[05:00] <AliTabuger7> anyone up?
[05:07] <cody-somerville> no
[15:06] <AliTabuger7> Anyone here? Shahriar86? Hubuntu? Pep?
[15:06] <shahriar86> yes just arrieved
[15:06] <shahriar86> hi AliTabuger7 whats new? :)
[15:06] <AliTabuger7> I put another mockup on the wiki: http://img386.imageshack.us/img386/5351/spreadubuntudiygridalitwy9.jpg
[15:06] <shahriar86> checking
[15:08] <shahriar86> this is the get material page ?
[15:09] <shahriar86> humm ok
[15:09] <shahriar86> this is good...
[15:09] <AliTabuger7> It's a grid view possibility
[15:09] <AliTabuger7> What i put ont he wiki: The grid view has many advantages over a table, or vertical list of nodes. The thumbnails can be larger. Since they are closer together, it is easy to do side by side comparisons. Eliminates information users may not have interest in, like an exact download count. While this information is interesting, and extremely useful for sorting, and even considering/weighing materials with a close up viewing, it bears little rel
[15:09] <AliTabuger7> evance when a user is looking for something of a certain style. Download count and rating indicate quality, not style. Since download count is already sorted, the first results will undoubtedly be of good quality, so it becomes a style choice. - AliTabuger7
[15:10] <shahriar86> yes
[15:11] <shahriar86> thats the idea
[15:12] <AliTabuger7> it might be nice to have a table view possibility as well, which can be very easily done. The more I thought about it, a grid seems like the best view for the typical user.
[15:12] <shahriar86> I do not prefer table view.(though not sure what I am imagining is the right one)
[15:12] <shahriar86> can you show me a sample of table view?
[15:14] <AliTabuger7> http://neomenlo.org/og
[15:14] <AliTabuger7> thats my website. That would be a table view. It is good for displaying text information and details
[15:16] <shahriar86> yes this is what I was thinking... table view is good in listing details like who contributed, what purpose date size etc. but when I think of comparing or viewing the materials then table view is not so convenient
[15:17] <AliTabuger7> Exactly. That information is useless to most users
[15:17] <shahriar86> yes. I agree with you :)
[15:18] <AliTabuger7> Especially since you can filter/sort so that it fits your criteria. The download count will be high, the language will most likely be yours. The only other thing someone might look for is maybe a "topic", but that would be hard to do because there would be so many topics
[15:19] <AliTabuger7> and the search box should be able to do that anyway
[15:19] <shahriar86> hummm yes
[15:20] <AliTabuger7> I'm not saying it would be impossible to set up a "topic" field. It would have to be very well thought out and structured on our behalf for it be useful.
[15:21] <shahriar86> well topic in this sector is not that important
[15:21] <shahriar86> we can get some idea from the name of the posting maybe
[15:22] <shahriar86> topic will be very diversified
[15:22] <AliTabuger7> yes, but this may become necessary as more content gets put up
[15:23] <shahriar86> ok will have to think of it then, how to put things into common topic catagory
[15:23] <AliTabuger7> I like to use the firefox addons repository as an example. Any user can easily find the topic they are looking for because they picked broad categories
[15:24] <shahriar86> hummm....
[15:24] <AliTabuger7> It might actually make sense to add this after the site has been online for a while. We will then be able to see what 'topics' the materials use.
[15:24] <shahriar86> yes thats another way
[15:24] <shahriar86> I was thinking of it when the we have hundreds of materials
[15:25] <shahriar86> we can sort it then catagorize
[15:25] <AliTabuger7> Yes. at that point the feature actually becomes useful, and we have some content to look at to categorize and really get the categories right
[15:26] <shahriar86> :)
[15:26] <shahriar86> I am thinking what I am doing now :( nothing to help you with now. may be later...
[15:27] <shahriar86> any way your ideas are nice. just make it more readable (I can't read everything :P )
[15:27] <shahriar86> *on the mocup
[15:28] <AliTabuger7> One other thing to consider is that Drupals taxonomy feature (categorization/tagging) has heirarchial terms (tags) meaning they kind of function like folders since they can have subfolders
[15:29] <AliTabuger7> You aren't really supposed to read it. Most of it is giberish anyway. Like the big thumbnail image in the grid view says "Huge Thumbnail" on it and below it says title
[15:29] <AliTabuger7> most of the stuff is like that
[15:29] <shahriar86> ha ha ok...
[15:30] <AliTabuger7> if you were wondering about anything in particular, tell me where it is and i can tell you what it says
[15:30] <shahriar86> humm nothing... I just like what I see. because I am talking with you instantly
[15:31] <shahriar86> but other guys when they see it they might not get it.. but ofcourse the technical people will get it..
[15:31] <AliTabuger7> It's all visual. The text there is kind of filler
[15:31] <shahriar86> ok
[15:31] <shahriar86> yes the visual is good to explain the idea
[15:32] <shahriar86> I liked both of your idea
[15:32] <shahriar86> homepage and grid view in the get material
[15:33] <AliTabuger7> What would be a page i should do next?
[15:33] <shahriar86> grid view was what I had in mind, but did not know how to tell you
[15:33] <AliTabuger7> the specific view of a single material?
[15:33] <shahriar86> means?
[15:33] <shahriar86> it can have two way to approach
[15:34] <shahriar86> one is small tumbernail with description or directly the material?
[15:34] <AliTabuger7> no... i could show you... So this is like the grid view: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/search?q=&cat=1%2C22
[15:34] <AliTabuger7> then you click on like the first one
[15:35] <AliTabuger7> and this is like the "specific" view of a single material: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/11
[15:35] <shahriar86> yes I get it.. just of like image site
[15:35] <shahriar86> or the wallpaper site
[15:35] <shahriar86> right?
[15:35] <shahriar86> I am talking about the specific material page now..like I clicked the first one
[15:36] <shahriar86> what I will see?
[15:36] <AliTabuger7> I was just using the firefox addons as a way to kind of give you an example of what the difference in "grid" (they used list) and "specific view of a single material"
[15:36] <AliTabuger7> i was saying should that be the next one i mockup?
[15:36] <shahriar86> ohh yes I understand the difference
[15:36] <shahriar86> yes I was also talking about that
[15:37] <shahriar86> I was talking there could be two way right the one on firefox addon.
[15:37] <AliTabuger7> huh?
[15:38] <shahriar86> specific material page how it will be?
[15:38] <shahriar86> I am saying the way firefox addon site is done that is one way... right? another way could be downloading the material directly without much information?
[15:39] <AliTabuger7> So, i'm imagining a large(r) thumbnail at the top left. The title in the center. The author's name underneath it. Below that is a horizontal list of "liscense: ... language:... etc"
[15:39] <AliTabuger7> below the thumbnail there is a rating on a scale of 1-5 stars
[15:39] <AliTabuger7> and below the rating is the downloads all time (and maybe this week like on firefox addons)
[15:40] <AliTabuger7> and beneath all of that is a bunch of comments
[15:41] <AliTabuger7> if we want to get really really fancy (i don't know how the backend guys would implement that) it might be nice to have a "related materials" view at the right, kind of like youtube
[15:42] <AliTabuger7> Unrelated thought: is a ? a universal symbol?
[15:44] <shahriar86> I was disconnected
[15:44] <shahriar86> what was the last line I said? AliTabuger7
[15:45] <AliTabuger7> "I am saying the way firefox addon site is done that is one way... right? another way could be downloading the material directly without much information?
[15:45] <shahriar86> this all could be on the get material page  right under the thumbernail. we can have those info
[15:45] <shahriar86>  why need to load another page to give those info again?
[15:45] <shahriar86>  with small later= the contributor, license size
[15:46] <shahriar86> language and other are sortable via the drop down manu  and license could also be given as serch criteria	
[15:46] <shahriar86> this will enhance the search of material
[15:47] <shahriar86> don't have to load all the material to know the license
[15:48] <shahriar86> am i clear or confusing you?
[15:50] <AliTabuger7> I think I get what you are saying. I would like to avoid putting that information on that page to reduce page data size and visual clutter. Although I see what you mean. It does just say the same thing again, but it allows you to give feedback as well. Maybe we could compromize and have a direct download link?
[15:51] <shahriar86> yes that could be
[15:51] <AliTabuger7> it could be as simple as a green down arrow (v) before the title
[15:51] <shahriar86> yes
[15:51] <shahriar86> but what about feedback then.. it did not come to my mind before
[15:51] <shahriar86> say I want to customize a material, want the source file then how do I contact?
[15:52] <AliTabuger7> you click on the "title" or "thumbnail" links that go to the "specific single material" view i was talking about
[15:52] <shahriar86> hummm... yes
[15:52] <shahriar86> and specific single material page will include same info..
[15:52] <AliTabuger7> we could modify the grid view so that before each title there is an image that says "V Get"
[15:53] <AliTabuger7> which links do the direct download
[15:53] <shahriar86> humm yes
[15:53] <shahriar86> does javascript or ajax make the page more heavy?
[15:54] <AliTabuger7> depends on what you want to do with it
[15:54] <AliTabuger7> sometimes it makes it lighter
[15:54] <shahriar86> I was thinking hovering over the thumbernail or clicking the thumbernail can open another inlay data
[15:54] <shahriar86> say the descriptions and such
[15:54] <shahriar86> so the user don't have to load another page
[15:55] <shahriar86> they get the information just hovering over the thumbernail, or clicking on the thumbernail
[15:55] <shahriar86> same goes with comments, feedback?
[15:55] <shahriar86> (although sometimes this hovering thing gets on my nerve, could be annoying)
[15:56] <AliTabuger7> Although that isn't a terrible idea, and might be lighter weight, it couldn't be done in a way that is 'failsafe'. Theres an official word like... regression or something. What it means that if a user does not have javascript enable either for security or google crawler, the content cannot be viewed by them
[15:56] <shahriar86> yes I  have heard of it..
[15:57] <shahriar86> is there any way to make exception for a specific site?
[15:57] <shahriar86> then we can ask the user to enable javascript only once for our diy site?
[15:58] <AliTabuger7> It's typically a bad idea to do that because it means that your valuable data will not be indexed by google. 
[15:59] <shahriar86> ok (though not sure why)
[15:59] <shahriar86> google discourages this ?
[15:59] <AliTabuger7> Although I'm looking at the firefox addons again. If you click on the thumbnail of an image with javascript it pops up in that weird thing. If you click on it and you don't have javascript enable, it goes directly to that image. So it might be possible
[16:00] <shahriar86> hummm...
[16:00] <AliTabuger7> they don't discourage, they don't allow. If you make it so the content is only viewable with javascript enabled, they won't index it because they don't have it enabled. Same with flash and all that other stuff. The rest of the content gets indexed, but you're still missing that other content, which may be your most important information
[16:01] <shahriar86> that was just an idea,,so user don't have to load two three pages to find the right material for them
[16:01] <shahriar86> they can easily search and get the material they want viewing the get material page with javascript
[16:01] <AliTabuger7> if we could find a way to do what addons did with the thumbnail, except brining up the description when enabled, and the "specific view of a single material" i was talking about if it is disabled, it would be fine though
[16:02] <AliTabuger7> i consider 2 or 3 pretty good
[16:02] <shahriar86> hummm ok
[16:02] <AliTabuger7> I agree that less is better though
[16:03] <shahriar86> yeah make the work better and more bug free..
[16:03] <AliTabuger7> i also don't know if it could be done in a way that is both efficient (smaller data than loading another seperate page) and not annoying to the user
[16:04] <shahriar86> but again sometimes I am thinking from my point of view.. I would not like to load a full page then find that is not what I am looking for..
[16:04] <shahriar86> then clicking is ok, insteed of hovering over
[16:04] <AliTabuger7> Yeah, it's definitely something to consider
[16:05] <AliTabuger7> yeah clicking and doing something ajaxy MIGHT work. Not sure...
[16:05] <shahriar86> :) ok you look into it, it might work
[16:07] <AliTabuger7> Now that I think about it though, this too is not very necessary. It is good to have as few as possible, but right now it is important to get something basic up quickly that is completely bug free. Doing the ajax thing would make it much more difficult, take much longer, and would undoubtedly add many more bugs because of the added complexity. This definitely should be done later on though.
[16:08] <shahriar86> ok
[16:08] <shahriar86> no problem.. rock solid thing is first priority
[16:09] <AliTabuger7> The direct download thing can easily be added, and should definitely be added to this version
[16:09] <shahriar86> ok
[20:07] <AliTabuger7> anyone here now?
[20:10] <Flannel> Ahoy
[20:10] <AliTabuger7> Hello flannel
[20:10] <AliTabuger7> I finished a couple mockups
[20:11] <AliTabuger7> Home: http://img387.imageshack.us/img387/1600/spreadubuntudiyhomealitcy2.jpg    Grid View: http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/9586/sugridv0002resizedzy1.jpg
[20:12] <AliTabuger7> They are on the wiki too
[20:19] <AliTabuger7> Flannel, any thoughts?
[22:25] <hubuntu> hi AliTabuger7 
[22:25] <AliTabuger7> hello
[22:28] <AliTabuger7> welcome back, hubuntu
[22:28] <hubuntu> how is life?
[22:29] <hubuntu> I'm working in the minutes and will send an update about the meeting to the list
[22:29] <AliTabuger7> Pretty good. Did you see my mockups?
[22:29] <hubuntu> Haven't no, are they online already? I started at my new job on monday so I'va been pretty busy
[22:30] <AliTabuger7> Ah. I understand. How is that?
[22:30] <AliTabuger7> I put them up on the wiki: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MarketingTeam/Projects/SpreadUbuntu/diy#Design
[22:32] <hubuntu> it's nice: huayra.wordpress.com ;)
[22:33] <hubuntu> wow, you been really giving this some thought
[22:34] <AliTabuger7> I get bored alot and this is interesting
[22:35] <AliTabuger7> I put my username on all of those 'posts' because I wanted people to be able to leave 'comments' and feedback. that's how I'm supposed to do it, right?
[22:35] <hubuntu> good, I like people that have learned to canalize their energy :)
[22:35] <hubuntu> you do it the way it suits your needs
[22:35] <hubuntu> If it works for you it's cool
[22:35] <hubuntu> there is really no "rules" about how to do it other than doing it
[22:36] <hubuntu> I like the homepage
[22:37] <AliTabuger7> I know. I couldn't understand why shahriar and flannel were so opposed to it when i was telling them about it, but shahriar loves it now that he sees it.
[22:37] <hubuntu> your homepage with this: http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/3948/mockup5ax5.png would be a perfect start
[22:37] <AliTabuger7> I actually took a suggestion of his earlier today. Grid version 2 I think looks a lot more realistic
[22:38] <hubuntu> I rather see things than hearing about them... like Flannel's image of SU
[22:38] <AliTabuger7> I got rid of those tabs in place of what I think fits the traditional ubuntu website
[22:38] <hubuntu> it really made glad to visualize the layout of the site architecture
[22:39] <hubuntu> I really think the tabs are important
[22:39] <hubuntu> and we are really not copying ubuntu.com, but I mean you do what you want and then we find out how we end up
[22:39] <AliTabuger7> They provide important information, i agree. But I think that the "get" "make" and "share" works a lot better at the left than the tabs
[22:39] <hubuntu> It's Open Source... Those who can do, and what they do is what gets done
[22:40] <AliTabuger7> Well I'm open to criticism on it. I'm not going to just do it. I liked shahriar's idea for the grid.
[22:41] <AliTabuger7> and I actually had one idea written on there already, that maybe we should get rid of the canonical "products support community..."
[22:41] <hubuntu> definitely!
[22:42] <hubuntu> We should use those to give even more direct access to our document tags
[22:42] <AliTabuger7> That is one perfectly good suggestion there. Other parts of that menu could be used later on to integrate with regular spreadubuntu
[22:42] <hubuntu> >press releases >Invitations >flyers >whatever
[22:43] <hubuntu> the easiest the access, the better we get down to business
[22:43] <hubuntu> people want to get their job done. The most simple it gets, the most it weill be use
[22:44] <hubuntu> *will
[22:44] <AliTabuger7> I think if you are shooting for simplicity a drop down menu is absolutely horrible
[22:45] <AliTabuger7> speedy but not simple. I find them to be pretty confusing and overwhelming sometimes
[22:45] <AliTabuger7> but thats when they use it for entire websites. So maybe you are right, it could be used for filtering by content type and tags
[22:46] <hubuntu> I ment dropping the dropdown part of it
[22:46] <hubuntu> like shipit.ubuntu.com
[22:46] <hubuntu> just tags links
[22:46] <hubuntu> or even droppe the whole menu altogether
[22:46] <AliTabuger7> oh, yeah sure
[22:46] <AliTabuger7> the search box could get moved up there
[22:47] <AliTabuger7> rss?
[22:50] <AliTabuger7> I'm still a fan of the left menu opposed to the tabs. I think the ones at ubuntu.com look good and are very useful, but still simple
[22:51] <hubuntu> rss? what you mean?
[22:52] <AliTabuger7> I thought for a split second that maybe a rss feed could be included of all the latest materials
[22:52] <hubuntu> ooooooooh that's an awesome idea
[22:52] <AliTabuger7> that's REALLY easy to do in drupal
[22:52] <hubuntu> yeah, I know
[22:53] <hubuntu> Drupal rulez!
[22:53] <AliTabuger7> i thought of it because rss icon's sometimes go in the top right
[22:53] <hubuntu> that's definitely a wonderful idea
[22:55] <AliTabuger7> Are you still sure you like the tabs in the top?
[23:06] <AliTabuger7> I have to go: be back in an hour
[23:13] <hubuntu> I do like the tabs because it gives easy access to Uploaders/Downloaders to get where they want, but really it is up to you