cannot be installed.
[23:54] <pochu> ah, I see
[23:59] <emgent> night.
[23:59] <emgent> see you later people.
[23:59] <pochu> there's bug 242236. I'll let it and the sugar update to someone else though... I'm not going to check I don't break it badly :)
[23:59] <pochu> night emgent