/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/07/23/#ubuntu-meeting.txt

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bazhang@schedule11:21
ubottubazhang: Schedule for Etc/UTC: 23 Jul 17:00: QA Team | 23 Jul 22:00: Platform Team | 24 Jul 13:00: Desktop Team | 24 Jul 14:00: Java Team | 24 Jul 16:00: Ubuntu Mobile | 25 Jul 20:00: MOTU11:21
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=== ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ |
greg-g@now San Francisco17:53
ubottugreg-g: Error: Unknown timezone: San Francisco - Full list: http://tinyurl.com/4vyvp817:53
greg-g@now Los Angeles17:53
ubottugreg-g: Current time in America/Los_Angeles: July 23 2008, 09:53:38 - Next meeting: Community Council in 13 days17:53
greg-g@now17:53
ubottugreg-g: Current time in Etc/UTC: July 23 2008, 16:53:53 - Next meeting: Community Council in 13 days17:53
=== ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 05 Aug 22:00 UTC: Community Council | 28 Aug 00:00 UTC: Rebuild test | 14 Aug 00:00 UTC: Intrepid Alpha 4 | 24 Jul 00:00 UTC: Intrepid Alpha 3 | 11 Sep 00:00 UTC: UserInterfaceFreeze | 28 Aug 00:00 UTC: Upgrade testing begins
bdmurraybah, Portland should be a valid time17:59
ara:)18:00
LaserJockbdmurray: who lives there? ;-)18:00
bdmurraylike everybody!18:00
* jpds waves.18:00
* stgraber waves18:01
* ogasawara waves18:01
henohey all!18:01
arahey!18:01
* cgregan waves18:01
greg-ghello18:01
LaserJocko/18:01
sbeattiehey everyone18:01
heno#startmeeting18:01
MootBotMeeting started at 12:04. The chair is heno.18:01
MootBotCommands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]18:01
henoAgenda: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Meetings18:02
davmor2hello18:02
bobbohey18:02
cody-somervillehi18:02
schwukhi18:02
stgraberlot of people tonight18:02
henoI've moved the technical items to the top of the list to make sure we get to them18:02
henogreat to see lots of new people!18:03
heno[TOPIC]: Alpha 3 testing status18:03
MootBotNew Topic: : Alpha 3 testing status18:03
henosbeattie, davmor2, stgraber ^ your views?18:03
henoI understand ubiquity is a bit broken still18:04
stgraberServer looks good except a weird conflict between LAMP and Mail server, I pinged #ubuntu-server about it18:04
stgraberubiquity is a bit broken and we have a kernel/usplash bug making usplash to display a black screen18:04
davmor2there aren't that many things to test till the ubiquity issues get fixed and kubuntu has a number of post install issues18:04
davmor2thank god it's an alpha18:04
Riddellfixed ubiquity is being uploaded now18:04
Riddelldavmor2: post install issues?18:05
LaserJockafter Alpha2 I wonder if we need like an ISO testing twitter feed :-)18:05
davmor2kdesudo, printing, adept, etc18:05
Riddellah well, details details :)18:05
stgrabertesting in kvm is still more or less broken for Desktop so I won't be able to help much there. I'll work on Edubuntu and Server images testing for today.18:05
davmor2As I say post install the install on alternative is fine18:06
arahave anyone tried virtualbox? is still broken as well?18:06
henocr3 will be piloting some more automated install testing for this alpha - Ubuntu/Kubuntu i386/amd6418:06
LaserJockheno: can we get details of that sent to ubuntu-qa?18:06
stgraberara: I tried to install virtualbox and it's still not using dkms on Intrepid so I can't get it to build the kernel module18:06
henovbox worked for me about two weeks ago but was broken yesterday18:07
davmor2I test on hw mostly so pass :)18:07
henoLaserJock: yes, we'll post the test results and an overview of what we are doing18:07
=== ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Current meeting: Test Event | Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 07 Dec 19:00 UTC: Mozilla Team | 02 Nov 19:00 UTC: Mozilla Team | 14 Sep 18:00 UTC: Mozilla Team | 03 Aug 18:00 UTC: Mozilla Team | 23 Aug 13:00 UTC: Xubuntu Community
LaserJockheno: awesome, thanks18:08
henobasically we are opening up the Canonical certification infrastructure to also be useful to the wider Ubuntu project18:08
henostgraber, cr3 and schwuk are working on that18:08
LaserJockgood news18:09
henoso it looks like testing will continue most of tomorrow18:09
heno[TOPIC]: Searching for upstream Debian bugs (bdmurray)18:09
MootBotNew Topic: : Searching for upstream Debian bugs (bdmurray)18:09
bdmurrayI found out that the debian bug tracking system has a SOAP interface somewhat recently and I've written a script for searching package bugs for a string with it.18:10
bdmurrayIt's called debian-bug-search and I've added it to the ubuntu-qa-tools project18:10
arauseful, thanks18:11
bdmurrayI've had some success using it and thought it might be handy for the Hug Day tomorrow with apt18:11
henothat will be excellent!18:11
henois there any documentation available?18:12
LaserJockbdmurray: do you have some other tools that would be helpful for Hug Days or triaging in general?18:12
davmor2bdmurray: so is the idea behind it to help confirm upstream issues or to tag the ubuntu bug with the upstream bug?18:12
LaserJockseems like you do18:12
bdmurrayThe idea is to link upstream bugs to Ubuntu bugs18:12
LaserJockespecially with a package like apt it's very helpful information18:13
davmor2Sounds like a plan18:13
bdmurrayheno: I put a wee bit of documentation in the README for the project but its really straight forward18:13
henoperhaps we need a tools page under the hug day pages - we could move the 5-a-day and editmoin text  there18:13
henothey currently take up a fair bit of space on each hug day page18:14
LaserJockheno: I was actually thinking about having a Hug Day .deb18:14
henoLaserJock: or at least a bugsquad .deb18:14
LaserJockor more generally a bugsquader .deb18:14
LaserJocklol18:14
araone question, if we find an upstream bug, let's say, for gedit, that it is already filed in debian bug tracking system, which one should we link?18:14
heno:)18:14
arathe gnome bug tracker or the debian?18:15
araboth?18:15
greg-gLaserJock/ heno: ++18:15
LaserJockara:  both seems reasonable to me18:15
henoSo: Try the new debian bugs tool!18:15
bdmurrayI'd definitely link the Launchpad bug to the debian bug18:15
araok, thanks bdmurray18:15
heno[TOPIC]: Ubuntu testing teams (St├ęphaneGraber)18:15
MootBotNew Topic: : Ubuntu testing teams (St├ęphaneGraber)18:15
bdmurrayThe other way might be less useful and you have to use an e-mail interface to work with debian bugs18:16
stgraberok, so we currently have basically one team of testers for each derivatives18:16
LaserJockcody-somerville: ping?18:16
cody-somervilleLaserJock, pong18:16
LaserJockah, there you are18:16
stgraberthat's over 400 members counting for all testing teams we have18:16
stgraberunfortunately we only see a very small part of those participating in ISO testing18:17
stgraberI don't know if that's better with SRU testing but those team doesn't seem very useful to me as they currently are18:17
stgraberbecause people join them and forget about them some weeks later, we don't have a way to contact those testers and don't have (AFAIK) any kind of structure in place at the moment18:18
stgraberif we take ISO testing as an example, I'd say that for Hardy final testing we had only like 15-20 testers most of them testing distributions they don't use usually18:18
LaserJocknot being able to contact people is particularly difficult18:18
henoso you're suggesting a restricted testing team like bug-control?18:18
henothat would let us track it better and might instil more commitment18:19
stgraberno, I don't think having a restricted team is a good idea but we clearly need to document what the team is for and maybe setup a team mailinglist on LP so we can send call for testing a week before an Alpha18:19
persiaGiven the nature of testing, and the desire for more testers, it may be best to have clearly inviting language for any such restricted team "Anyone can join, just ask.  Renewals every three months.  Members are expected to participate in x% of testing targets for the team".18:20
* persia retracts the comment, seeing that it won't be a restricted team18:20
LaserJockstgraber: are there expirations on memebrship?18:20
sbeattieis there a reason not to encourage subscription to the ubuntu-qa@ list and announce testing there?18:20
LaserJocksbeattie: yeah :-)18:20
henoor we could have two levels, modelled on bugsquad/bug-control18:21
stgraberthere is 6 months expiry IIRC18:21
LaserJockwell, what if a  LP team list is created18:21
LaserJockand that were to be used extensively for testing announcments18:21
LaserJocknot just "heah, Alpha3 is coming up" but "2008XXXX is invalidated, standby"18:22
=== ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 07 Dec 19:00 UTC: Mozilla Team | 02 Nov 19:00 UTC: Mozilla Team | 14 Sep 18:00 UTC: Mozilla Team | 03 Aug 18:00 UTC: Mozilla Team | 23 Aug 13:00 UTC: Xubuntu Community | 31 Jul 16:00 UTC: Ubuntu Mobile
LaserJockI'm not particularly eager to see all that on ubuntu-qa, but on a testing team list it'd maybe make sense18:22
henoI'm wondering how well the current email notification is working18:23
stgraberwhat I'd propose as a start is: reduce expiry to 3 months, create a mailing-list18:23
persiaI thought having LP lists for Ubuntu teams was discouraged.18:23
stgraberheno: not well as it's opt-in and people don't generally enable it18:23
LaserJockpersia: it is, but in this case it might be a good idea18:23
henoit's not very good at differentiating between alphas and major milestones where we need more testing18:23
henostgraber: sounds good18:24
LaserJockpersia: in the sense of using it specifically to contact members of the team18:24
LaserJocknot for general discussion18:24
henowe should then look at posting tracker updates automatically to that list18:25
stgraberwe currently have 81 users with e-mail notification turned on18:25
henoand make sure it's easy for people to filter18:25
henoby having rich header info18:25
LaserJockstgraber: you can get email notification from iso.qa.ubuntu.com?18:25
stgraberheno: we just have to create an account on the tracker and subscribe it to all the testcases18:25
stgraberLaserJock: yep18:25
davmor2LaserJock: yes18:25
henoI'm guessing half of them or more ignore mails for alphas18:26
LaserJockstgraber: didn't know that, interesting :-)18:26
henoI'm happy for stgraber to reduce expiry to 3 months, create a mailing-list - any objections?18:26
davmor2go for it :)18:27
LaserJockI would just add that I think we could also clarify some of the pages18:27
stgraberheno: btw, can you also make me a team administrator ? pochu wanted to when he left the team but only the owner can do that :)18:27
stgraberLaserJock: +118:27
LaserJocklike the team page and perhaps the wiki page18:27
henostgraber: will do18:27
=== ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 24 Jul 14:00 UTC: Java Team | 24 Jul 16:00 UTC: Ubuntu Mobile | 25 Jul 20:00 UTC: MOTU | 31 Jul 16:00 UTC: Ubuntu Mobile | 02 Aug 13:00 UTC: Xubuntu Community | 03 Aug 18:00 UTC: Mozilla Team
henook, next18:27
heno[TOPIC]: QA liaison to Launchpad (LaserJock)18:28
MootBotNew Topic: : QA liaison to Launchpad (LaserJock)18:28
LaserJockheno: are we talking about a @lists.ubuntu.com mailing list?18:28
henoLaserJock: an LP one I think18:28
LaserJockheno: we may need to discuss that later, lets move on for now18:28
LaserJockok, so in #ubuntu-quality the other day we were discussing some possible improvements to Launchpad that would help in QA efforts18:29
henook, I don't have strong feelings about where the list sits18:29
LaserJockand thekorn, greg-g and some others were talking about having a QA Liaison to Launchpad18:29
LaserJocksimilar to what the MOTU have18:29
aracan anyone give a some background on this, please?18:30
LaserJockthere was also some discussion about possibly teaming the liaisons together to form a "Launchpad Advisory board" or some such18:30
bdmurrayWould a Canonical employee be okay in this role?  We meet with them fairly regularly18:30
LaserJockbdmurray: I'd really rather not18:30
henoI think that makes sense - several Canonical folks already have good connections with the LP team, but a community voice would be valuable as well18:31
LaserJocknothing personal about Canonical employees, but part of the issues that come up is that Launchpad developers communicate with other Canonical employees more often then they do with community people18:31
bdmurrayI thought this was a liason role though18:32
LaserJockso I think it'd probably be better to get an "outside" person18:32
LaserJockit is18:32
LaserJockbut it's not a Canonical-Canonical liaison role, if you know what I  mean18:32
greg-gCanonical-CommunityMemeber-Community, Canonical-Canonical-Community18:32
greg-gbut a "not" between those two18:33
greg-gs/but/put18:33
* greg-g grrs18:33
* persia suspects that some Canonical people may be able to balance the difference, but that a non-Canonical person may be more approachable18:33
LaserJockara: the background is that it's difficult for Launchpad developers to prioritize or even figure out what needs to be done when there are hundreds of voices in their ear18:33
LaserJockara: so having a person appointed as a go-between helps Launchpad developers and our team get things we need done18:34
henoI'm wondering what form the liasing would take - maintaing a wiki page of QA team wishlist items would be good18:35
LaserJockpersia: agreed, very much so18:35
bdmurrayLaserJock: and I think there is a fair bit of overlap between what I want and what the rest of the team wants - subsequently some points may become redudant18:35
greg-gheno: we kinda have a starting of that now: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/IdeaPool18:35
henoand be in contact with the LP team on IRC and at UDSes18:35
LaserJockheno: for instance, the MOTU liaison uses a "motu" tag, which is a recognized Launchpad tag to prioritize bugs18:36
bdmurrayLaserJock: there already is an ubuntu-qa tag18:36
LaserJockheno: they also work with LP people on upcoming specs that are relevant to MOTU18:36
henogreg-g: thanks, we could tighten that and ask the LP team to look at it18:36
LaserJockbdmurray: yes, I'm aware of that18:36
greg-gheno: it is most certainly a work in progress, fyi :)18:37
LaserJockanyway, this is really part of a larger effort to create a team of people who LP dev/management can go to18:37
LaserJockand the community can work through18:38
henoIf the LP team is open to an additional contact point, I'd be happy to see someone like thekorn in this role18:38
davmor2need to go I'll catch up on the rest :)18:39
LaserJockheno: they are indeed18:39
henothe person should know LP from a few angles and should ideally have met LP bugs members already at a UDS or so18:40
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LaserJocksure18:40
LaserJockI was just going to throw out a "who all wants to do it" email to ubuntu-qa and go from there18:41
henoperhaps we should post a request for applications ...18:41
bdmurraySomebody already checked with the launchpad team then?18:41
LaserJockbdmurray: yes, I did18:42
henoThe LP team have some say in the selection of the MOTU liason, is that right?18:42
LaserJockheno: well, yes, and no18:42
LaserJockthey don't technically but it'd be odd to have somebody do it that the LP people don't want to work with18:43
LaserJockso generally you want somebody who has a good working relationship with them18:43
LaserJockI can work up a job description, etc. and post it with my email to ubuntu-qa18:44
henoI don't remember what the selection process was like18:44
LaserJockI was the MOTU liaison for a long time (it's now siretart)18:45
persiaFor MOTU, we've always accepted volunteers.  If someone was unsuitable (which has yet to happen), MOTU would likely call for replacement.18:45
henoWe should work out how this person collaborates with the Canonical QA team members who already have close connections with the LP team though18:45
LaserJockheno: well, there is that18:45
bdmurrayI really think there is a risk of a lot of duplication of effort18:46
LaserJockto a fairly large extent what Canonical QA wants to do is up to them :-)18:46
araduplication or overlapping18:46
henoIn reality our requirements are generally the same18:46
aracommunication between this person and Canonical QA is also important18:46
persiaoverlapping can be good, if supportive and collaborative18:46
bdmurrayIt doesn't seem efficient to me though18:47
henothe Canonical Ubuntu QA team works in the open, apart from a few support cases18:47
LaserJockalso keep in mind, this is hopefully a part of a larger liaison team18:47
henowhere we have to preserve customer privacy18:47
LaserJockI would like to see QA representation there18:47
henowe are building a lot of teams here ;)18:48
LaserJockheno: hopefully only good and useful ones ;-)18:48
LaserJockI definatelly see where bdmurray is coming from18:49
henoWe discussed some feature additions to LP bugs at the sprint in London last week - I suggest we flesh out the notes in the ubuntu wiki and discuss it at next weeks meeting18:49
LaserJockbut my guess is that duplication shouldn't be an issue18:50
henowe can then add requests from this group and see whether there is a need for a new team to represent that list18:50
henoI think we would be able to agree on the whole list in this meeting format and present that to the LP team as a common list18:51
henothen we need to follow that up as LP makes their releases18:51
henowith the items in the open wiki we can all follow along18:52
LaserJockwell, there is a lot more than wiki pages18:52
henosuch as?18:52
LaserJockfiling bugs, following up, getting information on upcoming changes in LP18:52
LaserJocktalking with the LP devs to see what things can be done, etc.18:53
LaserJockit's not mearly just presenting them with a wishlist18:53
LaserJockas that will almost certainly be largly ignored18:53
henonot if we present it as our common feature request list18:54
LaserJocklol18:54
LaserJockalright, we can try that then, if you think it will work18:54
henolet's see how that looks next week, and then reconsider posting the role18:55
LaserJockok18:55
heno[TOPIC]: Intrepid Roadmap (LaserJock)18:55
LaserJockok18:56
LaserJockso there's the great spec list at QATeam/Specs18:56
LaserJockbut as we're building the Ubuntu QA team mid-release I wondered if it would be useful to combine Intrepid specs with community efforts into an Intrepid roadmap page18:57
LaserJockfor Intrepid+1 it should flow much more naturally, but currently there's not a Roadmap for non-spec tasks18:58
LaserJockso the question is, does that seem like a fruitful thing to do?18:58
henoRoadmaps are good - should some of these things be written up as specs though?18:59
LaserJockheno: some yeah18:59
LaserJockI just didn't want to interfer with the existing material18:59
henoLaserJock: what are the non-spec items you have in mind?19:00
LaserJockwell, more like bitesized tasks, people can get kind of turned off by "specs" as to large of a process to go through19:01
LaserJockI'm more interested in track what people in the team are doing19:01
araLaserJock: can we get some examples?19:01
LaserJockara: simple tools19:01
henowe already have todo lists for the bugs team19:02
aralike the ones at ubuntu-qa-tools ??19:02
heno(and for testing?)19:02
LaserJockor community projects, or things that are just not "big" enough to warrant a full on spec19:02
henohttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/TODO19:03
LaserJockheno: yeah, so I'd like to have an roadmap that indicates what we as a group want to accomplish for Intrepid19:03
henoLaserJock: fine with me - feel free to start a page19:03
LaserJockheno: yeah, that's good stuff19:03
henolet's review it next week19:04
persiaIt may also be good to use un-spec'd Roadmap items as "future" when completing them within the current release cycle is likely infeasible.19:04
LaserJockI just don't want people to *not* do work because they think they need a full-on spec to do it19:04
henoright19:04
LaserJockif it needs a spec go for it19:04
LaserJockbut I'm more interested in tracking work19:04
henowe should in fact review such a list every 4 weeks or so19:05
LaserJockwe've collected a pretty significant team in Ubuntu QA, more than I had hoped for19:05
LaserJockbut it needs to be doing stuff ;-)19:05
henoright, we should wrap up this meeting and do some ISO testing!19:06
stgraber+119:06
henoany further topics?19:06
stgraberyes, a short one19:06
stgraberhas anyone taken note last week ?19:06
henonot me unfortunately19:06
heno#endmeeting19:07
MootBotMeeting finished at 13:09.19:07
henothanks everyone! good meeting :)19:07
schwukthanks heno19:07
stgraberthanks19:07
sbeattiesorry, I didn't take notes last week, either.19:07
stgraberif someone did, please update the meeting page on the wiki. It currently only contains the agenda.19:08
arawell, thanks everybody19:08
arabye,19:08
boredandblogging@now19:44
ubottuboredandblogging: Current time in Etc/UTC: July 23 2008, 18:44:48 - Next meeting: Java Team in 19 hours 15 minutes19:44
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calchi23:02
* slangasek waves23:02
liwyo23:02
slangasekevan won't make it today; he called to let me know his ISP is experiencing a massive outage and they can't tell him when they'll be back up23:03
* ArneGoetje yawns23:03
liwyo23:03
dokogood morning23:04
asachi23:04
TheMusoHey folks./23:04
TheMusoJp[e all your trips home were uneventful.23:04
TheMusogah cold fingers.23:04
dokoso who should be here? slangasek, liw, asac, TheMuso, calc, bryce, ArneGoetje, ogra (away), ...23:05
calcwow netsplit23:06
asacjames_w i guess23:06
* slangasek opens the floor: intrepid alpha-3 tomorrow23:08
liwdoko, from Colin's mail: asac, ArneGoetje, bryce, calc, evand, james_w, liw, TheMuso, doko, ogra, slangasek23:08
slangasekgrab your test cases here: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/build/all23:08
asacanyone has anything on agenda?23:08
dokoohh, james_w as well23:08
liwslangasek, the ISOs are ready for testing now?23:09
ArneGoetjersyncing...23:09
dokono, just lets go through the list of people about the specs targeted for hardy23:09
dokos/hardy/intrepid/23:09
* doko upgrades quickly 23:09
asaclol23:10
slangasekliw: everything except desktop should be viable; the desktop images are rsyncable but not yet worth testing23:10
liwslangasek, ook, I'll see about helping with that tomorrow (it's past midnight already...)23:10
dokoArneGoetje: could you start the specs state?23:10
slangasekliw: worth starting an rsync though, to save time later23:11
liwslangasek, sure23:11
ArneGoetjedoko: well, I'm basically working on language-selector to finish the language-support package split we have started in Hardy and make it selectable in the UI.23:12
ArneGoetjedoko: good progress in this case23:13
dokolooks like "not delayed"23:14
ArneGoetjedoko: I expect it to be ready for FF23:14
dokoasac: continue?23:15
asacno :)23:15
asacj.k23:15
asacwell. for firefox and such the biggest building blocks are flash experience and safe upgrading23:15
asacflash experience is partly done. the tricky bits still missing though23:16
asacsafe upgrading is probably on track as we have some improvements in bzr23:16
asacthe other thing is NM 0.7, which should enter intrepid after alpha323:17
dokois there something workable for armel?23:18
doko(flash)23:18
asacdoko: how would i know ;) ... i guess gnash builds in debian.23:18
slangasekasac: is 3g-networking-intrepid covered under "NM 0.7"?23:20
asacyes23:20
dokoasac: do you think these are on track for ff?23:20
asacthats basically it. feedback is good so far.23:21
asacsome cards appear to be not recognized as "modem" by hal. the others work out of the box.23:21
asacdoko: hard to say. NM 0.7 certainly wont be much tested until we reach beta23:22
dokobryce: continue?23:23
liwhmm: --- [bryce] idle 291:31:02, signon: Sun Jul  6 17:36:0123:23
slangasekI haven't seen bryce speak up yet; maybe skip him for now and come back if he shows up?23:24
dokocalc, continue?23:24
calcok23:24
calcOOo upload is slightly delayed23:25
calcIts now scheduled for 3.0rc1 to be uploaded week of Aug 21 after Alpha 423:25
dokowhich one, 2.4.x, or 3.0something?23:25
calci made a 2.4.1 upload last week to take care of the a3 oversized cd23:25
dokocould you target just a milestone?23:25
slangasek(is that related to a spec? I don't see anything on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid)23:25
dokothis should be as good as rc-something23:25
calcslangasek: yea, let me see23:26
calchttps://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/ooo-intrepid-upload-schedule23:26
calci might still be able to get 3.0rc1 in before alpha4 its scheduled for aug 823:27
dokocalc: what about an earlier snapshot?23:27
calcbut we were wanting to give it a week before, i should be free that weekend due to my wife having a large photoshoot so i can probably get it in on saturday23:27
calcdoko: i am planning on getting earlier snapshot into a PPA, hopefully by the end of this week, i was going to get it in last week but the 2.4.1 upload delayed it a bit23:28
calcwe didn't want to put 3.0 into intrepid directly until rc due to they may slip the schedule too much..23:28
dokocalc: please could you use the group ppa?23:28
calcok will do23:28
dokothanks23:29
dokook, that's me then23:29
calcso assuming no more slippage by OOo we will have 3.0rc in around aug 8 for FF23:29
slangasekcalc: do you mean that we don't want to *count* on putting 3.0 into intrepid directly until RC?23:29
calcslangasek: yes, it could be that they slip the release past our release23:29
slangasek'cause if it's available sooner, surely it's better to have it in23:29
slangasekright23:29
calcunless we plan on just shipping a 3.0rc23:30
calcwell unless we are ok with doing that in case they slip i mean23:30
dokocalc: ususally the critical patches are in ooo-build, so I wouldn't bother that much if it's 3.0rc-23:30
calcok23:30
slangaseknot sure if we should get into a full discussion about that here, but I would note that hardy's support cycle is well past intrepid's, so security support isn't a concern for sticking with 2.423:31
doko+123:31
dokocalc: please go ahead of debian. we'll have to have it releasable, not them23:32
* calc isn't planning on waiting on debian for this, as they are already frozen (aiui)23:32
liwcalc, Debian freezes next weekend, I think, but that's close enough23:33
calcok23:33
* doko doesn't have any specs, but "java in main". getting in shape, although we'll have to use three different jvms together with openjdk. next thing is to default default-jre/-sdk to openjdk. this will be done before ff.23:34
dokoI'm not sure if I will get a working python3 (not just the core package) in intrepid in ff.23:34
asacdoko: will the java applet situation on !i386 improve this cycle?23:35
dokono, probably not. there is work done by fedora on the icedtea plugin, but it's currently not my focus (and still labeled as experimental)23:37
calcdoko: is openjdk-6 ready enough for me to attempt to switch OOo building to it?23:37
dokocalc: yes, there was never anything wrong with it (except being located in universe)23:38
dokoand you told me you did test it ;)23:38
calcok, great :)23:38
calcyes it worked last year when i tested it23:38
dokoevend is not here; james_w, continue?23:39
dokoahh, isp problems; liw, continue?23:40
slangasekjames_w is also having isp problems?23:40
liwcleanup-cruft: progressing nicely (cleaning up prototype code from the sprint)23:40
liwpython-memory-profiling-tool: stalled23:41
liwget-rid-of-python-central-and-support: slow progress this week, need to finish the doc/spec23:41
liwgobby-server-persistent-state: code works, waiting for reactions from IS and upstream23:41
liwfast-lsb-release: not started yet23:41
liwsuper-piuparts, lintian-harness-improvements: post feature freeze23:41
liwno-fsck-at-boot: to be reassigned, but have concluded that it's not doable without new magic23:41
liw</ul>23:41
dokohappy to look at the get-rid-of spec ... (we have to few get-rid-of specs overall ;)23:42
slangasekget-rid-of-computers23:42
dokoliw: all specs in time?23:43
liwI'm not critically late on anything, yet, if that's what you're asking :)23:44
dokook23:44
dokoogra not here; slangasek, continue?23:44
slangasekno approved specs assigned; I have the pam configuration magic which I'm working on and believe I can deliver in time for intrepid, but this isn't actually on the schedule anywhere officially at this point23:46
slangasek(that's https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PAMConfigFrameworkSpec)23:46
slangasek'sall for me, unless someone has questions23:47
dokook, TheMuso to close the list ...23:47
TheMusoDesktop Accessibility Review spec: Still reading and understanding code and documentation for python-dbus/policykit interaction and reading docs for python-xlib/python-gtk, but am almost ready to port some code from gnome-session to python, that is used for checking that at-spi-registryd started correctly. This will be used in ubiquity-dm when accessibility is enabled for speech/magnification.23:47
TheMusoI will certainly have the ubiquity stuff fixed up for FF, but will have to take things one at a time to get software sources/hardware testing ported to policykit/getting the UI accessible to the user.23:48
TheMusoSo certainly some of the spec will be completed by FF.23:48
TheMusoDmraid: Spent time with Colin at the sprint getting to understand partman internals, and now reading libparted code to educate it about dmraid/mapper devices for use with dmraid. Need to read vol_id code to link against dmraid shared library for use with providing better integration for vol_id/udev for use at boot.23:49
TheMusoConfident that this will be complted by FF.23:49
dokoslangasek: did you see any specs not mentioned (besides from people not in the meeting)?23:50
slangaseknope23:50
asacTheMuso: how is sound going?23:50
TheMusoasac: Since Debian is freezing soon, I am not sure whether they will hav e alsa 1.0.17. Once I know for sure, I'll either merge, or upload new upstream versions of the alsa bits. I also intend asking the kernel guys about getting alsa driver 1.0.17 into the kernel, so everything matches.23:51
TheMusoI am still aware of the pc-speaker issue, and intend debugging that today. With luck, 1.0.17 will help solve it.23:51
slangasekTheMuso: which alsa is in 2.6.26 upstream kernel, since skew caused problems for us before?23:52
TheMusoslangasek: Still 1.0.16.23:52
slangasekbut we want to jump to 1.0.17 for some reason?23:52
asacare all the sound issues we had with pulseaudio/alsa and flash now gone in a default intrepid install?23:52
TheMusoSupport for more hardware, and some more fixes, particularly for use with pulse.23:53
TheMusoasac: Until we can use a sound card properly, not sure yet.23:53
asacsure23:53
TheMusoAs for pulse itself, I highly doubt the new version will land for intrepid. Its still highly unstable.23:54
TheMusoHowever itf it were to land, and we wanted it, we would have to go to alsa 1.0.17.23:55
slangasekah23:55
dokoany other business?23:56
liwnothing from me23:57
slangaseknone here23:57
doko323:57
doko223:57
doko123:57
dokomeeting ends ;) (I'm tired)23:57
liwthanks and good night23:57
TheMusoThanks.23:57
ArneGoetjethanks23:57
slangasekthanks, folks23:58
asacoff23:58
calcby323:59
calcer bye :)23:59

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