[00:10] Where can I get information on what the final theme / artwork will be for Intrepid? [00:12] * JontheEchidna grabs his crystal ball [00:15] human? :) [00:23] human-murrine ? [00:44] Is anyone having issues with connecting using static IP address? [00:44] I tested Xubuntu Alpha 6 on two systems, and can't even ping my server [00:45] How can I completely remove kubuntu-desktop? [00:45] !puregnome [00:45] If you want to remove all !KDE packages and have a default !Ubuntu system follow the instructions here « http://psychocats.net/ubuntu/puregnome » [00:45] charlie-tca: How are you connecting with a static IP, via network-manager? [00:46] Pici: Doesn't work for intrepid / KDE4 [00:46] I tried to, but it won't let me enter static IP [00:46] Do I need to remove network manager? [00:46] Jordan_U: :/ sorry. [00:46] charlie-tca: In what way does it not let you? no [00:47] When I click to add a new connection, click on manual, OK greys out and never comes back [00:47] Even if I try to edit the existing Auto eth0 it does it [00:47] charlie-tca: Did you fill in all of the required fields? [00:47] Yes, all the fields including route [00:48] /etc/network/interfaces shows the static connection, too, with all the information [00:48] how can i prevent seahorse from revealing empathy gtalk password? [00:49] charlie-tca: Please file a bug report [00:49] Okay, against Network Manager? === Ng_ is now known as Ng [00:50] charlie-tca: I am not sure, since you say that your /etc/network/interfaces also isn't getting the job done, but the package is just a "suggestion" anyway, and network-manager is a good place to start [00:50] Okay. I'll go do that. Thanks! [01:37] does intrepid have 3d support for ati cards yet? [01:48] jadams_: for ones supported by the radeon driver [01:50] crdlb, I have an X1200 / RS690, so it looks like I'm 2d only under radeon: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RadeonDriver [01:51] nope, it should work in intrepid [01:51] cool. I'm updating right now, a week or two ago it wasn't working. [01:52] hmm [01:52] I'm running intrepid atm [01:52] the X1200 is a particularly vile graphics card, to be honest [01:52] mine's an X1250 I think [02:01] I have a question, but I have more of a procedural question (teach a man to fish and whatnot) [02:01] I want to know what version of the gimp is current with intrepid, but in general I want to know how I should check what version of package X is current with intrepid [02:01] so I don't have to ask people stupid questions [02:06] jadams_: you can use https://launchpad.net/ubuntu [02:09] jadams_, or http://packages.ubuntu.com/ [02:09] thanks [02:17] the problem with packages.ubuntu.com is that it's only updated once a day [02:17] I just want gimp 2.5 to hit intrepid [02:18] or gimp with GEGL, whatever [02:18] I've been waiting on GEGL for what seems like forever, and the little bit I've seen integrated so far into the GIMP is making me supremely happy [02:19] Hi. I'm in the live CD right now. I want to install on to an existing ext3 partition. I moved all the important files (/home etc)on the partition into a subdirectory (/oldsys)... I selected manual partitioning and to NOT format the drive. Now it's warning me that existing directories containing system files ("/etc, /lib, /usr, ...") will be deleted during the install... Can I go through with this without it touching /oldsys? [02:20] <_Zeus_> morsch: i really don't think that's a good idea [02:20] morsch: no [02:20] morsch: I think so, but I wouldn't bet unbacked up files on it [02:20] <_Zeus_> i don't think that's wise [02:20] <_Zeus_> you'll be left with the files that got removed in that version [02:21] you'd be better off just upgrading via update-manager [02:21] the root folder is basically empty apart from /oldsys at this point... [02:21] if the existing install is hardy [02:21] damn [02:22] yeah it is... or rather was, I think going back will be rather painful after the moving around of folders I did earlier [02:22] but I really, really want to do a clean install and not (another) dist-upgrade [02:22] you absolutely should have a backup of all important files on another HDD before using the intrepid installer in any mode [02:22] You have all in one partition, did a backup for your old system in /oldsys, and then installed telling to not format? I dont see a problem. [02:23] you could try it I guess, but only if you have a backup of everything in /oldsys [02:23] I'll try backing it up to another partition, but it's sooo much data... I'm sure I could lose a lot of it, but wading through it would take forever ;) [02:24] <_Zeus_> morsch: i wouldn't update to intrepid if you have no backup and valuable files [02:24] okay [02:30] How do I get II, and how do I update my GNOME in HH? [02:37] How glitchy is alpha 6? [02:40] Hello. [02:42] mn: *alpha* = "use if you do not mind your computer exploding" [02:42] I was wondering if I could obtain some info pertaining to Ibex... [02:43] JaseX: just ask the question! [02:43] jrib: is it really that bad? surely it's not too much worse than what the beta will be? [02:43] !anyone [02:43] A large amount of the first questions asked in this channel start with "Does anyone/anybody..." Why not ask your next question (the real one) and find out? [02:43] Yes okay. [02:43] mn, it works fine here. You can search the intrepid ibex ubuntu forum to get a rough idea of possible problems. [02:43] I just upgraded from Heron to Ibex... and now I cannot access my TTYs using the new kernel... [02:43] mn: it's not bad, but with updates still going on, anything can happen. I wouldn't rely on a system with intrepid for anything other than helping develop intrepid to be honest [02:43] Thus I cannot kill GDM to install Nvidia graphics [02:44] Envy crashes... and I'd prefer not to use it anyways. [02:44] JaseX: why aren't you using system -> administration -> hardware drivers? [02:45] Will I be able to return to HH if I don't like II? [02:45] mn, nope, unless that you reinstall [02:46] ooo, I don't really think I wanna go for it then [02:46] :P [02:46] How about the beta? Will that have a possibility to break your system too? [02:46] mn: if you just want to try out gnome, use a livecd [02:47] I have gnome [02:47] and kde [02:47] mn: you were asking about the newer version right? [02:47] I thought it was better to use the actual nvidia driver... [02:47] =/ [02:47] JaseX: why? [02:47] Someone told me that. [02:47] =/ [02:47] I remember a while back in 7.04 production. An update ruined it for a lot of ppl for 3 days [02:47] Either way I don't have TTYs [02:47] just flashing ascii junk [02:48] jrib: Oh, yeah. That's true. Is there any way to get the new gnome on hardy? [02:48] mn, sure, anything is possible when the user base is small. Not all bugs can be discovered. [02:48] JaseX: true, I don't know about that. The benefits to using Hardware Drivers is your X doesn't break everytime you upgrade your kernel like it does if you install the drivers manually [02:48] So that's the only difference? [02:49] relatively speaking is ibex about where ubuntu release usually are in terms of stability at this stage? [02:49] JaseX: eventually the versions will be different [02:49] mn, thats asking for big trouble I guess. [02:49] jrib: So if I installed drivers with ndiswrapper, my X will break on upgrade to II? [02:49] mn: no [02:49] mn: only with the binary nvidia ones [02:50] oh, ok [02:50] larson9999: alpha is alpha, aka not ready for production machines [02:50] Oh, well I guess to satisfy my curiosity I'll go download the Alpha 6 and burn it to a cd to see what it's like [02:51] mn, i've had alpha-6 on my desktop and laptop and they've been fine, it didn't like my older hardware work machine tho. [02:51] So... just use the ones ubuntu provides? [02:51] djbender, sure. that's why i asked in relation to normal ubuntu releases. and all alpha's aren't create equal. [02:51] it chooses not to configure the xserver properly though [02:52] larson9999, someone more experienced than me would have to answer your question then ;-) [02:52] Whereas I never have fail with the manually installed ones. [03:00] Hmm [03:00] So no apparent reason why I might see random ascii color crap? [03:01] and not be able to ask my TTYs [03:01] Well, I like Alpha 6. :-) [03:01] I do too... [03:01] Haven't found anything wrong yet [03:01] Minus lack of TTYs [03:01] Speaking of which I need to re-install USP [03:02] One last question about bugs of Alpha 6. Has anyone here found any major bugs on Alpha 6 (system-breaking bugs, etc.)? [03:03] ...lol [03:03] kind of mn. [03:04] I get a kernel panic ocassionally while starting up. [03:04] Seems related to my TTY problem. [03:04] I dunno. [03:04] djbender: I know im kinda beatin a dead horse, but I can't help it. [03:04] JaseX: What do you do to stop the kernel panic. Reboot? [03:05] Yeah... [03:05] * mn would like to see a kernel panic. Just not one that breaks the system. [03:05] I had to re-install the kernel to solve it. [03:05] Just booted into 2.26.24 [03:06] were you in 2.26.27 before? [03:06] had no idea why the original one had a kernel panic. [03:06] Yeah. [03:06] Just re-installed [03:06] I think it had something to do with the wireless or something. [03:06] How'd you re-install a different kernel? [03:06] I didn't... I just went into the old kernel... [03:07] and purged .27 [03:07] and installed again. [03:07] Oh, so you kept both kernels. How'd you purge it? [03:07] I just used synaptic. [03:08] and hit purge to all instances mentioning 2.26.27 and hit apply [03:08] and re-marked all of it, and installed again. [03:08] been fine since. [03:09] Oh, so if I upgrade and something fails in intrepid, I can just revert to the old kernel as long as it's the OS and not the GUI, app, etc? [03:09] it should keep your old kernel in the list. [03:10] and it will also add a last working boot option. [03:10] JaseX: on GRUB? [03:11] Yes. [03:11] Not sure if you use LiLo though. [03:14] Hmm, still awaiting some input on my color ascii junk I'm receiving when I press alt+f1~6 [03:14] I use GRUB. Hrmm, I can't decide. "To upgrade, or not to upgrade; that is the question." [03:14] mn... why not just wait :D [03:14] It'll be released fully soon, and less things to worry about being broken. [03:14] JaseX: I know it would be safer to wait, but I'm very curious. [03:15] It's still a month and a half till final release [03:15] guys, do you what's going on with samba? i can't make a user 'root' account that access entire / [03:15] It's not that much different yet :D [03:16] and i have commented out the disabled users line, for 'root' [03:16] is this the right channel to post ubuntu server questions [03:16] JaseX: from hardy? [03:16] yeah... it'd be better to wait. [03:17] geoilocate: I do not believe so. [03:17] This is for the Intrepid Ibex pre-release development. [03:17] We need as much testing as we can get, and trying a live CD is a safe way to do it. [03:17] If you don't depend on your system being completely stable, you can try to upgrade it. [03:17] mn, if your computer is critical to your every day tasks... i would recommend against it. [03:17] (if you know what you're doing and can unbreak things) [03:17] Of course. [03:17] and just use a virtual machine/livecd [03:18] Jasex: downloaded an iso for Intrepid Ibex but the server version [03:18] But I got limited bandwith. Getting a full .iso would take way more band width than an upgrade [03:18] Testing live CDs on every bit of hardware you can get your hands on is useful, particularly considering the new kernel. [03:18] Ah... so you're looking for help on Intrepid Ibex then? [03:18] mn: Not necessarily. [03:18] mn trust me [03:18] which reminds me to keep growing this list of ALSA quirks. Sigh. It just never ends. [03:19] JaseX: alright [03:19] Depending on the desktop CD's compression, it may be smaller (and more than likely faster) than upgrading. [03:19] wgrant: really? [03:19] it's about 566 MB [03:19] the .iso is [03:19] That's a bit on the small side... [03:20] It should be ~700MB. [03:20] -rw-r--r-- 1 william william 696M 2008-09-20 09:21 intrepid-desktop-i386.iso [03:21] JaseX: yes, on installing as a guest OS and when need to reboot get this error "unable to boot - please use a kernel appropriate for your CPU [03:21] geoilocate: You're not trying to install amd64 onto i386 hardware, are you? [03:21] Or i386 onto some old pre-i686 hardware? [03:21] Which version? [03:22] wgrant: you're right. sorry, i was thinking of Xubuntu being 566 MB. Would an upgrade take more than 700 MB? [03:22] mn: Most packages will be upgraded, so it would be similar for a default installation. [03:22] JaseX: wgrant: no using Alpha 6 [03:22] mn: Plus you probably have extra stuff installed, which would make it larger. [03:22] geoilocate: What are you trying to do? === geeter is now known as crimsun_ [03:23] wgrant: mm ok. then liveCD it is [03:23] crimsun_: Strange nick. [03:23] yeah, wack defaults here. [03:23] mn... did you get my posts? [03:23] 693mb for a cd [03:23] 845 mb for update-manager -d [03:23] 12:18:44 < JaseX> mn trust me [03:23] :D [03:23] JaseX_: That's the last we got. [03:23] wgrant: using VirtualBox 2.02 and trying to instal alpha6 [03:24] what i just posted is what suceeded what you just reposted wgrant [03:24] it was an extra hundred and a half megabytes [03:24] wgrant: installation proceed well, but when needing to reebot i get the error [03:25] JaseX: Yeah, I was leaning to LiveCD when you said that. This computer isn't all that vital. I was trying to save bandwidth, so/but LiveCD it is. [03:25] geoilocate: Does the kernel panic, or actually give the error that you said? [03:25] wgrant: gives the error [03:26] I get a kernel panic from intrepid ibex in virtualbox myself... so I installed it natively. [03:26] geoilocate: You might want to try http://www.bytebot.net/blog/archives/2008/05/04/sun-xvm-virtualbox-is-released [03:26] There appear to be instructions for resolving a similar problem there. [03:27] wgrant: this kernel requires the following features not present on the CPU: pae unable to boot - please use a kernel appropriate for your CPU [03:27] wgrant: will look at the link [03:27] Sounds like you're using -server. [03:27] (the -server kernel, that is) [03:27] Install -generic, and you should be OK. [03:28] geoilocate: did you try enabling pae on vbox? [03:28] * wgrant hasn't use VirtualBox, so knows nothing of this option. [03:28] JaseX_: no and how do I do that [03:29] wgrant [03:29] err [03:29] geoilocate: [03:29] shutdown the virtual machine [03:29] and open general options [03:30] there should be a checkbox on one of the tabs to enable the pae option [03:32] JaseX_:pae option checkbox disabled [03:32] Disabled? [03:32] Are you sure your processor supports it ? [03:32] try this from a local terminal [03:33] 'sudo lshw -html >> ~/Desktop/info.html [03:33] and then look through that till you see your browser [03:33] JaseX_: running Windows :( [03:33] Ah... [03:33] Hmmm [03:33] I don't know any other way then. [03:33] The command I just showed you will list your processor and the instructions it handles [03:35] I got a question maybe the developers may be able to help with-- It involves the fluxbox in the Synaptic-- Where upon using Nautilus the right command click disappears- thank goodness I already had a Xterm open-- Can anyone have a clue I know Flux is not supported officially. [03:36] redvamp128: if no one here can answer... try jumping on over to ##fluxbuntu double hash sign intentional... [03:36] They're working on an 8.10 release currently. [03:36] and of course revolves around fluxbox. [03:36] I didn't know that was a version-- [03:36] channel-- I mean-- [03:37] it is. [03:37] :D [03:37] uh [03:37] wait [03:37] sorry... not double hash [03:37] that's a diferent channel [03:37] just #fluxbuntu [03:38] I was thinking of ubuland [03:38] which is ##ubulande [03:38] minus the e [03:38] After Xp crahed I decided to give Ubuntu a try... I like it- it is faster than XP--- I also like the ability to change Session Mangers-- Have Kubuntu-Xubuntu- LXDE and Fluxbox installed. [03:39] Though the applicaitons menu is very full of apps when I sign into Gnome [03:39] Somehow I ended up with All the Kde3 and Kde4 apps [03:41] Hmm [03:42] Yeah [03:42] I get that problem too [03:42] 0:41:59 PM) SUNWjoejaxx: because nautilus takes over the rootwindow [03:57] I like KDE apps myself. I use amarok, K3B, Ktorrent, Klibido, among others [03:58] I like the Gnome apps, but I like KDE 4.1.1 [04:09] are you using KDE right now in Ibex? [04:09] me? [04:10] I was using Hardy Kubuntu, Ibex upgrade last night messed it up. It's ok now after I switched back to gnome [04:10] yes [04:10] I am using Gnome and KDE on Hardy right not. [04:11] now* [04:11] Im about to upgrade to Intrepid though [04:11] I suggest you switch to Gnome first, then upgrade [04:12] I have both [04:17] in the process of upgrading right now. just started [04:22] alright good luck [04:22] thanks. by the way ppl are tlkin, ima need it :) [04:48] dsffdf [04:48] hello? [04:48] hello [04:48] know any metacity recovery commands? I tried metacity --replace, but it cant find the x server... [04:49] (I sorta ran compiz, without any 3d drivers installed, and its borking my computer...) [04:52] I don't use that [04:52] danbh_intrepid, metacity --replace. Did you run it from inside X? [04:52] x1250: no, from one of the alternate terminals [04:53] klsdjfa [04:53] opps [04:53] muahahahaah, got it, no idea how [04:54] danbh_intrepid, ok, you must run it inside X. [04:54] the problem was, that I couldn't get a terminal in X to get into focus [04:54] danbh_intrepid, you could have used ALT+F2 [04:54] somehow, when I typed that random crap, suddenly I found myself in one of the open terminals, and was able to run metacity --replace. I thinks ill file a bug report [04:55] x1250: mmmm,, good to know, though, allot of things werent working [04:58] hello all. I have an ATI X1200 equipped toshiba notebook... i understand that fglrx is not operable with the new xserver version. or is it? and with driver "radeon" compiz is functional but i cannot play video with any media player mplayer, or vlc, or other, if i use radeonhd then compiz-fusion does not work, what are my options in 8.10? [04:59] can anyone shed some light on this? [05:00] tj83, leave the default driver in xorg.conf (that is, no driver specified) and use: [05:00] Option "AccelMethod" "EXA" [05:00] in Section "Device" [05:01] x1250, ok, thank you so very much i have been pulling my hair out on this... so this is actually the "radeon" driver with the additional option right? [05:01] x1250: nope, alt-f2 does not work :P [05:02] tj83, yes, but you can just comment the line, since radeon its the default driver. [05:02] righto , thanks again x1250 i'll let you know how i fair. [05:10] x1250, ty, i dont know why that could not have been auto configured but that fixes the problem. much appreciated. [05:11] tj83, np [05:21] x1250, any support for 3d accel with the X1200 and "radeon"? only fglrx right? do you happen to know if ATI has anything in the works for the release of 8.10 on october 30th? [05:30] tj83, AFAIK the radeon driver doesn't support all card features, and it is also slower. Maybe Cedega needs some stuff radeon doesn't support yet, but google it if you want to be sure. [05:30] x1250, alright, will do. [05:31] tj83: Cedega's 3d accel test isn't particularly good, or wasn't last time I checked. [05:31] I don't think that my 7600Go with the nvidia blob passed it, for example. [05:33] RAOF, got the neuveau drivers working 2D for now and hopefully 3D soon... [05:34] terminator_: I wouldn't hold your breath on 3d :) [05:34] RAOF, ok, thanks for the input [05:35] RAOF, Thank you for pointing this out to me. [05:36] terminator_: I mean, the best you can currently hope for is that some apps will work, and some will even work faster than software :) [05:37] RAOF I'm just happy to get a graphic driver that works and gets me out of low resolution mode. [05:37] It's a start. [05:37] :) [05:39] RAOF Will update manager update neuveau if changes are made to it or do I have to manually update it by hand. [05:41] terminator_: If you've added my PPA to your sources, then yes. Each time I update the nouveau package it'll appear as an update for you. [05:41] thanks thats great to know. [06:02] Will wicd become a normal part of Intrepid? [06:03] heh, no [06:03] Its not even in the repositories [06:03] danbh_intrepid: What does 'heh' here mean? [06:03] Pici: Thank you for your information. [06:03] bullgard4: just what Pici said, its not even in the repositories [06:04] danbh_intrepid: Thank you. [06:04] bullgard4: ironically, Im running wicd right now. Its the only program that can work my wifi card [06:05] ok. [06:05] (sorry if that heh provided insult, btw) [06:06] danbh_intrepid: I did not know what this interjection meant here. [06:11] Can someone without KDE installed please pastebin the output of "sudo apt-get install kubuntu-desktop" For some reason autoremove isn't working and I want to get entirely rid of KDE [06:11] Jordan_U, that ought to be everybody [06:12] Jordan_U: have you tried the purekde factoid? [06:12] my output is "[sudo] password for stephen:" [06:12] danbh_intrepid: Not updated for Intrepid / KDE4 [06:13] Jordan_U: http://paste.ubuntu.com/48794/ [06:13] danbh_intrepid: Thanks [06:14] np [06:17] danbh_intrepid: It's great watching my menu's become uncluttered in real time :) [06:17] : ) [06:40] how may I know if I am using Alpha 5 or 6? [06:42] upgrade for justice! [06:43] Andre_Gondim: srsly, alpha 5 and alpha 6 refer to a release of a snapshot of the alpha of intrepid. If you update, you have the latest snapshot of intrepid [06:44] danbh_intrepid,thanks === jason_ is now known as DBO [07:18] hi i am using intrepid ibex; because of the ath5k support, but it seems not to be working; even though it says it connects. === boshhead_ is now known as boshhead [07:23] hi i am using intrepid ibex; because of the ath5k support, but it seems not to be working; even though it says it connects. [08:00] how have upgrades in kubuntu (hardy->ibex) gone for people? (not talking about clean installs that keep /home) [08:04] Lynoure: Should be somewhat safe by now I think [08:04] Teiseii: so you did it and it vent fine? [08:04] s/vent/went/ [08:04] Yes [08:04] * DanaG wonders what we'll be able to do with multitouch in the future... [08:04] Right now, there aren't a whole lot of cool applications that I've seen. [08:05] !find toshiba_acpi [08:05] File toshiba_acpi found in Use, of, uninitialized, value, in (and 32 others) [08:06] grr. [08:06] could be could for drawing, maybe [08:06] http://www.hp.com/united-states/campaigns/touchsmart/alt/tsalt.html [08:06] Would need MPX (Multi-Pointer X). [08:07] its so much fun running alpha software [08:07] darthanubis: yes, but I'm starting a new job tomorrow, so totally messing things today would be a big minus :) [08:08] I don't get it? [08:08] whats a new job have to do with anything? Naturally alpha software is NOT on a production machine? [08:09] darthanubis: totally messing up today the computer that I'm supposed to work with tomorrow would be a big minus... but I feel so tempted to upgrade. [08:09] thats just silly [08:09] Don't do it if you don't have a spare system or such. [08:09] basically [08:09] Or even just a spare hard drive... or partition. [08:09] DanaG: Always done it to my main system at this point. [08:09] Or be willing to accept any breakage that may occur. [08:09] I've used it on both my main and backup systems... I just never update both at the same time. [08:09] DanaG: always gone ok, but less timescale to straighten things this time [08:10] That way, if one breaks... I know not to upgrade the other. [08:10] My current backup is a Aspire One =) [08:11] Heh, when I get my new laptop (as soon as HP makes the 15" EliteBook customizable), I'll have new things to play with. [08:11] UEFI... sounds fun to mess with. [08:11] It'll let me use the rEFIt boot menu thingy. [08:12] Lynoure, clone the install to a virtual machine and mess it up there [08:12] But oddly enough, not any for Win98. [08:13] er [08:13] argh [08:13] dang scroll on tabs... that was one line of a conversation in a different channel. [08:14] Context: /me likes VirtualBox -- it has guest additions for both Windows and Linux, with seamless mode. It also has guest additions for OS/2, for god only knows what reason. But oddly enough, not any for Win98. [08:14] elmargol: that would abstract away all the hw problems, which might be good if one had an itch for just the newness, but this is also ideal point to report those bugs. catch22, big time [08:15] You can test hardware problems using a live cd [08:15] * DanaG is currently on a system with an NV17 card. [08:17] elmargol: except for hibernation. [08:18] Which is the thing that seems to reliably toggle between releases =) [08:18] * DanaG pokes nvidia with a stick: fix the **** 96 drivers! [08:18] Lynoure, if you have a swap partition bibernation should work I guess... [08:18] Either that... or open-source the cards that need the 96 or older drivers. [08:19] elmargol: yes, I guess, if I make live-cd to use that swap [08:19] Lynoure, it does this by default i think [08:19] elmargol: no, does not seem to [08:20] elmargol: or at least it did not mess with the hibernation image I had there while I played with livecd [08:21] and I don't expect it to be smart enough to avoid that, but could be underestimating [08:23] swapon, swapoff [08:24] So only Teiseii had done that kind of upgrade, no one else? [08:25] (how it had gone generally was my question, rest I can manage to decide if I know that) === sourcode is now known as sourcode[0] [08:32] DanaG: you upgraded? Do you still use Kubuntu? (I hope I don't remember wrong) How did it got? [08:33] I'm on Gnome, actually. [08:33] Be aware that Intrepid actually replaces KDE3 with KDE4. [08:33] I am. [08:33] One of the things I want to find out is how gracefully/gracelessly that happens [08:34] I haven't done it with a KDE-based system. [08:34] as it will decide whether my mother stays a buntu-user or not [08:34] tip: don't put Intrepid on other people's systems, until after release. [08:35]