[17:55] <Eghie> some (edu)buntu developer here?
[17:56] <Eghie> I want to help solving the bugs for hanging applications, although I want to know what information is needed to make the logs usefull
[17:57] <Eghie> hanging applications, which is the main problem on LTSP at the moment
[17:57] <Eghie> for example, some Gnome applications don't close when the parent is closed
[17:58] <HedgeMage> Eghie:  it's a Friday, hard to find people on the weekends -- you may have better luck during the week, or using the mailing list
[17:58] <Eghie> ah
[17:58] <Eghie> ok
[17:58] <Eghie> well, I tried to send a mail to the edubuntu list, but it seems it was needed to moderate it, but it was never posted on the list
[17:59] <Eghie> so that's why i ask here
[17:59] <HedgeMage> ahh, once the moderators check their queues, I'm sure it will be posted
[17:59] <HedgeMage> Otherwise, try here monday :)
[18:00] <Eghie> hehe, ok
[18:01] <Eghie> well, I wanted it to be on the list at this very moment, because people could see some debugging tools I posted with, so they could report bugs before wednesday, when there is a bugsquashing day
[18:09] <HedgeMage> Eghie:  then hang out and keep trying -- someone may yet show up :)
[18:10] <Eghie> hehe, I just leave it to the moderators
[18:10] <Eghie> bug reporting could always be done, so that shouldn't be a problem
[18:11] <HedgeMage> ;)
[18:59] <sbalneav> Eghie: Which apps are hanging?
[18:59] <Eghie> sbalneav: for example gconf
[19:00] <Eghie> sbalneav: when gnome-session gets killed
[19:01] <sbalneav> Yup gconf is one that gets left around.
[19:01] <sbalneav> Do any stop your users from logging in again?
[19:02] <sbalneav> For instance, the gconf gets left around, but it doesn't affect a subsequent login by the same user.
[19:02] <Eghie> sbalneav: well, I kill them with a script before they login again
[19:03] <sbalneav> Many of the ones that get left around don't actually affect anything.
[19:03] <sbalneav> They SHOULD exit, but leaving them is OK
[19:03] <sbalneav> I'm more concerned about, say, a paneld that doesn't exit, so that the next time the user logs in, they can't start their panel.
[19:03] <Eghie> sbalneav: well I read the edubuntu mailing list, and I saw many of those problems
[19:04] <Eghie> I do already have some experience with this, so I wanted to help
[19:04] <Eghie> I saw your comments on it, so, I though, well, lets look what we can do
[19:04] <Eghie> sbalneav: hmm, I do remind some panel
[19:05] <sbalneav> Right.  People are making an issue of things that don't exit.  While they are a bug, what we want to focus on FIRST is something that actually stops people or affects people from logging back in.
[19:05] <Eghie> sbalneav: indeed, gconf did hold up on Ubuntu edgy though
[19:05] <Eghie> sbalneav: but, that could be changed now
[19:05] <Eghie> sbalneav: gconf had a lock on some files
[19:05] <sbalneav> Here at LegalAid, I get gconfd's left around all the time.  I just leave them, because they don't seem to hurt anything.  When, say, a paneld gets hung, that stops a person from logging back in.
[19:06] <sbalneav> I want us to target and triage the important ones FIRST.  We'll get to them all eventually, but we need to focus on the ones that actually degrade performance.
[19:07] <Eghie> sbalneav: yes I know, it's a matter of priority
[19:09] <sbalneav> gvfs is one of the ones that seems to be a current problem.
[19:09] <Eghie> yes, I also saw that in the mailinglist, but I do not seem to have that problem for now
[19:10] <sbalneav> I've currently got 153 of them running on this box that only supports 4 people :)
[19:11] <Eghie> hehe
[19:11] <Eghie> also a hanging dcopserver
[19:11] <Eghie> ah, not any more
[19:11] <Eghie> seems being killed a little late
[19:12] <Eghie> I going for a little coffe
[19:13] <Eghie> coffee
[19:13] <Eghie> being back in 15 minutes i guess
[19:14] <Eghie> will be trying laten on, to simulate some crashes on my server to see if some processes block my relogin process
[20:16] <sbalneav> Hmm, well the patch to gvfs that I found and posted on the DebuggingLTSP page seems to have cured some of my gvfs woes
[20:17] <sbalneav> built a new package, and now it exits properly on session end.
[20:19] <Eghie> sbalneav: can you send me a link to the patches?
[20:22] <Eghie> sbalneav: ah, I see already in the bugzilla of gnome
[20:23] <Eghie> the: if (subthread_main_loop != NULL) patch
[20:24] <sbalneav> I've installed some new packages here, I'll let them run for a couple of days, see if that cures the hanging gvfs
[20:24] <sbalneav> Looks like they've already updated it in the upstream gnome svn, so long term it should go away
[20:25] <sbalneav> Apparently gconfd doesn't have proper shutdown code in it, but we may be able to (sanely) get around that one with a gconftool-2 --shutdown in a ldm logout script.
[20:28] <Eghie> sbalneav: gconfd stays polling, not detecting anything
[20:29] <sbalneav> right, but if we send it an explicit shutdown, that may help
[20:29] <Petaris> Hi all
[20:29] <sbalneav> Hello
[20:29] <Eghie> sbalneav: that could help yes
[20:29] <Eghie> hello
[20:30] <Petaris> I just installed edubuntu 8.04 LTSP and I was wondering what the best way to get xfce was
[20:30] <Petaris> should I just go for that package or should I install the kubuntu meta
[20:30] <Eghie> Petaris: aptitude install xubuntu-desktop should do some tricks :)
[20:31] <Eghie> Petaris: well xubuntu-desktop contains a full xfce desktop
[20:31] <Eghie> Petaris: so, if you want that, go for that
[20:32] <Petaris> ok
[20:32] <Petaris> and I did mean xubuntu not kubuntu
[20:32] <Petaris> woops
[20:32] <Petaris> :)
[20:34] <Eghie> sbalneav: sending a shutdown seems to work
[20:35] <Eghie> sbalneav: at least, for me it works, so a logout script doing that could be a workaround for it
[20:36] <Petaris> Thanks Eghie
[20:36] <Eghie> Petaris: no problem
[20:38] <Eghie> sbalneav: saw this: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/235698  ?
[20:39] <Eghie> it's being tested in Intrepid, but not being backported to Hardy yet, I guess
[20:44] <Eghie> sbalneav: I just reported a bug for gconf2: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gconf2/+bug/269541
[20:44] <Eghie> I couldn't find it on Launchpad
[20:44] <Eghie> so maybe by a couple of weeks, it will also be of the past
[20:47] <sbalneav> Do you have an orphaned one there right now?
[20:47] <sbalneav> can you (as the user) run a gconftool-2 --shutdown, and see if it exits cleanly?
[20:49] <Eghie> sbalneav: I did already and it did exit cleanly yes
[20:51] <Eghie> I executed the script as the user
[20:51] <Eghie> so, it could be usefull in a logout script
[20:52] <sbalneav> Perfect.  It's a better solution than the "kill " option
[20:52] <Eghie> sbalneav: indeed it is
[20:52] <Eghie> i hope gvfs would react on it as well, although I don't think it will
[20:53] <Lns> Are we talking about orphaned processes after logging out of a TC session?
[20:53] <Eghie> Lns: yes
[20:53] <sbalneav> If you run into some other ones, put 'em at the end of wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingLTSP
[20:53] <Lns> sbalneav: I can give you a bunch as gnome-watchdog syslogs all of the procs it kills after logout
[20:53] <Lns> it seems to be just a few common ones, however
[20:54] <sbalneav> You've posted them on the list, I think, right?
[20:54] <Lns> Hmmm...not sure if I did. I'll put it on the wiki regardless
[20:54] <sbalneav> So far we have potential (proper) solutions for gconfd and gvfd-fuse-daemon
[20:54] <sbalneav> sure, throw 'em on the wiki
[20:54] <Lns> nice
[20:54] <Lns> yeah I know those 2 were common
[20:54] <Lns> and bonobo-activation...
[20:54] <Eghie> Lns: it would be nice if you could strace them, the processes
[20:55] <sbalneav> bonobo-activation-server seems to be another one for me.
[20:56]  * Lns hates the panel drawer bug
[20:57] <Eghie> I just putted the gconfd proces on the wiki with the launchpad bug report on it
[20:58] <Lns> sbalneav: I have a HUGE file, i guess i'll link to it instead of cluttering up the wiki page
[20:59] <Eghie> Lns: could you host the file and link to it via the wiki?
[20:59] <Lns> yeah
[20:59] <Eghie> that would be great
[20:59] <Eghie> I can also host the file if you want
[20:59] <Lns> it's cool..i can see my webserver from my desk. ;)
[20:59] <Eghie> lol :)
[21:04]  * Lns links http://logicalnetworking.net/other/watchdog.txt to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingLTSP
[21:04] <Lns> i'll post that to the list too
[21:12] <Eghie> ah, my beer is calling
[21:12] <Eghie> see you later
[21:13] <Lns> haha..priorities! ;) see ya Eghie
[21:13] <Eghie> indeed :)