kwwiigood morning04:58
Zirodaykwwii: we must have just missed each other last night? You still there now?09:58
kwwiiZiroday: yepp11:44
Zirodaykwwii: gret11:45
Zirodaydid you see my email regarding DA?11:45
Zirodayor last nights backlog?11:45
kwwiinope, haven't checked my emails in a while...been working on another machine11:45
Zirodaykwwii: thought as much :)11:46
Zirodaykwwii: well basically DA said unless canonical sponsered the event (not sure in what capacity)11:46
Zirodaythen they would not11:46
Zirodayhowever if canonical does sponser that means that either the winning wallpaper would be the default or at least on the cd and/or canonical would have to put up prizes11:47
Zirodayand since canonical is you in this case :)11:47
kwwiiZiroday: yeah, and promised to include it...I'd have to talk to mark about this before I could agree to that11:48
Zirodaythats very much what I thought11:48
Zirodayotherwise we could always have a wallpaper contest outside of DA11:48
Zirodaysimilar to the KDE4 one11:48
Zirodaycause what I want from the spec (or how I see it) is that we are trying to get CC artists who may not have even considered doing something for ubuntu interested and have an easy way for them to start contributing11:49
Zirodaykwwii: anyway heart of the matter is that you have to take it to mark and get his decision11:50
Zirodayand I am more then happy to drop it or persue this wherever it goes :)11:51
kwwiiI have a phone call with him tomorrow, I will ask him then11:51
kwwiibetter to ask in person :-)11:51
Zirodaykwwii: thats wonderful11:51
Zirodaykwwii: I'll hang out here for the response then11:51
Zirodayand have an awesome night (or day)11:52
kwwiiok, sounds good11:52
kwwii1 in the afternoon here now11:52
Zirodayaround 7 here in asia11:53
kwwiiworking for canonical has opened up my mind to different time zones :p11:53
Zirodaykwwii: I still can't get my head around that when I go to sleep some peoples day starts half way across the world11:54
kwwiifor a while I had meeting with people from intel in California and people at an unamed hardware manufacturer in Taiwan...it was nice to be in the middle :p11:54
kwwiiyepp, northern bavaria11:55
* Ziroday has always wanted to visit germany11:55
Zirodaymy parents rave about it all the time11:55
kwwiithe beer is great!11:55
Zirodayhaha :D11:55
kwwiiwhere do you live in asia?11:56
Zirodaya very boring little country11:56
Zirodayever been there?11:56
kwwiinope, but I love green tea :-)11:57
Zirodayha, well if you ever do come enjoy the food11:57
kwwiiI have never been anywhere in asia11:57
Zirodaykwwii: you havent!11:57
kwwiimaybe one day when I get time off and have enough money11:57
kwwiikinda hard with a wife and kid11:57
Zirodaywell singapore is a nice starting place, its asia for wimps basically11:57
kwwiihehe, nice11:58
Zirodaymmm and expensive with wife and kids11:58
kwwiiI do love asian food though :-)11:58
Zirodayif asian foods is anything like the stuff in the US you might be in for a shock11:58
* Ziroday is fond of japanese food11:59
Zirodaybut it is terribly expensive11:59
kwwiialways wanted to try sambal stingray11:59
Zirodaynever heard of it12:01
Zirodayoh that!12:02
Zirodayyes it is nice but very very bad for you12:02
kwwiireally, how so?12:02
kwwiiouch, well that is out then...just heard about it and thought it sounded interesting12:03
Zirodayif you like that then you might also like chilli or pepper crab12:03
Zirodayalso very very nice12:03
kwwiiyes! the chili crab sounds delicous (I love crab)12:03
Zirodayyep the chilli crab sure is nice12:03
Zirodaywith cereal prawns12:04
Zirodayand deep fried baby squid12:04
* Ziroday is now very hungry12:04
kwwiimmm, squid does sound good12:04
kwwiiI bet you get it really fresh (so it is not too chewey)12:05
Zirodaywell if you ever are in sg find me and I'll take you for a yummy seafood dinner12:05
kwwiiin germany that is the kind of stuff you stay away from because there is no way it is fresh :-)12:05
Zirodayerm the food is okay freshness wise12:05
Zirodayits usually around ~3 days old12:05
Zirodayas none of its caught in sg12:05
Zirodayall in other parts of south east asia and then shipped here12:06
kwwiihere it is usually weeks old12:06
kwwiiI have a friend from greece and they drive down every month and pic up fresh fish12:06
kwwiiso once a month I get decent seafood12:06
Zirodaywell I am new zealander from origin and having fish less then 4 hours old from the sea is just beautiful12:07
kwwiipretty much all the food in germany is fattening :p12:07
kwwiimeat and potatoes12:07
ZirodayI bet you get good steaks and such no?12:07
kwwiilots of pork here...for steaks you need to go to brazil :-)12:08
Zirodaykwwii: sorry elisa had a hissy fit on me12:09
Zirodayand I miss a good pork roast12:09
Zirodaymost of the meat here is chicken, and horrible caged, hormone injected chickens at that12:10
kwwiiohhh, if you like roast you would love it here12:11
ZirodayI do miss my roasts12:11
Zirodayhad them alot in NZ12:11
kwwiiI buy all my meat from an organic farm so nothing I get has any hormones or such in it12:11
Zirodaystuff like that is hard to find here and very expensive12:12
kwwiithe chicken is a bit smaller but has a better flavor12:12
kwwiiin the last 5 years or so organic food has become very popular here12:12
Zirodaymmm I doubt it would here12:12
Zirodayeveryone likes hawker cause its cheaper then mcdonalds12:12
Zirodayabout SG$4.50 for a really good meal for one12:13
kwwiiI guess that such stuff has its place as well12:13
kwwiiI have no idea what the exchange rate is :-)12:14
Zirodayha mcdonalds doesn't have nearly any places here12:14
Zirodayits about US$3.1812:14
Zirodayfor a meal and drink for one12:14
Zirodayat a hawker center that is, and thats a pretty gourment meal at that12:14
kwwiiwow, that is cheap12:15
Zirodaygovernment has large subsidies on rice :)12:15
Zirodaypretty much near free rice is12:15
Zirodaybut in germany you have autobahns?12:16
kwwiiyes! I drive my mercedes at around 220km/h :-)12:17
* Ziroday wants12:17
Zirodayjust to try at least once12:17
Zirodayit must be so much fun12:18
kwwiiat first it is pretty scary...it took me a few years to get used to going so fast12:18
Zirodayyeah I can imagine12:18
Zirodaybut it would be one hell of a awesome commute :)12:18
Zirodaybut in germany you don't have national service?12:20
kwwiigermany has a great train service (and buses, etc)12:20
kwwiiwe have a fast train that goes like 200km/h as well12:21
Zirodaywe only have the underground12:21
kwwiiI have a card for reduced prices in the 1st class section...that is the way to travel12:21
Zirodayonly time I have ever been on a train was in the US and I thought that was great fun12:21
Zirodaybut I can't imagine a country that takes longer then 20minutes to cross12:22
Zirodayanyway I need to go now12:22
Zirodayhave to actually get some work done :P12:22
kwwiiok, have fun, talk to you soon12:22
kwwiihehe, yeah, me too12:22
Zirodayyou have a great afternoon12:23
Zirodaykwwii: thanks!12:23
kwwiithanks :-)12:23
thorwilgood morning _MMA_12:51
_MMA_kwwii: Get anywhere on that wallpaper?12:52
thorwilso Ken V. is gone12:59
_MMA_Yep. :(13:02
thorwilwonder how we can attract new people13:03
_MMA_I'll have a wide announcement ASAP.13:04
thorwil_MMA_: breathe/kyudo combined?13:04
thorwilfunny how we have endless threads of bla-bla, but now it's like syrup :)13:07
_MMA_Totally. It's those damn kids. Good for nothing. ;)13:08
_MMA_bbl (morning stuff)13:21
kwwii_MMA_: still working on it13:56
_MMA_kwwii: preview?13:57
=== luisbg_ is now known as luisbg
kwwii_MMA_: in a bit I can show you a couple of ideas13:58
thorwilme too ;)13:59
kwwiithorwil: I know this is a no-no, but I made this a while ago... http://sinecera.de/ubuntu_brushStroke.png14:06
thorwilkwwii: what is it for and why a non-no?14:07
thorwilah yes, we don't play with the logo :)14:08
kwwiiright :-)14:08
kwwiibut it looked nifty so I kept it14:09
aantnkwwii: heh :-)14:29
aantnit does look nifty, even if it'll never be used14:29
_MMA_kwwii: I wanna know what you have in mind as far as a base file icon.14:31
kwwiierm, you mean mimetype template?14:35
kwwiior just the empty file template?14:35
_MMA_Since you don't care for the page curl thing.14:36
kwwiiI'll have to take a look at the latest14:37
_MMA_Latest what?14:37
_MMA_I just pulled from Oxygen. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/BreatheIconSet/Icons14:38
_MMA_Oh. We're mixed up.14:38
kwwiino doubt14:38
_MMA_The file icon itself.14:38
DanaGOh good, a straight-on icon set, rather than a slanty one.14:39
_MMA_DanaG: You're gonna help right?14:39
DanaGI'm not an artist, actually.14:40
_MMA_I have grunt work you can do. ;) I'd personally like to see less talk and more action from you.14:40
kwwiiok, here is an idea for a wallpaper....not finished, and just a mod of my other one on the wiki...and very brown14:42
kwwiiand with that, I will go make myself a tea14:42
_MMA_DanaG: No "Ok. I can get involved." Nothing?14:43
DanaGOh yeah, what is there that I'd be able to do?14:43
_MMA_I will have work where you using Inkscape to take the various sizes of the Oxygen icons and putting them into our template.14:45
DanaGWhat's the template?14:46
* DanaG goes up a level... and finds it.14:47
_MMA_Now I'm not ready to start this yet as the template still needs a couple of fixes. But you can still play with it.14:47
_MMA_kwwii: Since Ken V has had to take a leave, when you can, I'd like to see your idea/revisions of his folder icon and the generic file icon.14:49
* DanaG goes off to classes now.14:51
thorwilkwwii: http://sinecera.de/ibex_mod2a.png makes me think of sun flares. the horn/spiral idea is not clear there15:00
* _MMA_ agrees. It's also, kinda bland. (sorry)15:07
_MMA_kwwii: Maybe use the logo colors like you did in the others? Transparent like you have the circles here. Should end up kinds subtle but might be a nice touch of color.15:10
kwwiiyeah, I am going to put the color back into it somehow15:10
kwwiithe darker version looks better with the colors15:10
kwwiiI gotta take my wife to the doctor and my son to judo, bbl15:11
szerencsefiaIs here any 'master' of Metacity?15:32
_MMA_Probably best to just !ask. ;)15:32
szerencsefiasure, I aim to have shaded state to be different at the bottom edge from normal state. Is this possible to make?15:34
_MMA_Hmm... Lemmie look.15:34
_MMA_I can say I've never seen it though. Only active vs. inactive.15:35
szerencsefiaright, that I know15:35
szerencsefiaI could not get so far anyhow shaded state to be different :'(15:36
_MMA_szerencsefia: From looking at that I would say, maybe.15:39
szerencsefiaThanks for this. I sent email to both of them at the bottom, but no answer yet and the documentation did not include answer to my question.15:40
_MMA_szerencsefia: Im gonna say you can because I see several mentions to the state in various metacity themes.15:44
_MMA_Mostly referencing the titlebar. But if it's a state like maximized and whatnot, might be possible.15:46
szerencsefia_MMA_: do ya have any theme in mind that draws somewhat shaded state and I could look into to compare with mine?15:52
szerencsefiaor anyone ... 8-)15:55
_MMA_szerencsefia: The Human theme doesn't?15:57
_MMA_Hi Conn.15:57
szerencsefiaif it does so, I did not recognize it16:02
thorwil_MMA_: got any private replies regarding Breathe meeting?17:10
kwwiiooooh-y-oooh taking retards to the zoo17:11
_MMA_thorwil: Nope.17:11
thorwillets rename our efforts to Dry and Desert, then ^^17:12
kwwiimy secret is to tell people that they have no choice or say in the matter and they seem to love offering ideas :p (joke)17:13
thorwilif interest goes up after the release? perhaps including a few capable souls among the muppets?17:14
_MMA_We'll see. I think it's our show 'till them. Be as open and communicative as you can but I don't expect much for a bit.17:15
* _MMA_ goes to play with the kids. (not a euphemism) 17:29
kwwii_MMA_: wait17:30
kwwiiwith color17:31
* _MMA_ puts up ac wallpaper.17:31
kwwiijust the basic idea, no specifics17:32
_MMA_kwwii: are you working with this as a widescreen?17:32
_MMA_kwwii: The green feels out of place to me but I think this could go go somewhere. Though, this feels like a kid doing his homework 5 mins before class is supposed to start. :P17:34
thorwilkwwii: better. nice to see some fresh color in there. what if you make one of the spirals a bit more prominent?17:34
thorwiloh damn, forgot17:34
thorwilkwwii: please tell us about your intentions, the target audience, what is your message? ^^17:35
_MMA_***thorwil is now known as troy_s.17:36
thorwiltroywil? oh noes!17:36
thorwil_MMA_: hush hush, it's playing time :p17:36
_MMA_kwwii: Though, with a darker theme, I quite like this as-is.17:38
kwwiimy target audience is color-blind gender transitioned 37 year olds17:38
_MMA_LOL! <-really did. :)17:38
thorwilnow that you say it, i can't make out the numbers in the dots :O17:39
kwwiiI am going to take something like at and put it as wallpaper and make another version for GDM and put it in intrepid17:40
kwwiilet the forums have their fun17:40
_MMA_thorwil kwwii: Added new "color cues". http://mma.users.ubuntustudio.org/Breathe_Icon_Template_revised.svg18:13
darkmatterdear... GAWD... next time a themer uses gtk-tooltips instead of gtk-tooltip* they better damn well get life in prison. Maybe that'll make the rest of them get with the program and learn...18:34
* thorwil looks at template18:39
thorwil_MMA_: did you have a look at the human icons and their colors yourself?18:42
_MMA_thorwil: No sir. I did not. I simply grabbed the swatches.18:44
_MMA_Oh wait.18:45
_MMA_yeah. I looked. :)18:45
_MMA_But thought your picks were fine.18:45
_MMA_If that's what you were after.18:45
thorwilok. yes18:45
_MMA_So if you're fine with that format I'll get Ken to look over and go from there.18:46
darkmattergeez.. even half of the upstream gnome themes use gtk-tooltips *beats gnome art team to death with a cluebat*18:46
thorwilscaling the swatched to non-integer values has interesting effects on their borders. they touch, but inkscape still draws a bit brighter there18:46
thorwildarkmatter: what's the problem there?18:47
thorwil_MMA_: fine18:47
darkmattergtk-tooltips is obselete :P it's actually gtk-tooltip now, but some third-party apps still use the 's', so the proper syntax is gtk-tooltip* ;o18:48
thorwilsounds like the name change was totally worth it ^^18:49
darkmatterI mean, if they're working upstream they should realize this :P18:49
andreasndarkmatter: you should probably file a bug(s)18:50
darkmatteryup.. and attach an announcement "attention themers: we know where you live" :P18:51
* _MMA_ gives a glance at his Studio theme.18:52
thorwil_MMA_: each time i wonder if that's haha funny or *oh yes, that is soooo funny :P*18:53
_MMA_hehe. gtk-tooltip* in the Studio theme. :P18:53
_MMA_thorwil: Same as LOL for me. It's an actual laugh. :)18:53
thorwilah, ok18:53
thorwilaantn: http://thorwil.wordpress.com/2008/09/23/infolders-informative-folders/19:23
aantnthorwil: cool19:24
thorwilaantn: ty. think you can do something with this? even if just bringing it to a wider audience?19:25
aantnthorwil: I hope so19:26
_MMA_thorwil: XP does something like this. Kinda neat but I've never found it useful. Can't say no to having the feature available though. :)19:26
aantnthorwil: at the very least, I can bring it to the attention of people who have the power to absolutely make it happen19:27
=== njpatel is now known as njpatel_away
thorwil_MMA_: i'm nost sure, but isn't it only for images and will only show the first 4 or something?19:27
aantn_MMA_: if you mix this with os x style previews and big (coverflowed?) icons then it's a lot more useful19:28
thorwilaantn: great :)19:28
aantnthorwil: good job with the mockups, though19:28
thorwileven just having folders that imply one of: empty, few items, many items would be nice19:28
aantnthorwil: yeah19:28
aantn_MMA_: how about showing a much larger preview on mouseover19:29
thorwilaantn: i tried to not spend to much time on it, but i also know that a shoddy presentation can kill :)19:29
aantn_MMA_: instantly access contents w/o opening the folder in a full window19:29
aantnthorwil: yeah, that's true19:29
_MMA_thorwil: Sure. That's why I said "*something* like this". Last I looked it did video as well. I could be mistaken. And it is only 4.19:29
thorwil_MMA_: yes. i asked because i'm not sure. last i sat in front of XP, i used detail view all the time :)19:33
_MMA_For me, I just found the images too small. Not good enough to really know what's inside. And sometimes, at a glance, I had to remember what I was looking at. Is that a folder, icon, whatever?19:35
aantn_MMA_: a big hover over would help that19:35
_MMA_That could be cool.19:36
aantnlike os x's quick look but for entire folders19:36
thorwil_MMA_: for me, here, a clue about the number of items is the important thing. if you make something out about images, that's just a plus. pr0n folders should stand out ;)19:36
_MMA_Though it needs some tweaks, I think the new Thunar preview thing they ripped from Vista.19:36
_MMA_thorwil: LOL! You know though, I don't want someone peaking over my shoulder seeing all that. :P19:37
_MMA_1084 p0rn files!19:37
_MMA_No thank you. :) Kids are gettin' smarter by the day.19:38
_MMA_*My kids...19:38
thorwil_MMA_: don't you use a harmless/start/path/continued/with/boring/to/in_the_depth/pygmy-riding-on-chicken-pr0n?19:38
_MMA_hahah Um.19:39
* _MMA_ thinks this has taken a weird turn. :)19:39
aantnany thoughts on this? --> http://theesylum.com/2008/09/14/task-centric-design/19:39
aantnthe general idea, not the specific design19:40
thorwilwasn't there such a sidebar in the online desktop stuff?19:41
thorwilgood if the sidebar is just a possible container for applets19:42
* thorwil never leaves so much space to the sides of app windows19:42
aantnthorwil: yes19:42
aantnthorwil: look at the notes on the second mockup19:42
_MMA_aantn: While I think it's cool eye-candy, for me, a dashboard/sidebar gets in the way. This type of feature might depend on audience.19:42
aantnthorwil, _MMA_: this doesn't need to be limited to a sidebar; see the notes19:43
aantnalso, I wonder if something like this is implementable with the online desktop19:43
thorwilno clue if and how that project progressed19:44
aantnthorwil: it's still being developed... somewhat19:44
_MMA_aantn: Sure. I'm personally not a big widget user either. I have a very specific setup. So I might not be your audiance. :)19:44
aantnthorwil: I think the usage of a sidebar may have restricted things19:45
thorwilaantn: what exactly is the idea here, if we look past having applets that can sit on a sidebar or elsewhere?19:45
* aantn ranted to owen about something similar a while back19:45
thorwilan idea i support, although i'm not a widget user, either, so far :)19:45
aantnthorwil: track events and display them to the user19:46
aantnshow the user want he wants to see anyway instead of making him check19:46
aantnalso, make it very easy to react to events and to view related information19:46
thorwilall good stuff. the fun starts if you work out the details19:47
aantnthorwil: aye19:48
* aantn wonders how something like this would work out with the document-centric-gnome and semantic-desktop ideas19:49
thorwilaantn: i wonder if events could be expressed as files19:49
aantnthorwil: why?19:50
aantnevents should be associated with documents (not necessarily files) but they themselves aren't really files19:50
thorwilaantn: to use the same search/filter mechanism for documents, email, events ...19:51
thorwilgood evening Cimi19:51
aantnI'd say the key concepts to focus on are events, documents (not necessarily files), time, actions (things you can do with documents, often in response to an event), and people (which are a useful way of grouping actions, events, and documents)19:52
Cimiyou too thorwil19:52
aantnhey Cimi!19:53
aantnbtw, I believe the mathusalem-like progress bars are being worked on19:54
aantnit would be cool to integrate that with the rest of the mockup19:55
thorwilaantn: mathusalem-like?19:55
aantnnjpatel_away: sorry, who's working on it again?19:55
aantnthorwil: http://live.gnome.org/Mathusalem19:55
aantnperhaps tracker could be used for some of this19:57
thorwilfor downloads, i would like to have the file icons appear with progress bar right on them /close to them. a file search for incomplete files would be used to list all downloads in progress19:58
aantnthorwil: that would be neat19:59
aantnicons do need a refresh20:00
aantnthey haven't changed much in the past long time20:00
aantnthorwil: btw, another person just complimented your icon mockups in #universal-applets20:04
thorwilaantn: send my thanks :)20:05
aantnthorwil: heh, will do20:05
thorwilaantn: or is there an interesting discussion there?20:05
thorwilstill no subscribers to the kyudo wiki pages. 55 views on main page. maybe i have to take matters piece by piece to the list20:07
aantnthorwil: nothing too interesting; mostly discussing names for UA20:07
* _MMA_ feels like an ass because he hasn't subscribed. Does so now.20:09
=== DanaG1 is now known as DanaG
thorwilinteresting new theme on http://planetkde.org/21:01
thorwilgood night!21:12

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