[09:53] <persia> RIght.  Looks like the AMD Geode is a i586, so the lpia kernel probably won't work.
[09:54] <gonzopancho> yup
[09:54] <persia> I suspect it's the same situation as the C7-M, in that hardy doesn't quite work right.
[09:55] <persia> The problem is that most of the packages are specially customised to behave differently on the lpia architecture.
[09:55] <persia> Given the number of Geode and C7-M users, this seems to be a source of frustration for many.
[09:55] <gonzopancho> right, but there has to be some way to completely rebuild from source with the right switches set, no?
[09:55] <amitk> persia: and lpiacompat kernel doesn't work either?
[09:55] <gonzopancho> haven't tried, waiting on hw (next week)
[09:56] <persia> amitk: On i586?  You'd know better than I.  Doesn't boot on C7-M.  I've not heard about Geode specifically.
[09:57] <persia> gonzopancho: You could certainly rebuild everything from source, but you might do as well to convince your machine that it is "lpia" anyway, and run a regular kernel and lpia userspace.
[09:58] <gonzopancho> and... how would I go about doing that?
[10:00] <persia> Umm.  That's the part I don't know :)  My HW is lpia (although I sometimes run i386 on it).  I think you'd have to debootstrap lpia onto the target disk, and manually copy the i386 kernel, but there may be more to it.
[10:05] <amitk> persia: should work on the geode since we have a M586 processor as default in the config. It would be interesting to find out the actually boot problem
[10:06] <gonzopancho> ok, when hw arrives, I'll report back.  
[10:06] <amitk> in order to support more HW, we could lose a few more optimizations if required
[10:08] <persia> amitk: I thought lpia was i686 only.  If it also supports i586, how does it differ from i386?
[10:09] <amitk> persia: lpia doesn't do out-of-order execution
[10:10] <amitk> lpiacompat was created so that users of other devices could play with UME without owning lpia HW
[10:11] <gonzopancho> does "play with" == "not supported"?
[10:12] <persia> amitk: Aha!  So lpiacompat is supposed to work on Geode, C7-M, etc.?
[10:13] <persia> gonzopancho: support is a tricky thing.  Let's say that it should work.
[10:17] <amitk> persia: "supposed to work" is tricky thing. :) We made it work with the Samsung Q1s so we could get started with UME work, but if we can, we should certainly extend it to other devices.
[10:18] <persia> amitk: Isn't the Q1 a A110 part?  That's i686+
[10:20] <persia> I'm just confused about the definition of "lpia".  If it is special because of the 1GB memory limit, and the in-order execution, and the instruction set assumptions, it is useful.  If that's not the case, I don't understand.
[10:27] <amitk> lpia is the architecture created (for buildds) with the above constraints, gcc flags, etc. Inside that we have two flavours for kernels - lpia and lpiacompat. lpia requires real HW, lpiacompat was a pseudo flavour to allow us to run all this code on non-lpia machines. So lpiacompat doesn't necessarily have these constraints.
[10:28] <amitk> persia: hope that made sense...
[10:29] <persia> I see, so lpia is a real architecture, but the lpiacompat kernel is supposed to allow one to run lpia on i386 (kinda like how some people run i386 with an amd64 kernel).
[10:31] <amitk> right..
[10:34] <persia> amitk: Thanks.  I'll advise people with C7-M and the like to try lpiacompat.  If that doesn't work, bugs may be filed.
[11:15] <ogra> persia, i can try geode if you need it, i have two gedoe systems here now (just got a new GX last week at the ltsp hackfest and have an older LX around since a while)
[11:16] <ogra> the usual prob is not the CPU wth them but the fact that we dont really have stable X drivers .... (the LX should now work with the recent hardy-updates packages though)
[11:18] <ogra> also they *work* with 686 but not in any acceptable performance level
[11:18] <persia> ogra: Could you try lpia on Geode with the lpiacompat kernel?  Just to verify boot & hildon-desktop launch.  If it works, I'll stop telling people not to do that.  If it doesn't work, we found a bug.
[11:18] <persia> Geode can run i686?  All the docs I found said they were i586.  Are there both sorts of Geodes?
[11:19] <ogra> well, i assume you will have something like 5min boottime with 686 ande your mouns wont actually move as fast as you expect etc 
[11:19] <ogra> i have some seen booting 686 though, but for a usable system 686 is not an option on them
[11:20] <ogra> well, i just got the GX, i can only talk about LX from experience the GX still sits in its box in my bag :)
[11:21] <ogra> but i suspect to 99.9% that none of the graphics drivers we have in any image will actually drive them anyway
[11:22] <ogra> that will require tinkering (an di actually got the GX because its known to not work on hardy at all)
[11:26] <ogra> s/mouns/mouse/ :)
[11:26]  * ogra needs coffee
[11:28] <persia> ogra: Ah.  If it's *known* not to work then perhaps it's not the best test :)
[11:28] <ogra> right, LX will work with the latest drivers from -updates
[11:28] <ogra> but the GX wont ...
[11:30] <ogra> intrepid is a different thing ... i will have to check that for ltsp anyway though so can tell within the next days 
[11:31] <ogra> it is supposed to be better, but there are some probs with the PCI detection code for them i heard
[11:31] <persia> OK.  No rush.  The seeds are still being mangled for intrepid: there's no ubuntu-mobile to install today (or wasn't last I updated my intrepid apt cache)
[11:32] <ogra> do we have a pubic branch of the builder i can just checkout and run to get an image ? 
[11:33] <persia> https://code.launchpad.net/~stevenk/livecd-rootfs/trunk should workd.  Mind you, it misses two weeks of local fixes: maybe poke for an update.
[11:37] <ogra> hum, i need to run livecd.sh and then build_ume_image ? why didnt he just make build_ume_image a wraper that does everything in one go ? 
[11:39] <ogra> hmm and handing over the UUID to casper should speed up booting of the installer image a lot 
[11:40] <ogra> oh, he does that, just not on the kernel commandline 
[13:55] <pd> hello everyone. is someone in here who can tell me who is responsible for the bluez-utils package?
[14:16] <mterry> pd: I don't know exactly who maintains it, but I've dealt with it a few times...
[14:17] <mterry> pd: The package lists the following uploaders: Edd Dumbill <ejad@debian.org>, Filippo Giunchedi <filippo@debian.org>, Mario Iseli <mario@debian.org>
[14:18] <pd> mterry, but they are only responsible for the debianpackage not the ubuntu one?
[14:19] <pd> mterry, i hit a bug  with the package and found that it is caused by a small bug for which is a patch avaible over a month
[14:19] <mterry> pd: Yeah.  Looking at the debian/changelog file, you can see stevenk and lool touch it a lot
[14:19] <pd> everything is well documented at launchpad
[14:19] <pd> but noone seems to care about it
[14:20] <mterry> pd: Sounds like StevenK or lool are good people to poke until they care
[14:20] <pd> hehe
[14:20] <pd> the patch is only a 3 liner.... it shoulnd be too hard to add it ;-)
[14:21] <StevenK> pd: What's the bug number? I'll upload it tomorrow
[14:23] <pd> hi StevenK, its bug nummer 211252 and here https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez-utils/+bug/211252/comments/81 is the comment with the patch to fix a problem with bluez-utils that made serial connections undiscoverable
[14:24] <StevenK> pd: Okay, I'll sort it out
[14:25] <pd> the topic is not really complete... maybe there are several problems which the bug solves... 
[14:26] <pd> okay thanks a lot steven!
[16:51] <persia> Meeting in 10 minutes.  Oddly enough, we're having it here this week (due to a conflict)
[16:55] <mkrufky> is there an agenda this time?
[16:56] <persia> Yep.
[16:56] <mkrufky> :-) ok, i'll wait and see
[16:56] <persia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/Meeting/20080731
[16:57] <mkrufky> heh... looks a lot like last week's
[16:57] <persia> mkrufky: Has an item in it this week.  More could go there, but nobody seems to raise anything for discussion.  There's still three minutes for a quick edit if you want to add something.
[16:58] <mkrufky> unfortunately, all my pending issues are specific to the sub-project ....  nothing really in general... but im interested in sitting in on these while i can, and would be happy to discuss any tv related stuff if anything comes up
[16:59] <mkrufky> iow... nope, i got nothing to add :-)
[17:00] <persia> OK.  Let's get started.
[17:01] <persia> #startmeeting
[17:01] <MootBot> Meeting started at 11:04. The chair is persia.
[17:01] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[17:01] <persia> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/Meeting/20080731
[17:01] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileAndEmbedded/Meeting/20080731 
[17:01] <persia> No action items from last week
[17:01] <persia> [TOPIC] Change of meeting time
[17:01] <MootBot> New Topic:  Change of meeting time 
[17:02] <persia> davidm, who can't be here this week, asked that we adjust the meeting time to be a bit earlier.  12:00 UTC was suggested.
[17:02] <persia> Does this time work better or worse for anyone?
[17:02] <persia> (It's better for me)
[17:03] <cgregan> 1200 UTC I thought it was 1100
[17:04] <persia> cgregan: Could be 11:00  Is that better for you?
[17:04] <cgregan> no
[17:04] <cgregan> 1200 is ok
[17:04] <persia> Well then :)
[17:04] <persia> Anyone else?
[17:05] <cgregan> here the text from the email: We have a green light for this so I'd like to propose that we move it to 06:00 CDT (11:00 UTC) Thursdays.
[17:05] <cgregan> Unfortunately it says 1100 :-(
[17:05] <persia> cgregan: I'm not worried about email :p
[17:06] <cgregan> hehe
[17:06] <cgregan> David might have chosen 1100 because of his schedule
[17:06] <cgregan> Not sure he will make it to 1200
[17:06] <persia> Anyway.  Anyone here who would find 12:00 inconvenient?
[17:07] <cgregan> I think we are the only two here! I'm good with 1200
[17:08] <persia> OK.  Then.  Since the only objection is that someone who isn't here might prefer a time that is more inconvenient for someone who is here, we'll go with 12:00.
[17:08] <cgregan> Sweet!
[17:08] <persia> [AGREED] Henceforth, meetings will be 12:00 UTC in #ubuntu-meeting (when available)
[17:08] <MootBot> AGREED received:  Henceforth, meetings will be 12:00 UTC in #ubuntu-meeting (when available) 
[17:08] <persia> [TOPIC] Other Business
[17:08] <MootBot> New Topic:  Other Business 
[17:08] <persia> Anyone have any last-minute items to add?
[17:09] <cgregan> maybe
[17:09] <cgregan> Any information on specs for UME Intrepid?
[17:09] <cgregan> Is there a wiki
[17:09] <cgregan> any decisions made?
[17:09] <persia> Err.  There ought be, although I'm not sure which specs are for intrepid.
[17:10] <persia> cgregan: Would you be willing to select some specs for intrepid for presentation/review at the next meeting?
[17:10] <cgregan> sure
[17:10] <persia> [ACTION] cgregan to select some specs for intrepid
[17:10] <MootBot> ACTION received:  cgregan to select some specs for intrepid 
[17:10] <persia> OK.  Anything else?
[17:10] <cgregan> I'm good
[17:11] <persia> Thanks all for coming.  See you next week, with actual content planned :)
[17:11] <persia> #endmeeting
[17:11] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 11:14.
[17:11] <cgregan> Thanks for hosting
[17:11] <Maverick2k> I have one question outside the meeting
[17:11] <persia> Maverick2k: Sure.  Meetings over.  Ask your question.
[17:12] <Maverick2k> what are the consequences of this message 
[17:12] <Maverick2k> http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS3713000918.html?kc=rss
[17:12] <Maverick2k> that the moblin project is shifting from ubuntu too fedora
[17:12] <persia> Maverick2k: That's a very open-ended question :)
[17:13] <Maverick2k> the mobile stuff on the site of ubuntu will continue?
[17:13] <Maverick2k> for the MIDs 
[17:13] <Maverick2k> etc
[17:13] <Maverick2k> ?
[17:13] <persia> Personally, I think it means that Intel will be building their packages for Fedora, and we'll be working with them as we do with any other upstream.
[17:14] <persia> Oh, certainly.  There's no reason to stop doing Ubuntu on the smaller devices just because of some press releases.
[17:15] <Maverick2k> i'm very new, so I was just curious
[17:16] <Maverick2k> thnx for your anwser
[17:19] <persia> Maverick2k: To explain it differently, aside from some messiness with architectures right now, ubuntu-mobile is just a collection of software in Ubuntu that makes the experience of working on a smaller device more pleasant.  Ubuntu itself seems to expect 1024x768 or better, and so doesn'T look so good on 800x480, 800x600, or 1024x600 screens.
[17:19] <persia> The icons also get fairly tiny above about 150 DPI.
[17:20] <ogra> gah
[17:20] <persia> The collection in ubuntu-mobile is intended to overcome that confusion, so tries to make the experience better.  One example is by making applications run fullscreen, so they don't get lost.
[17:20]  * ogra missed the start of the meeting
[17:20] <persia> This effort remains interesting regardless of external events, at least to those of us who use Ubuntu and have smaller devices.
[17:21] <persia> ogra: And the end :p
[17:21] <ogra> oh
[17:21]  * ogra curses
[17:21] <Maverick2k> k thnx
[17:22] <persia> ogra: The main point was an agreement that the meeting would change to 12:00 UTC.  Is that time particularly bad for you?
[17:22] <ogra> nah
[17:22] <ogra> on thu. ?
[17:23] <ogra> thursdays 12:00UTC is just fine, not sure if we clash with davidm's calls though
[17:23] <persia> ogra: Yes, on Thursday.
[17:32] <davmor2> great a meeting at dinner time :) on thursdays :)
[17:32] <ogra> dinner at 12:00 UTC in the uk ? 
[17:32] <ogra> youre an early bird man ...
[17:33] <persia> "Dinner" is one of those words that doesn't always translate well.  It often means "midday meal" in the UK
[17:33] <davmor2> lunch then and 12:00 is 13:00 uk time currently
[17:33] <ogra> ah, right they have dinner and supper :P
[17:34] <ogra> yeah, 14:00 german time
[17:34] <davmor2> dinner and tea :)
[17:34] <ogra> lol, indeed ... i forgot about that one 
[17:39] <Maverick2k> maybe a stupid question does anyon know how to auto identify on freenode with KSirc, I used a perl script but that didn't work
[17:41] <Maverick2k> if someone knows an another good IRC client thats okay, I'm not that attached too KSirc
[17:43]  * ogra is a big xchat fan
[17:44]  * persia hears a number of KDE users talk about Konversation
[17:44] <Maverick2k> thnx I will look for both and make a choice
[17:56] <Maverick2k> So that is better auto join works
[17:57] <Maverick2k> thnx persia and orga
[20:55] <shishirm1> hi people
[20:56] <shishirm1> i am trying ubuntu on khojinsha sh series
[20:56] <shishirm1> i  have downloaded the .img file
[20:56] <shishirm1> can any1 tell me how to try it on my tablet??
[21:02] <shishirm1> hey please tell me wht to do next
[21:02] <shishirm1> i have downloaded the mccaslin  one
[21:03] <shishirm1> the tablet has intel atom processor
[21:03] <sioux> and on which hw have you planned to install it
[21:05] <shishirm1> the tablet doesnt have a cd drive
[21:05] <shishirm1> i will have to install with a udb pen drive
[21:05] <shishirm1> usb*
[21:06] <shishirm1> how exactly should i do that?
[21:08] <shishirm1> sioux: atleast give me a link which explains how to do it??
[21:22] <GrueMaster> ﻿ shishirm1:  This uses the 945 chipset.  Try using the McCasslin based image.  The Menlow image is for a different chipset.
[21:24] <GrueMaster> To install, you will need to download the image, then type "dd bs=1024 if=<image file> of=<usb drive>" (where <image file> is the img file you downloaded and <usb drive> is the actual usb drive - not the partition - i.e. /dev/sdb).
[21:46] <Maverick2k> ls
[21:47] <Maverick2k> sorry wrong window ;)
[22:03] <heat> anyone know if the usbc patch ever made to upstream? and if so, where it lives?
[22:06] <GrueMaster> heat:  no, it has not.
[22:06] <GrueMaster> The only portion that made it upstream is alsa support for the HD Audio portion of the chipset.
[22:07] <heat> hmm any idea what the hold up is?
[22:07] <GrueMaster> no, I don't.
[22:07] <heat> :(
[22:07] <GrueMaster> I do know that it isn't me.  :)
[22:08] <heat> seems like it should have already been in linux-next by now (and would have been nice if it was in linux-next a few weeks ago, so it would have made it to .27 :)   )
[22:08] <GrueMaster> Actually, it should have been in 2.6.26
[22:08] <heat> i think the i2c stuff made it too
[22:08] <heat> GrueMaster: yeah, true..
[22:09] <heat> i2c-isch.c, yeah smbus stuff got in.. but no usb :(
[22:09] <heat> doh
[22:09]  * heat mumbles
[22:10] <heat> thx for the info
[22:18] <Maverick2k> I newbie on this, but how can I compile for a 32 bits machine on a 64 Bits machine
[22:18] <Maverick2k> mcCasslin = 32 bits and my working station 64 bits
[22:19] <Maverick2k> I can chroot in the project McCasslin and compile with gcc, but that is probably 64 Bits
[22:21] <heat> Maverick2k: give gcc a -m32
[22:22] <Maverick2k> and how can I do that for dpkg-buildpackage -b for the kernel that is
[22:27] <heat> hell if i know.. i don't use silly debian tools :-]
[22:27] <Maverick2k> lol
[22:28] <Maverick2k> I will try google
[22:28] <Maverick2k> heat: thnx
[22:28] <heat> sry :(
[22:46] <Maverick2k> goodnight
[22:46] <Maverick2k> cya