[00:06] <zerwas> hm, kwwi is not there ...
[01:02] <zerwas> Cimi: ping
[01:10] <Flannel> zerwas: Are you subscribed?
[01:10] <zerwas> Flannel: it worked now.
[01:11] <zerwas> I am, but i registered with an @gmail.com address. in the meantime, Google had to rename it in germany to googlemail.com, that was the problem
[01:12] <Cimi> zerwas: pongù
[01:14] <zerwas> Cimi: you just answered to my mail regarding the dust theme, thanks. so i am right that the same theme which hardy had will also get into intrepid?
[01:15] <Cimi> similar themes
[01:16] <zerwas> ah okay. thank you :-)
[04:34] <pwnguin> I wonder if it's a bad thing that gmail marks a lot of ubuntu-artwork threads as spam =(
[12:13] <thorwil> ah, welcome back kwwii!
[12:14] <kwwii> hi thorwil
[12:15] <kwwii> just reading up on something like 2000 emails
[12:15] <thorwil> kwwii: i can imagine. i'm the cause of some of them ^^
[12:15] <kwwii> hehe
[15:17]  * thorwil waves to _MMA_ 
[15:17] <_MMA_> Hello sir.
[15:22] <kwwii> ok, so I finally read all the emails
[15:22] <kwwii> erm, finished reading
[15:22] <_MMA_> \o/
[15:24] <thorwil> now comes answering them all? ^^
[15:26]  * thorwil himself noticed a sharp rise in spam getting through the filters of his mail provider
[15:26] <thorwil> hilton, spears and rolex. it sounds so easy to filter
[15:28] <kwwii> I'll only answer a few...probably nothing specific on the art list
[16:17] <psyke83> kwwii: I know you're busy, just FYI. I found a slight problem in all the themes (one line fix), I'll email the updated gtkrc files a little later
[16:19] <kwwii> psyke83: cool, i saw your email with the other theme, I'll test that out later
[16:19] <psyke83> kwwii: grand. I only attached a screenshot, I'll send the files along with the other updates so you can take a look
[16:21] <kwwii> cool :-)
[17:39] <thorwil> kwwii: regarding standard theme presentation, back when i worked on my experimental theme series, this was my base: http://thorwil.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/02.jpg
[17:39] <thorwil> selected to show the stacking of windows and many widgets in there real context
[17:41] <thorwil> i wonder if opening and placing specific apps and dialogs could be scripted
[17:47] <kwwii> not sure about the scripting but providing a template is the least we could do
[17:47] <kwwii> showing the widget factory is probably necessary in addition to what you have on that screenshot, I guess
[17:49] <thorwil> sure. it's the widget factory that needs at least one less artificial shot in addition ;)
[17:50] <thorwil> heck, a single resolution would be a win already
[17:51] <kwwii> definitely
[17:51] <kwwii> I guess making a couple of them at smaller resolutions is more realistic for more people
[17:51] <kwwii> but changing resolution and getting a decent screenshot is something that won't work on every box
[17:57] <thorwil> i have to admit that i just used my native resolution :)
[17:58] <kwwii> yeah, pretty normal and I guess we can't change that easily
[17:58] <kwwii> anyway...time to head out for dinner with the family
[17:58] <kwwii> bbl
[17:58] <thorwil> guten hunger!
[18:38] <tlp> .
[19:49] <tretle> hi, is the default theme for intrepid still undecided?
[19:51] <_MMA_> I'm sure the idea is there as to what's going to be used.
[19:52] <_MMA_> tretle: Whats up?
[19:52] <tretle> was hoping that the wall-light gtk theme might make it
[19:53] <_MMA_> Highly doubtful.
[19:53] <tretle> the gdm theme is really good too
[19:54] <tretle> I thought that intrepid would get the postponed theme change, from the looks of it community themes are being snubbed in favour of the old theme again
[19:55] <Cimi> welcome back kenneth
[19:55] <Cimi> did you spend great days with your sons?
[19:56] <tretle> hey cimi?
[19:57] <Cimi> tretle: are you kenneth?
[19:57] <savvas> maybe there are two kens :)
[19:58] <Cimi> :)
[19:59] <tretle> nope, John here :D :P was just being polite :D
[20:00] <_MMA_> Cimi: kwwii went out with his family to dinner. Should be back soon.
[20:01] <tretle> Cimi - what do you think of Will-Light ?
[20:03] <_MMA_> tretle: Its mostly a concept. Nobody's made it.
[20:03] <tretle> they have
[20:03] <tretle> its a bit buggy though
[20:03] <_MMA_> And for me, it's too OSX.
[20:03] <_MMA_> Along with not having the rights to the wallpaper.
[20:03] <tretle> thats because awn is in the mockup
[20:04] <tretle> ignore awn and concentrate on the gdm, gtk theme
[20:04] <_MMA_> As well as AWN *needing* compotite to work. We can't guarantee that.
[20:06] <_MMA_> There are nice ideas but in the end, it needs alot of work.
[20:06] <_MMA_> Digg +1's don't really make things happen.
[20:07] <tretle> well theres going to be some pissed off people when the theme change gets delayed again despite community demand
[20:07] <thorwil> awww
[20:07] <_MMA_> You can call it "ignoring the community" but the "community" is deeply unaware about what it takes to actually do something.
[20:08]  * _MMA_ hands "the community" a tissue while ﻿thorwil pats them on the back.
[20:09]  * thorwil had some other act in mind, but they could use a tissue then, too
[20:09] <_MMA_> :P
[20:10] <thorwil> i'm actually more with troy then i used to be. let's do this, let's do that --- but what about the why?
[20:11] <_MMA_> Hahahaha. Everyone ends up thinking like Troy. :)
[20:11] <_MMA_> But...
[20:11] <_MMA_> I do still like to do things "because it's cool". :)
[20:12] <thorwil> _MMA_: that's quite compatible with what one could work out as master plan for ubuntu studio anyway ;)
[20:12] <_MMA_> :P
[20:13] <tretle> if there isn't going to be a theme change then don't announce it, that's all I am saying, it gives a bad impression of the art team and just stirs up bad press. Every distro release there are reviews, the common review of hardy included disappointment at the postponing of the new theme, continuously failing to reach deadlines will just give said reviewers ammunition to bash ubuntu.
[20:13] <_MMA_> Oh well.
[20:14] <thorwil> tretle: if some random guy stirs up shit with a mockup on digg, nobody here can do anything about it
[20:14] <_MMA_> +1
[20:14] <_MMA_> haha
[20:14] <thorwil> the artwork "team" is not resposible for announcements, btw
[20:14]  * _MMA_ "Dugg" ﻿thorwil's comment.
[20:15] <thorwil> finally, a bad impression is not necessarily wrong. and we all value honesty and truth, right? ^^
[20:15] <_MMA_> No.
[20:15] <thorwil> ok, _MMA_ is on the dark side, actually
[20:16]  * _MMA_ wants sunshine constantly blown up his a$$. :P
[20:16] <thorwil> ubuntu studio will subtly shift all music made with it to death metal
[20:16] <_MMA_> \m/
[20:16] <tretle> "we all value honesty and truth, right?" indeed thats why they will have a field day with the lack of theme change again
[20:16] <_MMA_> *If* we even release anymore.
[20:17] <_MMA_> tretle: Oh well. ;)
[20:17] <thorwil> tretle: don't worry. digg, slashdot and co are not the world. also, you are still adressing the wrong people
[20:17] <tretle> is there going to be any theme change at all
[20:18] <_MMA_> Sure. kwwii will be best to say what it will be.
[20:18] <_MMA_> psyke83 might know a bit as well.
[20:18] <tretle> http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/11805/
[20:19] <_MMA_> So? :)
[20:20] <_MMA_> Brainstorm in no way controls Ubuntu. I is only occasionally used as a metric.
[20:20] <_MMA_> *It is...
[20:21] <thorwil> _MMA_: no, actually i got worried now!!
[20:21] <_MMA_> metric/gadge
[20:21] <tretle> _MMA_ out of curiosity what is it you actually do?
[20:22] <_MMA_> tretle: Im part of the "community".
[20:22] <tretle> other than shun change :D :P lol
[20:22] <_MMA_> I sit around making uninformed comments as if they were truth and do nothing to change things. :)
[20:22] <tretle> _MMA_ why do you think you are better than the other 815 community members that voted?
[20:23] <thorwil> tretle: out of curiosity, what is it that you do, other than complaining to the wrong people without offering actual help?
[20:23] <_MMA_> tretle: You assume I am better. Not I. ;)
[20:24] <_MMA_> thorwil: Well, as we both know, anyone can *offer* to help. It's the rare person who sticks around and actually *does* something. Where's Salene? :)
[20:26] <thorwil> _MMA_: yes. should have said "without _even_ offering help". Salane got disillusioned and grumpy quickly.
[20:27] <_MMA_> Yep.
[20:27] <thorwil> the idea to take to the CC was interesting, though
[20:27] <_MMA_> Yes. Though, it was for not.
[20:28] <thorwil> good thing we are not disillusioned and grumpy
[20:28] <_MMA_> :P
[20:28] <tretle> the reason I didnt offer help was because you never told me who was the right people to discuss this with and the majority of responses were SO?, and digg bashing which was just irritating.
[20:28] <_MMA_> ﻿﻿tretle: I'll happily listen to anyone of those 815 people if that do more than talk and click a +1 button. ;)
[20:29] <tretle> there have been gdm and gtk themes made already
[20:29] <tretle> I said this earlier
[20:29] <_MMA_> So. That's it. All done then. :) Go use 'em.
[20:30] <thorwil> tretle: i think you were told that kwwii is the man (who hasn't returend yet, apparently). otherwise you would need to talk with sabdfl himself. good luck trying that
[20:30] <tretle> right I give up, you win
[20:30] <_MMA_> What you (ant *many* others) don't realize is the other work involved.
[20:30] <_MMA_> *and
[20:30] <thorwil> i refuse to win just for being told so!!
[20:30] <_MMA_> You said yourself it's buggy as hell. Why should that be default in *any* distro?
[20:31] <tretle> I was referring to _MMA_ but you can share the trophy
[20:31] <thorwil> no way
[20:31]  * _MMA_ wrastles it away from ﻿thorwil.
[20:32]  * thorwil hands _MMA_ an "e"
[20:32] <tretle> Well, I was thinking that since the groundwork is done and it is a popular theme/concept that maybe people from the ubuntu art theme could concentrate on fixing it and maybe using it as default in ibex or ibex+1
[20:33] <_MMA_> tretle: I'm sorry. We are having a *bit* of fun. Just realize that it's a *much* more complex issue than you, or any one of the hundred people I've seen come in here and ask about that theme.
[20:33] <thorwil> tretle: maybe we are not exactly fair to you. but see, there were what felt like half a dozen times that that wall-light thing got brought up on our mailing list
[20:34] <tretle> really
[20:34] <_MMA_> Along with the fact that the mailing list has gone over this alot already. You wanna get the story, read the last 3 months on the ubuntu-artwork ML.
[20:34] <tretle> understandable response to my entrance then
[20:34] <thorwil> phew
[20:35] <_MMA_> And in truth, I think the theme sux.
[20:35] <_MMA_> There's nothing original about it. IMO
[20:36] <_MMA_> It's all borrowed parts.
[20:36] <thorwil> yeah, not enough honeycombs
[20:36] <_MMA_> No sir.
[20:36] <tretle> I like the yellow drop down menus
[20:39]  * _MMA_ goes back to makin' beehives and unusable dark themes.
[22:41] <rsc_> hi guys.
[22:53] <zerwas> hi rsc_
[22:54] <rsc_> is using Nabble a good way to participate in the list?
[22:54] <rsc_> :b