[03:28] <rsc_> guys help. anyone know GTK theming here? my theme fails when the colors are set to default. "Invalid symbolic color 'fg_color'"
[11:11] <dilomo> anybody knows how to theme the notification balloon here:
[11:11] <dilomo> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/17688393/Screenshot.png
[11:36] <cody-somerville> dilomo, yup
[11:36] <cody-somerville> You need to modify the source code
[11:37] <dilomo> what source code?
[11:37] <dilomo> of Rhythmnox?
[11:37] <cody-somerville> no
[11:37] <cody-somerville> of the notification-daemon
[11:37] <dilomo> Rhythmbox*
[11:37] <dilomo> explain
[11:38] <cody-somerville> notification-daemon is responsible for those pop-ups
[11:38] <dilomo> yes but can't I change their color without
[11:38] <dilomo> modifying the src but
[11:38] <dilomo> with using gtkrc match patterns?
[11:38] <cody-somerville> I'm sure you can.
[11:39] <dilomo> can you give me a tip or smth
[11:39] <dilomo> or pint me to the source code
[11:40] <dilomo> so that I can look up for the names
[11:40] <cody-somerville> at the command line, type: apt-get source notification-daemon
[11:41] <dilomo> thanks
[11:41] <dilomo> I will try to do something
[11:41] <dilomo> bbl
[12:15] <dilomo> I'm trying this:
[12:15] <dilomo> widget_class "*NotifyDaemon*" style :highest "newwave-notify-daemon"
[12:15] <dilomo> but it doesn't work.
[12:15] <dilomo> Any ideas?
[12:18] <andreasn> it should be possible to set the theme used in gconf
[12:19] <zniavre> isn't just >widget_class "*notif*" 	
[12:19] <dilomo> probably but I need something that can change it from the gtkrc
[12:19] <andreasn> I'm not sure that is possible currently
[12:19] <dilomo> zniavre: I will try
[12:20] <andreasn> but I could be wrong
[12:20] <dilomo> andreasn: theming is hard task
[12:24] <dilomo> zniavre: I had different style for the "*notif*"
[12:24] <dilomo> actually the panel style
[12:25] <dilomo> but it doesn't seem that the notify has these colors
[12:25] <dilomo> here's example:
[12:25] <dilomo>  http://launchpadlibrarian.net/17688393/Screenshot.png
[12:28] <Cimi_> Still not in love with that menubar
[12:29] <Cimi_> also I'm not convinced on the statusbar
[12:29] <Cimi_> te icon theme should be much more sharp/contrasted
[12:29] <Cimi_> given the high contrast of new wave
[12:30] <dilomo> Cimi: I know about the icons
[12:30] <Cimi_> use tango
[12:30] <dilomo> but i don't have time for them
[12:31] <dilomo> why are you not convinced about the statusbar
[12:31] <Cimi_> it looks washed out
[12:33] <dilomo> and the menu?
[12:36] <Cimi_> haven't seen
[12:36] <dilomo> I meant the menubar
[12:36] <Cimi_> I really can't stand why we should copy osx with those dark menubars
[12:38] <dilomo> this is not a copy but a usability feature
[12:38] <dilomo> that allows you to concentrate on the contents
[12:38] <dilomo> and your actual work not the menu and menubar
[12:39] <Cimi_> well
[12:39] <Cimi_> having a dark menubar is concentrating you to the menubar, not the contents
[12:39] <Cimi_> so is is less usable
[12:39] <dilomo> have you tried it out?
[12:39] <Cimi_> when I see those screenshots, I'm noticing the dark menubar at first
[12:39] <dilomo> it actually works and all the people I have asked say it works
[12:40] <Cimi_> this is just suggestion imho
[12:40] <dilomo> probably this is a first impression but
[12:40] <Cimi_> http://www.trackback.it/wp-galleryo/le-nuove-feature-di-snow-leopard/snow-leopard-versione.jpg
[12:40] <Cimi_> as osx
[12:40] <dilomo> it works for me
[12:40] <Cimi_> dark menubar
[12:41] <dilomo> well thats toolbar and titlebar but
[12:41] <Cimi_> same thing
[12:41] <Cimi_> osx toolbar = out menubar
[12:41] <Cimi_> *our
[12:42] <Cimi_> since osx doesn't have a menubar in the window
[12:42] <Cimi_> just be honest and say *well I was inspired*
[12:42] <Cimi_> no one is killing you for inspirations :)
[12:43] <dilomo> no I haven't had inspiration from mac
[12:43] <dilomo> if you had carefully
[12:43] <Cimi_> I'm just disappointed that we have three themes in the community artworks and all of these have this osx menubar
[12:43] <dilomo> read the mailing list you had probably
[12:44] <dilomo> noticed that it all started just like an experiment
[12:44] <dilomo> way back in April or May
[12:44] <Cimi_> ok
[12:44] <andreasn> Cimi_: I think the drawback of using this kind of combined toolbar/titlebar is that on Mac OS X you can click and drag on the whole area, where with Metacity/GTK+ you can't
[12:45] <andreasn> (as far as I know)
[12:45] <Cimi_> yeah
[12:45] <Cimi_> this concerns usability
[12:45] <Cimi_> that's why in gnome the unfocused metacity still has the frame/border
[12:45] <Cimi_> so
[12:46] <Cimi_> -1 for the community themes
[12:46] <dilomo> well you should try it out and then speak
[12:46] <andreasn> it looks slick though
[12:46] <Cimi_> dilomo, it is a real issue
[12:46] <Cimi_> you can't know when the titlebar starts
[12:46] <dilomo> http://img28.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=88676_NewWave_test_03_122_1054lo.jpg
[12:46] <dilomo> it looked like this
[12:47] <dilomo> before to make this gnoem "usability" thing
[12:47] <Cimi_> this should be more usable
[12:47] <dilomo> but everybody has taste
[12:47] <dilomo> and I'm not making theme for visual invalids that
[12:47] <Cimi_> because now you can see where the titlebar starts
[12:48] <Cimi_> so you know where to place your pointer in order to move the window
[12:48] <dilomo> cannot distinguish what's in front of them
[12:48] <dilomo> well if I had make this
[12:48] <Cimi_> and with a touchpad could be a trouble if you don't know where's the titlebar because it looks merged with the menubar
[12:48] <dilomo> we would have sticked to old look from 1990
[12:49] <dilomo> maybe it is not perfect now but that's not because I want it to be such
[12:49] <dilomo> but because the software does not allow me to do it right
[12:49] <Cimi_> but now we are 1980 from an usability point ov view with those themes, then
[12:50] <Cimi_> anyway, having a separated window border doesn't mean *1990*
[12:50] <Cimi_> it just doesn't mean *osx*
[12:50] <Cimi_> oh yeah, you're not copying osx *LOL*
[12:51] <andreasn> dilomo: I don't think Cimi is saying that you _have_ to make them distinguished, I mean, it's totally up to you, but it might end up with people using the theme sitting in front of their computers cursing because they miss the area where they are supposed to hit to move the window as it don't have any visual indication where to aim
[12:51] <dilomo> aim at the title tex
[12:51] <dilomo> text*
[12:51] <Cimi_> yeah
[12:52] <dilomo> and you are right
[12:52] <Cimi_> do this with a touchpad
[12:52] <Cimi_> gh
[12:52] <dilomo> andreasn: I wish I could make it better either by
[12:52] <dilomo> having a very simple patch that allows for the user to click the menu and drag the window
[12:53] <dilomo> or by making inactive windows have their menu transparent
[12:53] <Cimi_> also the 1px border on the borders of the window is copying osx
[12:53] <andreasn> dilomo: I spoke to rhult, a GTK+ developer, and he said it would be a bit tricky to do (or impossible?) as window managment on OSX and GNOME works totally different
[12:54] <Cimi_> also
[12:54] <Cimi_> rhult is the developer of the gtk+ port over osx
[12:54] <Cimi_> so he knows those terms
[12:55] <dilomo> I have tried to report the bug ages ago
[12:55] <Cimi_> dilomo, 1px border on the sides makes the window _Really_ difficult to resize
[12:55] <andreasn> anyway, I don't think this is such a big deal really. I would kick and scream if this was the default that was being distributed to 10 million users, but it's just a community theme
[12:55] <dilomo> and somewhere on gnome's bugzilla
[12:55] <dilomo> and there was that patch
[12:56] <andreasn> that made it work? oh.
[12:56] <andreasn> url?
[12:56] <dilomo> I will try to search but I'm not sure
[12:56] <dilomo> I will find it
[12:56] <dilomo> as to the one pixel borders
[12:57] <dilomo> that is an issue of the window manager
[12:57] <dilomo> and you have a 5px border at the bottom
[13:00] <dilomo> here we go:
[13:00] <dilomo> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=500437)
[13:00] <dilomo> the menubar drag
[13:00] <dilomo> yeah :)\
[13:07] <dilomo> andreasn: what do you think?
[13:09] <andreasn> I have to think about it. There seems to be both pros and cons of the approach. Probably need to ask a UI designer for input.
[13:10] <dilomo> well wouldn't it be possible to be controlled
[13:10] <dilomo> from the gtkrc file?
[13:10] <dilomo> smth like this gtk-enable-animations = 1
[13:10] <dilomo> but regarding menus
[13:11] <andreasn> so there would be one behavior with one theme, but another behavior if you switched to another? sounds a bit eeeky to me.
[13:13] <dilomo> well it depends on the look of the theme
[13:13] <dilomo> plus a global override setting can be preset
[13:34] <kwwii> dilomo: I was working on a new package, where is your latest stuff?
[13:34] <dilomo> only on LP
[13:49] <Cimi_> dilomo, in the statusbar you can do vertical resizing
[13:49] <Cimi_> so your metacity is actually less usable
[13:50] <Cimi_> for horizontal resizing
[13:50] <dilomo> be happy man
[13:50] <dilomo> I don't want to argue with you
[13:50] <dilomo> if you have will you will find a way, you know ;)
[14:00] <thorwil> bonjour!
[14:01] <_MMA_> Guten Tag
[14:03] <dilomo> Добър ден! :)
[14:03] <kwwii> moin moin
[14:03] <lucazade> ciao!
[14:04] <dilomo> :-D
[14:14] <Cimi_> dilomo, I am happy. I'm just trying to teach you that you should take care of those usability issues if you want to make in the future a theme that is something more than a simple community theme
[14:15] <Cimi_> usability should always be more important than appearance
[14:15] <_MMA_> Cimi_: Usability strongly depends on audience.
[14:15] <thorwil> usability and appearance are not separated
[14:16] <dilomo> I agree with all of you
[14:16] <_MMA_> What's "usable" for some, is not for others. There's no such thing as universal usability.
[14:16] <Cimi_> _MMA_, those two issues I've claimed are not depending on the audience... because almost everyone is resizint the windows
[14:16] <Cimi_> oh no _MMA_ , there is :)
[14:16] <Cimi_> talk to calum benson
[14:16] <Cimi_> usability engineer @ Sun
[14:17] <kwwii> usability is a metric not a state
[14:17] <kwwii> it is an action not something you achieve
[14:17] <_MMA_> No. It's a complete dilution. And since your English and my Italian skills aren't the best, it's not something we should get into.
[14:17] <thorwil> there just happens to be issues that are the same or similar for all people within a very large group :)
[14:18] <Cimi_> _MMA_, I understand english very well, I'm just in trouble when comes to write complex paragraphs
[14:18] <dilomo> Usability is if people like to use their themes
[14:18] <_MMA_> thorwil: Sure, like I said: "There's no such thing as *universal usability*." Nothing is one-size-fits-all.
[14:19] <dilomo> and despite of the minor glitches they are happy
[14:19]  * _MMA_ notes the Studio theme. ;)
[14:20] <Cimi_> the fact is that with dilomo I've had a discussion like that "with your theme it is difficult to move a window" "no people don't move windows", "with your theme you can't do horizontal resize" "no people won't resize their windows"
[14:20] <thorwil> _MMA_: yes, exactly. there's a reason i included a definition of usability with context in my text :)
[14:20]  * thorwil -> coffee
[14:21] <dilomo> As I said I won't argue anymore
[14:22] <dilomo> :) - remember
[14:22] <_MMA_> Cimi_: Well, though true (and I would suggest a heavier border myself) if dilomo knows his audience, and caters to them, that's fine. If people don't like it, they won't use it. Simple.
[14:22] <lucazade> appereance and usability depends on razionality in my opinion
[14:22] <Cimi_> _MMA_, ok
[14:23] <Cimi_> as andreasn said "I don't think this is such a big deal really. I would kick and scream if this was the default that was being distributed to 10 million users, but it's just a community theme"
[14:24] <Cimi_> I must quote him
[14:24] <dilomo> Me too "(14,46,33) andreasn: it looks slick though"
[14:25] <Cimi_> kwwii, I've talked with asac about the firefox patch, it will be fixed for beta1, so I will fix for the default theme
[14:26] <kwwii> Cimi_: excellent
[14:27] <kwwii> Cimi_: I guess it is safe for me to make another murrine svn snapshot
[14:27] <kwwii> ?
[14:27] <Cimi_> yeah, also please remove style = MURRINE, not rename it to profile
[14:28] <Cimi_> I've written an email to the mailing list
[14:28] <Cimi_> I would like to have your opinions on that matter
[14:28] <kwwii> right, in the current version which I am preparing we have commented that out
[14:28] <Cimi_> @kwwii, _MMA_ , dilomo , thorwil ... who wants :)
[14:28]  * _MMA_ has commented it out.
[14:29] <_MMA_> Cimi_: It will break alot of themes on GNOME-Look as many are writing for SVN now. SO I would make an announcement there or on you blog about the change.
[14:30] <andreasn> hum, I tend to get quoted today
[14:30] <andreasn> :)
[14:30] <dilomo> :)
[14:30] <dilomo> Cimi: btw when is that argb going to be real?
[14:31] <dilomo> I mean upstream
[14:31] <Cimi_> _MMA_, yeah you're right
[14:31] <Cimi_> dilomo, you mean the engine or the gtk patches?
[14:31] <dilomo> the patches
[14:32] <dilomo> because as far as I know they are the hard thing
[14:32] <dilomo> not all developers are willing to include them
[14:32] <Cimi_> within 6 months or 1 year
[14:32] <Cimi_> dilomo, no, that's not true
[14:32] <dilomo> ok cool
[14:33] <dilomo> :)
[14:33] <Cimi_> please notice that RGBA doesn't mean transparency
[14:33] <Cimi_> it just means *please give us another channel, over red green and blue, give us !alpha!*
[14:33] <Cimi_> and then the engine coders could take care of it or no
[14:34] <dilomo> interesting
[14:37] <thorwil> hmm, so that channel could be for octarine instead of alpha :)
[14:38] <andreasn> anyway, I don't care about usability this or usability that, a design decision is a design decision with pros and cons
[14:39] <andreasn> http://mpt.net.nz/archive/2008/08/11/usability is great reading, so is The Design of Everyday Things
[14:39] <andreasn> back to work
[14:39] <thorwil> the later is the greater reading ^^
[14:41] <thorwil> _MMA_: so, do you think i should move kyudo to the wiki already?
[14:42] <_MMA_> thorwil: um, um, um... gimmie a sec. Gotta handle the kids here. :)
[14:42] <thorwil> heh, ok
[14:46] <dilomo> andreasn: nice one
[14:48] <kwwii> ok, I just almost everything in my PPA
[14:48] <kwwii> most all of it is for hardy and intrepid
[14:48]  * thorwil hands kwwii an "updated"
[14:49] <_MMA_> thorwil kwwii whoever: Can we have an impromptu meeting in say, 45 mins to discuss kyudo and it's would-be impact on the communities future?
[14:50] <thorwil> _MMA_: ok with me. for the whoever, the only other one known to be knowing about it is troy
[14:51] <thorwil> talking about http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Et-w-/%2Bjunk/kyudo/download/9/project_kyudo.txt-20080829180050-1jvy5xri2xm1fogv-1/project_kyudo.txt?file_id=project_kyudo.txt-20080829180050-1jvy5xri2xm1fogv-1
[14:51] <_MMA_> thorwil: np. We can use this to get others up to speed. :) But as far as this being on the wiki, I would say putting it on its own page for people to look over would be great. I also think it would lower the barrier for collaboration a bit.
[14:52] <kwwii> _MMA_: yepp, let's skype first :-)
[14:52] <thorwil> _MMA_: the only reason it is not on the wiki is that didn't want easy access for everyone. up to now ;)
[14:53] <_MMA_> thorwil: Sure. I get it. :) So I say go ahead for its own page. And we can go on from there to see if we can officially adopt it as a design guideline for the community.
[14:53] <_MMA_> kwwii: Ok. Say, in 30?
[14:54]  * _MMA_ really needs to straiten the house before he sits on the computer all day. :P
[14:55] <kwwii> _MMA_: yepp
[14:55] <kwwii> _MMA_: do we want to ping jono?
[14:55] <kwwii> today is his birthday I here
[14:56] <kwwii> hear
[14:57] <_MMA_> kwwii: If that's the purpose of the Skype chat I think today, and the coming days will be difficult to chat with him.
[15:02]  * _MMA_ is away for 30 mins or so.
[15:04] <Cimi_> dilomo, new wave looks good, compliments
[15:05] <dilomo> I can't understand
[15:05] <Cimi_> ?
[15:05] <dilomo> well just before some time
[15:05] <Cimi_> I've just tried it
[15:05] <dilomo> you were saying it is bad
[15:05] <Cimi_> =)
[15:05] <Cimi_> no
[15:06] <dilomo> well  thank you :)
[15:06] <Cimi_> I have said I don't like notebooks and menubars
[15:06] <Cimi_> and I can confirm that I don't like them
[15:06] <Cimi_> dilomo, the theme lacs of the focus on the norebook
[15:07] <Cimi_> *lacks
[15:07] <dilomo> ok now (as you have tried the theme) I can say
[15:07] <dilomo> I agree with you to some degree
[15:07] <dilomo> the tabs may change because they look somehow strange
[15:08] <dilomo> but the menusystem is not (only in Ibex the main menu will become light)
[15:08] <Cimi_> have you tried reducing the contrast of the buttons and other styles?
[15:08] <Cimi_> s/styles/widgets
[15:08] <dilomo> why?
[15:09] <Cimi_> for trying
[15:09] <Cimi_> people seems to like low-contrasted themes
[15:09] <Cimi_> (just take a look @ oxygen)
[15:09] <dilomo> I have but
[15:10] <dilomo> i didn't like how it looked
[15:10] <Cimi_> oh ok
[15:11] <thorwil> contrast is a difficult topic because it is strongly affected by the display, display settings and environment /lighting conditions)
[15:11] <Cimi_> exactly
[15:11] <Cimi_> thorwil, but New Wave borders are really contrasted
[15:12] <dilomo> when you decrease the contrast of your laptop you will get better image ;)
[15:12] <dilomo> well there should be all kinds of themes
[15:12] <Cimi_> I'm using a professional colorimeter to adjust the display to standards
[15:12] <Cimi_> I won't change them :)
[15:13]  * thorwil bows before Cimi_ 
[15:13] <dilomo> ok that was just a joke
[15:15] <dilomo> In my next themes I will take your tip under consideration
[15:16] <Cimi_> oh
[15:16] <Cimi_> a gimp mockup
[15:17] <Cimi_> DEFAULT (high): http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/175266/Screenshots/high-contrast.png
[15:17] <Cimi_> MEDIUM: http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/175266/Screenshots/medium-contrast.png
[15:17] <Cimi_> LOW: http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/175266/Screenshots/less-contrast.png
[15:18] <dilomo> the low is too washed out
[15:19] <dilomo> maybe smth between Default and medium will be good
[15:19] <kwwii> yeah, I think so too :-)
[15:19]  * Cimi_ give a kiss to his high-contrast monitor :)
[15:19] <Cimi_> here the contrast is still high on the low, this confirms what thorwil said
[15:20] <Cimi_> s/give/gives
[15:20] <Cimi_> when'll start writing in english without making mistakes?
[15:21] <dilomo> when the pc starts to write from our voice  ;)
[15:22] <Cimi_> it should translates my italian, then
[15:22] <Cimi_> :)
[15:22] <dilomo> wow that would be perfect
[15:23] <dilomo> talk native write in English
[15:23] <Cimi_> there was a fun video about speech control
[15:24] <dilomo> haha
[15:26] <Cimi_> dilomo, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCSgkUnlGGA
[15:27] <Cimi_> it simply doesn't work!
[15:27] <Cimi_> it is so fun when he repeat the commands because it didn't work
[15:28] <dilomo> I'm wondering if the program learns form him
[15:28] <dilomo> then it will be unable to recognize native English :)
[15:29] <Cimi_> when he says "cut"
[15:29] <Cimi_> 2.20 minutes
[15:29] <Cimi_> AHAHAHAH
[15:29] <dilomo> :D
[15:30] <_MMA_> Hi Conn
[15:30] <dilomo> its fun indeed
[15:30] <psyke83> hi
[15:31] <_MMA_> psyke83: When you can, please email me the latest revisions to the Studio theme with Cimi's new recommendations/fixes.
[15:31] <Cimi_> psyke83, do not rename style to profil
[15:31] <Cimi_> *e
[15:31] <Cimi_> remove it instead
[15:32] <psyke83> Cimi_: in the revisions I sent to Ken, I simply commented the line
[15:33] <psyke83> Cimi_: is that the only recommendation you made? I didn't see your original note
[15:36] <dilomo> hey psyke83 do you know how to theme the notify balloons from within the gtkrc file?
[15:37] <psyke83> dilomo: I haven't checked them, but they inherit the tooltip colours, don't they?
[15:37] <dilomo> yes but not all  of them
[15:37] <dilomo> look here : http://launchpadlibrarian.net/17688393/Screenshot.png
[15:37] <dilomo> the color on the left is ugly
[15:41]  * thorwil pokes _MMA_ 
[15:47] <psyke83> dilomo: that's libnotify, and AFAIK it doesn't support theming yet. See: http://trac.galago-project.org/ticket/122
[15:48] <dilomo> wow opened 2 years ago
[15:49] <dilomo> I guess that it won't be fixed at least in a year :)
[15:49] <dilomo> at least it can be made to pick better colors not hardcore them
[16:07] <Cimi_> psyke83, but ubuntu is theming it
[16:07] <Cimi_> there's a setting in gconf
[16:08] <Cimi_> /apps/notification-daemon/theme
[16:19] <dilomo> I looked through the src code and the new style is complicated c code
[16:20] <dilomo> which means I can't use it from the gtkrc file
[16:22] <Cimi> of course you can't, but maybe should be possible to write that them in C
[16:23] <Cimi> I mean, of couse you can't theme it with the gtkrc only
[16:24] <dilomo> It's too complicated for me as I've never code visual gtk stuff
[16:24] <dilomo> I prefer to wait the day when I will be able to set it up from within gtkrc
[16:25] <Cimi> anyway the default theme looks better than the ubuntu's
[16:25] <Cimi> you could use gconftool to replace it
[16:28] <dilomo> yeah looks better now
[16:28] <dilomo> it's too edgy
[16:28] <dilomo> but better
[16:41] <thorwil> _MMA_: any caveats i should know of when creating that wiki page?
[16:44] <psyke83> _MMA_: sent the update a little while ago, btw.
[16:44] <_MMA_> psyke83: Got it.
[16:44] <psyke83> Cimi: it was just the "style = MURRINE" that needed removal?
[16:44] <Cimi> yeah
[16:44] <_MMA_> thorwil: Not really. I can clean up anything if you need help later.
[16:46] <Cimi> psyke83, read here http://www.cimitan.com/murrine/project/murrine/development
[16:46] <Cimi> so you can stay up-to-date
[16:46] <psyke83> Cimi: great, thanks
[16:54] <Cimi> psyke83, it automatically updates from SVN
[16:55] <DanaG> Oh yeah, have you heard of HP's new DreamColor display?  30-bit color depth.  I wonder if Linux supports that...
[17:00] <DanaG> Heh, when on KDE (such as on the lab computers at school, since their Gnome is freakishly old), I often use the HighColor Classic theme, with the KDE2 windeco.
[17:06] <thorwil> is there a content license implied on the wiki?
[17:08] <_MMA_> Not that I know of.
[17:08] <_MMA_> People have put licenses on pages though.
[17:10] <thorwil> _MMA_: should we apply CC-BY-SA?
[17:10] <_MMA_> At your discretion. Think about it's future use.
[17:10] <_MMA_> SA is fine by me though.
[17:32] <thorwil> _MMA_, kwwii: i will stop editing for a while now: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/KyudoGuidelines
[17:33]  * _MMA_ bookmarks
[17:34] <thorwil> _MMA_: you are listed as technical lead with link to your wiki page :)
[17:35] <_MMA_> :P
[17:36]  * thorwil considers changing that into lead gurner
[17:50] <_MMA_> thorwil: *Added Table of Contents. See what you think.
[17:51] <thorwil> _MMA_: that's good. though that page might see quite some splitting up
[17:51] <thorwil> _MMA_: what happened to the first headline?
[17:53] <_MMA_> Ot was pushing the 1st section of text way down. Try it if you like.
[17:54] <thorwil> no need, this stuff makes jan tschichold cry, anyway :)
[17:55] <_MMA_> s/Ot/It
[17:59] <thorwil> http://leogg.wordpress.com/2008/09/16/sfd-2008-artwork/
[18:01] <_MMA_> thorwil: I was gonna contact him. I don't know if he speaks English. "Byron"
[18:02] <kwwii> I bet he speaks spanish pretty well though :p
[18:03] <_MMA_> Si
[18:04]  * thorwil -> dinner
[18:05] <kwwii> yeah, time for band practice...bbl
[18:11] <stemount^> e me!
[20:05]  * thorwil builds an archer
[20:08] <nand> Oo
[20:19] <DanaG> Oniasdfasdfas dfasdcaefrawe araghh lagggg
[20:20] <nand> So do I
[21:04] <PRGUY85> what did you all think of new wave's new metacity?
[23:51] <__mikem> the new human theme is nice but the round corners on the windows still have pixelation and it still feels arhaic
[23:55] <kwwii> do you mean the newhuman theme or the new "human" theme?
[23:55] <kwwii> ie the dark one or the light one?
[23:55] <kwwii> and which background are you using with it?
[23:56] <__mikem> kwwii: newhuman
[23:56] <__mikem> I am using the background with the firebird thing