| === baron1984 is now known as AlmightyCthulhu | ||
| === baron1984 is now known as AlmightyCthulhu | ||
| pwnguin | well thats an unfortunate blowup regarding foxconn | 04:35 |
|---|---|---|
| === asac_ is now known as asac | ||
| AlmightyCthulhu | I'm in contact with Foxconn's Chinese headquarters | 04:49 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | they say that even after applying my ACPI mods, some types of RAM are freezing the kernel | 04:49 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | this does not happen in Windows | 04:49 |
| pwnguin | well, i meant more the instant reaction and villification of foxconn | 05:11 |
| baron1984 | I just got off the phone with Foxconn | 06:02 |
| baron1984 | They called me at 1 AM (here) from China | 06:02 |
| baron1984 | and were asking me to help them with Linux support for their BIOS | 06:03 |
| pwnguin | heh | 06:03 |
| pwnguin | if you feel out of your league, just give them canonical's email | 06:04 |
| pwnguin | or url | 06:04 |
| pwnguin | they have an OEM vendor cert thing | 06:04 |
| pwnguin | http://ubuntu-virginia.ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=5459641&postcount=120 | 06:04 |
| pwnguin | baron1984: ^ was that a joke? | 06:05 |
| baron1984 | no | 06:06 |
| baron1984 | they actually called me | 06:06 |
| baron1984 | from Shenzen, China | 06:06 |
| pwnguin | the other part | 06:06 |
| pwnguin | teh s3kr3t me55ag3 | 06:06 |
| baron1984 | the part about them sending me a fixed BIOS ROM? | 06:06 |
| baron1984 | oh, hehehehe | 06:06 |
| baron1984 | yeah | 06:06 |
| baron1984 | that was a joke | 06:06 |
| pwnguin | sorry, that thread is just so chock full of accusations, vitrol and hate that I can't take anything at face value =( | 06:07 |
| pwnguin | it seems very un Ubuntu what transpired there | 06:07 |
| baron1984 | what, they gave out a sabotaged BIOS | 06:08 |
| baron1984 | when they get massively and publicly called out on it | 06:08 |
| pwnguin | its not very collaborative, productive or respectful | 06:08 |
| baron1984 | they go from buy vista screw yourself, to "how can we help?" | 06:08 |
| pwnguin | granted, they might not have treated you with respect | 06:08 |
| pwnguin | i think you would have been better off writing an open letter to the acpi folks | 06:09 |
| === baron1984 is now known as AlmightyCthulhu | ||
| AlmightyCthulhu | it's not Intel's fault | 06:10 |
| pwnguin | intel doesnt run acpi | 06:10 |
| pwnguin | and acpi owns the acpi trademarks | 06:10 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | they have a reference implementation of how ACPI should work | 06:10 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | and a compiler that validly compiles the BIOS code | 06:10 |
| pwnguin | if someone's claiming "acpi compliance" ACPI probably had a hand involved in it | 06:10 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | so why are they passing the completely busted and incorrect Linux table | 06:11 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | when even Vista's works better? | 06:11 |
| pwnguin | for the same reason we ship busted software in 8.04 | 06:11 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | they never had any intention to fix it | 06:11 |
| pwnguin | shit happens, and what isn't a priority slips through the cracks | 06:12 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | and wouldn't have, unless it broke Vista or XP | 06:12 |
| pwnguin | clearly they had no intention, but it seems unfair to accuse them of fraud | 06:12 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | in any event | 06:13 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | they admitted it was an invalid implementation | 06:13 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | written by unskilled programmers | 06:13 |
| pwnguin | (well duh) | 06:13 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | which makes it non compliant, even if it wasn't their intention | 06:13 |
| pwnguin | do you know who the acpi sig secretary is? | 06:14 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | probably Microsoft | 06:14 |
| pwnguin | bingo | 06:14 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | probably signs off on bad BIOS implementations | 06:15 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | just to bite Linux users | 06:15 |
| pwnguin | at any rate, mjg59 thinks the point is moot since newer kernels masquerade as windows | 06:15 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | then my mod shouldn't do anything | 06:15 |
| pwnguin | you two might talk | 06:15 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | but it does | 06:16 |
| pwnguin | newer kernels | 06:16 |
| pwnguin | what are you using? | 06:16 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | 2.6.26? | 06:16 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | :P | 06:16 |
| AlmightyCthulhu | Linux ryan-desktop 2.6.26-4-generic #1 SMP Mon Jul 14 18:39:36 UTC 2008 x86_64 GNU/Linux | 06:16 |
| pwnguin | http://mjg59.livejournal.com/94560.html contains comments from some fairly influential and intelligent people | 06:17 |
| pwnguin | you two might talk and compare notes. its part of the CoC after all ;) | 06:18 |
| pwnguin | at any rate, im goin to bed, what i know about dsdt and acpi wouldn't amount to a plate of beans | 06:19 |
| pwnguin | oh, and I'd love to see a way of keeping up to date on progress via this. now that you brought it up and made it a huge deal, it would be terrible to see it wasted =( | 06:22 |
| pwnguin | ubuntu-kernel has a fairly low volume ML that might be appropriate, I donno. | 06:22 |
| === gnomefre1k is now known as gnomefreak | ||
| === gnomefre1k is now known as gnomefreak | ||
| === gnomefre1k is now known as gnomefreak | ||
| === gnomefre1k is now known as gnomefreak | ||
| === gnomefre1k is now known as gnomefreak | ||
| === gnomefre1k is now known as gnomefreak | ||
| ceeka1 | i'm getting a kernel oops on ubuntu 7.04. i have set up kdump and crash so i'm able to see where the error occurred... appears to be in line 717 of skbuff.h (skb_dequeue which is inlined into process_backlog) anyone have suggestions where i could start on figuring out what could be going wrong? the machine it crashes on just sits on my network at the office | 17:30 |
| === ceeka1 is now known as seekay | ||
| === Daviey_ is now known as Daviey | ||
| Nafallo | BenC: ping 3945B :-) | 19:01 |
| BenC | Nafallo: yes, was there a fix? | 19:27 |
| BenC | Nafallo: I don't really have a test rig | 19:27 |
| Nafallo | BenC: ah. should I look for someone that has one or just go with the obscurity of my findings this far in a bugreport? :-) | 19:28 |
| BenC | Nafallo: I have a 3945 card, just no B network to connect to | 19:29 |
| Nafallo | yea. same here at the moment :-) | 19:29 |
| Nafallo | hmm... I should try setting my linksys in B only mode... | 19:31 |
| Nafallo | not now though. I need my internets :-) | 19:31 |
| smb_tp | :q | 19:40 |
| === doko_ is now known as doko | ||
| holycow | hi guys | 21:07 |
| holycow | i have a fujitsu u810 umpc. everything works great but this thing has a set of keyboard led lights id like to learn how toturn off or on. i guess ill haveto blearn how to write drivers. what sorts of techniques should i be looking at when trying to discover how these leds afre turned on? | 21:11 |
| holycow | lspci doesnt szeem to show anything that looks like it controls the leds | 21:12 |
| pwnguin | arent keyboard leds kinda controlled by the keyboard? | 21:26 |
| pwnguin | i dont think you'd need a PCI slot for that | 21:27 |
| holycow | not this one, i think its driver controlled but i didnt get windows with it to check | 21:27 |
| pwnguin | well theres still a driver | 21:27 |
| pwnguin | its just not PCI | 21:27 |
| holycow | its two leds on a ledge above the kb starngely | 21:27 |
| holycow | and i dont see a switch for them ... everything is in japanese | 21:28 |
| holycow | heh | 21:28 |
| pwnguin | there's a kernel LED module i think | 21:28 |
| pwnguin | clever | 21:28 |
| holycow | oh! | 21:28 |
| pwnguin | im not sure what it controls, or if its sort of a generic interface for all things that have leds | 21:29 |
| pwnguin | at any rate, there's also Xkb | 21:29 |
| holycow | aha, googling | 21:29 |
| BenC | holycow: usually things like that hang off the parallel port IO range (or similar IO ranges) | 22:31 |
| BenC | and they are usually poorly documented, requiring IO sniffing in windows to reverse engineer | 22:32 |
| BenC | or decompiling the windows driver to find out the write/read combos used to control it | 22:32 |
| holycow | aha! | 22:32 |
| BenC | holycow: is this keyboard on a USB bus? | 22:33 |
| BenC | if so, not integrating the led's is a very poor design :) | 22:33 |
| holycow | lol i dont know, im just starting my journey | 22:33 |
| pwnguin | holycow: lsusb is a complimantary tool that might help answer that without logic analyzers and taking the device apart ;) | 22:33 |
| holycow | actually i doubt it | 22:34 |
| pwnguin | you'd be surprised | 22:34 |
| holycow | oh right forgot about that | 22:34 |
| pwnguin | sometimes the quest to reduce costs means integrating several functions into a single chip / bus | 22:34 |
| pwnguin | even though its more expensive | 22:34 |
| BenC | pwnguin: I'd be surprised if they hung keyboard led's off a usb bus and not have them hardware integrated into the keyboard itself | 22:35 |
| pwnguin | true | 22:35 |
| BenC | actually, I'm surprised they aren't already | 22:37 |
| holycow | i have a touch screen and a finger scanner on the usb bus | 22:37 |
| BenC | holycow: are these caps/num lock led's or something else? | 22:37 |
| holycow | no led controller of any kind ... makes sense | 22:38 |
| holycow | oh something elese | 22:38 |
| holycow | they are additional leds on little raisers to light the kb at night | 22:38 |
| holycow | its a umpc fujitsu u810 | 22:38 |
| BenC | oh, keyboard backlight | 22:38 |
| holycow | thats it! | 22:39 |
| BenC | most likely low level IO type things | 22:39 |
| holycow | that sounds right | 22:39 |
| holycow | your original suggestion is probable the right approach | 22:40 |
| BenC | under windows does it change the keyboard backlight based on ambient lighting in the room? | 22:40 |
| BenC | or is it manual control? | 22:40 |
| holycow | manual | 22:40 |
| BenC | might be good to email fujitsu to see if they are willing to cough up specs | 22:42 |
| holycow | fgqrtyu-= | 22:42 |
| holycow | oops sorry | 22:42 |
| holycow | BenC: indeedy, will do | 22:43 |
| pwnguin | BenC: i saw your talk on hardware whoring | 22:43 |
| holycow | thx for the heads up | 22:43 |
| BenC | pwnguin: hehe | 22:43 |
| pwnguin | i thought it was kinda wierd, because it didnt mention how developers can get in touch with the right people | 22:44 |
| BenC | damn innanet | 22:44 |
| pwnguin | it was basically all "when vendors call you" | 22:44 |
| BenC | pwnguin: I've never had to go that route | 22:44 |
| BenC | pwnguin: and doing so is usually different (and difficult) depending on the company you are talking about | 22:45 |
| pwnguin | apparently if you call the FTC and claim they're committing fraud they get you in touch with people | 22:45 |
| BenC | pwnguin: good starting points are linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org archives to find out if an engineer from that company has already come out | 22:45 |
| BenC | and similar places...websites are good places too, but always hard to find something other than customer support | 22:46 |
| pwnguin | i guess what i'm saying is it might be a good idea to give people ideas on constructively contacting the right people | 22:46 |
| pwnguin | but thanks for the tips | 22:46 |
| BenC | true, but it wasn't an area where I had experience, so I neglected to mention anything :) | 22:46 |
| pwnguin | if you're invited to give the talk again, i might suggest pointing out the deficiency as a way of starting a dialog at the end of the talk :) | 22:47 |
| holycow | slowly windowsonly hardware is starting to lessen tho | 22:47 |
| BenC | pwnguin: good idea, thanks for the feedback | 22:48 |
| pwnguin | sure | 22:48 |
| holycow | hopefully vendors will buildintotheirproduct cycles better community interaction | 22:48 |
| pwnguin | doubtful | 22:48 |
| pwnguin | product cycles dont fit into neat six month releases | 22:48 |
| holycow | well i dont meant ubuntu community specifically, just thinking more generically | 22:49 |
| pwnguin | intel hired some smart people to deal with that, but i think we'll quickly see a "peak keithp" similar to "peak oil" | 22:49 |
| holycow | heh | 22:50 |
| holycow | bbl low on battery powr | 22:52 |
| holycow | thx for the help btw | 22:52 |
| pwnguin | BenC: is there a better resource for toshiba than that website? | 22:52 |
| BenC | holycow: np | 22:59 |
| BenC | pwnguin: Don't know off hand | 22:59 |
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