/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/07/17/#ubuntu-website.txt

newz2000sorry guys, I didn't get the email sent about the meeting, I will have to send it tomorrow05:05
VolansHi all! newz2000 have you 5 minutes?15:06
newz2000Hey Volans, sure15:07
Volansfirst of all, have you talk with lizzeh or other active members for the meeting?15:07
newz2000I'm just going to send an email... already started compzing in fact15:07
Volansok, the second is your opinion about 3 bugs15:09
Volans1) a fridge bug, like the background problem, you tell me about a new theme in the Fridge, but when you think to upload it?15:10
newz2000right now the fridge problem is low on my priority list so I've not scheduled a time to do it15:12
newz2000I've created a better template (though fixed width) and uploaded it, but it's just an html file, not a drupal theme15:13
Volansand release a little fix (probably 1 line in css) to resolve at least the background problem in the meantime?15:14
Volans(you think that can be a good compromise between time to spent on and results)15:14
newz2000what is the background problem?15:14
Volanshttp://fridge.ubuntu.com/about15:31
Volansyou don't see a background problem?15:31
Volans(sorry for the delay, I have see only now your reply, the tab does not flashed)15:31
newz2000ah, that prob15:32
newz2000Volans: I see it, just forgot about it.15:32
newz2000(short content)15:33
Volansyou can solve it (I think for all browsers except IE6 and below) simply adding: min-height:582px; at styles.css:27 class #contentr15:33
newz2000ok, I'll do that right now15:34
Volansat least 582px, maybe some more pixel will be better in order to avoid problem15:34
Volanswith different pixel dimensions for different browsers15:34
* newz2000 tries to remember what server that's on15:34
VolansLOL15:34
Volans.183 marais15:35
Volans;)15:35
newz2000Volans: done15:36
newz2000thanks for the quick fix suggestion15:36
Volansno problem, can you check also for windows browsers?15:36
Volans(or I can start the VM)15:37
newz2000I have a vm open15:37
newz2000I'm sure that it won't work in ie615:37
Volansseems good on FF215:37
Volansfor IE6 and the known problem of min-height I have found a good solution15:37
Volansin general15:37
newz2000it works in ie7 though, which is interesting... I didn't know it had min-height15:38
Volansif you have a div you want to add a min-height and it is in a page with many other divs floating or not, I found that putting another div works for ie615:39
Volans<div><div class="minheight">content</div></div>15:40
Volansor at least works for me in many cases :)15:40
newz2000so in a sense just clearing the floated divs with a non-floated div15:41
newz2000neat idea15:41
Volansif you have IE6 open15:41
Volanstry for example this http://forum.ubuntu-it.org/index.php?action=search15:41
newz2000whoa15:42
Volansthe div id="bodyarea" have a min-height15:42
newz2000the fridge is totally messed up in ie615:42
VolansI never tried, but thinking about due to the strange position of the top div that is at the bottom in the code15:43
newz2000I don't know... it's like all of the text is white15:43
* Volans starting the VM... too curious15:43
newz2000the new theme I'm using is currently in place on https://shipit.ubuntu.com15:45
newz2000it seems to work well across browsers15:45
newz2000there is the "flash of unstyled content" problem in IE though I need to fix.15:46
Volansnewz2000: why shipit have as favicon the new launchpad logo?15:47
newz2000ah, didn't notice that... shipit is part of launchpad15:47
Volansnot clear from the site layout ;) seems to be ubuntu site15:48
Volansehm with IE6 I don't see the content on the fridge...15:49
newz2000right, that's the problem I mentioned15:49
VolansI can help for that? (I understand that for you is a very low priority problem)15:49
newz2000if you'd like to, that's fine... or if you want, you can help create a drupal theme from the shipit theme15:50
newz2000either option will mean you become boredandblogging new best friend15:51
VolansLOL, sincerly I never worked on drupal themes... but I have experience of themes for other CMS15:51
newz2000drupal is easier than most... for example, far easier than wordpress15:52
Volansshipit now is a standalone site, without a cms behind?15:52
newz2000correct... it has been from as far back as I know15:53
Volansok, I will look what I can do15:53
newz2000I can help you... I have an html file15:53
Volansgood starting point :)15:54
newz2000http://people.ubuntu.com/~mnuzum/projects/layout-guide-helper.png15:55
newz2000oops15:55
newz2000no, that's not it15:55
newz2000http://people.ubuntu.com/~mnuzum/projects/ubuntu08.zip15:55
newz2000so what might surprise you when you look at this file is that I used a css framework called blueprint to create the layout and handle typography and a full reset15:56
Volansok15:56
Volansthe other 2 bugs are simpler... for bug 188297 I don't know your opinion... the pdf seems clear and looks good15:57
ubot3Malone bug 188297 in ubuntu-website "Website [stylesheet probably] Problem." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/18829715:57
Volansops15:57
Volansnot this one15:58
newz2000and here's an examle drupal theme for you to use https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~newz/ubuntu-website/ubuntu0715:58
Volansthis one bug 18539815:58
ubot3Malone bug 185398 in ubuntu-website "Add developer playbook to the development page" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/18539815:58
newz2000oh, awesome16:00
Volansnewz2000: How many IE6-compatibility is required for the sites managed by you and the team?16:14
newz2000IE 6 is needed for ubuntu.com, but I'm satisfied with "site is readable but not perfect"16:14
Volanshave you read this article? http://googleonlinesecurity.blogspot.com/2008/07/are-you-using-latest-web-browser.html16:15
Volanscit. "Only 52.5% of Microsoft Internet Explorer users have updated to version 7"16:16
newz2000yes, but I'm quite certain that stat is wrong...16:16
newz2000oh, wait, maybe not16:16
newz2000here's what I know about our users... on www.ubuntu.com which is the most trafficked site of ours by IE users (other sites have smaller % of IE users than www.u.c) less than 15% are using IE616:17
newz200015% is a lot, so I want to ensure the site is navigable and readable16:17
VolansI agree!16:17
newz2000so for example, ubuntu.com has a white line going down the right side16:18
newz2000it doesn't hinder usability. Its not ideal (and the new theme fixes that) but it's not a big deal.16:18
newz2000to me16:18
newz2000Volans: that's a neat article16:19
Volansok, in my previous work every browser used by more than 1-2% of users must be compatible16:20
vbabiynewz2000: do we have a launchpad time?16:20
vbabiyteam16:20
newz2000vbabiy: not really. There's one for bugs if you're interested in that.16:21
newz2000we will at some point have a team16:21
newz2000Volans: I don't know if you had a chance to look at that theme...16:21
newz2000you'll see there's a subtle diff in the drop shadow16:21
newz2000the designers who made the original concept did something horrible with the drop shadow16:21
Volansnews the shipit theme?16:21
newz2000yes16:21
Volansonline or in the code?16:22
newz2000if you download that zip file and open it you can view the theme in your browser16:22
newz2000but shipit is ok to16:22
newz2000the original ubuntu theme has a drop shadow that extends out both the left and right side and overlays a gradient background16:22
newz2000this is harder to implment that it seems at first16:23
newz2000so the new ubuntu08 theme gets rid of the drop shadow on the sides, its just on the bottom16:23
Volansdownloaded the zip, not already open it, I was working on the opera bug16:23
newz2000which allows the markup and css to be far simpler16:23
Volansah ok16:23
newz2000anyway, that one fix makes life far easier and now the theme should work great in all major browsers16:24
Volanswe have the side and bottom shadow and I have worked hard to make it almost compatible with all browser and ie616:24
newz2000so you have felt the pain eh?16:25
vbabiyHey have you guys seen the post I did on the Wiki? Any suggestion? One thing I noticed this morning the side bar is a little to large I think and I still need new fonts. Tonight I am going to work on the screen shot widget and maybe the descriptions part.16:25
newz2000vbabiy: yes, I did16:25
newz2000I agree the text on the side is too large16:25
vbabiynewz2000: yeah that still needs some work16:25
newz2000I think you've done some good work there16:26
newz2000before you do a lot more we should discuss some goals16:26
vbabiysounds good to me16:26
newz2000I'll say again, I want the community to drive this one as much as possible, but I'd like to ask some probing questions16:26
vbabiyI am really starting to like Inkscape for web work16:26
newz2000yeah, me too16:27
vbabiynewz2000: I am all ears, I would also love this to be a community thing not something I put together16:28
vbabiynewz2000: I think once people start seeing more work done, they will start throwing in suggestions16:29
newz2000yes, I agree16:29
newz2000let's do the probing questions during the meeting16:29
newz2000I'm about to send the email now16:29
vbabiynewz2000: okay, I will work what I can till then16:29
newz2000(just doing some timezone calculations)16:29
vbabiynewz2000: I hate that, always confuse my self. :D, good luck16:29
newz2000vbabiy: one line of questioning I was going to bring up goes along these lines: (for you to ponder)16:30
newz2000how many screenshots do we want, do we want to give people a walk-through of the desktop so they can feel like they're sitting in front of it, should people be able to navigate through the images and if so, how?16:31
vbabiynewz2000: I am going to write up my answer to the question, so I can ready for the meeting16:31
newz2000ok16:31
newz2000One thing I'd like to request, but I won't insist on, is the ability to see larger images than you can see on the current feature tour16:32
newz2000maybe a "click here to view larger" or something like that16:32
* Volans back16:32
Volansnewz2000: I'm working on the opera bug for the planet and upgrading to the latest opera I notice that there is a very horribly shadow effect on the titles of planet's post16:33
newz2000orly?16:34
Volansopera 9.51 on planet.ubuntu.com for example16:34
vbabiynewz2000: I agree to be able to enlarge the images would be a benefit for older, and visual impaired people.16:35
Volansand also on www.ubuntu.com the top menu icons (red arrows) are overlapping the menu titles16:35
newz2000I'll have to get opera, I don't seem to have it installed anymore16:35
vbabiynewz2000: is it in the repos16:36
newz2000I don't see it16:36
Volansin my XP VM I have IE from 5.5 to 7, safari, opera, FF2 and FF316:36
vbabiysudo apt-get install opera16:37
newz2000says not available16:37
vbabiynewz2000: I am installing now16:37
newz2000hardy?16:37
vbabiyyeah16:37
newz2000oh, partner repo was turned off16:37
vbabiyYeah I got 9.2716:38
vbabiyokay guys I am got to run, newz2000 looking forward to meeting16:39
newz2000ok. ttyl. keep up the nice work.16:40
Volansbye vbabiy, very good work in the wiki16:40
vbabiythanks Volans16:40
Volansnewz2000: for the jcastro pdf you want I assign the bug to you or set it directly to fix released (if you want to do that)?16:44
newz2000go ahead and assign it to me16:45
newz2000I'm getting behind on my bugs while trying to work on a little project, but I'm hoping to clear those out tomorrow16:45
Volansok16:46
Volansdone, and what about the guys with black DE themes that have white default color for text in browsers?16:47
Volans(there is a bug about that, but this is a choice I think, not real a bug :))16:47
newz2000no, this is a bug actually16:48
newz2000I investigated it and I need to specify both a text color and a background color or specify neither16:48
newz2000by specifying one then the other defaults to the OS and causes a prob16:48
Volansyeah16:49
Volansboth is better16:50
Volansyou are sure what the user will see16:50
newz2000Volans, does this sound right?16:51
newz2000    6:00 in Brisbane (Australia) which is 2000 UTC/2100 London or 0230 India16:52
newz2000    7:00 in Alaska (USA) which is 11am Eastern US or 1500 UTC/1600 London16:52
Volanslet me check16:52
Volansthe first line will be 1:30 in India, they don't have DST16:55
newz2000thanks16:55
Volans7:00 in alaska will be 1:00 in the night in brisbane...16:56
Volansand possible time also for india16:56
newz2000I wonder what the best way to collect the votes is, do you have an idea?16:56
newz2000we can have votes go to the list as replies... any other option?16:57
Volansno list replies no... 80 email only for that16:57
newz2000yeah16:57
Volansyou have an ubuntuforums test site???16:57
Volans:D16:57
newz2000no, sorry16:57
newz2000we could do a shared google spreadsheet or a wiki page16:58
newz2000I use google spreadsheets for church events and it works ok16:58
Volanswiki page can be a solution... and what of a webservice?16:58
newz2000I'm not sure we have enough time to pull it off... I know I couldn't get it done in time16:59
Volansno no, not your service...16:59
Volansa web based already poll service16:59
VolansI'm searching on google and there are many16:59
newz2000oh, I see17:00
newz2000there are four options (two times, two days). We could use something that gives them the option to rate their choices 1,2,3,417:00
newz2000we may want to get their name so we can eliminate options where key people can't attend17:01
Volansor a wiki page...17:05
VolansI have the idea...17:06
Volansfopr the wiki17:07
Volansnewz2000: I think we have to put a date limit for the poll...17:13
Volansnewz2000: I have the wiki page ready, if you have the 2 date I will put directly the final datetimes...17:16
newz2000    2000 UTC/2100 London which is 0600 in Brisbane (Australia) and 0130 India17:17
newz2000    1500 UTC/1600 London which is 0700 in Alaska (USA) and 11am Eastern US17:17
newz2000    Tuesday, July 22nd UTC17:17
newz2000     Friday, July 25th UTC17:17
Volansok17:18
Volanshow many time the meeting will continue?17:18
newz2000I'm going to shoot for 40m but let's say 40 - 60m17:19
Volansonly????17:19
VolansI have attended the last mozilla team meeting17:19
Volanstheoretically of 1h30m... but really more17:20
newz2000wow, no, I can't handle that17:20
newz2000if we need to go longer we'll schedule another meeting because obviously we're not prepared enough17:20
Volansok17:20
newz2000we don't have a huge agenda for this meeting17:21
newz2000Volans: do you have a link to the wiki? My email is ready.17:27
Volansyes, just one minute17:27
Volansnewz2000: what is your vote for the 4 options? :)17:30
VolansI have put from 0 to 317:30
Volans0 = no attend, 3 best choice17:30
newz2000I'm equally fine with all four17:30
VolansI can put yourself as first voter?17:31
newz2000sure17:31
Volansjust decide the poll end... july 20?17:33
newz2000noon UTC on 21st17:33
Volansnewz2000: check it out before send the mail ;) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Website/Meetings17:37
newz2000looks great17:39
newz2000I've got agenda items already, let me add them17:39
Volansnewz2000: have you checked fridge agenda for those datetimes?17:39
newz2000no, since we're meeting in this channel I didn't feel it was necessary17:40
newz2000is it necessary?17:40
Volansah no, sure... I'm thinking about #ubuntu-meeting, sorry17:41
newz2000email sent. Thanks a bunch Volans.17:49
Volansit was a pleasure17:50
Volansreceived17:52
Volansfor the black/white problem, I'm trying with a high inverted contrast theme... it seems quite simple17:58
Volansjust add in the body { color: #000; } and add a body input { background-color: #fff; }18:00
VolansI have cheched only the homepage18:00
newz2000Volans: would you go ahead and just note that in the bug?18:01
Volanssure! you need also to check that every site have a background specified18:01
newz2000ok18:01
VolansI made some test before...18:04
Volansnewz2000: I have some problem with radio and check boxes... seems that they don't give the color from the css.. I have tried with a input, textarea, select {} entry in the css18:18
Volansbut around the web I found that this is the right way18:18
Volansperhaps you know some trick?18:18
newz2000I've found that adding styles to inputs can cause problems. For example, in ff3 once you assign some styles the inputs stopping looking like the OS widgets and start looking like plain ole ugly buttons and etc18:19
newz2000I'd have to try it to see what you're experienceing though18:20
* Volans trying ff318:20
Volansyes, not so ugly in my case but there is a noticeable difference18:21
Volansmy changes now are on commons.css line 8218:22
Volansadding a color: #000; in the body statement and adding just below a:18:22
Volansinput, textarea, select { color: #000; background-color: #fff; }18:22
Volansoh, I have found an epiphany bug while surfing... :)18:24
Volansyou need to do a width trough the css or style option for the select tag, in the download page the choose mirror select in epiphany go over the right border (although the last part is not visible, the same effect of overflow:hidden)18:28
Volanss/to do/to set/18:28
newz2000I thought I did that...18:29
newz2000oh, I did it in code to truncate the length of the text18:29
Volansseems that epiphany wants the width of the select tag explicitly18:30
VolansNow I have to go.... I will investigate more on the white/black problem as I'm interested on that and I will try to find the time to work on the drupal theme ;)18:33
newz2000thanks, Volans18:33
* Volans back to a clear theme... 18:33
Volansdon't mention it... :) see you, bye bye18:34
kilpshi all ... i was wondering if there are any plans atm for a software / package directory - i cant see anything in the wiki but maybe i missed it?19:34
newz2000kilps: there is http://packages.ubuntu.com - is that what you had in mind or something else?19:41
kilpsya i know about packages.ubuntu.com - but that isnt really geared towards the average user ... i was thinking more along the lines of the comparison of the Add/Remove dialog to synaptic ... but hopefully more powerful19:43
newz2000nothing like that is currently planned19:43
kilpsperhaps in a wiki format ... but something which just had general information about software with comments etc.19:43
kilpsdo you think that there would be interest in such an idea?19:44
newz2000there may be ,but it's probably out of the scope of this team19:44
newz2000is this something you want to do kilps?19:44
kilpsoks cool ... um im not really sure - something i thought of yesterday so trying to get an idea of if it would be worthwhile - would have to balance it with a number of other projects i have on the go though19:45
newz2000I understand. If its something you want to do, we can support you, but I think there are higher priority tasks for the team to take on first19:46
kilpsok cool - ill keep track of what is going on and if i get around to starting anything or see someone with a similar idea ill get in touch19:47
newz2000ok19:47
kilpsjust for interest some of the comments at http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/103/ suggest something similar to my idea - see "2cents wrote on the 24 Apr 08 at 22:09 "19:52
pephi20:45
newz2000howdy pep20:45
pepIhad a look at the archive of the shipit theme20:46
pepjust now20:46
pepI'm wondering... this is not usable by drupal is it?20:46
pep(I never used drupal before)20:47
pepbut I suppose drupal themes are in php or something20:47
pepI'm installing the cms20:47
pep(on our testserver for spreadubuntu ;-)20:47
newz2000yes, the themes are in php20:47
newz2000you can also download the code for the existing drupal theme...20:47
newz2000(ugly css/html)20:47
pepI've got an archive named "ubuntu08" with html/css shipit theme20:48
newz2000https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~newz/ubuntu-website/ubuntu0720:48
newz2000you'll see the themes are pretty simple compared to a lot of CMS20:48
pepIs that the same as shipit? or is it without the rounded part at the bottom?20:48
newz2000that's what's on ubuntu.com now20:48
newz2000just use it as an example of a drupal theme20:49
pepI only used CMSmadesimple and some custom ones until now20:49
pepOk20:49
pepand ubuntu08 theme is not yet on launchpad?20:49
pepthe one shipit uses..20:49
newz2000correct20:50
pepok20:51
* Volans back23:40
pepnewz2000: do you have an idea when the ubuntu08 theme will be on launchpad? I think we are going to work on spreadubuntu with ubuntu07 theme whilst developing our background infrastructure...23:41
pepwelcome back Volans23:41
newz2000pep: do you mean "on launchad" or do you mean "a completed drupal theme"?23:42
VolansHi pep23:42
pepnewz2000: "a completed drupal theme" if it's the official one, to be inline with the other sites it would be nonsense to make our own one23:47
newz2000pep: its not scheduled23:47
pepbut ubuntu.com is planning to take over the same theme as shipit?N23:47
pep-N23:47
newz2000yes, that's the current plan, but it's not scheduled yet23:48
pepok very well23:48
pepwe won't be up so quickly anyway, and it's not a problem if we use the current theme for the moment.. I'm working on the move of the ubuntu-be site from CMSMS to Drupal too, attending a sprint for this in Brussels tomorrow, so I'll earn some drupal experience. If I have time I might make the template  myself then and get back to you.23:50
pepbut that wold be at the soonest in September.23:50
Volanspep: I'll talked with newz2000 about the same thing just today... if I find the time, it's possible that I will try to make a drupal theme from the shipit site23:51
pepah yes23:52
Volansmaybe we can cooperate?23:52
pepwe could, but at the soonest in September23:52
newz2000Volans: you're going to have to be careful about all you volunteer for. ;-)23:52
newz2000pep: September sounds reasonable23:52
Volansnewz2000: sure! but atm I'm not really involved in any "big thing"... bugs are a hobby :)23:53
* newz2000 goes for food23:53
pepwell, that's my point Volans, I'm involved in a relatively big thing I think, so this would not be a priority really :)23:53
Volanspep, really I'm not involved in big thing here on the website... in the Italian loco I have many things ;)23:55
pepok23:55
pep:)23:55
Volansso depends if I found the time this summer23:55
Volansand I don't have any drupal experience too...23:55
pephehe me neither23:55
pepBut seems easy23:56
pepI installed it this afternoon23:56
Volansyeah, matt say more that wordpress23:56
Volans/that/then/23:56
pepyes, I have the feeling too :)23:56
pepbut you know how it is with new things, gotta get used to them23:57
VolansI have experience for IPB and SMF forums and something about joomla23:59
Volansfor the theme customization of existing CMS23:59

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