[18:08] <mrevell> hey gmb, leonardr, barry: I have a minor sound problem that I'm working to fix
[18:09] <leonardr> mrevell: i have a question. is this going to be edited later? i'm expecting a package within the next hour
[18:09] <leonardr> so i may need to take a short break
[18:09] <mrevell> leonardr: Yeah, it'll be edited later. I think it'll only take ten to fifteen mins
[18:10] <leonardr> cool
[18:12] <mrevell> this is all on the assumption that I can get my audio problem sorted
[18:12] <barry> mrevell: brb
[18:13] <barry> mrevell: ready
[18:14] <mrevell> sorry barry, I've had to find another laptop and am waiting for it to boot
[18:49] <Ursinha> matsubara, are you going to be the host?
[18:49] <matsubara> Ursinha: yes
[18:49] <Ursinha> great
[19:00] <matsubara> #startmeeting
[19:00] <MootBot> Meeting started at 13:00. The chair is matsubara.
[19:00] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[19:00] <matsubara> [TOPIC] Roll Call
[19:00] <MootBot> New Topic:  Roll Call
[19:00] <mrevell> meme
[19:00] <beuno> me
[19:00] <abentley> me
[19:00] <bac> me
[19:00] <gmb> me
[19:00] <flacoste> me
[19:00] <matsubara> Not on the Launchpad Dev team? Welcome! Come "me" with the rest of us!
[19:00] <salgado> me
[19:00] <henninge> me
[19:00] <mars> me
[19:00] <adeuring> me
[19:00] <matsubara> me
[19:00] <sinzui> me
[19:00] <barry> me
[19:00] <thumper> me
[19:00] <Ursinha> me
[19:00] <stub> me
[19:01] <cprov-afk> me
[19:01] <kiko> em
[19:01] <matsubara> Releases is here
[19:01] <BjornT> me
[19:01] <matsubara> TLs please check if your team members are here
[19:01] <thumper> rockstar: ping
[19:01] <BjornT> allenap and intellectornica are off today
[19:01] <kiko> are the TLs here, is the real question? ;)
[19:01] <matsubara> thanks BjornT
[19:01] <BjornT> rest of bugs team is here
[19:01] <bigjools> me
[19:01] <jtv> me
[19:01] <rockstar> me
[19:01] <thumper> Code is here
[19:02] <flacoste> Foundations is missing leonardr and EdwinGrubbs
[19:02] <kiko> they are being printed on milk cartons as we speak
[19:02] <leonardr> me
[19:02] <matsubara> bigjools, jtv: soyuz, translations?
[19:02] <bigjools> soyuz all present
[19:03] <jtv> matsubara: Translations almost complete
[19:03] <kiko> al-maisan is excused this week
[19:03] <herb> me
[19:03] <matsubara> all right then. let's move on
[19:03] <matsubara> [TOPIC] Agenda
[19:03] <MootBot> New Topic:  Agenda
[19:03] <matsubara>  * Next meeting
[19:03] <matsubara>  * Actions from last meeting
[19:03] <matsubara>  * Oops report & Critical Bugs (matsubara/ursinha)
[19:03] <matsubara>  * Operations report (mthaddon/herb/spm)
[19:03] <matsubara>  * DBA report (stub)
[19:03] <matsubara>  * Sysadmin requests (Rinchen)
[19:03] <matsubara>  * New packages required (salgado)
[19:03] <mthaddon> me
[19:04] <matsubara> so next meeting same time, same channel?
[19:04] <Ursinha> +1
[19:04] <kiko> YES!
[19:04] <matsubara> done
[19:04] <kiko> good idea
[19:04] <matsubara> [TOPIC] Actions from last meeting
[19:04] <MootBot> New Topic:  Actions from last meeting
[19:04] <matsubara>     * salgado to test query that fixes oops in +participation on staging and after that run the query on production db. Query approved by stub
[19:04] <matsubara>     * Ursinha to ask danilo /jtv about bug 261507
[19:04] <matsubara>     * Ursinha to ask Bjornt about bug 252674
[19:04] <matsubara>     * Ursinha to ask mthaddon about bug 259947
[19:04] <kiko> beuno will tell us that consistency is an absolutely desireable goal :)
[19:05] <salgado> matsubara, done
[19:05] <matsubara> thanks salgado
[19:05] <EdwinGrubbs> me
[19:05] <Ursinha> matsubara, bug 261507 was workarounded and then lowered to High, danilo said that they're w
[19:05] <Ursinha> orking on the fix
[19:05] <Ursinha> bug 252674, it is now in progress, cool
[19:05] <kiko> I hate private bugs
[19:05] <thumper> kiko: you have the power
[19:05] <kiko> are these security sensitive?
[19:06] <Ursinha> i haven't spoken with mthaddon about bug 259947 yet
[19:06] <Ursinha> kiko, i'm not sure of that
[19:06] <jtv> kiko: 261507 isn't very security sensitive
[19:06] <matsubara> Ursinha: I don't think any of those shipit OOPSes happened again.
[19:07] <matsubara> since last week, I mean
[19:07] <Ursinha> matsubara, no, they stopped happening
[19:07] <kiko> I think if you're going to list them in a public channel they had better be public
[19:07] <kiko> I think
[19:07] <Ursinha> kiko, +1
[19:07] <sinzui> +1
[19:07] <kiko> an the beautiful sound of consensus
[19:07] <matsubara> please assignees disclose your bugs if you think they're ok to be public
[19:08] <matsubara> [TOPIC] * Oops report & Critical Bugs (matsubara/ursinha)
[19:08] <MootBot> New Topic:  * Oops report & Critical Bugs (matsubara/ursinha)
[19:08] <Ursinha> bugs for today: 259440 (MailinglistApiView), 263672, 260206 (resolve_lp_path), 260140 (revisions.atom), 160236 and 174368 (last two pretty much the same)
[19:08] <Ursinha> bug 259440, it was CP but already causing a lot of oopses in production, barry?
[19:09] <barry> Ursinha: no more than it was, but the oops reports are much smaller now
[19:09] <thumper> bug 260140 bounced pqm due to conflict, resolving as we speak and resubmitting
[19:09] <matsubara> [ACTION] matsubara to add a note in the MeetingAgenda page about disclosing private bugs that will be discussed during the meeting
[19:09] <MootBot> ACTION received:  matsubara to add a note in the MeetingAgenda page about disclosing private bugs that will be discussed during the meeting
[19:09] <Ursinha> i saw a lot
[19:09] <barry> Ursinha: flacoste and i have discussed further refinements to (hopefully) eliminate the oopses
[19:09] <kiko> barry, so it still times out, but less often?
[19:09] <barry> kiko: i think so
[19:09] <Ursinha> kiko, considering the oopses, yes
[19:09] <Ursinha> but there are a lot still
[19:09] <barry> kiko: many fewer queries, but the ones it does still take a long time
[19:10] <thumper> the resolve_lp_path was being worked on by mwhudson, I'll chase the status
[19:10] <Ursinha> thanks thumper
[19:10] <Ursinha> barry, so you're working on it?
[19:10] <matsubara> [ACTION] thumper to chase status of resolve_lp_path bug
[19:10] <MootBot> ACTION received:  thumper to chase status of resolve_lp_path bug
[19:10] <kiko> thanks thumper really
[19:10] <barry> Ursinha: can you open a new bug and attach some of the latest oopses?
[19:10] <Ursinha> barry, sure
[19:10] <matsubara> [ACTION] barry to work on more refinements for MailingListAPIView bug
[19:10] <MootBot> ACTION received:  barry to work on more refinements for MailingListAPIView bug
[19:10] <barry> Ursinha: not at the moment, but it's on the list!
[19:11] <barry> thanks
[19:11] <Ursinha> barry, ok... i'll file the bug and send you
[19:11] <Ursinha> ok, next
[19:11] <Ursinha> bug 263672, matsubara filed this one and asked salgado about it, it seems that it belongs to Bugs. Anyone from bugs to take care of it
[19:11] <Ursinha> maybe BjornT
[19:12] <Ursinha> anyone?
[19:12]  * Ursinha pokes bugs team
[19:12] <kiko> oh how interesting
[19:12] <kiko> is that a bug in the merge code I wonder?
[19:12] <stub> I normally fix them
[19:12] <kiko> stub, salgado: is this a case in which we can't automatically handle it?
[19:12] <sinzui> kiko: I think so
[19:12] <stub> It means we have a unique constraint to handle, or handle better.
[19:13]  * Ursinha pokes salgado 
[19:13] <salgado> Ursinha, stub already explained
[19:13] <Ursinha> okay so
[19:13] <kiko> yeah
[19:13] <salgado> he knows that a lot better than myself
[19:13] <kiko> and I think stub's volunteering
[19:13] <stub> Ok
[19:14] <Ursinha> so the last one
[19:14] <matsubara> [ACTION] stub to fix bug on account merging raising db constraint
[19:14] <MootBot> ACTION received:  stub to fix bug on account merging raising db constraint
[19:14] <Ursinha> two actually
[19:14] <stub> Other people are welcome to learn how it all works though ;)
[19:14] <matsubara> MootBot is really handy
[19:14] <Ursinha> bug 160236 and 174368, similar oopses happened yesterday. Can anyone of foundations take care of it?
[19:14] <Ursinha> matsubara, indeed
[19:14] <Ursinha> these bugs are about problem when searching for bugs
[19:15] <Ursinha> bug 174368
[19:15] <matsubara> Ursinha: that's another one for stub perhaps?
[19:15] <stub> So there is this really disgusting python method embedded as a string in fti.py.... it transforms the query string a human enters into tsearch2 syntax.
[19:15] <flacoste> stub: feel like revamping the fti regexp?
[19:15] <stub> I hate revamping that.
[19:15] <stub> Its a pile of poo
[19:16] <flacoste> time for redesign maybe?
[19:16] <stub> I'd love someone who knows how to do tokenization properly to have a go, but I can patch it :)
[19:16] <Ursinha> hm, good
[19:16] <Ursinha> ok
[19:16] <Ursinha> this is all for now guys
[19:16] <Ursinha> thanks a lot
[19:16] <kiko> stub, does jtv know how to do that?
[19:16] <kiko> I know he is a genius at some sorts of things
[19:17] <jtv> kiko: I know nothing
[19:17] <kiko> jtv, brownie points--
[19:17] <matsubara> [ACTION] stub to patch our fti regexp
[19:17] <stub> Its not magic - you just need to transform (foo AND bar OR (baz AND NOT boom) to foo & bar | (baz & ! boom)
[19:17] <MootBot> ACTION received:  stub to patch our fti regexp
[19:17] <jtv> stub: can we talk about this, oh, tomorrow?
[19:17] <stub> And probably pull out the hyphenation crack
[19:18] <stub> yer
[19:18] <matsubara> ok. moving on then. thanks Ursinha. Thanks everyone.
[19:18] <matsubara> [ACTION] stub and jtv to discuss a proper fix to our fti regexp (bug 174368)
[19:18] <MootBot> ACTION received:  stub and jtv to discuss a proper fix to our fti regexp (bug 174368)
[19:18] <matsubara> [TOPIC] * Operations report (mthaddon/herb/spm)
[19:18] <MootBot> New Topic:  * Operations report (mthaddon/herb/spm)
[19:19] <mthaddon> • CP to xmlrpc-internal that has reduced size of xmlrpc-internal oopses
[19:19] <mthaddon> • Have begun work on migrating to new version of psycopg2
[19:19] <mthaddon> • App servers still dying, but as above may help
[19:19] <mthaddon> • Codebrowse still having issues, but not as many as immediately after the rollout
[19:19] <mthaddon> • In the process of migrating RF branches (where possible) to be hosted on LP itself
[19:19] <mthaddon> • Any comments on jamesh' suggestion that some branches can be removed from RF?
[19:19] <mthaddon> • IS sprint next week means we'll all be in London (i.e. on the same timezone)
[19:19] <mthaddon> • That's it from the LOSA team unless there are any questions
[19:19] <kiko> ooooh, utf-8 bullets
[19:19] <stub> If the test suite passes without em, they aren't needed
[19:19] <kiko> mthaddon, is psycopg2 on staging?
[19:19] <kiko> ah, it's the same appservers
[19:20] <mthaddon> kiko, it is, yes
[19:20] <kiko> mthaddon, and crashes since?
[19:20] <matsubara> those bullets come from tomboy, I presume
[19:20] <mthaddon> kiko, hasn't crashed since
[19:20] <mthaddon> matsubara, correct!
[19:20] <kiko> no way!
[19:20] <mthaddon> kiko, hasn't been on that long though
[19:21] <kiko> still...!
[19:21] <matsubara> I guess, I can move on then. thanks mthaddon and LOSAs
[19:21] <matsubara> [TOPIC] * DBA report (stub)
[19:21] <MootBot> New Topic:  * DBA report (stub)
[19:21] <kiko> thanks guys
[19:21] <stub> DB patch reviews in my queue where discussed with Mark and all approved. I'll be sending out the reviews with any necessary tweaks tomorrow. At least one has come in after the cutoff (which I haven't looked at yet). I'll see if I can get approval for it to land this cycle, but it might have to wait until next.
[19:21] <stub> The read-only-launchpad branch has finally landed, yay. getUtility(IZStorm).get('main') now blows up. I need to update the wiki pages when I find them.
[19:21] <stub> Done.
[19:22] <kiko> stub, it landed today, so we should be on the lookout tomorrow, right?
[19:22] <kiko> i.e. staging and edge issues
[19:22] <stub> Yup
[19:22] <stub> There are config changes...
[19:22] <flacoste> stub: any formal QA we can do on it?
[19:22] <mthaddon> stub, anything we need to be aware of?
[19:22] <stub> I think I got them right :)
[19:22] <mthaddon> stub, such as chokecherry is now a production machine? :)
[19:22] <kiko> FLW
[19:22] <stub> mthaddon: Nothing you can't work out ;)
[19:23] <stub> mthaddon: The appservers still only talk to a single database, despite there being config for a master and a slave
[19:23] <stub> mthaddon: Which is why the connection strings should be identical
[19:23] <mthaddon> ok, cool
[19:24] <matsubara> stub: so, no QA needed for the read-only db yet?
[19:24] <kiko> well
[19:24] <kiko> keep an eye on production
[19:25] <stub> It should still work tomorrow like it does today.
[19:25] <kiko> that's what he meant :)
[19:25] <matsubara> ok. thanks stub.
[19:25] <matsubara> [TOPIC] * Sysadmin requests (Rinchen)
[19:25] <MootBot> New Topic:  * Sysadmin requests (Rinchen)
[19:26] <matsubara> if you have any outstanding RT, let me know and I'll forward those to Joey and/or IS
[19:26] <kiko> now that psycopg2 is delivered and I have salgado's list
[19:26] <kiko> I think I'm a happy camper!
[19:26] <kiko> salgado, you got that yesterday mid-stream?
[19:26] <salgado> kiko, I did.  will write the SQL to delete the unused ones today
[19:27] <matsubara> all right, moving on then
[19:27] <matsubara> [TOPIC] * New packages required (salgado)
[19:27] <MootBot> New Topic:  * New packages required (salgado)
[19:27] <salgado> anything for me this week?
[19:27] <salgado> I didn't hear back whether or not we need to depend on the new psycopg2 package
[19:27] <salgado> does anybody know for sure?  I'm pretty sure we do
[19:27] <kiko> salgado, let's wait to see how it handles production first
[19:28] <salgado> ok
[19:28] <matsubara> ok. thanks salgado
[19:28] <stub> We do, or we need to revert my branch for the test suite to pass
[19:28] <flacoste> it's already deployed on PQM
[19:28] <flacoste> so that shouldn't be a problem
[19:28] <kiko> but if it's okay by monday then I say yes
[19:28] <kiko> just to avoid the shell-shock of downgrading
[19:29] <stub> Yer, but devs who haven't updated could trip over it.
[19:29] <salgado> I guess stub meant for the tests to pass locally
[19:29] <kiko> maybe I'm being too careful?
[19:29] <matsubara> [TOPIC] Improving review kwality - bigjools
[19:29] <MootBot> New Topic:  Improving review kwality - bigjools
[19:30] <mthaddon> stub, so is the new psycopg2 going to be a dependency on edge from tomorrow?
[19:30] <bigjools> ok
[19:30] <kiko> mthaddon, unless we don't roll out..
[19:30] <bigjools> are you done? :)
[19:30] <mthaddon> i.e. yes
[19:30] <stub> I don't think so, no. Our test suite excercises the bug now purely by accident
[19:30] <mthaddon> ah, okay
[19:30] <kiko> ah
[19:31] <bigjools> So, the issue of quality of reviews came up recently
[19:31] <bigjools> I talked to Barry and Bjorn and we have some things to propose
[19:31] <flacoste> quality of reviews or of branches submitted to review?
[19:31] <bigjools> reviews
[19:31] <flacoste> interesting!
[19:31] <kiko> damn, busted
[19:32] <bigjools> the upshot is that reviewers need to:
[19:32] <bigjools> 1. ask more questions and not take the dev's word for things
[19:32] <bigjools> 2. the reviewer should try and call the dev if it's a non-trivial branch, so they can discuss it
[19:33] <bigjools> 3. Team leads should allow time for their members OCR in planning
[19:33] <bigjools> (I know Francis does this already)
[19:33] <bigjools> and lastly, we should consider doing half or 3/4 day shifts to reduce OCR workload
[19:34] <bigjools> any questions?
[19:34] <kiko> I don't understand the last point
[19:34] <barry> taking into account that there /will/ be review follow ups
[19:34] <bigjools> what he said
[19:34] <kiko> I am all for questions and calls fwiw
[19:34] <bigjools> full day OCR is tiring
[19:34] <sinzui> bigjools: I have mastered asking stupid questions, does that count?
[19:34] <bigjools> sinzui: there's no such thing as a stupid question
[19:34] <sinzui> bigjools: yes this is.
[19:35] <flacoste> lol
[19:35]  * sinzui looks for his list
[19:35] <kiko> bigjools, well... yes, but so is other sorts of work
[19:35] <kiko> bigjools, and full day OCR AIUI doesn't actually mean 8h of reviews
[19:35] <flacoste> indeed, we should aim for half or 3/4 of work days
[19:35] <bigjools> kiko: there should be enough reviewers to spread the load a bit more evenly
[19:35] <kiko> though it may feel like 12h of them :)
[19:35] <flacoste> since there /will/ be overtime :-)
[19:35] <bigjools> I get the feeling that some of them do the lion's share
[19:35] <barry> kiko: ask sinzui about that :)
[19:36] <bigjools> *cough* Fridays *cough* :)
[19:36] <kiko> fridays are overrated
[19:36] <kiko> every day feels like friday to me
[19:36] <bigjools> anyway that's it from me, I just wanted to raise awareness of this issue
[19:36] <matsubara> [ACTION] update reviewers process to account for half or 3/4 of work days for on call reviewing
[19:36] <MootBot> ACTION received:  update reviewers process to account for half or 3/4 of work days for on call reviewing
[19:37] <kiko> bigjools, thanks for bringing it up, more seriously. I know this bothers us from time to time and we need to address a process for review feedback
[19:37] <bigjools> indeed
[19:37] <barry> kiko: +1
[19:37] <matsubara> thanks bigjools. moving on.
[19:37] <matsubara> [TOPIC] matsubara - early pre release QA
[19:37] <MootBot> New Topic:  matsubara - early pre release QA
[19:37] <barry> btw, anybody can ping me any time if they want to talk about reviews they're doing or reviews they're getting
[19:37] <Ursinha> awesome
[19:37] <matsubara> so, how's the early pre release QA coming? What do you guys think about it? Is it helping? How can Ursinha and I help more there?
[19:39] <kiko> has anyone done any pre-release QA?
[19:39] <kiko> :)
[19:39] <matsubara> kiko: yes!
[19:39] <flacoste> my team has
[19:39] <Ursinha> kiko, foundations, i guess
[19:39] <Ursinha> :)
[19:39]  * thumper raises his hand
[19:39] <salgado> I did!
[19:39] <matsubara> soyuz had
[19:39] <cprov-afk> yes, soyuz did.
[19:39] <bac> yes.
[19:39] <matsubara> but there are still lots of items there in NEEDSTESTING
[19:39] <flacoste> kiko: have you, that's the question?
[19:40] <kiko> I haven't fixed any bugs, I'm afraid
[19:40] <kiko> matsubara, who are the biggest offenders?
[19:40] <matsubara> Please do contact me or Ursinha to help with testing.
[19:40] <Ursinha> yes, please
[19:40] <kiko> well
[19:40] <kiko> I'm asking to figure out if somebody doesn't know about PRQA yet
[19:41] <jtv> kiko: Translations knows
[19:41] <Ursinha> kiko, matsubara sent emails to the teams
[19:41] <matsubara> I have had no answer from code and translations
[19:41] <kiko> the usual culprits! easternlings
[19:41] <kiko> jtv, thumper: so.. you guys not doing it?
[19:41] <kiko> jtv, thumper: the expectation is for the tests to be done 24h from the landing
[19:41]  * thumper has only just landed something
[19:41] <jtv> kiko: yes, we just learned about it though
[19:41] <thumper> I'll poke the team
[19:42] <Ursinha> great thumper
[19:42] <kiko> thumper, thanks, please help us get everybody on the same pageeee
[19:42] <matsubara> thanks guys, and please, if you guys are too busy with coding, let us know and we can land a pair of hand for testing stuff, but you need to let us know!
[19:42] <matsubara> and the final topic
[19:43] <matsubara> [TOPIC] BCTL - kiko
[19:43] <MootBot> New Topic:  BCTL - kiko
[19:43] <kiko> okay
[19:43] <kiko> I don't want to remind people of this again
[19:43] <kiko> but tomorrow is the deadline for BCTL
[19:43] <kiko> if you are confused ask your team lead
[19:43] <kiko> it means a lot though
[19:43] <kiko> kthxbye!
[19:44]  * beuno wonders what BCTL is
[19:44] <matsubara> well, that's it then. thanks everyone
[19:44] <matsubara> Thank you all for attending this week's Launchpad Developer Meeting. See the channel topic for the location of the logs.
[19:44] <matsubara> #endmeeting
[19:44] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 13:44.
[19:44]  * abentley votes for Big Chees Taco Land.
[19:44] <mrevell> nice work matsubara
[19:44] <matsubara> right on time! cool
[19:45] <barry> Badly Coordinated Transactional Lobsters
[19:45]  * thumper is confused with BCTL
[19:45] <thumper> perhaps it is just the early morning
[19:45] <mrevell> Big chested... No, I shan't go on
[19:45] <stub> thumper: Ask your team lead.... oh...
[19:45] <thumper> :)
[19:45] <beuno>  /me emails the marketing director about it
[19:46] <thumper> Badly Coordinated Team Leads?
[19:46] <bigjools> lol
[19:46] <flacoste> thumper: i think that's the one