[21:33] <zerwas> Hi
[21:36] <zerwas> In a few days the first deadline is there. Can somebody explain to me what this means?
[22:41] <askand> Is it only me or is half the mailinglist complains about topposting? =-O
[23:05] <nand_> it's a rite amongst Ubuntu artworkers :)
[23:05] <pwnguin> it needs to be solved once and for all
[23:06] <pwnguin> claiming there's an established ettiquette is simply a lie
[23:06] <Flannel> topposting is evil
[23:06] <pwnguin> psh
[23:07] <pwnguin> write google and tell them how they're being evil then
[23:07] <Flannel> its a crime against your fellow man, and because such, is against the code of conduct :)
[23:07] <pwnguin> if open source is worth a damn, this angst should produce some sort of technical solution
[23:07] <pwnguin> given that we know they exist
[23:07] <nand_> one of the - involuntary - culprit is Gmail : it is hiding the quoted text so that topposting or not, it looks the same. So Gmail users don't understand what is the problem
[23:08] <Flannel> pwnguin: Theres a good number of clients (all in Ubuntu?) that default to starting replies below quoted
[23:09] <pwnguin> Flannel: ok, so how about some decent threading and collapsing
[23:09] <pwnguin> did google patent it?
[23:09] <Flannel> Eh?  I have no idea what you're talking about
[23:10] <pwnguin> have you not seen gmail threading in action?
[23:10] <Flannel> Nope.  I prefer to own my data.
[23:10] <pwnguin> i dont see how that means you never look at what others are doing
[23:10] <pwnguin> anyways
[23:10] <Flannel> Having never used gmail, I obviously am unaware of its UI
[23:11] <Flannel> Sorry for not watching your type emails over your shoulder.
[23:11] <pwnguin> like there aren't videos etc
[23:11] <pwnguin> anyways
[23:11] <pwnguin> what it does is collapse quoted text into a small purple "click to expand quote"
[23:12] <pwnguin> and automatically threads mail
[23:12] <Flannel> threading is ... all over the place
[23:13] <pwnguin> in my experience it works almost perfectly
[23:13] <Flannel> pwnguin: and, a cursory search reveals that thunderbird has a quote collapse extension thing too.
[23:13] <pwnguin> great
[23:13] <pwnguin> i should try it sometime
[23:14] <pwnguin> the point is, lots of the world has never heard of "top posting"
[23:14] <pwnguin> technology can make that an artifact of time
[23:15] <pwnguin> and the sooner that happens, the sooner people won't feel antagonized in ubuntu-artwork
[23:15] <Flannel> pwnguin: Yes, but people in FOSS do, and older people (from the beginnings of the internet) do too.  There's just a gap for the rest, which are also the people who click on email links to download screensavers and icon packs.  I'm, not really sure where you're going.
[23:16] <Flannel> pwnguin: The first thing one should do when joining a community officially or unofficially, is observe their social norms.
[23:16] <Flannel> This goes for any community, whether online, or a new job, or whatever.
[23:16] <pwnguin> having observed the social norms of -artwork, they seem unhealthy :P
[23:17] <Flannel> pwnguin: I'm actually not subscribed to the mailing list, so I wouldn't be the one to comment on that.
[23:18] <pwnguin> then you'll have no choice to believe me when I say that every month a collossal top posting thread is initiated by one or two agitators
[23:18] <pwnguin> ive tried to remedy the poison
[23:19] <pwnguin> it seems to have worked a bit, but it's a social solution to a technical problem