[00:19] <CarlFK> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/250340  "Add a comment/attachment" ... how?
[00:21] <thumper> CarlFK: are you asking how to add a comment or an attachment or both?
[00:21] <thumper> CarlFK: click on the link, and a form should appear
[00:21] <thumper> CarlFK: needs JS
[00:21] <thumper> CarlFK: or if JS is disabled, it *should* take you to another page
[00:31] <CarlFK> i reloaded the page, now it is a link
[01:02] <wgrant> thumper: You are of course assuming that production is serving CSS and JS. That isn't a valid assumption at this point.
[01:26] <hansengel> Hi, I messed up here.. I accidentally created a milestone named '1.1' inside the 'trunk' release series, which I don't use. I just realized this after already filing bugs under this milestone. How can I move the milestone to the '1.0' series, and delete the 'trunk' series?
[01:26] <hansengel> my project is at https://launchpad.net/twitkit
[02:37] <hansengel> hi, are there any launchpad admins in here? I need this release series to be deleted https://launchpad.net/twitkit/trunk
[02:40] <Rinchen> hansengel, please file an answer ticket (see irc top) and someone should get around to it tomorrow during the week
[02:43] <hansengel> Rinchen: okay, thanks
[04:26] <Wofl> hey, who do i talk to if i need a project to be renamed?
[04:26] <mwhudson> Wofl: answers.launchpad.net/launchpad
[04:28] <Wofl> not possible to find someone on irc really fast?
[04:29] <Hobbsee> Wofl: probably not at this time.
[04:29] <Wofl> ok, thanks
[04:29] <Hobbsee> Wofl: and i'm not sure that "really fast" is a priority for launchpad.
[04:29] <Hobbsee> (in general, anyway)
[04:34] <thumper> :)
[04:43] <Wofl> its ok, i just submitted it there
[04:43] <Wofl> lets see how long that tkaes
[04:44] <Wofl> takes*
[05:00] <spm> Wofl: name changed. Sorry for delay. Was recovering a downed server. :-)
[05:17] <poolie> hey that was actually pretty fast :-)
[05:42] <Wofl> thanks a lot
[05:43] <Wofl> did you see my question regarding a redirect?
[05:54] <thumper> yeah, LP isn't set up to handle redirects right now
[05:54] <thumper> we have raised it before WRT renaming projects
[05:54] <thumper> cool URLs don't die and all that
[06:09] <Wofl> thumper: just toss a php file in there for now? or that too much extra?
[06:10] <thumper> haha
[06:10] <thumper> sorry
[06:10] <thumper> the entire system is "virtual"
[06:10] <thumper> a zope based web servcie
[06:10] <thumper> service
[06:16] <Wofl> i see...
[06:47] <Wofl> should i register a ndiswrapprer project and have a like to the real page?
[07:10] <lut4rp> I have a branch in my project, which has one subscriber. I cant delete that branch, and I cant figure out how to remove that subscriber. Can someone help me?
[07:12] <jml> lut4rp: you have to contact the subscriber and ask them to unsubscribe.
[07:13] <lut4rp> jml, even if I am the admin of the project?
[07:13] <jml> lut4rp: yep.
[07:13] <lut4rp> jml, thanks
[08:17] <kblin> morning folks
[08:20] <kblin> what's the best way to make the bug tracker changes go to a mailing list? sorry if that's sort of a common question, but I'm still waiting for answers.lp.n to come up for me, I'm on a really lousy connection
[08:34] <BjornT> kblin: you can create a team, setting the mailing list address as the 'contact address'. you can then subscribe that team to the project's bugs.
[08:37] <kblin> I can make a team a member of another team, right?
[08:42] <BjornT> kblin: yes
[08:44] <kblin> BjornT: ok, that'll do then. Thanks :)
[09:57] <gnomefreak> any LP admins awake yet?
[09:58] <lut4rp> I am using bazaar and lp for the first time. sorry if this is dumb, but i am unable to figure out how to push to trunk. I have an ssh key. can someone help me?
[10:03] <spiv> lut4rp: what command are you trying?
[10:03] <spiv> lut4rp: and what error are you getting?
[10:04] <gnomefreak> spiv: i dont think he has by the sound of it hes not sure of the commands
[10:04] <lut4rp> spiv, i am trying "bzr push lp:poonji" as it says on my project page.
[10:04] <gnomefreak> i was gonna look they all up
[10:04] <lut4rp> strangely, i have got no response or error for the past 15 mins.
[10:04] <gnomefreak> lut4rp: did you commit first?
[10:05] <lut4rp> gnomefreak, sorry, what do you mean by that?
[10:05] <gnomefreak> lut4rp: you have to commit the files that you are trying to push.
[10:05] <gnomefreak> lut4rp: hold on i have all the commmands you need
[10:06] <lut4rp> gnomefreak, okay.
[10:07] <lut4rp> hmm, its saying on LP, Branch format 6
[10:07] <gnomefreak> damn i dont have them but first you have to make your local files a branch
[10:07] <lut4rp> Repository format: Packs containing knits without subtree support
[10:07] <lut4rp> gnomefreak, and how do I do that?
[10:08] <spiv> lut4rp: you mean the 'bzr push lp:poonji' command has given no response for 15 minutes?
[10:08] <gnomefreak> lut4rp: theres bzr docs online. iirc its "init" than "commit" than push but you would have to read docs. once i get a sec ill find them
[10:09] <lut4rp> spiv, you're right. I am on ubuntu hardy, if that's needed.
[10:10] <lut4rp> okay, i did do "init"
[10:10]  * lut4rp looks up "commit"
[10:10] <gnomefreak> lut4rp: it commits the files to get them ready to be pushed
[10:11] <lut4rp> hmm, it should be more verbose :)
[10:11] <spiv> lut4rp: you should have gotten a response from the command like "No revisions to push."
[10:12] <lut4rp> spiv, but I didn't. I cancelled it anyway now.
[10:13] <spiv> lut4rp: yeah, that sounds like a bug.  If you could pastebin your ~/.bzr.log I'd be interested to see where it got stuck.
[10:13] <spiv> lut4rp: Anyway, http://doc.bazaar-vcs.org/latest/en/mini-tutorial/index.html is worth looking over if you haven't already.
[10:13] <lut4rp> oh thanks!
[10:14] <gnomefreak> spiv: are you LP admin by chance?
[10:15] <spiv> gnomefreak: nope
[10:15] <spiv> Just a bzr developer (and ex-launchpad developer).
[10:16] <gnomefreak> it seems teams only have a month when you renew the membership this has just happened ice had team for over a year now i have to renew every month
[10:17] <spiv> gnomefreak: that doesn't sound good, but unfortunately I don't know anything about that.
[10:17] <alecw1> Why isn't Launchpad open-source?
[10:17] <gnomefreak> alecw1: parts of it is
[10:17] <gnomefreak> just not the part we use ;)
[10:17] <alecw1> which parts?
[10:17] <spiv> alecw1: https://help.launchpad.net/FAQ#Is%20Launchpad%20Free%20Software/open%20source?%20If%20not,%20why%20not?
[10:19] <wgrant> gnomefreak: The team admin sets the renewal period...
[10:19] <alecw1> So, it's closed because (1) you don't want "multiple launchpads", and (2) it helps funding?
[10:19] <gnomefreak> wgrant: i set it to not expire when i made it over a year ago
[10:19] <gnomefreak> or longer
[10:19] <wgrant> gnomefreak: That sounds unlikely and bad.
[10:20] <gnomefreak> Created on:  2006-12-27
[10:20] <wgrant> And none of my teams work like that.
[10:20] <wgrant> What are the settings?
[10:20] <alecw1> Will Launchpad ever release it's source?
[10:20] <alecw1> its*
[10:20] <gnomefreak> aafter hitting renew i got Membership renewed until 2008-08-26.
[10:20] <gnomefreak> a month?
[10:20] <wgrant> alecw1: 'Unlike those other services, we have committed to making Launchpad Free Software.'
[10:21] <wgrant> gnomefreak: How is the team configured, what do you expect to happen, and what happens?
[10:21] <alecw1> Okay, but I'm wondering why it's not open-source, not "free".
[10:21] <gnomefreak> Subscription period: 0
[10:21] <wgrant> Open source is almost sysnonymous with Free.
[10:21] <wgrant> *synonymous
[10:22] <gnomefreak> wgrant: i expect it to work the same way since the date i showed you above
[10:22] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Huh? What does the date have to do with anything?
[10:22] <gnomefreak> wgrant: https://edge.launchpad.net/~mozillateam
[10:22] <alecw1> wgrant: no, that's not true at all. Things that are free as in "free beer" are not the same as "you can look at the ingredients, and the recipe here, for free."
[10:22] <wgrant> alecw1: 'Free Software' has a specific meaning.
[10:22] <gnomefreak> wgrant: the sate i created it. this is the first time i had to renew it and now it seems like its monthly
[10:22] <wgrant> Meaning free as in speech, not as in beer.
[10:23] <gnomefreak> s/sate/date
[10:23] <wgrant> gnomefreak: You probably have an expiry date set...
[10:23] <alecw1> What does it mean that it is free "as in speech"?
[10:23] <stgraber> alecw1: in this sentence "Free Software" is meant as in "free speech", LP is already free so there would be no point in saying "we have commited to making" otherwise
[10:24] <wgrant> alecw1: Same as it means for any other piece of Free Software.
[10:24] <kblin> alecw1: if you want to fix the free as in beer vs. free as in speech thing, find out where to file a bug about the English language
[10:24] <gnomefreak> wgrant: no i just showed you. please look at https://edge.launchpad.net/~mozillateam
[10:24] <gnomefreak> and give me a hint on wtf is wrong
[10:24] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Subscript period != your expiry date
[10:24] <wgrant> *subscription period, damnit.
[10:25] <gnomefreak> is 0
[10:25] <alecw1> wgrant: I'm not sure what "free as in in free-speech" metaphor means. Can you explain?
[10:25] <kblin> alecw1: for all practical purposes, "free as in free speech" for software means open source
[10:25] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Have you altered your expiration date since you were last asked to renew? And are you sure it's on that team?
[10:26] <wgrant> alecw1: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_Software is good.
[10:26] <gnomefreak> wgrant: no this is the first time i had to renew
[10:26] <alecw1> you mean, "I have the right to browse the code source."
[10:26] <gnomefreak> i havent touched any settings
[10:26] <alecw1> because "open source" literally means... "open source".
[10:26] <kblin> alecw1: there's some philosophical connotations to both "Open Source" and "Free Software"
[10:27] <wgrant> alecw1: But Free Software implies something extra.
[10:27] <alecw1> Not just that it is "free" as in beer?
[10:27] <wgrant> There are many Open Source licenses which are unfortunately not Free Software.
[10:27] <wgrant> RIght.
[10:28] <alecw1> So, how does the community benefit from a project being "free software" without releasing its source?
[10:28] <kblin> alecw1: yeah, but what about a license where you're allowed to see the source, but not to modify it? :)
[10:28] <wgrant> That's not possible.
[10:28] <wgrant> Free Software implies Open Source.
[10:28] <wgrant> But not vice-versa.
[10:28] <gnomefreak> found the issue and fixed it
[10:28] <alecw1> Then Launchpad should be open source, right?
[10:28] <wgrant> gnomefreak: What was the issue?
[10:28] <alecw1> If you claim to be "free software".
[10:28] <wgrant> alecw1: They do not claim to be free software.
[10:28] <wgrant> They claim they will be.
[10:29] <alecw1> "we have committed to making Launchpad Free Software. "
[10:29] <stgraber> alecw1: please read the page you were pointed to before ... "we have committed to making Launchpad Free Software."
[10:29] <alecw1> Oh.
[10:29] <gnomefreak> wgrant: i missunderstood since mozillateam is owner of mozillasquad it was mozillasquad page that was causing it
[10:29] <alecw1> So, you are NOT "Free Software" right now.
[10:29] <stgraber> indeed
[10:29] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Aha. So I was right: "And are you sure it's on that team?"
[10:29] <gnomefreak> it was saying mozillateam as owner the relationship between 2 team would expire
[10:29] <alecw1> Therefore, you have committed to release the source code, eventually, correct?
[10:29] <wgrant> alecw1: Note that there are no official Launchpad people involved in this conversation right now.
[10:29] <gnomefreak> yep
[10:30] <alecw1> wgrant: noted. =)
[10:30] <alecw1> Has Launchpad made any progress to just "eventually"?
[10:30] <gnomefreak> You must specify a default renewal period greater than 0.
[10:30] <gnomefreak> since when
[10:30] <alecw1> I mean, it would be great to have a timeframe, or some sort of specification for when they will release the backend.
[10:31] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Leave it blank, I suspect.
[10:31] <gnomefreak> wgrant: same thing
[10:31] <kblin> alecw1: the way I read the FAQ, it seems so
[10:31]  * kblin shrugs
[10:31] <kblin> I have to admit I don't care. :)
[10:31] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Ensure you have the first option selected.
[10:31] <gnomefreak> its optional so i shouldnt have to put anything there and im assuming nothing == 0
[10:31] <wgrant> AS one can't automatically renew for 0 days.
[10:31] <alecw1> I mean, they have "dedicated" to "becoming" free software, but I would like some sort of real commitment that it WILL happen.
[10:31] <wgrant> alecw1: As would we all.
[10:32] <wgrant> alecw1: Parts have been released.
[10:32] <gnomefreak> subscription policy == openteam
[10:32] <wgrant> gnomefreak: No, the renewal policy.
[10:32] <alecw1> wgrant: which parts? significant ones?
[10:32] <gnomefreak> subscription period == 30
[10:32] <wgrant> alecw1: Storm is pretty significant, I suspect.
[10:32] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Period != policy.
[10:32] <gnomefreak> next invite them to renew their own memebership
[10:32] <alecw1> Oh, there is a paragraph showing what they have released.
[10:33] <gnomefreak> renewal period == problem
[10:33] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Right, that's the problem.
[10:33] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Set it to not allow them to renew their own?
[10:33] <kblin> alecw1: you're preaching to the choir here. I doubt any foss developer would mind more open source software
[10:33] <mwhudson> yeah, releasing cscvs really enabled community contributions!
[10:33] <wgrant> gnomefreak: You can't allow them to renew their own but then say you can only renew for 0 time.

[10:33] <wgrant> mwhudson: But cscvs is useless as we have bzr-svn.
[10:33] <wgrant> And it seems to work.
[10:33] <wgrant> Whereas other parts of LP do not.
[10:33] <alecw1> kblin: I'm certainly not trying to preach, I'm just trying to understand, and get some sort of feel for the current status with launchpad's status as free software.
[10:34] <mwhudson> wgrant: it's still the best choice for importing cvs when you don't have the ,v files, afaik
[10:34]  * gnomefreak confused only thing that matches that is renew their membersip auto.. also notifie admins
[10:34] <wgrant> mwhudson: Probably so.
[10:34] <wgrant> gnomefreak: EPARSE
[10:34] <wgrant> 'invite them to apply for renewal'
[10:34] <mwhudson> (i would actually be extremely interested if i'm wrong about this)
[10:34] <gnomefreak> When someone's membership is about to expire, notify them and:
[10:35] <gnomefreak> 05:33 <          wgrant > gnomefreak: You can't allow them to renew their own  but then say you can only renew for 0 time.
[10:35] <alecw1> I can't think of a reason they wouldn't release the source code, either. They are currently well established in the open-source community, thus, they probably don't have to worry about being one-upped by someone with their own source.
[10:35] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Yes?
[10:35] <gnomefreak> you are conflicting comments
[10:35] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Where is this conflict?
[10:35] <gnomefreak> you said dont let them renew
[10:36] <wgrant> I don't see where I've said otherwise.
[10:36] <gnomefreak> wgrant: oh i see it i had to scroll :(
[10:36] <wgrant> That form needs rewording, but it's quite intelligible.
[10:36] <kblin> alecw1: hm, sorry, that's a figure of speech. I mean you're telling this to people who will agree with you
[10:36] <gnomefreak> wgrant: it sounded conflicking sinc ei couldnt see whole page
[10:36] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Ah.
[10:36] <wgrant> It is strange that it's labelled as optional when it is in fact required most of the time.
[10:36] <wgrant> And I shall now run off and file a bug.
[10:36] <gnomefreak> ok so everything will stay good than?
[10:37] <wgrant> gnomefreak: If you have the first radio button selected, it should let you pass.
[10:37] <alecw1> kblin: well, I guess it ended up like that, yes. But originally I was just curious about Launchpad's code.
[10:37] <gnomefreak> wgrant: it did
[10:37] <alecw1> Thanks a lot, everyone.
[10:37] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Great.
[10:38] <gnomefreak> wgrant: thanks
[10:38] <wgrant> np
[10:39] <wgrant> gnomefreak: Bug #173019
[10:39] <wgrant> (thankyou Hobbsee)
[10:39] <gnomefreak> ah not just me
[10:39] <gnomefreak> Hobbsee: opened that bug?
[10:40] <wgrant> She did.
[10:40] <gnomefreak> she seems to open bugs just beofre i see the issue
[10:40] <wgrant> This was 80000 bugs ago.
[10:40] <wgrant> Hm, that's a few bugs.
[10:40] <gnomefreak> maybe she should stand in door way to this channel and tell people problems when she finds them ;) save us alot of worrk
[10:40] <wgrant> Heh.
[10:42]  * wgrant shakes a fist at mpt. You broke my automated process for looking at each Launchpad bug by making the milestone easy to see.
[11:00] <mpt> Gooooooooooooooooooooooood morning Launchpadders!
[11:06] <mpt> wgrant, what automated process?
[11:07] <wgrant> mpt: The one where I automatically expand the task (sorry) to see if it's going to be fixed in the next 12 months.
[11:07] <mpt> aha
[11:07] <mpt> I didn't break that, the milestone's still there
[11:07] <mpt> I just made it unnecessary ;-)
[11:07] <wgrant> Some pleasant retraining will be required.
[11:07] <wgrant> This is true.
[11:09] <geser> where did the box with the package versions on the bug page go? I was quite handy while doing sponsoring for checking the last version and component
[11:09] <wgrant> geser: To mpt's context independent land
[11:09] <wgrant> One decision I see the rationale for, but cannot agree with.
[11:10] <mpt> geser, hover over the package name
[11:10] <wgrant> mpt: Where is this documented?
[11:11] <wgrant> And woah that date is ugly.
[11:11] <wgrant> And there are no links :(
[11:11] <geser> mpt: thanks for the hint. It contains all the info I need
[11:11] <mpt> wgrant, do you have any suggestions for where we could document its new position that would be easier to find than its new position?
[11:12] <wgrant> mpt: It could be inside the task.
[11:12] <geser> wgrant: LP just want to be precise about the upload date :)
[11:12] <wgrant> Or somewhere less completely undiscoverable.
[11:12] <wgrant> It should be in the tooltip as well.
[11:12] <wgrant> But it should be mentioned in the non-existent page help.
[11:13] <wgrant> As I don't want to have to hover over every element on the page or grep through the source to work out what has a .title.
[11:14] <mpt> wgrant, eventually we want to get rid of the expandable section, so that wouldn't be a long-term design
[11:14] <wgrant> mpt: Where do all of the widgets go!?
[11:14] <mpt> a long-term solution, rather
[11:15] <mpt> wgrant, into the table when you click on a cell.
[11:15] <mpt> e.g. click "New" and it turns into an option menu.
[11:15] <mpt> Click the package name and it turns into a text field.
[11:15] <mpt> etc.
[11:15] <wgrant> mpt: Oh, I thought that that must have been dismissed as an option, as it's rather obvious.
[11:16] <wgrant> I was thinking that the package name could act somewhat like an <abbr>
[11:16] <mpt> It already does, in the sense that <abbr> usually has title=, and the package name has title= giving its details
[11:16] <wgrant> ? cursor, dotted underline, which everyone knows to mean it has a tooltippy thing.
[11:16] <mpt> In what sense do you mean it?
[11:16] <mpt> ah
[11:19] <wgrant> I spent all too much time cleaning a webapp UI up today. So I might be annoyed and wrong.
[11:30] <Hobbsee> gnomefreak: no, i opened the bug ages ago when creating a team, after the auto-expiry stuff.
[11:30] <Hobbsee> that's months old
[11:31] <gnomefreak> ah
[11:31]  * gnomefreak very behind ;)
[11:42] <Hobbsee> dear launchpad, if you can't cope with Big Numbers, why do you let me enter them in your fields?
[11:43] <Hobbsee> why not restrict me to numbers the size that you can actually handle.  no love, me.
[11:44] <wgrant> Hobbsee: What's this?
[11:44] <Hobbsee> wgrant: manually reprio'ing a build.
[11:44] <Hobbsee> wgrant: LP will let you put in a Very Big Number, then will oops, presumably because the number is too big.
[11:45] <wgrant> Hobbsee: Nice. How big were you making it?
[11:45] <Hobbsee> oh, i held down '9' for a couple of seconds, so pretty long.
[11:45] <wgrant> Ah.
[11:45] <Hobbsee> surely, if you've only got a limited number of possible inputs, you can limit the number of digits that can be entered, so your software *won't* fall over.
[11:45] <wgrant> I think you need a 'build this now really kthxbye' button.
[11:46] <wgrant> Or at least fail gracefully.
[11:46] <Hobbsee> wgrant: buildd.py tends to do that, yes.
[11:46] <Hobbsee> i was just already there, and only wanted to hit one arch.
[12:21] <mpt> Hobbsee, please report that, (I assume) I don't have permission so I can't give an example URL
[12:22] <mpt> (I mean I don't have permission to reprioritize a build, not that I don't have permission to report a bug)
[12:23] <Hobbsee> mpt: i've already reported it for the length of time for members of a team to be invited to renew, and afaik, that hasn't been fixed yet.
[12:23] <Hobbsee> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/logwatch/7.3.6.cvs20080702-1ubuntu1/+build/662729/+rescore is a sample url
[12:23] <Hobbsee> well, is the one i used before
[12:23] <mpt> Hobbsee, that's a separate bug that'll need a separate fix
[12:23] <mpt> ok
[12:24] <mpt> Hobbsee, do you have the oops code handy? (or generate a new one?)
[12:24] <Hobbsee> you'll have to find something that hasn't built yet, and look up the build, and add +rescore to it for another one.
[12:24] <Hobbsee> i do not.
[12:25] <Hobbsee> mpt:  (Error ID: OOPS-933EA36)
[12:25] <Hobbsee> from https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/softgun/0.16-2.1/+build/666832/+rescore
[12:25] <mpt> thankyew
[12:25] <Hobbsee> np.
[12:26] <mpt> Hobbsee, do you happen to know what the maximum value is?
[12:27] <mpt> Ursinha, welcome!
[12:27] <Ursinha> mpt, hi! :)
[12:27] <Ursinha> thanks :)
[12:28] <mpt> Everybody, Ursinha is our new QA person
[12:28]  * Ursinha waves
[12:29] <andrea-bs> hi Ursinha! I hope you'll like my bugs :D
[12:29] <Ursinha> hahahahaha :)
[12:30] <Ursinha> andrea-bs, sure i will :)
[12:30] <mpt> andrea-bs is one of our most prolific bug reporters
[12:31] <andrea-bs> Ursinha: mpt is too generous ;)
[12:31] <Ursinha> :)
[12:33]  * wgrant apologises to Ursinha in advance.
[12:33] <Ursinha> hahaha why so?
[12:33] <wgrant> I file too many bugs.
[12:34] <Hobbsee> mpt: 2147483647 is the highest number you can put in.
[12:34] <Ursinha> you should be proud of it ;)
[12:34] <Hobbsee> without LP oopsing.
[12:34] <Hobbsee> heya Ursinha
[12:34] <wgrant> Oh no! Implementation details! Run!
[12:35] <mpt> Hobbsee, reported bug 250490
[12:35] <Ursinha> Hobbsee, hi :)
[12:36]  * Hobbsee is another troublesome filer.
[12:36] <Ursinha> so you are the bug gang :P
[12:36] <Hobbsee> yeah...
[12:36] <Hobbsee> and we're the "whine when LP goes down, or otherwise breaks" gang.
[12:37] <Ursinha> :)
[12:37] <wgrant> Hobbsee: Whining that one of the production appservers is borked doesn't help on a weekend, unfortunately.
[12:37] <Hobbsee> wgrant: don't you have numbers of doom to call?
[12:37] <Hobbsee> actually, i couldn't reproduce the errors.
[12:37] <Hobbsee> which is why i didn't call.
[12:37] <wgrant> Hobbsee: Of course not.
[12:37] <geser> wgrant: just abolish weekends for LP admins and LP devs :)
[12:38] <Hobbsee> oh, i see, that's what the subscriber panel is supposed to look like.
[12:38] <wgrant> It was only production, so most would have missed it.
[12:38] <wgrant> And what's this? A LOSA in a sane timezone! Yay!
[12:38] <Hobbsee> even when switching to production
[12:38] <mpt> Hobbsee, as opposed to...?
[12:38] <Hobbsee> mpt: the bloody mess it is in anything ubuntu-related.
[12:38] <Hobbsee> :)
[12:39] <mpt> aha
[12:39] <wgrant> At least the actions are up the top now.
[12:39] <wgrant> That is a definite improvement.
[12:39] <Hobbsee> yeah, but what shocks me more is you can actually easily see what the next box is underneath it
[12:39] <Hobbsee> you dont' have to do the scrolling dance first.
[12:39] <Hobbsee> to the point where the boxes underneath are vaguely useful
[12:39] <wgrant> It is much more pleasant navigating LP bugs.
[12:40] <Hobbsee> although, why we have a search on the lower right, and another one at the bottom, i'm not so sure.
[12:41] <mrevell> New Launchpod episode online at: http://news.launchpad.net/podcast/launchpod-episode-8-developer-interview-with-curtis-hovey-and-chat-about-landscape
[12:41] <wgrant> Huh? Landscape in Launchpod?
[12:42]  * Hobbsee wonders offhand, if planet ubuntu is supposed to be an advertising ground.
[12:42] <mpt> Hobbsee, does that mean you won't scream if I get rid of the search from the lower right?
[12:42] <Hobbsee> mpt: i'd say so - i've never used it.
[12:42] <wgrant> I find the LP posts on Planet Ubuntu to be somewhat appropriate. It is a big part of Ubuntu.
[12:43] <mpt> I'm fairly sure I've seen posts about bugzilla.gnome.org on Planet Gnome
[12:59] <gnomefreak> where is the page to turn off edge.launchpad.net? i thought it would be at launchpad.net but its not there
[13:00] <gnomefreak> nevermind it wasnt there under edge but is without the edge
[13:03] <geser> is there a reason why the edit icon/link for the bug title is after the title while every other icon is before the text?
[13:19] <mpt> geser, the edit icons for bug supervisors and translation groups are also after the text
[13:19] <mpt> The one for bug privacy is before the text, but that'll change soon
[13:20] <mpt> Putting the one for the bug title before the text would indent the title oddly
[13:20] <mpt> but putting it after makes the title harder to copy
[13:20] <mpt> soren, not sure what to do there :-)
[13:20] <mpt> arg, *so* I'm not sure what to do there
[13:21] <mpt> (that's the second time I've done that in the past week)
[13:27] <geser> it looks a little bit inconsistent right now, but if some other links will change soon, perhaps it doesn't look inconsistent afterwards anymore
[13:34] <soren> mpt: You're not the only one... :/
[13:34] <soren> :)
[13:35] <mpt> soren, at least you don't have a kernel driver named after you
[13:35] <soren> Hahah!
[13:35] <soren> No, I do not.
[13:35] <soren> Yet.
[13:35] <soren> :)
[13:56] <jmunro> does anyone know why my ppa package builds on most architectures, but not amd64? the build deps are correct as far as i can tell
[13:57] <jmunro> "dpkg-shlibdeps: failure: couldn't find library libgtk-x11-2.0.so.0 needed by debian/sugar-develop-activity/usr/share/sugar/activities/Develop.activity/lib/libgtksourceview-2.0.so (its RPATH is '')."
[13:58] <jmunro> i have the required dependancies and this builds fine on i386
[14:04] <mpt> bigjools, ^
[14:19] <mpt> bigjools, can you help jmunro?
[14:20] <bigjools> I'll have a look
[14:20] <bigjools> jmunro: what is your PPA name please
[14:21] <jmunro> chapter78
[14:22] <jmunro> im sure its just me making a novice error, but help is appreciated
[14:27] <Hobbsee> jmunro: which arches is it building on?
[14:28] <jmunro> i386, lpia
[14:29] <Hobbsee> er, which package?
[14:30] <geser> Hobbsee: I'd guess the package is sugar-develop-activity
[14:30] <bigjools> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/16211531/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-amd64.sugar-develop-activity_33-0ubuntu1~ppa2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[14:31] <Hobbsee> oh, the one that's deleted, and the other two that are superceeded?
[14:31] <Hobbsee> yeah, no wonder i didn't find that one
[14:32] <Hobbsee> jmunro: didn't you fix it, with ~ppa3?
[14:33] <jmunro> nope i made human errors on all of them lol
[14:33] <jmunro> excluding the one i deleted, that failed to build
[14:33] <Hobbsee> no it didn't
[14:33] <Hobbsee> the one you deleted *did* build.
[14:33] <Hobbsee>     * sugar-develop-activity_33-0ubuntu1~ppa3.diff.gz (1.2 KiB)
[14:33] <Hobbsee>     * sugar-develop-activity_33-0ubuntu1~ppa3.dsc (693 bytes)
[14:33] <bigjools> only on i386
[14:33] <Hobbsee>     * sugar-develop-activity_33-0ubuntu1~ppa3_all.deb (210.8 KiB)
[14:33] <Hobbsee>     * sugar-develop-activity_33.orig.tar.gz (209.7 KiB)
[14:33] <jmunro> ppa3 has human error
[14:33] <Hobbsee> bigjools: yes, that's deliberate.
[14:34] <Hobbsee> but that will work on all arches
[14:34] <jmunro> Hobbsee: i changed arch to 'all' but this is incorrect
[14:34] <Hobbsee> jmunro: why?
[14:34] <jmunro> it has .so's, surely these are arch dependent?
[14:35] <jmunro> (apologies for taking your time, im inexperienced at creating packages)
[14:37] <Hobbsee> oh, hmmm.
[14:37] <Hobbsee> libgtk2.0-0 is definetly *built* on all the arches, separately.  i don't know :)
[14:38] <jmunro> im a bit confused to the nature of the problem, at home i have amd64, i could try building there to see if it stumbles on the same problem
[14:40] <bigjools> there might be a problem with the libgtk2.0-0 package on amd64, I dunno
[14:40] <jmunro> is it still possible that there is an error on my behalf?
[14:40] <MagicFab> Where should I log a bug about news.launchpad.net ?
[14:41] <beuno> MagicFab, https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad-documentation/
[14:42] <MagicFab> gracias :)_
[14:42] <beuno> de nada
[14:44] <bigjools> jmunro: I see the package being installed in the build chroot, then dpkg-shlibdeps can't find one of its files.  I can't see anything else wrong, sorry I can't help more :(
[14:45] <jmunro> thats ok, perhaps there is somewhere else i can find help bigjools?
[14:46] <bigjools> jmunro: I like your idea of building it on your home machine
[14:47] <jmunro> ill try this tonight
[14:47] <bigjools> let me know how it goes
[14:47] <jmunro> thanks for your help!
[14:47] <bigjools> np, sorry I can't help more
[15:10] <mpt> I'm looking for a prettier way to present the "This site is running pre-release code" message on edge.launchpad.net. Anyone have any suggestions? :-)
[15:12] <intellectronica> mpt: ah i see what you mean. on my screen, it would fit nicely on the same line as the menu and the username/logout button
[15:12] <intellectronica> there may not be enough space on smaller windows, though
[15:12] <mpt> intellectronica, which menu? You mean the Launchpad > ... hierarchy?
[15:13] <intellectronica> mpt: yes
[15:15] <mpt> Yes, whether there was room there would depend highly on the name of any project/package/person and the width of the window
[15:15] <andrea-bs> mpt: how about a small "beta" label near the "launchpad" logo on the location bar?
[15:15] <mpt> I was thinking maybe a diagonal ribbon in the corner
[15:15] <mpt> or something in the footer
[15:16] <andrea-bs> in the footer there's "beta site" near the version number
[15:16] <mpt> andrea-bs, that would work, but it wouldn't be obvious how to report bugs
[15:16] <andrea-bs> mpt: that's right
[15:17] <klette> A nice large gif animation of some road workers and a big fat "under construction" sign.. Back to the 90s ;-)
[15:17] <mpt> http://mpt.net.nz/archive/2005/12/27/web-2
[15:18] <klette> hehe
[15:19] <klette> A ribbon or something non-intrusive like that is a good idea though. Doesnt need to be a big fat warning, as lp is mainly for developers anyway, and all developers know that beta-software means :-)
[15:22] <beuno> mpt, hey there. Is it just me, or under the last item of the hierarchy, there is blank 1-2px blank space?
[15:23]  * andrea-bs notices this too
[15:24] <beuno> mpt, also, maybe for pre-release code, you can add an overlapped round icon that says "beta" on the top left of the hierarchy. Like we did with the messages/warnings/errors
[15:25] <mpt> beuno, the 1px gap is dependent on your font size and zoom level. I'm expecting it to go away when I redo the hierarchy with floats.
[15:26] <beuno> mpt, I have default font size and zoom level set. The only way I can get it to go away is by zooming out.
[15:27] <mpt> Well you implemented that, you tell me ;-)
[15:29] <beuno> heh, fair enough. I'll take a stab at it, and see if I can find what's causing this
[15:31] <beuno> mpt, I also have a fix for the warning image to send you, which doesn't have a transparent background now
[15:32] <mpt> beuno, ah great, I was going to regenerate it from the SVG but hadn't had time yet
[15:33] <beuno> mpt, I have somewhere around here an improved SVG, so I'll send you the whole lot
[15:33] <mpt> ok, thanks
[16:04] <mpt> beuno, since it's going to be rewritten anyway, it's probably not worthwhile to spend time on the 1px gap
[16:04] <mpt> More interesting to investigate why the tabs aren't centered and "Answers" wraps occasionally :-)
[16:27] <beuno> mpt, centered by a few pixels?  I know why that is already. Answers, on the other hand, hmmm...  any way to reproduce that?
[16:28] <mpt> beuno, sure, resize the window. Happens at many widths in IE, moderately often in Konqueror, occasionally in Firefox.
[16:29] <beuno> ah, I see...
[16:30] <beuno> min-width is probably off
[16:30]  * beuno pulls
[16:50] <mrevell> Hey, beuno, could you check a line of Spanish text for me please?
[16:54] <beuno> hey mrevell, sure
[16:55] <mrevell> thanks beuno. "Por favor, seleccione la página de inicio que desea usar"
[16:55] <beuno> I don't quite understand in what context that would work, but there's nothing wrong with it
[17:58] <beuno> mpt, I don't see the 1px separation in trunk  :/
[18:00] <mpt> beuno, try zooming in
[18:05] <Dexhu> hello
[18:06] <Dexhu> 13 does anayone know anything about -  enabled community maintained software (universe)
[18:07] <Dexhu> 13 hello
[18:08] <Dexhu> any upgard people here??
[18:09] <Dexhu> any upgrade people here??
[18:10] <mpt> Dexhu, what are "upgrade people"?
[18:10] <mpt> Dexhu, this channel is about Launchpad. If you're looking for help with Ubuntu, try #ubuntu.
[18:10] <Dexhu> I'm upgrading to 8.04 and I want to knw what - enabled community maintained software (universe) IS??
[18:11] <Dexhu> should I go to Ubuntu to find this anaswer??
[18:11] <LaserJock> Dexhu: #ubuntu would be the right place
[18:12] <Dexhu> OK..THX laser jock
[18:12] <beuno> mpt, right, if I zoom in enough, I see it. But I have to fiddle with it.  Right now, I see if by default
[18:12] <beuno> any unlanded changes to the CSS?
[18:12] <mpt> beuno, yes, the hierarchy rewrite that I mentioned before :-)
[18:13] <beuno> mpt, ignore me, for some reason, I can see the same issue now
[18:13]  * beuno grumbles and gets back to CSS
[18:14] <LaserJock> is there somebody about I can bug about bug #81002 ?
[18:14] <LaserJock> it's rather annoying to not be able to sort search results
[18:15] <LaserJock> is there a reason why sorting was removed?
[18:41] <smarter> Hi
[18:41] <smarter> How many times does it take for a .pot/.po to be approved?
[18:44] <smarter> *how long
[19:18] <bdmurray> bug spam is dealt with via answers is that right?
[19:20] <matsubara> bdmurray: yes, that's the best way to get lp admins attention.
[19:36] <LaserJock> is there a particular reason why I wouldn't be getting bugmail for comments I've made?
[19:37] <LaserJock> it's been a number of minutes and I haven't gotten anything
[19:39] <andrea-bs> LaserJock: It may be a temporary slowdown. How long have you been waiting?
[19:39] <LaserJock> hmm, probably 20min
[19:40] <kiko> LaserJock, for what?
[19:40] <LaserJock> not all that long, but usually they are quite quick
[19:40] <LaserJock> kiko: I've been changing some tags and making comments on some bugs
[19:40] <LaserJock> but I haven't gotten any bugmail
[19:40] <kiko> LaserJock, hmmm, that's odd
[19:56] <LaserJock> kiko: do you know of any reason why I wouldn't be getting my own bugmail? I've been getting bugmail in general
[19:56] <kiko> LaserJock, no, I asked BjornT but he didn't answer, but I've been receiving some at least
[19:58] <LaserJock> hmmpf
[19:58] <LaserJock> weird
[20:07] <andrea-bs> I've filed a bug 8 minutes ago and I've received the mail just now
[20:12] <LaserJock> hmm, I've still got nothing
[20:46] <BjornT> LaserJock: you're not using gmail, are you?
[20:51] <BjornT> LaserJock: if you are, that's probably the problem. gmail doesn't display mail from yourself by default.
[20:52] <kiko> yeah
[20:52] <beuno> BjornT, really?  I constantly get emails "from myself" that LP sends
[20:52] <beuno> to the point where it's annoying  :)
[20:53] <beuno> reporting bugs, for example
[20:53] <BjornT> beuno: i think there is a setting for this. maybe you have changed it (or google changed the default)
[20:55]  * beuno looks
[20:56] <beuno> I can't find such a setting
[20:57] <LaserJock> BjornT: what? really?
[20:57] <LaserJock> I am indeed using gmail
[21:02] <BjornT> LaserJock: you could try sending a mail to yourself; see if you get it.
[21:04] <LaserJock> ok, I did
[21:05] <LaserJock> BjornT: yeah, I do get it when I just send a test email to myself
[21:06] <LaserJock> BjornT: I got bugmail from myself on July 10th
[21:09] <BjornT> LaserJock, beuno: hmm. i know there used to be such a setting. and from reading the help, it seems like gmail still does it for mails you send to mailing list. maybe there is some auto-detection going on there.
[21:10] <BjornT> LaserJock: can you give an example of a bug you changed, but didn't get a notification for?
[21:10] <beuno> BjornT, ah, yes, I don't get emails from mailing lists I send, although I always thought that was something the mailing list did for me
[21:11] <LaserJock> beuno: many mailing lists are set up that way
[21:11] <BjornT> LaserJock: also, are the mail sent directly to you, or through a mailing list?
[21:11] <LaserJock> BjornT: which mails?
[21:13] <beuno> mrevell, this weeks Launchpod was really good, congrats  :)
[21:14] <BjornT> LaserJock: sorry, i was referring to the bug notifications. i.e., are you subscribed directly, or through a team that has a mailing list.
[21:14] <LaserJock> BjornT: it wasn't through subscriptions
[21:14] <LaserJock> bug #109544 is an example
[21:15] <LaserJock> BjornT: do I have to be subscribed to a bug to get my own bugmail?
[21:15] <BjornT> LaserJock: yes
[21:15] <LaserJock> why? :(
[21:16] <LaserJock> I don't remember needing to in the past
[21:17] <kiko> LaserJock, you are auto-subscribed if you reported the bug. I don't know what you are talking about.
[21:17] <BjornT> LaserJock: it has always been like that. doesn't make sense to get only your changes, but not anyone else's, does it?
[21:17] <kiko> this has never changed
[21:18] <LaserJock> are you sure?
[21:18] <LaserJock> I swear that I used to get all bugmail
[21:18] <LaserJock> BjornT: yes, it very much does make sense
[21:18] <LaserJock> I use the bugmail to record what I've done
[21:20] <kiko> LaserJock, yes, we're absolutely sure. you /are/ confused, trust me.
[21:20] <kiko> LaserJock, if you're not subscribed to a bug, you don't get email about it. end of story. always been that way. you can be however an implicit subscriber.
[21:21] <LaserJock> hmm, I'm not sure how I could have been getting that bugmail previously then
[21:21] <mario_limonciell> cprov, ping
[21:21] <cprov> mario_limonciell: pong
[21:21] <LaserJock> I guess it must have been through implicit subscription, but I'm not sure how
[21:21] <mario_limonciell> cprov, i got a reject email on my first try to upload dkms to main
[21:21] <kiko> anyway, I have a session now, will be back later
[21:21] <mario_limonciell> telling me that "Signer is not permitted to upload to the component 'main' of file 'dkms_2.0.20.2-0ubuntu1.dsc'."
[21:22] <cprov> mario_limonciell: irght, let me check
[21:23] <LaserJock> BjornT: so how do I get a record of what I've done then? if the bugmail is incomplete and the activity logs are incomplete I'm not sure where else I can get information
[21:23] <kiko> LaserJock, ubuntu-bugs.
[21:23] <matsubara> cprov!
[21:23] <kiko> bbl!
[21:23] <cprov> matsubara: opa
[21:23] <matsubara> cprov: de volta pra terrinha?
[21:25] <cprov> matsubara: yup, I'm back home.
[21:25] <matsubara> cool. welcome back!
[21:33] <cprov> matsubara: thanks
[21:34] <mrevell> thanks beuno!
[21:37] <cprov> mario_limonciell: there is indeed a problem in the code, mainly caused because you already have perms to 'universe'. I will have to debug it a little more.
[21:37] <mario_limonciell> cprov, ah, that's unfortunate then
[21:37] <cprov> mario_limonciell: is the upload urgent ?
[21:37] <mario_limonciell> cprov, it's not urgent.  it's a minor bug fix release
[21:38] <cprov> mario_limonciell: ok, give some hours, I will email you soon.
[21:38] <mario_limonciell> cprov, okay thank you
[21:42] <TuniX12> hello
[21:43] <TuniX12> how to upload packages into PPA ??
[21:43] <beuno> TuniX12, take a look at: https://help.launchpad.net/PPAQuickStart
[21:44] <mouz> I'd like to use wikiname Mouz. I can not because it is in use by another account. As far as I can see the account has never been used (de-can; created 2005-08-29). I sent a mail about 6 days ago to the mail address on ~de-can, but I got no reply. Can I have the Mouz wikiname somehow? Currently I'm using MouzMouz and redirecting it to 'his' page.
[21:46] <jpds> mouz: I'd file a question in Launchpad requesting that the inactive user be deleted.
[21:47] <mouz> jpds: ok i'll do that. thanks
[21:49] <TuniX12> hello how to make sha keys?
[21:50] <beuno> TuniX12, https://help.launchpad.net/YourAccount/CreatingAnSSHKeyPair
[21:50] <TuniX12> beuno: thanks
[21:50] <beuno> :)
[21:51] <beuno> TuniX12, https://help.launchpad.net/  contains all kinds of wisdom, I'd recommend you check it out
[21:51] <TuniX12> ok thank you
[21:52] <beuno> welcome'
[22:31] <mario_limonciell> so it appears that with the libtool in intrepid, ltmain.sh got moved from /usr/share/libtool/ltmain.sh to /usr/share/libtool/config/litmain.sh.  Should we be writing patches to configure scripts to handle this, or what's the appropriate policy for it?
[22:33] <mwhudson> mario_limonciell: this is definitely not the right place for that question
[22:33] <mario_limonciell> oops sorry mwhudson i thought i was in #ubuntu-devel :)
[22:33] <mario_limonciell> my bad
[22:34] <mwhudson> :)
[22:54] <Laibsch> Is it correct that to download translations from launchpad you need to be logged in, IOW you need to have an account?
[22:56] <wgrant> It needs to know your email address, doesn't it?
[22:56] <emgent> wgrant: heya.
[22:57] <wgrant> Hi emgent. I'm about to leave.
[22:58] <emgent> why launchpad dont send an email to last uploader if someone open bug on package?
[22:59] <wgrant> emgent: Because we don't have the concept of maintainers, and TIL is weak at best.
[22:59] <wgrant> You should subscribe to the package's bugs if you want to get them.
[22:59] <wgrant> doko doesn't want to get mail for 600 packages because he uploaded a transition
[22:59] <emgent> yeah but i can subscribe in a bug, not in package.
[23:00] <wgrant> emgent: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/somepackage should have the action.
[23:00] <wgrant> You can subscribe to all bugs for a package easily.
[23:00] <wgrant> Ah, scrap the 'bugs.'
[23:01] <doko_> wgrant: ?
[23:01] <wgrant> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/somepackage/+subscribe
[23:01] <wgrant> doko_: Argh, I thought it wouldn't ping you because you had a tail. Sorry.
[23:01] <emgent> oh nice, i saw now.
[23:07] <Laibsch> wgrant: that is rather suboptimal
[23:07] <wgrant> Laibsch: Why?
[23:07] <wgrant> Laibsch: It needs to know when to email you.
[23:07] <wgrant> *where
[23:07] <Laibsch> not if the stuff was available for download
[23:07] <wgrant> And it probably needs to stop people from requesting enormous numbers of exports or the world will collapse.
[23:07] <Laibsch> I am trying to push LP for translation
[23:07] <Laibsch> and this could be the killer for it
[23:08] <wgrant> Is it that hard to create an account? The Launchpad account creation process is particularly painless.
[23:08] <wgrant> But I must run.
[23:10] <Laibsch> well, *I* have an account and I don't see a problem
[23:42] <Q-FUNK> howdy! is there any way to relaunch a build that stopped because of a missing build-dep on a ppa?
[23:43] <cprov> Q-FUNK: access the build page and click 'retry'.
[23:43] <Q-FUNK> ah, ok.  let's see...
[23:44] <Q-FUNK> I see build logs, but not build actions
[23:45] <Q-FUNK> ah
[23:45] <Q-FUNK> found
[23:45] <Q-FUNK> ot an obvious place