| === RainCT_ is now known as RainCT | ||
| === LucidFox is now known as Sikon | ||
| === Sikon is now known as LucidFox | ||
| andresj | hello. anybody here? :) | 04:10 |
|---|---|---|
| ScottK-laptop | Nope. | 04:11 |
| andresj | haha | 04:11 |
| andresj | hey I'm trying to package the latest versions of lyx in my PPA; but I'm running into problems. | 04:12 |
| andresj | I could upload 1.5.6 (only source change, no debian/ dir changes) for intrepid to launchpad, and it worked well | 04:12 |
| andresj | but when I run pbuilder locally on a package for hardy, it cant find some dependencies | 04:13 |
| andresj | the thing is, those dependencies are in hardy RELEASE | 04:13 |
| andresj | (whilst lyx-1.5.5 is in hardy-backports) | 04:14 |
| ScottK-laptop | You pbuilder probably doesn't have backports in it's sources. | 04:16 |
| ScottK-laptop | You/Your | 04:16 |
| andresj | that could be... but does it matter? the packages it says are virtual (e.g. Depends: libboost-test-dev which is a virtual package.) all come from boost source package, which changelog says is in "hardy", not "hardy-backports" | 04:17 |
| andresj | * ScottK-laptop | 04:18 |
| ScottK-laptop | Ah. | 04:18 |
| ScottK-laptop | andresj: What version of boost do you want? | 04:21 |
| ScottK-laptop | Yeah, there aren't any in backports | 04:22 |
| danbhfive | anyone here that can help me with debugging a c project's compile errors? | 04:23 |
| andresj | ScottK-laptop: any that works :P >= 1.34.1 the package seems to say | 04:23 |
| ScottK-laptop | Which hardy has. | 04:23 |
| andresj | exactly. | 04:24 |
| andresj | I don't see why pbuilder fails | 04:24 |
| andresj | telling me they're virtual | 04:24 |
| ScottK-laptop | It's not a virtual package either. | 04:24 |
| ScottK-laptop | I suspect a pbuilder bug. | 04:24 |
| wgrant | Perhaps the pbuilder lacks universe? | 04:24 |
| ScottK-laptop | boost is in Main | 04:24 |
| wgrant | So it is. | 04:25 |
| ScottK-laptop | andresj: There is more than one way to get pbuilder to try and satisfy dependencies. | 04:25 |
| andresj | ScottK-laptop: I am completely lost regarding that sentence. | 04:25 |
| m8i-freya | Could I ask some question about packaging? If I found some bug in the "debian" directory comes from svn, should I report to upstream? | 04:25 |
| ScottK-laptop | andresj: pbuilder has to figure out what packages you need to build with. | 04:26 |
| andresj | of course | 04:26 |
| ScottK-laptop | There's more than one set of methods it has to do that. | 04:26 |
| andresj | mm... ok... | 04:26 |
| ScottK-laptop | I find the current default method somewhat problematic. | 04:26 |
| ScottK-laptop | IIRC I got errors like that. | 04:26 |
| andresj | mm... how do I change it, then? | 04:27 |
| ScottK-laptop | So I'm going to suggest you change it. | 04:27 |
| ScottK-laptop | I'm looking that up. | 04:27 |
| ScottK-laptop | It's been a while since I've done it. | 04:27 |
| andresj | hahaha ok | 04:28 |
| ScottK-laptop | andresj: You'll need to edit /etc/pbuilder/pbuilderrc | 04:29 |
| ScottK-laptop | andresj: There's a line that starts PBUILDERSATISFYDEPENDSCMD= | 04:30 |
| ScottK-laptop | andresj: Make it say: PBUILDERSATISFYDEPENDSCMD="/usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends-classic" | 04:30 |
| ScottK-laptop | I'm not sure that will help, but it's helped me when I had problems like yours in the past. | 04:30 |
| andresj | mm... ok ill try that :) thanks. | 04:30 |
| andresj | still telling me that libboost-filesystem-dev is not available. :/ | 04:33 |
| andresj | oh thats in universe! | 04:33 |
| andresj | ScottK-laptop: do u know how to add universe to pbuilder? | 04:33 |
| ScottK | andresj: Sorry, I'm exhausted and off to bed. | 04:34 |
| andresj | hahaha | 04:34 |
| andresj | thats ok thanks for your help :) | 04:34 |
| andresj | hey any idea why a specific requeriment was added to my package when debian/control doesn't say that? More specifically, lyx-1.5.6~ppa1~hardy1 has Build-Depends: libboost-dev (>= 1.34.1), libboost-filesystem-dev, libboost-signals-dev, libboost-regex-dev (among others), but Dependencies in aptitude appear: libboost-filesystem1.34.1 (>= 1.34.1-8), libboost-regex1.34.1 (>= 1.34.1-8), and libboost-signals1.34.1 (>= 1.34.1-8) none o | 05:17 |
| RAOF | andresj: dpkg-shlibdeps magic. | 05:18 |
| andresj | RAOF, oh I see... but I only have 1.34.1-4 in enabled repositories, I don't know where 1.34.1-8 came from... (I am using PPA) | 05:19 |
| RAOF | Apparently 1.34.1-8 is the last time that the ABI was added to. Alternatively, because it's crazy C++, they might just bump the shlibs each revision. | 05:19 |
| RAOF | andresj: Where are you building it? Because it'll pick up the dependencies from where you build it. | 05:20 |
| andresj | RAOF, on launchpad, in a PPA | 05:20 |
| RAOF | Presumably actually building in a hardy context? | 05:21 |
| andresj | RAOF: well, the package is distribution hardy, if that's what you mean | 05:21 |
| andresj | (I mean, not only in the version number) | 05:22 |
| RAOF | Right. I'm not sure if PPAs build against backports? Maybe that's it? | 05:22 |
| andresj | RAOF, does that mean the package won't build? it did, though. | 05:22 |
| andresj | i have binaries, and I added my PPA to my sources.list, and tried installing lyx through aptitude | 05:23 |
| RAOF | The package obviously built, and is picking up those dependencies from the packages installed during the build process. | 05:23 |
| andresj | now, where does packages come from? I have all checkboxes marked in my Software Sources dialog | 05:24 |
| RAOF | Can you pastebin the build log? | 05:26 |
| andresj | RAOF, you mean from the PPA? It already has an URL: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/17331201/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.lyx_1.5.6-0ubuntu1%7Eppa3%7Ehardy1_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz | 05:26 |
| RAOF | andresj: Hm. The boost libs are all coming from Hardy universe. I idon't know why you've got crazy dependencies. | 05:28 |
| andresj | RAOF, yeah, its very wierd. What's even more wierd is that the build log never mentions 1.34.1-8; only 1.34.1-4 (for libboost-filesystem, that is) | 05:30 |
| RAOF | Right. I dunno. | 05:31 |
| andresj | whats more, it specifically says that the pkg depends on libboost-filesystem1.34.1 (>= 1.34.1-2.1)... | 05:31 |
| andresj | thats extremely wierd | 05:31 |
| andresj | well thank you for your help RAOF :) | 05:31 |
| andresj | oh!! | 05:32 |
| andresj | lol | 05:32 |
| andresj | i added my PPA for intrepid, not for hardy | 05:32 |
| andresj | 'tupid 'tupid! | 05:33 |
| andresj | :P | 05:33 |
| RAOF | HEh. | 05:33 |
| andresj | OK, so now I have packages for LyX 1.5.6 in my PPA. I think this almost fixes the bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lyx/+bug/253196 (Bugfix upstream release of Lyx (1.5.6)). All that is needed is for the package to be put into the official distribution. | 05:53 |
| ubottu | Ubuntu bug 253196 in lyx "Bugfix upstream release of Lyx (1.5.6)" [Low,Triaged] | 05:53 |
| jscinoz | yay revu is broken again | 06:49 |
| jscinoz | http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=google-gadgets | 06:49 |
| jscinoz | fail. | 06:49 |
| === orly_owl_ is now known as orly_owl | ||
| RAOF | Hm. Any motu-release around? | 08:18 |
| RAOF | I'd like to get an FFe for gnome-do + gnome-do-plugins; do you want 2 separate bugs for that, or just one? -plugins is useless without the first, and gnome-do is fairly useless without -plugis. | 08:19 |
| === greeneggsnospam is now known as jsgotangco | ||
| NCommander | RAOF, gnome packages had a freeze exception already I thought | 08:46 |
| RAOF | Do isn't a GNOME package. | 08:46 |
| NCommander | oh | 08:46 |
| NCommander | d'oh | 08:46 |
| RAOF | I don't suppose anyone said anything ueful while I was punched off the internest? | 08:47 |
| * RAOF wonders how long he'll stay on the net this time. | 08:50 | |
| DKcross | RainCT, | 09:04 |
| DKcross | estas ahi? | 09:04 |
| DKcross | alguien anda por aqui? | 09:04 |
| DKcross | necesito una ayuda porfavor | 09:05 |
| Hobbsee | RAOF: i'd say together. | 09:05 |
| Hobbsee | RAOF: i could ack it, technically, but... | 09:05 |
| DKcross | hi | 09:06 |
| DKcross | can help me man? | 09:06 |
| DKcross | i have problems. with package | 09:06 |
| DKcross | Hobbsee, | 09:07 |
| NCommander | morning Hobbsee | 09:07 |
| Hobbsee | hey NCommander | 09:07 |
| Hobbsee | DKcross: yes? | 09:07 |
| DKcross | help me please | 09:08 |
| Hobbsee | DKcross: with? | 09:08 |
| DKcross | packaging | 09:08 |
| DKcross | dpkg-source: construyendo emesene en emesene_1.0.1-1.dsc | 09:08 |
| DKcross | debian/rules build | 09:08 |
| DKcross | test -x debian/rules | 09:08 |
| DKcross | mkdir -p "." | 09:08 |
| DKcross | /usr/bin/make -C . CFLAGS="-g -O2 -g -Wall -O2" CXXFLAGS="-g -O2 -g -Wall -O2" CPPFLAGS="" LDFLAGS="-Wl,-Bsymbolic-functions" | 09:08 |
| DKcross | make[1]: se ingresa al directorio `/home/dkito/Preparacion evento/de home/charla/tar conversion/emesene-1.0.1' | 09:08 |
| DKcross | make[1]: *** No se especificó ningún objetivo y no se encontró ningún makefile. Alto. | 09:08 |
| DKcross | make[1]: se sale del directorio `/home/dkito/Preparacion evento/de home/charla/tar conversion/emesene-1.0.1' | 09:08 |
| NCommander | DKcross, please do not flood the channel | 09:08 |
| DKcross | make: *** [debian/stamp-makefile-build] Error 2 | 09:08 |
| DKcross | dpkg-buildpackage: fallo: debian/rules build entregó error de estado de salida 2 | 09:08 |
| DKcross | dkito@dk-System:~/Preparacion evento/de home/charla/tar conversion/emesene-1.0.1$ | 09:08 |
| NCommander | DKcross, post the logs/output on paste.ubuntu.com | 09:08 |
| Hobbsee | *pastebin*. | 09:08 |
| * wgrant makes some gurgling noises, then asphyxiates. | 09:09 | |
| NCommander | ah crud, I missed the MOTU meeting | 09:09 |
| * NCommander pokes wgrant's dead body with a stick | 09:09 | |
| * wgrant rots. | 09:09 | |
| Hobbsee | NCommander: seeing as no one really bothered to attend it (again), then...you didn't miss much | 09:09 |
| DKcross | what is the problem? | 09:09 |
| * NCommander shoves wgrant corpse in a blender for quick and easy disposal | 09:09 | |
| * Hobbsee doesn't read whatever language that is. | 09:10 | |
| slangasek | the problem is your debian/rules doesn't correspond to your upstream sources | 09:10 |
| NCommander | DKcross, most of us speak english, you'll have to set LC_ALL/LANG to en_US to get the error messages in something we can read | 09:10 |
| NCommander | or another en setting | 09:10 |
| slangasek | and is looking for a makefile, which you don't have | 09:10 |
| Hobbsee | and don't paste the english version in this channel, either! | 09:10 |
| DKcross | mm | 09:10 |
| sebner1 | siretart: is already someone else working on mlt? | 09:14 |
| DKcross | i need help:( | 09:15 |
| siretart | sebner1: not that I know, just assign the bug to you | 09:28 |
| DKcross | hi | 09:31 |
| DKcross | need help please | 09:31 |
| wgrant | DKcross: Why are you trying to repackage emesene 1.0.1 in what is likely a highly inappropriate manner? | 09:37 |
| DKcross | wgrant, hola? | 09:39 |
| DKcross | hi wgrant | 09:39 |
| DKcross | hola alguien habla español? | 09:42 |
| wgrant | !es | 09:42 |
| ubottu | En la mayoría de canales Ubuntu se comunica en inglés. Para ayuda en Español, por favor entre en los canales #ubuntu-es o #kubuntu-es. | 09:42 |
| DKcross | pero necesito ayuda de motu | 09:43 |
| DKcross | no es problema que este en un canal hablando español | 09:43 |
| Nafallo | and in English? | 09:43 |
| DKcross | ubottu, please help me | 09:44 |
| ubottu | Sorry, I don't know anything about please help me | 09:44 |
| DKcross | :p | 09:44 |
| DKcross | Nafallo, u can help me? | 09:44 |
| Nafallo | I can help you in Swedish if you want? :-) | 09:44 |
| DKcross | :o | 09:45 |
| DKcross | ok thanks | 09:45 |
| sebner1 | DKcross: we can help you in English ;) | 09:45 |
| Nafallo | the point was you're better off with English. sorry :-) | 09:45 |
| slangasek | some of us can help in Spanish, but I assume it's considered a faux pas to do so on channel | 09:46 |
| slangasek | is there a quick tutorial on how to make a python package with cdbs? | 09:57 |
| tseliot | DKcross: si encuentras a algun motu hispanoablante (por ej. pochu) le podrás hacer preguntas en privado (yo soy italiano y aun no soy motu) | 09:58 |
| wgrant | slangasek: Module or application package? | 09:58 |
| slangasek | wgrant: application | 09:58 |
| DKcross | tseliot, gracias | 09:59 |
| DKcross | tseliot, thanks | 09:59 |
| slangasek | tseliot: he already found one, but I can't offer very good advice in this case | 09:59 |
| tseliot | slangasek: oh, ¿hablas español? ;) | 10:00 |
| slangasek | he's trying to do a packaging demo shortly for an ubucon, but is trying to use dh_make to repackage emesene, and this obviously doesn't work out of the box | 10:00 |
| wgrant | slangasek: There's nothing to it, then. | 10:00 |
| slangasek | tseliot: entre otros idiomas | 10:00 |
| wgrant | Um. Isn't dh_make meant to die? | 10:01 |
| slangasek | meant to by whom? | 10:01 |
| slangasek | are you thinking of debmake? | 10:01 |
| wgrant | Anybody with sanity? | 10:01 |
| tseliot | slangasek: nice. BTW did you have a look at this page? http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy | 10:01 |
| wgrant | Possibly. | 10:01 |
| POX_ | slangasek: I guess the easiest way is to start with files generated with stdeb (http://stdeb.python-hosting.com/, it doesn't use cdbs IIRC, though) or just take a look at one of packages from python-{apps,modules} repo and and then join #debian-python ;) | 10:01 |
| slangasek | DKcross: the URL that tseliot gives, http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy, appears to include a quick example of how to set up CDBS for use with distutils | 10:03 |
| slangasek | DKcross: and emesene uses distutils | 10:03 |
| RainCT | morning | 10:03 |
| DKcross | ok | 10:03 |
| wgrant | Doesn't one need just a single line, in general? | 10:03 |
| DKcross | i go :p | 10:03 |
| DKcross | http://stdeb.python-hosting.com/ this? | 10:04 |
| DKcross | its http://stdeb.python-hosting.com/ | 10:04 |
| slangasek | DKcross: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy, busca "CDBS + distutils" | 10:04 |
| _ruben | hmm .. the debian maintainer's guide still lists dh_make as the way to go .. so apparently there's another/better way? .. | 10:04 |
| * _ruben googles | 10:04 | |
| slangasek | _ruben: dh_make is still what I use for spawning a new package, but I don't package python stuff | 10:05 |
| slangasek | (I also don't spawn many new packages, either...) | 10:05 |
| DKcross | ok thanks | 10:05 |
| _ruben | ive only done a small number of repackaging .. am about to start working on my first 'fresh' package | 10:05 |
| slangasek | DKcross: and I'm afraid that's all I can do for you, son las dos de la madrugada aqui y ya tengo que dormirme | 10:07 |
| _ruben | ah .. debmake is an old package .. i thought it was dh_make successor or smth, but seems the other way around | 10:07 |
| POX_ | slangasek: some examples for Python applications: http://svn.debian.org/viewsvn/python-apps/packages/ | 10:07 |
| DKcross | :o aqui son las 43 | 10:08 |
| DKcross | 3 | 10:08 |
| DKcross | perdon | 10:08 |
| DKcross | soy de EL Savdor man | 10:08 |
| DKcross | graciaspor tu ayuda | 10:08 |
| DKcross | creo que lo terminare haciendo | 10:08 |
| DKcross | sudo apt-get source emesene | 10:08 |
| DKcross | ese ya trae la carpeta "debian" | 10:08 |
| slangasek | indeed it does... :) | 10:09 |
| DKcross | ni modo | 10:10 |
| _ruben | what would be the best/recommended way to package (3rd party) kernel modules? i guess smth with module-assistent? | 10:11 |
| RainCT | wgrant: how many times have you died already? :P | 10:13 |
| wgrant | RainCT: Too many. Floods tend to do that. | 10:13 |
| DKcross | RainCT, | 10:13 |
| DKcross | HI | 10:13 |
| RainCT | hola | 10:17 |
| DKcross | hola | 10:17 |
| DKcross | necesito tu ayuda | 10:17 |
| DKcross | por fa.. | 10:17 |
| === RainCT is now known as RainCT_ | ||
| RainCT | DktrKranz: Hey. Just to be sure, does bug #267078 need an exception or can I consider it a bug fix release? | 11:06 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 267078 in gbrainy "Update gbrainy 0.99 to 1.00" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/267078 | 11:06 |
| DktrKranz | RainCT, is there a "common" changelog? I see several of them, scattered into the diff | 11:07 |
| RainCT | DktrKranz: No. There's a NEWS file, but the changes it lists for 1.00 were already done in versions 0.98 and 0.99 (currently in Intrepid). | 11:08 |
| DktrKranz | - Better support for low resolutions. | 11:09 |
| DktrKranz | - Better error handling. | 11:09 |
| DktrKranz | those could be considered as feature, unless they are bugfixe | 11:10 |
| RainCT | DktrKranz: well, I consider them bug fixes, someone else may consider them features ;) | 11:13 |
| RainCT | DktrKranz: anyway. that's the diff for the low resolutions: http://paste.ubuntu.com/43876/plain/ | 11:14 |
| RainCT | DktrKranz: and here is the error stuff: http://paste.ubuntu.com/43880/ | 11:16 |
| toobaz2 | hello. I don't want to bother, and it even isn't a direct problem for me, and I have no problem in waiting. But that said: is there any particular reason why my simple patch for the critical (for its package) bug 221007 hasn't still been accepted after a week? I mean: should I contact someone or just wait? thanks | 11:19 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 221007 in python-gtk2-doc "[patch] bad interpreter (python 2.4) given for pygtk-demo" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/221007 | 11:19 |
| DktrKranz | RainCT, seems low impact or just bugfixes then. You can proceed | 11:19 |
| * DktrKranz mode cooker on, c u later | 11:20 | |
| RainCT | DktrKranz: thanks :) | 11:20 |
| Hobbsee | toobaz2: er, probably because we can't read minds, and don't read all bugs. | 11:21 |
| * Hobbsee grabs a link | 11:21 | |
| toobaz2 | Hobbsee: this was just the point: I thought "[patch]" tag would have taken your attention; next time, should I ping someone here? | 11:22 |
| toobaz2 | I mean: what's the expected behaviour of a "patcher"? | 11:23 |
| * Hobbsee mutters at teh wiki. | 11:23 | |
| Hobbsee | toobaz2: have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess | 11:23 |
| Hobbsee | toobaz2: (and patch is less than useful, as various people are known to tag their bugs with 'patch', even when there isn't a valid patch, in an attempt to get them fixed faster) | 11:24 |
| Hobbsee | toobaz2: the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess is the preferred process - although i don't know why it's not linked from the MOTU/ section. | 11:24 |
| Hobbsee | so it gets looked at every once in a while, and preference tends to be given to the sponsorship queue | 11:25 |
| toobaz2 | Hobsee: OK, was just following https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing under "Preparing patches"... | 11:25 |
| Hobbsee | i figured. it needs an amalgamation :) | 11:25 |
| Hobbsee | 151. yeesh. i thought people had been working on it | 11:25 |
| RainCT | toobaz2: (note that you will have to provide a debdiff for the sponsorship queue; normal patches will just be rejected) | 11:26 |
| toobaz2 | RainCT: OK | 11:29 |
| RainCT | toobaz2: basically the only difference is that you're missing a new changelog entry (use dch -i -D intrepid to create it) and that you've to use the command debdiff instead of diff | 11:29 |
| toobaz2 | yep, I know debdiff, I maintain a package in Debian, I just didn't know how to act in Ubuntu. thanks, shall act immediately | 11:30 |
| RainCT | toobaz2: Ah, alright. The process is basically creating the debdiff, testbuilding the package (with pbuilder or whatever) to ensure that it works, and uploading the debdiff to a bug and subscribing ubuntu-universe-sponsors (universe, multiverse) or ubuntu-main-sponsors (main, restricted) to it :) | 11:32 |
| RainCT | (although some packages, like the mythbuntu- ones, have a different prefered workflow) | 11:33 |
| toobaz2 | RainCT: shall I post a patch for Intrepid and one for Hardy? Or will Hardy - in case it seems necessary - just be backported? | 11:34 |
| RainCT | toobaz2: first one for Intrepid, and once it has been accepted you can create one for Hardy and follow the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates process | 11:34 |
| toobaz2 | ok | 11:34 |
| === stefanlsd_ is now known as stefanlsd | ||
| bobbo | If an Ubuntu native package (not in Debian) has the version number "0.1", how should the next version be named? (0.1-1?) | 12:19 |
| geser | bobbo: can you be more specific? which package is it? | 12:20 |
| bobbo | geser: usb-creator | 12:21 |
| sebner | geser: \o/ for the ACK script :) | 12:21 |
| === fta_ is now known as fta | ||
| bobbo | geser: current version is 0.1 and I dont know how to version the next bugfix | 12:21 |
| geser | I'd probably use 0.1.1 but better ask evand about the versioning scheme for it | 12:23 |
| bobbo | geser: ok, thanks | 12:23 |
| geser | but 0.1-1 seems also good as you don't touch "upstream" version space | 12:24 |
| nhandler | Is there a way to be able to build a source package (debuild -S) with an Ubuntu version in debian/changelog, but a non-ubuntu maintainer in debian/control? | 13:56 |
| DktrKranz | nhandler, export DEBEMAIL=something_not_containing@ubuntu.com | 13:57 |
| DktrKranz | I'm not sure it can be bypassed in other ways, that's the one I use when I need to :) | 13:58 |
| nhandler | Thanks DktrKranz. That worked. IMHO, there should be an option you can pass to debuild that will tell it to not complain about this. | 14:00 |
| DktrKranz | that change is hardcoded in devscripts, but I think a wishlist bug can be filed. Not sure if it has already discussed, though | 14:01 |
| DktrKranz | nhandler, could you please try with dpkg-buildpackage -S -W ? | 14:02 |
| nhandler | What does the -W option do DktrKranz ? | 14:03 |
| DktrKranz | if it doesn't work, change could be probably integrated with that option to turn error into a warning | 14:03 |
| RainCT | nhandler: -W Negates a previously set -E. Only dpkg-source uses this, but dpkg-buildpackage recognizes it, and passes it thru to dpkg-source. | 14:03 |
| RainCT | nhandler: manpages are your friends :) | 14:03 |
| DktrKranz | RainCT, we haven't manpages.u.c yet :) | 14:03 |
| RainCT | DktrKranz: we have :) | 14:04 |
| DktrKranz | wasn't it empty? | 14:04 |
| iulian | And it rocks so far :) | 14:04 |
| RainCT | DktrKranz: no, the default page is just bad. search for something or click on a distro and you'll get the manpages | 14:04 |
| geser | nhandler: what's the use case for this? (ubuntu version but no ubuntu maintainer) | 14:04 |
| nhandler | DktrKranz: 'dpkg-buildpackage -S -W' failed with the same error | 14:04 |
| DktrKranz | RainCT, WOW, thanks :) | 14:05 |
| === asac_ is now known as asac | ||
| iulian | RainCT: Well, I wouldn't say that the default page is bad :-) What would you expect to see in a page that shows only manpages? | 14:06 |
| * iulian thinks that is great. | 14:06 | |
| nhandler | geser: I am currently submitting a patch that was applied in Ubuntu to Debian. As a result, there is no need to have an Ubuntu maintainer. I like to include the changelog entry in the patch to make it easy for the Debian Maintainer to quickly see what changes the patch includes. | 14:06 |
| RainCT | iulian: something ;). the current page looks confusing | 14:08 |
| nhandler | RainCT: I don't think it is too confusing. I just hope that they create a script that I can run from a terminal to fetch manpages from manpages.ubuntu.com. | 14:08 |
| RainCT | iulian: at least the dots would link to the <distro>/<section>/ index page, or there should be a big version of the search box or something | 14:09 |
| RainCT | iulian: I also thinked that the page was empty like DktrKranz until I saw that someone mentioned the search box on the ML | 14:09 |
| RainCT | *thought :P | 14:09 |
| RainCT | nhandler: somewhere someone (yes, my memory is great :)) said that he was working on a patch for man | 14:10 |
| iulian | nhandler: That website is there just to not use 'man' in a command line, isn't it? | 14:10 |
| RainCT | nhandler: which would fetch the manpages if it isn't available | 14:10 |
| * DktrKranz was lazy enought to avoid noticing search box | 14:10 | |
| sebner | RainCT: requestsync is totally b0rken for me. but /me can't send a crash report since firefox is also b0rken xD | 14:11 |
| RainCT | lol | 14:11 |
| RainCT | sebner: what's the problem? | 14:11 |
| nhandler | RainCT: I would love to see that patch in the repositories. It would save me a lot of time. | 14:11 |
| DktrKranz | RainCT, it's a feature, it's a feature, IT'S A FEATURE! :) | 14:12 |
| sebner | RainCT: http://paste.ubuntu.com/43924/ | 14:12 |
| DktrKranz | I broken it intentionally to avoid sebner using it | 14:12 |
| DktrKranz | *broke | 14:12 |
| sebner | DktrKranz: /me is using it the first time :P | 14:12 |
| iulian | RainCT: Ahh, you haven't noticed the search box? Yeah, I think it should be moved somewhere else. | 14:12 |
| geser | RainCT: perhaps somewhere = planet.u.c, someone = kirkland ? | 14:12 |
| nhandler | sebner: Have you tried using the --lp option? | 14:12 |
| RainCT | sebner: you didn't close Firefox properly or something | 14:12 |
| sebner | nhandler: in the first try, yes | 14:13 |
| sebner | ah | 14:13 |
| sebner | working again | 14:13 |
| sebner | ^^ xD xD xD | 14:13 |
| DktrKranz | gah! | 14:13 |
| RainCT | sebner: although showing a warning and trying to find a cookie somewhere else would be good. feel free to submit a patch ;) | 14:13 |
| * DktrKranz hides from sebner | 14:13 | |
| sebner | DktrKranz: I still have >5 sync requests without filing more now ;) | 14:13 |
| * geser has exported his LP cookie to a text file which requestsync uses | 14:14 | |
| sebner | RainCT: /me != python | 14:14 |
| RainCT | sebner: then learn python while you are young :P | 14:14 |
| iulian | Or C | 14:14 |
| DktrKranz | sebner, brainfuck is a better choice | 14:14 |
| sebner | RainCT: no ^^ , btw. how to use this thing O_o I read the manpage but it's still a secret to me | 14:14 |
| * RainCT runs away from iulian | 14:14 | |
| sebner | iulian: C , gah | 14:14 |
| sebner | DktrKranz: what about whitespaces? | 14:15 |
| RainCT | sebner: requestsync <package> intrepid | 14:15 |
| DktrKranz | sebner, butterflies | 14:15 |
| DktrKranz | sebner, you are new to programming languages, it's better to start with something easy. assembler is a good starting point | 14:15 |
| sebner | RainCT: you are my hero :D (writing intrepid shouldn't be necessary. fix it!) :P :P :P | 14:16 |
| sebner | DktrKranz: rofl. hmm not that new. /me likes C# xD | 14:16 |
| RainCT | DktrKranz: ah, a got an idea a while ago.. We should get a rule so that when sebner gets a MOTU he has to sponsor as many stuff as he got sponsored | 14:16 |
| nhandler | DktrKranz: Yeah right. I would suggest perl ;) | 14:16 |
| RainCT | s/a/I | 14:16 |
| iulian | RainCT, sebner: I prefer to write something in C instead of python, but yeah, python is great too. | 14:16 |
| DktrKranz | sebner, c#??? go away, go away, GO AWAY! | 14:16 |
| nhandler | RainCT: I think all MOTUs should be doing that anyway. | 14:17 |
| sebner | DktrKranz: :P | 14:17 |
| * geser throws mono at sebner | 14:17 | |
| DktrKranz | RainCT, sebner is under *my* pressure. When he become MOTU, I'll push so many debdiffs to him he will collapse | 14:17 |
| iulian | Haha | 14:17 |
| RainCT | :) | 14:17 |
| * RainCT hugs DktrKranz | 14:17 | |
| sebner | geser: mono rocks :) | 14:17 |
| sebner | DktrKranz: what about reviewing it yourself instead :P | 14:17 |
| DktrKranz | sebner, I'll drop my MOTU icon by then | 14:18 |
| DktrKranz | just for the sake to bother you | 14:18 |
| sebner | DktrKranz: lol. | 14:18 |
| * RainCT rofl | 14:18 | |
| * sebner hides and runs away. No sebner no MOTU | 14:18 | |
| sebner | RainCT: help me to haXX0r my .lpcookie.txt | 14:18 |
| sebner | XD | 14:18 |
| nhandler | According to the top uploaders page that emgent made, I will have to sponsor 177 patches (as of now) in order to make up for the ones that other people sponsored for me | 14:19 |
| iulian | sebner: You like C# and hate C? | 14:19 |
| RainCT | sebner: you should leave stupid sync requests and create some good packages instead, and then finally apply to MOTU. | 14:19 |
| sebner | iulian: there are worlds between them O_o | 14:19 |
| iulian | Or I misunderstood? | 14:19 |
| sebner | RainCT: stupid? I'm fixing RC bugs :P | 14:20 |
| iulian | Well yea... | 14:20 |
| DktrKranz | does anybody know how many times (and what are they) PPA publishes binary packages? | 14:20 |
| jorgenpt | PPAs are updated every 5 minutes, afaik? | 14:20 |
| RainCT | sebner: yes but once you're a MOTU you can fix more RC bugs as you save time because you don't need to subscribe u-u-s ;) | 14:20 |
| RainCT | iulian: C# is more like Java, afaik | 14:21 |
| sebner | RainCT: doesn't matter. Have I never told you? I pushed my application back after intrepid release | 14:21 |
| nhandler | RainCT: C# and java are very similar | 14:21 |
| RainCT | (I don't know much about it, though. Knowing who created it scares me away *g*) | 14:21 |
| DktrKranz | jorgenpt, upload queue is scanned every 5 minutes, I was referring to publishing binary packages into the repository | 14:21 |
| iulian | RainCT: Indeed | 14:21 |
| jorgenpt | Oh, thought that was the same timer. | 14:21 |
| sebner | DktrKranz: have you noticed that nhandler uploaded >50 packages more than I did? Punish him! :P | 14:21 |
| DktrKranz | nhandler, keep rocking. sebner: go on retirement | 14:22 |
| RainCT | sebner: where are the stats? | 14:22 |
| iulian | RainCT: /+uploaded-packages? | 14:23 |
| sebner | RainCT: http://thc.emanuele-gentili.com/utu/ | 14:23 |
| sebner | well exactly 50 ^^ | 14:23 |
| RainCT | thanks | 14:23 |
| sebner | DktrKranz: I should :) | 14:23 |
| * DktrKranz has 285 ?!?!?!? | 14:23 | |
| sebner | DktrKranz: seems so ^^ | 14:24 |
| DktrKranz | mh... I didn't think so many | 14:24 |
| iulian | Ahh, didn't know that emgent hosts a service like this. | 14:24 |
| DktrKranz | but I suppose it's right :) | 14:24 |
| sebner | DktrKranz: xD | 14:24 |
| * DktrKranz wrote underlying code... python rocks! | 14:25 | |
| RainCT | blargh my package count for intrepid is pathetic :P | 14:25 |
| iulian | Yikes! I'm 69 | 14:25 |
| sebner | RainCT: hihi :P | 14:25 |
| * RainCT considers breaking some stuff and fixing it afterwards to get some more uploads :P | 14:25 | |
| sebner | lol | 14:26 |
| sebner | lol | 14:26 |
| sebner | lol | 14:26 |
| * RainCT discards that idea before Scott kills him ;P | 14:26 | |
| sebner | RainCT: meanwhile you could tell me how to haXX0r my .lpcookie.txt to make it working | 14:26 |
| DktrKranz | RainCT, could I suggest you "dch -i Rebuild just to enter Top-10 uploader list" ? | 14:26 |
| RainCT | and I'm still listed several times.. emgent`nl will you fix that somewhen? :P | 14:26 |
| RainCT | DktrKranz: Good idea. I could write a script to do that with all 20.000 universe packages :) | 14:27 |
| geser | sebner: wget http://people.ubuntu.com/~kees/scripts/cookies-sql2txt, run it and store the output in ~/.lpcookie.txt | 14:27 |
| DktrKranz | RainCT, do you want it? I already have it... now seahorse-plugins is in place, it's all automatic :) | 14:28 |
| * DktrKranz hugs twice seb128 for that! | 14:28 | |
| RainCT | geser: I think requestsync already uses that script | 14:28 |
| sebner | geser: you are my hero now :D | 14:29 |
| RainCT | DktrKranz: woo. what is that for? | 14:29 |
| RainCT | (seahorse-plugins) | 14:29 |
| DktrKranz | RainCT, it keeps stored your gpg password, no need to retype it each time | 14:29 |
| geser | RainCT: yes, but sebner wanted to store the cookie in a text file | 14:30 |
| DktrKranz | and when you do NBS cleaning, it's AWESOME! | 14:30 |
| RainCT | btw, I installed and purged epiphany-browser a while ago and since then whenever I try to open a link from terminator it opens in gnome-terminal with elinks :/. How can I fix that? | 14:30 |
| * sebner doesn't want but requestsyncs wants | 14:30 | |
| geser | RainCT: select an other default browser doesn't work for you? | 14:33 |
| RainCT | geser: Where? | 14:34 |
| geser | Gnome or KDE? | 14:34 |
| RainCT | geser: Gnome. I already have Fx3 selected on System -> Prefs. -> Prefered Applications | 14:35 |
| DktrKranz | use chrome with wine :P | 14:37 |
| Laney | RainCT: What does `xdg-open http://some.url' do? | 14:37 |
| sebner | DktrKranz: It's running but not usable xD | 14:38 |
| RainCT | Laney: elinks | 14:38 |
| DktrKranz | sebner, so I guess you already tried... bad boy | 14:38 |
| Laney | RainCT: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xdg-utils/+bug/255621 | 14:38 |
| sebner | DktrKranz: sure I tried :P | 14:38 |
| ubottu | Ubuntu bug 255621 in xdg-utils "xdg-open's Gnome detection is broken" [Medium,Confirmed] | 14:38 |
| sebner | geser: sebner@ubuntu:~/Desktop$ python cookies-sql2txt | 14:39 |
| sebner | Usage: %s SQLITE3DB DOMAIN | 14:39 |
| sebner | !? | 14:39 |
| RainCT | Laney: thanks | 14:39 |
| RainCT | Laney: is the problem also on Hardy? | 14:40 |
| Laney | No idea! | 14:40 |
| Laney | I don't think so though | 14:40 |
| geser | sebner: python cookies-sql2text ~/.mozilla/firefox/*/cookies.sqlite launchpad | tee ~/.lpcookie.txt | 14:40 |
| sebner | geser: O_o | 14:40 |
| Laney | Do echo $GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID and see if it returns anything | 14:40 |
| RainCT | Laney: OK, it doesn't; I'll define that in my ~/.bashrc then. Thanks :) | 14:41 |
| sebner | geser: output is "# HTTP Cookie File" xD | 14:43 |
| geser | so it worked | 14:45 |
| sebner | geser: not really xD but nvm. I'm doing it oldstyle | 14:47 |
| RainCT | sebner: the "database is locked" exception is catched now and only prints a warning | 14:48 |
| mok0 | What is the status of the following page? It seems to be somewhat out of date. When looking through the MOTU minutes, it seems persia promised to create a writeup on the New Upstream Review process (using interdiff) but I can't locate that anywhere? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Meetings/2007-11-05/NewUpstreamReview | 14:48 |
| RainCT | mok0: I don't know about that page, but I thought we don't use interdiff anymore? | 14:49 |
| mok0 | RainCT: yeah, me too | 14:49 |
| geser | that's what I also remember, current is attach the new .diff.gz | 14:49 |
| sebner | RainCT: bah, you did gbrainy 1.0 :P | 14:49 |
| mok0 | geser: but it's not documented anywhere? | 14:50 |
| RainCT | sebner: of course :P | 14:50 |
| mok0 | Our wiki is getting sanded with loads of out-of-date info | 14:50 |
| sebner | RainCT: you stole me a FFe sync :P | 14:51 |
| geser | NCommander: Hi, interested in an interesting FTBFS? It involves libtool though. | 14:52 |
| ScottK | geser: NCommander likes fixing libtool stuff. | 15:00 |
| devfil | zul: ping | 15:10 |
| zul | devfil: pong | 15:11 |
| devfil | zul: can you please take a look at bug 264554 ? | 15:11 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 264554 in xen-3.3 "libxen3 and libxen3-dev both include /usr/lib/libblktap.so" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/264554 | 15:11 |
| Laney | apachelogger: Hi, are you interested in a debdiff for the kdelibs ftbfs? | 15:12 |
| zul | devfil: ok | 15:12 |
| apachelogger | Laney: very much so | 15:12 |
| Laney | apachelogger: Excellent, just testbuilding then I will give it to you | 15:12 |
| apachelogger | cool :) | 15:13 |
| * Laney updates GPG key with Ubuntu address \o/ | 15:15 | |
| RainCT | sebner: uhm? gbrainy 1.00 isn't in Debian | 15:27 |
| RainCT | sebner: and it didn't need a FFe | 15:28 |
| RainCT | mok0: nice mail (re rsplib) :) | 15:31 |
| mok0 | RainCT: All that stuff ought to be in a guide for REVU uploaders | 15:31 |
| RainCT | mok0: indeed. maybe somewhere in (or linked from) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU | 15:32 |
| mok0 | RainCT: Right! I could start a document based on that email | 15:33 |
| Ampelbein | hi there! i have a question about fixing a bug. If the package has not yet an automated-patch-system could i then use quilt to make my patches? or should i use inline-patching? | 15:50 |
| RainCT | Ampelbein: if there isn't any commented out patch system or such it is usually recommended to see which one the Maintainer uses on some others of his packages, or use the easiest one (eg., if the package uses CDBS then the obvious choice would be simple-patchsys.mk) | 15:53 |
| Ampelbein | ah, ok. thank you. | 15:54 |
| ScottK | liw: Are you around? | 15:55 |
| Adri2000 | zul: fail2ban sru? | 16:03 |
| gnomefreak | is revu updated every 10 minutes? or is there an issue with revu | 16:17 |
| RainCT | gnomefreak: do you have a problem? | 16:33 |
| gnomefreak | RainCT: i repushed a package and its not updating it | 16:41 |
| gnomefreak | RainCT: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=firegpg isnt updating its been 30 minutes or so since push | 16:41 |
| andresj | are people here? i created a package to solve https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lyx/+bug/253196 in my PPA (https://edge.launchpad.net/~andresjriofrio/+archive), and I was wondering if a MOTU member could check it (it works flawlessly with me) and release the upgrade... | 16:43 |
| ubottu | Ubuntu bug 253196 in lyx "Bugfix upstream release of Lyx (1.5.6)" [Low,Triaged] | 16:43 |
| andresj | i have both intrepid and a straightforward backport (no changes except in changelog) to hardy | 16:43 |
| Laney | andresj: You should follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess | 16:46 |
| andresj | Laney: mm... ok I'll go that, thanks :) | 16:47 |
| Laney | andresj: Did you speak to the Debian maintainer of lyx? | 16:48 |
| andresj | Laney: no, I didn't. I created the package mainly so that I could have the new version. :P but then I saw that bug and thought my packages would help. | 16:49 |
| Laney | andresj: Well if it's good he might want to upload it to Debian, no sense duplicating work | 16:50 |
| Laney | But there is a freeze on over there so he might not | 16:50 |
| andresj | Laney: mm... I see, I see. Do bugfix releases superseed freezes like in Ubuntu? | 16:51 |
| Laney | andresj: Only for "important" bugs | 16:52 |
| Laney | And I see that 1.6 is already in experimental so it's probably not very likely | 16:52 |
| andresj | hahaha, ok. I'll try sending this using the Sponsorship Process, then. :) And nice to hear that, now I can use that package and port it to Ubuntu. :P Although I'm not sure which would be easier... | 16:54 |
| Adri2000 | are automatic config.{guess,sub} changes acceptable in a sru? | 16:54 |
| RainCT | gnomefreak: the firegpg upload was rejected | 17:04 |
| andresj | hey is there a way to see the changes in the .diff.gz between two packages (same program, diff versions)? | 17:05 |
| RainCT | gnomefreak: uhm.. seems like it worked now; do you see it? | 17:06 |
| RainCT | andresj: debdiff <old>.dsc <new>.dsc | 17:06 |
| andresj | RainCT: thanks :) oh and btw there's somebody in RainCT_ | 17:08 |
| andresj | oh and is there a command to download all files related (.orig.tar.gz, .diff.gz) given the .dsc? | 17:09 |
| === DrKranz is now known as DktrKranz | ||
| DktrKranz | Adri2000, it could be better if they can be omitted (e.g. launching debuild -S in a $distro chroot) | 17:11 |
| ScottK | andresj: dget is what you want. | 17:11 |
| Adri2000 | DktrKranz: ok | 17:13 |
| andresj | ScottK: oh ok thanks :) | 17:17 |
| andresj | ScottK: hey debdiff also compares the upstream version files; is there a way to stop it from doing that? | 17:19 |
| ScottK | No. | 17:19 |
| andresj | umm... | 17:20 |
| ScottK | Just use diff directly and diff the two debian dirs. | 17:20 |
| andresj | ScottK: what is the command to prepare a dir? | 17:20 |
| andresj | that does: tar -xf .orig; apply diff; etc | 17:20 |
| ScottK | dpkg-source -x xxx.dsc | 17:21 |
| andresj | haha thanks! wow its like u had all this in your head already | 17:22 |
| === emma is now known as |riVen| | ||
| === |riVen| is now known as emma | ||
| gnomefreak | RainCT: ill check | 17:29 |
| gnomefreak | RainCT: ah it did thanks | 17:29 |
| gnomefreak | should i add ubuntu-universe-sponsors to the bug ? | 17:30 |
| gnomefreak | ah already are | 17:31 |
| gnomefreak | can someone please review and sponsor http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=firegpg u-u-s is already subscribed to bug all lintian warnings/errors have been fixed | 17:33 |
| mok0 | gnomefreak: we have FeatureFreeze... | 17:40 |
| gnomefreak | already | 17:40 |
| mok0 | gnomefreak: since aug. 28 | 17:40 |
| gnomefreak | oh | 17:41 |
| mok0 | Hopefully REVU days will start again when the devel cycle begins | 17:42 |
| gnomefreak | devel cycle for intrepid+1 | 17:42 |
| mok0 | gnomefreak: yes | 17:42 |
| mok0 | "jj" :-) | 17:43 |
| nxvl | cody-somerville: ping | 17:45 |
| cody-somerville | nxvl, pong | 18:07 |
| nxvl | cody-somerville: i forgot what i was looking for you :S | 18:07 |
| nxvl | s/what/why | 18:09 |
| andresj | hey anybody know how to add universe/multiverse repositories to my pbuilder? | 18:13 |
| andresj | i tried `pbuilder --login` and adding them, but it won't work. | 18:13 |
| andresj | it doesn't change anything, i mean | 18:13 |
| ScottK | andresj: If you want to login and have the results saved, you also need --save-after-login | 18:14 |
| andresj | hahaha oh ok! :) | 18:14 |
| andresj | thanks | 18:14 |
| geser | andresj: see also the wiki how to add universe to your pbuilder (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#Universe%20support) | 18:15 |
| andresj | haha thanks that's so much easier :) | 18:16 |
| DktrKranz | ScottK, re bug 267187, is it legal for motu-release members to self-ACK requests? | 18:17 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 267187 in yazpp "[FFe] libyaz3 transition" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/267187 | 18:17 |
| ScottK | DktrKranz: Absolutely. | 18:19 |
| ScottK | It's one of the prime perks of doing all this work. | 18:19 |
| DktrKranz | ok, I'll ack it myself and then upload. thanks. | 18:19 |
| riot_le | hi @all, i have an Question about Bugfixing | 18:22 |
| riot_le | i joined dholbachs Lessons at UDW this week and want to start with my new knownledges, i take an patch from fedora (found on harvest: http://daniel.holba.ch/harvest/handler.py?pkg=gnome-settings-daemon¬_apply=11547) and apply this patch, edit the changelog, debuild, pbuilder and created an debdiff. What have to follow next? | 18:25 |
| riot_le | no one there who can help? | 18:31 |
| albert23 | riot_le: now you attach your debdiff to the bug report and subscribe the right sponsor team. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess | 18:31 |
| riot_le | there is no bug in Launchpad to that, i have taken this patch from direct from fedora-cvs | 18:34 |
| albert23 | riot_le: in that case you open a bug yourself and describe the problem that will be fixed with your patch. | 18:35 |
| riot_le | ok thank you albert23 | 18:37 |
| albert23 | riot_le: no problem | 18:38 |
| mok0 | I've thrown a few paragraphs into a new wiki document. Please help expand! https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVUWhatNext | 18:41 |
| riot_le | albert23: i open a new bug report: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/267210 do you think that looks good? | 18:43 |
| ubottu | Ubuntu bug 267210 in gnome-settings-daemon "no sound sample cache plugin that drops cached samples from pulseaudio " [Undecided,New] | 18:43 |
| albert23 | riot_le: From reading the bug, it's not clear for me yet what the problem is that will be fixed. | 18:46 |
| riot_le | i think there was no real problem, the patch just added a plugin | 18:48 |
| albert23 | riot_le: so it is a new feature? | 18:50 |
| riot_le | in my opinion yes | 18:51 |
| riot_le | i try it | 18:51 |
| albert23 | riot_le: in that case it may be a problem. We have FeatureFreeze now, and only fix bugs for Intrepid | 18:51 |
| riot_le | ah ok, ill try to find another bug to improve my bugfixing-knowledge | 18:52 |
| albert23 | riot_le: that may be better. Good luck! | 18:55 |
| riot_le | thanks for your help | 18:55 |
| apachelogger | Laney: what's the testbuild status? | 19:11 |
| === superm1|away is now known as superm1 | ||
| === superm1 is now known as superm1|away | ||
| === tuxmaniac is now known as Shilpa_ | ||
| === Shilpa_ is now known as tuxmaniac | ||
| NCommander | ScottK, :-P | 23:17 |
| ScottK-laptop | ? | 23:17 |
| ScottK-laptop | Oh, the libtool thing. | 23:17 |
| NCommander | ScottK, yeah :-P | 23:22 |
| * NCommander runs through his email | 23:25 | |
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