NCommanderStevenK, ping?00:27
ScottKNCommander: Would you please have a look at http://launchpadlibrarian.net/18240816/buildlog_ubuntu-intrepid-hppa.openexr_1.6.1-3_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz00:30
ScottKNCommander: lamont fixed glib2.0.00:30
NCommanderWow, how?00:30
NCommanderScottK, your not a DD, are you?00:31
ScottKNeed to find time to work on T&S.00:31
NCommanderI need a DD to help update my packages00:31
ScottKShould be no rush unless you've got RC bug fixes for Lenny.00:32
NCommanderScottK, more approaching the end of my NM process, and some of my packages have had outstanding patches for awhile00:35
NCommanderAfter three failed RFS attempts, I gave up00:35
NCommander(the patches were rolled into Ubuntu however after I became active here)00:35
ScottKRight.  How about openexr?00:50
LaserJockwe're just under FF right? no need to get every upload approved yet01:05
ion_I wonder how to debug LP #278188?01:08
ubottuLaunchpad bug 278188 in linux "irda broken on Thinkpad T23 with 2.6.27-4-generic, works with 2.6.24-16-generic" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27818801:08
ion_benc: You seem to have made some commits to nsc-ircc. Any thoughts?01:26
StevenKNCommander: Pong01:41
Hobbseemorning dinx02:02
=== bluefox_ is now known as bluefox
pittiGood morning06:20
pittiHobbsee: 277419 seems to have been sorted out, thanks tseliot06:22
Hobbseepitti: ah, cool!06:22
NCommanderwgrant, poke06:27
=== Nicke_ is now known as Nicke
=== jscinoz_ is now known as jscinoz
StevenKdoko: I worked on cacao, can you look over what I did?07:12
dokoStevenK: nice, what should I look at?07:19
StevenKdoko: Just want a second pair of eyes on it. http://people.ubuntu.com/~stevenk/cacao/07:19
dokoStevenK: do have debdiff with just the debian part and a dokg -c of the source package?07:21
dokoavoiding to type07:21
StevenKdoko: From the last package in Ubuntu (0.98-2) or Debian (0.99~rc5) ?07:21
dokoStevenK: the last one in Ubuntu should be ok07:26
StevenKdoko: http://people.ubuntu.com/~stevenk/cacao/cacao_0.99.3-0ubuntu1.debdiff07:29
dokoStevenK: hmm, I asszme this is the patched version in the source, isn't it?07:34
StevenKdoko: There's a patch needed?07:34
dokoahh, ok, there are no patches07:36
dokoStevenK: looks fine, now you could update to the head of the 1.0.x branch ...07:42
* doko ducks07:42
sleepsterI would like to add a package to the ubuntu repository.. does it take a long time?07:45
dokoStevenK: preparing a source package07:50
dokoStevenK: http://people.ubuntu.com/~doko/tmp/cacao_0.9.4~20081006.orig.tar.gz07:55
lukehasnonameping pitti07:55
StevenKdoko: How is that cacao related to the 0.99.3 I downloaded?08:00
dokotaken from the 1.0.x branch (which will become 0.99.4)08:00
StevenKOh, so it should be 0.99.4~20081006, rather than 0.9.408:01
pittipinging me and then disappearing?08:08
StevenKdoko: You'd rather use the 1.0.x branch than 0.99.3?08:09
loolpitti: The trigger is committed in upstream hal08:11
pittilool: \o/ thanks, I'll merge that08:11
=== ivoks_ is now known as ivoks
dokoStevenK: yes, as seen in the cacao-oj6 package. there will be a 0.99.4 release next week08:15
StevenKdoko: Can you repack the tarball? It ought to be 0.99.4... rather than 0.9.408:16
dokoStevenK: done08:20
loolpitti: Eh it's the work of Michael, not mine08:21
pitticjwatson_: what was the  component again which is responsible for copying the jockey installed packages to the installed system?08:29
=== cjwatson_ is now known as cjwatson
cjwatsonpitti: err ... jockey (debian/jockey.ubiquity)08:32
pitticjwatson: *headdesk* thanks08:32
pitticjwatson: my current woe is bug 25848608:33
ubottuLaunchpad bug 258486 in casper "X fall in failsafe mode after install if nvidia restricted drivers are installed during LiveCD session in intrepid" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/25848608:33
pitticjwatson: in short, we copy nvidia-* from the live system, but not /var/lib/dkms/08:33
pittithus after booting the installed system, there are no nvidia.ko modules, and DKMS doesn't even know about them since they aren't registered08:34
pitticjwatson: so I wondered whether I should just copy /var/lib/dkms/ to the target system08:34
pitticjwatson: can I just use file copying to /target/, or is there a special command for this, like apt-install?08:35
=== jamesh_ is now known as jamesh
pittiif that's too messy, we can alternatively completely disable jockey on the live system again08:37
=== tkamppeter_ is now known as tkamppeter
tkamppeterpitti, have you seen my new CUPS BZR upload for Debian and Ubuntu? Can you put it into Debian and Intrepid? Thanks-08:47
pittitkamppeter: I got your mail, yes08:48
tseliotpitti: have a look at the last 2 commits of my jockey-generic branch when you have the time08:49
pittihey tseliot, good mornign08:49
pittitseliot: great work!08:53
pittitseliot: clicking on the details button raises AttributeError: 'KDEUI' object has no attribute 'current_driver_name'08:54
tseliotpitti: do we have a test for this?08:54
pittitseliot: unfortunately not08:54
tseliotpitti: maybe it's better if we discuss this in private (so as not to flood the ubuntu-devel08:55
NCommanderpitti, I got a question you can answer08:55
NCommanderpitti, is it possible to retroactively bump something up to main?08:55
pittiNCommander: sure, we do that all the time (called "main inclusion request"), https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionProcess08:56
NCommanderFor something already released?08:56
NCommander(this needs a promotion in dapper, fiesty, and gutsy)08:56
StevenKNot sure we can/will do that08:56
pittiNCommander: nope, we won't do that08:57
NCommanderAny ideas how to fix this problem then?08:57
lukehasnonameI have to say08:58
lukehasnonameno, I don't have to say.. let me think about what I was going to say before I say it.08:58
NCommanderpitti, I personally don't care too much about it being broken in feisty or gutsy, but dapper still has two years of support left, it would be nice if we could get it fixed there ... :-/08:59
pittiNCommander: well, what *is* the problem?09:00
NCommanderxfprintf requires a2ps to actually print09:00
NCommanderTHis broken in gutsy09:00
NCommander(obvious Xubuntu users don't print)09:00
NCommanderpitti, now there is only one or two apps that actually use xfprint4, so its not a huge issue but ...09:02
pittiNCommander: oh argh, xubuntu-meta is in main for dapper/feisty/gutsy, so we can't even pull it in there09:03
NCommanderThe problem fixed itself when we got bumped to universe09:03
NCommander(and someone added a2ps to the Depends)09:03
NCommanderNow correct me if I"m wrong, but a promotion to main won't break things since main will always be enabled. Is there any way we could possibly get an exception to the no old release promotion rule?09:04
NCommander^- pitti09:05
NCommander(a2ps is pretty deeply wrapped around xfprint4, it would be a major PITA to fix that)09:06
pittiNCommander: I don't want to decide that on the spot; that has to be discussed with the soyuz guys (whether it's possible in the first place), and with some more archive admins09:06
NCommanderRight, no, that I understand, but I just want to know if at all its a possibility, or I should give up hope via this method, and look for some other way to resolve it :-)09:06
StevenKpitti: It starts a dangerous precedent09:06
NCommanderStevenK, how often would a package need to be bumped to main to fix a bug in an SRU?09:07
StevenKdoko: Right, 0.99.4~20081006 builds09:07
StevenKdoko: So, I hit up pitti to approve it, or now what? :-)09:08
asachmm ... are there use-cases for not having "lo" iface upped?09:08
StevenKasac: No, stuff breaks if it isn't09:08
pittiasac: it might happen if you don't have any network support compiled into your kernel, perhaps? (for really small embedded devices)09:09
asacyeah ... i wonder if there might be corner cases ;)09:09
pittiasac: but I can't imagine it on anything which also uses network-manager09:09
asacpitti: ok. but if there is network support, and "lo" interface can be upped, it should be upped i guess :)09:09
pittioh, yes09:09
ion_Could someone please sponsor http://launchpadlibrarian.net/18250664/iconv.debdiff to fix LP #278195? Thanks.09:10
ubottuLaunchpad bug 278195 in opensync "Incorrect encoding for the synchronized entries" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27819509:10
asacis sudo ifconfig lo up always the right thing to do?09:10
cjwatsonpitti: copying files to /target is fine if it's necessary09:10
cjwatsonpitti: (how come /var/lib/dkms doesn't get generated when installing those packages, the same way as it does normally?)09:11
cjwatsonNCommander: it could be done if there were a newer version of the package in -updates09:11
cjwatsonNCommander: I'm not even sure how it would be represented otherwise, or if Soyuz can technically do it without a newer version09:12
NCommanderIt seems Soyuz can't09:12
* NCommander just asked09:12
pitticjwatson: I need to find that out; currently exploring options, but I haven't reproduced it yet09:12
dokoStevenK: I thought he did approve it before?09:12
NCommandercjwatson, so could we upload a X.1 of a2ps which can be bumped to main, and then simply add the depends?09:12
cjwatsonNCommander: in theory09:13
pitticjwatson: apt-install will do a full install, including postinst, I assume09:13
cjwatsonpitti: yes09:13
cjwatsonpitti: note that it uses DEBIAN_FRONTEND=noninteractive though09:14
pittithat should be ok, nvidia-glx-* don't use debconf09:14
NCommandercjwatson, I'm asking now to see if thats a possibility09:14
pittitseliot: any idea about bug 258486 ?09:14
StevenKpitti: So, can I beg you to look at a new upstream Cacao?09:14
ubottuLaunchpad bug 258486 in jockey "X fall in failsafe mode after install if nvidia restricted drivers are installed during LiveCD session in intrepid" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/25848609:14
pittiStevenK: new features? if so, please attach a changelog to the bug09:15
pittitseliot: it seems that after copying nvidia-glx-*, the target system doesn't get the modules built (presumably because they aren't registered to dkms)09:15
tseliotpitti: I have added a comment there. Without a log and some other details I can't see what failed09:15
NCommandercjwatson, they say in theory its possible, although bigjools wasn't sure if archive admins could do the necessary promotion09:15
NCommander(i.e., it might require some black magic)09:15
pittitseliot: ok; I'll try to fake it in a VM09:15
cjwatsonNCommander: pretty sure we can09:16
StevenKpitti: Looking at the NEWS file, it's mostly bug fixes09:16
StevenKpitti: Do you want NEWS or ChangeLog, or both in a bug report? Keeping in mind I'm doing this for NBSage, and 0.98-2 FTBFS09:17
NCommandercjwatson, so now that the techinical part of the promotion is sorta resolved, whats the next step? I assume a post to -devel to discuss it?09:17
tseliotpitti: I guess that the system doesn't copy what was built by DKMS (/var/lib/dkms, the symlinks, etc.)09:17
cjwatsonNCommander: I suppose so09:17
tseliotpitti: s/system/installer/09:17
cjwatsontseliot: but why aren't those regenerated when the package is installed in /target?09:17
cjwatsontseliot: the hook that does this doesn't copy files, it calls apt-get install (eventually)09:18
tseliotcjwatson: yes, they are rebuilt if the driver is in the dkms tree in /var/lib/dkms09:18
cjwatsontseliot: the driver gets there in the first place by installing a package09:19
tseliotcjwatson: ok, I'll try to reproduce the problem here09:19
cjwatsontseliot: why doesn't installing the package in /target work?09:19
tseliotcjwatson: it should work. I'll see if I can track down the problem09:19
liwon Thursday and Friday last week, I tried upgrading my desktop machine from hardy to intrepid; both times it crashed hard, and from syslog and other things it seemed that the fglrx kernel module was the problem; last night, I restored the original state, removed the restricted kernel modules and restricted from sources.list, ran the upgrade again, and now it worked09:22
liwI should file a bug about that, but... any other suggestion?09:23
pittiStevenK: whatever is detailled enough to list/describe all the relevant new features09:25
pittiStevenK: and I'd like to have doko's "OK" for that update, he's the expert09:25
dokopitti: ok (I asked fot it =) )09:26
dokowill let us drop the cacao copy from cacao-oj609:27
StevenKpitti, doko: Bug 27895709:32
ubottuLaunchpad bug 278957 in cacao "FFe for cacao" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27895709:32
pittiStevenK: thanks; bug updated09:35
NCommanderStevenK, here's the proof of concept https://dogfood.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/basket - its possible to promote in a pocket09:36
NCommander^_ pitti09:36
pittiNCommander: ah, nice09:36
NCommanderWe're waiting on dogfood's backend to generate apt files09:36
NCommanderStill need to make sure nothing nasty breaks09:36
NCommanderBut from first glance, it can be done09:37
StevenKI figured it could be made to work09:37
NCommanderWe knew it was possible09:37
StevenKNCommander: Now you get to prepare uploads to -proposed09:37
NCommanderStevenK, and you get to upload them :-)09:37
NCommanderThe thing I was worried about if your promote a pocket it might affect the main archive09:37
StevenKNCommander: Do I? :-P09:37
NCommander(i.e., if I promote something in release, then backports and updates get prompted automagicially)09:38
NCommanderer promoted09:38
tseliotcjwatson: does the Ubuntu installer dump a log anywhere?09:41
NCommanderpitti & StevenK: I got confirmation that publisher does the right thing w.r.t. to promotion in a pocket09:45
cjwatsontseliot: /var/log/installer/syslog09:46
tseliotcjwatson: ok, thanks09:46
=== m-y-t-h-o-s is now known as mythos
=== m-y-t-h-o-s is now known as mythos
tkamppeterpitti, can you fix bug 271286 in Intrepid, otherwise driver auto-download is nearly non-functional.09:57
ubottuLaunchpad bug 271286 in jockey "Jockey should not only get "recommended" drivers from OpenPrinting" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27128609:57
pittitkamppeter: it's on my list, yes09:57
=== m-y-t-h-o-s is now known as mythos
Adri2000pitti: how often does the -sru team check main sru bug reports?10:08
pittiAdri2000: I check the upload queue every few days, and read the bug mail10:08
wgrantNCommander: Hi. Did #launchpad solve your issue?10:10
Adri2000pitti: if few days < 1 week, you probably missed vsftpd :)10:11
NCommanderwgrant, yes, it proved that promotion in a pocket will not cause the archive to self-destruct10:11
wgrantNCommander: So I read.10:11
NCommander(a pity ... *shot*)10:11
StevenKpitti: Mind binary NEWing cacao-source? I don't think I should do it since I prepared it10:17
pittiStevenK: it was just a sync, wasn't it? so don't worry about it, but I'll do it now10:18
pitticocoplum.ubuntu.com: forward host lookup failed: Unknown host10:18
pittiwasn't that the new drescher?10:18
slangasekbut you could just pass it off to the guy on archive duty today :)10:19
pittioh yeah, this "delegate" thing; admittedly I'm bad at that10:19
liwdelete, delegate, do... the GTD mantra :)10:20
liwthere's a defer there somewhere too... I need to re-read the book10:20
pittiStevenK: looks ok, accepted10:20
StevenKpitti: It wasn't a sync, though10:21
cjwatsonpitti: cocoplum.canonical.com10:35
cjwatsonoh, slangasek said, only more coded10:35
directhexcan a core dev please decline the release nomination on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mono/+bug/278946 ?10:35
ubottuLaunchpad bug 278946 in mono "Please update to Mono 2.0" [Undecided,New]10:35
pitticjwatson: yep, got it from slangasek; thanks10:35
Hobbseedirecthex: declined.10:36
directhexthanks Hobbsee.10:36
Hobbseedirecthex: you're welcome10:36
directhexHobbsee, it's a big sexy new upstream release, but it's tens of thousands of commits newer, and an upstream which needs a lot of patching..... and it's already october10:38
Hobbseedirecthex: indeed.10:38
NCommanderdirecthex, I'd run in horror if there was a FFe on that10:39
directhexNCommander, so would i, and i'm the mono guy10:39
directhexNCommander, trust in pkg-mono. even if i don't know what i'm doing, slomo and meebey do :p10:40
NCommanderdirecthex, I know enough that I should be a mono guy, I fixed evolution-sharp10:40
NCommanderremember that one :-)?10:41
directhexoh, grand announcement: the final obstacle to syncing mono (build-dep on libgda2) should now be gone, it ought to be syncable for jaunty once 2.0 packages land10:41
directhexjaunty will have a nice mono stack. more syncing, mono 2.0+, moonlight, mono-basic10:44
pittidirecthex: great work!10:44
wgrantIs there a good reason for the NM connection editor to not be in System->Preferences?10:46
sebnerpitti: what do you think, granting all FFe for mono 2.2 (March) :P10:46
directhexsebner, i'm laughing because it's true :). seriously though, we've spoken to upstream & they should now be MUCH more approachable when it comes to concerns over upstream releases versus distro freezes10:47
sebnerdirecthex: hrhr :)10:47
directhexthey're generally being a much better-behaved upstream, we even have our own packagers mailing list now to discuss things like downstream patches10:48
sebnerdirecthex: great to hear. hope they stick to the roadmap though10:49
directhexsebner, the fewer patches we need to apply, the more likely we are to be able to even consider FFes (for minor versions only, of course). making sure they're warned *in advance* of freezes lets them know which versions will be installed on thousands of machines10:51
sebnerdirecthex: hehe10:52
directhexe.g. "1.2.6" means "ubuntu 8.04", "" means "debian etch", "1.2.2" means "SLES10"10:52
sebnerdirecthex: let's hope for 2.2 means ubuntu 9.04 :P10:54
directhexsebner, well, whatever. the important thing from our perspective is, first and foremost, the best platform for desktop apps like f-spot and tomboy. cool new upstreams is a secondary concern10:55
sebnerdirecthex: of course10:55
=== nm-rocker is now known as asac
slangasekpitti: wow, still 8 distinct crasher bugs in console-kit-daemon?11:02
pittislangasek: on my triage rave on Friday I identified about three (of which one should be fixed in the latest version, and the other was the double close()), and some less frequent ones11:03
pittithe one in the creation of its gazillion threads doesn't seem fully fixed yet, though11:04
tseliotcjwatson, pitti: for some strange reason no nvidia-glx-VER package was installed after the installation of Ubuntu. Any ideas?11:09
pittitseliot: you enabled the nvidia driver on the live system and then installed?11:09
pittitseliot: in the bug report the reporter said that the package itself was installed, thuogh11:09
tseliotpitti: yep. And the modified xorg.conf is still there11:10
tseliotpitti: maybe he was referring to the modalias files?11:11
pittitseliot: that's possible, yes11:11
tseliotpitti: after all they are named nvidia-177-modaliases, etc. and nvidia-common too might be misleading11:12
pittitseliot: after installing the driver under the live system, they should appear in /var/cache/jockey/installed_packages; maybe something was missing there?11:12
tseliotpitti: there's nothing there but maybe the cache was emptied11:13
pittitseliot: I mean *in* the live system11:13
pitti(the cache dir isn't copied to the installed system)11:14
tseliotpitti: I am sure that the driver was installed and the the module was built because when this happens you can hear the login sound and network manager says that it disconnected and reconnected to the internet11:14
tseliotpitti: too late, I have installed Ubuntu in Virtualbox. I can try the livecd again11:14
* tseliot tries the livecd again11:15
tkamppeterpitti, I have uploaded an new system-config-printer package. Can you start this version and do the following:11:17
tkamppeterpitti, click "New Printer", select an arbitrary detected printer, Forward, "Search for a printer driver to download", Make and Model: "HP LaserJet 3390", Search, Forward,11:20
tkamppeterpitti, then you see on the next screen a description of the downloadable PPD for the HP LaserJet 3390. Can you make Jockey providing the same info when it has found a printer driver?11:22
pittitkamppeter: can you please put that information into a bug report? I'll look into it11:22
tkamppeterpitti, there is already a bug report, I could add there that I implemented rthe display of the info in s-c-p.11:23
pittitkamppeter: that works, too11:23
slangasek  dpkg --compare-versions $2 lt 3.1-pre11-1 || return 011:26
slangasek  dpkg --compare-versions $2 lt 3.2-pre9-4 || return 011:26
* slangasek coughs11:26
cjwatsonI hope that code is only run in cases where $2 may not be empty11:27
slangasekit's still broken, though :)11:28
cjwatsonwell, yes :)11:28
siretartslangasek: in case you're processing the NEW right now, the 'ffmpeg' package is targeted for multiverse (whereas 'ffmpeg-debian' should stay in main)11:29
tseliotpitti: /var/cache/jockey/installed_packages contains only nvidia-glx-177 (which is ok, I guess)11:29
pittitseliot: ah, I just fixed the boilerplate text in the KDE window if no driver is available11:29
slangaseksiretart: I saw ffmpeg in the new queue and started sobbing into my beer11:29
pittitseliot: that sounds fine11:29
pittitseliot: that list should get installed into the target system11:29
siretartslangasek: if you have any question about that package, I'm happy to answer them11:30
pittitseliot: by /usr/lib/ubiquity/target-config/31jockey_pkgs (shipped by jockey-common)11:30
siretartslangasek: as for potential or maybe patent problems, we have far worse examples already in multiverse, so I wouldn't expect THAT to be a problem11:30
tseliotpitti, cjwatson: is it possible that the cache is wiped before ubiquity takes that list?11:30
tseliotpitti: shouldn't that file say "apt-get install" ?11:32
pittitseliot: no, apt-install is a d-i command11:32
tseliotpitti: ok, I just wanted to be sure11:32
tseliotpitti: I thought I had fixed the problem with the KDE ui when no handlers are available11:33
slangaseksiretart: I'm primarily bothered by the code duplication.  So, all 6 of these libraries have to be rebuilt to enable the fuzzy stuff?11:33
pittitseliot: the crash, yes, but not the boilerplate elements like License: (license)11:34
pittitseliot: oh, maybe in your branch, indeed11:34
pittitseliot: I noticed it in GTK, too, and just fixed it in both11:34
tseliotpitti: aah, that11:34
pittitseliot: anyway, I'll merge from your's again now11:34
tseliotpitti: ok11:34
siretartslangasek: I'm aware of the code duplication and I already have a plan to avoid that, or at least to make it managable. For intrepid this is the best solution I've come up with. for jaunty I promise to have a better solution11:38
siretartI have sketched that plan on the pkg-multimedia mailing list, however alioth seems down, so I cannot give you the reference right now11:39
cjwatsontseliot: which cache?11:39
slangaseksiretart: ok.  the new queue is behind freeze exceptions on my todo list, but I won't run screaming from it then :)11:39
tseliotcjwatson: /var/cache11:39
cjwatsontseliot: any particular bit of it?11:40
tseliotcjwatson: /var/cache/jockey/installed_packages11:40
cjwatsontseliot: ubiquity doesn't wipe /var/cache, in general11:40
tseliotcjwatson: that's created by jockey (even in the livecd) when you install a driver11:40
pittiso the file is created in the live system,but a following ubiquity install doesn't install the packages it mentions?11:41
tseliotcjwatson: I'm not blaming it on ubiquity, I'm just trying to figure out what might have gone wrong in the installation process11:41
cjwatsonif /var/cache/jockey/installed_packages exists, I don't see any reason that code shouldn't work11:41
cjwatsontseliot: I would like to see the installation log though11:41
tseliotcjwatson: http://pastebin.com/m1afbdb4c11:45
pittishould the script appear there? or anything like "target-config"?11:46
pittishould the script appear there? or anything like "target-config"?11:47
cjwatsontseliot: I have a suspicion that this only works if the packages in question are on the CD11:49
tseliotcjwatson: if the DVD installer is available I can try it and see if I can reproduce the problem with it too11:50
cjwatsonI'm not quite sure though11:50
cjwatsontseliot: it would be worth putting set -x at the top of the script so that we get a shell execution trace11:50
cjwatsonactually, no, the above comment (packages in question on the CD) ought to be false11:51
cjwatsoncan you check /var/lib/ubiquity/apt-installed please?11:51
tseliotcjwatson: there's no such directory in my system11:52
=== davmor2 is now known as davmor2_away
cjwatsontseliot: even after the installer has run?11:53
tseliotcjwatson: I'm using the installed system. Shall I boot into the installer, install again and see if I can find that file?11:54
cjwatsontseliot: please11:54
tkamppeterpitti, bug 269454 updated11:55
ubottuLaunchpad bug 269454 in jockey "show printer driver support contacts, status, and unsupported color mode warning" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/26945411:55
pittitkamppeter: danke11:57
liwI'd like to get system-cleaner in intrepid updated to a bug-fixed version (274715, 274717, 275034); should I discuss this with release managers before asking for a sponsor to upload?12:15
slangasektseliot: on bug #220563, why do we not simply promote screen-resolution-extra to be a dependency of gnome-control-center?12:17
ubottuLaunchpad bug 220563 in gnome-control-center "Useful dual-head configuration requires manual editing of xorg.conf to set Virtual" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/22056312:17
slangasektseliot: given that it's already a recommends and therefore installed by default12:18
tseliotslangasek: of course I have no objections on this. I would like to know what seb128 or bryce_ think of it12:19
seb128tseliot: about what?12:19
slangasekseb128: gnome-control-center Depends: screen-resolution-extra, instead of adding extra code to g-c-c to handle s-r-e being absent12:19
slangasekit's not a difference in CD size at all, we'd just be promoting a Recommends to a Depends12:20
seb128right, that would work for me too12:20
tseliotoh, and BTW s/objections on/objection to/12:20
seb128but there is no real point to do that12:21
seb128it should be a recommends12:21
slangasekthe point would be to not write extra code and add additional UI strings just to keep it as a recommends12:22
seb128recommends are installed by default, they just give the flexibility to users who don't want those to uninstall12:22
slangasek(well, the code is written; but we wouldn't have to include it)12:22
seb128what changing to a depends would bring?12:22
slangasekseb128: it would solve the error condition in bug #22056312:23
ubottuLaunchpad bug 220563 in gnome-control-center "Useful dual-head configuration requires manual editing of xorg.conf to set Virtual" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/22056312:23
tseliotseb128, slangasek:  this is the link to the FFE: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/27597712:23
ubottuLaunchpad bug 275977 in gnome-control-center "Setting the Virtual resolution should be easier" [Wishlist,Confirmed]12:23
seb128slangasek: I would say it's a minor issue and can be delayed to next cycle, it's only a bug for people who don't install recommends12:24
tseliotslangasek: aah, the extra strings are the problem12:24
slangasektseliot: eh, you also subscribed ubuntu-release to bug #220563 and sent a debdiff there...12:24
ubottuLaunchpad bug 220563 in gnome-control-center "Useful dual-head configuration requires manual editing of xorg.conf to set Virtual" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/22056312:24
tseliotslangasek: yes, I was suggested to do so but at that point I couldn't unsubscribe ubuntu-release from the 1st bug report12:25
tseliotcjwatson: the installation process is not complete yet, however I can see both apt-installed (which contains also nvidia-glx-177) and the jockey_installed filed in /var/cache/jockey/12:28
tseliotcjwatson: would you like to see the full apt-installed file? Or is there any other file  you would like to have a look at?12:29
cjwatsontseliot: the former - apt-installed should be short12:32
cjwatsonI have to take the dog out now, but will follow up when I get back12:32
cjwatsontseliot: is the nvidia-glx-177 package installed in /target?12:33
tseliotcjwatson: let me check12:33
tseliotcjwatson: if I do ls /target/var/lib/dpkg/info | grep nvidia12:34
pittitseliot: you can sudo chroot /target and use dpkg -s, dpkg -L , etc.12:35
slangasekummm.  why does firefox want to use 'bazaar' as a handler for diffs?12:35
tseliotcjwatson: only nvidia-common and the nvidia-VER-modaliases files show up. No trace of nvidia-glx-177 or nvidia-177-kernel-source12:36
Keybuksoren: since updating desktop to Intrepid Beta, NFS mounts aren't mounted anymore on boot?12:37
liwKeybuk, they are for me (but I have two default routes, which messes other things up)12:37
tseliotpitti: right12:38
tseliotcjwatson, pitti: dpkg --list | grep nvidia confirms that the package wasn't installed12:40
pittitseliot: would be interesting to check whether /usr/lib/ubiquity/target-config/31jockey_pkgs was actually run; sth. like "set -x" and "exec 2>/tmp/jockey.txt12:41
tseliotpitti: shall I reinstall Ubuntu?12:44
pittitseliot: maybe cjwatson will have additional ideas when he returns; but for now we don't even know whether the script doesn't run, or whether apt-install fails, right?12:45
pittitseliot: so yeah, if it doesn't cause you trouble, changing the script that way and reattempting the installation would be interesting12:45
tseliotpitti: yes. I find it a bit weird that the package is in apt-installed though12:46
pittitseliot: oh!12:46
pittitseliot: ok, then I'm pretty sure that the script itself ran12:46
sorenKeybuk: Oh dear. Soething you could look into? I've started paternity leave today..12:51
pittisoren: oooh! congratulations, and good luck! *hug*12:52
=== davmor2_away is now known as davmor2
kwwiiseb128: I guess we should talk sometime about the gnome-themes package...bascially, we need to remove everything except the high-contrast themes12:56
seb128kwwii: could you mail the ubuntu desktop list? I don't like how things are being decided without public discussions there12:57
wtgeeHola all...I am trying to become an ubentero and gpg doesn't seem to be sending the keys or doing anything...pilot error?12:58
kwwiierm, ok but mark wanted me to report to him on wendesday about how far we are with this :-)12:58
slangasekseb128: is it your opinion that f-spot should not be updated for intrepid?  I'm likely to refuse this FFe request unless someone on the desktop team speaks up on behalf of it12:59
cjwatsonpitti: right, if it's in apt-installed then the target-config script ran; that was the point of that test12:59
seb128kwwii: you can tell him that such changes should be discussed somewhere so the community doesn't feel excluded etc12:59
Hobbseekwwii: is that dreary wallpaper *really* the final one?13:00
cjwatsonpitti: so that suggests to me that install_extras is busted, *again* - sigh13:00
Hobbsee(speaking of changes not being discussed in public)13:00
seb128slangasek: no, I think it should be upgraded but I'm not wanting to do the upgrade ;-)13:00
kwwiiHobbsee: no13:00
slangasekseb128: ah, heh :)13:00
Hobbseekwwii: oh thank goodness.  What's the new one like?13:01
Hobbseekwwii: and when will it land?13:01
kwwiiHobbsee: it is one that everybody loves :p13:01
Hobbseeoh, bah.13:01
kwwiiHobbsee: asap13:01
seb128kwwii: the change is an half an hour work so there is no issue to do it, I would just like a public mail about the suggested changes and the rational before doing that so we don't have "what the heck are you doing" bugs and comments13:01
Hobbseekwwii: hope you haven't seen brainstorm then.  or the forums :P13:01
Hobbseekwwii: excellent!  Where can we see it?  :)13:01
pitticjwatson: ok, I'll add the current findings to bug 25848613:01
ubottuLaunchpad bug 258486 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-173 "X fall in failsafe mode after install if nvidia restricted drivers are installed during LiveCD session in intrepid" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/25848613:01
pitticjwatson: should that be ubiquity, or some d-i component?13:02
stgraberslangasek: bug 278399 and bug 278425 for LTSP13:02
cjwatsonpitti: ubiquity13:02
ubottuLaunchpad bug 278399 in ldm "[UVFe] ldm (2.0.12 -> 2.0.13)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27839913:02
kwwiiHobbsee: I am going to use one of the pics on the wiki, either one from rico or thorsten13:02
ubottuLaunchpad bug 278425 in ltsp "[UVFe] ltsp (5.1.22 -> 5.1.25)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27842513:02
ograstgraber, you should probably mention that the "cosmetic change" in ldm fixes a regression13:04
Hobbseekwwii: i look forward to seeing it, as there are many pics on the wiki.13:04
seb128slangasek: upstream seems to expect the new f-spot version being shipped in the distros coming and blogged about that, and I would argue that f-spot is buggy enough anyway so new versions are not a stability issue anyway13:04
stgraberogra: oh ? I didn't know :)13:04
kwwiiHobbsee: something like https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/Earthenibex_wallpaper13:04
slangasekseb128: ok; I don't see that anyone currently on that bug is offering to prepare the package, though13:05
wgrantkwwii: That's nice, but it'd need to be scaled down a bit to make the desktop usable.13:05
ograstgraber, the password entry moved to the side with a patch early in the dev cycle, that patch centers it again13:05
Hobbseekwwii: nice13:06
seb128slangasek: right, I'll try to see if some of the active desktop team contributors is wanting to do it in the next days13:06
ograstgraber, oh, and we should probably also get a fix for bug 277331 in13:07
ubottuLaunchpad bug 277331 in ltsp "'ltsp-build-client' should pull from *-updates repository by default" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27733113:07
ograi think the "--copy-sourceslist" fix is the best way to go13:08
ogra(i.e. using that as default option if not on CD)13:08
kwwiiwgrant: yeah, that was my thoughts as well13:11
ogrameh, does anyone else see errors when trying to install devscripts ?13:11
stgraberogra: hmm right, that may break ltsp-cluster though13:11
stgraberogra: as I add a PPA to the sources.list, not sure if that will be overwritten or not13:11
kwwiihttp://bazaar.launchpad.net/~t-w-/ubuntu-artwork/thorwils_backgrounds/annotate/32?file_id=rsc_ibex_woodblock.j-20080927154856-l2xo5c38l0j5uun8-6 might be better in that regards13:11
ograstgraber, add it after the copy-sourceslist plugin ran then13:12
stgraberogra: anyway, for now best is to get both packages uploaded, the remaining bugs can be fixed without changes to upstream release (they are Ubuntu specific)13:12
Hobbseeogra: i *do* hope that pastebin, if linked to the line above, wasn't a serious question.13:13
ograHobbsee, it was, the recomends of devscripts are *insane*13:13
Hobbseeogra: i'm aware of that.  But you didn't give the error from above.13:13
ograHobbsee, it tires to install an MTA, isnt that error enough ?13:14
Hobbseeogra: surely, then, that's a bug about "devscripts wants to install a MTA".  Saying that there are "errors when installing devscripts" implies a packaging error, and packaging uninstallability.13:15
ograHobbsee, additionally all of these packages run invoke-rc.d inside a chroot ..13:15
liwogra, invoke-rc.d is supposed to be run13:16
liwogra, invoke-rc.d then calls policy-rc.d to see if it should do anything13:16
Hobbseewhich is a fix someone will probably want to delve in quickly, rather than the longer process of figuring out which ones can be removed, and dealing with any mailing list complaints because of your changes.13:16
mok0ogra: the application "gamgi" is in ubuntu universe for ii. You may want to include it in your edubuntu seed13:16
ograliw, all of them *require* proc to be mounted for invoke-rc.d13:16
ograthas not really kosher for chroots imho (beyond the fact that i dont want an mta just because i unpack and resign a source package)13:17
liwogra, hm, how do they require /proc in a way that no other packages require?13:18
ogradevscripts pulls in a massive amount of extra crap through its recommends13:18
Keybuksoren: I'm not home that much between now and release :-/13:18
ograit used to be a slim thing13:18
* ogra doesnt get why he would need x-www-browser in a chroot for example 13:19
jcristauit's ok, you don't need devscripts in a chroot either13:20
ograliw, no, but they simply require /proc ... which wasnt the case before ... when installing devscripts in hardy you get a small set of packages for manually fiddling with packages, when installing it in intrepid i get 100M more or so13:21
ograwhich is just a waste13:21
ograjcristau, if i work on packages for lpia i *need* a chroot with devscripts13:21
Keybukwhy is there a discussion about /proc being required or not? :p13:24
Keybuk/proc is always mounted13:24
ograKeybuk, my discussion point isnt /proc (though i dont like to have it required now) my point is that i dont want my chroots to explode by 100s of megabytes to silly recommends13:24
Keybukit's required13:25
ograits never been mounted in my chroots up to now13:25
Keybukso many things break if it's not there13:25
Keybuklike ps, pidof, killall, etc.13:25
ograand if we *require* it chroot should be patched to mount it yutomatically13:25
Keybukthat's not a bad idea (well, dchroot)13:25
KeybukI'm actually strongly considering having Upstart hard-coded to mount /proc and /sys13:26
jcristauschroot already does that afaik13:26
Keybuksince the overhead of /bin/mount is faintly ridiculous for a single syscall13:26
ograanyway, i dont see why i should need to buy bigger disks for the ten chroots i use for development for different purposes because they suddenly require a gig more on disk together13:27
Keybukjcristau: you appear to be correct13:27
liwI don't see big differences in the Depends of devscripts in hardy vs intrepid13:27
Keybukogra: use schroot ;)13:27
ograliw, we didnt use any recommends of them13:27
ogralook at the recommends13:27
liwogra, sure, but you don't _have_ to install recommends13:27
ograwe should have a devscripts-light or some such then13:28
liwogra, how do you install devscripts?13:28
ograapt-get install devscript13:28
ogra(and yes, i'm aware of the apt option)13:29
ogramy point is that people wont expect that and that there are others that even have scripts that keep their chroots up to date automatically ... havng a chroot filled with 100s of MB of crap isnt a good idea imho13:30
Keybukdo you mean MB or MiB?13:30
cjwatsonI'm amazed you've managed to get by for so long without /proc mounted in your chroots; I've been mounting it in my development chroots for years13:30
ograespecially with stuff that totally isnt needed for ubuntu package development13:30
cjwatsonogra: you could just use apt-get --no-install-recommends install devscripts13:30
ograKeybuk, that think with the M in the beginning :P13:31
cjwatsonif you don't like them, that is the proper answer13:31
liwKeybuk, that was lame. You owe me an explanation of why I get two default routes under intrepid (when using bridging).13:31
slangasekor you could configure your chroot to always use --no-install-recommends13:31
ogracjwatson, yes, i said i'm aware of that above13:31
Keybukliw: nuffin' t'do wi' me guvna13:31
slangasekwhich is sorta the sensible thing to do anyway13:31
cjwatsonogra: the option is there for people like you :-)13:31
ograslangasek, no, because i want the recommends for the other packages13:31
slangasekogra: in a dev chroot?  I assert that you do not :)13:31
cjwatsonogra: if everyone demands that their use case needs to be the default, we will never be able to satisfy everyone13:32
ograi might test installability :)13:32
liwwould anyone be willing to sponsor an upload of system-cleaner from REVU for me? 1.10 in REVU fixes several bad problems that are in the 1.8 version in intrepid13:32
slangasekrecommends-by-default gives wrong results for any sort of build-dep checking13:32
ogracjwatson, i just dont want it to regress so badly13:32
Keybuk. o O { why does blogs.msdn.com need to use such a small font? }13:32
cjwatsonogra: for most people, I assert that it's an improvement13:32
Keybukcjwatson: my use case should be the default, and so should yours ;)  everyone else can customise <g>13:32
ograhaving exim in a chroot is an improvement ?13:33
dokotkamppeter: when did hplip-gui introduce the dependency on python-reportlab?13:33
slangasekliw: why is it on REVU, rather than an LP bug + ubuntu-universe-sponsors?13:33
ograor subversion ?13:33
Keybuk(the fact that we completely disagree on everything makes that a humorous statement)13:33
slangasekliw: I thought REVU was only used for new packages13:33
cjwatsonogra: not having scripts installed that won't run is an improvement13:33
liwslangasek, I thought REVU was supposed to be used for all uploads13:33
cjwatsonogra: you're microfocusing on the problem you see rather than the reasons behind it13:33
ogra... or www-browser13:33
cjwatsonKeybuk: :-)13:34
ogracjwatson, well, that microfcusing results in several 100M per chroot on my disk :)13:34
cjwatsonogra: only because you're stubbornly refusing to use the option to make it not do so ...13:35
cjwatsonwww-browser is a little silly; bts only needs sensible-browser13:35
cjwatsonand works fine with w3m13:35
slangasekliw: in my experience, it's only used for new packages; I don't know if using the ubuntu-universe-sponsors queue will get it uploaded faster in practice, but it improves the chances of me looking at it personally, given that I would have to look up where REVU is located :)13:35
liwslangasek, right. I'm now looking for the next elusive wiki page to describe this :)13:36
ograwell, i see i wont convince anyone here  ...13:36
liwslangasek, it's as if all development docs were distributed in a maze of small hypertext pages, all alike13:36
cjwatsonogra: I agree that there are problems, but it would be much better to address them calmly rather than railing against recommends (which were always supposed to be installed along with the package in normal situations, per policy) and throwing around big numbers13:36
slangasekliw: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess13:36
ograeven though it feels like adding mono to build-essential ... i guess i'll have to live with it13:36
cjwatsonno, you could use the option13:36
slangasekliw: feel free to link to that from whatever page failed to inform you of it :)13:36
cjwatsonyou don't have to live with it13:37
ograthats whyt i mean by live with it13:37
ograthough i would prefer to have the old devscripts behavior back and just have a "devscripts-full" for the recommends13:37
cjwatsonthere is no point to --no-install-recommends if we're just going to take every package with recommends and split it into foo and foo-full13:38
liwogra, to get that done, you probably want to talk this over with devscript maintainers in Debian13:38
cjwatson(I know you didn't say that, but it's the logical conclusion)13:38
liw(it's unlikely to happen, but that'd be the right place)13:39
ograyeah, i get that13:39
tseliotcjwatson: is there any other file (in the live system) you would like to have a look at or can I shut down virtualbox?13:39
cjwatsontseliot: /target/etc/apt/sources.list and a listing of the files in /target/var/lib/apt/lists/ would be nice13:39
cjwatson(I was just getting back to you ...)13:40
slangasekpitti: it appears we still don't have a viable set of packages for ekiga 3.0? :( (#274085)13:40
sorenpitti: Thanks! :)13:43
sorenKeybuk: Ok. I'll try to look into it. Is there are bug report about it?13:43
Keybuksoren: I wouldn't know what to put in one other than "FAIL"13:43
cjwatsonpitti,tseliot: it does look as if *no* packages are being installed by install_extras13:44
sorenKeybuk: Can I see your /etc/network/interfaces, please?13:53
Keybukauto lo13:54
Keybukiface lo inet loopback13:54
ogrado we still maintain a blacklist for compiz ?13:55
ograit appears that compiz it used by default on geode systems, that doesnt work13:55
ograhmm, ENOMVO13:55
Keybukogra: /usr/bin/compiz is still a shell script13:56
Keybukand it still has a driver _whitelist_13:56
ograweird ...13:56
Keybukwhat driver are you using?13:56
ograi have reports from someone using ubuntu-mobile on a geode based system13:56
tseliotcjwatson: did you get the links to the sources.list and the other files or shall I post them again? (I've noticed that you were disconnected)13:57
ograand he complains about the massively slow effects13:57
ograapparentl its a AMD Geode LX80013:57
ograshould use the nsc driver iirc13:57
=== realist_ is now known as realist
ograwhich definately isnt in that whitelist13:58
cjwatsontseliot: I wasn't disconnected - it was a netsplit that we were on opposite sides of13:58
sorenKeybuk: That's it? Nothing commented out or anything?13:58
Keybuksoren: the wired card is brought up by NM13:58
cjwatsontseliot: I didn't get them, but please put them in the bug13:58
tseliotcjwatson: ok13:58
sorenKeybuk: Yeah, I guessed.13:58
jcristauogra: compiz wouldn't even start on a geode, afaik14:01
Keybuksoren: logs suggest Network Manager brought up the wired during the boot as usual; and didn't wait for login14:01
ograjcristau, hmm, i wonder why he complains about slow effects then, od we default to have composite on in metacity now ?14:01
Keybukogra: apt-get source metacity14:02
Keybukogra: apt-get install less14:02
cjwatsonKeybuk: miaow14:04
mok0ogra, did you see my shout ~45 minutes ago?14:04
sorenKeybuk: You never responded to this: 12:58:24 < soren> Keybuk: That's it? Nothing commented out or anything?14:06
tkamppeterdoko, I think hplip-gui always depended on python-reportlab. What is the problem?14:09
Keybuksoren: that's it, nothing commented out14:09
Keybuksorry, I thought that was implied by "NM brings the interface up"14:09
=== ogra_ is now known as ogra
sorenKeybuk: I just wasn't sure if that was a response to that since you only took two seconds to see my question, think up a response, and then type it :)14:11
=== ivoks_ is now known as ivoks
* soren bows to Keybuk's mad typing skillz14:11
ogra-n800grr, so a simple killall firefox killed my laptop now14:11
ogra-n800oh fun and after reboot i have no graphics output at all14:11
ogra-n800hmm, second reboot works... at least i see usplash14:11
* ogra checks for upgrades14:12
Keybukdid you have /proc mounted? :p14:12
ograok, i'm behing on kernel ... that might be it14:13
KeybukI actually ask, because killall defaults to killing *all* processes if you don't <g>14:13
ograwell, there was clearly somethng wrong with the graphics after rebooting14:13
Hobbseewubi pops up a dialog when you put an ubuntu cd into a windows machine, asking if you want to install it, doesn't it?14:14
ograi probably forgot to unmount proc in the chroot i used before though :P14:14
evandHobbsee: umenu does.  Wubi is an option in umenu.14:15
Hobbseeevand: cool :)14:15
* Hobbsee edits brainstorm more14:15
liwsoren, do you happen to know about network configs? my desktop is using a setup copied from KVM's wiki page and under intrepid I'm now getting double routes (which means packets go nowhere in some cases)14:15
sorenKeybuk: Hypothesis: Before I "fixed" mountnfs, do you think it might have tried to mount the nfs mounts straight away (like say when it brought up lo), and then only actually finished mounting it when the network came up?14:17
sorenliw: I'd blame NetworkManager. :)14:18
liwsoren, hmm, I can try removing that14:18
sorenliw: Either that, or try commenting out the nic's in /e/n/i.14:19
liwsoren, which nic? eth0?14:19
sorenliw: the one that gets configured twice.14:19
Keybuksoren: it looped waiting for a network device to come up I thought :p14:19
ograsoren, err14:20
ograwe use that in ltsp ... please dont break it14:20
sorenKeybuk: A cursory galnce at the code at least suggests that it'd bail unless it was configuring the final interface marked "auto".14:20
ogra(assuming you talk about the one in initramfs-tools)14:21
sorenogra: I'm not.14:21
ographew, ok14:21
ograthen ignore me :)14:21
sorenogra: I'm talking about /etc/network/if-up.d/mountnfs14:21
sorenKeybuk: ...but to be perfectly honest, I've not read all the code. I just saw the very clearly wrong path in there, fixed it, saw that it removed an error message, and thought all was good.14:22
sorenKeybuk: I'm kind of wondering why it worked before. :/14:23
liwsoren, hmm, right, if I disable NM (/etc/init.d/NetworkManager stop), then the double route doesn't happen, so now I need to figure out how to tell NM to not touch eth0 (the rules of which seem to have changed again)14:24
ograliw, it should manage eth014:24
liwogra, why?14:24
ograliw, it has a handler for /e/n/i now, but thats buggy, afaik asac is working on a fix14:25
ograliw, because thats the central point for handling interfaces now ... it's supposed to handle all of them centrally14:25
ograeven on commandline systems14:26
asacogra: i enabled it now14:26
liwogra, I don't understand you at all now; NM has had a handler for /e/n/i for a long time now, and NM most certainly has no business at all touching eth0 on my desktop14:26
asacogra: will send a mail to -devel after lunch14:26
asacliw: upgrade to latest NM ... default is "unmanaged" mode14:26
liwasac, define latest? this is upgraded today14:27
asacliw: so if you do nothing NM should stop managing devices in eni14:27
asacliw: the present is: network-manager 0.7~~svn20081004t225044-0ubuntu1 ... everything else is the "past"14:27
liwasac, is that a very recent upload?14:28
asacliw: uploaded 1h ago? :-P14:28
liwno wonder it isn't on my local mirror, then :)14:29
asacliw: < liw> ogra, I don't understand you at all now; NM has had a handler for /e/n/i for a long time now, and NM most certainly has no  business at all touching eth0 on my desktop14:30
asacliw: in intrepid LP: #< liw> ogra, I don't understand you at all now; NM has had a handler for /e/n/i for a long time now, and NM most certainly has no  business at all touching eth0 on my desktop14:30
asacliw: LP: #25605414:30
Keybuksoren: before, the boot used to mount nfs mounts in an /etc/network/if-up.d script14:31
KeybukI wonder14:31
Keybukasac: NM still runs those, right? :)14:31
sorenKeybuk: Right. That's what I touched.14:31
sorenI was just about to ask that.14:31
sorenI don't see networkmanagerdispatcher anymore.14:31
asacKeybuk: yes. thats the idea14:32
Keybukasac: how are they run?14:33
asacsoren: its a dbus action now14:33
asacKeybuk: ^^14:33
Keybukwhat's a "D-Bus Action" ?14:33
asacKeybuk: /usr/share/dbus-1/system-services/org.freedesktop.nm_dispatcher.service14:34
asacso service ;)14:34
Keybukso what causes that to be executed?14:34
Keybukbecause it's so not running here14:34
asacdbus activation?14:34
Keybukbut that used to listen to D-Bus signals before14:34
Keybukdid someone replace the D-Bus signals with method calls on the dispatcher?14:35
asacKeybuk: yes. now its auto activated and shuts down when finished14:35
Keybukand what does the dispatcher do now?14:35
* ogra reboots14:35
asacKeybuk: same as before. running /etc/NetworkManager/dispatcher.d/14:35
guysoft42hey all, i seem to have the following error in my repository when running $ reprepro check:Internal error of the underlying BerkleyDB database:  Within packages.db subtable hardy|main|i386 at c_get(DB_NEXT): DB_PAGE_NOTFOUND: Requested page not found . what to do?14:36
Keybukasac: ok14:37
Keybukneed to reboot after a kernel update, so let me see if it actually runs that14:37
asacsoren: Keybuk: if you see particular issues, let me know14:37
dokotkamppeter: could you check the cover generation with this package (new upstream version): https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=python-reportlab14:37
asacdidnt test for the last month or so, but last time i looked it worked quite well14:37
ograstarting virtualbox turned all my gtk into QT !!!!14:39
sorenKeybuk: I see the script running.14:39
sorenKeybuk: I put a "echo foo > /tmp/ping" at the top of mountnfs, and that worked.14:40
sorenKeybuk: (just tested it for my gprs connection)14:40
ograah, no, it just made gnome-settings daemon crash14:40
asacogra: so you mean s/QT/plain GTK theme/ :)14:41
sorenKeybuk: I'm in a hospital room right now with nothing but a gprs connection, so it's kind of hard to debug much right now. I'll take a peek when I get home and find some free time.14:43
* Keybuk hugs dkms14:43
Keybuknow it works, I like it14:43
ograah, better14:43
madduckhow are the chances of intrepid being released before 20 october?14:43
ograso now, why cant i enable compiz14:43
slangasekmadduck: ... zero?14:45
* madduck is trying to schedule a study involving ubuntu people so as to not conflict with the final sprint...14:45
slangasekmadduck: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IntrepidReleaseSchedule14:45
ograeven before oct 30th according to the schedule14:45
=== lamont` is now known as lamont
Keybukmadduck: Intrepid is released on the _30th_ of October14:45
madduckah, i didn't know about that page14:46
Keybukslangasek: temped to make a https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyReleaseSchedule with just "WHEN IT'S READY HA HA HA" on it :p14:47
Keybukasac, soren: ok machine came back after reboot14:47
Keybukso NM is definitely bringing up the interface before login14:47
madduckKeybuk: that would not be an acceptable answer to my question in this case, funny person you! :)14:47
Keybuknm-dispatcher did call 01ifupdown, which did a run-parts on /etc/network/if-up.d14:47
Keybuksoren: mountnfs was called for eth0, but appears to have not done anything14:48
Keybukah, my bad14:48
Keybuklet's try another reboot14:48
slangaseksuperm1: blah, why are the packages in the bluetooth ppa not using ppa version numbers? (evolution, totem)14:49
Keybukmadduck: could you not schedule your thingy to co-incide with UDS?14:50
madduckKeybuk: my study will run for several weeks (although the individual involvement totals at a few hours)14:51
Keybuksoren: interesting ...14:51
madduckKeybuk: what would be the benefit of making it happen in sync with UDS?14:51
Keybukmountnfs never called mount14:52
Keybukmadduck: ease of participation from ubuntu people?14:52
madduckKeybuk: i'd say that UDS might actually make it harder for people to work on my study, just judging from my own summit/conference experience.14:52
ograKeybuk, ogra@osiris:~$ compiz --replace14:52
ograChecking for Xgl: not present.14:52
ograDetected PCI ID for VGA:14:52
ograChecking for texture_from_pixmap: Segmentation fault14:52
ogranot present.14:52
ograthats on a i96514:52
madduckKeybuk: so you think UDS would make it easier for people to participate?14:52
Keybukmadduck: well, they'd be already there?14:52
KeybukI don't know what you're asking them to participate in?14:53
ograi assume its shouldnt really segfault14:53
madduckan email discussion; you should have gotten a message about it, didn't you?14:53
madduckKeybuk: ^14:53
madduckKeybuk: <20080926143635.305A34524@piper.oerlikon.madduck.net>14:53
Keybukoh, is that what that is?14:53
KeybukI confess that is sitting unread in my inbox14:53
madduckI confess it's rather lengthy and scary. :)14:54
tseliotogra: does glxinfo segfault too?14:54
Keybuksoren: ooooh, I have a *fun* bug report to write14:54
Keybuksomething, during the upgrade process, must have edited /etc/fstab14:54
Keybukand left it without a final newline14:54
madduckKeybuk: but it's a very cool method, I think, you might get a chance to look at it still. I did extend the deadline till Thursday...14:54
Keybukit appears that mountnfs ignores the last line if it doesn't have a final newline14:54
slangasekthat's the email that says "I'd like to take 5 minutes of your time" and then includes 10 minutes worth of text with a request at the end? ;)14:54
tseliotogra: and what card model do you use?14:54
Keybukso it ignored my nfs mount :p14:54
madduckanyway, sorry for the OT and thanks for all the help.14:54
madduckI will consider UDS when making scheduling plans too.14:55
tseliotogra: and what driver?14:55
ogratseliot, i965GM/GL96014:55
ograintel i guess14:55
ograi have no xorg.conf14:55
Keybuk(see also: why parsing fstab in shell a hundred times during boot is *BAD*14:55
ograyep, Xorg.0.log says intel14:55
Keybuk in fact, why parsing fstab at all and not using getfsent() is *BAD*)14:55
tseliotogra: can I see the Xorg.0.log?14:56
ogratseliot, http://paste.ubuntu.com/54643/14:57
* ogra has a conf call now ... back soon14:57
jcristauheh. '(II) NVIDIA GLX Module  173.14.12'14:58
tseliotogra: type sudo apt-get remove nvidia-173-kernel-source14:58
tseliotjcristau: right14:59
superm1slangasek, oops.  wasn't really estimating how long this whole process would be taking, i'll delete/readd those packages then15:00
ogratseliot, oh, where di that come from ?15:00
ograi surely didnt instal it manually15:00
slangaseksuperm1: ok :)15:01
* ogra purges 15:01
tseliotogra: it might be a Recommends of some package you have installed15:01
slangaseksuperm1: so will the 4.x stuff magically fix my inability to connect with gnome-phone-manager, or to run btsco, both of which worked in hardy and are basically the only bluetooth things I have that need to work?15:02
ografor me only one out of four devices works :(15:03
superm1slangasek, well what did you use btsco for?15:03
superm1slangasek, and what did you do with gnome phone manager?15:03
slangaseksuperm1: er, I used gnome-phone-manager for connecting to my phone, and now it doesn't work15:03
slangaseksuperm1: and I used btsco to get a device that ekiga could talk to, and now btsco doesn't work15:04
slangasek(with the packages currently in intrepid)15:04
superm1slangasek, connecting to your phone and sending address books, or which?15:04
slangasekgnome-phone-manager> dialing, actually15:04
superm1oh it provided a handsfree profile?15:05
superm1that's pretty interesting..15:05
slangasekI haven't tested the address book syncing yet, I guess I should test that too15:05
slangasekyes, g-p-m integrates with evolution address book even15:05
azeemout of curiousity, what is g-p-m using for sync?15:05
Keybuk            os.rename("/etc/fstab.intrepid","/etc/fstab")15:05
Keybukfor 10 points, spot the obvious error15:06
tseliotsuperm1: did you have a look at my nvidia-xconfig?15:06
superm1as for the sco stuff, if we end up with the latest pulseaudio it can enumerate bluetooth devices, but i'm not sure we will end up with it15:06
slangasekbut I don't use it all that much, I haven't settled on a workflow that doesn't make me hate computers15:06
slangasekazeem: it doesn't do syncing15:06
Keybukthe less obvious error than me pasting the wrong line ;)15:06
Keybuk            open("/etc/fstab.intrepid","w").write("\n".join(lines))15:06
Keybuk^ that line15:06
azeemslangasek: ah, k15:06
superm1tseliot, i glanced at it but didn't check it yet15:06
tseliotsuperm1: ok, no problem15:07
slangasekKeybuk: missing trailing newline?15:07
liwKeybuk, you mean the error of overwriting a sysadmin's manually created file?15:07
superm1slangasek, oh also regarding an earlier ping, i dont think that list is exhaustive of all cards that are transitioned over15:07
Keybukliw: "fixing" a file is a perfectly valid upgrade case ;)15:07
liw(that was the obvious one for me... the newline problem I had to think about)15:07
Keybukslangasek: exactly15:07
liwKeybuk, overwriting /etc/fstab.intrepid is not valid :)15:07
Keybukslangasek: where do we file bugs on the magic dist upgrader tarball?15:07
slangasekKeybuk: against project 'mvo', innit?15:07
slangasekor update-manager, maybe :)15:08
Keybukslangasek: he's on holiday15:08
Hobbseeslangasek: you can't file bugs against people.  I've long considered this a bug.15:08
ScottKHobbsee: They'd need a significantly bigget DB server if that was allowed.15:08
cjwatsonit's been update-manager in the past, yes15:11
Keybukslangasek: bug #27909315:12
ubottuLaunchpad bug 279093 in update-manager "Removes trailing newline from /etc/fstab" [Critical,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27909315:12
pitticjwatson: ah, tzdata 2008g-1 just hit incoming; shall I sync that to intrepid?15:13
liwslangasek, incidentally: unless it's PEBKAC, #278963 may need some bug fixing attention before release15:13
pitticjwatson: (that should fix Argentinia, too, I'll double-check that)15:13
cjwatsonpitti: oh, yes please if it fixes the argentina thing15:13
liwArgentina has messed up their time zone again?15:14
slangaseksuperm1: right, upgraded; and bluetooth-applet gives me the option to 'set up a new device', but doesn't show any devices and gives me no option to refresh the list...15:14
pitticjwatson: (there first was a 2008f-2 for argentinia, and then 2008g shortly afterwards)15:14
cjwatsonliw: yes, basically the government missed their deadline ...15:14
liwcjwatson, they should just switch to utc like all sensible people...15:14
superm1slangasek, the refresh should be constantly happening15:14
superm1if it's not showing anything for your device, are you sure the device doesn't require a reset quirk (as a lot of bluetooth devices do); did it need to be reset in the past for magic to happen?15:15
slangaseksuperm1: ah, I suppose it's not going to show my bluetooth headset because I didn't have it in pairing mode, meh15:15
liw. o O (BT could have been such a wonderful technology...)15:16
slangaseksuperm1: ok, the upgrade and a re-pairing through the wizard lets me get g-p-m connected to my phone; so far that's an improvement15:17
slangasekbut, er, previous versions of g-p-m allowed initiating calls, this one only seems to implement SMS15:18
pitticjwatson: confirmed, 2008g fixes it15:18
slangasek(that, or I'm thinking of one of the 12 other bluetooth things I tested to try to find something that works, but I don't think so)15:18
pitticjwatson: synced, intrepid task closed15:20
slangaseksuperm1: who do I hurt for these new buttons in GNOME preferences dialogs that consist of icons with no tooltips?15:20
slangaseklike this lovely "i" in a circle, the universal symbol for "information", which I know from previous bluez-gnome versions actually means "trusted device" :P15:21
superm1slangasek, that would be upstream.  slytherin offered to write a patch to put in tooltips though15:21
rom1vwhen ubuntu starts, where is the call to "compiz" (to launch compiz)?15:22
slangaseksuperm1: who upstream?  I've not noticed GNOME upstream as a whole to be afflicted with this particular brand of insanity in the past15:22
superm1slangasek, upstream bluez, they're the ones that author this15:22
slangaseksuperm1: as in, Marcel?  Hmm, that doesn't explain why things like unlabelled +/- buttons also appear in the keyboard prefs dialog15:23
superm1slangasek, yeah as in marcel15:23
slangasekwelp, btsco still fails15:23
* liw is hit by boot-time fsck. again.15:24
sorenKeybuk: Interesting. Something completely knackered my /etc/hosts recently as well.15:24
Keybuk"completely knackered" ?15:25
* liw hopes it wasn't python-fstab15:25
sorenKeybuk: When I opened it today, I found 7-8 identical lines reading: "# Do not remove the folliwing line...blahblahblah... something something" I forget what it read exactly, but something along those lines.15:25
soren...and nothing else.15:26
superm1slangasek, i'm pretty sure upstream is much more preferable to using the native sco support in bluez anyhow.. btsco is a third party universe project isn't it?15:26
Keybuksoren: mine appears to have15:26
Keybuk~30 blank lines added to the end15:26
slangaseksuperm1: I know upstream doesn't *want* me to use btsco, but that opinion is worth bupkis when the apps I'm trying to use aren't compatible with bluetooth alsa virtual devices15:27
sorenKeybuk: Very odd. I have 8 blank lines at the end now.15:27
superm1slangasek, well we'll see if TheMuso ends up setting up  the latest pulseaudio -  which includes bluetooth support.  if nothing else, that part should be better by jaunty..15:28
liwasac, upgrading to the current version of network-manager did fix my double route problem, thanks15:28
rom1vcould someone help me?15:28
asacliw: do you use bridging?15:29
liwasac, yes15:29
slangaseksuperm1: well, I should at least do some testing of audio output, here; if I can remember how to configure gstreamer for bluetooth, either...15:29
superm1i had a changer script for that; it's on another comp though.  mterry might have it handy15:30
pittitkamppeter: that means that the pdftoraster workaround in 1.3.8-11ubuntu1 is obsolete now and can be overridden by trunk, right?15:31
ograyay, compiz love15:32
* ogra hugs tseliot ... thanks a lot 15:33
tseliotogra: you're welcome. Knowing what installed the nvidia driver would be nice too15:34
cjwatsonrom1v: init reads /etc/event.d/rc2 which tells it to run /etc/init.d/rc which calls /etc/rc2.d/S30gdm which starts gdm which reads /etc/gdm/gdm.conf which tells it to run /etc/gdm/Xsession which calls /etc/X11/Xsession.d/50x11-common_determine-startup which reads /usr/share/gnome/autostart/gnome-wm.desktop which tells it to run /usr/bin/gnome-wm which decides which window manager to run, possibly compiz15:35
cjwatsonrom1v: HTH, but next time please don't ask support questions on a developer channel :)15:35
rom1vgreat answer ! thank you :)15:35
rom1vI need that because I think in a future realease, ubuntu should call "nvidia-settings -l" just before launching compiz15:35
ogratseliot, well, /var/log/apt/ only has info about the removal, so it must have been theer since a while15:35
Nafallocjwatson: wow :-)15:36
rom1vif graphical card is nvidia15:36
cjwatsonrom1v: similarly, bug reports => bug tracking system15:36
=== LucidFox_ is now known as LucidFox
rom1v(else nvidia settings are not used by compiz)15:36
asacsoren: Keybuk: those empty lines are a bug in NM ... shouldnt happen that frequently anymore after latest upgrade though (except when you change the hostname)15:36
cjwatsonerr, I missed out gnome-session running between /etc/X11/Xsession.d/50x11-common_determine-startup and reading /usr/share/gnome/autostart/gnome-wm.desktop, though15:36
rom1vI already reported that, but I will add this line "nvidia-settings -l" where it should be, then propose a patch15:36
ograoh, less isnt autodetecting .gz files anymore ?15:37
Keybukasac: ?! why is NM even _writing_ to /etc/hosts?15:37
* ogra was used to that 15:37
tjaaltonare hald/gdm startup priorities going to change for intrepid? there are bugs where people don't have a working keyboard/mouse before restarting X15:37
asacKeybuk: it doesnt do that anymore ... except when you change the hostname ;)15:37
tseliotogra: ok. Let me know if that happens again.15:37
Keybukasac: oh, change the hostname in NM?15:37
KeybukI noticed something deleted my custom bits from there15:37
ogratseliot, will do15:37
Keybukand I now appear to have the machine's hostname twice15:37
asacKeybuk: yeah ... now you can do: echo newname > /etc/hostname ... or send a dbus-send ... to change it through NM15:37
Keybukonce on where it should be15:37
Keybukand another time on ?!15:38
ogra127.0.0.1 should only be localhost, no ?15:38
Keybukogra: no?15:38
ograwhile should be the actual hostnale15:38
Keybukthat's just bogus15:38
Nafalloogra: yes15:38
KeybukI got rid of
Keybukand it's come back15:38
liwasac, I'm now ready to install nm with my phone and gprs, over a cable (after I have a bite to eat); is it useful to do that before I flash the phone to a current (only two years old) firmware?15:38
liwasac, or should I flash the phone first?15:38
Keybukogra: why can't be the hostname? :)15:39
asacliw: what phone is that? we should at least try to do it without firmware upgrade imo15:39
ograKeybuk, no idea, i just noticed it is like that when i installed this laptop with hardy15:39
liwasac, nokia e61; I will flash the phone first then, no worries15:39
asacliw: why flash first?15:40
Keybuk127.0.1.1 isn't even _valid_15:40
ograthogh checking now it apparently has changed15:40
ograogra@osiris:~$ cat /etc/hosts15:40
liwasac, er, sorry, I misread15:40
Keybukit just happens to work because of a freak of the way that Linux implements the loopback network device15:40
asacliw: lots of users will most likely not flash their phone ;) ... so lets try unmodified if possible15:40
ograi know in hardy there was only "localhost.localdomain localhost" for
Keybukasac: is NM setting the hostname to be or :?p15:40
cjwatson - This block is assigned for use as the Internet host15:40
cjwatson   loopback address.15:40
liwasac, lots of people with that firmware version _will_ flash their phone, since it has bugs that make one assume Nokia has never, ever made a phone before... things like the red phone button not hanging up on a call15:41
ograand had the hostname ...15:41
asacKeybuk: would have to look. maybe both?15:41
Nafalloexactly. is valid.15:41
rom1vcjwatson: in gnome-wm, don't you think the special case handling for dapper upgrades should be removed?15:41
asacKeybuk: whats the difference of and
cjwatsonrom1v: not my code15:41
Keybukcjwatson: that's quite new? RFC1700 only ever allowed ?15:41
cjwatsonrom1v: file a bug if you want it changed15:41
rom1vyes, I imagine :)15:41
asacwhy would anyone not want either?15:41
liwasac, so yeah, I'll try first without flashing, I'll report any problems/patches later15:41
rom1vok, I will (not for that problem, but for nvidia problem)15:41
ograKeybuk, i think windows did it since ages like that15:41
ogracant be *that* new15:42
asacliw: right. first step: 1. does NM detect your phone. if not -> patch hal-info  :)15:42
asacthen it becomes interesting i guess15:42
cjwatsonKeybuk: RFC1700 says:15:42
cjwatson      (g)   {127, <any>}15:42
cjwatson         Internal host loopback address.  Should never appear outside15:42
cjwatson         a host.15:42
Keybukcjwatson: why do Debian set the hostname to a different IP though?15:42
cjwatsonKeybuk: Debian bug 31609915:42
ubottuDebian bug 316099 in netcfg "Please give system hostname IP address" [Unknown,Closed] http://bugs.debian.org/31609915:42
cjwatsonit's to work around other problems15:43
Keybukso the reverse of the hostname is the hostname?15:43
NafalloKeybuk: Sept. 2002 by the looks of it.15:43
cjwatsonhttp://lists.debian.org/debian-boot/2005/06/msg00639.html is the root of the thread15:43
Keybukthe thread doesn't really specify any problems though15:44
cjwatsonthere is something wrong with the setup, but I don't think just reverting that netcfg change is the right answer; we'll just get a different set of problems15:44
Keybukthe thread starts with a "should always" assertion15:45
cjwatsonI'm afraid I don't have the references to hand, but I remember that thread coming after an enormous series of problems due to hostname reversal problems15:45
Keybukbut that seems to be the only thing made true by the way it's set up15:45
cjwatsonthe netcfg change replaced those problems with a smaller set of problems15:45
Keybukwell, normally you'd have15:46
Keybukso a lookup of "IP" or "HOSTNAME" replies "FQDN"15:46
Keybuk87.194.19.205  quest.netsplit.com quest15:46
Keybukbut if doing DHCP, there's an adversion to putting the hostname in that file15:47
Keybuksince the IP could be anything15:47
cjwatsonthe desired properties were (a) reverse( == localhost (b) reverse(forward(system hostname)) == system hostname15:47
Keybukin theory, you should never have the hostname in that file ;)15:47
cjwatsonthat makes forward(system hostname) == impossible15:47
Keybukbut I guess there are(were?) things that relied on it being there?15:47
cjwatsonstill are; I believe sudo is one15:48
rom1vcjwatson: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/215876 (my last comment)15:48
StevenKsudo only warns now, I think15:48
ubottuLaunchpad bug 215876 in ubuntu "compiz & nvidia-settings" [Undecided,New]15:48
KeybukI can't think of any problem that would actually caused by the lookup look resolving to localhost or
Keybukother than someone's aesthetics being offended15:48
cjwatsonrom1v: I would appreciate no longer being part of this conversation; it is not my area15:48
rom1vok, sorry15:48
cjwatsonKeybuk: so what is the problem it's causing now?15:49
cjwatsonother than your aesthetics, that is :)15:49
Keybukcjwatson: well, now, something is sticking it back in my hosts file15:49
Keybukwhich means it's got two different IPs15:49
Keybukand now local traffic is actually going to not the real IP15:49
Keybukwhich broke my apache virtual setup :p15:49
cjwatsonok, that's entirely separate from the installer doing it to start with15:49
Keybukyeah, I'm only wondering why it got added twice15:49
cjwatsonmaybe update-manager is being overenthusiastic or something15:49
Keybukcjwatson: NM apparently?15:49
KeybukI can't find it in update-manager15:50
ogralikely nm15:50
KeybukI didn't have it in /etc/hosts at all15:50
ograwith its new setting of hostnames philosophy15:50
Keybuknow it's come back twice15:50
Keybuk(and annoyingly removed my own custom entries)15:51
ograKeybuk, yep, its definately NM, booting without usplash even tells you it sets the hostname15:54
ograand it just mangled my line in /etc/hosts15:54
ograadding the hostname on front of "localhost.localdomain   localhost"15:55
ograinstead of just setting only15:55
asacogra: have you tried the latest NM?15:55
ograthe one that hasnt built yet ?15:55
asacogra: it has ;)15:55
ograi upgraded 1h ago15:56
ograah, there it is15:57
* ogra installs15:57
asacogra: be sure you restarted NM and killall nm-system-settings15:57
ograi'll reboot after changing the line in /etc/hosts15:58
ograasac, erm16:01
ograogra@osiris:~$ wc -l /etc/hosts16:01
ogra42 /etc/hosts16:01
ograit changed the line again *and* added 31 newlines to the end of the file16:02
asacogra: was it 41 before you rebooted? or 31?16:02
ograit was 11 lines16:02
asacogra: ok16:03
asacso is what debian uses as loopback address?16:03
ograand only one empty one in the middle16:03
ogra(between ipv4 and v6 settings)16:03
ograthe 31 empty ones got appemded apparently16:03
asacogra: are you 100% sure that those got appended in this reboot?16:04
ograpretty, yes, my vim had a tilde after the last line while editing16:04
asacogra: ok. so you did what? remove line from hosts?16:04
ivoksogra: you are lucky... my /etc/hosts has 310 lines; most of them empty :)16:04
ograi changed:16:05
ogra127.0.0.1   osiris  localhost.localdomain   localhost16:05
araif any one is interested in testing infrastructure, cr3 is giving now a session at #ubuntu-classroom16:05
ogra127.0.0.1   localhost.localdomain   localhost16:05
ograthen rebooted16:05
asacok let me try16:05
ograand have:   osiris  localhost.localdomain   localhost16:05
ograplus the empty lines16:05
ivoksasac ogra i can confirm this; same thing happens to me16:06
davmor2if any one is interested in testing infrastructure, cr3 is giving now a session at #ubuntu-classroom16:06
kirklandRiddell: hi, are you around?  Can I get you to promote musica to the universe archive?  It's in the queue.16:07
asacogra: is ifupdown enabled in /etc/NetworkManager/nm-system-settings.conf ?16:07
ogranever touched it16:07
asacthats fine16:07
Nghmm, is showing avahi network printers still off by default in intrepid?16:08
asaci cannot reproduce by restarting NM and nm-system-settings16:08
asaci will look in code now16:08
Riddellkirkland: let me look16:08
Ngwhere by "avahi" I probably don't mean avahi, I mean whatever broadcasting cups does16:08
asacogra: is your /etc/hostname updated through some other mean during startup?16:08
kirklandRiddell: thanks!16:08
ograi didnt manually restart them, but rebooted, probably it behaves differently in that case16:08
ograasac, not on purpose at least16:08
kirklandRiddell: slangasek asked me to ask someone else; he was swamped ;-)16:08
kirklandRiddell: and you helped me with update-motd last time16:09
sorenKeybuk: I haven't followed the discussion (kind of in the middle of something here).. Is the mountnfs thing sorted, or do I still need to look into it?16:09
Riddellsiretart: ffmpeg in queue?16:09
Keybuksoren: I've blamed dist-upgrader16:09
Keybuksoren: the shell code in mountnfs is buggy in so many ways16:10
Keybukso there's no point even trying to mitigate the problem there16:10
asacogra: yeah. only reason i could see that it behaves differently is when hostname isnt set at all at the time NM starts16:10
kirklandsoren: Keybuk: nfs mounts not happening on boot?16:10
asacogra: but i am looking at code now16:10
ograasac, well, /etc/init.d/hostname.sh sets it16:10
Keybukkirkland: yes16:10
kirklandsoren: Keybuk: i saw this just last night on my mythfrontend upgrade from hardy to intrepid16:10
asacogra: can you please paste your /etc/hosts?16:10
ograthough it doesnt change the file, but calls hostname16:10
sorenKeybuk: Ok.16:10
Keybukogra: that only writes to /proc/hostname16:10
Keybukkirkland: can you ssh to it?16:10
ograKeybuk, yeah16:10
kirklandKeybuk: yes16:11
asacmost likely calls hostname based on what currently is in /etc/hostname ?16:11
Keybukkirkland: do you have a final newline in /etc/fstab ?16:11
ograasac, http://paste.ubuntu.com/54665/16:11
Keybukasac: needlessly more complicated than that, but yes16:12
ograpastebin cuts off the empty lines16:12
siretartRiddell: yes16:12
kirklandKeybuk: i did, but I deleted it16:12
siretartRiddell: it is targeted for multiverse16:12
Keybukkirkland: you deleted it?!16:12
Keybukkirkland: the newline or fstab? :p16:12
Riddellsiretart: don't we already have an ffmpeg?16:12
siretartRiddell: 'ffmpeg-debian' should stay in main, however16:12
kirklandKeybuk: the trailing newline :-)16:12
Keybukwhy did you delete it?16:13
siretartRiddell: 'ffmpeg' contains 'replacements' libraries with the excluded encoders in, plus linking to some other stuff in multiverse16:13
Keybukanyway, that file won't work if it doesn't have a trailing newline :)16:13
kirklandKeybuk: because i have a vimrc that highlights in bright red trailing whitespace of any kind and i tend to prune things like that16:13
asacogra: ok. so the problem comes up  when you remove the "osiris" from the first line?16:13
siretartRiddell: that's basically the implementation of the plan I crafted some months ago16:13
ograasac, right, it gets re-added16:13
sorenkirkland: When you say it had a trailing newline, do you mean that you had an empty line at the end?16:15
siretartRiddell: are you currently processing it?16:15
* soren is not even sure how he'd get vim to save a file without a trailing newline..16:16
cjwatson:set binary noeol16:16
sorencjwatson: That's handy. Thank you.16:16
rom1vcjwatson: thank you very much for your help, I know it's not your piece of code, but the information you gave me allowed me to fix the problem :)16:16
cjwatsonI've never heard of vim highlighting a trailing newline though16:16
cjwatsonrom1v: no problem16:16
cjwatsonbecause, err, it isn't really trailing whitespace on a line :)16:17
rom1vbut I imagine, no chance that the fix will be included in intrepid?16:17
Keybukindeed, vim tends to vaguely mention if you *don't* have a trailing newline16:17
Keybuk[noeol] in the buffer16:18
Riddellkirkland: the licencing is incomplete.  there's no GPL included.  index.php suggests its GPL 3 and CC2.5 but debian/copyright says GPL2+ with no mention of CC2.516:18
asacso the debian way of doing things is to have the hostname mapped to ?16:18
Keybukand when you save it, puts one in anyway :p16:18
kirklandRiddell: ah, right, icons are CC2.516:18
asacand only mapping to localhost and localhost.localdomain?16:18
Keybukasac: no localhost.localdomain iirc16:18
Keybuk127.0.0.1 localhost16:18
Keybuk127.0.1.1 hostname16:18
KeybukBUT ONLY if exists16:18
kirklandRiddell: i'm not sure how that happen, i'll clean it up immediately.16:18
Keybukif does not exist, do not add it16:18
sorenKeybuk: It does indeed. Quite annoying if you've been editing binary files (%!xxd + %!xxd -r style).16:18
* ogra had localhost.localdomain in a fresh hardy install16:19
asacKeybuk: ok.16:19
Riddellkirkland: rejecting.  please [have upstream] add full licence texts to the upstream tar, and ensure debian/copyright matches16:19
asaci remember that debian systems had localhost.localdomain as well16:19
kirklandRiddell: thanks.16:19
Keybukogra: my hardy and intrepid installs don't have it - my pre-hardy does; so I assumed that it's gone16:19
KeybukI vaguely remember someone saying that it was invalid16:19
Keybukcjwatson: ?16:19
asacyeah. i remember a bug about that. but i think it was a reverse lookup order thing16:20
Riddellpitti: any sign of a new langpack upload?16:24
pittiArneGoetje: ^ we do have a newer base export and a delta tarball; can you please prepare an upload?16:24
cjwatsonKeybuk: I don't think it's changed recently16:25
cjwatsonKeybuk: what was your pre-hardy install originally?16:25
Keybukcjwatson: err, warty I think :p16:26
Keybukthat one _has_ localhost.localdomain16:26
cjwatsonKeybuk: right, I think it went away in dapper16:26
KeybukI knew it had gone away at some point ;)16:26
cjwatsonThomas Hood's change was Nov 200516:26
cjwatson(and there are dapper changes just above it in the changelog)16:26
cjwatsonasac: ubiquity/scripts/install.py line 1479+ has current rules16:28
Keybukwhy is NM doing this anyway?16:28
cjwatsonasac: or netcfg/netcfg-common.c:netcfg_write_common16:28
Keybukthis is a bit "aha! I see you changed a file! I shall go do more stuff that you were about do do anyway, so when you edit the file, you'll be slightly puzzled"16:29
cjwatson(the former is a transcription of the latter really)16:29
* ogra confirms in a freshly installed hardy vm there is only localhost, no trace of localdomain16:29
Keybukthere is no localdomain, only zul16:30
ograi think fedora uses localhost.localdomain still16:30
asacand suse as well16:30
* ogra guesses it comes from there16:30
Keybukasac: so what, exactly, is NM doing?16:31
Keybukit's watching you edit /etc/hostname (or setting /proc/hostname ?) and editing /etc/hosts to match?16:31
asacKeybuk: do you want the code?16:31
ograintrestingly my hardy /etc/hosts has: " ubuntu.local ubuntu"16:31
Keybukogra: that's wrong on so many levels16:31
Keybukogra: having .local in there may actually break things :p16:31
ograsmells like avahi addition16:31
ograKeybuk, its a fresh install16:31
Keybukoh dear :)16:32
ogramy hardy reference VM16:32
asacKeybuk: it watches /etc/hostname and changes done there are propagated to /etc/hosts ... yes.16:32
Keybukasac: "why" ?16:32
asacKeybuk: all this landed to support dynamic updated hostnames16:32
ograKeybuk, so you can change the hostname from NM16:32
asace.g. from dhcp and ppp and so on16:32
ograon the fly16:32
Keybukogra: no, if it was doing that, it wouldn't _need_ to watch /etc/hostname ;)16:33
ograwhich gets funnny if done from a running X session16:33
Keybukasac: but doesn't changing the hostname underneath running things break them?16:33
Keybuksudo springs to mind16:33
asacKeybuk: it breaks Xauth ... but thts a bug in how we start local x sessions16:34
cjwatsonogra: the only way the installer could do that is if you (or something) told it your domain was "local"16:34
Keybukhere's a better question16:34
Keybukit watches /etc/hostname ...16:34
ogracjwatson, i didnt16:34
Keybukdoes it actually look to see if you *set* that as the hostname? :p16:34
cjwatson"or something"16:34
asacKeybuk: at best join #nm ;)16:34
ograits a plain alternate install16:34
asacthats the best place to get input from the master ;)16:34
Keybukasac: I just don't see what it's fixing here16:35
Keybukwhile seeing a lot of breaking16:35
asacKeybuk: there might be glitches here and there. especially since debian does it different16:35
Keybukif you get a DHCP response with a hostname, why would you edit /etc/hostname?16:36
Keybukyou'd just set /proc/hostname directly16:36
asacKeybuk: assume hosts is properly rewritten and xauth is fixed. what other breakage is left?16:36
Keybukand since you're on an active network, there's no need to put that in /etc/hosts16:36
asacKeybuk: no16:36
Keybukwhy no?16:36
asacKeybuk: we dont edit /etc/hostname16:36
sorenWhy is it that we want the hostname to change based on dhcp, by the way?16:36
asacwhen you get dhcp response16:36
cjwatsonogra: I'm just describing the behaviour of netcfg. I'm not saying you're not seeing what you're seeing, but I don't see anything in the installer that could possibly do that so I'm suggesting that perhaps the cause is something else16:36
Keybukasac: exactly16:36
Keybukso what is NM watching again? :P16:36
Keybukyou said NM was watching for /etc/hostname changes ...16:37
Keybukbut we *don't* edit /etc/hostname16:37
asacKeybuk: NM edits /etc/hostname for instance ... or you do that in vi16:37
ogracjwatson, yeah, i didnt mean to argue with you about that :)16:37
Keybukbut why would NM edit /etc/hostname?16:37
Keybukthat's just wrong16:37
Keybuktbh, it's not entirely clear to me why you even need to change the system hostname16:38
Keybukbut I can appreciate that it would be nice in some situations16:38
asacKeybuk: so: NM applet gets a widget "hostname" where you can change your hostname16:38
Keybukat most, dynamic hostname is a change to the *current* hostname16:38
Keybuk(ie. set /proc/hostname)16:38
asacKeybuk: that gets sent to NM daemon, which propagates that request to the system integration plugin ... which then updates hostname16:38
sorenI don't even want it to do that.16:38
Keybukyou don't need to put that in /etc/hostname, since you can guarantee it's not permanent16:38
Keybukand you don't need to put that in /etc/hosts either16:38
Keybukasac: sure, that makes sense as a method16:39
Keybukbut you said it was watching the system and doing this itself automatically as well?16:39
sorenI dont' see the point, really. It messes up samba url's, .local hostnames, etc., etc.16:39
asacKeybuk: right. so. given that nothing touches /etc/hostname exept NM through that dbus method or you through "vi", i dont see that the "watching" is a issue on its own16:39
Keybukasac: but other things will touch /etc/hostname16:39
Keybuklike the sysadmin16:40
Keybukand NM should not be going and mucking around on its own16:40
asacKeybuk: what you complain about is that the hosts rewrite is buggy atm ;)16:40
Keybukhell, I can touch /etc/hostname by using bzr :)16:40
Keybukno, I'm complaining that it does it at all16:40
Keybukif *I* change /etc/hostname, *I* will change /etc/hosts16:40
KeybukI don't need NM being smart16:40
cjwatsonI agree that a sysadmin intentionally editing /etc/hostname and /etc/hosts in sequence is going to get desperately confused by something doing the latter for him16:40
Keybukespecially since it could break things in the process16:40
cjwatsonwe definitely shouldn't be applying inotify watches to files in /etc like this16:40
Keybukcjwatson: not to mention the sysadmin is likely racing NM16:40
cjwatsonit doesn't matter how correct the file rewrite is16:41
Keybukit's valid for NM to apply a change to /etc/hostname and /etc/hosts because it was *told* to by method call16:41
KeybukI cannot understand a scenario where NM would be told to do this by anything other than a "Change Hostname" button16:41
Keybukand I cannot understand any scenario where NM would apply the change automatically because of something else it saw happen16:41
asacKeybuk: so why do you touch /etc/hostname using bzr? without wanting your hostname to be like that?16:42
Keybukasac: I frequently fiddle in /etc yes16:42
Keybukand even better16:42
KeybukI often deliberately change a hostname16:42
asacKeybuk: but if you change /etc/hostname you probably want your hostname to be like that16:42
Keybukasac: and I know to edit /etc/hosts as well16:43
Keybukbecause I'm clearly clever enough to know about /etc16:43
cjwatsonasac: turn it around: what justification does network-manager have for this surprising behaviour?16:43
cjwatsonnetwork-manager is the thing that's changing here, and therefore it has the burden of proof16:43
cjwatsonit sounds like a "because it can" justification, and really, it's not useful to the sorts of people it's trying to "help"16:45
asacthe idea is to keep /etc/hostname in sync. i have no strong opinion on whether it should automatically apply the changes or not.16:45
Nafallothe hostname are set during install. stop messing with it. kthxbai.16:45
Keybukthis is also a good example of "it's best to get bogus behaviour right on the first try, otherwise people notice it" :-)16:46
ogranot true16:46
asacNafallo: this is about something else. not about messing with hostname ;)16:46
ograyu can set hostnames by dhcp :P16:46
Keybukogra: but you would never apply that to the disk16:46
Keybukthe whole point of a DHCP hostname is that it's _dynamic_16:46
ogranah, to /proc16:46
Keybukyou don't need it to hit the disk16:46
Keybukjust set /proc/hostname and carry on16:46
Keybukit doesn't even need to be /etc/hosts - because the best bit is that it's only active all the time you're on that network anyway16:46
asacKeybuk: again, dhcp hostname will not write to /etc/hostname :)16:47
stgraberbut it'll updated /etc/hosts right ?16:47
cjwatsonasac: that's what Keybuk is saying too16:48
asacyeah, wasnt 100% sure if he said "DHCP doesnt need to do that - but NM is wrong" or "NM doesnt do that right now" :)16:49
Keybukyou were justifying NM's strange behaviour as being for dynamic hostnames16:49
Keybuk<asac> Keybuk: all this landed to support dynamic updated hostnames16:49
asacKeybuk: yeah. that was the root cause why hostname support landed ;)16:49
Keybukand I was illustrating that none of this is necessary for that16:49
Keybukso all of this complex and error-prone editing of files is entirely unecessary16:50
Keybukand indeed potentially really quite dangerous16:50
Keybukconsider a sysadmin doing a "bzr update" of their /etc16:50
Keybukbzr applies a diff to /etc/hostname16:50
Keybukand then to /etc/hosts16:50
KeybukMEANWHILE NM starts dicking around with it16:50
asacKeybuk: yeah. NM approach is that you always get dynamic behaviour unless your system integration plugin says something different ;)16:50
asacKeybuk: thats why the ifupdown plugin provides a hostname (fixed hostname)16:51
Keybukall that's going to happen is pain and misery16:51
Keybukasac: ???16:51
asacKeybuk: also ifupdown provides write support so you can set your hostname through UI or dbus16:51
Keybukasac: I have no problem with that code16:51
Keybukasac: *what* is watching /etc/hostname for changes?16:51
asacKeybuk: the inotify thing was a request by upstream. i dont mind to make it a configure option16:51
asacconfigure - runtime config option16:52
Keybukif we can turn that off, I would feel much happier16:52
KeybukI don't think we want that on16:52
asacKeybuk: thats not a problem at all. and i never said that your request is unreasonable. i just wanted to understand why users dont want the hostname to be updated if /etc/hostname changes16:52
asacand if users dont want that if its really something that mainstream users dont want :/16:53
cjwatsonthe hypothetical mainstream user won't care either way - if we're doing our job right they'll never hit this case16:54
Keybukasac: I think that the kind of user who is updating /etc/hostname knows about /etc/hosts16:54
cjwatsonthe only users that care are non-mainstream16:54
asacKeybuk: only reason i currently see for keeping inotify thing on is when some third party tool updates /etc/hostname and runs sethostname on its own while NM is running, that NM internal state about hostname might gets out of sync and _might_ (not sure) cause wierd behaviour.16:54
Keybukasac: the users that don't just want a button that says "Change Hostname"16:54
Keybukasac: it can update NM's state - that's fine -- it shouldn't go and rewrite /etc/hosts though (!!)16:55
Keybukbecause the third party tool could be *also* doing that16:55
Keybukhell, if they're on XFS, they could end up with null bytes where their /etc/hosts used to be <g>16:55
asacKeybuk: ok. but then it becomes difficult. for dhcp/dynamic host updates NM probably has to update /etc/hosts16:55
Keybukasac: no it doesn't16:55
Keybukthink about it16:55
Keybukit doesn't need to *touch* /etc/hostname *or* /etc/hosts16:55
Keybukthey can stay as they were16:56
Keybukif it's a dhcp/dynamic hostname, it's only valid as long as the dhcp lease16:56
Keybukthus only ever needs to be set as the system hostname16:56
Keybukwhen the dhcp lease expires, you simply set the hostname back to whatever is in /etc/hostname16:57
Keybukand because that hostname is only valid all the time there's a network connection16:57
Keybukit _does_not_ need to be in /etc/hosts16:57
asacKeybuk: and how does the reveser lookup work when dhcp lease is active?16:57
Keybukthe hostname is only in /etc/hosts so you can lookup the hostname while there's no network connection16:57
Keybukasac: using this wonderful invention called "DNS"16:57
Keybukiirc. dynamic hostname over DHCP actually involves a DNS lookup anyway, so you know that works16:58
Keybukin fact, in most situations with dynamic hostname - the daemon doing dhcp also happens to be doing dns :)16:58
Keybuk(dnsmasq or something)16:58
Keybukyour behaviour16:59
KeybukI have a hostname "laptop"16:59
liwis /proc/hostname really /proc/hostname or /proc/sys/kernel/hostname?16:59
KeybukI boot up, my machine is called "laptop"16:59
Keybukliw: the latter, I was shortening16:59
KeybukI log onto a network16:59
KeybukI'm given the hostname guest-234117:00
Keybukthat's ok, I guess17:00
Keybukmy laptop battery runs out17:00
liw(fwiw, I fully agree with Keybuk about /etc/hosts and /etc/hostname handling: NM has no business touching them)17:00
asacKeybuk: right. all agreed. so only thing that might be confusing (though definitly a corner case) is when some external tool updates /etc/hostname, and user/admin wants to change hostname in nm-applet and doesnt see the actual hostname ;)17:00
Keybukwhen I boot again, my machine is now called guest-2341 and hardcoded as such everywhere (!!)17:00
asacbut that is neglectable i think ;)17:00
Keybukmy way:17:00
Keybukmy machine is called "laptop"17:00
asac(or fixable through some other mechanism)17:00
KeybukI log onto a network, and am given guest-234117:00
* liw also doesn't want his hostname to change, ever, and will be cross at anything that changes it, thank you very much17:00
Keybukbut this time, since neither /etc/hostname or /etc/hosts was touched - it's just changed online17:00
Keybukif I run out of power, and boot again17:01
Keybukmy machine is _still_ called "laptop"17:01
Keybukasac: like I said, it's ok if NM updates its own internal data17:01
Keybukbut arguably if it's showing the current hostname by reading /etc/hostname, it's broken anyway17:01
Keybukit should be just calling gethostname() :P17:01
asacKeybuk: well. the current way would work too ... e.g. dhcp will only update /etc/hosts, but when you bootup /etc/hostname gives you "laptop" again so /etc/hosts is rewritten to "laptop" :)17:02
asacbut i dont want to argue that17:02
asaci am not really a friend of inotify to update system configs on the fly17:02
asacits what upstream doesn and i implemented it that way. i can make that an option for sure17:02
jcristau/etc/hosts shouldn't be rewritten at all...17:02
liwasac, please do disable any editing of /etc/hosts by default, thanks :) I'll buy you a beer :)17:03
asacjcristau: i will carry that to NM maintainer. its always hard to stand in for something that isnt my idea ;)17:03
asacat best join #nm which even allows flames according to /topic :)17:03
stgraberhmm, let's just keep the good old (and well working) behavior at least for Intrepid, right ? :)17:03
liwasac, and I appreciate your being in between two difficult parties, your colleagues on the one hand and NM upstream on the other17:05
TuniX12who is responsible for artwork in ubuntu?17:11
PiciThe artwork team.17:11
KeybukTuniX12: please ask questions in #ubuntu-art17:11
TuniX12the new theme and specially wallpapers are realyy horrible and unprofessional17:12
KeybukTuniX12: so is your spelling, and your asking of the question in this channel even when you've been asked not to17:12
TuniX12keybuk: sorry english is not my native language can you speak french you i dont think so!17:14
Keybukoui ;)17:14
cody-somervilleQui ne peut pas parler ces jours au français ?17:14
Keybukmaintenant, posez votre question dans #ubuntu-art s'il vous plait17:15
Keybukkwwii: clearly, a fan17:19
ograKeybuk, hey, this is an english speaking channel :)17:19
mathiazmdz_: how long does the TB meeting last usually? 1 hour or 2 hours?17:21
ogratjaalton, i got contacted by a guy working on touchscreen support upstream at freedesktop, apparently he is trying to unify all tablet and touchscreen drivers into evdev17:21
ogratjaalton, he is willing to work closely with us in jaunty17:22
mathiazmdz_: because tomorrow's TB meeting is scheduled from 14:00 to 16:00 UTC (on the fridge) and the Server Team meeting is scheduled to start at 15:00 UTC.17:23
mathiazmdz_: So I'd like to know if the Server Team should start one hour later (16:00 UTC)17:23
slangaseksuperm1: well, from what I've been able to track down, there's a regression in bluetooth audio support in 2.6.27... alsa fails with "BT_SETCONFIGURATION failed : Input/output error(5)"17:24
cjwatsonseb128: any objection to me just reverting the problematic change in intltool (bug 275795)? there's been no response from upstream yet ...17:25
ubottuLaunchpad bug 275795 in intltool "po/Makefile creation regressed in 0.40.4" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27579517:25
superm1slangasek, so nothing to do with bluez 4.x however17:25
superm1slangasek, perhaps within the transition from hci_usb to btusb in 2.6.2717:25
slangaseksuperm1: right, it just means that I can't test it either way17:25
slangasekwithout doing kernel archaeology17:25
superm1was that 2.6.27rc8 or rc7?17:26
superm1i know btusb had some delta to rc817:26
slangasekit was 2.6.27-4-generic :-P17:26
superm1okay so that's rc717:26
seb128cjwatson: did it break any other build? did you workaround that in ubiquity? I would prefer waiting for upstream comment if there is nothing which push us to revert the change17:26
slangaseksuperm1: ok, I can try later with 2.6.27-5-generic then17:26
cjwatsonseb128: I worked around it by reverting the change on my laptop, but that's no good as soon as somebody else needs to regenerate ubiquity's autotools17:28
cjwatsonseb128: at least oem-config would suffer the same problem; I don't maintain enough other intltoolish stuff to know17:28
seb128cjwatson: I pinged upstream on IRC about the bug, what about reverting tomorrow if he doesn't reply?17:28
cjwatsonseb128: sure, that would be fine17:28
seb128ok, let's do that then17:28
seb128cjwatson: <dobey> seb128: i'll fix it and make a release today.17:29
cjwatsonseb128: hooray17:30
cjwatsonfound a new code drop of the totem BBC plugin in my spam-bin :-( so I'll be uploading that shortly once I've tested it a bit17:31
liwasac, regarding my phone: I connect USB cable, tell phone to use USB for "IP through traffic" ("IP läpivienti" in Finnish, I don't know what the phone says in English), NM notices it, starts doing dhcp on it, but never gets a response17:32
liwasac, so now I don't know what to do next :)17:32
cjwatsongar, running autoconf in totem produces a 30000+-line diff to 70_autotools.patch. (Running autoreconf is more like 70000+ lines.) What on earth were people using to autoconfiscate this?17:36
Keybukif you look at the original files, you should be able to tell17:37
cjwatsonit seems to be more reordering than actual changes17:38
KeybukI was more thinking of the great big version stamp ;)17:38
Keybukwhich would /directly/ answer your question, if perhaps not /helpfully/17:38
asacliw: ok. did you use the wizard to configure your connection?17:38
cjwatsonseb128: is there a standard tool that people use to update autotools patches in desktop packages? the intuitive (to me) autoreconf -fi; quilt refresh produces lots of diffs that indicate people weren't using quilt to do it17:38
liwasac, nope, it started doing dhcp on its own17:38
Keybukcjwatson: don't use -f ...17:38
cjwatsonKeybuk: ok, but irrelevant to my question17:39
Keybukbut </broken record that people are long since past ignoring>17:39
cjwatson-diff -Nurb totem-2.24.1/bindings/Makefile.in totem-2.24.1.new/bindings/Makefile.in17:39
cjwatson---- totem-2.24.1/bindings/Makefile.in  2008-10-01 16:00:53.000000000 +020017:39
cjwatson-+++ totem-2.24.1.new/bindings/Makefile.in      2008-10-02 00:16:29.000000000 +020017:39
cjwatson+Index: bindings/Makefile.in17:39
cjwatson+--- bindings/Makefile.in.orig17:39
seb128cjwatson: the totem autotools patch is only a configure update, usually we only run autoconf for those and aclocal too when required17:39
cjwatson++++ bindings/Makefile.in17:39
cjwatsonI'm talking about diffs like these17:39
cjwatsonseb128: what do you use to generate the patch file though? it doesn't look like quilt refresh17:39
asacliw: so you ran into the "recommends dont get installed on upgrade bug" :) ... please see if installing libmbca0 and then creating a new connection helps17:39
asac(selecting your proper provider in the wizard)17:40
cjwatson(you plural)17:40
seb128cjwatson: I tend to use cdbs-edit-patch because I dislike quilt (sometime that requires commenting the debian/rules quilt line though)17:40
seb128cjwatson: but the other debian pkg-gnome guys use quilt17:41
liwasac, it was already installed17:41
ograpitti, superm1 did any of forget you adjust my samsung Q1U patch to the new hal-info upload ? seems the samsung keyboard stuff now ended up in the toshiba area ...17:41
cjwatsonthis was done by norsetto by the looks of things17:41
liwasac, version 0.0.3~bzr42-0ubuntu217:41
asacliw: which applet version?17:41
ogra*any of you17:41
seb128cjwatson: dunno how he did it then, but using quilt should work correctly17:42
liwasac, 0.7~~svn20081005t082522-0ubuntu117:42
asacok. all restarted i assume?17:42
liwasac, rebooted and everything17:42
asacliw: anyway. please go to connection editor and create a new connection. then you should see a wizard?17:42
asac(new mobile broadband)17:42
nxvlcjwatson: you already fix this issue, right? ->https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/debian-installer/+bug/27912717:43
ubottuLaunchpad bug 279127 in debian-installer "Corrupted screen in Intrepid server installer" [Undecided,New]17:43
liwasac, what is the connection editor called in Finnish? (I don't understand nm-applet's UI...)17:43
cjwatsonseb128: it works, it's just ugly :-) I like to produce minimal debdiffs when working on other people's packages17:43
nxvli remember to see a patch somewhere but i can't find the bug17:43
liwasac, or rather, where is it in the menu?17:43
cjwatsonnxvl: I did?17:43
BenHoltzHey guys, Question...  How far our of RC1 would you guys say we are?17:43
cjwatsonBenHoltz: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/IntrepidReleaseSchedule17:43
superm1ogra, i've only touched one fdi file with my upload, you'll have to see if pitti did anything though17:43
nxvlcjwatson: i remember to see a patch when i was fixing the partman-ext3 issue, i think it was from you17:43
liwasac, right mouse button menu, third item?17:43
asacliw: right click on applet ... edito connections17:43
asacliw: there is amobile broadband tab and you can create new connections there17:44
ograsuperm1, well, was it 30-keymap-misc.fdi ?17:44
nxvlcjwatson: but i can be wrong17:44
superm1ogra, no :)17:44
BenHoltzcjwatson: I guess a better question would be is it worth my time to do the upgrade now, or are there still Major holes left17:44
cjwatsonnxvl: oh, Dustin fixed that, bug 27715317:44
ubottuLaunchpad bug 277153 in mdadm "confirmation screen contains string errors when there are md or raid partitions" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27715317:44
cjwatsonnxvl: (feel free to dup)17:44
ograsuperm1, then it was pittis fault i guess :)17:44
nxvlcjwatson: thank you!17:44
liwasac, ok, done that, now I have one for my operator, and it say "ei koskaan" ("never" in Finnish)17:44
nxvli knew i saw a patch17:45
asacliw: yeah. thats ok. (it tells you when you last used that connection)17:45
seb128cjwatson: that's a good intend but don't bother about the autoconf patches format just use whatever tool is easier for you17:45
asacliw: try to connect to it in the applet (the connection should be there)17:45
cjwatsonBenHoltz: from beta onwards we generally say that reasonably competent users can give it a go and report problems to us; there are of course still problems17:46
liwasac, the UI doesn't make it at all clear what the "never" thing is... but that's less important than getting this to work17:46
cjwatsonseb128: ok, thanks17:46
liwasac, I don't see any connection in the applet, should I disable the non-NM-managed networking first?17:46
BenHoltzcjwatson: Thank you sir! I will give it a go and let you know when I find anything that's not in the bug tracking.17:47
BenHoltzand open a new bug along with it.. ;)17:47
cjwatsonwell, don't let me know personally, I don't want to be a clearing-house for all bugs :)17:47
asacliw: hmm. maybe try that. after changing the config you can sudo killall nm-system-settings to reread it17:47
BenHoltzthanks again...17:48
asacliw: do you have ppp0 or something configured in /etc/network/interfaces?17:48
* BenHoltz disappears so productive work can go on without his pesky interruptions.17:48
liwasac, I only have lo, eth0, and br0 in /e/n/i17:48
liwasac, after the sudo killall, NM is again trying to do dhcp on eth1, which seems to be the phone17:49
asacliw: ok. try to disable it. but unless its a bad applet bug it appears that NM just doesnt see your device at all17:49
asacliw: eth1 is your phone?17:49
liwasac, eth1 appears when I attach the phone and disappears when I detach it17:50
asacliw: i doubt it ... also dhcp is not run on 3G ... thats ppp that doing the IP shuffleing17:50
asacliw: wow17:50
liwasac, disable it? disable what? how?17:50
asacliw: /etc/NetworkManager/nm-system-settings.conf ... managed=true17:50
asacliw: then killall like above17:50
liwasac, perhaps I am choosing the wrong option in the phone, when I connect the usb cable?17:51
asacliw: what options are available?17:51
liwasac, should I use "PC suite" or "data transfer" or "ip tunnel" (I think tunnel is a better translation)?17:51
asactry PC suite17:52
asacthat sounds familiar ;)17:52
liwasac, now I get... in syslog, from the kernel, things like "usb 1-2: bad CDC descriptors" and "cdc_acm 1-2:1.10: ttyACM0: USB ACM device"17:53
liwand more17:53
asacliw: ok. and NM doesnt see your phone?17:54
liwasac, correct, it does not see my phone17:54
asacliw: do you get a result by: hal-find-by-capability --capability modem17:54
liwasac, yes17:55
mathiazcjwatson: I've udpated the description of some tasks used in the server install (tomcat, samba and virtualization). Should a new version of taskel be uploaded ?17:55
asacliw: could you paste please17:55
asacliw: also the tail of syslog when plugging the phone in would be helpful17:55
ograliw, that looks like a prob with the driver rather than NMs fault17:55
liwasac, copying by hand, since the machine has no network... /org/freedesktop/Hal/devices/usb_device_421_44d_noserial_if0_0_serial_unknown_017:55
ogra"usb 1-2: bad CDC descriptors" is definately a driver message17:55
asacliw: i need the complete output ;)17:55
liwasac, just a minute, I'll put it back online17:56
liwasac, http://paste.ubuntu.com/54694/17:57
asacliw: ok. and the capability output?17:58
liwasac, what's that?17:58
asac18:54 < asac> liw: do you get a result by: hal-find-by-capability --capability modem17:58
asacliw: oh sorry ;)17:58
asaclshal -u `hal-find-by-capability --capability modem`17:59
asacliw: ^^17:59
liwasac, just a minute17:59
cjwatsonmathiaz: ok, I'll do that soon18:00
liwasac, http://paste.ubuntu.com/54696/18:01
asacliw: yeah ok. you need to adjust modem fdi18:01
asacliw: edit /usr/share/hal/fdi/information/10freedesktop/10-modem.fdi18:01
asacsearch for nokia18:01
asacand add your product_id there18:02
liwasac, do I need to restart hal or something before I try again?18:03
kirklandRiddell: hey, i've cleaned up the licensing inconsistency, new version pushed onto the queue18:03
asaci think restart is enough.18:03
ogramadwifi needs a SUSPEND_MODULES="ath_pci" andtry for pm-utils ... does anyone have an idea in which package to put that ? l-r-m or pm-utils rather ?18:04
seb128cjwatson: oh, I noticed that my totem local source was outdated that's why I said we usually run only autoconf, you need the automake update for the new plugin, I just run autoreconf (using no argument) in those cases, I noticed that you have Makefile.in changes in the bbc patch, we usually prefer to split source changes and autotools updates, it makes easier to do update (the source changes usually apply easily and we can regenerate the autot18:04
seb128ools changes)18:04
asacliw: ^^ you should be able to see the result in the lshal above: GSM should be in the command_sets (in addition to V.250 which you already had)18:04
mathiazcjwatson: great - thanks !18:04
superm1ogra, that sounds like a regression wrg to needing to remove the module prior to suspend.  i thought it was suspend safe in the past?18:05
Riddellkirkland: accepted18:05
ograsuperm1, no idea i didnt use it before18:05
kirklandRiddell: outstanding, thanks so much18:05
ograsuperm1, the prob is that ath5k gets loaded even if its blacklisted ... so on resume ath5k replaces ath_pci18:06
ograwhich results in non working wlan on devices that dont work with ath5k18:06
superm1ogra, oh that's quite an interesting problem with ath5k loading18:06
liwasac, whee! now it works18:07
superm1ogra, did you bug the kernel guys about that yet?18:07
ograsuperm1, yeah, especially that it doesnt respect blacklisting18:07
liwasac, should I file a bug with a patch? network-manager?18:07
ogranot yet, it was low on my todo18:07
liwasac, or rather: hal-info ?18:07
* ogra takes that over to -kernel18:08
asacliw: yeah please against hal-info18:08
asacliw: pitti will apply that upstrem and in our package18:08
asacliw: thanks for testing ;)18:08
asacliw: ip tunnel is definilty iteresting though :)18:08
liwasac, I assume it is related to wifi on the phone18:08
asacliw: if you understand what that does  let me know ,)18:08
liwnow that I think abou tit18:08
asacliw: yeah. if you get it working that would be cool :) ... if its just dhcp that doesnt work you could also create a connection with static IP18:09
asacliw: you know where the connection editor is ;) in case you want to play a bit with it18:09
liwasac, the phone has no wifi to connect to...18:09
asacliw: oh ok :)18:10
* asac has to run bbl18:10
liwasac, the phone has some kind of "connection editor" inside it, too... which is a) way confusing and b) crashes18:10
james_wliw: hey, is your system-cleaner update bugfix-only?18:12
liwjames_w, yes18:13
liwjames_w, in my opinion, anyway18:13
james_whmm, I spy displaying the version number at startup, sounds like a feature to me :-)18:13
liwjames_w, that's a bug fix, it prevents people from claiming they have updated to a new version when they haven't :)18:14
james_wliw: looks like it to me. Size of diff isn't so important, just makes review harder. I'm looking at it now.18:14
james_wliw: that argument works for me :-)18:14
liwasac, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hal-info/+bug/27918218:17
ubottuLaunchpad bug 279182 in hal-info "Nokia E61 info for hal-info" [Undecided,New]18:17
jcastrokees: Is this the only bug for tracking getting webcams to work? https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/260918/18:23
ubottuLaunchpad bug 260918 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] libv4l" [Wishlist,Confirmed]18:23
=== Lutin_ is now known as Lutin
jcastrokees: wrt. your post to -devel a month ago18:24
Ngdoes firefox have any gvfs support?18:25
keesjcastro: afaik, yes.  pgraner was looking into it as well18:25
=== thegodfather is now known as fabbione
jcastrokees: ok, I was just checking the calendar. :D18:27
keesjcastro: yeah, it's making me nervous18:28
jcastroespecially since stemp had it in his ppa for about a month18:28
jcastromaybe at UDS we need to discuss PPA->distro workflow smoothage or something18:28
cjwatsonseb128: OK, I'll try to unpick those18:29
kirklandtkamppeter: ping18:33
kirklandtkamppeter: got your message in the bug, i can pull the data you want, right quick, if you're around18:33
kirklandKeybuk: okay, sorry distracted...  I added a trailing carriage return to my /etc/fstab, nfs mounts still not happening automatically on boot18:35
kirklandKeybuk: was that supposed to 'solve' the problem?18:35
lukehasnonameIn Intrepid 64 bit, how can I rid myself of the error caused by bug #27383318:36
ubottuLaunchpad bug 273833 in v86d "v86d missing from initramfs" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27383318:36
lukehasnonameFirst, can I get around it and boot, and second, how can I fix it? Booting up to a terribly loud system error beep at 4am does not make the roommate happy.18:37
Keybukkirkland: it solved my bug18:39
Keybukyou obviously may have a different bug :-)18:39
kirklandKeybuk: looks so18:39
kirklandKeybuk: i'll dig, this one is bothering me ;-)18:40
tkamppeterkirkland, yes, I am here.18:40
KeybukI debugged by added18:40
Keybukexec 2>/var/run/nfsmount.$IFACE18:40
Keybukset -x18:40
Keybukto the top of the script in /etc/network/if-up.d18:40
cjwatsonlukehasnoname: as far as I know, the bug as described is mainly cosmetic. If you're getting an error beep, have you considered the possibility that you in fact have a different bug (even if the output above is the last thing you see on the console)?18:40
cjwatsonlukehasnoname: pretty much everyone running intrepid experiences bug 273833, and most of us can boot18:41
ubottuLaunchpad bug 273833 in v86d "v86d missing from initramfs" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27383318:41
kirklandtkamppeter: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/54711/18:41
lukehasnonameSomething simple that I didn't try: Can I just hit "Enter" and move past the error?18:42
lukehasnonameand point taken about the "different bug"18:42
cjwatsonlukehasnoname: since you're probably encountering something different and as yet undetermined, it's hard to say ...18:42
cjwatsonone easy way to find out ;-)18:42
lukehasnonameWell, I'm already installing hardy because I got pissed18:42
lukehasnonamebut I might try again with the beta, depending on my mood when I get home18:43
cjwatsonwell, intrepid is for people eager to find out the reasons behind problems ;-)18:43
tkamppeterkirkland, foomatic-rip generates temporary files with names foomatic-sdfhjsfg, but why are they created in /dev/shm? What is /dev/shm good for?18:43
slytherinhi all, is there any workaround for bug #276349? I am not able to use the alternate CD image for daily upgrade.18:44
ubottuLaunchpad bug 276349 in apt "intrepid alternate CD make apt print out a warning" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/27634918:44
cjwatsonslytherin: I don't think so at present18:45
lukehasnonamecjwatson: I'm aware. I'll consider what's been said, though assuming my hardy install isn't broken, I'll probably stick with that at least until the 30th.18:45
siretart\o/ ffmpeg accepted! thanks for that!18:45
cjwatsonlukehasnoname: the risk is that it may be a problem nobody else is encountering, and so won't get fixed :-(18:45
lukehasnonamedamnit, don't guilt me into testing....18:46
kirklandtkamppeter: /dev/shm is a tmpfs filesystem in memory18:46
kirklandtkamppeter: high speed, not written to disk18:46
kirklandtkamppeter: i symlink my /tmp to /dev/shm18:46
kirklandtkamppeter: shm = shared memory18:46
lukehasnonameI'll be back on later, class is over.18:47
kirklandtkamppeter: perms on /dev/shm are drwxrwxrwt18:48
tkamppeterkirkland, then you manual deviation of the standatd config causes the bug, probably all programs which use an added security architecture, like AppArmor or SELinux would break on your system, as long as you do not manually correct all the config files for these architectures.18:48
kirklandtkamppeter: i should be able to add the appropriate label or something /dev/shm, no?18:49
tkamppeterkirkland, but CUPS is AppArmor-protected, it can only write to locations which AppArmor allows via the /etc/apparmor.d/usr.sbin.cupsd file.18:49
mdz_mathiaz: it lasts anywhere from 30 minutes to 2 hours depending on the agenda18:50
tkamppeterYou must edit this file to get your printing working again.18:50
mdz_mathiaz: if you are only available for the first part of the scheduled time, then just let us know and we should be able to accomodate you by ordering the agenda accordingly18:50
tkamppeterkitkland and Intrepid has a lot of files in /etc/apparmor.d, you probably also need to edit the files of other programs, too.18:50
jdstrandkirkland: fyi, symlinks are 'normalized' to the actual path in apparmor (by design)18:51
kirklandjdstrand: should /dev/shm be added to some swath of profiles?18:52
mathiazmdz_: well - I'm not planning to attend the TB meeting. I'm interested to know if the Server meeting shoudl be moved one hour later.18:52
kirklandjdstrand: i didn't think my linking /tmp -> /dev/shm was all that unusual18:52
jdstrandkirkland: I only caught the tail end of this...18:52
kirklandjdstrand: cups/printing stopped working for me last week18:52
tkamppeterkirkland, the new foomatic-rip solves the problem by checking several temporary file locations, including /var/spool/cups/tmp, so installing the new foomatic-rip should also solve the problem.18:52
kirklandjdstrand: with tkamppeter's help, i think we've narrow the problem to the fact that my /tmp is a symlink to /dev/shm18:53
kirklandtkamppeter: cool, thanks.18:53
kirklandjdstrand: i'm just wondering if we might see any other problems creep up18:53
jdstrandkirkland: it may not be unusual, but it is non-standard, and off-hand, I am uncomfortable giving that access by default18:54
jdstrandkirkland: but you should see all the errors in /var/log/kern.log if it is indeed part of the problem18:54
mdz_mathiaz: the average meeting is <=1 hour, so there will only be a conflict for especially long-running meetings18:54
mdz_mathiaz: i.e. I don't think it's necessary to move it18:54
kirklandjdstrand: okay, i'll beware18:55
mdz_mathiaz: it has always been at this time. so if you haven't noticed a problem, that's not expected to change18:55
mathiazmdz_: ok.18:55
* ogra curses once more about quilt18:56
radixwhen upgrading using update-manager or do-release-upgrade, does it upgrade including -updates from the new distribution?18:59
geserHi, is a core-dev around who has some time to sponsor bug #264554?19:01
ubottuLaunchpad bug 264554 in xen-3.3 "libxen3 and libxen3-dev both include /usr/lib/libblktap.so" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/26455419:01
zulgeser: ill do it right now19:01
geserzul: thanks19:01
slytherinradix: -updates have packages only after the new release is made. It is of no use for development release.19:10
ograradix, while slytherin is right, ${next release}-updates lines are by default in sources.list after a dist upgrade (even in development releases)19:11
radixogra: thank you19:12
slytherincjwatson: am I correct to assume that it is you who implemented 'last good boot' feature?19:26
ograslytherin, that was BenC iirc19:26
cjwatsonslytherin: no; what led you to that conclusion?19:27
slytherincjwatson: I was confused probably.19:27
cjwatson(ogra is correct)19:29
slytherinogra: cjwatson: any idea what all changes did it involve? I am using grub2 currently and the entries are not added to menu.19:31
ograslytherin, there were docs about it on the wiki and there was a blueprint for it19:32
ogra(dont ask for URLs though)19:32
* slytherin searches19:32
* cody-somerville hides.19:35
tjaaltonogra: søren hauberg? cool, wonder if it would replace wacom_drv though, but likely evtouch at least19:47
ogratjaalton, yeah, soren19:47
ograwell, he wasnt aware that there are six drivers we'll go over them in jaunty19:48
ograevtouch is only one19:49
slytherinogra: not able to find anything related to last-good-boot in wiki or blueprints. Didn't even find any link on BenC's blog. :-(20:08
slytherinogra: thanks, I will see if I can modify grub2 to include the feature.20:18
ograbest tal to BenC20:18
kirklandtkamppeter: thanks, fix verified, printer works with foomatic-rip updates!20:19
slytherinis any archive admin around? I am waiting for some java libs to be moved to universe to work on their rdepends/reverse-build-depends.20:20
ahasenackjibel: nice call on #278518, that was bugging me a while. We have others which I can now trace to the root cause21:18
ahasenackjibel: thanks21:18
jibelahasenack: you're welcome21:21
Laneyasac: Is this FF bug reported? Seeing this when downloading things: http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/ff21:29
asacLaney: locale?21:34
Laneyasac: en-gb21:34
Laneyasac: Hmm, getting it on the about dialog too21:35
james_wLaney: have you updated today?21:43
Laneyjames_w: Yep21:43
LaneyI didn't restart though.21:43
james_wI'm seeing that too, and it often happens when firefox updates and you don't restart21:44
LaneyStrange, I've never had it before21:44
LaneyOh, restarting did fix it ;)21:45
Laneyasac: Never mind.21:45
Laneythanks james_w21:45
james_wwhich-pkg-broke isn't hinting at anything mozilla related updating for me today though21:45
james_wand there wasn't a firefox restart notification, but there was a system one.21:45
LaneyNo there wasn't a firefox one, hence why I didn't restart it21:46
sebnerjames_w: new kernel update ;)21:47
LaneyGrr, this PA bug is irritating21:47
asacLaney: from which version did you upgrade and are you using ubufox?21:59
Laneyasac: FF didn't update today, and yes I am22:00
asacLaney: ok. could you look in /var/log/apt/term.log to see if you got language pack updates today?22:05
asacor maybe extension packages22:05
james_wasac: I got language-packs, and totem-mozilla22:11
asacjames_w: so you had the same issue?22:12
james_wasac: yeah, it sounds like it22:12
james_we.g. view source gives XML parsing error: undefined entity22:13
Laneyasac: I got language-pack-en updates if that's what you're after22:13
Laneycan't see anything else22:13
LaneyOh no, ignore that last one, that was later22:14
TheMusosbeattie: I am well aware of that bug. It doesn't always occur, and there are other symptoms and behaviors, as it is a race condition. I will be looking at it today.22:22
RAOFTheMuso: Have you heard anyone else complain that the alsa->pulseaudio routing breaks skype on x86-64?22:29
BenHoltzhey guys, are there known issues with compiz?22:35
cjwatsonerr, yes - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bugs22:35
* BenHoltz asked a dumb question..22:35
cjwatsonI suspect you wanted to ask a more specific question22:36
* ScottK suspects wanting a more specific answer.22:36
desrt+1 colin's jerkpoints :)22:36
BenHoltzI'll go ask in #ubuntu+122:36
* BenHoltz just read topic and is leaving disgracefully...22:37
=== mthaddon changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Intrepid beta released | archive: Feature Freeze | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not application development on Ubuntu) | #ubuntu for support and generaldiscussion for dapper/feisty/gutsy/hardy, #ubuntu+1 for intrepid | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs | bazaar.launchpad.net down from 22:00 UTC
=== mthaddon changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: bazaar.launchpad.net down from 22:00 UTC for up to 4 hours | Intrepid beta released | archive: Feature Freeze | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not application development on Ubuntu) | #ubuntu for support and generaldiscussion for dapper/feisty/gutsy/hardy, #ubuntu+1 for intrepid | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.co
wgrantWhich fruit is replacing vostok?22:41
cjwatsondesrt: I wasn't actually trying to be a jerk, I figured I might as well give him a useful link as well as gently suggesting that he might want to be more specific :)22:41
spmwgrant: crowberry22:43
=== Laney changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: bazaar.launchpad.net down from 22:00 UTC for up to 4 hours | Intrepid beta released | archive: Feature Freeze | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not application development on Ubuntu) | #ubuntu for support and generaldiscussion for dapper/feisty/gutsy/hardy, #ubuntu+1 for intrepid | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com
wgrantspm: Aha.22:43
LaneyWhat should that link be?22:43
james_wLaney: HelpingWithBugs I believe22:46
LaneyWorks for me22:47
=== Laney changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: bazaar.launchpad.net down from 22:00 UTC for up to 4 hours | Intrepid beta released | archive: Feature Freeze | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not application development on Ubuntu) | #ubuntu for support and generaldiscussion for dapper/feisty/gutsy/hardy, #ubuntu+1 for intrepid | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs
=== cjwatson changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: bazaar.launchpad.net down from 22:00 UTC for up to 4 hours | 8.10 beta released | archive: Feature Freeze | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development on Ubuntu) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper/feisty/gutsy/hardy, #ubuntu+1 for intrepid | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs
cjwatsonjust saving a few characters ...22:53
=== cjwatson changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: bazaar.launchpad.net down from 22:00 UTC for up to 4 hours | 8.10 beta released | archive: Feature Freeze | Development of Ubuntu (not support, not app development on Ubuntu) | #ubuntu for support and general discussion for dapper-hardy, #ubuntu+1 for intrepid | #ubuntu-motu for getting involved in development | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment | See #ubuntu-bugs for http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs
wgrantPoor Edgy. Always forgotten.22:53
ajmitchis it EOL?22:54
cjwatsonmight have something to do with it being EOL, yes :)22:54
cjwatsondon't think the fine distinction is worth precious topic space, though22:54
wgrantI assumed so.22:54
ajmitchnext you'll be complaining that we don't answer questions about warty in here22:55
RAOFwgrant: Any luck with Mouse->Touchpad tab?22:55
wgrantI saw somebody complaining about Hoary's repos vanishing when they finally purged the archive of the old distroseries last year.22:55
wgrantRAOF: tjaalton is working on a new backport of XI property stuff to our xserver, which will hopefully help to fix it.22:56
dx9s_workanybody here working on bug 19102723:00
ubottuLaunchpad bug 191027 in totem ""Failed to connect stream: Invalid argument"" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/19102723:00
* wgrant fixed that locally by changing to PulseAudio in gstreamer-properties.23:02
dx9s_workit's weird.. seen several "work-arounds" ... mine was the most recent...  'asoundconf set-pulseaudio' .. and that solved it for me .. no changing anything else . no alsa updates (outside what is available on the dev branch for intrepid) ...23:04
dx9s_workwas curious as to pulseaudio and when it is starts during an xsession... the first work around was to stop and restart the user-space pulseaudio server... the 'asoundconf set-pulseaudio' doesn't require restarting the first pulseaudio server (however it starts during logging into machine via gdm/ start of X session)23:06
=== cjwatson_ is now known as cjwatson
dx9s_workalso, another thing to note. reguardless if 'asoundconf set-pulseaudio' or removing the .asoundrc* from homedir ... when openning 'alsamixer' it shows the pulseaudio "master" volume... so in either case, alsa somehow defaults to forwarding non-specific sound hardware to the pulseaudio server... an 'alsamixer -c 0' will bring up the REAL hardware mixer ...  where as 'alsamixer' will default to pulseaudio .. (with OR without the 'asoundconf set-pu23:09
dx9s_workwgrant, does any of this make sense?23:10
asacLaney: ok thx23:10
TheMusogrrr latest updates have broken my MacBook Pro backlight control. I saw a hal update, will have to dig further.23:20
bryce_TheMuso: the hal change that just now went in was for dell studio systems only23:24
=== Ng_ is now known as Ng
TheMusobryce_: the last hal change I have is the latest merge from Debian.23:27
bryce_TheMuso: ah okay nevermind, then that is suspicious23:27
bryce_TheMuso: and actually the hal change I sponsored was to hal-info, not hal.23:27
TheMusobryce_: Right, I am referring to pitti's upload.23:28
TheMusoI'll dig deeper.23:28

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