[01:45] <persia> ogra: I think having a consistent /dev/touchscreen is an excellent idea, but I think that it ought be achieved by udev rules, rather than a script using ln -s.
[01:46] <persia> If you look at the Q1U config, it has a udev rule that matches the specific model: perhaps this could be expanded to support a wider variety of touchscreens.
[01:46] <persia> Err.  /dev/input/touchscreen
[01:46] <ogra> well, i discussed the idea with Keybuk and bryce ... and they convinced me to rather try to get it properly into hal
[01:47] <ogra> so the whole config can be handled there and is dynamic
[01:47] <ogra> my attempt was a bit shortsighted and only actually targets the current situation ... which will not be the intrpid situation
[01:48] <persia> ogra: Hmm.  That is better, and yes, doesn't work without the new xinput2 stuff.
[01:48] <ogra> it would be a good solution for hardy though with your point to use udev it would even be better
[01:49] <persia> In the Q1U images, we do use udev, just with a very tight udev rule matching only one device.
[01:49] <ogra> but i will take a deep look into hal-input i think ... as soon as time permits
[01:49] <persia> Yeah, I've been meaning to do that as well.  It is the future.
[01:49] <ogra> we can use udev to trigger hal
[01:50] <persia> Well, do we want /dev/input/touchscreen for legacy purposes?  If not, we can just trigger hal when adding any input device, and let hal-input sort it out
[01:50] <ogra> right
[01:50] <ogra> dev wont matter in the hal case
[01:50] <ogra> v/dev i mean
[01:50] <persia> The only case where one wouldn't want that is for MIDI, as the programming for MIDI is currently too different to handle generally.
[01:51] <ogra> depends, i guess even that can be made workable by hal
[01:51]  * persia was looking at indamixx press recently
[01:52] <persia> Not for intrepid.  For later, maybe.
[02:04] <ogra> btw, do you know the reason why Mouse0 in the config isnt using /dev/input/mice as it should be, but /dev/input/mouseX ? 
[02:04] <ogra> using mice here makes all additionally attached pointing devices work as well ... (i.e. the trackball of my wreless kbd and my usb mouse) 
[02:05] <persia> No idea at all.  That was frustrating to me, as it required adjustment to work on my hardware (or else only the touchpad worked, not the joystick or the touchscreen)
[02:05] <ogra> right
[02:05] <ogra> with /dev/input/mice all works equally fine
[02:05] <ogra> i wonder if we can get that as fix in
[02:06] <ogra> we'll likely need to re-roll an updated image for the speedup stuff i guess
[02:10] <persia> Do you think /dev/input/mice is SRU-worthy?
[02:10] <ogra> not sure, i'd like to hear other opinions and hear from testers first
[02:11] <ogra> it might just work because of the module order i used for loading them
[02:14] <ogra> (which indeed would indicate a worse bug in udev/modprobe somewhere)
[02:15] <persia> Why?  /dev/input/eventx is populated in module loading order with increasing X.  The same is true to a lesser degree for /dev/input/mouseX and /dev/input/jsX (why don't we support multiple keyboards like that).
[02:16] <persia> Well, not module loading order exactly, but hardware plug event order, which is strongly influenced by module loading order
[02:16] <ogra> i guess because we dont have a /dev/kbd
[02:17] <ogra> hmm
[02:17] <ogra> we do
[02:17] <persia> Well, it has been there in the past.  Just more confusion because X has it's own keyboard drivers (which is frustrating when one has an interesting keyboard-like device)
[02:17] <ogra> and i assume thats exactly what hal-input will do
[02:18] <ogra> my leyboard is /dev/input/event1 here
[02:18] <ogra> *keyboard
[02:18] <persia> Well, some of that.  There's still differences with the console, as it doesn't tend to use hal-input.
[02:18] <ogra> it should then :)
[02:18] <persia> Have you looked at the input-utils package?  I find it very useful when looking at input stuff.
[02:19] <persia> Should a VC really depend on a running HAL?  That's an interesting direction.
[02:19] <ogra> no, i just dug around in hal-device-manager
[02:19] <ogra> err
[02:19] <ogra> gnome-device-manager
[02:19] <ogra> ... was renamed
[02:19] <persia> Ah.  Install it: `lsinput` is a much simpler interface :)
[02:20] <persia> MInd you, input-utils seems to need more root access than one would expect, but ...
[02:20] <ogra> i think hal should as abstraction layer indeed handle all HW at some point
[02:21] <ogra> and afaik devicekit is trying to solve that 
[02:21] <persia> Mind you, `cat /proc/bus/input/devices can be similarly informative.
[02:23] <persia> Yeah: having a central abstraction layer would be nice.  With a bit of extension, it ought be able to handle 漢字 entry cleanly in the console as well.
[02:23] <ogra> well, thats what hal reads 
[02:23] <ogra> not /proc but the equivalent in sysfs
[02:24] <ogra> and /proc is suposed to vanish since linux 2.6.0 was released
[02:25] <CShadowRun> Is there any devices that actually run ubuntu mobile nicely, and are released?
[02:25] <CShadowRun> and ubuntu mobile is linux, so i can use most of my stuff i run on my pc on the mobile device (Providing it's not too resource intensive obviously)
[02:27] <ogra> A samsung Q1 runs it over here, and yes, ubuntu mobile uses the standard ubuntu archive you can theoretically install everything from apache up to gnome
[02:27] <CShadowRun> and is there any way to test ubuntu mobile without installing KVM, KVM seriously borked my computer last time i tried to use it.
[02:27] <CShadowRun> nice :)
[02:27] <CShadowRun> like, could i try it out in virtualbox? that'd be nice.
[02:27] <persia> CShadowRun: Pretty much any device with an A100, A110, or Atom processor ought work fine.  Best experience for 1024x600 screens, and many things are optimised for the Samsung Q1U.
[02:28] <ogra> i did try it in virtualbox, but you need to manually convert the image wiht qemu to a vbox image 
[02:28] <persia> There's been talk about virtualbox images, but I don't know of any published ones.
[02:28] <persia> ogra: How does one do that?
[02:28] <ogra> and to get a proper screen size you need the vbox modules in the image
[02:28] <ogra> there is a qemu command to convert it 
[02:29] <CShadowRun> if someone could talk me through that it'd be nice
[02:29] <CShadowRun> i'm really into the idea of ubuntu mobile :D
[02:29] <CShadowRun> specially the python part, hehe
[02:30] <CShadowRun> as i say, i tried to apt-get install KVM before, and my entire system froze while "setting up kvm", and then my package manager was completely broken, because every time i did the dpkg command to repair, it tried to install kvm again :x
[02:30] <CShadowRun> after doing dpkg like 5 times it did finally go through, then i had to try another 2 times to remove the blasted thing because it broke virtualbox, lol
[02:30] <ogra> qemu-img convert <your qemu image>.img <raw image of your quemu image>.bin 
[02:31] <CShadowRun> cool
[02:31] <CShadowRun> then what would i do with the output file?
[02:31] <ogra> vditool DD <final vbox image>.vdi <raw image of your quemu image>.bin 
[02:31] <CShadowRun> ok :)
[02:31] <ogra> vditool is shipped with vbox
[02:32] <ogra> its a two step thing and the resulting image is a good bunch bigger than the qemu one
[02:32] <ogra> due to the step through the raw image
[02:33] <CShadowRun> hehe providing it's not more than like 800GB...
[02:33] <CShadowRun> lol
[02:33] <ogra> heh, no
[02:33] <ogra> but my vbox image is 5G vs the 2G qemu uses
[02:33] <CShadowRun> while file do i want? mid-8.04.1-kvm.tar.gz ?
[02:34] <ogra> hmm, no idea, i built my on image with the builder back then ... it was before release ... 
[02:34] <CShadowRun> lol
[02:34] <ogra> but i suspect the kvm one is right
[02:34] <CShadowRun> kk :)
[02:34] <CShadowRun> the only other options are a few mccaslin and a few menlow ones.
[02:35]  * ogra slaps forehead 
[02:35] <StevenK> CShadowRun: They are install images.
[02:35] <CShadowRun> ok :)
[02:35] <ogra> i just see vditool has a SHRINK command
[02:35] <CShadowRun> so i want the kvm one then
[02:35] <CShadowRun> ogra haha
[02:35] <CShadowRun> downloading that now, it'll be done in 15 minutes :p
[02:35] <ogra> well, diskspace is cheap :P
[02:36] <persia> Well, not too cheap: there seems to still be demand for 2G devices.
[02:36] <ogra> heh
[02:36] <ogra> sadly 
[02:36] <ogra> life would be easier without them ... 
[02:36] <persia> Indeed, given that 4G solid state is available in 130g devices these days...
[02:36] <ogra> at least my life :P
[02:37] <CShadowRun> hehe, personally i probably would buy a 2G
[02:37] <CShadowRun> and use a flash drive to install things on
[02:37] <CShadowRun> because SSD is so much more expensive than flash
[02:37] <CShadowRun> plus with flash you can carry a bunch with you :D
[02:37] <persia> SSD usually is flash.
[02:37] <CShadowRun> yea but they charge so much more for it compared to a USB flash stick
[02:37] <CShadowRun> (because it's new, and cool.)
[02:38] <persia> That will go away soon.  It's also just sizing.
[02:38] <CShadowRun> aye :)
[02:38] <ogra> yeah
[02:39] <persia> Anyway, the issue is more with the base install.  4G gives enough space to not *require* extra flash devices for basic use.  With 2G one needs to mangle the install images to try to get enough local space.
[02:39] <ogra> yeah :(
[02:39]  * persia has never had a 2G device, so maybe isn't very sympathetic
[02:39] <ogra> its a pain
[02:40] <ogra> but i have still some ideas to save more space i didnt work on yet :)
[02:40] <CShadowRun> lol the Q1U looks nice
[02:40] <CShadowRun> i found a B-Grade one for $686
[02:40] <persia> CShadowRun: It has the least useful keyboard I've ever seen on a device.  It's also larger than you would expect.  Other than that, it's pretty good.
[02:41] <ogra> i must admt i can imagine to get used to it if i wuldnt have a coice
[02:41] <ogra> *admit
[02:42] <StevenK> But why would you want to? It would turn your hands into claws not even suitable for console gaming after prolonged use
[02:42] <CShadowRun> lol i do admit it looks a bit ugly
[02:42] <ogra> its all about finger memory and getting your thumbs right
[02:43] <persia> The new Kohjinsha Atom boxes are awfully nice.  Smaller than the samsung, but in a convertible tablet form-factor (and still with ~7" 1024x600)
[02:43] <StevenK> ogra: And not hitting four keys with your Western-size thumb?
[02:43] <persia> ogra: You mean putting your thumbs in a pencil sharpener?
[02:43] <ogra> i mean i cant imagine messaging 200 words in 10 min with my mobile with one finger, but i know people who can
[02:43] <persia> StevenK: It's not just Western thumbs: I say that even thumbs on this side of the world rarely fit.
[02:43] <ogra> persia, something like that :)
[02:44] <CShadowRun> anything else thats "officially" (Or going to be officially) supported by ubuntu mobile?
[02:44] <CShadowRun> apart from the Q1
[02:44] <persia> ogra: I've seen people typing faster than that on mobiles, but the keys are bigger.
[02:44] <CShadowRun> i'm quite a fan of the XDA execs look, something like that would be awsome :p
[02:44] <ogra> right, they are 
[02:45] <persia> CShadowRun: Anything with a Intel A110, A100, or Atom processor ought work.  With luck, things should work with VIA C7-M or AMD Geode.
[02:45] <CShadowRun> i see
[02:45] <CShadowRun> lol cool so it's happy in an EEEPC
[02:45] <CShadowRun> EEE is so tempting.
[02:46] <persia> Well, it's not happy yet.  It should work, but nobody has yet reported that it does.  On the other hand, nobody has explained why it doesn'T.
[02:46] <persia> Perhaps it will do better on the Atom EeePCs
[02:46] <CShadowRun> yea thats what i meant
[02:47] <ogra> which are out since a week or so
[02:47] <persia> Sure, but we've not a test report yet :)
[02:47] <ogra> two guys in #ltsp got theirs on monday
[02:48] <CShadowRun> huh? i found them available on google shopping already
[02:48] <ogra> the 901 atom ? 
[02:48] <CShadowRun> yes
[02:48] <ogra> they didnt ship until very recently
[02:48] <CShadowRun> well they appear to be up, theres a bunch of them up :)
[02:48] <CShadowRun> and acer seem to make some too
[02:48] <persia> Yep.  Now that they've shipped, they are shipping in volume.
[02:48] <ogra> you could order them since a month or so at amazon though
[02:49] <ogra> there re more to come
[02:49] <ogra> honestly i would wait a bit for more beautiful and cheaper devices
[02:49] <persia> That's the unfortunate thing about devices: it's always better to wait another few months (although it is nice to have something to use)
[02:49]  * ogra is not an eee fan .... chepa keyboard and ugly case
[02:49] <ogra> *cheap
[02:50] <persia> Also in the unfortunate form factor: too big for the pocket, too small for serious use.
[02:50] <CShadowRun> the sharp D4 looks nice
[02:50] <ogra> if they at least were slim
[02:50] <CShadowRun> thats the sorta thing i'd love to get my hands on :p
[02:50] <CShadowRun> yea maybe
[02:50] <persia> CShadowRun: That is a lovely device.  The keyboard feels nice.  Fits in the pocket.
[02:50] <CShadowRun> sweet
[02:51] <CShadowRun> thats the sorta thing i'd love to get my hands on
[02:51] <persia> CShadowRun: Where are you?  It is likely one can be shipped.
[02:51] <CShadowRun> UK
[02:52] <ogra> heh, and runs vista by default
[02:52] <CShadowRun> well yea, but that can be changed :D
[02:52] <CShadowRun> there we go, download finished, i have a kvm file and a qcow2 file
[02:53] <persia> Hmm.  Neither trisoft nor dynamism is shipping the D4 yet.  I don't know anyone else who ships to the UK.
[02:53] <CShadowRun> aww.
[02:54] <persia> Dynamism does have the kohjinsha SC though (although it's still a little big)
[02:55]  * ogra twiddles thumbs ... 5 min to go fo rmy upload
[02:55] <CShadowRun> yea thats quite nice :)
[02:56] <CShadowRun> hmm, thats odd
[02:56] <CShadowRun> i have virtualbox installed, but i don't appear to have vditool
[02:56] <CShadowRun> ubuntu tells me to install the open source edition :p
[02:57] <ogra> i have it in /usr/bin/vditool
[02:57] <ogra> with the packages from the archive 
[02:57] <persia> ogra: Which package provides /usr/bin/vditool for you?
[02:57] <CShadowRun> nope, not there for me :(
[02:57] <ogra> ogra@osiris:~$ dpkg -S /usr/bin/vditool
[02:57] <ogra> virtualbox-ose: /usr/bin/vditool
[02:58] <CShadowRun> not even on my computer, did a search lol
[02:58] <CShadowRun> i did a dpkg -L on my virtualbox, and it's not been installed.
[02:58] <CShadowRun> must only be included in the OSE version :S
[02:58] <ogra> but you use the nonfree version
[02:58] <ogra> i never tried that 
[03:00] <CShadowRun> ah
[03:00] <CShadowRun> and these files that ubuntu came in arn't img files
[03:00] <CShadowRun> one is a kvm one is a qcow2
[03:01] <persia> qcow2 is the image file, and ought be able to be converted.
[03:02] <CShadowRun> with qemu-img convert root.qcow2 raw.img
[03:02] <CShadowRun> right?
[03:02] <persia> I think so, but I've not done that, so I'm guessing.
[03:03] <CShadowRun> now the only problem is vditool then :)
[03:03] <persia> For that you probably need virtualbox-ose
[03:03] <CShadowRun> i managed to find a copy of it on the web but it says i don't have libuuid.so.1
[03:03]  * CShadowRun tries installing the dev package
[03:05] <CShadowRun> i do have it though :/
[03:06] <CShadowRun> it's a symlink in /lib that points to libuuid.so.1.2
[03:06]  * ogra updates http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/classmate/images/hardy/ and prepares to finally get some sleep
[03:07] <ogra> phew ... that was a long day today
[03:07] <CShadowRun> hehe
[03:12]  * ogra waves .... 
[03:12] <ogra> night all
[03:13] <CShadowRun> night :(
[18:40] <cshadowrun> I installed the ubuntu mobile package on my laptop
[18:40] <cshadowrun> but all it seems to do is like install a few new applications :(
[19:04] <ogra> cshadowrun, what did you expect to happen ? 
[19:05] <ogra> th eubuntu-mobile package is a metapackage used to pull in the default set of applicaions into a mobile imae build
[19:05] <ogra> *image 
[19:05] <ogra> (like all metapackages in ubuntu)
[19:07] <cshadowrun> uh
[19:07] <cshadowrun> i expected it to be like a diffrent desktop session or something
[19:07] <cshadowrun> so i could try it out just like it was a phone
[19:07] <cshadowrun> :(
[19:07] <cshadowrun> thats what i wanna do
[19:10] <ogra> then you would need ot install the whole image 
[19:10] <cshadowrun> how do i do that?
[19:10] <ogra> but that wuld wipe your disk, the installer in hardy isnt very intelligent about such stuff
[19:10] <cshadowrun> thats fine
[19:10] <cshadowrun> i wanna test it on my laptop which has no data on it anyway
[19:11] <ogra> you can try the mccaslin image from the link in the channel topic
[19:11] <cshadowrun> is it an iso?
[19:11] <ogra> dd that to a usb key, boo from it and let the installer do its work 
[19:11] <cshadowrun> oh
[19:11] <ogra> nope, n .img file
[19:11] <cshadowrun> how big usb key do i need?
[19:12] <ogra> 1Gn shoudl suffice
[19:12] <cshadowrun> i only have 512 :(
[19:14] <cshadowrun> wonder if i could run ubuntu off this image file
[19:14] <cshadowrun> s/ubuntu/virtualbox
[19:17] <ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/mobile/releases/hardy/ says the mid-8.04.1-mccaslin-install-usb.img  is only 501
[19:17] <ogra> so 512M might work
[19:17] <cshadowrun> maybe
[19:20] <cshadowrun> ubuntu says the total capacity is 495.2MB
[19:20] <cshadowrun> :<
[19:20] <ogra> formatted as ext2/3 ? 
[19:21] <cshadowrun> nah, msdos
[19:21] <ogra> note that this usually reserves 5% for root
[19:21] <ogra> ah, k
[19:21] <cshadowrun> maybe i can get this img file to load in virtualbox
[19:22] <ogra> you need to grab the kvm image for that and convert it to a vbox image
[19:22] <cshadowrun> oh cool i already got that :p
[19:23] <cshadowrun> only problem is vditool doesn't work on 64bit
[19:23] <cshadowrun> but i guess i can use my laptop to convert it
[19:23] <ogra> right
[19:23] <ogra> or build a 32bit chroot 
[19:23] <cshadowrun> ?
[19:24] <ogra> debootstrap --arch i386 hardy ./chroot
[19:24] <ogra> that would build a chroot for 32bit in ./chroot 
[19:25] <cshadowrun> that sounds complicated, i'll just use my laptop :p
[19:25] <ogra> with: sudo chroot ./chroot you can enter that and execute 32bit apps inside
[19:25] <cshadowrun> havn't been using linux for all that long.
[19:25] <cshadowrun> nah it has like library issues
[19:25] <cshadowrun> it says i have missing librarys (But i dont)
[19:25] <Maverick2k> computer says no ;)
[19:26] <cshadowrun> exactly :)
[19:26] <ogra> computer is silly !
[19:26] <ogra> :)
[19:27] <Maverick2k> but chroot is not that hard, you will create a user space for 32 bits
[19:27] <ogra> right
[19:28] <Maverick2k> and within that console you could do anything for your image
[19:28] <ogra> just takes a bit of time and diskspace but is handy for caese like the above
[19:28] <cshadowrun> so what do i have to do with the ubuntu.kvm and root.qcow2 to run them in vbox?
[19:28] <ogra> *cases
[19:28] <ogra> you need to convert the .kvm image to a raw one with qemu 
[19:29] <ogra> then convert the raw image to a vbox one 
[19:29] <cshadowrun> qemu-img convert ubuntu.kvm raw.img right?
[19:29] <cshadowrun> or qemu-img convert root.qcow2 raw.img
[19:29] <cshadowrun> because theres 2 files in the kvm package o.o
[19:31] <ogra> i think its the qcow, not sure though
[19:32] <cshadowrun> kk doing that
[19:32] <cshadowrun> what next?
[19:32] <ogra> use vditool to make a vbox image from that
[19:32] <cshadowrun> yea, now i meet with the vditool problem again :(
[19:33] <cshadowrun> it's not included in the binary virtualbox, and if i download it from someplace it says i have a missing libuuid
[19:33] <cshadowrun> which i don't, it's in /lib :x
[19:34] <cshadowrun> ./vditool: error while loading shared libraries: libuuid.so.1: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory.
[19:37] <ogra> its in the vitrualbox-ose package in the ubuntu archive
[19:38] <ogra> sorry i never tried any other vbox verson
[19:38] <cshadowrun> i have the binary version already installed
[19:38] <cshadowrun> i needed usb support
[19:38] <ogra> *version
[19:40] <cshadowrun> the version of vditool on the website must be broken
[19:40] <cshadowrun> theres no other way about it, my laptop has exactly the same files as my pc does, and it doesn't work on my pc.
[19:50]  * cshadowrun sighs and splits raw.img into a bunch of parts so i can transfer with usb drive
[19:53] <cshadowrun> urgh this job is gonna make me want to stab my eyes out with a fork.
[19:53] <cshadowrun> 14 parts.
[22:20] <cshadowrun> hey, anyone know how ubuntu mobile is on a Nokia N810 ?
[22:20] <cshadowrun> is everything supported? (GPS, Wifi, Bluetooth)
[22:23] <ogra> N810 has an ARM CPU
[22:23] <ogra> arm is not yet supported by ubuntu
[22:23] <ogra> (work i on the way though)
[22:23] <ogra> *is
[22:24] <cshadowrun> aww.
[22:30] <cshadowrun> i wish there was a list of them lol
[22:30] <ogra> list ? 
[22:31] <cshadowrun> like a list of ubuntu mobile compatible devices
[22:31] <ogra> h, yeah
[22:31] <ogra> we should assembel something like that, but that needs more community involvement
[22:32] <cshadowrun> yea
[22:32] <ogra> i.e. people that are brave enough to trash their existing installs on their mobile devices and report back if it worked :)
[22:32] <GrueMaster> currently, essentially anything with an x86 core can be supported.  Images are specific to Intel chipsets at the moment.
[22:32] <ogra> right
[22:32] <ogra> but we dont now which devices specifically
[22:32] <cshadowrun> exactly :)
[22:32] <ogra> beyond the handfull we develop on
[22:33] <cshadowrun> it'd be nice to have a page with pictures and specs.
[22:33] <ogra> feel free to trigger something by making a call for testers on the mailing list ;)
[22:34] <GrueMaster> Don't need to know.  All you need to know is that Menlow images work with the Intel SCH500 chipset, and the Mccaslin images work with the 9xx series chipsets.
[22:34] <ogra> and setting up a wikipage
[22:34] <GrueMaster> specific hardware support can be tweaked in from there.
[22:34] <ogra> right but isnt there out of the box
[22:35] <ogra> people with not much tech knowledge will want to know if it just works for them
[22:35] <cshadowrun> exactly my thoughts :D
[22:35] <ogra> so an overview page would indeed make sense
[22:35] <ogra> and having some brave people helping testing and developing the device specific patches would help even more
[22:36] <GrueMaster> UME in it's current form is difficult to make out of the box support for a lot of systems.  It's too bad there isn't a better installation method.
[22:37] <ogra> that will get better with intrepid
[22:37] <ogra> and even if the ubiquity approach wouldnt work i have an installer thats working well and can easily be adjusted which i wrote for the classmate image i maintain since a year
[22:38] <ogra> so *something* will be there in intrepid
[22:39] <GrueMaster> cool
[22:39] <ogra> (preferably ubiquity indeed, since its slick)
[22:39] <cshadowrun> :)
[22:41] <cshadowrun> does anyone here actually own a ubuntu MID? :)
[22:44] <GrueMaster> I don't personally own one, but I work on them.
[22:44] <cshadowrun> got any names of some devices that work nice currently so i can look them up? :)
[22:45] <ogra> well, most deveopment is done on the samung Q1 ultra atm
[22:46] <cshadowrun> aww, they arn't that nice though
[22:46] <cshadowrun> and they are pretty expensive
[22:47] <ogra> get 100000 people to buy one and they get cheaper :P
[22:47] <cshadowrun> lmao
[22:47] <ogra> thats the rules of the market :)
[22:48] <GrueMaster> YOu could also use the Asus Eee PC.  It's almost the same hardware (sans touch screen).
[22:48] <cshadowrun> oh well it does have a touch screen so thats a bonus.
[22:49] <cshadowrun> yea, i want a handheld though
[22:49] <cshadowrun> already got a pair of laptops :p
[22:49] <ogra> btw did you get your vbox setup running ? 
[22:49] <GrueMaster> Actually, it's about the same size, just in a clamshell with a fuller keyboard.
[22:49] <cshadowrun> ogra still transfering the file from my laptop, LAN is really slow :(
[22:49] <cshadowrun> 1:22 ETA :<
[22:49] <ogra> phew
[22:50] <cshadowrun> yea but i'm after something i can "Walk down the street™" with
[22:51] <ogra> yeah, desktop PCs are not really handy for that especially the generator you need to pull behind you
[22:51] <cshadowrun> yea, same with laptops
[22:51] <cshadowrun> unless you wanna kinda balence the laptop on one hand and type with the other :x
[22:51] <cshadowrun> or strap it to your arm.
[22:51] <cshadowrun> lol
[22:55] <cshadowrun> funny question, does the Q1U hard proper graphics drivers?
[22:55] <cshadowrun> (So like, could you run compiz? xD)
[22:56] <ogra> technically yes
[22:56] <cshadowrun> compiz would be awsome on a device like that lol, i could be such a show off.
[22:56] <cshadowrun> haha nice
[22:56]  * ogra didnt try it though
[22:56] <cshadowrun> you have a Q1U?
[22:56] <ogra> i have one here but dont own it
[22:57] <cshadowrun> ah
[22:57] <cshadowrun> lol why does everyone have one but not own it?
[22:57] <cshadowrun> is canocial giving them out to devs or something?
[22:57] <ogra> to employees at least
[22:58] <cshadowrun> nice
[22:58] <ogra> else it would be hard to develop MID ... 
[22:58] <ogra> you need some HW ot work on 
[22:58] <ogra> *to
[22:58] <cshadowrun> true
[22:58] <cshadowrun> Q1U is a bit big though :(
[22:58] <ogra> yeh
[22:59] <cshadowrun> i wonder if an OQO would work
[22:59] <ogra> i like it though, but the keyboard is misdesigned
[22:59] <cshadowrun> OQO is pocket sized :p
[22:59] <cshadowrun> yea the keyboard looks wrong.
[22:59] <cshadowrun> the OQO is an amazing device though, you seen the OQO's?
[23:00] <ogra> a while ago, yes
[23:00] <cshadowrun> yea they are old but i havn't found anything as nice as an OQO yet
[23:02] <cshadowrun> think ubuntu MID would work on an OQO?
[23:02] <cshadowrun> come to think of it, think ubuntu full would work on an OQO? lol
[23:03] <ogra> normal ubuntu likely would... its a plain c7
[23:04] <cshadowrun> funky
[23:07] <cshadowrun> OQO doesn't have a touch screen though, which makes me sad :(