[00:00] <IdleOne> Nafallo, I am running alpha4 8.10
[00:00] <IdleOne> if you don't know the answer don't be a tool about it
[00:02] <Nafallo> I don't actually...
[00:02] <Nafallo> should be either preferred applications or some of the links in /etc/alternatives I'd imagine.
[00:02] <bdrung> i am running intrepid too, but in a virtual machine ;)
[00:03] <IdleOne> just seems strange that firefox is the official browser used by ubuntu but epiphany loads up when clicking on a link
[00:03] <Nafallo> not really
[00:04] <bdrung> IdleOne: did you look into gnome-default-applications-properties?
[00:04] <Nafallo> if it's alternatives it's likely to be the last browser installed that sets it.
[00:12] <asac> hmm ... thats the second time that someone reported that epiphany took over ;)
[00:50] <[reed]> asac: it's chpe's evil plot
[01:00] <asac> absolutely ;)
[12:49]  * asac yawnsd
[15:41] <daggett> hello
[15:41] <daggett> anyone can tell me how to use the thunderbird tool to suppress spam from folder ?
[15:42] <daggett> mine is inactive
[15:42] <daggett> and I can't use it, but sometimes I can use it and dont know why
[15:44] <asac> daggett: ?
[15:44] <asac> you need to enable spam filtering
[15:44] <asac> there is an option in the menu somewhere
[15:45] <asac> daggett: in account settings -> junk settings
[15:46] <asac> there you can configure adaptive junk mail
[15:46] <asac> remember that youz need to train tbird first
[15:46]  * asac break
[15:48] <daggett> asac: thanks but it's already active, in fact this option used to be available, but since some update it's greyed most of the time and sometimes it's available
[15:49] <daggett> I don't understand this behaviour
[15:49] <daggett> it should not be greyed at all any time
[15:54] <daggett> asac: ok I suppressed the .thunderbird folder in my home and all went back to normal
[15:55] <asac> daggett: suppressed? what does that mean?
[15:55]  * asac afk
[15:56] <daggett> rm -rf /home/daggett/.thunderbird
[15:56] <daggett> asac: that's what I did
[15:56] <daggett> I made a copy of that folder just in case
[15:56] <asac> thats not suppress, but remove ;)
[15:56] <asac> daggett: if .thunderbird matters, then you are not using ubuntu builds
[15:57] <daggett> well... yes
[15:57] <asac> better ask in mozilla support channels
[15:57]  * asac afk for real
[15:57] <daggett> ok thanks
[15:57] <daggett> are there any mozilla IRC channel ?
[15:58] <asac> on irc.mozilla.org #thunderbirfd
[15:58] <asac> on irc.mozilla.org #thunderbird
[16:00] <daggett> ok thanks
[17:32] <fta> hi
[17:34] <asac> hi
[17:39] <fta> what's up ?
[17:40] <fta> asac, i see you have activated the plugin pref, does that mean the ui is ready?
[17:40] <asac> no. but the pref works ;)
[17:40] <asac> the ui is also just a matter of doing. all issues are sorted
[17:40] <asac> well ... not all, but all blockers imo
[17:42] <asac> i hope to get all new features in by feature-freeze + 1w
[17:43] <asac> unfortunately, as it looks now, kde-integration will not make it
[17:43] <asac> its better done in 3.1 anyway
[17:44] <fta> i wanted to do a 3.1+qt but i'm not sure how
[17:44] <asac> fta: does it work?
[17:44] <asac> i mean in general?
[17:44] <fta> supposed to
[17:44] <fta> i has been merged in trunk
[17:44] <fta> it
[17:45] <asac> is that in libxuL?
[17:45] <asac> or did they move that to a separate component?
[17:46] <asac> oh i completely forgot about one important feature ;)
[17:46] <asac> the unbranded browser thing :)
[17:46] <fta> http://browser.garage.maemo.org/news/10/ff3qt.png
[17:47] <asac> nice
[17:48] <fta> it's activated using --enable-default-toolkit=cairo-qt instead of our cairo-gtk2
[17:48] <asac> yeah. most likely it really is libxul where this ends up in
[17:48] <fta> yes
[17:49] <asac> fta: do they have their own theme?
[17:49] <asac> e.g. kdestripe?
[17:50] <asac> or are they using the old winstripe theme thing?
[17:52] <fta> seems it uses gnomestripe
[17:53] <asac> good
[17:53] <fta> http://hg.mozilla.org/index.cgi/mozilla-central/rev/4a506fa751d8f89f0abc93662cb5ad805b9f24c5
[17:53] <asac> so most likely still depends on gtk?+
[17:53] <asac> e.g. ldd on libxul.so ?
[17:56] <fta> i wanted to do it like totem. ie, totem is a metapackage for totem-gstreamer (default) and totem-xine
[17:57] <fta> not sure about -dev
[17:57] <fta> will it work for both ?
[17:57] <asac> let me get the tree
[17:59] <fta> hmm, http://jtechinda.blogspot.com/2008/08/firefox-qt-packages-hit-kubuntu.html
[18:00] <fta> should we let that diverge ?
[18:01] <asac> no
[18:01] <asac> that guy needs to be get in here ;)
[18:01] <fta> it's apachelogger
[18:01] <fta> hm, it's a plain ff build, not ff+xul
[18:02] <asac> fta: yeah ... i just summoned him in -deve
[18:02] <asac> l
[18:11] <asac> i wonder if there is a tool to split .so files post-linkage
[18:14] <fta> sounds crazy
[18:14] <asac> yeah probably is
[18:14] <fta> http://www.ubuntugeek.com/how-to-install-flock-web-browser-in-ubuntu-hardy.html
[18:17] <asac> fta: is your package working?
[18:18] <fta> no, it's 1.2, i did 2.0
[18:18] <asac> kk
[18:19] <fta> 1.2 is based on ff2
[18:20] <asac> xulrunner doesnt support qt yes. just firefox
[18:20] <asac> at least the build probably fails
[18:20] <fta> hm ?
[18:20] <asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/40209/
[18:20] <asac> no qt toolkit in there
[18:21] <asac> so the XLIBS will miss during linkage i guess
[18:21] <asac> ifneq (,$(filter gtk gtk2 xlib,$(MOZ_WIDGET_TOOLKIT)))
[18:21] <asac> -> ifneq (,$(filter qt gtk gtk2 xlib,$(MOZ_WIDGET_TOOLKIT)))
[18:21] <asac> (most likely)
[18:21] <fta> it was expected, as usual
[18:21] <asac> well. maybe it works. but looking at make files it looks like that block is for "linux/unix" in general and not for just gtk
[18:22] <asac> anyway. what i think is that we can build everything as normal and then try to redo libxul.so by rebuilding those subtrees with tweaked variables
[18:23] <asac> and toolkit/library of course
[18:23] <asac> at least worth a try
[18:23] <asac> then we can divert libxul.so by the -qt package
[18:24] <asac> hmm toolkit/remote needs to be rebuild as well as it seems
[18:24] <asac> why do we need toolkit specific remote things?
[18:24] <asac> its just X iirc
[18:25] <asac> hmm widget/qt/ as well ... too bad
[18:25] <asac> well ... the module appears to have its own namespace
[18:25] <asac> so we can just built it and link it into the qt thing
[18:25] <asac> (should work quite out of the box)
[18:26] <fta> http://mozillalinks.org/wp/2008/08/serious-javascript-performance-boost-for-firefox-31/
[18:32] <fta> http://weblogs.mozillazine.org/roadmap/archives/2008/08/tracemonkey_javascript_lightsp.html
[18:38] <asac> i finally have to figure if i can do the anti-flash detection kit thing
[18:42] <asac> hehe
[18:42] <asac> i should really setup my development environment again. building packages to test a single line is just bad
[18:43] <asac> fta: is there a mozilla-central branch for 1.9.0 branch`
[18:43] <asac> ?
[18:43] <fta> i don't think so
[18:43] <fta> it's still in cvs
[18:43] <asac> apparently not
[18:44] <fta> hm, i still see that bzr upgrade warning
[18:44] <asac> fta: yeah. that wont go away until we upgrade i guess
[18:44] <asac> fta: you have a fast line?
[18:44] <fta> yes
[18:45] <asac> hmm. i think i should do it from within the canonical net
[18:45] <asac> fta: can you create backups from the branches that we want to upgrade?
[18:46] <asac> ill do backups too .. in case something goes wrong
[18:46] <fta> you mean, on lp ?
[18:46] <asac> and then run bzr upgrade
[18:46] <fta> or locally ?
[18:46] <asac> no .. i mean: bzr branch the latest to your disc
[18:46] <asac> locally i think#
[18:46] <asac> fta: well. you can also push them to ~fta
[18:46] <asac> ;)
[18:46] <asac> let me create a ssh key on an internal  machine
[18:49] <asac> fta: ok. lets try with https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/songbird/songbird.head
[18:49] <fta> good, they didn't reject my bug 260627
[18:50] <asac> that one is old and small ;)
[18:50] <asac> i took a backup on the canonical machine
[18:50] <asac> let me know when you did your backup ;)
[18:50] <asac> then ill run bzr upgrade lp~mozillateam/songbird/songbird.head
[18:50] <asac> and see how far we get
[18:51] <fta> done
[18:51] <asac> fta: bzr upgrade --pack-0.92 is new enough?
[18:51] <asac> i think thats what --default is
[18:51]  * asac running  bzr upgrade --default lp:~mozillateam/songbird/songbird.head
[18:52] <fta> default is good
[18:52] <asac> http://paste.ubuntu.com/40218/
[18:52] <asac> fta: so if you branch it to a new place it should be upgraded
[18:54] <asac> fta: ok worked. a fresh branch is pack-0.92 now
[18:54] <asac> fta: what branch next? xulrunner-1.9.1? or another low-risk branch?
[18:55] <fta> hold on, i have a xul1.9.1/ff3.1 update in progress
[18:55] <asac> sure
[18:56] <fta> it still says dirstate-tags
[18:56] <fta> or should i wait more ?
[18:57] <asac> fta: what still says that?
[18:57] <asac> fta: you sure you got it through ssh?
[18:58] <fta> bzr info
[18:59] <fta> hhm
[18:59] <fta> ix:~/tmp$ bzr branch lp:~mozillateam/songbird/songbird.head songbird.head.new
[18:59] <fta> Server is too old for streaming pull, reconnecting.  (Upgrade the server to Bazaar 1.2 to avoid this)
[18:59] <fta> Branched 23 revision(s).
[19:00] <fta> ok, format: pack-0.92
[19:00] <asac> fta: http://paste.ubuntu.com/40220/
[19:00] <asac> yeah
[19:00] <asac> yeah strange that message ;)
[19:00] <asac> but i think we cannot fix it serverside
[19:00] <asac> ok ... one more branch?
[19:00] <asac> or maybe a list of branches?
[19:01] <fta> i still need to upgrade locally
[19:01] <asac> lp:~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-3.0.hardy
[19:01] <asac> lp:~mozillateam/firefox/ubuntu-2.0.0.x.gutsy
[19:01] <fta> yep
[19:02] <asac> lp:~mozillateam/firefox/ubuntu-2.0.0.x.hardy
[19:02] <asac> lp:~asac/firefox/ubuntu-2.0.0.x
[19:02] <asac> hmm ... that one should probably go to mozillateam or die
[19:02] <asac> anyway
[19:02] <asac> lp:~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-3.0.dev
[19:02] <asac> ok ... lets try those for now
[19:02] <asac> tell me when you havbe them backed up safely
[19:05] <fta> huge tarballs..
[19:05] <asac> wow
[19:05] <asac> firefox-3.0.hardy
[19:05] <asac> ages ;)
[19:06] <asac> yeah ... even on canonical machine its still running ;)
[19:07] <asac> i think i should better run the upgrade in a screen
[19:07] <asac> i am sure i'd get a disconnect in such a long running operation
[19:08] <asac> fta: you know if i can remove a passphrase from ssh key post-creation?
[19:09] <asac> ah ... with -p
[19:09] <asac> ok ill try that
[19:10] <fta> yep
[19:10] <asac> ok ... is your backup gone?
[19:10] <asac> err done ;)
[19:10] <asac> for the four branches above ?
[19:11] <fta> 3/4
[19:11]  * asac starts the screen, waiting for green light
[19:12] <fta> done
[19:12]  * asac runs: for i in  "lp:~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-3.0.hardy" "lp:~mozillateam/firefox/ubuntu-2.0.0.x.gutsy" "lp:~mozillateam/firefox/ubuntu-2.0.0.x.hardy" "lp:~asac/firefox/ubuntu-2.0.0.x"; do  echo bzr upgrade --default $i; bzr upgrade --default $i; done
[19:12] <asac> hmm ... maybe set -e would have been smart
[19:12] <asac> anyway ;)
[19:12] <asac> lets hope
[19:13] <asac> *drumrolls*
[19:14]  * asac gets more frightens as he sees a progress bar appearing
[19:14] <asac> "Copying contents into repository"
[19:15] <asac>  lp:~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-3.0.hardy -> done :-D
[19:15] <asac> \o/
[19:16] <asac> fta: wanna verify that its not broken?
[19:16] <asac> maybe try if a pull will upgrade your "original copy"?
[19:16] <asac> or if we need to branch from scratch now to get pack-0.92 locally too
[19:16] <asac> hmm. you probablydont have a normal .hardy copy
[19:16] <asac> anyway
[19:17] <asac> lp:~mozillateam/firefox/ubuntu-2.0.0.x.gutsy -> done 1
[19:17] <asac> 2 ;)
[19:20] <asac> ok ... next on list are:
[19:21] <asac> "lp:~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-3.0.gutsy-backports" "lp:~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-3.1.head" "lp:~mozillateam/firefox-extensions/XPI.TEMPLATE" "lp:~mozillateam/firefox-extensions/XPI.TEMPLATE" "lp:~mozillateam/firefox-extensions/BOT.TASKS" "lp:~mozillateam/flock/flock.head"
[19:21] <fta> as i said above, a pull does not upgrade the local branch
[19:21] <asac> yeah. that makes sense as a push doesnt do that either
[19:22]  * asac getting backups of those
[19:23] <asac> fta: let me know when you have them as well
[19:23] <asac> for i in  "lp:~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-3.0.gutsy-backports" "lp:~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-3.1.head" "lp:~mozillateam/firefox-extensions/XPI.TEMPLATE" "lp:~mozillateam/firefox-extensions/XPI.TEMPLATE" "lp:~mozillateam/firefox-extensions/BOT.TASKS" "lp:~mozillateam/flock/flock.head"; do  echo bzr branch $i; bzr branch $i; done
[19:26] <asac> i thik i forgot BOT in that list. but that branch is probably new pack anyway
[19:27] <asac> ok let me know. i am waiting for your command
[19:28] <fta> done
[19:28] <asac> ok running upgrade
[19:32] <fta> lunch time
[19:33] <asac> fta: lunch? are you in US?
[19:33] <fta> i mean, diner
[19:33] <asac> hehe
[19:33] <asac> enjoy
[19:39] <asac> for i in "lp:~mozillateam/iceape/debian-1.1.x" "lp:~mozillateam/iceape/ubuntu-1.1.x" "lp:~mozillateam/kazehakase/kazehakase" "lp:~mozillateam/mozilla-devscripts/mozilla-devscripts.hardy" "lp:~mozillateam/mozilla-devscripts/mozilla-devscripts" "lp:~mozillateam/mozilla-devscripts/mozilla-devscripts.intrepid.0.08.1" "lp:~mozillateam/mozilla-devscripts/mozilla-devtools" "lp:~mozillateam/nspr/nspr.hardy" "lp:~mozillateam/nspr/nspr.dev" "lp:~mozill
[19:39] <asac> going for that huge batch now
[19:39] <asac> doing backup first
[19:42] <asac> ok ... given that the other branches worked well i assume that the backup i am having is good enough
[19:46]  * armin76 yawns and stabs asac 
[19:46] <armin76> bumb!
[19:47] <asac> armin76: there is nothing left to bump ;)
[19:47] <asac> mission accomplished: "grand world bump"
[19:49]  * asac goes for for i in "lp:~mozillateam/prism/prism" "lp:~mozillateam/prism/prism.dev" "lp:~mozillateam/rosetta/po2xpi" "lp:~mozillateam/songbird/songbird.head" "lp:~mozillateam/sunbird/ubuntu-0.x.hardy" "lp:~mozillateam/sunbird/iceowl.debian-0.x" "lp:~mozillateam/sunbird/ubuntu-0.x" "lp:~mozillateam/thunderbird/icedove-branding-2.0.0.x" "lp:~mozillateam/thunderbird/thunderbird.hardy" "lp:~mozillateam/thunderbird/icedove-2.0.0.x" "lp:~mozi
[19:50] <asac> po2xpi doesnt need upgrade
[19:51] <asac> songbird.head awas already done before
[19:54]  * asac upgrades those
[20:43] <asac> fta: ok. ia m going for the xulrunner ones now
[20:43] <asac> (the last)
[20:45] <asac> ok including miro that is:
[20:45] <asac> for i in "lp:~mozillateam/xulrunner/xulrunner-1.9.hardy" "lp:~mozillateam/xulrunner/xulrunner-1.9.dev" "lp:~mozillateam/xulrunner/xulrunner-1.9.1.head" "lp:~mozillateam/xulrunner/xulrunner-1.9.head" "lp:~mozillateam/xulrunner/xulrunner-2.0.head" "lp:~mozillateam/xulrunner/xulrunner-1.9.gutsy-backports" "lp:~mozillateam/xulrunner/xulrunner-porting" "lp:~mozillateam/democracy/miro.trunk" ; do  echo bzr branch $i; bzr branch $i; done
[20:45]  * asac goes for it
[20:45]  * asac creates the backups
[20:47]  * asac final upgrade run ;)
[20:49] <asac> urgh ... i think the sync to http server doesnt like the upgrade for some branches :/
[20:49] <asac> fta: ^^
[20:49] <asac> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/thunderbird/thunderbird.dev
[20:53] <asac> hmm firefox-3.0.dev wasnt upgraded
[20:53] <asac> looks like i didnt do that branch
[20:53] <asac> creating backup and upgrading too
[20:54] <asac> ok ... the branches that are broken during syn are ok over ssh
[21:08] <asac> fta: ok final branches are now in upgrade
[21:08] <asac> i think there should be everything migrated in a few minutes
[21:08] <fta> good
[21:08] <asac> if you find a branch through bzr+ssh that isnt upgrade let me know ;)
[21:08] <asac> the branches currentyl upgrading are: bzr upgrade --default lp:seamonkey/2.0; bzr upgrade --default lp:seamonkey;  bzr upgrade --default lp:ubufox
[21:09] <asac> also i told the bzr launchpad crew that we broke their http syncs ;)
[21:09] <asac> the latest upgrades dont even show up in the "error" way like the others
[21:09] <asac> so i guess the syncher gave completely up
[21:10] <asac> ok all finished ;)
[21:11] <asac> you can see all upgraded branches by the warning sign on https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mozillateam
[21:11] <asac> fta: ^^
[21:11] <asac> ;)
[21:11] <asac> well ... all but the last 8 i did
[21:11] <asac> because of the reason i gave above
[21:11] <fta> looks ugly
[21:11] <fta> :)
[21:12] <asac> yeah ... but for me it still works through ssh
[21:12] <asac> i also tried to do bzr diff -c REVISION
[21:12] <asac> for a few
[21:12] <asac> and they worked
[21:12] <asac> i still have the backups ;)
[21:12] <asac> if you find a bug let me know :(
[21:12]  * asac wonders if we should make the backup more redundant
[21:13] <asac> ok i tarr that up and copy it to the people.ubutnu.com webserver ;)
[21:15] <fta> there's no real backup for lp ?
[21:15] <asac> there is
[21:15] <asac> but invoking that is probably quite cumbersome ;)
[21:16] <asac> i am not sure about the backup solution they have
[21:16] <asac> and if librarian is really backed-up outside the disk array itself
[21:16] <asac> not sure ;)(
[21:16] <asac> fta: http://people.ubuntu.com/~asac/bzr-mozillateam-upgrade-backups.tar.gz2
[21:17] <fta> ok
[21:17] <fta> gz2 :)
[21:17] <asac> yeah ;)
[21:17] <asac> i first wanted to use bz2 ;)
[21:17] <asac> but then didnt like the idea to wait for ages
[21:18] <asac> ok ... what a job ;)
[21:18] <asac> upgrading bzr branches
[21:18] <asac> definitly worth mentioning in monthly mozillateam report :)
[21:20] <asac> i hope that bzr can settle on a final branch format soon
[21:21] <asac> but there is already --rich-root and --rich-root-pack (e.g. pack 1.6) that will probably be the next thing :(
[21:22] <asac> a bit scary imo
[21:24] <fta> good thing is there's far less files in .bzr now.
[21:24] <asac> yeah ;)(
[21:24] <asac> everything should be much faster now
[21:24] <asac> especially the initial branch
[21:25] <asac> and merging
[21:25] <asac> but --rich-root scares me a lot
[21:25] <asac> i couldnt upgrade my network-manager branch (which is a full source branch)
[21:25] <asac> and i couldnt merge from the new rich-root upstream thing
[21:25] <asac> (which is the used format on the official gnome bzr mirror)
[21:25] <asac> http://bzr-mirror.gnome.org/NetworkManager/trunk/
[21:26] <asac> otherwise thats really great
[21:26] <asac> it even attempted to make the trunk and branches related
[21:26] <asac> of course merges cannot be detected that great in svn
[21:28] <fta> doesn't gnome have a good front end for gdb ?
[21:29] <asac> fta: what is a good frontend for gdb?
[21:29] <fta> something like ddd but in gtk
[21:29] <asac> fta: a good frontend would have IDE integration i guess. which is anjuta
[21:30] <asac> fta: what benefit do you get from ddd over the command line tool
[21:30] <asac> isnt that just a X window with a gdb shell in pricinpal?
[21:30] <fta> the display feature
[21:31] <asac> fta: nemiver - Standalone graphical debugger for GNOME
[21:31] <asac> ?
[21:31] <asac> not sure
[21:31] <asac> otherwise i dont think there is anything
[21:31] <asac> ;)
[21:32] <asac> fta: let me know if that works well ;)
[21:32] <fta> http://www.gnu.org/software/ddd/all.png
[21:34] <asac> fta: can you interactively nvigate in the graphic?
[21:34] <fta> yes
[21:34] <asac> e.g. clicking on a field will bring you to the reference object?
[21:34] <asac> not that bad then ;)
[21:34] <asac> when i tried gdb it either didnt have that feature or i didnt see it;)
[21:34] <asac> but thats years ago i think
[21:34] <asac> err tried ddd ;)
[21:35] <fta> last time i used ddd i was ~10 years younger
[21:35] <fta> it looks the same :(
[21:38] <verwilst> hi guys
[21:38] <asac> ok ... let me try to send a "missingPlugins" event whenever there is a request for a "Shockwave Flash" names plugin against the navigator object ;)(
[21:38] <verwilst> i have a firefox crasher that i want to debug
[21:38] <verwilst> any help from you guys would be appreciated
[21:38] <asac> verwilst: read: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MozillaTeam/Bugs/#Crashes
[21:38] <asac> to get started
[21:39] <verwilst> http://pastebin.com/d34796219 < is this helpful already or is more needed wrt backtrace?
[21:39] <asac> verwilst: you need more debug symbols
[21:40] <asac> verwilst: read that page
[21:40] <asac> ites just a short paragraph
[21:40] <verwilst> asac: well yeah i already did
[21:40] <verwilst> and i installed all the packages
[21:40] <asac> all?
[21:40] <verwilst> ddebs for -security is broken though for quite some time
[21:40] <verwilst> so i had to recompile my own with dbgsym support
[21:40] <asac> verwilst: everything from -security should be in -updates too
[21:41] <asac> verwilst: strange. maybe you have builds from some PPA?
[21:41] <verwilst>   xulrunner-1.9-dbgsym: Depends: xulrunner-1.9 (= 1.9~b5+nobinonly-0ubuntu3) but 1.9.0.1+build1+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.8.04.3 is to be installed
[21:41] <asac> verwilst: yes you are missing -updates in your dbgsym apt lines
[21:42] <asac> follow instructions on that page ;)
[21:42] <verwilst> deb http://ddebs.ubuntu.com hardy-updates main universe
[21:42] <asac> oh
[21:42] <verwilst> oh idd ;)
[21:42] <asac> maybe that wasnt pocket copied? not sure than
[21:43] <asac> not sure then. however the libxul.so symbols appear to be non-existing or bogus
[21:43] <verwilst> asac: what version does it want to install when you try xulrunner-1.9-dbgsym?
[21:43] <asac> thats the one in plain hardy
[21:43] <verwilst> yip
[21:43] <asac> verwilst: try the 1.9.0.1+build1+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.8.04.2 version
[21:43] <asac> maybe its still there
[21:43] <asac> it was generically build in -proposed
[21:43] <asac> so you might be able to find it there
[21:44] <verwilst> apt-cache show xulrunner-1.9-dbgsym shows the  1.9~b5+nobinonly-0ubuntu3 only here
[21:44] <verwilst> does it show something else @ your machine?
[21:44] <verwilst> if it does, can i copy your sources.list for a sec? :)
[21:44] <asac> dont have hardy at hand atm
[21:44] <verwilst> oh hm
[21:46] <asac> strange
[21:46] <asac> xulrunner and firefox are indeed missing
[21:46] <verwilst> ahah
[21:46] <verwilst> so i wasnt going crazy ;)
[21:46] <asac> well ... i looked in the packages files
[21:46] <asac> on the server
[21:46] <verwilst> it sucks because firefox is the sore spot in hardy
[21:47] <verwilst> it drives my newly semi-volunteer ubuntu-ified girlfriend crazy
[21:47] <asac> lets look in the pool
[21:47] <fta> it's not there
[21:47]  * verwilst looks
[21:47] <fta> http://ddebs.ubuntu.com/pool/main/x/xulrunner-1.9/
[21:47] <asac> tse
[21:47] <asac> that s**ks
[21:47] <fta> bug pitti
[21:47] <verwilst> yeah i checked that before the weekend too, when i was having troubles as well
[21:48] <asac> yeah. though i think that has something to do with how the .3 was released
[21:48] <asac> jdstrand attempted to pocket-copy it from -upstreawm to security
[21:48] <asac> most likely that removed the ddebs from there
[21:48] <asac> ro something
[21:48] <asac> however it failed and thus it needed a full respin in security
[21:48] <verwilst> where can i find this pitti guy? :)
[21:48] <asac> verwilst: well. i'll take care of that
[21:48] <asac> verwilst: for now you need to build the packages on your own
[21:49] <asac> which is really really painful, i understand that
[21:49] <asac> ;)
[21:49] <verwilst> wtf
[21:49] <verwilst> ii  xulrunner-dbgsym                           1.8.1.13+nobinonly-0ubuntu1                        debug symbols for package xulrunner
[21:49] <verwilst> 1.8.1?
[21:49] <asac> thats the old branch
[21:49] <verwilst> yeah..
[21:49] <asac> you dont need those
[21:49] <verwilst> but..
[21:49] <verwilst> i compiled them myself? :P
[21:49] <asac> yeah
[21:49]  * verwilst is dazed and confused
[21:49] <asac> that means you have the wrong ones ;)
[21:50] <verwilst> i apt-get sourced firefox3 so..
[21:50] <asac> which explains why you have no symbols for libxul
[21:50]  * verwilst rechecks
[21:50] <verwilst> yeah
[21:50] <asac> verwilst: firefox-3.0 and xulrunner-1.9 are the sources
[21:50] <asac> so good news ;)
[21:50] <asac> though the non existing dbgsym packages are really devastating ;)
[21:50] <verwilst> firefox-3.0-dbgsym_3.0.1+build1+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.8.04.3_i386.ddeb
[21:50] <asac> no doubt that piled up a bunch of not-retraced crash reports :(
[21:51] <asac> verwilst: yes. thats correct
[21:51] <verwilst> that's the one my recompile gave me
[21:51] <asac> however, firefox has almost no binary code ;)
[21:51] <verwilst> and which i installed i figure
[21:51] <asac> so you need xulrunner-1.9
[21:51] <verwilst> goddamn :)
[21:51] <asac> verwilst: yeah. but firefox-3.0 isnt important for backtraces ;)
[21:51] <asac> all C++ code is in xulrunner-1.9
[21:52] <verwilst> downloading
[21:52] <asac> should take 20-40 minutes depending your system
[21:52] <verwilst> well, i remember i installed xulrunner dbgsym's as well
[21:52] <asac> verwilst: if you want to use multiple cores you can build with:
[21:52] <asac> dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -j3
[21:52] <verwilst> i never figured to check the version too :)
[21:52] <asac> in case you dont know
[21:53] <verwilst> ah i usually do debuild
[21:53] <asac> verwilst: not sure if debuild has the same option
[21:53] <asac> verwilst: but since hardy only dpkg-buildpackage gives you a generic built .... ;)
[21:53] <asac> so better use that
[21:53] <asac> debuild misses to inject some options
[21:53] <verwilst> dpkg-buildpackage in the source package?
[21:53] <asac> yes like above
[21:53] <asac> (just like debuild)
[21:54] <asac> dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -j3
[21:54] <asac> (for 2 cores)
[21:54] <verwilst> c2d yeah
[21:54] <asac> dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -j6
[21:54] <asac> for 4 cores ;)
[21:54] <verwilst> a 8400, so should be plenty fast :)
[21:54] <asac> what is 8400?
[21:54] <verwilst> core 2 duo 8400
[21:54] <asac> ah
[21:54] <verwilst> 3ghz
[21:54] <asac> yeah. youll see
[21:54] <asac> ;)
[21:55] <asac> verwilst: run:
[21:55] <asac> time dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -j3
[21:55] <asac> and let me know ;)
[21:55] <verwilst> hm
[21:55]  * verwilst ctrl-c's
[21:55] <asac> hehe
[21:55] <asac> verwilst: oh
[21:55] <asac> time dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -j3 -b
[21:55] <verwilst> how do i clean it?
[21:55] <asac> so you just build the binaries ;)
[21:55] <asac> i dont care aobut source package cvreation
[21:55] <verwilst> or does it restart from scratch?
[21:55] <asac> verwilst: fakeroot ./debian/rules clean
[21:55] <asac> no ... you shoul clean it to get a good time ;)
[21:56] <verwilst> it's off
[21:56] <asac> good ;)
[21:56] <verwilst> hm, i miss my distro dev days
[21:56] <asac> hehe
[21:56] <verwilst> only know the basics at debian dev'ing
[21:56] <verwilst> which sucks
[21:57] <verwilst> ( been gentoo dev for 3 years, a long time ago :) ) best linux time of my life hehe
[21:57] <asac> hehe
[21:58] <verwilst> my girlfriend's ubuntu crashes sometimes 10 times in a few hours
[21:58] <asac> armin76 is gentoo guy still
[21:58] <verwilst> always firefox
[21:58] <verwilst> i quit after 3 years
[21:58] <asac> though i think he will switch to binary distribution once he realizes that that makes more sense ;)
[21:58] <verwilst> it was a time when anyone could get cvs access, if they just asked
[21:58] <verwilst> a lot of core devs quit then
[21:58] <asac> verwilst: girlfriends problem is most likely flash
[21:58] <verwilst> yeah it is
[21:59] <asac> verwilst: if libflashsupport is installed it would crash every 30 minutes
[21:59] <verwilst> but still, i cant tell her not to use it :)
[21:59] <asac> verwilst: you can try to use nspluginwrapper from mozillateam ppa
[21:59] <verwilst> well, it's better now
[21:59] <asac> that should make firefox go down more rarely
[21:59] <verwilst> flash 10 rc, and asound.conf configured
[21:59] <asac> hmm
[21:59] <verwilst> it's a lot better now, and at least she has sound in all apps
[21:59] <asac> good
[21:59] <verwilst> which was pretty embarrassing
[22:00] <asac> well. flash is crap
[22:00] <asac> gnash is getting better ;)
[22:00] <asac> i hope intrepid it will be good and in intrepid+1 installed by default ;)
[22:00] <verwilst> you switch someone to linux from windows, and then have to tell her she cant listen to her music and youtube at the same time
[22:00] <verwilst> pretty awkward
[22:00] <armin76> yuck
[22:00] <asac> does that work now?
[22:00] <verwilst> ( not to mention the constant crashes )
[22:01] <verwilst> yeah, it does now
[22:01] <asac> ok
[22:01] <verwilst> took a while to find out though
[22:01] <asac> well pulseaudio was a mess imho
[22:01] <verwilst> pulseaudio is nice
[22:01] <asac> yes, but all the issues we had are because of pulseaudio :)
[22:01] <verwilst> but the handling @ ubuntu could be better :)
[22:01] <asac> pulse needs to mature ... maybe not on its own, but all the integration
[22:01] <verwilst> yeah
[22:02] <verwilst> ofcourse flash was the main bottleneck
[22:02] <verwilst> and still is
[22:02] <asac> well, flash 9 wasnt possible to make working with pulse
[22:02] <asac> so  @ubuntu couldnt do better
[22:02] <verwilst> damned proprietary crap
[22:02] <asac> and flash is also one of the main thing (if not the only thign) that causes problems here
[22:02] <verwilst> yeah i know
[22:02] <verwilst> flash and skype i guess
[22:02] <asac> everything else uses pulse and thuse doesnt cause tht many issues
[22:02] <verwilst> but flash 10 seems to be a lot better
[22:02] <asac> yes, but if skype uses sync alsa  then the pulse plugin would have worked
[22:03] <verwilst> that's actually the upside of moonlight
[22:03] <verwilst> it's open source
[22:03] <asac> but for flash even that wasnt possible
[22:03] <asac> what is open source? flash 10`
[22:03] <verwilst> ( that's pretty much the only upside i can find for it but hey )
[22:03] <verwilst> moonlight
[22:03] <verwilst> microsoft's "let's copy flash and call it an innovation" crap
[22:03] <asac> urgh
[22:03] <asac> well. better stick to gnash
[22:03] <asac> or swfdec if you want
[22:04] <asac> you can do most things there. you just have to take care that you dont use flash bugs ;)
[22:04] <verwilst> i cant give gnash to my girl
[22:04] <asac> yes. but microsofts flash replacement wont work too in those cases
[22:04] <verwilst> it's too immature
[22:04] <verwilst> how's that?
[22:04] <verwilst> novell is creating a mono counterpart eh
[22:04] <verwilst> open source
[22:04] <verwilst> moonlight = silverlight, FOSS
[22:05] <verwilst> and silverlight = MS
[22:08] <verwilst> asac: http://www.bomahy.nl/hylke/blog/moonlight-animations/
[22:11] <verwilst> real	15m11.027s  user	19m47.906s sys	1m25.741s
[22:11] <verwilst> :)
[22:15] <verwilst> xulrunner-1.9-dbgsym is installed, still no other backtraces..
[22:17] <verwilst> #2  0xb729ba55 in ?? () from /usr/lib/xulrunner-1.9.0.1/libxul.so
[22:17] <verwilst> No symbol table info available.
[22:17] <verwilst> grm
[22:21] <verwilst> silence...
[22:21] <verwilst> :P
[23:06] <apachelogger> awfully long channel name :P
[23:06] <apachelogger> hey everyone
[23:07] <asac> hi apachelogger
[23:08] <fta> ho
[23:08] <fta> hi
[23:08] <asac> apachelogger: you are interested in qt builds for firefox 3.1?
[23:09] <apachelogger> asac: that involves work, doesn't it?
[23:10] <asac> apachelogger: not sure. you published builds ;)
[23:11] <apachelogger> asac: they are a pretty hackish adoption of the firefox source package
[23:12] <apachelogger> the Qt integration isn't at a stage where I would want to spend a lot of time on packaging it
[23:13] <asac> apachelogger: well. if they are not use worthy, then please dont publish them. they get on user systems and might cause support work
[23:14] <apachelogger> I published them mentioning the danger and unsuability
[23:15] <asac> sure. thats ok. however, that doesnt matter once the people get issues ;)
[23:15] <asac> at best let us take a look before you publish such ;) ... its not much additional work to make them play good in the packaging eco system ;)
[23:16] <apachelogger> well
[23:16] <apachelogger> it does play well
[23:16] <apachelogger> the worst thing that can happen is that it eats the .mozilla dir
[23:16] <asac> which is bad enough ;)
[23:16] <apachelogger> in fact, it's most likely that it does that :D
[23:16] <apachelogger> I tried to change the config dir to .mozilla-qt but that didn't work all that much
[23:17] <asac> apachelogger: we will publish such packages as soon as they are test worthy. if you want to help, you are welcome.
[23:17] <asac> changing the profile dir isnt a big problem if you know how that is done
[23:17] <apachelogger> if you have to do anything but poke the configure script it's bad implemented :P
[23:18] <asac> apachelogger: anyway. all i want to say is that if you are interested in firefox packaging, do it here. its much more efficient and helps people more
[23:18] <apachelogger> sure, the current package is really just for bleeding edge users, who can't stop killing their system
[23:18] <asac> apachelogger: could you remove them anyway?
[23:18] <asac> such packages go around in the world
[23:19] <asac> and they come back informs of bugs
[23:19] <asac> and after hours of asking and trying to figure users suddenly remember ... oh i had that package installed in the past
[23:19] <asac> such things happen frequently
[23:19] <apachelogger> I could, but I wouldn't feel very comfortable
[23:19] <asac> apachelogger: why?
[23:20] <apachelogger> I rather have people use packages which work somewhat than have them use checkinstall packages
[23:20] <asac> no ... packages that work somehow are worth
[23:20] <apachelogger> and these are almost certain to appear in this case
[23:20] <asac> worse
[23:20] <asac> make install adds an addition barrier that users have to go
[23:21] <apachelogger> checkinstall doesn't
[23:22] <asac> anyway. would be good if you could remove that package. i dont mind about checkinstall. debs floating on the net are just worse
[23:22] <asac> people look for it, and install it. reading no announcement and nothing
[23:22] <apachelogger> well
[23:22] <apachelogger> checkinstall creates the debs that are floating
[23:23] <apachelogger> asac: we have stated very clearly that these packages and the entire repository they reside in is super experimental and really not meant for producation systems
[23:23] <asac> it always can be worse and i cannot talk into people that i have no chance to talk to
[23:23] <asac> apachelogger: people blog about that package
[23:23] <asac> thats how we found it
[23:24] <apachelogger> asac: got the URL at hand?
[23:24] <asac> and that causes attention. people dont look at what the repository is about. they install
[23:24] <apachelogger> anyway, I understand your POV and will discuss the removal with the kubuntu ninjas
[23:24] <asac> and that causes pain for the ubuntu distributions in form of bugs
[23:24] <asac> and wierd support requests
[23:24] <asac> apachelogger: you uploaded that package.
[23:25] <apachelogger> nothing stops people from using the binary
[23:25] <apachelogger> which will just as well rape the .mozilla dir
[23:26] <asac> doesnt matter. everything that comes from *ubuntu-* whatever on launchpad should go through mozilllateam. i can only try to get the pieces together that are more or less remotely realted to ubuntu.
[23:26] <asac> anyway. think about it. if kubuntu-experimental is an effort that is affiliated with kubuntu then this package surely has to go. otherwise i can only hope that you do it ;)
[23:27] <apachelogger> I'll do my best to find an appropriate solution
[23:27] <asac> apachelogger: http://jtechinda.blogspot.com/2008/08/firefox-qt-packages-hit-kubuntu.html
[23:28] <asac> apachelogger: if you are affiliated with kubuntu, remove it. if you are an independent group, do what you want
[23:28] <asac> thanks
[23:29] <asac> oh. you are ubuntu-dev .... you really have to remove it then
[23:29] <apachelogger> yeah
[23:29] <apachelogger> or leave the project
[23:29] <asac> hehe
[23:29] <asac> well
[23:30] <asac> no need to do that
[23:32] <fta> no need to go that far. I initially wanted to merge our efforts, i.e., make the firefox-3.1 / xulrunner-1.9.1 packages i currently maintain do QT in a way or another.
[23:32] <asac> apachelogger: i dont want to enforce anything here ... its not important enough. i just thought that ubuntu-dev members understand distro issues that can come from such packages ... so only thin i do here is to appeal to you that it makes more sense to do it in the mozillateam
[23:33] <asac> apachelogger: so. just line up with fta ;)
[23:33]  * apachelogger moves in line
[23:34] <fta> :)
[23:34] <apachelogger> fta: it's Qt, btw... QT is QuickTime ;-)
[23:34] <asac> wow, i only knew quicktime for windows :-D
[23:38] <fta> apachelogger, you got my point. btw, it's still not clear how we could do gtk and Qt packages without rebuilding everything twice. it sure needs some patches. but that's the probably the way to go, even if the Qt part is not polished yet, it would benefit from the work we do on the main packages
[23:39] <asac> fta: is there any way to fix the fortify crash without rebuilding everything?
[23:39] <asac> did the PATH_MAX*10 thing work?
[23:39] <fta> it did, last time i checked
[23:42] <asac> fta: but thats still an issue on 3.1?
[23:44] <fta> yes, the patch has not landed upstream
[23:44] <asac> fta: which patch ... the *10 thing?
[23:44] <asac> redhat guy said to me that it works for them with fortify 2 without any patch
[23:44] <asac> i dont understand all that
[23:45] <fta> lol, no, not my ugly workaround
[23:45] <asac> fta: is there another fix?
[23:45] <fta> hold on, firing bugzilla
[23:47] <fta> mozilla bug 412610
[23:47] <fta> last att is "Fix based on the patch used in Fedora"
[23:47] <asac> wow
[23:48] <asac> apparently the mozilla guy at redhat doesnt know what they ship ;)
[23:48] <fta> "Fedora 9 (glibc-2.8 and gcc-4.3.0) on x86_64 requires the attachment 325441 [details] for getting well-worked firefox with the compiler option of -DFORTIFY_SOURCE=2."
[23:48] <asac> ok ... so 4096 i typed manually should be ok
[23:49] <asac> good
[23:49] <asac> so my manual patch did the same ;)
[23:50] <fta> as good as my *10
[23:50] <asac> ok ... let me think what i wanted to test ;)
[23:50] <asac> ah ... anti-flash detection ;)