[04:00] <chillywilly> what can I run that will tell me what repo a package is in?
[04:01] <RAOF_> apt-cache policy $MYPACKAGE
[04:01] <RAOF_> Gives you all available versions of MYPACKAGE, their priorities, and the archive they're from.
[04:13] <nhandler> chillywilly: You can also use 'apt-cache madison PACKAGE'
[04:31] <lifeless> or rmadison PACKAGE
[04:33] <nhandler> lifeless: rmadison just shows what version of the package is in each version of Ubuntu. It doesn't show if the package is in main, restricted, universe, or multiverse.
[04:35] <lifeless> nhandler: they are suites, not repositories; if you want to be pedantic :P
[04:45] <NCommander> hey nhandler, what's up?
[04:47] <nhandler> Nothing much NCommander. I'm working on figuring out how to get some of the packages I touched to build from source again.
[04:47] <NCommander> nhandler, build log? I"ll handle it
[04:49] <nhandler> NCommander: I would rather figure out how to fix it myself. It will be a good learning experience.
[04:49] <NCommander> nhandler, I can give you a hint if you want?
[04:49] <NCommander> s/?/.
[04:56] <nhandler> NCommander: I'm currently working on taskjuggler. Here is the i386 build log: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/17091043/buildlog_ubuntu-intrepid-i386.taskjuggler_2.4.1-1ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz. It is complaining about missing KDEPIM, so I assume I need to add a Build-Depends
[04:57] <NCommander> kdelibs4-dev: missing
[04:57] <NCommander> libkcal2-dev: missing
[04:57] <NCommander> libkcal2-dev: does not exist
[07:13] <dholbach> gooood morning
[07:17] <ajmitch> hi dholbach
[07:17] <dholbach> hi ajmitch
[07:18] <devfil> dholbach: hi
[07:18] <dholbach> heya devfil
[07:19] <highvoltage> gooood morning to you too!
[07:25] <dholbach> hiya highvoltage :)
[07:33] <ara> dholbach: morning, how did yesterday session end?
[07:34] <dholbach> ara: I'm just writing the summary of yesterday's day :-)
[07:34] <dholbach> ara: which session do you want to know more about?
[07:34] <ara> dholbach: the fixing an ubuntu bug one
[07:35] <dholbach> ara: oh, we managed to fix two bugs and lots of good patches turned up at the end of the session (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/devweek0809/FixingBugs2 the log)
[07:35] <ara> dholbach: cool, I'll have a look to the logs
[07:35] <dholbach> people were clearly excited at the prospect of really being able to make a difference and make Ubuntu a better place :)
[07:38] <lucas> dholbach: I feel guilty. During debconf, jorge castro mentioned you (about harvest), and I couldn't understand that he was talking about you. It's funny how people make up their own pronounciations for names and then stick to them. :)
[07:39] <slangasek> hole-back? ;)
[07:39] <dholbach> lucas: Guilt for what? Misunderstanding my name? :-)
[07:39] <StevenK> Haha
[07:39] <dholbach> slangasek: that's exactly how 90% of all Ubuntu people pronounce it
[07:39] <dholbach> lots of people on IRC even type  dholback
[07:40] <lucas> dholbach: not realizing he was talking about you :-)
[07:40] <lucas> "<lucas> I don't think I know him"
[07:40] <dholbach> but I don't blame anybody, I even get letters for Mr Holbert, Holbers, Holba, ...
[07:40] <dholbach> lucas: haha :-)
[07:40] <slangasek> I've received mail for Mr. Langster
[07:40] <StevenK> dholbach: "Mr Dholbach" ? :-)
[07:41] <dholbach> slangasek: props to the post service! :)
[07:41] <slangasek> and I receive all kinds of IRC messages for someone named "sladen" ;)
[07:41] <dholbach> StevenK: or since I have the domain name some people referred to me as "Daniel Holba"
[07:41] <dholbach> haha
[07:41] <StevenK> slangasek: Haha!
[07:42] <lucas> well, yesterday I had to spell out my name on the phone, and it turns out that I'm the only "nussbaum" in lyon. The guy didn't even ask for my firstname for confirmation.
[07:42] <slangasek> heh
[07:46] <dholbach> lucas: I absolve you from your sins. :-)
[07:46] <lucas> thanks :)
[07:47] <slangasek> dholbach: dude, sweet power, do they give that to everyone on the community team?
[07:47] <dholbach> slangasek: "I feel guilty" seemed to require an action from me
[07:47] <slangasek> haha
[07:48] <dholbach> slangasek: also I'm not sure the metal-heads on the community team should have that power
[07:48] <slangasek> :-)
[08:03] <zoeken> i need help joining motu
[08:03] <zoeken> i don't understand the process.
[08:10] <zoeken> hello......
[08:11] <dholbach> zoeken: did you check out  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted ?
[08:11] <dholbach> it's not necessary to join a team before starting to make Ubuntu better
[08:11] <dholbach> the page links to all kind of documentation that's helpful on the way
[08:12] <zoeken> yeah i checked it out.......
[08:12] <dholbach> Packaging Guide, other documentation, links to lists of bugs that should be easy to start off with and how to get fixes uploaded into Ubuntu
[08:12] <dholbach> which process do you need help with?
[08:13] <zoeken> i followed the tutorial of how to create a simple package.....
[08:14] <zoeken> but i don't understand what i should do in order to gain membership.
[08:14] <dholbach> the process is pretty easy:
[08:15] <dholbach>  - work on making Ubuntu better
[08:15] <dholbach>  - get your work reviewed and uploaded by sponsors
[08:15] <dholbach>  - repeat until you hear a lot of "hey, you're really good, you should apply for membership" from everybody :)
[08:15] <dholbach> then apply :)
[08:16] <zoeken> sponsors who are they?
[08:16] <zoeken> how to get my work reviewed?
[08:16] <dholbach> check out the SponsorshipProcess page
[08:16] <dholbach> it's linked from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted
[08:19] <zoeken> i will check the link.........and inform u, thank u.
[08:19] <dholbach> Excellent - if you have any questions, be sure to ask here.
[08:22] <zoeken> how to find a sponsor?
[08:22] <dholbach> it's explained on that wiki page
[08:39] <didrocks> morning everyone \o/
[08:41] <iulian> Good morning
[09:09] <stefanlsd> Whats the correct procedure when doing something in a PPA to test something for a specific user?  I would like to rebuild a package for him to test, but I have some other guys using my PPA and i dont particulary want them to get the package. does PPA cater for this, or should i be getting him the .debs some other way?
[09:09] <Hobbsee> surely that's a question for those who do ppa...ie, #launchpad.
[09:09] <Hobbsee> but, afaik, you can't stop people getting certain packages without apt pinning, etc.
[09:10] <stefanlsd> Hobbsee: thanks, will ask in #launchpad
[09:22] <huats> morning everyone !
[09:22] <stefanlsd> with these tests that im doing, i am incrementing the ubuntu# at the end.  i dont expect them to make it into intrepid, when the package is updated in intrepid - probably ubuntu1, what happens to the guys that have an ubuntu2 in my ppa?
[09:24] <persia> stefanlsd: They keep the PPA package, and never get upgraded.  This is part of why PPAs are currently discouraged for testing a package for direct import to the archives, and many people suggest using ~ppaX versioning.
[09:29] <stefanlsd> persia: kk. thanks for pointing that out, so i should be doing  package-(rev)ubuntu(rev)~ppa(ver)?
[09:29] <persia> stefanlsd: That is one option that is known to preserve upgrades.
[09:33] <stefanlsd> persia: thanks. i think i will do that in future.
[10:19] <dholbach> devfil: CONGRATULATIONS :)
[10:19] <devfil> dholbach: really thanks :)
[10:20] <jpds> devfil: congrats!
[10:24] <iulian> devfil: Congratulations!
[10:24]  * devfil says a general thanks to all :)
[10:25] <mok0> Way to go, devfil!
[10:25] <DktrKranz> devfil: remember... your first upload MUST be a SRU...
[10:26] <dholbach> DktrKranz: a sponsorship item!
[10:26] <devfil> DktrKranz: to gei it rejected?
[10:26] <devfil> s/gei/get/
[10:26] <wgrant> A sponsored SRU!
[10:26] <dholbach> wgrant: deal :)
[10:26] <DktrKranz> dholbach: oh... let's say a sponsored SRU then
[10:26] <DktrKranz> wgrant: heh :D
[10:26] <devfil> DktrKranz: your package must be approved.... lol
[10:26] <dholbach> devfil: but no pressure.... :-)
[10:27] <DktrKranz> you only have three minutes left, or your MOTUship will expire
[10:27] <devfil> dholbach: I'm fighting with xfs+grub/lilo at the moment...
[10:27] <dholbach> DktrKranz: give Devid some time for testing :)
[10:27] <devfil> DktrKranz: WTF!
[10:28] <DktrKranz> dholbach: just because it's you
[10:28]  * dholbach strangles DktrKranz with passion
[10:28]  * DktrKranz hides
[10:28] <DktrKranz> btw, congrats devfil
[10:28]  * devfil think that all people is going to hugs dholbach...again :P
[10:28] <DktrKranz> now... wxwidgets is not ours anymore!
[10:28] <mok0> Ugh, dholbach hope you're not that cannibal guy...
[10:29]  * dholbach hugs y'all back
[10:29] <dholbach> mok0: cannibal guy? I hope you're not confusing me with jono
[10:29] <mok0> hehe
[10:29] <iulian> Is he a cannibal?
[10:29] <dholbach> at day he's "community community community" all over the place, at night though...
[10:30] <iulian> Hah
[10:30]  * dholbach won't go into too much detail about the slaughtered cats in Wolverhampton and his metal friends
[10:30] <wgrant> Daniel Balmer-Holbach?
[10:30] <dholbach> wgrant: I was talking about Jono
[10:30] <DktrKranz> jono: are you hungry? fresh MOTU blood here... very good at taste
[10:30] <wgrant> dholbach: Oops.
[10:31] <mok0> Oohh vampires even...
[10:31]  * devfil hides :P
[10:31] <wgrant> So that's what UDS is for.
[10:31] <wgrant> Collecting fresh MOTU blood.
[10:31] <wgrant> For the community team to consume.
[10:31] <mok0> Fortunately, I have green slime in my veins...
[10:33] <dholbach> quick... all behave now... there might be new folks from Ubuntu Developer Week here
[10:33] <wgrant> Run away!
[10:33] <DktrKranz> wgrant: I think I'll take baths with garlic fragrance from now on, just to make sure to have an horrible taste
[10:34] <mok0> garlic, mmmmmm
[10:34]  * iulian dances
[10:43]  * warp10 announces to all the contributor and prospective developer that devfil will now be happy to sponsor everything is needed to be sponsored. Please, feel free to ping him whenever you need! 0:-)
[10:43] <devfil> warp10: LOOOL
[10:43] <DktrKranz> warp10: revenge is sweet :)
[10:44] <warp10> DktrKranz: man, how true! :)
[10:46] <DktrKranz> and with devfil, italian MOTU approved within a year raise to six! \o/
[10:46] <NCommander> devfil, welcome to MOTU
[10:46] <NCommander> BTW, DktrKranz & warp10, I applied for UUC, comments wanted
[10:46]  * NCommander is going to apply for MOTU in October
[10:47] <DktrKranz> NCommander: already answered...
[10:47] <NCommander> you did?
[10:47] <NCommander> you did
[10:47] <DktrKranz> yes
[10:47] <NCommander> \o/
[10:47] <NCommander> Now we just need to do the gnat-4.2 hardy transition
[10:48] <DktrKranz> indeed, now we're in feature freeze, I have some times during weekend to do that
[10:48] <jono> hehe
[10:48] <jono> crazy people :)
[10:48] <jono> dholbach: damn you :)
[10:48] <DktrKranz> jono: enjoy your meal... ehm.. good morning :)
[10:48] <jono> DktrKranz: hehe
[10:49] <jono> I did bite my lip yesterday, if that counts :)
[10:49] <mok0> crunch, crunch, jono
[10:49] <DktrKranz> jono: self-eating is not considered
[10:49] <jono> hehe
[10:49] <jono> damn
[10:49] <jono> :)
[10:50] <jono> how is MOTU land this morning?
[10:51] <highvoltage> sunny
[10:51] <highvoltage> with a light breeze
[10:51] <NCommander> DktrKranz, all the packages are in my PPA expect gnatgps which will be "fun" since it has a policy violation in it
[10:51] <mok0> high-spirited as you can see....
[10:52] <NCommander> DktrKranz, I'll leave it to you, I have my fun bootstrapping Ubuntu amd64-pie
[10:53] <huats> stupid question : but I have modified a configure.ac file. In order that it is take into account do I need to do anything special (when i am building a package)
[10:53] <NCommander> huats, you need to rerun autofun and friends
[10:53] <huats> NCommander: sure
[10:53] <huats> NCommander: that was my guess...
[10:53] <NCommander> Well
[10:53] <DktrKranz> NCommander: IIRC gnat-gps is just a leaf, core packages are already in it
[10:54] <NCommander> Some people put the results in a patch, so autotools don't need to be run in the build-dep
[10:54] <NCommander> The desktop team does that for instance
[10:54] <mok0> huats: and you need a clean target that removes all the auto-generated stuff again
[10:55] <huats> NCommander: ok
[10:55] <huats> I'll do that I think
[10:55] <huats> mok0: ok
[10:55] <huats> thanks
[10:55] <NCommander> If you use CDBS, it has automatic rules to do extactly that
[10:55] <huats> NCommander: indeed
[10:55] <huats> the package uses CDBS
[10:56] <mok0> ... In fact, it would be really useful if dpkg-buildpackage had a switch telling it to ignore changes outside of debian/
[10:56] <huats> NCommander: so no need for the clean rule right ?
[10:56] <NCommander> mok0, dpkg-source --exclude
[10:56] <mok0> NCommander: no, when building the source package
[10:56] <NCommander> mok0, yeah, if you build it with dpkg-source (which is what debuild -S calls), you can do it
[10:57] <NCommander> huats, I had to add one since the CDBS package wasn't completely perfect w.r.t. doing the cleaning, but generally, yeah
[10:57] <huats> NCommander: ok
[10:57] <huats> thanks
[10:57] <mok0> NCommander, ah, I will try that next time...
[11:12]  * dholbach needs to take a look at the MOTU and uuc Map again
[11:12] <dholbach> seems that Italy is taking over :)
[11:17] <DktrKranz> yay!
[11:17] <DktrKranz> dholbach: we're pushing more blood, be prepared :)
[11:18] <dholbach> I need to start running those regular Bug Jams in Berlin
[11:19] <mok0> We better not loose sight of the PPC platform... news today about a $120 PPC based mini-laptop running Linux
[11:20] <mok0> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKQbN6tpYXw
[11:20]  * dholbach hasn't booted his PPC since Edgy
[11:22] <mok0> dholbach: you mean it's still running?
[11:23] <dholbach> mok0: still running edgy? yes, I suppose so, I never fired it up again since then :)
[11:23] <dholbach> it's a very old machine :)
[11:23] <mok0> heh
[11:23] <dholbach> but it ran Xubuntu just fine
[11:40] <torkel> yeah, it would be nice if PPC was supported again. We have a couple of Cell blades I would prefer to run Ubuntu on. And a few Power6 blades too
[11:41] <gnomefreak> what team do we use for sync requests?
[11:42] <cjwatson> gnomefreak: requestsync should figure it out for you; but, if not authorised to upload to the relevant component, then ubuntu-universe-sponsors or ubuntu-main-sponsors depending on the component; if authorised to upload, then ubuntu-archive
[11:42] <gnomefreak> cjwatson: thanks
[12:01] <directhex> torkel, what do you use cell for?
[12:03] <torkel> directhex: research, mostly on //-algorithms
[12:04] <directhex> torkel, are those the original 32-bit-only SPE's, or the latest gen with proper double precision support?
[12:05] <torkel> directhex: both. We got 4 QS22 a few weeks ago, and we had 2 QS21 earlier.
[12:06] <ogra> mok0, thats not PPC ... its a MIPS cpu
[12:06] <mok0> ogra: yeah you are right.
[12:07] <directhex> torkel, interesting. done any work on algo design using GPGPU stuff as well?
[12:08] <torkel> directhex: well, I'm only administrating those bastards, but I think some of the researchers here are involved it that area too
[12:13] <ogra> mok0, its sweet though ... i want one :)
[12:13] <ogra> $98 is what 65€ ? ... heh
[12:13] <torkel> directhex: some of the guys are involved in OpenCL
[12:17] <mok0> ogra: ... but probably meant for the chinese market, don't you think?
[12:18] <ogra> mok0, well, as long as they have a usable en_** keyboard
[12:18] <directhex> you can get ultra-cheap MIPS laptops outside china, you know
[12:18] <mok0> ogra: Yeah... that's what the chinese use to construct their characters afaiu
[12:19] <directhex> a bit more expensive, mind
[12:19] <mok0> I'm kinda sweet on the EEE 901
[12:19] <mok0> Would like one for travelling etc
[12:20] <directhex> http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=225532&source=1 is nice and non-x86, if you hate x86 for some reason
[12:20] <mok0> So I don't risk loosing my 10x more expensive laptop with all family pictures etc.
[12:20] <directhex> mok0, i'm not sure which netbook i'd buy right now with my money. probably an acer
[12:20] <mok0> directhex: more expensive, though
[12:21] <directhex> mok0, acer versus asus? or the minibook?
[12:21] <mok0> directhex: acer vs. asus
[12:21]  * jussi01 chimes in with "the new dell is nice..." (and has ubuntu)
[12:21] <directhex> jussi01, not in .uk
[12:21] <mok0> jussi01: can you buy that one now?
[12:21] <ogra> http://hvsco.com has a good bunch of intresting netbooks btw
[12:21] <jussi01> mok0: yeah, i think so
[12:22] <ogra> (they are the manufacturer it seems)
[12:22] <directhex> mok0, asus 901: £293.14
[12:22] <jussi01> mok0: http://www.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/laptop-inspiron-9?c=us&l=en&s=dhs&cs=19
[12:22] <mok0> Can you run Vista on those? :-P
[12:23] <directhex> personally i'm stoked for the dell e4200. weighs the same as the netbook, but it's a core 2 with 12" screen
[12:23] <directhex> and if work are paying, why not treat myself? ;)
[12:23] <mok0> directhex: by all means, go for it ;-)
[12:24] <directhex> mok0, still "coming soon" on dell.co.uk :(
[12:25] <mok0> Kudos to ASUS though, for starting this whole trend
[12:25] <directhex> http://www1.euro.dell.com/content/products/productdetails.aspx/laptop_latitude_e4200?c=uk&cs=RC1059030&l=en - IMHO one sexy computer
[12:25] <mok0> Good for Linux, baaaaaad for MS
[12:25] <mok0> directhex: nice
[12:26] <directhex> mok0, yeah, but i'm somewhat suspicious - asus don't know their arse from their kernel. i really think the linux choice is just a way to force cheap xp pricing. which, oh look, they got
[12:26] <mok0> (talking about the girl)
[12:26] <directhex> and now it's hard to find the linux models in the uk compared to windows
[12:26] <ogra> mok0, intel started the trend 1/2 year before asus with the classmate PC
[12:27]  * ogra finds it odd that asus gets all the credit for that
[12:27] <directhex> 9/10 of business is marketing. the classmate was never targeted at the general public
[12:27] <ogra> right ...
[12:27] <ogra> but its the granddaddy of all netbooks :)
[12:27] <mok0> ogra: except, when launched as a "classmate" pc it sounds more like a toy thing. Asus got it right with the "in a lady's handbag" approach
[12:27] <directhex> apple get all the credit for making mp3 players big, but weren't first in anything to do with them, as an example
[12:28] <ogra> yeah, its all marketing indeed
[12:28] <mok0> indeed
[12:28] <directhex> the classmate was an attempt to make an XP-based XO for white kids. the eee was an attempt to sell a laptop to the world & his wife
[12:28] <directhex> and their dog
[12:28] <ogra> oh and btw, VIA actually invented the netbook ... they had a model at computex even before intel had the cmpc
[12:28] <directhex> netbooks kinda live in the second category, even if the kit's the same as the first
[12:28] <ogra> but that never went in production
[12:29] <directhex> via never put things into production. i hear they've had "post-1996 performance" designs sat on a shelf for years!
[12:29] <mok0> But with more and more hazzle travelling, for example in the US they can now confiscate your laptop in the ariport, it makes sense to have a second cheap mini netbook for travelling
[12:29] <ogra> you cant compare the classmate and the XO
[12:29] <ogra> and classmate was never supposed to be XP based
[12:29] <directhex> same target markets. and now with XO shipping with xp...
[12:29] <mok0> ... and leave your big whopping 17" screen thing at home :-)
[12:29] <ogra> XP was always an alternative t the existing linux solutions on the classmate
[12:30] <ogra> and still costs you $50-60 more
[12:30] <mok0> The XO is fcked, imho
[12:30] <ogra> which is quite critical for schools
[12:30] <ogra> mok0, thats by design
[12:30] <ogra> they had some immensely good ideas
[12:31] <mok0> ogra: well they caved in to MS, changing their design specs etc
[12:31] <ogra> and if it would have gone as reserach project it would probably still exist ... but X0 never had any distribution plans etc
[12:31] <ogra> the manuafacturers should simply have joined forces
[12:32] <mok0> ogra: they are scared shitless
[12:32] <mok0> ogra: MS can take away their business any day they please
[12:33] <ogra> intel made an attempt, they had the better HW for the same price but less good ideas and a lot less infrastructure around it ... asus suddenly held the market ... if intel, MIT and asusu would have joined forces you could have gotten something awesome for the kids
[12:33] <mok0> ogra: however, if manufacturers joined forces they could win
[12:33] <ogra> yeah
[12:34] <ogra> but that didnt/doesnt happen ... money involved instead of spirit breaks that
[12:34] <ogra> as if all of them wouldnt earn enough ... tsk
[12:34] <mok0> Otoh, China is such  a big market, that increasingly, the manufacturers such as Asus, don't need to care to much about MS
[12:35] <directhex> so when will ubuntu ship a disc that cites official support for longsoon godson3 chips? ;)
[12:35] <mok0> directhex: good point
[12:35] <directhex> loongson, sorry
[12:36] <directhex> basically, mips needs officialness!
[12:36] <ogra> MIPS is official sice SGI exists :)
[12:36] <mok0> Exactly. It's a bad time to drop archs just because a few of them seem to victor in the West
[12:36] <directhex> aha, mipsel. apparently debian runs
[12:37] <directhex> ogra, how long since SGI shipped anythign MIPS based?
[12:37]  * ogra has an indigo2 sitting onteh shelf behind him
[12:37]  * directhex has 5 racks of high-spec altix a few metres away away
[12:37] <ogra> oh, that might be 10 years by now that they swiched to x86
[12:37] <directhex> ia64 != x86
[12:37] <mok0> We halted our last Iris machine a couple of years ago --- it made so much noise :-)
[12:38] <ogra> their workstations came with redhat on dual PII in 1999 i think
[12:38] <ogra> mok0, their case design is still unbeaten imho
[12:38] <directhex> SGI still know their game, though. never dealt with a vendor with support like SGI
[12:38] <mok0> ogra: yeah it was cool
[12:39] <ogra> i mean it still is ... i havent seen anything as sexy up to today
[12:39] <directhex> "help, our users' apps keep crashing" "mail us a core dump plz... okay, looks like your stack limit is too small. poke with ulimit"
[12:39] <directhex> not many hardware vendors do that
[12:39] <RainCT> devfil: congrats! :)
[12:39] <mok0> ogra: like some women... sexy, but extremely noisy
[12:39] <ogra> lol
[12:40] <directhex> jms@orac:~> grep -c ^proc /proc/cpuinfo
[12:40] <directhex> 256
[12:40] <directhex> \o/
[12:41] <leleobhz> o.0
[12:41] <directhex> which makes a 128 load average seem positively low
[13:07] <karooga> Hi, I'm new to packaging and am trying to package a python extension (python bindings to a c program).  The package name is ppgplot... do I call the ubuntu package python-ppgplot?
[13:07] <liw> karooga, yup
[13:08] <liw> karooga, http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy may be useful to you
[13:09] <karooga> liw, thanks, does this supersede http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/python-policy/index.html
[13:10] <liw> karooga, more or less
[13:22] <karooga> liw: the Standards-Version that dh_make made and debian policy from command line differ, is this a prob?
[13:22] <azeem> karooga: dh_make is not authoritave in any way
[13:22] <liw> karooga, if you're creating a package from scratch, you should use the newest standards-version available in Ubuntu (or Debian, if you're uploading to Debian)
[13:25] <karooga> liw: so this would be 3.7.3.0 in hardy
[13:25] <liw> karooga, yeah; you can leave out the last .0 though
[13:35] <mok0> Is there any overview of packages that has been superseded in ii??
[13:51] <karooga> liw: should the extension be private or public?  given this is the first time it has been packaged.
[13:52] <lucky711x> Where/how do I sign up for motujava?
[13:52] <liw> karooga, is it meant to be used only by some specific program? if so, then private; if it is meant to be a generally useful library, then public
[13:53] <karooga> liw: it's general, python bindings to a c library.
[14:16] <karooga> liw:  how do i build the package for python2.4 and 2.5?  does XS-Python-Version: all in the control file do this?
[14:23] <liw> karooga, if you're using cdbs, that should be it, yes
[14:43] <ScottK> DktrKranz: I think we should go ahead and approve python-django.
[14:44] <ScottK> DktrKranz: I just gave it a plus one.  Would you please confirm it.
[14:48] <karooga> liw, I'm uncertain what to put in debian/rules.  <FEFF>To install the
[14:48] <karooga> program normally I just run python setup install.  Do I need more than that
[14:48] <karooga> in the rules file e.g. debhelper.mk, python-distutils.mk etc?
[14:57] <DktrKranz> ScottK: done
[14:57] <ScottK> Thanks.
[14:58] <DktrKranz> I'm curious to see Debian RM reaction, but I think it will be positive too
[14:59] <ScottK> If not, good for us and bad for them.
[14:59] <ScottK> We'll see.
[15:03] <soren> ScottK: FWIW, I'm very much in favour of python-django 1.0 as well.
[15:03] <ScottK> soren: FFe is approved, so now it just needs merge, sync, whatever.
[15:03] <ScottK> Feel free to jump in ...
[15:04] <soren> It needs some dependenc...
[15:04] <soren> Oh..
[15:04] <soren> Not anymore.
[15:04] <soren> Wow. They must have been synced just hours ago.
[15:05] <soren> Oh, never mind me. I'm thinking of hardy.
[15:05] <ScottK> Yep.
[15:05] <ScottK> I've already gotten pinged about a backport, but Intrepid first ....
[15:06] <DktrKranz> soren: regarding your request for a motu-sru charter, what kind of informations MC would like to see?
[15:06] <soren> python-django should be a straight sync.
[15:06] <DktrKranz> *motu-release
[15:07] <soren> Some form of description of what motu-releases responsibilties and authority is.
[15:07] <soren> Currently, all we have is disagreement and a completely out-of-date one-line description. :)
[15:07] <DktrKranz> heh
[15:08] <DktrKranz> well, next MOTU meeting will be today, but two out of five are on vacation now, so it's probably better to delay it a bit more
[15:09] <ScottK> I agree we need to update it.
[15:09] <soren> Ooh, the diffs on launchpad are clickable now. *drool*
[15:09] <ScottK> Even in non-controversial areas there are things we're doing that aren't documented.
[15:13] <soren> ScottK, DktrKranz: It doesn't have to be complete. It's not a matter of strictly defining exactly what you can do and can't do, but something that will at least make sure we're all reasonably on the same page.
[15:14] <ScottK> soren: Sounds good.  Once we have people back off vacation, we'll get something worked out.
[15:15] <soren> ScottK, DktrKranz: An interesting point is that the MC's charter says that we're the ones who are supposed to settle disputes between developers, but "the recent case" demonstrates that that might not always be the case. I'd like it if at least some effort was made to describe when it's MR's and when it's MC's job.
[15:20] <ScottK> soren: Agreed.  My thought on that is that MR has an interest in the overall state of the system.  The 'recent case' had global implications for how the system worked.  If it's two devs disagreeing about a particular package, I don't think MR normally has an interest.  For security or severe policy violations (see gui-ufw for an example) it might.
[15:21] <ScottK> Note: Speaking just for myself here.
[15:37] <karooga> Hi, I'm trying to package a python extension using pycentral.  I keep getting a message saying that the library i've just compiled "shouldn't be linked with libpthread.so.0 (it uses none of its symbols)".  How do I get rid of this?
[15:39] <ScottK> karooga: You ignore it.
[15:40] <ScottK> That's an interesting error that almost every package seems to generate some of and I've no great idea what to do with it.
[15:40] <karooga> ScottK, thanks.
[15:42] <karooga> ScottK, so what you are saying is that I may just have created my first working deb package? :-)
[15:43] <ScottK> Possibly.  I don't have enough information to really go that far.
[15:44] <laga> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythtv-theme-metallurgy-wide - can someone please review my package and ACK it, if possible?
[16:00]  * laga sobs quietly
[16:02]  * mok0 hugs laga
[16:03]  * laga puts some chloroforme on a piece of cloth, lets mok0 smell it and drags him into REVU to review mythtv-theme-metallurgy-wide
[16:03] <mok0> Aaaarghh
[16:03]  * mok0 looks
[16:04]  * laga puts away the gun
[16:05]  * leleobhz see the kidnapping while walk in the street... decides dont do anything :p
[16:06] <laga> leleobhz: that's the spirit.
[16:06] <laga> ;)
[16:07] <leleobhz> laga: yeap! :p
[16:08] <mok0> laga: have you got an FFe for this?
[16:08] <laga> mok0: yes
[16:08] <mok0> laga: great
[16:09] <mok0> laga: is it meant for the mythbuntu distro?
[16:09] <laga> yes
[16:09] <mok0> laga: some kind of skin?
[16:09] <laga> yes, for mythtv
[16:10] <laga> you can see screenshots here: http://www.miffteevee.co.uk/themes/metallurgy.html
[16:10] <mok0> laga: it needs to go into multiverse afaics
[16:10] <laga> yes, it does
[16:10] <superm1> yeah i ack'ed the FFe already.  it just needs one more MOTU to do a REVU
[16:10] <laga> because it depends on mythtv-common and because of the license anyways
[16:10] <mok0> superm1: looking at it as we speak :-)
[16:10] <superm1> great :)
[16:15] <mok0> laga: it is unclear from the description what the difference is between the -osd_ and the -wide_ packages
[16:15] <mok0> laga: at least to a dumb guy like me
[16:16] <laga> mok0: hum. that's obvious from the package name i hoped :) the OSD is the on screen display
[16:17] <laga> but you're right, i'll extend the description
[16:17] <mok0> Thanks
[16:17] <mok0> Woah it even builds :-P
[16:17] <laga> now who would have thought that ;)
[16:18] <mok0> Yeah looks good
[16:18] <laga> i'll upload a fixed description and then you ACK it?
[16:19] <mok0> yeah, and superm1 can ack it too
[16:20] <laga> mok0: btw, what is unclear to you? the term "OSD"?
[16:20] <superm1> mok0, you can just go off my old ack, you can upload after the new description i say
[16:20] <mok0> superm1: ok
[16:20] <mok0> laga: yes
[16:20] <mok0> laga: is "wide" for a wide-screen tv?
[16:20] <laga> mok0: it means "on screen display".
[16:20] <mok0> ah
[16:21] <laga> mok0: yes.
[16:21] <mok0> See? I am dumb
[16:21] <mok0> But the descr. needs to be for dumb guys as well :-P
[16:21] <laga> the -osd package is for a completely different portion of mythtv. it's displayed over video playback, the -wide package is for the normal UI
[16:21] <laga> you're not dumb ;)
[16:21] <laga> i'll expand it
[16:21] <laga> there is no 4:3 theme, so only a -wide variant
[16:22] <mok0> laga: well, there you have the sentences you need to include
[16:22] <laga> :)
[16:24]  * mok0 is waiting for norsetto to come on-line...
[16:25] <mok0> laga: interesting, you are maintaining this package in bazaar... is that true of all the myth team packages?'
[16:26] <laga> mok0: most of them, yes.
[16:26] <mok0> laga: so you have collective maintenance I guess?
[16:26] <laga> mok0: yup
[16:26] <mok0> nice
[16:27] <laga> within the usual "ask me before you touch my package" ;)
[16:27] <mok0> ah, ok
[16:27] <superm1> mok0, yeah we generally step out and ask for a motu for a second ack on newer packages though to keep with the workflow
[16:28] <superm1> but keeping everything in bzr makes operating on a team pretty straightforward
[16:28] <mok0> superm1: so, you have a local branch checkout of all the packages, for example?
[16:29] <laga> mok0: a new upload should appear in a few minutes on revu
[16:29] <superm1> mok0, yeah i have most on my laptop at home
[16:29] <superm1> mok0, and we have a get-orig-source rule for every package in bzr to build an orig.tar.gz
[16:29] <superm1> (i'm not on my laptop at home though, so i'm not able to sponsor or checkout right now)
[16:29] <mok0> superm1: what about packages that are synced/merged from Debian?
[16:30] <superm1> mok0, so a majority of myth-* isn't in debian
[16:30] <directhex> it's in debian-multimedia and even there it's old and pretty featureless compared to the mythbuntu work
[16:30] <superm1> mok0, ideally it should eventually land up there, but the exact same reasons its in multiverse are whats keeping it from headed that way
[16:30] <mok0> superm1: dang
[16:31] <superm1> mok0, eg compiling with lame and a bunch of other patent encumbered support that makes it fun to use
[16:32] <mok0> superm1: you mean like mp3 and mp2 etc.?
[16:32] <superm1> mok0, yeah
[16:32] <mok0> superm1: it's a drag with all that IP shit
[16:32] <superm1> mok0, without them, your recording formats are pretty useless
[16:32] <superm1> mok0, yeah
[16:39] <laga> mok0: new upload is on revu
[16:39] <mok0> laga: ok
[16:39] <laga> i just got a python backtrace in revu, but didnt think to save it. i guess i reloaded while it was processing the upload
[16:40] <mok0> laga: it seems to be there
[16:44] <mok0> superm1: so you have a blanket FFe for mythbuntu stuff, right?
[16:44] <laga> yep
[16:44] <laga> answering for him ;)
[16:44] <mok0> heh
[16:44] <mok0> laga: ok I will upload it now
[16:44] <ScottK> mok0: Not quite.  motu-release delegated to him to decide what Mythbuntu stuff gets an FFe.
[16:45] <ScottK> So it's not a blanket FFe, just he gets to decide.
[16:45] <mok0> ScottK: OK. I just asked because I couldn't find an explicit FFe for this package
[16:46] <ScottK> mok0: I know he OK'ed it, so you can upload it.  I think it's in the needs-packaging bug, but I wouldn't swear to it.
[16:47] <mok0> bug 263242
[16:48] <mok0> Well that bug should be closed soon...
[16:52] <mok0> Could someone take a peek at this odd build failure, please? https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/atlas/3.6.0-21.5ubuntu1/+build/639735
[16:53] <mok0> Several other packages have failed to build because they are missing the atlas libraries
[16:54] <mok0> Looks like a compiler error to me
[16:59] <ScottK> mok0: Did you ask NCommander to look at it.  He's very good with odd build failures.
[16:59] <mok0> ScottK: No I didn't... NCommander? AYT?
[17:01] <Blaze_Boy> i want to convert a python program into a .DEB package, can YOU help me in that ?
[17:01] <mok0> Blaze_Boy: You can get help with questions, but you have to do the bulk of the work yourself
[17:02] <Blaze_Boy> mok0 : ok i'm with u
[17:02] <mok0> Blaze_Boy: Have you seen the wiki pages on packaging?
[17:02] <Blaze_Boy> nup
[17:03] <mok0> ! packaging
[17:03] <mok0> Blaze_Boy: you can also pick a package that reminds of yours and see how it's done there
[17:04] <Blaze_Boy> hhm , OK
[17:05] <mok0> Blaze_Boy: does the python program use distutils?
[17:05] <mok0> Huh? Did he expect someone to do it for him?
[17:09] <jpds> mok0: Like all the drive-by people.
[17:09] <nxvl> NCommander: i never see an aplication with that many supporters in a short time as yours
[17:09] <mok0> nxvl: what app is that?
[17:10] <RainCT> mok	ubuntu-universe-contributors
[17:10] <nxvl> mok0: Michael Casadevall
[17:10] <mok0> Heh, I thought it was a computer application... you know, a program :-P
[17:12] <RainCT> hehe
[17:12] <RainCT> mok0: you've to check your inbox more often ;)
[17:13] <jpds> RainCT_: Do you not filter mailing list posts?
[17:13] <mok0> RainCT: yeah...
[17:14] <mok0> jpds: I use procmail...
[17:14] <jpds> mok0: I use Gmail filters for now, but have procmail configured just in case.
[17:14] <RainCT> jpds: why would I do that? :P
[17:14] <mok0> so ubuntu-mc postings never reach my inbox :-)
[17:15] <jpds> RainCT: ^
[17:15] <karooga> hi, is it necessary to compile a python module for all python versions?
[17:15] <mok0> karooga: use python-central
[17:15] <karooga> s/compile/package/
[17:15] <RainCT> karooga: all supported versions with which it is compatible, yes
[17:15] <mok0> karooga: it will be done for you
[17:16] <karooga> mok0: I am using python-central
[17:16] <mok0> heh ok
[17:16] <jpds> RainCT: I'll take your answer as: "No."
[17:17] <karooga> mok0: but I can only get it to compile for python 2.5 (XS-Python-Version: >= 2.5)
[17:17] <ScottK> DktrKranz: Would you please look at Bug #243947 and maybe discuss with cody-somerville?  I want to make sure you don't consider anything SRU worthy before I approve the backport.
[17:17] <RainCT> jpds: No. I use tags but I leave everything new in the inbox.
[17:17] <RainCT> karooga: does it work with Python 2.4?
[17:18] <RainCT> karooga: if it is, then use   >= 2.4
[17:18] <mok0> karooga: you mean no matter what you put in debian/control?
[17:19] <karooga> RainCT, mok0:  I mean that it works fine with 2.5 but not with 2.4.  Should I be trying to make sure it works with 2.4 as well?
[17:20] <mok0> karooga: are you using dh_pycentral?
[17:20] <mok0> karooga: for >= hardy I guess it is the default python
[17:20] <RainCT> karooga: then it's right like that; why would it be byte-compiled for 2.4 when it doesn't work with it?
[17:21] <mok0> RainCT: I think he means that the 2.4 version of the *pyc files are not generated
[17:21] <karooga> mok0:  in my rules file I have pycentral defined for deb_python_system, then only debhelper.mk and python-distutils.mk
[17:21] <RainCT> karooga: on your last question, it's always nice to support it, but if it doesn't then patching it or not depends on you.
[17:22] <mok0> karooga: it also depends whether it's a program, or if it's a module that someone using only 2.4 might want to use.
[17:22] <RainCT> mok0: right; it isn't because he has "XS-Python-Version: >= 2.5" set (which is correct as he says that it doesn't work with Python 2.4)
[17:23] <mok0> RainCT: it is correct if the python code uses features that did not exist in 2.4
[17:23] <karooga> RaintCT:  I mean that when I package with XS-Python-Version: >- 2.5 it works when I use >= 2.4, it bombs out
[17:23] <RainCT> mok0: I don't recall having said the opposite :)
[17:23] <mok0> karooga: ah there you go
[17:24] <RainCT> karooga: "bombs out" = you get Python errors at install time?
[17:24] <DktrKranz> ScottK: even minor fixes can be suitable of a SRU if someone is *really* interested. Those are cosmetic issues, a backport could be a better solution than SRU process.
[17:24] <mok0> RainCT: you didn't
[17:24] <karooga> thanks mok0, RainCT.  (I'm being hauled off to dinner... will have to catch up a bit later) :-)
[17:24] <mok0> karooga: bon appetit!
[17:25] <karooga> think i've got my answer. Ta.
[17:26] <mok0> Ah, that Python. Now we have to deal with 2.6 and 3.0 soon...
[17:26] <mok0> ... and Python 3.0 will not be backwards compatible, from what I understand
[17:27] <jorgenpt> mok0: Hello World will break.
[17:27] <cody-somerville> persia, ping
[17:27] <RainCT> indeed :(
[17:27]  * RainCT hates the new print function, if it is like he read
[17:29] <mok0> RainCT: Many will remain at 2.6 for quite a while.
[17:29] <DktrKranz> ScottK: my opinion is actual SRU policy is quite "permissive" because minor fixes could go in as well, so almost every patch is suitable. If we could restore "severe impact" requisite, we could differentiate SRU and backports better.
[17:29] <ScottK> DktrKranz: OK.  I didn't think minor fixes should go in.
[17:30] <ScottK> DktrKranz: So you would classify this as minor?
[17:30] <DktrKranz> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates, When section
[17:30] <DktrKranz> "Bugs which do not fit under above categories, but (1) have an obviously safe patch and (2) affect an application rather than critical infrastructure packages (like X.org or the kernel)."
[17:30] <DktrKranz> these could really be suitable, given the point above
[17:31] <RainCT> Oh. Are those points new?
[17:31] <ScottK> OK.  You tell me.  You're the SRU dude.
[17:32] <DktrKranz> I'd go for a backport. I like SRUs when there's some "urgency".
[17:32] <ScottK> OK.  Will do.
[17:33] <DktrKranz> cody-somerville, if you have any objections...
[17:33] <ScottK> Let me know and I'll un-ack the backport ...
[17:34] <DktrKranz> anyway, I'd like to discuss this a bit with the community, just to define a guideline for motu-sru. We're too open nowadays, IMHO
[17:35] <ScottK> DktrKranz: I know wpasupplicant is in Main, but would you please give an opinion on Bug #252576 (relates to Bug #252574)?
[17:35] <cody-somerville> lp #241036 looks SRU worthy
[17:35] <sebner> devfil: congratulations :D
[17:35] <devfil> sebner: thanks :D
[17:36] <ScottK> siretart: What do you think about SRU for Bug #252574?
[17:38] <DktrKranz> ScottK: at a first look, it seems a good candidate. This causes a regression, at least.
[17:39] <ScottK> OK.  I'm going to continue to hold off on that one.
[17:39] <ScottK> I'll let you and cody-somerville sort out the one issue with orange.
[17:40] <cody-somerville> ScottK, I think a backport is fine but bug #241036 (if I read it correctly) is probably SRU worthy by its self.
[17:41]  * DktrKranz will catch it later
[18:03] <siretart> bug 252574
[18:08] <siretart> ScottK: I cannot test it myself, however if someone prepared a test package and users could and would confirm fixes, sure!
[18:49] <sladen> slangasek: well, you /could/ stick to your own vorlon.* namespace ;-)
[19:28] <emgent`nl> heya
[19:35] <sebner> emgent`nl: \o/
[20:40] <sebner> ogra: still want to sponsor bug #261991 ?
[20:40] <sebner> wb DktrKranz :D
[20:41] <DktrKranz> sebner, did you miss me?
[20:41] <sebner> DktrKranz: of course!
[20:41] <DktrKranz> nothing better to do, then
[20:42] <sebner> ^^
[20:43] <DktrKranz> sebner, do you want to do my tomorrow office work for me?
[20:43] <sebner> DktrKranz: I have to work too tomorrow :(
[20:44] <DktrKranz> ok... you do mine, I do yours
[20:44] <sebner> ^^
[20:52] <ScottK> siretart: OK.  Thanks.
[21:00] <ScottK> liw: A very good answer to my question about why the cruft cleaner should get in is it's for an approved spec.
[21:31] <cbx33> hey guys
[21:31] <cbx33> who owns packages.ubuntu.com?
[21:31] <jpds> Hey Pete.
[21:32] <jpds> cbx33: Canonical hosts it.
[21:32] <cbx33> hey jpds
[21:32] <cbx33> ok
[21:32] <cbx33> i meant who maintains....as in codes
[21:32] <cbx33> is there an api to get an xml list of search results?
[21:32] <jpds> cbx33: "djpig"
[21:33] <cbx33> ko
[21:33] <cbx33> not here
[21:33] <cbx33> shame
[21:33]  * cbx33 was going to work on a ubiquity plugin to search the package list
[21:34] <jpds> cbx33: http://source.djpig.de/git/?p=packages.git;a=summary
[21:34] <cbx33> jpds: thanks
[21:35] <cbx33> hmmm
[21:35] <cbx33> not sure where to start looking
[21:35] <cbx33> don't think there is one though
[21:37] <cbx33> hmmm
[21:37] <cbx33> perhaps I can mung the results as they are
[21:37] <jpds> cbx33: I don't think there is an API for it.
[21:39] <directhex> oh god i forgot how great this rum is
[21:39] <jdong> yea yea continue teasing the underaged devs.
[21:43] <directhex> nah, i'm teasing the american devs. this is cuban rum
[21:44]  * NCommander wakes up
[21:51] <NCommander> ScottK, you floating around?
[21:54] <dk> hola alguien me puede ayudar a crear paquetes deb?
[21:56] <dk> hi,, any can help me?
[21:56] <dk> i need create a package .deb
[21:56] <directhex> what are you packaging?
[21:56] <directhex> depending on what it is, it might be easy or terrifying
[21:57] <directhex> and the requirements for debianization are much harder if you want the package to get into a distribution
[21:57] <dk> :o
[21:58] <dk> speak spanish?
[21:58] <directhex> sorry, no
[21:59] <RainCT> hola dk
[21:59] <dk> RainCT,  q tal
[21:59] <dk> hola
[22:00] <dk> me puedes ayudar,? es que necesito crear un paquete debian pero no me sale.estoy intentando
[22:00] <dk> pero no me sale
[22:01] <ScottK> NCommander: Yeah.
[22:01] <dk> RainCT,
[22:01] <dk> hola?
[22:01] <NCommander> ScottK, KDE4 is awesome. Consider me involved in Kubuntu now :-)
[22:02] <ScottK> Kewl.
[22:02] <ScottK> NCommander: Just uploading indi now that the freeze is over.
[22:02] <RainCT> dk: si, qual es el problema?
[22:02] <NCommander> ScottK, care to add koffice2?
[22:02] <NCommander> (I tracked down the FTBFS)
[22:03] <ScottK> Let me deal with kde4bindings first.
[22:03] <ScottK> But yes.
[22:04] <dk> RainCT,
[22:04] <dk> me lees?
[22:05] <dk> perdona
[22:05] <dk> pues mira que tengo q exponer acerca del mantenimiento de los paquetes debs
[22:05] <dk> y me pase estudiando leyendo y no me salen
[22:05] <dk> nose que pasara
[22:05] <RainCT> dk: ven a #ubuntu-motu-es mejor
[22:06] <dk> no sabia que existia
[22:06] <dk> vas alla tu?
[22:06] <dk> me vas a ayudar?
[22:07] <RainCT> dk: no existia, lo acabo de crear porque como continuemos hablando aqui aun se enfadará alguien :P.  me estan llamando para cenar pero cuando vuelva te puedo ayudar
[22:07] <RainCT> nxvl: if you are around perhaps you can help him while I'm away ^
[22:07] <dk> bueno, en cuanto tiempo?:D
[22:07] <RainCT> dk: unos 15 minutos
[22:07] <dk> excelente
[22:07] <dk> es que mañana es un ubucon
[22:07] <dk> te imaginas
[22:08] <dk> bueno te espero y provecho
[22:09] <nxvl> RainCT: yeah, i'm kind of busy right know with some work stuff
[22:10] <nxvl> RainCT: but if the script has no more bugs i can take a minute or two
[22:10] <nxvl> :D
[22:14] <NCommander> Wooo, qemu-mips might work for what I want to do
[22:56] <RainCT> persia: advocations use the hearth icon on REVU's details.py page, now :)
[22:56] <RainCT> (btw: if someone gets big icons on REVU, use Ctrl + F5)
[23:27] <wgrant> RainCT: I hope you mean s/hearth/heart/? Or are we burning new packages now?
[23:28] <RainCT> LOL
[23:40] <RainCT> wgrant: we should do a package cake some day :P