[04:00] <stgraber> @schedule America/Montreal
[05:23] <superm1> @schedule America/Chicago
[11:59] <TheMuso> Hey amachu.
[11:59] <amachu> TheMuso: Hi..
[12:00] <amachu> persia: elkbuntu: lifeless: Hi
[12:00] <persia> Good evening.
[12:00] <amachu> persia: Good evening
[12:00] <Arc> morning
[12:00] <amachu> elkbuntu: are you there?
[12:01] <elkbuntu> hello
[12:01] <amachu> great, and lifeless?
[12:01] <amachu> Arc: Hi
[12:02] <Arc> hey amachu
[12:02] <elkbuntu> daylight savings has kicked in. it's now 10pm for lifeless, TheMuso and I.
[12:02] <TheMuso> Thats still managable for me.
[12:02] <amachu> amireldor and svaksha appear not to be here
[12:03] <elkbuntu> well yes, i'm the only one of the three that has to commute :Þ
[12:03] <amachu> elkbuntu: ok
[12:03] <persia> Do we want to try to change the time for daylight savings?  It's still only 16:30 for India.
[12:04] <amachu> persia: We will first take up candidates, and later come to discuss on that
[12:04] <amachu> persia: elkbuntu: TheMuso and myself
[12:04] <amachu> We have quorum
[12:04] <persia> OK.
[12:04] <amachu> Arc: Hi..
[12:04] <elkbuntu> i dare say we wont be able to negotiate the time :(
[12:05] <elkbuntu> this is the time stretch i was worried about
[12:05] <Arc> so what's the order?
[12:05] <amachu> Please go ahead presenting yourself and your contributions to Ubuntu
[12:06] <amachu> order?
[12:06] <Arc> oh order that we're going
[12:06] <amachu> Please go ahead
[12:06] <Arc> well I've been involved in promoting Ubuntu for a few years now through various programs
[12:07] <Arc> a few months ago I got involved in organizing our LoCo along with Nikkiana (who's now our team leader)
[12:08] <Arc> big recent contributions is organizing Software Freedom Day in front of our state capitol (the "Live Free or Die" state, an easy sell)
[12:08] <Arc> and very recently, last night presenting an Ibex preview at our local LUG as part of the loco
[12:09] <Arc> I also do both commercial and free community support on my own, as I have for years, helping people install or "fix" their home ubuntu machines
[12:10] <Arc> I've personally installed Ubuntu for over 50 people in the last year
[12:12] <elkbuntu> everyone still on the one server?
[12:13] <elkbuntu> s/still/not/
[12:13] <TheMuso> yep
[12:13] <elkbuntu> blah. 10pm brain just set in
[12:13] <persia> heh
[12:13] <Arc> I'm currently working with other LoCo members at putting together a NH themed Ibex remix CD and figuring out how to fund a CD rep run
[12:13] <amachu> yes
[12:14] <nikkiana> Arc was also really instrumental in being a force to keep the newly forming NH LoCo from falling apart before it got started.
[12:14] <persia> Arc, It seems like most of your work has been with your LoCos.  Were you able to convince any other members of the NH LoCo to get up so early?
[12:14] <elkbuntu> nikkiana, in what way?
[12:14] <Arc> persia: yea nikkiana :-)
[12:16] <Arc> in addition to nikkiana our team advisor, Liz aka pleia, wrote a testimonial on my wiki page; https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArcRiley
[12:16] <Arc> she also serves on the Americas membership council, so was in a bit of conflict of interest when I applied through that council
[12:17] <elkbuntu> nikkiana?
[12:17] <nikkiana> elkbuntu, when we were experiencing problems with the then leader who had a different idea of what the group should be than the rest of us, many of us (myself included) were ready to just give up and quit  and start a different project.
[12:18] <nikkiana> Arc was the one in the group who encouraged us to work through our conflict with our former leader.
[12:19] <Arc> our former team leader was removed by the LoCo council after a lengthy process in which neither we or they could find a more amicable resolution with him
[12:21] <elkbuntu> nikkiana, so like a cheerleader? or mediator?
[12:23] <amachu> Arc: you launchpad profile shows you to be part of Ubuntu Women Team.. What role you play there?
[12:24] <Arc> amachu: mostly I like to keep track of the mailing list threads, there's a lot of thought-provoking stuff on there
[12:24] <Arc> I self-identify as a feminist and having gender balance in activities is important
[12:26] <nikkiana> elkbuntu, sort of a bit of both. he played a mediator role in helping our group focus our frustration into an effort to make the group survive rather than to just go our seperate ways. when the rest of us were questioning whether it was worth it, Arc was there encouraging us not to give up.
[12:27] <nikkiana> He also took a lead role when we were dealing with the LoCo Council regarding the situation surrounding the removal of our former leader.
[12:27] <Arc> there really wasn't a lot of "mediation" going on, since our former leader wouldn't talk to us beyond declairing his position
[12:28] <Arc> that's what the LoCo council found as well, and why he was removed.  aritocratic behavior isn't acceptible, especially for leaders
[12:28] <amachu> Arc: How about women in New Hampshire Team?
[12:29] <Arc> I know about overall membership, but we had almost an equal number of women to men volunteering at SFD'08 two weeks ago
[12:31] <amachu> I hope we can take voting now..
[12:31] <Arc> we were tabling in public and outreaching to people walking by, having a nearly equal number of women at the tables represented Ubuntu as not just a "geeky male thing"
[12:33] <amachu> and one more question from me, other that pySoy are there any other list of packages in your mind cureently which you like to package
[12:34] <Arc> I need to get more involved with MOTU, but I'm generally interested in getting more Python stuff packaged.  Newer Sphinx and Genshi come to mind
[12:34] <Arc> PySoy itself is a game engine though, I think we'll have a good deal of work in packaging PySoy-based games in the future
[12:35] <amachu> Genshi, is that related to trac?
[12:35] <Arc> it's the templating system for Trac, my current task in the Sphinx project is adding Genshi template support
[12:36] <Arc> it's an XML-based templating system that's much more robust than Jinja (Sphinx's default)
[12:36] <amachu> Arc: Ok
[12:36] <Arc> I'm sure as I get more involved with MOTU I'll find more things that need to be packaged :-)
[12:38] <amachu> Arc: It appear you are involved with Hampshire team for the last five months
[12:39] <Arc> yea, I got involved just before the team's 2nd meeting
[12:40] <elkbuntu> 2nd under the prior mentioned overlord?
[12:40] <Arc> *nod*
[12:40] <Arc> he actually recruited me, after meeting me at our local PySIG (Python Special Interest Group)
[12:41] <amachu> and the testimonials, presence of nikkiana, promising work on pySoy convince me to give +1 for you
[12:41] <amachu> persia: TheMuso: elkbuntu: ??
[12:41] <Arc> we talked about the Ubuntu promotion I did in Ithaca, and he thought I was ideal for the LoCo
[12:42] <elkbuntu> +1
[12:42] <TheMuso> +1 from me. I think Arc has been doing some great work, particularly helping to get a group back on its feet.
[12:42] <persia> +1 from me.  looks like good work in both Ithaca and NH, along with support of the LoCo team leader.
[12:44] <amachu> Great! Welcome Arc and best wishes for your future work
[12:44] <Arc> thank you guys :-)
[12:44] <elkbuntu> svaksha is sorta-kinda-maybe around, but just got split off
[12:44] <amachu> stefanlsd: appear not to be here
[12:45] <elkbuntu> lets wait for the netsplat before we finish up
[12:46] <amachu> elkbuntu: We need discuss on the time period that can be considered apt for considering contributions..
[12:46] <amachu> We were in the middle of the discussion on whether 2-3 months is enough or more time is needed
[12:47] <elkbuntu> i thought this was something that was going to be discussed across all the councils, not just ours
[12:47] <amachu> persia: and on the time factor?
[12:47] <amachu> elkbuntu: ok fine.
[12:47] <persia> elkbuntu, It will need to be so before changing the wiki.  I'm happy to discuss it ourselves first : if we don't have consensus, it's not worth pushing for the change.
[12:48] <persia> Personally, I'd be happier to change the wiki, as I'm not sure appropriate guidance is being given to candidates.
[12:48] <elkbuntu> i think the time thing probably is more important
[12:48] <persia> RIght.  Time first.
[12:48] <elkbuntu> while i dont mind the fact that we're dealing with alot of .eu
[12:48] <persia> I'm very flexible, so count me available.
[12:48] <elkbuntu> i suspect this is at the cost of the area we're supposed to be helping
[12:48] <amachu> elkbuntu: I agree
[12:49] <elkbuntu> are the indian region people finding a suitible board at all?
[12:49] <elkbuntu> amachu, you'd be the most up on this
[12:49] <amachu> how about the timings of others?
[12:49] <amachu> let me check..
[12:50] <TheMuso> As I said earlier, this time suits me, although an hour later would not.
[12:50] <elkbuntu> amachu, have any of your people recently used another board due to better compatibility?
[12:50] <elkbuntu> TheMuso, yes, this is right on the edge of what i can handle
[12:50] <elkbuntu> any later and it infringes on A Good Night Sleep
[12:51] <amachu> TheMuso: How about days?
[12:51] <TheMuso> amachu: Days are fine, but it makes it harder if it is during work time.
[12:51] <TheMuso> amachu: As sometimes I can get on a role and completely forget meeting times. :)
[12:52] <amachu> elkbuntu: thats a vast geography to cover, one was comfortable with our time and another expressedsome uneasyness
[12:52] <elkbuntu> amachu, it's a stupidly vast geography to cover
[12:52] <persia> Also, the wiki guidance says that each board will have a meeting in local "evening".  Moving to days gets us better support for the Americas, but not so much for some of our core region, if people cannot IRC at work.
[12:53] <persia> (and yes "evening" doesn't make sense with this many timezones)
[12:54] <elkbuntu> i think we need to expand the board and do alternating times
[12:54] <amachu> TheMuso: all Days are fine ? Mon - Sun
[12:54] <elkbuntu> amachu, that's still compromising a section of the world to 'sorry, you do not count'
[12:54] <TheMuso> amachu: Ok, mduring the week is preferable, so I can do all evenings except Monday evenings, and the weekend.
[12:54] <persia> elkbuntu, Essentially separate Asia and Oceania ?
[12:55] <elkbuntu> persia, kind of.
[12:55] <persia> elkbuntu, What sort of times were you thinking?  Maybe 8:00 UTC and 14:00 UTC?
[12:56]  * elkbuntu calculates
[12:56] <elkbuntu> too late for the magic brain clock :(
[12:56] <amachu> what time does EMEA or Americas have their meeting at?
[12:57] <amachu> 19.00 UTC for EMEA it appears
[12:57] <persia> elkbuntu, That's 19:00 AEDT and 19:30 IST
[12:58] <elkbuntu> 7pm is a tad early, based on running meetings in Aus, 8pm is more likely to work
[12:58] <elkbuntu> 7pm is Dinner Time for a huge proportion of peeps
[12:59] <persia> Yeah, that's why I figure it's a time that most candidates could make themselves available.  Bad for us, but good for them.
[12:59] <persia> 9:00 and 15:00 actually works better for me anyway.
[13:00] <persia> (that's 8:00 AEDT + 8:30 IST)
[13:00] <amachu> persia: 15:00 UTC?
[13:00] <persia> amachu, Yes.
[13:00] <amachu> that should also be fine
[13:00] <elkbuntu> now, what we need to do is to propose to the CC that we bring probably 2 more people on board. who are more compatible with amachu than with the 3 sydney folk
[13:01] <persia> Right, and those of us in UTC+8 can sit on both.
[13:01] <amachu> 9:00 would end up in a similar situation as of now
[13:01] <persia> amachu, Would you compose that proposal, or would you like a hand?
[13:01] <amachu> hey, belutz and zakame appear not to be present
[13:02] <elkbuntu> does 2 extra sound fair?
[13:02] <persia> 2 extra is enough iff we can get back the two members who haven't been in attendance for a while.  Otherwise we might want three or four.
[13:03] <persia> I still think we need 4 in attendance at each meeting, and I only expect one or two people to be able to attend both, given the times.
[13:03] <persia> (unless I misremember people's timezones)
[13:03] <amachu> persia: that mean two extra in board with same time?
[13:04] <elkbuntu> eeeek, lag time
[13:04] <persia> amachu, Two from the west.  Restore the centre.
[13:04] <persia> The east has good coverage.
[13:05] <elkbuntu> persia, sadly, you will probably be the most used :-/
[13:05] <amachu> elkbuntu: :-)
[13:05] <elkbuntu> which is probably not good either
[13:06] <elkbuntu> amachu, what times are zakame and belutz from?
[13:06] <persia> elkbuntu, That's only because I'm in the middle.  Ideally, I'd like to see 3 from the west, 3 from the east, and 3 from the centre.
[13:07] <amachu> belutz is close
[13:07] <elkbuntu> i now have to be completely embarrassed that i dont know where zakame and belutz are from...
[13:07] <TheMuso> Sorry folks, but I gotta run. I agree with probably having more people on board to cover more times since it seems we are not covering everyone atm.
[13:07] <amachu> belutz from Indonesia
[13:07] <persia> zakame is UTC+8, Belutz hid the timezone display
[13:08] <elkbuntu> amachu, so they're both technically center?
[13:08] <persia> Belutz is likely in UTC+8 or UTC+9
[13:09] <persia> elkbuntu, Yes, and should be as useful as I.
[13:09] <elkbuntu> persia, maybe we need to review if they're still able to participate?
[13:10] <amachu> persia: yes
[13:10] <elkbuntu> if not, now is probably the best time to shuffle
[13:10] <persia> elkbuntu, Indeed.  It's been a while since either attended.  If not, I'd like to see +8/+9 more widely represented (even from Perth, if required)
[13:10] <amachu> persia: yes. We need to ask them
[13:11] <elkbuntu> persia, yeah, perth people dont actually show up much. the only perthian in the loco is busy being high on e17 ;)
[13:11] <elkbuntu> well, the only active perthian
[13:12] <persia> elkbuntu, Yeah, well, my point is that it's not about Australians not being up late enough, just about timezones :)
[13:12] <elkbuntu> persia, yeah, i know
[13:12] <amachu> persia: are we for change of current time?
[13:12] <elkbuntu> however, as it's approaching '7 hrs until i need to wake' time, can i please suggest we continue this on the mailing list with the CC cc'd?
[13:13] <elkbuntu> amachu, i think this all needs doing in one fell swoop. we wont have quorum at your end until we have new vict... err... board members.
[13:13] <persia> amachu, I'm all for it. Please send the requisite request for expansion and multiple meetings to the CC.
[13:14]  * persia will have more meetings, but is usually in #ubuntu-meeting anyway
[13:14] <elkbuntu> persia, face it, you dont even sleep. you're a robot.
[13:14] <amachu> persia: fine. I will do it after hearing from belutz and zakame
[13:15] <amachu> good. it that all for now?
[13:16] <elkbuntu> speaking of timezones, is it just me or does that google mappy thingie in launchpad have odd ideas about where places are?
[13:16] <persia> elkbuntu, Please fund greater advances in battery technology.  Charge times could be improved.
[13:16] <elkbuntu> persia, hehehe
[13:16] <persia> elkbuntu, It's settable by anyone, and adjustable by anyway, and cannot be reset.  Bugs have been filed.
[13:16] <amachu> ;-)
[13:17] <elkbuntu> persia, delightful. i was wondering when you moved to In The Middle Of The Ocean.
[13:19] <persia> It was right after I was incorrectly placed by someone else, although I've been told I've since been moved from where I placed myself.
[13:19] <amachu> persia (Robo): elkbuntu: I will take it to our mailing list frist and then to Cc...
[13:19] <persia> The resolution here is sufficient that I'd need to either identify the specific section of my house, or lie.  I don't like either, so I choose to lie in a way that is incredibly obvious to all.
[13:19] <elkbuntu> instead of RoboCop, RoboGeek.
[13:20] <persia> (and am waiting for the resolution of the bugs)
[13:20] <persia> amachu, Sounds good to me.
[13:22] <amachu> fine then. Good bye
[13:22] <elkbuntu> amachu, sounds good. i suspect we schedule as per this week for the next meeting though.
[13:22] <amachu> Our next meeting will be on 21 Oct 08, 11.00 AM UTC
[13:22] <persia> Yeah.  No schedule changes until CC approves.  Also, I'd like to only have one meeting a week, alternating between the times.
[13:23] <amachu> persia: not on the second week :-)
[13:24] <amachu> persia: elkbuntu: thanks for participating.
[13:24] <persia> amachu, Well, if we change the time, the conflict goes away.  On Tuesdays, this room is booked for 11:00, 14:00, and 23:00 each biweekly.
[13:24] <elkbuntu> persia, two meetings a month should be perfectly fine, given our current load.
[13:25] <persia> elkbuntu, I guess.  I was thinking two meetings a month for each of 9:00 and 15:00, as I don't think we can handle more than 2 candidates an hour, and that's pressing it.
[13:25] <persia> I'd rather more shorter meetings.
[13:25] <elkbuntu> this is true
[13:25] <elkbuntu> but, its not like we're inundated. we had one candidate today.
[13:26] <persia> And we've not had an actual candidate from our theoretical region for a few weeks now (I think tuxmaniac was last)
[13:26] <elkbuntu> if we're going to get ganged by half a loco like the one time we had more than 2, we're going to get ganged no matter how we do it.
[13:27] <persia> True.  On the other hand, I think we sorted that LoCo in just two or three weeks.  I just don't want that to be a month or two.
[13:27] <elkbuntu> i suspect so. the ones from our region i think you'll find are the ones languishing in the wait list
[13:27]  * persia would like meetings with no applicants, and no discussion.
[13:27] <persia> Yeah, and hopefully more flexible meeting times will help with that.  I think we're only really good for UTC+8/+9 now, and that's not everyone.
[13:28] <amachu> ok
[13:29] <elkbuntu> persia, and aside from basically japan, that's basically an economically underpriveliged strip. why there are not more japanese piping up i'd love to know, but that's a story for another day.
[13:30] <persia> elkbuntu, It's complicated, but mostly language.  I expect we'll have a bunch of applicants in March or so.
[13:31] <amachu> persia: imagine India :-)
[13:32] <persia> amachu, I do regularly :)
[13:32] <amachu> have you visited?
[13:32] <elkbuntu> foss.in needs to pick a less-busy-for-me time :(
[13:32] <persia> Only Maharastra.
[13:33] <amachu> persia: Hmm.. thats intersting.. Mumbai?
[13:33] <persia> Yes.  A week of work, with bracketing weekends.  Definitely different than other cities I'd seen.
[13:34] <amachu> elkbuntu: there are lot of other events may also be queue..
[13:34] <amachu> may also be in queue..
[13:35] <elkbuntu> amachu, ooh, more confs in india?
[13:35] <amachu> freedel happens regularly as foss.in
[13:35] <amachu> elkbuntu: yes...
[13:36] <amachu> and we had one in Chennai last year and in Pune or Mumbai(?) too last year
[13:36] <amachu> People are planning to have one in Kearla this december
[13:36] <elkbuntu> is foss.in the biggest?
[13:37] <amachu> Ooof! lots of typing errors today :-(
[13:37] <amachu> elkbuntu: yes!
[13:37] <elkbuntu> amachu, i figured so, which is why i'm sad to miss it every year
[13:38] <amachu> but I am Chennai :-) both of you are invited anytime :-)
[13:40] <amachu> bye for now.. its time to leave..
[13:41] <elkbuntu> indeed. g'nite!
[13:42]  * _persia swaps batteries
[14:14] <freeflying> @schedule shanghai
[14:57] <pitti> hi
[15:02] <apachelogger> hey
[15:02] <superm1> hi
[15:02] <Keybuk> mdz is on his way
[15:02] <mdz> #startmeeting
[15:03] <MootBot> Meeting started at 09:03. The chair is mdz.
[15:03] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[15:03] <mdz> [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TechnicalBoardAgenda
[15:03] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TechnicalBoardAgenda
[15:03] <mdz> hello all
[15:03]  * ogra waves
[15:03] <mdz> we're starting a few minutes late, so let's get right into it
[15:03] <mdz> [TOPIC] ubuntu-core-dev application from Mario Limonciello
[15:03] <MootBot> New Topic:  ubuntu-core-dev application from Mario Limonciello
[15:03] <mdz> superm1: hi
[15:03] <superm1> hi mdz
[15:04] <Keybuk> superm1: you've had upload permission for dkms so far, and are now applying for full core-dev?
[15:04] <mdz> [LINK] https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2008-September/001650.html
[15:04] <MootBot> LINK received:  https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2008-September/001650.html
[15:05] <mdz> ^ Mario's application and support, courtesy of MOTU council
[15:05] <superm1> Keybuk, yes.  i've found that an increasingly large amount of the packages that I end up patching and working on are falling into main
[15:05] <mdz> superm1: is your work driving that change?
[15:06] <superm1> mdz, both my work and personal time have been driving that.  For work, it ends up that for enabling hardware a lot of stuff is in main.
[15:06] <superm1> mdz, for personal efforts, I've had interests in things such as AMD's closed driver and getting the bluetooth experience improved
[15:07] <mdz> superm1: bluez could certainly use some love
[15:08] <mdz> superm1: the feedback from your sponsors is great, just reading over it
[15:08] <superm1> mdz, over the last week and a half, i've been working with upstream to get the 4.x release in order with the intention of it coming into intrepid
[15:08] <Keybuk> which upstream is that?
[15:08] <mdz> superm1: eek
[15:09] <mdz> superm1: is there a feature freeze exception active for that?
[15:09] <superm1> there has been a rather thorough investigation of it going on in the bluetooth ppa to check that no regressions developed
[15:09] <pitti> (for the record, Steve just blessed the update, and there were loads of testers)
[15:09] <ogra> mdz, yes
[15:09]  * ogra is sad it doesnt work with most of his devices still
[15:09] <Keybuk> it'd be good to have someone caring for bluetooth
[15:09] <superm1> Keybuk, bluez upstream, particularly marcel
[15:10] <ogra> Keybuk, if davidm approves i'd take parts of it from jaunty on, mobile is deep in the bluez stuff anyway
[15:10] <ogra> and it annoys me that 3 out of four devices i own still dont work :P
[15:11]  * pitti raises his hand, he has two questions for Mario
[15:11] <mdz> superm1: I've always found it required a lot of fiddling to get even basic functionality working, so I expect it could only get better
[15:11] <superm1> mdz, yeah particularly input devices work great now - combined with xorg's input hotplug
[15:12]  * stgraber waves
[15:12] <superm1> and the wizard part of the 4.x stack.
[15:12] <superm1> sure, pitti ?
[15:12] <mdz> pitti: please
[15:13] <pitti> assume hal 0.5.12 would be released next week, and you heard it will fix some issues on Dell systems; what would you do?
[15:13] <pitti> (just some "policy & workflow" tests)
[15:13] <superm1> pitti, look at the delta from the last hal release and identify what else changed
[15:13] <superm1> pitti, if the delta did more than just that, pull out patches
[15:14] <superm1> particularly hal has git upstream, so it's easy enough to pull a patch and drop it into debian/patches
[15:14] <pitti> superm1: why don't you just update the package to the new upstream version?
[15:14] <superm1> pitti, to prevent new regressions that would not necessarily be forseen
[15:15] <pitti> superm1: ok, that's certainly a cautious and valid approach
[15:15] <superm1> pitti, now if there were other relevant bug fixes that we have things filed in launchpad, that's a different situation
[15:15] <pitti> note that if the update just fixes a couple of additional bugs, it is legitimate, and even encouraged, to upload it
[15:15] <superm1> pitti, and it would be more worthwhile to evaluate it
[15:16] <pitti> ok
[15:16] <pitti> let's further assume that in the following week you see a bug against hal with an updated FDI for fixing a magic key on a particular system; what would you do?
[15:16] <superm1> reclassify it against hal-info most likely, since that's where most the FDI's live
[15:17] <superm1> but if it's something I can double check, i'd like to try the updated FDI myself, submit it upstream and update hal-info
[15:18] <pitti> yep; thanks
[15:18] <pitti> (I'm done)
[15:19] <mdz> pitti: thanks
[15:19] <mdz> Keybuk: any further questions?
[15:19] <Keybuk> none from me
[15:20] <mdz> ou
[15:20] <mdz> ok
[15:20] <mdz> [VOTE] ubuntu-core-dev application from Mario Limonciello
[15:20] <MootBot> Please vote on:  ubuntu-core-dev application from Mario Limonciello.
[15:20] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[15:20] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[15:20] <Keybuk> +1
[15:20] <MootBot> +1 received from Keybuk. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[15:20] <mdz> +1
[15:20] <MootBot> +1 received from mdz. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[15:20] <mdz> #endvote
[15:21] <mdz> MootBot: *poke*
[15:21] <mdz> superm1: anyhow, congratulations and thank you
[15:21] <superm1> thanks everyone :)
[15:21] <apachelogger> superm1: congrats :)
[15:21]  * pitti hugs superm1, great work so far!
[15:21] <mdz> [ENDVOTE]
[15:21] <MootBot> Final result is 2 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 2
[15:21] <evand> superm1: congratulations!
[15:22] <ogra> yay superm1
[15:22] <mvo> congrats superm1
[15:22] <stgraber> congrats superm1
[15:22] <mdz> Riddell has added an application from Harald Sitter to the agenda
[15:23] <mdz> this one hasn't been processed by the MOTU council
[15:23] <mdz> [TOPIC] ubuntu-core-dev application from Harald Sitter
[15:23] <MootBot> New Topic:  ubuntu-core-dev application from Harald Sitter
[15:23] <Riddell> most of the motu council do seem to have responded
[15:23] <mdz> well, one of them has just become a father, so I can't blame him ;-)
[15:23] <_persia> Indeed.  At this point it's an administrative detail that the recommendation has yet to be sent.
[15:24] <Riddell> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2008-October/001681.html  https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2008-October/001679.html
[15:24] <apachelogger> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2008-September/001531.html
[15:24] <mdz> _persia: I really appreciate the application summaries that come in, with all of the links spelled out.  it saves us time in compiling all of the information
[15:24] <apachelogger> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2008-September/001555.html
[15:24] <mdz> Riddell: is Harald here?
[15:24] <Riddell> he is apachelogger
[15:24]  * apachelogger waves :)
[15:25] <mdz> ah, his realname is not set
[15:25] <mdz> apachelogger: what is your Launchpad username?
[15:25] <apachelogger> apachelogger
[15:25] <Keybuk> Batman, huh?
[15:26] <apachelogger> Keybuk: We founded a team to take care of KDE release packaging, which happened to be around the time the new Batman movie came out, so everything is kind of bat-ish.
[15:27] <apachelogger> Like the scripts we use are called batscripts etc.
[15:27] <Keybuk> I've just been sitting and trying to figure a humours way to work a K into that
[15:27] <ogra> did you find one ?
[15:28] <apachelogger> I would go with KBatman really ;-)
[15:28] <Keybuk> apachelogger: you've been working mostly on Kubuntu so far
[15:28] <apachelogger> Keybuk: yes
[15:28] <Keybuk> what do you see the biggest challenge that Kubuntu needs to solve in the next year?
[15:29] <mdz> _persia: are you saying on behalf of the council that you support his application?
[15:29] <apachelogger> Keybuk: Quality. There are a lot of bugs which are around for ages but never get fixed, even if they are pretty simple.
[15:30] <Keybuk> apachelogger: why do you think that they haven't been fixed?
[15:30] <apachelogger> No one looked at it.
[15:30] <persia> mdz, Yes.  I'll prepare that email now.
[15:31] <apachelogger> Keybuk: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdebase/+bugs?field.searchtext=&orderby=-importance&search=Search&field.status%3Alist=NEW&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE&assignee_option=any&field.assignee=&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_supervisor=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=&field.status_upstream-empty-marker=1&field.omit_dupes.used=&field.omit_dupes=on&field.has_patch.used=&field.has_cve
[15:31] <apachelogger> .used=&field.tag=&field.tags_combinator=ANY
[15:31] <mdz> tinyurl that?
[15:31] <apachelogger> mdz: faster that way ;-)
[15:31] <apachelogger> anyway, kdebase was pretty much the central part of KDE bugs in KDE 3 and now are at >100 New or Incomplete bugs
[15:32] <apachelogger> the very same applies for kdepim
[15:32] <Riddell> http://tinyurl.com/495bws
[15:32] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://tinyurl.com/495bws
[15:32] <apachelogger> \o/
[15:32] <Keybuk> apachelogger: why do you think nobody is looking at the bugs?
[15:32] <mdz> Riddell: do you have a link to your sponsorship feedback?
[15:33] <Riddell> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2008-August/001505.html
[15:33] <mdz> apachelogger: if you're interested in tracking down stale bugs and cleaning up, you might talk to the folks who run http://status.qa.ubuntu.com/ and see about getting some packages added there
[15:33] <apachelogger> Keybuk: lazyness mostly. Maybe also the fact that a lot of them are actualyl upstream bugs.
[15:34] <Riddell> with apachelogger we've been able to turn packaging KDE releases into a full community effort, it's working really well
[15:34] <mdz> kdebase is already on there
[15:34] <mdz> http://status.qa.ubuntu.com/qapkgstatus/kdebase
[15:34] <MootBot> LINK received:  http://status.qa.ubuntu.com/qapkgstatus/kdebase
[15:34] <ScottK> Here is my sponsor feedback https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2008-August/001494.html
[15:34] <ScottK> Despite the hesitation in the mail, I support the application.
[15:34] <mdz> dholbach: are you around?
[15:34] <apachelogger> mdz: yeah, good idea. Thank you.
[15:35] <apachelogger> Actually one can see pretty well when we started cleaning up kdebase on that page ;-)
[15:35] <Keybuk> apachelogger: did you respond to ScottK's question in his feedback?
[15:36] <mdz> Riddell:  you mention that Harald has been leading the KDE packaging process for 4.1.x.  can you tell us more about that?  how is that process organized?
[15:36] <apachelogger> Keybuk: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2008-August/001495.html
[15:37] <Riddell> mdz: it has to be done somewhat clandestinely since KDE gives us tars a week early but doesn't want them published until release day, so we have a secret archive and wiki page for coordination and share out the modules amongst people available
[15:38]  * ScottK can attest to the volume of work done by the team as I ended up sponsoring an entire KDE release when Riddell was on vacation.  It's a lot.
[15:38] <Riddell> I think it started when I was away during a KDE release, apachelogger tried to do it all himself and realised it was too much work so he got this community effort into process
[15:38] <apachelogger> Yes, that was KDE 4.1 rc I think.
[15:39] <mdz> Riddell: secret archive?
[15:39] <Riddell> just on apachelogger's own server
[15:40] <mdz> Riddell: with hand-built binaries?  then the source is uploaded on release day?
[15:40] <Riddell> mdz: yep
[15:41] <apachelogger> mdz: the team sends the packaging to me, I review it, and build it on a complete stack, then upload the source and debs for internal access
[15:41] <mdz> can anyone speak to why this application seemed to take a long time to get through the council?
[15:42] <nixternal> mdz: I voted right away on this one and others...I think the rest of the MC were very busy with personal life at the time
[15:42] <nixternal> which is usually the other way around, with me being super busy :)
[15:42] <persia> The council has been having difficulties with the processing of applications in a timely manner.  Alternate means of processing applications, or alternate methods of scheduling such processing have been the topic of discussion at the last few MOTU Council meetings.
[15:43] <mdz> persia: is there usually a single person who shepherds the applications through?
[15:43] <dholbach> mdz: yes, I'm around
[15:43] <nixternal> dholbach gets on us to wake us up when we are busy elsewhere
[15:43] <nixternal> :)
[15:43] <nixternal> perfect timing
[15:44] <mdz> I don't want to derail the meeting too much; let's take this part of the discussion to email.  if there's anything we (TB) can do to help keep the process working smoothly, let me know
[15:44] <persia> mdz, Not really.  It's essentially been left to each council member to vote in their own time.  While this has worked in the past, as of late this voting has not happened in a timely manner (since roughly June, with apachelogger being the worst example)
[15:44] <mdz> Keybuk: any questions for apachelogger?
[15:44] <Keybuk> no, mine have been answered
[15:44] <mdz> ok, I've more or less finished reviewing the email record
[15:45] <mdz> [VOTE] ubuntu-core-dev application for Harald Sitter
[15:45] <MootBot> Please vote on:  ubuntu-core-dev application for Harald Sitter.
[15:45] <MootBot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0  to MootBot
[15:45] <MootBot> E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting
[15:45] <mdz> +1 based on sponsor and MC feedback
[15:45] <MootBot> +1 received from mdz. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1
[15:45] <Keybuk> +1 also
[15:45] <MootBot> +1 received from Keybuk. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2
[15:46] <mdz> [ENDVOTE]
[15:46] <MootBot> Final result is 2 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 2
[15:46] <mdz> apachelogger: congratulations and thank you
[15:46] <apachelogger> \o/
[15:46] <apachelogger> Thanks everyone :)
[15:46] <nixternal> YAY \O/ congrats apachelogger!!!
[15:46] <vorian> yay apachelogger! Congrats!!!
[15:46] <dholbach> congratulations apachelogger
[15:46] <nixternal> thanks mdz and Keybuk, the Kubuntu community really needed this!
[15:46] <ogra> congrats apachelogger
[15:46] <stgraber> congratz apachelogger
[15:46] <mdz> [TOPIC] Limited upload rights for Romain Francoise
[15:46] <MootBot> New Topic:  Limited upload rights for Romain Francoise
[15:46] <ScottK> apachelogger: Congrats
[15:47] <mdz> siretart asked the TB to consider granting upload privileges to Romain  Francoise for emacs-snapshot
[15:47] <mdz> which is in universe
[15:47] <ogra> mdz, no stgraber on the agenda ?
[15:49] <ogra> (just stroke me... when i looked at it)
[15:49] <mdz> Romain is a Debian developer and maintains emacs-snapshot there, as well as a handful of other packages
[15:49] <mdz> ogra: you can add it but we're already short on time
[15:50] <siretart> correction: romain is emacs upstream, and maintains emacs-snapshot outside of debian
[15:50] <ogra> mdz, well, next meeting would be a bit pointless for intrepid fixes, i'll add it
[15:50] <siretart> we use his package unmodified in ubuntu, though
[15:50] <mdz> siretart: oh, I noticed him in Original-Maintainer and assumed
[15:50] <Keybuk> where is his package nominally uploaded to?
[15:50] <mdz> siretart: is emacs-snapshot in Debian? (and if not, why not?)
[15:50] <ogra> added
[15:51] <mdz> dholbach: I'd like to hear from the MOTU council about granting of upload rights for universe packages, as we haven't done this before
[15:51] <siretart> mdz: emacs-snapshot used to be in debian, but he asked to remove it because he does not agree to the GR prohibiting GFDLed documents in 'main'
[15:51] <mdz> dholbach: we've only granted it for select main packages for MOTUs
[15:51] <siretart> since then he publishes his packages on http://emacs.orebokech.com/ and in the ~ubuntu-elisp PPA
[15:51] <dholbach> mdz: I did not review Romain's activity in Ubuntu yet
[15:51] <dholbach> siretart: I guess you sponsored some of his uploads?
[15:52] <siretart> he is still a DD, though.
[15:52] <mdz> dholbach: what do you think of the general idea_
[15:52] <siretart> dholbach: well, that 'emacs-snapshot' package. additionally, that packaging is the basis for our 'emacs22' package.
[15:52] <dholbach> mdz: I think it makes sense and in the future we need a good process for people who know about packaging, demonstrated that they take good care of a small subset of packages
[15:53] <mdz> siretart: any particular reason why Romain should not apply for MOTU instead?
[15:53] <dholbach> mdz: as I guess with ArchiveReorg we will see it more often
[15:53] <mdz> siretart: (btw is he here?)
[15:53] <dholbach> mdz: we only had one case up until now where we approved an "upstream MOTU"
[15:53] <siretart> he is 'ore' on irc
[15:53] <dholbach> siretart: OK
[15:54] <siretart> mdz: AFAIUI, ore does not run any ubuntu machines. he tests the emacs-snapshot package in a kvm instance though. his package works fairly well in ubuntu and he responds to bug reports pretty fast
[15:54] <mdz> I need to leave in about 5 minutes
[15:54] <mdz> I think this is not a simple case to consider and we need to discuss more with the MOTU council
[15:54] <ogra> :(
[15:54] <siretart> :(
[15:54] <mdz> siretart: would you mind if we take this to email?
[15:54] <dholbach> mdz: it's a bit harder to demonstrate your skills when you just work on one package - so I guess that a few words from sponsors, a good track record of maintaining the package (bug work, etc) and a few reviews of changes to the packaging should be enough
[15:55] <siretart> mdz: no problem. the thread is already going on for some weeks now, though ;)
[15:55] <Keybuk> the MOTU process is more than just a gate of quality
[15:55] <Keybuk> it also introduces the prospective maintainer to our procedures, and our community
[15:56] <siretart> Keybuk: he is not applying for MOTU, though.
[15:56] <mdz> siretart: I realize. I'll keep it on the agenda for the next meeting in case it doesn't get resolved by email
[15:56] <siretart> mdz: OK
[15:56] <Keybuk> it occurs to me that to upload a single package, someone still needs to go through the general process of MOTU application
[15:56] <Keybuk> this is quite a different case from granting an existing MOTU further rights
[15:56] <mdz> [AGREED] defer decision due to time constraints, and continue the conversation in email (or at the next meeting)
[15:56] <MootBot> AGREED received:  defer decision due to time constraints, and continue the conversation in email (or at the next meeting)
[15:56] <mdz> [TOPIC] cdrtools update
[15:57] <MootBot> New Topic:  cdrtools update
[15:57] <mdz> a quick update here
[15:57] <siretart> Keybuk: I thought I remembered some talk about that the last UDS that we would consider this case via package ACLs
[15:57] <mdz> sabdfl and I spoke with Eben Moglen, and he agreed that we can acknowledge Joerg's interpretation if he states it explicitly in terms of the license which applies to the binaries
[15:57] <Keybuk> siretart: discussions at UDS were about components-sized ACLs, not individual packages
[15:58] <mdz> I'm told that Eben and Joerg spoke after that, and that the discussion was positive, but have not heard back from Eben yet
[15:58] <siretart> Keybuk: then I misunderstood. OK
[15:58]  * ScottK remembers both.
[15:58] <siretart> mdz: I have a quick update on that
[15:58] <mdz> siretart: go ahead
[15:58] <siretart> mdz: in the meantime, I spoke with joerg on IRC and asked him about the license of the binaries
[15:59] <siretart> mdz: he replied to me that he does not believe that this was legally possible (yes, I'm confused as well here), but he has no problems to distribute the binaries under GPL if that was possible
[15:59] <mdz> siretart: that sort of ambiguous answer is not entirely unexpected ;-)
[15:59] <siretart> mdz: he generally asked me for patches to cdrecord/LICENSE to improve the wording. I didn't get to that yet, help from others (espc native speakers) very welcome here!
[16:00] <mdz> we're expecting to receive a summary from Eben, and will take next steps based on that
[16:00] <mdz> siretart: if you can forward that additional info from joerg to technical-board@ that would be helpful
[16:00] <siretart> mdz: OK, will do.
[16:00] <mdz> I do need to go now unfortunately, I only have an hour scheduled for this meeting and usually it is much shorter :-)
[16:01] <mdz> it's good to see so much activity though
[16:01] <mdz> we will pick up where we left off next time
[16:01] <mdz> thanks, all
[16:01] <mdz> #endmeeting
[16:01] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 10:01.
[16:01] <ogra> mdz, any way that the stgraber approval can be done by mail ?
[16:01] <ogra> makr already replied i see
[16:01] <Keybuk> siretart: doesn't distributing the binaries under the GPL mean that nobody could redistribute them?  since they would be required to honour the part of the GPL about accompanying source, which specifies the licence of that source must be GPL?
[16:01] <mdz> ogra: I haven't looked at the specifics, but probably yes
[16:02] <ogra> mdz, i would like to get that approved for intrepid, next TB is a bit late for that
[16:02]  * mathiaz waves at the server team members
[16:03] <zul> hello
[16:03] <Koon> o/
[16:03] <sommer> hey all
[16:03] <siretart> Keybuk: that's excatly the point of that discussion. Joerg argues that the GPL does not exactly require the complete source to be under GPL, but to be compliant with the sections 1 and 2 of the GPL
[16:03] <siretart> Keybuk: and the cdrtools source code indeed fulfill that requirement
[16:04] <siretart> Keybuk: and AFAIUI, moglen seems to agree here
[16:04] <Keybuk> but section 1 uses the term "this License" ? :)
[16:05] <Keybuk> as does section 2
[16:05] <mathiaz> all right - let's get the Server Team meeting rolling.
[16:05] <siretart> Keybuk: lets move to #ubuntu-devel
[16:06] <mathiaz> siretart: thanks :)
[16:06] <mathiaz> #startmeeting
[16:06] <MootBot> Meeting started at 10:06. The chair is mathiaz.
[16:06] <MootBot> Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE]
[16:06] <mathiaz> Today's amazing agenda: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam/Meeting
[16:06] <kirkland> o/
[16:07] <mathiaz> Last meeting minutes: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/Server/20080930
[16:07] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Review ServerGuide for Intrepid
[16:07] <MootBot> New Topic:  Review ServerGuide for Intrepid
[16:07] <mathiaz> sommer: what's the state of the virtualization sections?
[16:08] <sommer> mathiaz: should be good to go
[16:08] <sommer> mathiaz: we merged the vmbuilder and jeos sections, based on nijaba's wiki guidle
[16:08]  * sommer guide
[16:09] <nijaba> o/
[16:09] <sommer> so I think we got in all the new/updated content for intrepid
[16:09] <mathiaz> zul: did you get a chance to review the new virtualization section?
[16:09] <zul> mathiaz: no I havent
[16:09] <mathiaz> sommer: is there some time to update the support section?
[16:09] <sommer> mathiaz: we can ask for a freeze exception
[16:09] <mathiaz> sommer: I can prepare a branch with the update.
[16:10] <mathiaz> sommer: Do you know how well the serverguide is translated?
[16:10] <zul> mathiaz: hopefully today
[16:10] <sommer> mathiaz: I don't think I can really judge that... only speaking english
[16:11] <sommer> mathiaz: I think there was a message this morning about some issues with the process though
[16:12] <mathiaz> sommer: right - I saw some messages on ubuntu-doc@
[16:12] <sommer> mathiaz: so I think there's a good chance of getting an exception
[16:12] <mathiaz> sommer: ok - so I'll prepare a branch
[16:12] <mathiaz> sommer: and send it to you
[16:13] <mathiaz> [ACTION] mathiaz to update the support section
[16:13] <MootBot> ACTION received:  mathiaz to update the support section
[16:13] <sommer> mathiaz: cool, thanks
[16:13] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Ubuntu vm builder
[16:13] <MootBot> New Topic:  Ubuntu vm builder
[16:13] <mathiaz> nijaba: what's the state of the tutorial update?
[16:14] <nijaba> mathiaz: it is finished, but we have a couple bugs to fix in vmbuilder for it to completely work
[16:14] <mathiaz> nijaba: have you filed bugs?
[16:14] <nijaba> mathiaz: yep, do you want the bug #?
[16:14] <mathiaz> nijaba: nope
[16:15] <mathiaz> nijaba: are they targeted for intrepid?
[16:16] <nijaba> mathiaz: not yet, but they could/should
[16:17] <mathiaz> nijaba: are these bugs showstoppers or minor annoyance?
[16:18] <nijaba> mathiaz: not show stopper; iti is just the -c option that does not work
[16:18] <nijaba> -c: specify a configuration file other thant the default
[16:18] <mathiaz> nijaba: ok. That's not so bad then.
[16:19] <mathiaz> nijaba: anything else you've noticed during your testing of vm-builder?
[16:19] <nijaba> mathiaz: not that have not been fixed already
[16:19] <RoAkSoAx> sommer: i could help judging the translation of spanish server guide
[16:20] <mathiaz> nijaba: ok thanks.
[16:20] <mathiaz> while we're on the topic of virtualization
[16:20] <sommer> RoAkSoAx: cool it's all done through launch pad
[16:20] <mathiaz> kirkland: have you seen anything important in kvm/libvirt?
[16:20] <kirkland> mathiaz: it seems to be working better than it ever has in intrepid
[16:21] <kirkland> mathiaz: haven't seen any showstopping bugs opened since i've been watching the queue (2 weeks) backing up soren
[16:21] <mathiaz> kirkland: do you know if virtio devices are supported in intrepid?
[16:21] <kirkland> mathiaz: i fixed a bunch, and sent a bunch upstream, against kvm and virt-manager
[16:21] <kirkland> mathiaz: i don't think so
[16:22] <mathiaz> kirkland: I remember we had to pull something out related to virtio just before hardy was released.
[16:22] <mathiaz> jdstrand: do you remember the issue with virtio in hardy?
[16:22] <kirkland> mathiaz: i'm sorry, i don't know much about virtio ... i can come up to speed, if necessary
[16:22] <RoAkSoAx> sommer: rosetta?
[16:22] <mathiaz> IIRC it was related to block devices
[16:23] <sommer> RoAkSoAx: yes
[16:23] <jdstrand> IIRC virtio was pulled for block devices, bit the virtnet (?) is still in place
[16:23] <jdstrand> s/bit/but/
[16:23] <RoAkSoAx> sommer: ok, i will take a look at it during this week :)
[16:23] <zul> mathiaz: it was slow when we were testing the isos with encrypted disks wasnt it?
[16:24] <mathiaz> right - virtnet is working (but not during installer)
[16:24] <mathiaz> zul: it would lock up the guest IIRC
[16:24] <zul> mathiaz: yes
[16:24] <mathiaz> zul: or at least the installation would be verrryyy slow
[16:25] <zul> mathiaz: have you seen that in intrepid yet?
[16:25] <mathiaz> zul: not yet.
[16:25] <mathiaz> but my guests are running with an ide bus instead of virtio bus
[16:25] <mathiaz> and I'm still running on a hardy host.
[16:25] <mathiaz> kirkland: you may wanna test that on an intrepid host
[16:25] <kirkland> mathiaz: what's that?
[16:26] <kirkland> mathiaz: "that" .. ?
[16:26] <mathiaz> kirkland: running guests with a virtio disk instead of an ide bus
[16:26] <mathiaz> kirkland: I'll show you after the meeting how to do that.
[16:26] <kirkland> mathiaz: cool, thanks
[16:27] <mathiaz> anything else related to virtualization in intrepid?
[16:27] <kirkland> mathiaz: not from me
[16:28] <mathiaz> ok - let's move on then
[16:28] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Ubuntu Server Survey
[16:28] <MootBot> New Topic:  Ubuntu Server Survey
[16:28] <mathiaz> kirkland: thanks for the post
[16:28] <mathiaz> nijaba: still going well?
[16:28] <nijaba> mathiaz: yes, great !
[16:28] <nijaba> we passed the 3000 responses
[16:29] <mathiaz> nijaba: has the launch plan been completed?
[16:29] <mathiaz> nijaba: you mentionned last week that some items were left
[16:29] <nijaba> mathiaz: yes it has
[16:29] <kirkland>  |^o
[16:30] <mathiaz> nijaba: great.
[16:30] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] DRBD
[16:30] <MootBot> New Topic:  DRBD
[16:30] <mathiaz> ivoks has been working on this issue and found the problem.
[16:30] <mathiaz> it was a change in the kernel id.
[16:31] <zul> ivoks is here? if not...ffe has been asked havent followed up on it yet
[16:31] <mathiaz> so we don't need to upgrade the driver and the userspace tools to a new rc version.
[16:31] <zul> no
[16:31] <mathiaz> zul: have you filed the FFe?
[16:31] <zul> mathiaz: we need to upgrade the userspace tools  to 8.2.6
[16:31] <mathiaz> zul: ah ok.
[16:32] <mathiaz> zul: I though we just had to change the id in 8.0.12.
[16:32] <zul> no I talked to ivoks about this yesterday and the userspace and kernel has to be the same
[16:32] <zul> hi ivoks
[16:32] <ivoks> hi
[16:33] <ivoks> (sorry for being late; business)
[16:33] <mathiaz> ivoks: just in time ! we were talking about drbd
[16:33] <mathiaz> ivoks: thanks for the good work on that one.
[16:33] <ivoks> all right
[16:33] <ivoks> no problem
[16:33] <ivoks> i don't know if zul talked about the problem
[16:34] <ivoks> and if you are interested, i could give you a quick explanation
[16:34] <mathiaz> ivoks: I mentionned the kernel id thing
[16:34] <zul> ivoks: I did the basics but if you want to go more in depth be my guest
[16:34] <mathiaz> ivoks: well - you don't have to. The most important thing is that we have solution
[16:34] <ivoks> only if others need to know :) bottom line is that we should keep our eyes on it, since this could happen again (drbd isn't upstream yet, so they aren't in sync)
[16:34] <mathiaz> ivoks: the tools still have to be updated to 8.2.6?
[16:35] <ivoks> mathiaz: yes
[16:35] <mathiaz> and the FFe has been filed.
[16:35] <ivoks> (drbd isn't in kernel)
[16:35] <mathiaz> ivoks: you mean in the upstream kernel. The Ubuntu kernel team adds it to the ubuntu kernel?
[16:36] <ivoks> mathiaz: correct
[16:36] <mathiaz> ivoks: ok - and whenever they do that they forget to update the userspace tools?
[16:37] <ivoks> mathiaz: basicaly, kernel team didn't do anything; drbd's ID was taken by framebuffer module in linus's tree
[16:37] <ivoks> mathiaz: i've told drbd upstream to watch out for that; they weren't aware this happened
[16:37] <mathiaz> ivoks: right - but IIRC there was also a mismatch during the hardy cycle
[16:37] <zul> nope
[16:38] <ivoks> mathiaz: no, drbd in hardy and in upstream have same ID
[16:38] <ivoks> there wasn't that frame buffer module :)
[16:38] <mathiaz> ivoks: but it seems that there isn't a strict dependency between the version in the kernel and the userspace tool
[16:38] <mathiaz> ivoks: right - I'm talking about the version of the kernel module and the user space tools
[16:38] <ivoks> mathiaz: yes, both for version of drbd and ID number
[16:38] <mathiaz> ivoks: not that very specific problem.
[16:38] <ivoks> drbd kernel and drbd userspace must be of same version
[16:39] <ivoks> since tools are built with kernel headers
[16:39] <mathiaz> ivoks: ok - IIRC it wasn't the case at some point in the hardy release cycle.
[16:39] <ivoks> there is one problem in package we should work on for intrepid+1
[16:40] <mathiaz> ivoks: and since the kernel team pulls in a new version of drbd there should be a way to sync the userspace tools too
[16:40] <ivoks> mathiaz: right... current problem is that userspace tools come with kernel module source, and build against it
[16:40] <zul> mathiaz: we should probably look at dkms for packagin in intrepid+1
[16:40] <ivoks> mathiaz: we should make that userspace build against our kernel headers
[16:41] <mathiaz> right - it seems that this topic should be discussed with the kernel team.
[16:41] <ivoks> anyway, for intrepid everything is ok if new userspace is uploaded
[16:41] <mathiaz> ivoks: great!
[16:41] <mathiaz> ivoks: we'll discuss the state of DRBD for jaunty during the UDS with the kernel team then.
[16:41] <ivoks> no need to stall the meating with this
[16:42] <ivoks> mathiaz: well... i hope so :D
[16:42] <mathiaz> ok - That's all I had from last week's meeting.
[16:42] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Open discussion
[16:42] <MootBot> New Topic:  Open discussion
[16:43] <mathiaz> anyone?
[16:43] <ivoks> me, again :)
[16:43] <ivoks> fwiw if you remember, last time i mentioned that bacula thing
[16:44] <mathiaz> ivoks: I'm not sure what you refering to
[16:44] <ivoks> reporter reported that patched version fixed the thing, so if anyone is interested in pushing this update in hardy, be my guest :)
[16:44] <ivoks> mathiaz: just a sec
[16:44] <zul> ivoks: is it in your ppa?
[16:44] <ivoks> zul: yes
[16:44] <mathiaz> ivoks: it's related to a -bacula-postgres segfaulting right?
[16:44] <zul> ivoks: cool Ill have a look then
[16:45] <ivoks> bug #227613
[16:45] <ivoks> mathiaz: it's related to at least 3 bugs
[16:45] <mathiaz> [ACTION] zul to look into SRUing bacula sigsegv - bug 227613
[16:45] <MootBot> ACTION received:  zul to look into SRUing bacula sigsegv - bug 227613
[16:46] <mathiaz> ivoks: anything else relatedt to bacula?
[16:46] <ivoks> atm no
[16:46] <mathiaz> ivoks: have you got a chance to test bacula in intrepid?
[16:46] <ivoks> mathiaz: not yet, but i will
[16:47] <ivoks> mathiaz: my plan is to test bacula and red hat cluster suite
[16:47] <ivoks> drbd is ok (with new update)
[16:47] <mathiaz> ivoks: great - thanks.
[16:47] <mathiaz> Anything else to add?
[16:48] <mathiaz> There isn't any new Freeze taking effect this week
[16:49] <mathiaz> so we're still in FeatureFreeze, UserInterfaceFreeze and DocumentationFreeze
[16:49] <mathiaz> Next week will be KernelFreeze
[16:50] <mathiaz> so testing, testing and testing is welcome
[16:50] <mathiaz> on all sort of hardware you can have access to
[16:51] <mathiaz> [TOPIC] Agree on next meeting date and time
[16:51] <MootBot> New Topic:  Agree on next meeting date and time
[16:51] <mathiaz> next week, same time, same place?
[16:51] <Koon> same (modified) time ?
[16:52] <nealmcb> modified?
[16:52] <ivoks> modified?
[16:52] <mathiaz> 15:00 UTC
[16:52] <Koon> ignore me
[16:52] <nealmcb> I guess in some countries daylight time is happening soon
[16:52] <ivoks>  /ignore Koon
[16:52] <ivoks> well, UTC is UTC
[16:52]  * Koon just realized this meeting occured at the usual time.
[16:52] <nealmcb> and vice versa....
[16:53] <nealmcb> so pay attention....
[16:53] <mathiaz> all right - same place same time next week
[16:53] <sommer> coolio
[16:53] <ivoks> ok
[16:54] <mathiaz> Koon: and we'll unmodify the not-modified schedule of this meeting for you
[16:54]  * Koon hugs mathiaz
[16:54] <mathiaz> #endmeeting
[16:54] <MootBot> Meeting finished at 10:54.
[16:54]  * nealmcb looks for a list of upcoming shifts of local time vs UTC around the world....
[16:56] <persia> There's a bunch of them soon, but UTC is nice and reliable.
[17:01] <sommer> meeting over?
[17:02] <ivoks> yes, 6 minutes ago
[17:02] <sommer> oh, missed that :-)
[17:30] <keffie_jayx> boredandblogging, ping?
[17:30] <keffie_jayx> @now
[17:34] <juliux> @schedule
[17:34] <juliux> @schedule berlin
[17:38] <keffie_jayx> juliux, stll two hours.. though fridge said 6 hours ... six hours ago
[17:38] <juliux> keffie_jayx: hehe
[17:39] <keffie_jayx> :D
[17:39] <juliux> i hope we will have a quorum today
[17:39] <keffie_jayx> juliux, I am hrer an so is nick
[17:39] <juliux> yeah
[17:39] <keffie_jayx> we oshould be good to go
[17:39] <juliux> nick is also here
[17:39] <keffie_jayx> I will be available on my mobile
[17:39] <juliux> so we are on the safe side
[17:39] <keffie_jayx> and it is pretty reliable
[17:40] <keffie_jayx> my wiife is getting her secound ecogram for our new baby and I am still here for this meeting :
[17:40] <keffie_jayx> :D
[17:40] <juliux> whhhoooo
[17:41] <keffie_jayx> yeah pretty cool
[17:42] <ogra> note that the bot is apparently broken
[17:43] <_persia> The bot's not that broken, just confused about recurrence.
[17:44] <juliux> hey ogra
[17:48] <keffie_jayx> @now
[18:12] <boredandblogging> keffie_jayx: hola
[19:15] <sbc> @now
[19:22] <juliux> popey: ping;)
[19:26] <effie_jayx> @now
[19:37] <emgent> hello.
[19:37]  * janc_EEE_900 is here too
[19:37] <effie_jayx> Cool
[19:40] <effie_jayx> Nick will be a bit late since he is in another meeting
[19:41] <effie_jayx>  
[19:43] <juliux> hi janc_EEE_900
[19:43] <juliux> janc_EEE_900: are you sure you can type fast enough on a eee pc?
[19:43] <janc_EEE_900> :-)
[19:45] <juliux> nxvl: around?
[19:45] <nxvl> juliux: yup
[19:45] <juliux> cool
[19:45] <juliux> china team around?
[19:46] <juliux> greece team around?
[19:49] <alefteris> juliux, we are here :)
[19:49] <juliux> alefteris: we == ? ;)
[19:49] <alefteris> the greek team I mean
[19:49] <juliux> thx
[19:50] <Mamarok> hi juliux :)
[19:50] <juliux> somebody from romania?
[19:50] <juliux> hi Mamarok
[19:50] <DoruHush> yes we are
[19:50] <juliux> DoruHush: thxs
[19:50] <juliux> hungary team also?
[19:50] <phanatic> juliux: yep
[19:51] <juliux> looks like it will be a good meeting today;)
[19:55] <elendil> hi
[19:55] <effie_jayx> @now
[19:55] <nxvl> effie_jayx: are you going to latinoware?
[19:55] <effie_jayx> Ok we are set then
[19:56] <effie_jayx> No :(
[19:56] <nxvl> :(
[19:57] <effie_jayx> Sounds like fun
[19:57] <nxvl> effie_jayx: for next year we are going to organize "encuentro ubuntu" in latinoware, so schedule it in your agenda
[19:57] <effie_jayx> Ok sound like me :-)
[19:59] <popey> moo
[19:59]  * nxvl waves
[19:59] <effie_jayx> juliux, ready?
[20:00] <juliux> effie_jayx: jip
[20:01] <effie_jayx> Let's go
[20:01] <juliux> ok effie_jayx is your toastmaster for today;)
[20:02] <popey> boredandblogging: about?
[20:02] <juliux> phanatic: he is a few minutes late, he has reallife meeting
[20:02] <juliux> popey: he is a few minutes late, he has reallife meeting
[20:02] <popey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncilAgenda
[20:04] <popey> ok, loco approvals first, is anyone from ubuntu-cn here?
[20:05] <nxvl> ping me when it's my turn please i won't we following the full meeting
[20:05] <effie_jayx> They expressed difficulty in showing for todays meeting i belive
[20:05] <juliux> nxvl: ok
[20:05] <nxvl> juliux: thank you
[20:06] <popey> ok, well based on what they have on their application.. do we make a decision?
[20:07] <juliux> i think they should be around
[20:07] <juliux> for some questions;)
[20:07] <effie_jayx> I believe the china team has been an active one
[20:07] <popey> ok, well shall we come up with some questions for them on the mailing list and get them to reply?
[20:07] <popey> via email
[20:08] <popey> There's clearly been a LOT of effort made by the ubuntu-cn team
[20:08] <effie_jayx> Sounds cool to of
[20:08] <juliux> lets send them a mail and everything is fine
[20:08] <effie_jayx> I agree
[20:08] <popey> given how much they appear to have done I dont think it's fair for us to force someone in a timezone waaaay over there ---> to come to the meeting.. is that fair?
[20:09] <popey> ok, cool
[20:09] <janc_EEE_900> we can have a meeting at another time maybe?
[20:09] <juliux> there where here last week so it is fair enough to send them a mail
[20:10] <popey> ok, shall we move on? Greece?
[20:10] <juliux> yes greece time;)
[20:10] <glogiotatidis> ok we are here
[20:11] <glogiotatidis> hi
[20:11] <alefteris> yei!!
[20:11] <rizitis> hi
[20:11] <popey> hi guys!
[20:11] <effie_jayx> I believe face value is important. And we should make an effort too. Maybe one or two from the council can attest things
[20:11] <juliux> hi greece team;)
[20:11] <popey> You have a nice busy community there
[20:11] <effie_jayx> Hello greece
[20:11] <glogiotatidis> popey, thnx. The team is growing fast
[20:11] <popey> do you have anything planned for a release party? (or parties) :)
[20:12] <glogiotatidis> yes we are already planning parties at Athens (the capital)
[20:12] <glogiotatidis> and Thessaloniki (another major city in Greece)
[20:12] <popey> two parties, what's the plan?
[20:12] <glogiotatidis> as we did for the hardy release
[20:12] <popey> drinking or installing? :)
[20:12] <popey> or both
[20:12] <juliux> making picutres;)
[20:13] <glogiotatidis> well the previous parties where drinking mostly
[20:13] <glogiotatidis> :)
[20:13] <popey> it happens
[20:13] <popey> what have you done to promote the party?
[20:13] <effie_jayx> What other thing are you guys working on
[20:14] <alefteris> popey, mosty there is discusion on the forum right now, havent started publising the parties yet
[20:15] <glogiotatidis> popey, and there is also a party planned at Chania (sourthern greece)
[20:15] <effie_jayx> Any challenges on your freshenad so far?
[20:15] <alefteris> effie_jayx, the is an online magazine planed to be release together with intrepid
[20:16] <effie_jayx> *Experience.
[20:16] <alefteris> effie_jayx, called "ubuntiστα" :)
[20:16]  * c00l2sv is up for Romania
[20:16] <effie_jayx> Sounds fantastic :-)
[20:16] <DoruHush> ﻿ ubuntu-ro
[20:16] <manuelciosici> here for ubuntu-ro
[20:16] <juliux> do you done some marketing things like posters or flyers?
[20:16]  * alex3f is here for ubuntu-ro too
[20:17] <DoruHush> http://www.ubuntu.ro/node/98
[20:17] <janc_EEE_900> juliux: they apparently did a booklet for SFD
[20:17] <DoruHush> for install fest Ubuntu 8.04
[20:18] <alex3f> http://rosedu.org/~alexef/uif/uifposterv2.jpg actually
[20:18] <effie_jayx> Very active in deed
[20:18] <glogiotatidis> juliux, we made flyers for SFD
[20:18] <janc_EEE_900> and ubuntu-ro, please wait your turn  :)
[20:18] <manuelciosici> also http://wiki.ubuntu.ro/MaterialePrezentari
[20:18] <rizitis> http://wiki.ubuntu-gr.org/SFD2008/
[20:18] <juliux> perhaps you can share them later via the spreadubuntu diy site;)
[20:19] <manuelciosici> sorry for previous
[20:19] <glogiotatidis> juliux, ok that sounds nice
[20:20] <juliux> glogiotatidis: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MarketingTeam/Projects/SpreadUbuntu/diy
[20:20] <juliux> it is still underconstruction
[20:20] <nxvl> i didn't knew about that page
[20:20] <popey> based on a consistent and growing community, and outreach to other non-ubuntu communities, +1 from me
[20:21] <boredandblogging> sorry
[20:21] <boredandblogging> I'm back
[20:21] <janc_EEE_900> +1 from me to
[20:21] <juliux> also +1 from me
[20:21] <effie_jayx> Plus one for of too
[20:21] <juliux> looks like your are doing greate work and also nice reallife getogethers;)
[20:22] <glogiotatidis> juliux, ok  thnx. I will keep everyone informed about that
[20:22] <alefteris> thank you guys :)
[20:22] <glogiotatidis> thanks !
[20:22] <popey> keep up the good work!
[20:22] <popey> and enjoy the parties :)
[20:23] <glogiotatidis> popey, thanks, we will post photos :)
[20:23] <juliux> glogiotatidis: add your parties to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IntrepidReleaseParties#Europe
[20:23] <glogiotatidis> juliux, when everything is set we will
[20:23] <juliux> glogiotatidis: cool
[20:24] <popey> ROMANIA!
[20:24]  * fdd is up for ro.
[20:24] <alex3f> here we are :D:D
[20:24] <manuelciosici> here
[20:24] <glogiotatidis> thanks everybody and greetings from greece
[20:24] <fdd> we have many enthusiasts around here.
[20:24] <fdd> greetings from romania!
[20:25] <popey> I see you guys are planning to localise the desktop course, how much of that is done, if any?
[20:25] <DoruHush> almost done
[20:25] <DoruHush> only 2 chapters renmayning
[20:25] <janc_EEE_900> cool
[20:25] <popey> wow!
[20:25]  * popey helped write a tiny tiny bit of that :)
[20:26] <popey> how many people are involved in that piece of work?
[20:26] <DoruHush> some probles with compilation but we will overcome those
[20:26] <DoruHush> mainly 4
[20:26] <boredandblogging> as the Romanian Team already approached schools?
[20:27] <manuelciosici> yes
[20:27] <DoruHush> without popye  :-D
[20:27] <manuelciosici> I have made a couple of presentations is my school
[20:27] <bvali> hello everybody
[20:27] <manuelciosici> and also convinced some of the teachers to agree to a few ubuntu running pcs
[20:27] <fdd> yes, presentations/installations in schools.
[20:27] <c00l2sv> our school opened on the 1st of Oct
[20:27] <bvali> i have helped classmates to install ubuntu
[20:28] <c00l2sv> so on that day at my faculty at Comp. Science
[20:28] <c00l2sv> we distributed about 70 flyers
[20:28] <juliux> c00l2sv: do you have these flyer online?
[20:28] <alex3f> i'm spreading word about ubuntu at my faculty
[20:28] <c00l2sv> http://www.softwareliber.ro/2008/09/29/promovare-gsl-la-deschiderile-de-la-faculta%c8%9bi/
[20:28] <c00l2sv> juliux, http://www.softwareliber.ro/2008/09/29/promovare-gsl-la-deschiderile-de-la-faculta%c8%9bi/
[20:29] <manuelciosici> and arlug is preparring an mirror for ubuntu (current tests on mirror.arlug.ro)
[20:29] <popey> is there anything in particular you do when new people join?
[20:30] <c00l2sv> popey, well we're holding parties almost every time we know there comming new peoples
[20:30] <manuelciosici> i guess that depends of the region of the country, in my town we invite them to beerfests and offer support for them
[20:30] <c00l2sv> we're going offline to pubs
[20:30] <c00l2sv> or something like that
[20:30] <juliux> btw add your release parties  to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IntrepidReleaseParties#Europe so other people know aobut it
[20:31] <DoruHush> we guide them to join first the localisation team
[20:31] <popey> do many people take part in localisation?
[20:31] <c00l2sv> juliux, we're planning a release party so far, and we're not fully decided when it is going to be held
[20:31] <boredandblogging> it seems like the Romanian team has done lots of work for 8.04
[20:32] <juliux> c00l2sv: ok
[20:32] <DoruHush> if they whant to help with the  Ubuntu localization
[20:32] <boredandblogging> there is not much listed for 7.10, is there any reason for that
[20:32] <c00l2sv> popey, not, sure, we cleaned a bit the translators group on launchpad recently
[20:32] <DoruHush> ﻿popey:  not so many as we wish, that,s why we ask them to join the team
[20:32] <alex3f> we focused on this year activity
[20:32] <DoruHush> and spread the word
[20:33] <manuelciosici> popey: I can't give you exact numbers but as far as i know about 20-30 people are involved in localisation
[20:33] <fdd> yes, the most is done for hardy.
[20:33] <popey> ok
[20:33] <boredandblogging> thats fine, I was just curious
[20:33] <fdd> something like that.
[20:33] <fdd> ok.
[20:33] <DoruHush> we do have an Ubuntu flavor
[20:34] <manuelciosici> there was also a floss camp this summer, I don't think it is listed anywhere in the activities
[20:34] <boredandblogging> +1 from me
[20:34] <DoruHush> http://kiwilinux.org/
[20:34] <juliux> looks like you were very active
[20:34] <janc_EEE_900> manuelciosici: 20-30 is pretty good, if they are all doing good translations
[20:34] <juliux> so from me +1
[20:34] <fdd> yes, kiwilinux. ro/hu oriented distro.
[20:34] <DoruHush> based on Ubuntu 8.04.1 at this time
[20:34] <alex3f> actually, suggestions come from more than 30 people,
[20:34] <juliux> and keep on your good work on releaseparties;)
[20:34] <popey> +1 from me too
[20:34] <janc_EEE_900> +1 from me too
[20:35] <c00l2sv> popey, here are some pics from a party I held supported by Ubuntu tean
[20:35] <c00l2sv> http://stas.nerd.ro/blog/index.php/photos/?album=MeetingInC7
[20:35] <fdd> thanks, juliux.
[20:35] <manuelciosici> janc_EEE_900: not all the time, but that is why the localisation team approves the translations
[20:35] <DoruHush> thank you all
[20:35] <c00l2sv> in a week, there's gonna be held one more one like that
[20:35] <fdd> thank you.
[20:35] <fdd> yes, sfd also.
[20:35] <popey> nice and busy c00l2sv !
[20:36] <c00l2sv> popey, thats what we like to do :)
[20:36] <c00l2sv> thx
[20:36] <juliux> and share your experiences on the loco contact list;)
[20:36] <boredandblogging> Hungary?
[20:36] <phanatic> boredandblogging: we're here
[20:37] <sianis> I'am here
[20:37] <toros> boredandblogging: ready
[20:38] <juliux> how often you have translation sprints? how are your experiences with that?
[20:38] <phanatic> juliux: approximately bi-monthly.
[20:38] <juliux> puhhh
[20:38] <kelemengabor> juliux: 2-3 months
[20:38] <popey> impressive
[20:38] <kelemengabor> preferably before releases :)
[20:39] <popey> does it help?
[20:39] <phanatic> unfortunately the number of active participants is decreasing
[20:39] <kelemengabor> experience is mixed tough
[20:39] <juliux> how many people attend this sprints?
[20:39] <phanatic> popey: it helps a lot with documentations
[20:39] <phanatic> juliux: around 10
[20:39] <phanatic> these are IRL sprints lasting a whole weekend
[20:39] <popey> are people leaving the team or just less people turning up for events?
[20:39] <phanatic> popey: the latter
[20:39] <effie_jayx> Is anything being done to promote participation?
[20:39] <kelemengabor> phanatic: is i18n your job or mine? :P
[20:40] <kelemengabor> well, we decided that IRL meetings are not that good idea
[20:40] <juliux> IRL meetings?
[20:40] <janc_EEE_900> kelemengabor: do you have people at home join in with the sprints?
[20:40] <kelemengabor> sprints, I mean
[20:41] <juliux> kelemengabor: what does irl means?
[20:41] <boredandblogging> in real life
[20:41] <kelemengabor> janc_EEE_900: yes, we allow anybody to join via irc
[20:42] <kelemengabor> that was pushed to the background though
[20:42] <kelemengabor> last time, we got criticism that it's hard to attend for people living far from the capital city
[20:43] <popey> yeah, that affects a lot of teams
[20:43] <kelemengabor> so we will try to make only irc sprints in the future
[20:43] <kelemengabor> and promote it a lot better
[20:44] <boredandblogging> is it possible to do the sprints in different cities?
[20:44] <janc_EEE_900> you can also organise sprints in different cities, and have other people join in through IRC / etc.
[20:44] <janc_EEE_900> hehe
[20:45] <boredandblogging> :-)
[20:45] <effie_jayx> I think promoting irc is good due to the interesting amount of ubuntu work going on around the globe
[20:45] <kelemengabor> well, we could try that too, but I'm skeptical
[20:45] <toros> boredandblogging: I don't think, many people would come to another cities... Hungary is _very_ capital-centric
[20:46] <janc_EEE_900> or combine work & fun: sprint + beer event in the evening
[20:46] <popey> have you had to deal with much in the way of vonflict in the loco team?
[20:46] <popey> er
[20:46] <nxvl> same in Peru, but we make smaller meetings in non-capital cities
[20:46] <popey> conflict
[20:46] <kelemengabor> toros: on the other hand, it can't be worse than it is now
[20:46] <toros> janc_EEE_900: we do it that way... :)
[20:46] <janc_EEE_900> hehe
[20:47] <toros> after the translation sprint, we go straight to have dinner and some beer :)
[20:47] <phanatic> popey: you mean conflicts inside the team?
[20:47] <popey> yes
[20:47] <popey> within your community - differences of opinion for example
[20:48] <toros> thera aren't many conflicts
[20:48] <phanatic> popey: not really. we have to deal with moderation issues mostly (they may cause conflicts) on forums and mailing lists
[20:49] <phanatic> but thats fairly uncommon fortunately
[20:49] <popey> ok, well based on the past and future events, and your consistent approach, +1 from me
[20:50] <janc_EEE_900> good moderators usually don't have a lot of work...   ;)
[20:50] <janc_EEE_900> +1 for ubuntu-hu from me
[20:50] <toros> there were some conflicts at the forum some months ago - so we "hired" moderators from the community. And it worked, because they deal with the conflicts between ppl...
[20:51] <popey> nice
[20:51] <toros> they not just delete inapropiate posts, but help in resolving conflicts
[20:52] <juliux> +1 me for ubuntu-hu
[20:52] <popey> boredandblogging?
[20:53] <popey> effie_jayx
[20:53] <effie_jayx> +1 from me
[20:53] <boredandblogging> +1
[20:54] <phanatic> thank you guys
[20:54] <popey> well done, keep up the good work!
[20:54] <toros> thank you
[20:55] <gsuveg> thank you
[20:55] <boredandblogging> congrats
[20:55] <sianis> thank you
[20:56] <popey> nxvl: you wanted to talk ?
[20:56] <boredandblogging> nxvl?
[20:56] <nxvl> \o/
[20:56] <nxvl> yup
[20:56] <nxvl> i send an e-mail to the loco-council list
[20:57] <nxvl> you might read it
[20:57] <nxvl> should i also explain it here again?
[20:57] <juliux> yes pls;)
[20:57] <nxvl> ok
[20:58] <nxvl> we make a great effort in the LoCo Teams, with the help of the whole community for making the release parties, were we celebrate the release of the new version
[20:58] <popey> basically nxvl  is suggesting a different date for the meeting?
[20:58] <nxvl> and a lot of people ask for it
[20:58] <popey> er party
[20:58] <nxvl> also we have Canonical sending us a LOT of CD's for the release
[20:58] <nxvl> for we use to have the parties before (2 weeks or so) of the arrival of ths shipment
[20:58] <popey> but no way to distribute them as the party was a week ago?
[20:59] <nxvl> so, what i'm proposing is to move the release parties one week or 2, with the commitment from canonical to send the CD's as soon as they can
[20:59] <popey> maybe you could take postage stamps (or equivalent) off people at the party - and post them to them when they arrive?
[20:59] <popey> still have the party on the 30th/1st?
[20:59] <popey> take "orders" at the party I mean
[20:59] <nxvl> in peru i think no, we use to wait a couple of weeks
[21:00] <nxvl> oh, yes
[21:00] <nxvl> popey: that's what we do
[21:00] <nxvl> well, almost
[21:00] <janc_EEE_900> I think people should decide on their own about the party date
[21:00] <popey> ah :)
[21:00] <popey> yeah, whatever works for you
[21:00] <nxvl> we burn a lot of CD's, give them that day
[21:00] <popey> we (UK) dont even talk about CDs at the party, but we are lucky because we have good internet connectivity
[21:00] <janc_EEE_900> some teams already have the party 1-2 weeks after the release
[21:00] <nxvl> and then we start gifting the official CD's in the other local events (which are a lot in this part of the world)
[21:01] <nxvl> popey: well, in peru there is no much people with a good broadband connection, so we use to download the iso, and then start burning like hell
[21:01] <nxvl> we use tu burn 50-100 CD's per event
[21:02] <popey> and that works?
[21:02] <janc_EEE_900> and some teams make their own CDs, which you can do in a couple of days if you are well-prepared...
[21:02] <nxvl> but it will be really nice to have the CD's that dates
[21:02] <nxvl> and i think Canonical marketing team will be interested on the proposal (here i'm assuming)
[21:02] <popey> yeah, official CDs for the party just isnt going to be possible
[21:02] <popey> it doesn't go "gold" until about the day before
[21:03] <popey> i suspect this is a common question
[21:03] <nxvl> popey: yes i know that they can't burn those CD's until the release date, that's quire obvious
[21:03] <popey> i dont mind asking Canonical on your behalf though, or alternatively I can pass you the name/email of the right person?
[21:04] <nxvl> i'm just suggesting to have it as a general rule, if the loco feel like it will we ok for them to make the party 2 weeks after, they do, if not, they don't
[21:04] <popey> the other issue is that there is no guarantee that they _can_ get the CDs to you by the time you have your party
[21:04] <nxvl> but to have it as a suggestion somewhere
[21:04] <nxvl> popey: agreed
[21:04] <popey> as janc_EEE_900 says, it's up to the individual loco in my opinion
[21:04] <popey> if you want a party late, have one late
[21:04] <popey> have one at christmas instead :)
[21:04] <popey> it doesn't _really_ matter when you have a party
[21:05] <nxvl> popey: that's why the commitment of canonical is very important in this, and it's nothing we can decide just here and now, but to start discussing about that
[21:05] <popey> nxvl: I'll mail canonical and cc you on it shall I?
[21:05] <janc_EEE_900> the Ubuntu-be 8.04 modified release party cd-image went gold on a friday morning and was pressed a couple of days later  ;-)
[21:05] <nxvl> popey: sounds good to me
[21:06] <popey> ok, will do tomorrow
[21:06] <nxvl> also, this is not me asking for something, just sending an idea that can be interesting for the canonical marketing team
[21:06] <nxvl> and can have some benefits for ubuntu
[21:06] <juliux> we have pressed ubuntu 6.10 dvds from friday to monday
[21:06] <juliux> and you realy don't want to do that again
[21:07] <nxvl> so receive it as just an idea that can be viable or can be not
[21:07] <juliux> it is a lot of stress
[21:07] <juliux> and you hvae the risk that there is a major bug on the iso:(
[21:07] <nxvl> juliux: 6.10 or 8.10?
[21:07] <janc_EEE_900> juliux: indeed, you have to do all transport yourselves, etc.
[21:07] <juliux> 6.10
[21:08] <nxvl> oh! ok
[21:08] <nxvl> well, that's everything i have
[21:08] <popey> thanks nxvl !
[21:08] <juliux> the release was on a thursday, we send the burned iso via ups overnight express to the producer, he pressed the master dvd on friday, produced 2000 dvds over the weekend end send them us on monday, so we had them on wednesday at the linuxworldexpo
[21:08] <nxvl> i just wanted to discuss this idea with you, since you are the ones to talk
[21:09] <juliux> so you can do that but it is a lot of work
[21:09] <juliux> and you need good planing;)
[21:09] <nxvl> juliux: we go to the event with a laptop and start burning insite
[21:09] <nxvl> i think i have some picture of that
[21:09]  * nxvl searches
[21:09] <juliux> hehe
[21:10] <juliux> we have done this also
[21:10] <juliux> and on some events we had a professional cd burnstation
[21:10] <janc_EEE_900> we do that a lot at computer fairs
[21:10] <popey> nice
[21:10] <boredandblogging> very nice!
[21:10] <nxvl> http://picasaweb.google.com/xander21c/UbuntuPeruEnElFesoli#5131626988519897586
[21:10] <juliux> the burnstation is cool, it burns and prints the label on the cd
[21:10] <nxvl> here they are preparing everything
[21:10] <juliux> and you have to do nothing
[21:11] <juliux> but the burnstation needs a windows pc:(
[21:11] <nxvl> http://picasaweb.google.com/xander21c/UbuntuPeruEnElFesoli#5131630050831579906
[21:11] <nxvl> and that's me burning CD's
[21:11] <juliux> nxvl: hehe
[21:11] <janc_EEE_900> and then give the CD-Rs away but ask for a voluntary monetary gift  ;)
[21:11] <nxvl> all that people were waiting for their CD's
[21:12] <janc_EEE_900> juliux: build your own burn-station with ubuntu  :)
[21:12] <nxvl> janc_EEE_900: here the standard is 2x1
[21:12] <nxvl> janc_EEE_900: you get one burned CD's you give 2 clean CD's
[21:12] <juliux> janc_EEE_900: give me time;)
[21:13] <nxvl> with official CD's we don't do that, or when someone give us CD's as sponsorship
[21:13] <nxvl> then we just gift them
[21:13] <nxvl> until we are about to get out of CD's
[21:13] <nxvl> :D
[21:14] <juliux> so i will levea no the irc
[21:14] <juliux> cu
[21:14] <elendil> bye juliux
[21:14] <emgent> heya
[21:15] <janc_EEE_900> nxvl: we have to pay for the fair booth too, and some people just give us 10 or even 20 euro, which saves our day for those who take dics for free
[21:16] <nxvl> janc_EEE_900: yup, that's why we do the 2x1
[21:16] <effie_jayx> Also consider shipping is all tough
[21:16] <nxvl> janc_EEE_900: is fair for everyone
[21:16] <nxvl> :D
[21:18] <nxvl> well, need to go
[21:18] <nxvl> thank you for your time
[21:18] <janc_EEE_900> and thanks for your proposal
[21:27] <emgent> @schedule
[21:38] <emgent> @schedule
[22:00] <Technoviking> hi all
[22:01] <Technoviking> is any other CC members here
[22:02] <Technoviking> We may not be able to get a quorium today, many CC members are travelling and having family emergencies today.
[22:04] <jussi01> :(
[22:06] <Technoviking> jussi01: yeah sorry, ping the group and see if we can get 3-4 people
[22:07] <jussi01> Technoviking: no matter. just sad when people have family emergencies.
[22:12] <Technoviking> I'm not able to ping anyone else. We will table adgenda to next time.
[22:13] <Technoviking> Sorry about that, promise this is not a trend, we will be back in two weel:)
[22:15] <jussi01> Technoviking: see you then!
[22:17] <cody-somerville> ;]