[00:01] <ScottK> crimsun: The way some people are doing merges these days, I think debian/changelog AND a comment in debian/rules just in case is a good plan.
[00:02] <ScottK> apachelogger: Do we have an equivalent of what's being added in Bug 271485?
[02:28] <jtechidna> could somebody doing livecd testing test for bug 49825?
[02:47] <vorian> evening
[02:51] <Hobbsee> @now utc
[02:59] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Have you decided about switching back to KDE? (sorry, I have lost track)
[02:59] <Hobbsee> ScottK: not currently.
[03:00] <Hobbsee> ScottK: however, do you want to test a cd? :)
[03:00] <Hobbsee> it'd show you kubuntu :)
[03:00] <ScottK> I'm busy watching wireshark compile on the one box I could do that on.
[03:00] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Link me for the Kubuntu live CD.  I'll download it and we'll see how things go tonight.
[03:01] <Hobbsee> ScottK: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/build/kubuntu/all
[03:01] <ScottK> Thanks.
[03:01] <Hobbsee> ScottK: it needs to be done in the next ~16 hours or so.
[03:21] <ScottK> OK.  I'll do some i386 CD Live testing.
[03:21] <Hobbsee> good :)
[03:39] <ScottK-laptop> OK.  Off to reboot to the Live CD
[04:00] <ScottK-laptop> OK, so this is KDE4 and I'm here.
[04:00] <ScottK-laptop> Hobbsee: What was the link for the ISO tests again?
[04:01] <ScottK-laptop> How can paste in Konsole possibly not default to shift-insert?
[04:01] <Hobbsee> ScottK-laptop: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/build/kubuntu/all
[04:02] <ScottK-laptop> Thanks.
[04:02] <Hobbsee> y/w
[04:03] <ScottK-laptop> My initial reaction (this is my first time in KDE4) is how could the people who made such a beautiful desktop possibly have produced such a horrible start menu?
[04:04] <Lex79> ya :(
[04:06] <Lex79> waiting raptor http://raptor-menu.org/
[04:11] <ScottK-laptop> Hobbsee: If one of the immutable test pages needs updating, where do we file that bug?
[04:13] <Hobbsee> ScottK-laptop: what needs changing?  I know i can do some edits.
[04:13] <Hobbsee> i don't remember exactly, but i'd guess against ubuntu-qa, if that exists
[04:18] <ScottK-laptop> In https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Cases/KubuntuDesktop it says to go to K-menu -> Multimedia -> Amarok, but as soon as you go to K-menu, Amarok is right there.
[04:18] <ScottK-laptop> Hobbsee: ^^
[04:19] <ScottK-laptop> So there's no need to go further, but if you did, it'd be K-menu -> Applications -> Multimedia -> Amarok
[04:19] <a|wen> isn't automake automatically run to create Makefile.in files etc. when building our kde packages
[04:20] <a|wen> or do you really need to run it manually before building
[04:21] <ScottK-laptop> If it's a new upstream you need to run build-prep
[04:21] <Hobbsee> ScottK-laptop: edited.
[04:21] <Hobbsee> ScottK-laptop: (but that's a wiki, so i'm not sure why it's immutable, as such?)
[04:22] <a|wen> ScottK-laptop: where do i find that?
[04:23] <ScottK-laptop> a|wen: Riddell told me about it.  I'm on a Live CD right now, so I don't have easy access to my notes.
[04:23] <ScottK-laptop> Hobbsee: In any case Ubuntu wiki isn't currently editable by Konqueror, so I'm stuck anyway.
[04:23] <Hobbsee> ScottK-laptop: ahhh, right.
[04:24] <a|wen> ScottK-laptop: hmm, strange ... apt-file gives me no results when searching for build-prep
[04:24] <ScottK-laptop> It's not a file, it's a command
[04:24] <ScottK-laptop> It's debian/rules target somehow.
[04:27] <ScottK-laptop> So if I click on a link in konversation, it doesn't know what app should open.  It starts doing something because I get asked if I want to accept a cookie before the app selection window comes up.
[04:27] <ScottK-laptop> Which package gets the blame for that?
[04:27] <a|wen> ScottK-laptop: thx ... "debian/rules buildprep" looks to be it
[04:27] <ScottK-laptop> Yeah.  That's it.
[04:30] <ScottK-laptop> And what's the official name for the horrible thing that traps the application menus so you can't see the entire list?
[04:31] <a|wen> that buildprep thing is really making a mess of things
[04:31] <a|wen> ... but seems that it is how it should be
[04:31] <ScottK-laptop> This is KDE3 or KDE4?
[04:31] <a|wen> ScottK-laptop: KDE3
[04:31] <ScottK-laptop> KDE3 is pretty ugly.
[04:31] <ScottK-laptop> Yeah.
[04:33] <a|wen> and when you start combining it with new components added in a patch it get's even worse, uff
[04:33] <ScottK-laptop> Hobbsee: So if I have some bugs, but not serious ones, that counts as 'passed', right?
[04:33] <Hobbsee> ScottK-laptop: yes, i think so.
[04:33] <ScottK-laptop> OK.
[04:33] <Hobbsee> ScottK-laptop: the bugs will be looked at anyway
[04:34] <ScottK-laptop> Right.  I'll file the bugs after I reboot so I won't be stuck on a wired network.
[04:38] <a|wen> ScottK-laptop: bug 262538 and status low = not a kde3.5.10 blocker?
[04:41] <a|wen> i've been looking at a partly fix from the kde svn ... but it seems to be somewhat unfinished
[04:43] <ScottK2> Well that was fun.
[04:44] <a|wen> nobody seems to have test-builded it in it's current context ... it build-fails due to deprecated function use
[04:45]  * a|wen takes this as a bad sign
[04:46] <ScottK2> Which package?
[04:46] <a|wen> kdepim
[04:46] <ScottK2> If this is updating the hardy-backport you shouldn't have needed to run build-prep again.
[04:47] <ScottK2> I did test build all of 3.5.10 before I uploaded it.
[04:48] <a|wen> ScottK2: the fix looks to be a helper app migrating the dist lists ... adding that helper app and you need to do a buildprep
[04:48] <ScottK2> Ah.
[04:49] <a|wen> but that helper app is anyway broken (use of deprecated functions)
[04:49] <ScottK2> I see.
[04:49] <ScottK2> It's kubuntu-default setting that own mime-type assignments, right?
[04:50] <ScottK2> -settings
[04:51] <a|wen> it contains some extra mime-types IIRC
[04:54] <ScottK2> OK.  What has the basic ones?
[04:54] <ScottK2> I'm trying to figure out who to blame that clicking on a link in Konversation it didn't know what app to use to open it.
[04:55] <a|wen> ScottK2: kde3 or kde4 ?
[04:56] <ScottK2> KDE4
[04:56] <ScottK2> Intrepid
[04:56] <ScottK2> Live CD
[04:57] <ScottK-laptop> a|wen: ^^^
[04:57] <a|wen> then that is a good question
[04:58] <a|wen> looks to be distributed between a lot of packages in kde3
[04:58] <ScottK-laptop> I'll go with kubuntu-meta and someone can change it from there.
[05:03]  * a|wen goes to
[05:03] <a|wen> ... bed
[05:03] <a|wen> goodnight all around
[05:08] <ScottK-laptop> Good night.
[05:08] <ScottK-laptop> Hobbsee: I guess I'm done.  Only 4 new bugs filed.
[07:18] <Arby> Riddell: Ubiquity proceeds all the way through and starts the install on todays desktop image (20080918)
[07:19] <Arby> leaving the install running
[07:19] <Arby> got to work now.
[08:14] <Arby> morning all
[08:35] <a|wen> ScottK-laptop: not much... but this is "the best of kde/svn" regarding kdepim in hardy-backports http://awen.dk/packages/kde3.5.10/kdepim_3.5.10-0ubuntu1~hardy2.debdiff
[08:37] <a|wen> ScottK-laptop: i've also made a comment on bug 262538 ... i'm not confident in trying to fix this as it is atm
[10:50] <yao_ziyuan1> scim-bridge-client-qt4 doesn't work in ubuntu 8.04 + kde 4.1.1
[10:50] <yao_ziyuan1> i hope intrepid can improve somewhat
[10:51] <Hobbsee> so, fix it?
[10:52] <yao_ziyuan1> the symptom is,
[10:52] <yao_ziyuan1> if you install kde 4.1.1 from ppa.launchpad.net,
[10:53] <yao_ziyuan1> and then you go to a gnome desktop and click Language Support
[10:53] <yao_ziyuan1> (before you install kde 4.1.1, you install ubuntu-desktop and in gnome's Language Support install Chinese and "Enable Input Methods")
[10:54] <yao_ziyuan1> after installing kde 4.1.1, you go to the same Language Support dialog box in gnome,
[10:54] <yao_ziyuan1> you will see the Chinese checkbox is now "partially checked", which is a [-],
[10:54] <yao_ziyuan1> and then you make it fully checked ( [v] ),
[10:54] <yao_ziyuan1> and then let it install the missing packages
[10:55] <yao_ziyuan1> it will automatically install scim-bridge-client-qt4
[10:55] <yao_ziyuan1> to add scim support to kde4 apps
[10:55] <yao_ziyuan1> but this somehow doesn't work -- when  you log in to a kde4 session,
[10:56] <yao_ziyuan1> the system becomes extremely slow, to the extent that you can only ctrl+alt+bksp
[10:56] <yao_ziyuan1> if you press ctrl+esc, you will see many "scim-panel-gtk"
[10:56] <yao_ziyuan1> means its has run into a dead loop
[10:58] <yao_ziyuan1> the solution for now is to remove scim-bridge-client-qt4
[10:59] <yao_ziyuan1> also, i found kubuntu-kde4-desktop is automatically removed by the last gnome language support action
[11:10] <Riddell> and gone
[11:33] <apachelogger> A wonderful good morning.
[11:35] <apachelogger> ScottK: I don't even understand what that feature is about.
[11:36] <apachelogger> Riddell: yao does that all the time
[11:38] <jussi01> apachelogger: good to hear :)
[11:39] <Riddell> drive by IRC grumping
[11:40] <apachelogger> hehe
[11:41] <jussi01> Riddell: thats the best description Ive heard of it... :D
[11:41] <jussi01> appmy comment was aimed at your first comment.. .D:
[11:42] <jussi01> and that smiley came out deformed...
[11:42] <apachelogger> *nod*
[11:42] <apachelogger> You should seek a doctor IMHO.
[11:42] <apachelogger> That doesn't look very healthy
[11:43] <davmor2> Arby: ping
[11:43] <jussi01> rofl
[11:44]  * jussi01 should look at doing some contributions again...
[11:44] <jussi01> anyone got a few basic things that need doing?
[11:44] <davmor2> Riddell: are you testing any live kubuntu's?
[11:44]  * apachelogger should go to the grocery and buy some motivation, then again that would require motivation..
[11:45]  * jussi01 sends apachelogger some liquid motivation in the post.. :D
[11:46] <apachelogger> That is gonna take a while :S
[11:46] <davmor2> apachelogger: or a cattle prod
[11:47] <apachelogger> Hm, now I am sad.... those poor animals :(
[11:54] <davmor2> is anyone testing Kubuntu live at all?
[12:11] <apachelogger> davmor2: I think Riddell did yesterday
[12:12] <Hobbsee> davmor2: ScottK did some testing of it earlier.
[12:12] <Hobbsee> davmor2: i don't think anyone else did.
[12:14] <davmor2> :( needed to know if their installer exited correctly
[12:23] <Riddell> davmor2: yes
[12:23] <Riddell> yes I'm testing
[12:24] <Riddell> no the installer didn't exit correctly and I also get an error about apt not being able to install packages from the CD
[12:24] <davmor2> Riddell: okay thanks.  Did you get bug 271693 too
[12:24] <davmor2> Riddell: cool ta :)
[12:25] <Riddell> yep, that's the one
[12:25] <Hobbsee> davmor2: actually, i think some of this mail i've gotten is related to a kubuntu install.
[12:25] <davmor2> :)
[12:26] <Hobbsee> davmor2: http://rafb.net/p/NptV5799.html
[12:26] <davmor2> Riddell: can you confirm please
[12:27] <Riddell> davmor2: I don't suppose ubuntu does the same?
[12:28] <davmor2> ubiquity is exting correctly yes but it also suffers from the error message
[12:36] <Riddell> davmor2: is bug 270423
[12:36] <davmor2> yeap
[12:37] <davmor2> cjwatson let me know on ubuntu-installer :)
[12:38] <Riddell> ah, that's where you all hide :)
[12:48] <JontheEchidna> good morning
[13:07] <davmor2> Riddell: \o/ oem looks pretty again :)
[13:07] <davmor2> Riddell: more import it works too :)
[13:14] <seele> Riddell: dfaure says default size ought to be fixed in the code and not the config file but there isn't really time for that
[13:15] <seele> Riddell: should we still use the config file to fix some of the app default sizes? some like System Monitor could really use it, regardless of the icon layout
[13:30]  * apachelogger thinks about getting a KDE EULA :P
[13:40] <apachelogger> NCommander: what is the REVU patch status?
[13:40] <apachelogger> smarter: did you apply for MOTU yet?
[13:40] <NCommander> apachelogger: you didn't send it to me
[13:40] <apachelogger> I even uploaded it!
[13:41] <NCommander> you did?
[13:41] <apachelogger> http://aplg.kollide.net/kubuntu/debdiffs/oxygen.patch
[13:41] <apachelogger> yus
[13:41] <ScottK> apachelogger: I don't know anything other than what's in Bug 271485.  It smells to me like another "Let's make Gnome people get some new kewl thing, but oops we forgot to tell Riddell so KDE could too." situation.
[13:41] <NCommander> I thought I asked for a bazaar tree ;-)
[13:41] <ScottK> Maybe Riddell knows/can find out?
[13:42] <apachelogger> ScottK: I completely agree on that.
[13:42] <apachelogger> NCommander: that is a bazaar tree patch :P
[13:42] <apachelogger> NCommander: you can merge it like any branch
[13:42] <apachelogger> Just that I don't have to create a branch just to get you these changes ;-)
[13:42] <Arby> davmor2:  belated pong
[13:43] <NCommander> I need breakfast
[13:43] <ScottK> davmor2: AFAICT when I rand the LiveCD everything installer related was fine.
[13:44] <NCommander> morning ScottK
[13:44] <ScottK> Heya.
[13:45] <NCommander> how goes it?
[13:51] <rgreening> morning all :)
[13:51] <ScottK> Not in a way I'm willing to describe on a logged channel.
[13:51] <ScottK> Heya
[13:51]  * rgreening wishes he stopped for coffee this AM
[13:55] <Riddell> davmor2: great, thanks for testing oem
[13:56] <Riddell> seele: yes changing in the config file seems best for intrepid
[13:56]  * jussi01 hugs ScottK
[13:56] <ScottK-laptop> Thanks.
[13:57] <jussi01> ScottK-laptop: do you have 2 machines next to each other there?
[13:57] <jussi01> :D
[13:57] <ScottK-laptop> Yes.  Desktop is on my desk.  Laptop is on my lap.
[13:57] <Riddell> ScottK-laptop: I've no idea what that bug is about
[13:58] <ScottK-laptop> OK.  If you're able it might be worth inquiring after as I suspect it's a warning of a future "How come I can do this in Ubuntu, but not Kubuntu" thing.
[13:58] <ScottK-laptop> seele/Riddell: Is there anything that can be done about the application lists being 'trapped' and having to scroll all the time?
[13:59] <ScottK-laptop> Yesterday when I was doing live CD testing was my first KDE4 experience and that was the only thing that gave me a "Dear God, no." kind of reaction.
[14:00] <Riddell> ScottK-laptop: which application list?
[14:00] <ScottK-laptop> Keeping in mind that I generally hate change, BTW, that's a huge good sign for KDE4.
[14:00] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: When you click on the K menu, then click on the Application icon
[14:01] <ScottK-laptop> There's a list bounded at the top with a search bar that contains the catagories/apps
[14:01] <ScottK-laptop> Once I clicked through to the application lists they virtually never fit in the space and I had to scroll.
[14:01] <Riddell> that's how it's supposed to be
[14:01] <ScottK-laptop> Really?
[14:02] <ScottK-laptop> I think that makes it much harder to find applications.
[14:02] <Riddell> it's a bit late to rewrite kickoff now, but we will be looking at alternatives for jaunty
[14:02] <ScottK-laptop> OK.
[14:02] <Riddell> yes, the idea (from suse) is that it makes the things you need most often quick to find and cares less about the things you need less.  or something.
[14:02] <ScottK-laptop> Oh dear, that's even worse then.
[14:03] <ScottK-laptop> So not only is it hiding stuff, it moves it around.
[14:04]  * ScottK-laptop was hoping there was some kind of "make_kickoff_usable=True" thing we could do or something.
[14:04] <ScottK-laptop> seele: Is this considered good usability?
[14:06] <ScottK-laptop> I've still got all the 3.5.10 packages installed for testing and in KDE3 the Utilities section is almost two full columns on my laptop, but it's all immediately visible and accesible.
[14:06] <ScottK-laptop> Urgh.
[14:07] <rgreening> why the the ALT+SysRq not work under KDE4
[14:08] <Riddell> you mean print screen r	?
[14:09] <rgreening> Ya, for Magic SysReq to reboot on lock.. Doesn't work
[14:09] <rgreening> Alt+PrintScreen+R+S+E+I+U+B
[14:09] <rgreening> Any ideas on how to fix/troubleshoot?
[14:10] <rgreening> and can anyone verify on their system
[14:10] <rgreening> that's it's not an isolated case
[14:10] <Riddell> nope but assigning printscreen to ksnapshot somehow has been requiested
[14:10] <rgreening> well, ALT+SysRq would be a diff keycode
[14:11] <rgreening> where sysrq is the Print key
[14:12] <rgreening> Alt+PrintScreen must stay as Alt+SysRq in meaning. Too many docs on how to recover using the magic key
[14:12] <rgreening> thoughts
[14:14] <rgreening> Used to work under Hardy/KDE3
[14:14] <rgreening> perfectly
[14:14] <davmor2> Riddell: have you looked at the test results?
[14:14] <rgreening> could it be the compositing engine settings for key mapping has altered something?
[14:15] <seele> ScottK-laptop: i've had a long standing enmity with kickoff
[14:16] <seele> and from what i know about kickoff code, changing anythign simple is not a simple task
[14:16] <ScottK-laptop> seele: OK.  Any suggested alternatives?
[14:17] <seele> not at the moment, people say lancelot is nice but i havent used it too much
[14:17] <ScottK-laptop> OK.  Thanks.
[14:19] <ScottK-laptop> Do we have that in the archive?
[14:20] <ScottK-laptop> Is it plasmoid-lancelot or is that something different?
[14:22] <rgreening> I think my system key mapping must be broken. Should hitting printscreen launch ksnapshot by default?
[14:22] <rgreening> it used to
[14:23]  * rgreening considers a fresh install...
[14:23] <Riddell> that is a known problem fixes welcome
[14:24] <rgreening> ah. bug reports?
[14:24] <JontheEchidna> ScottK-laptop: plasmoid-lancelot is indeed lancelot
[14:24] <Riddell> davmor the iso test results?
[14:24] <ScottK-laptop> JontheEchidna: Thanks.
[14:24] <davmor2> Riddell: yes you got a few red bugs :(
[14:25] <rgreening> I don't mind looking into it more. I thought I was losing my mind
[14:25] <davmor2> I've closed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/adept/+bug/271601 as it's two apps not the same one :)
[14:25] <apachelogger> seele: Lancelot still got some rough edges. I prefere kickoff currently.
[14:26] <apachelogger> davmor2: well, we need to do something either way
[14:26] <apachelogger> updater doesn't really need to be in the menu
[14:26] <apachelogger> and the installer should be in the toplevel and not some submenu
[14:26] <apachelogger> actually the installer should be added to the computer tab as well
[14:26] <davmor2> apachelogger: true but then the complaint was that they were the same and they're not :)
[14:27] <apachelogger> well, you could have changed it :P
[14:27] <apachelogger> Who is available for some powerdevil testing'?
[14:28] <ScottK-laptop> davmor2: That's my bug.  Then the bug is that there's no way without clicking to tell what's what as they are labled identically.
[14:29] <ScottK-laptop> davmor2: If the are different, then that difference should be apparent.  It certainly wasn't to me.
[14:29] <ScottK-laptop> IIRC I said that in the bug.
[14:29] <ScottK-laptop> Either way it's wrong.
[14:30] <davmor2> ScottK-laptop: they're not they are both labled differently and when you hover over them the text displayed is also different
[14:30] <davmor2> they do need icons though
[14:31] <ScottK-laptop> OK.  I looked at and hovered over both and noticed no difference.
[14:31] <ScottK-laptop> If it's different, it's too subtle.
[14:32] <davmor2> I think it is because the icons are missing that make it more apparent.  If you look at the text the only word the same is package :)
[14:33] <ScottK-laptop> My recollection is the text was the same, but perhaps not.  If I reboot into the LiveCD again, I'll double check.
[14:35] <davmor2> like I say if one had an icon of an up arrow and the other a gift box or something you probably wouldn't of noticed the text at all :)
[14:38] <rgreening> I assume Intrepid will stay with KDE4.1. Will 4.2 get back ported?
[14:39] <jtechidna> there will probably be backports available from the Kubuntu Members KDE4 ppa like with 4.1 in this cycle
[14:49] <rgreening> Riddell: what are your plans for qtjambi in Intrepid?
[14:49] <Riddell> rgreening: hope that the new version gets packaged somehow
[14:49] <apachelogger> Oo
[14:50] <rgreening> lol... besides that. It'll be done TODAY! If I have any control over it :) getting close now
[14:50]  * apachelogger turns up justice and starts patching kdesvn-kde4 
[14:51] <rgreening> Riddell: I have the basic debian rules, control, etc just about complete.
[14:51] <rgreening> Riddell: I was wondering what apps or utils (current/future) that will benefit in Intrepid (if there are any plans)
[14:52] <rgreening> qtjambi is certainly fast... for java
[14:52] <Riddell> rgreening: I don't know of any that use it, but most commercial Qt usage is private and the guys at trolltech are very keep for us to have it packaged so I suspect there are people who need it even if not yet in free software
[14:53] <Riddell> s/very keep/suspiciously keen/
[14:53] <rgreening> lol
[14:54] <rgreening> I should have a test deb(s) sometime today (if all goes well) for you to tear apart and help me make better/complete
[14:54] <rgreening> ha
[14:55] <rgreening> Riddell: this will be my first deb package.. and from scratch. I'll be impressed when it works .. lol
[14:57] <Riddell> good luck
[14:57] <rgreening> ty
[14:57] <rgreening> bug ya later... gonna do some tweaking on it now
[15:00] <NCommander> hey Riddell
[15:01] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: Did you see my message to kubuntu-devel about khelpcenter/khelpcenter4?
[15:02] <jtechidna> what does NBS mean?
[15:02] <NCommander> Not-built from source
[15:13] <Riddell> ScottK-laptop: don't think so
[15:14] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kubuntu-devel/2008-September/002473.html
[15:15]  * apachelogger wanted to answer that mail 4 times
[15:15] <apachelogger> always ended up kicking gnupg for screwing with the agent
[15:16] <ScottK-laptop> apachelogger: What's your answer then?
[15:17] <apachelogger> ScottK-laptop: Find out why debian add a 4, and get debian to drop it again in the most likely case that there is no real reason.
[15:17] <apachelogger> otherwise we might want to go with the transitional package which is IMHO an easier maintainable diff
[15:19] <ScottK-laptop> We already need a transitional package for Intrepid either way.  Hardy has both khelpcenter and khelpcenter4.
[15:19] <ScottK-laptop> If we look at the package naming conventions we generally use, I think adding the 4 only made sense when it was needed co-installable.
[15:19] <apachelogger> a replaces/conflicts should take care of this IMO
[15:20] <ScottK-laptop> No.
[15:20] <apachelogger> Why not?
[15:20] <ScottK-laptop> Actually it may.
[15:20] <apachelogger> We really would need a transitional package for every -kde4 one.
[15:21] <ScottK-laptop> Usually one needs the transitional package to depend on the new one to force it's install.
[15:21] <apachelogger> Yes, it will be the case I think
[15:21] <ScottK-laptop> In this case we can rely on the meta package to do that.
[15:22] <ScottK-laptop> So kubuntu-deskop will drag in the new packages and the replaces/conflicts will push the old ones out.
[15:23] <ScottK-laptop> I'd prefer khelpcenter over khelpcenter4, but mostly make sure we clearly pick one and move in that direction.
[15:23]  * apachelogger advocates khelpcenter as well
[15:23]  * apachelogger -> cooking
[15:26] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: ^^?
[15:40] <Riddell> prefer renaming the package?
[15:59] <rgreening> Riddell: qtjambi requires libphonon_gstreamer.so but I can't seem to locate a package for it.. ideas?
[16:01] <Riddell> rgreening: phonon-backend-gstreamer
[16:01] <Riddell> /usr/lib/kde4/plugins/phonon_backend/phonon_gstreamer.so
[16:02] <rgreening> ah. right. Now I remember you mentioning it. I forgot to make a note in my log. Thanks
[16:03] <rgreening> My locate wasn't updated... stupid updatedb being outdated :)
[16:03] <rgreening> So, should this be under KDE4? or Qt4?
[16:04] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: Right.  Should we use khelpcenter or stick with khelpcenter4?
[16:05] <Riddell> it's khelpcenter4 in Debian to make kdebase-runtime co-installable with kde 3
[16:05] <Riddell> my natural inclination is to keep as close to debian has possible
[16:06] <Riddell> so add a khelpcentre transitional package and keep khelpcentre4 as the real thing
[16:06] <ScottK-laptop> OK.
[16:10] <ScottK-laptop> Bug filed: Bug #271779
[16:21] <ScottK> Riddell: Are you good with the SRU proposal in Bug 271655?  If so I'll upload it?
[16:24] <Riddell> ScottK: when was that file moved?  before hardy was released presumably?
[16:25] <ScottK> Dunno.  a|wen or maybe tseliot would be good to ask.
[16:25] <Riddell> ScottK: well regardless, if that's where the file is the fix is fine
[16:49] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: Uploaded to hardy-proposed.
[17:17] <apachelogger> http://aplg.kollide.net/images/osiris/snapshot142.png
[17:18] <apachelogger> oh
[17:18] <apachelogger> uh
[17:18]  * apachelogger got invited to a tea party
[17:19] <apachelogger> Nightrose: did you ever attend a tea party?
[17:20] <Nightrose> apachelogger: hehe nope
[17:20] <apachelogger> me neither
[17:25] <rafaelmf> hi, I was trying recompile kdebase-dev (3.5.9) from hardy repo but an error ocurred on kubuntu_9922_kio_man_utf8.diff
[17:26] <rafaelmf> "trying reverse patch debian/patch... 1 ... 0 ... 2 failure
[17:27] <rafaelmf> someone could give a tip to resolve?
[17:29] <Arby> konqueror
[17:29] <Arby> oops sorry
[17:34] <Riddell> rafaelmf: patch -p1 -R < debian/patches/kubuntu_9922_kio_man_utf8.diff
[18:08] <rgreening> Riddell: Is phonon_gstreamer.so supposed to be the same as libphonon_gstreamer.so?
[18:08] <rgreening> cause qtjambi is looking for libphonon_gstreamer.so and not phonon_gstreamer.so
[18:10] <Riddell> rgreening: I suspect that's the difference between qt's phonon build and kde's phonon build
[18:11] <rgreening> hmm... so, q... do we need a diff package or do we need to trick the build system to use phonon_gstreamer.so instead
[18:12] <NCommander> hey Riddell
[18:29]  * rgreening bangs head against wall. I hate ANT
[18:34] <NCommander> rgreening: What's wrong with ANT
[18:34] <NCommander> It's a maginitude better then autofun
[18:35] <rgreening> I'll rephrase: I hate braindead applications that do not allow you to easily overrid simple file names :)
[18:35] <rgreening> HA
[18:36] <rgreening> NCommander: if you can help... I have qtjambi 4.4.0 and the build.xml file is looking for libphonon_gstreamer.so but we have it installed as phonon_gstreamer.so. Trying to finx a way to hack the buld.xml to look for  ours
[18:37] <NCommander> where is the source package?
[18:42] <rgreening> 1 sec
[18:44] <rgreening> http://trolltech.com/developer/download/qtjambi-src-gpl-4.4.0_01.tar.gz
[18:45] <rgreening> I know some java but only vaguely aware of ant... so, I may be missing something obvious.
[18:53]  * rgreening ponders: "the only good ant is a dead one"
[19:03] <goatsocks> rgreening: if you'd seen the monstrosities i'd created by mangling ant you'd call the exterminator
[19:03]  * goatsocks doesn't do java these days thankfully
[19:03] <rgreening> goatsocks: maybe you can help then
[19:03] <goatsocks> well i can take a look at it... but i won't like it ;)
[19:03]  * rgreening hands goatsocks an piping hot cup of java
[19:03] <goatsocks> so just a lib name
[19:04]  * goatsocks digs
[19:04] <goatsocks> what's jambi btw
[19:04] <rgreening> yeah.. the build.xml specifies a property of library which I guess forces the file to look for the name with a prefix of lib
[19:04] <rgreening> qtjambi - qt java
[19:05] <goatsocks> java bindings then?
[19:08] <rgreening> pretty much.. and more
[19:12] <goatsocks> rgreening: ok ant is appending "lib" to the specified name?
[19:12] <rgreening> yeah. I need it to look for phonon_gstreamer.so and not libphonon_gstreamer.so
[19:13] <rgreening> <library name="phonon_gstreamer" type="plugin" rootPath="${qtjambi.qtdir}" subdir="plugins/phonon_backend" load="never" if="${qtjambi.phonon_gstreamer}" />
[19:13] <rgreening> that's the line
[19:18] <goatsocks> rgreening: yeah they wrote their own custom subset of ant tasks and that's where the "lib" gets appended (not in build.xml)
[19:19] <rgreening> grrr...
[19:19] <goatsocks> rgreening: com/trolltech/tools/ant/LibraryEntry.java
[19:19] <rgreening> 1 sec. Let me look
[19:20] <rgreening> that's rude
[19:20] <rgreening> lol
[19:20] <goatsocks> well it's common practice for large projects
[19:21] <goatsocks> because ant core is somewhat lame
[19:21] <rgreening> so... wondering what to do...
[19:21] <goatsocks> we patch that, leaving the default "lib" behavior, but also adding checks without "lib"
[19:21] <goatsocks> otherwise it would likely break the other libs
[19:22] <rgreening> I was hoping to avoid to much messing with their code..
[19:23] <rgreening> I'l dig a little more
[19:23] <goatsocks> this code is only an extension of ant, so it's really no different than changing build.xml
[19:23] <goatsocks> it's not a part of qtjambi proper
[19:23] <rgreening> true
[19:24] <rgreening> just need to figure out where to insert check/change.
[19:24] <rgreening> I guess I could be specific and say if phonon_gstreamer.so... not sure though.
[19:24] <goatsocks> gimme a bit to look at it, i think we may be able to override the behavior in build.xml without having to patch any *.java stuff
[19:25] <rgreening> AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[19:25] <rgreening> :)
[19:28] <stdin> ooh, Qt 4.4.2 is out today
[19:36] <goatsocks> rgreening: can you try symlinking libphonon_grstreamer.so to phonon_gstreamer.so and tell me if any other libs are broken during build?
[19:38] <rgreening> yeah. Building it now. There are some other things I have to fix with symlinks. e.g. system wants to find all the libQt*.* in /usr/share/qt4/lib and not /usr/lib where we put them
[19:39] <rgreening> I still have to figure out if we should update the packages to put the symlink there or try and patch the build system to look in /usr/lib...
[19:39] <goatsocks> wha... why would it look in /usr/share for libs?
[19:39] <rgreening> well, it looks in QTDIR var which is /usr/share/qt4
[19:40] <goatsocks> ah
[19:40] <rgreening> QTDIR is an env var you set. It has to point to /usr/share/qt4 (believe me) as QTDIR in the build looks for everything Qt4 related there
[19:40] <rgreening> includes, lib, bin, etc
[19:40] <rgreening> so... no link to lib there.... and it wouldn't build
[19:41] <rgreening> I could patch the lookup I guess. though not sure what else may break
[19:41] <goatsocks> you could hardcode QTDIR into build.xml
[19:42] <rgreening> no. QTDIR has to point to /usr/share/qt4 as it's used by the xml file for all Qt stuff. You couldn't hardcode it to anything else that wouldn;t break other things like include files
[19:42] <rgreening> had that issue already
[19:42] <goatsocks> right
[19:42] <rgreening> it's a real pain
[19:43] <rgreening> hmmm....
[19:43] <stdin> could we not just add a link 'lib -> ../../lib' to /usr/share/qt4/ quite easily?
[19:44] <rgreening> yes/no
[19:44] <goatsocks> well on the lib+foo issue we're really boxed in by their custom ant tasks, leaving us with either symlinking or adding a line to LibraryEntry.java
[19:44] <goatsocks> symlinking is kinda bad because qtjambi package doesn't own phonon_gstreamer.so
[19:45] <goatsocks> phonon would be the proper package to do that in imo
[19:46] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna, Nightrose: pling
[19:46] <rgreening> exactly.. so either the package with the lib needs ot provide alt symlinks or I need to hack QtJambi... it's a toss up. Though, I may have an ide...
[19:46] <Nightrose> apachelogger: plong
[19:46] <goatsocks> i'm not seeing any way to override in build.xml, so that leaves patching LibraryEntry.java as the least dirty thing to do
[19:46] <apachelogger> Nightrose: got time to take kdesvn-kde4 for a test ride?
[19:46] <Nightrose> apachelogger: package? wohoooo
[19:46] <Nightrose> think so
[19:46] <claydoh> is there a FAQ somewhere about kde3/kde4/intrepid et al?
[19:46] <apachelogger> Nightrose: intrepid or hardy?
[19:46] <Nightrose> no time but meh :P
[19:46] <Nightrose> will test
[19:46] <Nightrose> hardy
[19:46] <claydoh> aif not do we need one?
[19:47] <goatsocks> if the situation were the other way around -- we had libphonon_gstreamer and they were merely looking for phonon_gstreamer -- build.xml would be a cinch
[19:47] <apachelogger> Nightrose: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/17733881/kdesvn-kde4_0.1+svn20080918-0ubuntu1~hardy1~ppa1_i386.deb
[19:47] <Nightrose> apachelogger: k - downloading and installing
[19:48] <stdin> claydoh: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kubuntu/Todo and links from there
[19:48] <claydoh> doh
[19:49] <rgreening> goatsocks: it passed the libphonon point, but fails in library.native.bundle:
[19:49] <rgreening> java.io.FileNotFoundException: /home/rgreening/Programming/ubuntu/qtjambi/qtjambi-4.4.0/lib/libcom_trolltech_qt_phonon.so (No such file or directory)
[19:49] <rgreening> not building the qtjambi_phonon library...
[19:49] <rgreening> hmm
[19:50] <rafaelmf> is it normal -backports repositories not have all sources? kdebase-dev (3.5.10) on hardy-backport doesnt have a respective source
[19:50] <stdin> rafaelmf: do you have a deb-src line for it?
[19:50] <Nightrose> apachelogger: it unsinstalls my kde3 kdesvn?
[19:50] <rafaelmf> yep
[19:51] <apachelogger> Nightrose: hm
[19:51] <apachelogger> yes :P
[19:51] <Nightrose> meh
[19:51]  * apachelogger starts fixx0ring
[19:51] <stdin> rafaelmf: what's the error you're getting?
[19:51] <Nightrose> k
[19:53] <rafaelmf> stdin: i am trying compile kdebase 3.5.10, but on deb-src...hardy-backports it doesnt exist
[19:53] <rafaelmf> so, i'm not able to compile
[19:53] <stdin> rafaelmf: it does, I just downloaded it
[19:53] <Nightrose> apachelogger: other than that it looks good
[19:53] <rafaelmf> stdin: from bzr?
[19:54] <apachelogger> Nightrose: does it worky?
[19:54] <stdin> rafaelmf: no, from "apt-get source kdebase-dev", bzr only has the debian/ dir
[19:54]  * apachelogger isn't much of an kdesvn user
[19:54] <NCommander> rafaelmf, are you sure you have the right package name?
[19:54] <Nightrose> apachelogger: looks like it - don't have anything to commit right now - but updating works
[19:54] <NCommander> (i.e., do you see it on packages.ubuntu.com)
[19:54] <Nightrose> apachelogger: (a kde3 svn checkout that is)
[19:54] <apachelogger> okies
[19:55] <claydoh> stdin: I am collecting some of the more common questiions I see about intrepid/kde4 and seeing about making a faq for them
[19:55] <apachelogger> Nightrose: thank you
[19:55] <Nightrose> ;-) yw
[19:55] <goatsocks> rgreening: it looks like the symlink is a bad idea too then, one sec and i'll have a patch for ya
[19:55] <rgreening> wow. kool!
[19:56] <rgreening> yes, Kool with a K
[19:56] <rgreening> :)
[19:56] <stdin> claydoh: there isn't exactly a FAQ about that, only developer resources on the wiki
[19:56] <Nightrose> claydoh: link to the official KDE KDE4 faq
[19:56] <claydoh> so i better get to work in it then :)
[19:56] <claydoh> Nightrose: now that would be too easy :)
[19:56] <Nightrose> (for upstream questions)
[19:56] <Nightrose> hehe
[19:57]  * apachelogger doens't like upstream anyway
[19:57]  * Nightrose doesn't believe apachelogger 
[19:57] <Nightrose> ;-)
[19:57]  * apachelogger doesn't believe apachelogger either
[19:58] <stdin> next you'll tell us you don't believe in Santa either!
[19:58] <stdin> it's insanity!!
[19:58] <apachelogger> insanity is dead
[19:58] <apachelogger> they broke her
[19:58] <Nightrose> it's dead, jim!
[19:58] <apachelogger> even though I warned them
[19:59] <apachelogger> I told them like years ago that insanity should at least be chrooted
[19:59] <apachelogger> no one listened
[19:59] <apachelogger> and now she is dead
[19:59] <stdin> I break ubottu every other day, but at least I have the sense to fix it after ;)
[19:59] <apachelogger> oh, right, they don't do backups either
[19:59] <Nightrose> apachelogger: wouldn't have been a problem if oggy had made a proper backup...
[19:59] <apachelogger> I think the backup script also got lost
[19:59] <apachelogger> Nightrose: I wrote a backup script
[19:59]  * Nightrose headdesks
[20:00] <apachelogger> I just didn't cron it because I didn't have access at that time
[20:00] <Nightrose> doh
[20:00] <stdin> the good thing about having access to ubottu's server, I can add the cron job to backup myself
[20:00] <apachelogger> never trust anyone if it is about backups ;-)
[20:00] <stdin> we even have backups of some backups
[20:00]  * apachelogger doesn't trust anyone anyway
[20:01] <apachelogger> so
[20:01] <goatsocks> rgreening: this is still kinda kludgy but hopefully it'll move you past the current build hiccup: http://paste.ubuntu.com/48121/plain/
[20:01] <apachelogger> What could I blog about?
[20:01] <rafaelmf> stdin: yes, its true. with apt-get source it downloads kdebase-dev 3.5.10, but (on same sources.list) with apt-build  is downloaded 3.5.9, you know why?
[20:02] <rgreening> goatsocks: that's what I was thinking too... haha
[20:02] <goatsocks> rgreening: dirty minds think alike
[20:03] <stdin> rafaelmf: I don't know, I'd use "apt-get -b source ...". never used apt-build
[20:04] <rgreening> yeah. I was hoping to avoid too many kludges. But, just to get this built is the main thing first.... clean up after.
[20:05] <goatsocks> rgreening: exactly... i suspect there may be a larger build issue encompassing this, so don't want to prematurely spend too much time trying to fix it the "right" way
[20:05] <stdin> rafaelmf: probably a bug in apt-build
[20:06] <rgreening> yep. they expect include, lib, bin to all be in one place. and then they code qtdir and hardcode the lookup in the function calls. it's poorly written build system
[20:07] <rgreening> it should be QTLIB, QTBIN and QTINC for ex
[20:07] <rgreening> which can be equal but not necessarily
[20:08] <rafaelmf> stdin: ok, i'll try now with apt-get
[20:10] <rafaelmf> thanks
[20:10]  * apachelogger should become openbsd dood
[20:14] <rgreening> goatsocks: java didn't like the case
[20:15] <goatsocks> rgreening: oof, can you pastebin the output?
[20:16] <rgreening> http://paste.ubuntu.com/48126/
[20:16] <goatsocks> doh, lame compiler
[20:17] <goatsocks> rgreening: try putting it in a proper if {} then {} block
[20:17] <goatsocks> er if {} else {}
[20:21] <rgreening> lol
[20:23]  * apachelogger thinks he should write a compiler in ruby
[20:23] <jjesse> caused you have nothing else to do
[20:24] <apachelogger> exactly
[20:25] <goatsocks> if there's one thing i loathe more than java, it's ruby!
[20:25] <goatsocks> no that's not true... i loath myself the most~!
[20:25] <goatsocks> *loathe
[20:25] <goatsocks> beecuz i kaint speel
[20:33] <rgreening> lol
[20:35] <apachelogger> hm
[20:35] <apachelogger> qt 4.4.2 is out
[20:35] <apachelogger> and no one told me
[20:35] <rgreening> I decided to make a symlink for libphonon_gstreamer.so in /usr/share/qt4/plugins/phonon_backend instead to see if that gets me further along. I think in the long run, having phonon and Qt libraries provide symlinks may be the preferable way to go.
[20:41] <apachelogger> Nightrose: what could I blog about?
[20:41] <Nightrose> apachelogger: a happy Nightrose? ;-)
[20:42] <Nightrose> or kdesvn-kde4?
[20:42] <apachelogger> Oo
[20:42] <Nightrose> or something we need for kubuntu?
[20:42] <apachelogger> what exactly did you do with kdesvn-kde4?
[20:42] <apachelogger> Oo
[20:42] <Nightrose> i didn't do much with kdesvn-kde4
[20:42] <apachelogger> well, it certainly made you happy
[20:42] <Nightrose> open my old repo and update it
[20:42] <Nightrose> and brows a little
[20:42] <Nightrose> *browse
[20:42] <Nightrose> nah
[20:43] <Nightrose> that didn't make me happy :P
[20:43] <apachelogger> well, yeah, not a happy happy
[20:43] <apachelogger> more a special kind of happy
[20:43] <apachelogger> right
[20:43]  * apachelogger thinks about that and ewwwws
[20:43] <apachelogger> geeks
[20:44] <Nightrose> nah I had a visitor the last two days -> happy nixternal
[20:44] <Nightrose> meh
[20:44] <Nightrose> Nightrose even
[20:44] <claydoh> lol
[20:44] <apachelogger> nixternal visited you?
[20:44] <apachelogger> Oo
[20:44] <Nightrose> *lol*
[20:45] <Nightrose> I knew it...
[20:45] <apachelogger> well
[20:45] <apachelogger> I didn't
[20:45] <goatsocks> rgreening: i almost finished the build... with my patch and: JAVA_HOME=/usr/lib/jvm/java-6-openjdk QTDIR=/usr/lib/qt4 ant
[20:45] <goatsocks> rgreening: but it bailed with: http://paste.ubuntu.com/48140/plain/
[20:45] <apachelogger> TBH, I would be a lot more happy if that wouldn't have changed
[20:45] <goatsocks> rgreening: have you gotten that far?
[20:45] <rgreening> let me check
[20:45] <Nightrose> apachelogger: hehe got a visitor now?
[20:46] <apachelogger> me?
[20:46] <Nightrose> ah nvm
[20:46] <Nightrose> ;-)
[20:47] <goatsocks> rgreening: admittedly i haven't read the build docs, so i may not have the proper libs installed
[20:47] <rgreening> goatsocks: oh, I get about 27 minutes into the compile :) I think further along...
[20:47] <apachelogger> NickNak: you still got a visitor? Oo
[20:47] <goatsocks> seems to be a version related error
[20:47] <apachelogger> Nightrose even
[20:48] <goatsocks> 27 minutes?!?
[20:48] <goatsocks> wtf is this thing, a browser?
[20:48] <Nightrose> apachelogger: nope :(  he left
[20:48] <rgreening> lol
[20:48] <apachelogger> so
[20:48] <apachelogger> where is nixternal?!
[20:48] <goatsocks> does it use openoffice as a plugin?
[20:48] <rgreening> goatsocks: well my system is only a 1.67GHz Centrino
[20:49] <goatsocks> my lappy is 1.67 GHz... but Core 2 Duo ;)
[20:49] <rgreening> goatsocks: QTDIR=/usr/share/qt4
[20:49] <goatsocks> yeah i know, i'll read the build docs ;)
[20:49] <apachelogger> [Build #719353] amd64 build of mozilla-plugin-plasma 0.1~git20080918-0ubuntu1~hardy1~ppa1 in ubuntu hardy RELEASE (kubuntu-experimental PPA)
[20:50] <apachelogger> Oo
[20:50] <apachelogger> what an awful day
[20:50] <apachelogger> Nightrose: do you have some unused motivation?
[20:50] <Nightrose> apachelogger: nope - all motivation sucked in by huge email backlog :(
[20:51]  * apachelogger got a bug email backlog :P
[20:51] <rgreening> goatsocks.. can I e-mail you something?
[20:53] <goatsocks> rgreening: yeah, addy is on my lp page for ~goatsocks
[20:53] <rgreening> goatsocks: here.. read this http://paste.ubuntu.com/48142/
[20:53] <rgreening> it's my readme
[20:53] <rgreening> :)
[20:54] <rgreening> should help immensley. there are NO docs
[20:54] <goatsocks> yeah they really need an ant distclean target, but that's upstream's job not ours
[20:55] <goatsocks> lots of .log and .java cruft
[20:55] <goatsocks> however, i guess if you're packaging it for ubuntu, you do need to make sure rules cleans all that junk
[20:56]  * apachelogger hands Nightrose, rgreening and goatsocks a cookie
[20:56]  * goatsocks has never submitted packages to ubuntu
[20:56] <goatsocks> apachelogger: nomnomnom
[20:57]  * Nightrose munches the cookie
[20:58] <NCommander> ScottK, I got sudo access on a HPPA machine
[20:58] <NCommander> :-)
[20:58] <NCommander> I can now resolve HPPA FTBFS
[20:58] <goatsocks> rgreening: which version of libqt4-dev do you have?
[20:58] <rgreening> mmm cookie.
[20:58]  * apachelogger wonders if NCommander commited the oxygen stuff yet
[20:58] <rgreening> 1 sec..checking
[20:59] <NCommander> apachelogger, been a little busy. I don't have a local REVU installation anymore to test your changes
[20:59] <rgreening> libqt4-dev_4.4.1-0ubuntu2_i386.deb
[20:59] <apachelogger> NCommander: please poke rainct with it ;-)
[21:00] <goatsocks> rgreening: ok same here... must be something else
[21:02] <rgreening> did you read the paste?
[21:02] <goatsocks> rgreening: yeah
[21:03] <rgreening> so... 26 minutes later and the build failed
[21:03] <goatsocks> heh, at least ant is incremental
[21:03] <rgreening> goatsocks: in library.native.bundle
[21:04] <rgreening> it knows about phonon, and can find phon but can't seem to link to it.
[21:04] <rgreening> goatsocks: java.io.FileNotFoundException: /home/rgreening/Programming/ubuntu/qtjambi/qtjambi-4.4.0/lib/libcom_trolltech_qt_phonon.so (No such file or directory)
[21:04] <rgreening> never bult the package
[21:04] <goatsocks> damn
[21:05] <rgreening> I think phonon is borked in it
[21:05] <goatsocks> our patch is worthless, because we seem to be giving it the wrong library entirely
[21:05] <goatsocks> best stub out the phonon functionality for now?
[21:05] <JontheEchidna> phonon in kde is different than qt phonon
[21:05] <goatsocks> oh yeah
[21:06] <JontheEchidna> well, not entirely different
[21:06] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: it is? crud. Is there a package for it?
[21:06] <JontheEchidna> nope, not built
[21:06] <goatsocks> JontheEchidna: kde4 will be relying on qt's in the future though right?
[21:06] <JontheEchidna> goatsocks: dunno
[21:07] <rgreening> damn. I need it. Is there source?
[21:07] <rgreening> I can see me having to build it
[21:07] <rgreening> doh
[21:07] <JontheEchidna> well, it's in the qt4-x11 source package
[21:07] <JontheEchidna> it's just not built
[21:07] <goatsocks> rgreening: i guess that's what the "lib" prefix was for
[21:08] <rgreening> oh... so with qt 4.4.2 just released, can someone package the phonon bits :)
[21:08] <rgreening> hehe
[21:09] <rgreening> Riddell: around?
[21:09] <JontheEchidna> iirc there are several other pure-Qt apps that need Qt phonon
[21:11]  * rgreening kicks himself in the behind
[21:11]  * rgreening invites others to join him
[21:12] <goatsocks> don't be too hard on yourself... i knew about two phonons, it just didn't occur to me ;)
[21:12] <rgreening> goatsocks: so, removing the symlinks for phonon.. see what happens
[21:12] <rgreening> lol
[21:12] <rgreening> I asked indirectly yesterday.. just never got the "right" answer. lol
[21:13] <rgreening> well, it wasn't a complete waste of time. learned more about ant
[21:13] <goatsocks> i've been in a brainfog all week
[21:13] <rgreening> All I want is to work on ubuntu full time and give up my current job
[21:13] <rgreening> :)
[21:14] <goatsocks> rgreening: maybe you can create an opening for yourself at canonical by getting someone there fired? ;)
[21:14] <rgreening> lol
[21:15] <goatsocks> make it look nonchalant... blog about seeing them in public holding hands with GregKH or something
[21:15] <rgreening> heh
[21:15]  * goatsocks just frightened himself
[21:15] <rgreening> or they liked the MS (Bill/Sienfeld commercials)
[21:16] <rgreening> apachelogger: around?
[21:16] <JontheEchidna> rgreening: http://penny-arcade.com/comic/2008/9/15/
[21:17] <goatsocks> haha
[21:17] <rgreening> I agree WTF :)
[21:17] <rgreening> haha
[21:19] <rgreening> so, any reason there isn't a package of QtPhonon yet?
[21:19] <rgreening> issues?
[21:20] <JontheEchidna> probably something to do with KDE phonon
[21:20] <JontheEchidna> perhaps an oversight
[21:20]  * JontheEchidna shrugs
[21:26] <apachelogger> my
[21:26] <apachelogger> display
[21:27] <apachelogger> is
[21:27] <apachelogger> blue
[21:27] <apachelogger> -.-
[21:27]  * apachelogger hates mplayer
[21:28] <goatsocks> apachelogger: using the intel driver?
[21:31] <goatsocks> rgreening: qt4's debian/rules, line 111: -no-phonon \
[21:31] <goatsocks> rgreening: nothing about it in changelog though :(
[21:31] <rgreening> hmmm...
[21:32] <apachelogger> goatsocks: yus
[21:32] <rgreening> mayhap I may get it and mod a build for myself and see what happends
[21:32] <apachelogger> rgreening: now I am around
[21:32] <rgreening> hey
[21:32] <rgreening> who is packaging Qt? and can we get phonon in Qt or are there issues with using it with KDE's?
[21:33] <rgreening> apachelogger: any idea? just asking as you meantioned it earlier in the channel
[21:33] <rgreening> :)
[21:33] <rgreening> poke-poke
[21:33] <apachelogger> *shrug*
[21:33] <apachelogger> I really think the stand-alone phonon is more up-to-date
[21:34] <rgreening> KDE or Qt?
[21:34] <apachelogger> there is no KDE phonon
[21:34] <apachelogger> phonon is independent of both
[21:34] <rgreening> oh.. ok. At any rate, I can't get the one we have to work with qtjambi
[21:34] <apachelogger> and since Qt probably only ships a snapshot, I assume the stand-alone one is more up-to-date
[21:34] <apachelogger> rgreening: what is the problem?
[21:35] <goatsocks> apachelogger: a little trick you can use with mplayer and intel to switch select the xv overlay output (the bluescreen) or the xv textured (gl) output: mplayer -vo xv:port=FOO, where FOO is 82 for overlay and 66 for textured
[21:35] <rgreening> apachelogger: qtjambi fails at building any pary related to phonon.
[21:35] <rgreening> and no discernable reason for it
[21:36] <apachelogger> goatsocks: that in itself is insane
[21:36] <rgreening> it requires libphonon and libphonon_gstreamer.so
[21:36]  * apachelogger purged mplayer
[21:36] <goatsocks> apachelogger: it works with xine too (and phonon-xine) but the syntax is a little different
[21:37] <Riddell> apachelogger: there is a Qt phonon, it's the version that comes with Qt, which is slightly different from the one that we use from kdesupport
[21:37] <rgreening> Riddell: hellllllooooo! :)
[21:37] <rgreening> Riddell: so, phonon in qtjambi appears to be a no show with the current system packaged version.
[21:37] <apachelogger> Riddell: I think I don't like Qt phonon very much then.
[21:38] <rgreening> I've tried everyting
[21:38] <apachelogger> goatsocks: xine doesn't turn my display blue
[21:38]  * apachelogger gets an authentification module for his rails project
[21:39] <rgreening> Riddel: I can build qtjambi is I exclude phonon, but not if it's there.
[21:40] <goatsocks> i'm pretty sure the qtjambi guys intended for qt phonon to be used, but maybe they can be persuaded to allow the standalone
[21:40] <rgreening> Riddell: I'm thinking I should send you a copy of what I have done and let you have a quick peek.
[21:40] <Riddell> rgreening: ok
[21:41] <rgreening> I can tar up the debian dir and the BUILD text info for you. what address should I mail to?
[21:42] <goatsocks> preferably one that accepts attachments > 10 MB ;)
[21:46] <rgreening> it's only the debian dir, not the source. 84k
[21:46] <rgreening> :>
[21:48] <Riddell> rgreening: put it on a web server somewhere
[21:50] <goatsocks> rgreening: just another thought... since the build process is generating jni-enabled classes from c++ then sun's jdk may be the best to get a baseline off of
[21:50] <rgreening> dun have a place to post. I sent to your maintainer addy. It's a small attach.
[21:51] <goatsocks> openjdk could be the problem iow
[21:52] <rgreening> goatsocks: I don't think so. When I ran the make manually, it said it couldn't locate libphonon (but it was there). It's almost like it's not a valid lib to link to.
[21:52] <jtechidna> Riddell: is bug 262957 fixed?
[21:53] <Riddell> jtechidna: should be, try it
[21:53] <jtechidna> hehe, fair enough :P
[21:53] <jtechidna> nope
[21:53] <jtechidna> Depends: libkipi0 but it is not going to be installed
[21:54] <jtechidna> then kipi-plugins and kdeprint
[21:54] <jtechidna> but those are recommends
[21:54] <Riddell> try installing libkipi0
[21:54] <Riddell> probably will remove gwenview and bits
[21:55] <jtechidna> yeah, it will
[21:56] <jtechidna> but hey, it's installable. :)
[21:56] <rgreening> Riddell: did my e-mail go thru?
[22:01] <Riddell> rgreening: yes
[22:01] <rgreening> k. let me know if you have any suggestions. I think we need to package qtphonon
[22:01] <rgreening> from qt-x11
[22:02] <rgreening> I see gentoo has it... possibly others
[22:03] <rgreening> Riddell: prob a good opp to do it now as qt 4.4.2 was released and it will need packaging... can enable phonon then
[22:15] <goatsocks> rgreening: i can anticipate the next problem with build.xml when qt 4.4.3 is released... you'll have to change "trolltech" to "nokia" in all those hardcoded paths
[22:16] <rgreening> BWahahahah
[22:16] <goatsocks> http://labs.trolltech.com/blogs/2008/09/18/repeat-after-me-the-release-is-not-out-until-i-blog-about-it/
[22:27] <rgreening> Riddell: I think I may take a stab at updatine qt4.4.2 debs... for a hoot (and some experience and cause I want to test that qt phonon) HA
[22:28] <Riddell> rgreening: we can't switch to qt phonon, that would be a feature change and could break goodness knows what. we've been advised by upstream to use kdesupport phonon
[22:28] <Riddell> rgreening: but packaging qt 4.4.2 would be good
[22:28] <a|wen> g'evening to all
[22:29] <rgreening> Riddell: np. I want to check it to prove a point on whether KDE phonon will work with qtjambi (which it appears to not)
[22:29] <rgreening> Riddell: I hate being stuck on something like this. :) It eats my soul
[22:29] <rgreening> heh
[22:32] <jjesse> g'evening a|wen
[23:06] <apachelogger> rgreening: you could probably poke the qtjambi doods
[23:07] <rgreening> yah. Im building qt 4.4.2 debs now. Will test phonon from that and see if it makes a dif.