[00:13] <jtechidna> Riddell or apachelogger: http://paste.ubuntu.com/55817/
[00:13] <jtechidna> or ScottK^
[00:16] <Riddell> jtechidna: onto it
[00:17] <Riddell> jtechidna: there it goes!
[00:18] <jtechidna> kewl
[00:18] <Riddell> seele: did your upgrade go ok?
[00:43] <ryanakca> Riddell: I talked some of the kdegames people, and their opinion seems to be that we should ship the non-scaling deck as default, because if we change it, we're not shipping the ``real'' kdegames, rather, something that looks like it. So I guess we should just patch the rc files in k-d-s?
[00:52] <Riddell> ryanakca: patch it to do what?
[00:54] <jtechidna> Riddell: to use the scalable deck, I presume
[00:55] <ryanakca> Riddell: to use an SVG deck so that the cards scale
[00:55] <ryanakca> or should we just stick to the default and forget about it?
[00:55] <Riddell> but you just said they object to use doing that
[00:56]  * ryanakca nods
[00:56] <Riddell> if it's better and they don't have any actual complaints about it then we should indeed change it :)
[00:56] <ryanakca> hehe, *nod*. That's why they provide configuration files, isn't it? :D
[00:57] <rgreening> :)
[01:00] <jtechidna> ryanakca: it sounds to me like you talked to pino, he hates patches of any form
[01:02] <ryanakca> jtechidna: yes, he was one of them :)
[01:02] <jtechidna> hehe
[01:02] <jtechidna> anyway, don't make them mad or they will rip your head off
[01:06] <jtechidna> Riddell: By the way, that Konsole patch causes bug 279190
[01:09] <rgreening> Riddell: I got koffice2 to compile. It seems some things changed so the install files need tweaking.
[01:11] <jtechidna> rgreening: that happens a lot every alpha release, heh
[01:11] <rgreening> :)
[01:12] <rgreening> it seems karbon had some changes
[01:12] <rgreening> i have to say, I really like pbuilder and pbuilder-hooks... I must thank apachelogger for shoving me in that direction.
[01:13] <Hobbsee> pbuilder hooks rock!
[01:13] <rgreening> yeah. I can see why
[01:41] <seele> Riddell: from alpha 6 to beta or kde4 remix to beta?  i've only done alpha 6 to beta.. i didn't have time to back up my kde4 remix to test the beta upgrade yet
[01:45] <ryanakca> Could someone review http://ryanak.ca/~ryan/kds.bzrbundle please, before I push it to LP?
[02:04] <DaSkreech> shouldn't kdm depend on xterm ?
[02:13] <jtechidna> DaSkreech: funnily enough we were discussing that the other day
[02:13] <jtechidna> dunno what the outcome of the discussion was though, lol
[02:15] <DaSkreech> Well either make it depend on xterm or take out the failsafe login
[02:15] <DaSkreech> one of the two
[02:19] <rgreening> I vote xterm goes it. Prob is setting alternatives correclty for xterm in failsafe... somehow.
[02:19] <jtechidna> apachelogger: preemptive sry for flooding your inbox ;D
[02:19] <rgreening> could do a wrapper
[02:21] <DaSkreech> What are the arguements for not having xterm?
[02:21] <jtechidna> I don't know if there were any actually, heh
[02:22] <DaSkreech> So ... why no instally?
[02:24] <jtechidna> probably an oversight I would guess
[02:25] <DaSkreech> Why does dolphin have the Ubuntu brand on it?
[02:26] <jtechidna> what do you mean?
[02:27] <jtechidna> screenshot maybe?
[02:27] <DaSkreech> The back and forward buttons are Ubuntu circle of friendship rings on my install of Ibex
[02:27] <DaSkreech> You know what
[02:27] <DaSkreech> never mind
[02:28] <jtechidna> \o/
[02:28] <DaSkreech> X has been screwing with me all day
[02:28] <DaSkreech> It's probably moving stuff around just to get me looking thn it will knife me in the groin
[02:28] <DaSkreech> The logout buttons are all little computer screens
[02:29] <jtechidna> haha
[02:29] <DaSkreech> Ok
[02:29] <DaSkreech> Time for my heroic attempt to merge .kde4 and .kde
[02:30] <jtechidna> good luck
[02:34] <txwikinger> DaSkreech: I am interested in the result :)
[02:35] <jtechidna> actually I'm pretty much using a .kde dating from fiesty-> hardy with .kde4 components from hardy-kde4
[02:35] <jtechidna> should go pretty smoothly
[02:35] <DaSkreech> Right now I'm doing apps that I need to move
[02:35] <DaSkreech>  Kopete is easy
[02:35] <DaSkreech> I'm orried about akregator
[02:35] <jtechidna> ya, akregator isn't doing to well even with fresh configs
[02:36] <jtechidna> we get the most bug reports for akregator out of all the kdepim apps
[02:36] <DaSkreech> Serious?
[02:36] <DaSkreech> Do we hav usage stats?
[02:36] <jtechidna> not really
[02:36] <DaSkreech> I still wish that Ubuntu would use smolt :(
[02:36] <DaSkreech> I'd suspect it's the most use kdepim app
[02:37]  * jtechidna would guess kontact or kmail was
[02:37]  * DaSkreech would guess kmail is second
[02:38] <jtechidna> I use Firefox live bookmarks for the few RSS feeds I read
[02:39]  * DaSkreech stays the long curseword away from Firefox
[02:39]  * jtechidna is using a combination of gtk-qt-engine plus a hacked-together firefox theme to make firefox look somewhat presentable
[02:41] <DaSkreech> I don't care about how it looks it's eats RAM like no tomorrow
[02:41] <DaSkreech> And that plus KDE4 = assured failure
[02:42] <jtechidna> Firefox 3 is using less memory these days
[02:43] <DaSkreech> ya
[02:43] <DaSkreech> Still too much
[02:43] <jtechidna> about the same as konq for me *shrugs*
[02:45] <DaSkreech> Yeah except that it hits that with 6 tabs in Firefox and with 18 tabs in Konq
[02:46] <DaSkreech> jtechidna: why does kdm recommend logrotate?
[02:46] <jtechidna> uh, dunno
[02:47] <yuriy> jtechidna: i use it for some sites but it still leaks memory here, I have to restart it occasionally
[02:49] <jtechidna> This graph is looking very nice: http://status.qa.ubuntu.com/qapkgstatus/kdebase
[02:49] <jtechidna> :)
[02:51] <yuriy> wooow
[02:51] <ScottK> DaSkreech: Because it logs stuff?
[02:51] <yuriy> jtechidna: I am so impressed by all the work you guys have been doing while I've been pretty much AWOL
[02:51] <DaSkreech> ScottK: So... by that logic wouldn't the kernel need logrotate?
[02:52] <ScottK> Dunno.  Does it recommend it too?
[02:52]  * DaSkreech ponders how thunderbird got installed on the computer
[02:52] <ScottK> Personally I think logrotate is a good thing.
[02:52]  * ScottK wishes logrotate would rotate the .Xsessions error log.
[02:54] <DaSkreech> ScottK: /etc/logrotate.conf
[02:54]  * ScottK marks that in TODO
[02:55] <DaSkreech> ScottK: It doesn't btw
[02:56] <ScottK> Oh.
[02:57] <DaSkreech> I wonder how I do a reverse look up for apt
[02:57] <DaSkreech> rdepends ?
[02:57] <ScottK> jtechidna: Please update your blog post.  It seems my characterization of superm1 as having 'shrugged' on IRC was incorrect.  Now that he's fixed kdebluetooth and is looking at solid-bluetooth, I think it ought to be mentioned.
[02:58] <jtechidna> ScottK: ok, will do
[02:58] <ScottK> Thanks.
[03:00] <jtechidna> Would be very unfair to him otherwise
[03:02] <ScottK> Right.  Additionally, the last thing I want to do is piss him off when he's fixing stuff of ours.
[03:02] <jtechidna> that too ;D
[03:05] <jtechidna> yuriy: Have you seen this: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+upstreamreport Pretty interesting/helpful
[03:11]  * Jucato pets jtechidna and jjesse :)
[03:13] <jtechidna> :)
[03:14] <Hobbsee> Jucato: hah. nice reply.
[03:14] <Jucato> :)
[03:16] <jtechidna> hehe, that mpt guy was a prick
[03:16] <jtechidna> I bet he thought he was tough for calling me out on a semantics issue
[03:16] <Jucato> but he was half right :P
[03:16] <jtechidna> Well, then Canoncial people should stop pretending to support us equally
[03:17] <jtechidna> if that really is the case
[03:18] <jtechidna> too much blame game, and eventually it all gets shifted on to us for not having enough manpower
[03:18] <jtechidna> everybody tries to save face
[03:18] <Jucato> I'm quite amused that history is repeating itself in a  one year cycle :P
[03:19] <jtechidna> oh well, I'll just keep trying as hard as I can
[03:19] <jtechidna> and call out marketing BS when I see it ;D
[03:19] <Jucato> yep. don't get discouraged. just think of Kubuntu as a community-driven distro and filter out any marketing crap :)
[03:19] <Jucato> there is one thing I was never able to filter out though... which drove me insane :)
[03:20] <jtechidna> what was that?
[03:20] <Jucato> no matter what you do, Kubuntu users will presume that Ubuntu and Kubuntu are equal :)
[03:20] <Jucato> and they'll expect the same level of "polish" whichever way you turn
[03:21] <claydoh> actually, in some cases maybe more :(
[03:21] <jtechidna> I think next cycle we'll make some strides in QA if our bug triaging work keeps up, so there's hope for improvement
[03:21] <Jucato> I never succeeded in getting the truth across :)
[03:21] <Jucato> claydoh: right :)
[03:22] <claydoh> at least in k-f-n they *seem* to understand better
[03:22] <jtechidna> probably because KDE > Gnome, and if Ubuntu is more polished than Ubuntu it's like saying Gnome is better than KDE
[03:22] <claydoh> or lese they keep themselves quiet
[03:22] <vorian> evening
[03:22] <Jucato> KFN is relatively low traffic compared to IRC :P
[03:22] <claydoh> I was thinking k-u mailing list latey (again)
[03:23] <jtechidna> I never read k-u, lol
[03:23] <Jucato> bah! I left k-u ML :)
[03:23] <claydoh> jtechidna: i wouldn't recommend it
[03:23] <claydoh> unless you want a fight, then have the thread hijacked 3 ways
[03:24] <claydoh> and thatis not an exagertion
[03:25] <jtechidna> well, even if I read it on the web archives I'd never post there :P
[03:25] <Jucato> claydoh: don't you mean 4 ways? :)
[03:25] <claydoh> Jucato: I stopped counting
[03:25] <Jucato> hehehe
[03:25]  * Hobbsee just moderates the rotten thing.
[03:26] <Jucato> jtechidna: I just hope that after all has been said and done, you won't lose enthusiasm for Kubuntu. it needs people, desperately :)
[03:26] <claydoh> but if you want some serioius kubuntu dev-bashing, then  thats your place
[03:26] <claydoh> +1
[03:26] <jtechidna> Jucato: don't worry, I'm just getting started. This just fired me up more :D
[03:26] <Jucato> jtechidna: good :)
[03:27]  * Jucato was actually happy to see new people getting involved a few months ago.. new blood
[03:27] <Jucato> ^,..,^
[03:28] <jtechidna> lol @ ascii vampire
[03:29] <DaSkreech> Ha ha
[03:29] <Jucato> :P
[03:29] <Jucato> yo DaSkreech
[03:29] <DaSkreech> Yo my man :)
[03:32] <jtechidna> On the kubuntu forums today I saw somebody who ditched Hardy for Gutsy test Intrepid
[03:32] <jtechidna> He liked Intrepid, I was suprised
[03:32]  * Jucato is scared to upgrade to Intrepid...
[03:33] <Jucato> but mea culpa for probably not reporting the "bug"
[03:34] <Hobbsee> which bug?
[03:35] <DaSkreech> I'm on it now
[03:35] <DaSkreech>  it sucks
[03:35] <Hobbsee> why?
[03:35] <Jucato> I can no longer enable deskto effects on my laptop. if I do, X crashes
[03:35] <DaSkreech> X hangs every 1/2 hour
[03:35] <Hobbsee> ouch, why?
[03:35] <DaSkreech> I don't know
[03:36] <DaSkreech> It's been doing that since the first day I installed Gutsy
[03:36] <DaSkreech> but now it's just a lot more frequent
[03:36] <DaSkreech>  running desktop effects doesn't help
[03:36] <Jucato> me it only happens in intrepid... I'm guessing new X or intel driver
[03:36] <Jucato> which sucks.. because KWin effects should be performing much better on my laptop than on my desktop :)
[03:37] <DaSkreech> I hate the new X :(
[03:37] <DaSkreech> I get what they are trying to do but can't they do that in a branch?
[03:40] <jtechidna> New X broke compat with the legacy nvidia driver for me, that's about the worst thing about Intrepid for me
[03:40] <Jucato> ah well, nvidia is t3h @#@(!!(#%$_! on KDE 4 anyway )
[03:40] <Jucato> but intel? c'mon!! it should work!! :D
[03:41] <dstambou> nvidia isn't bad now, with the new nvidia driver
[03:41] <jtechidna> actually legacy nvidia worked better than the hottest card on the market
[03:41] <dstambou> released a few days ago
[03:41] <dstambou> *brand new nvidia
[03:41] <jtechidna> it didn't offer 2D accell in the first place ;D
[03:57] <DaSkreech> kwin: X Error (error: <unknown>[DAMAGE+0], request: XDamageDestroy[DAMAGE+2], resource: 0x4e1a464)
[03:57] <DaSkreech> I'm getting that a few dozen time
[04:09] <DaSkreech> Anyone tried Quicksand yet?
[04:44] <gnomefreak> anyone have grub splash lines in thier /boot/grub/menu.lst i lost mine
[07:53] <jussi01> Morning all
[07:55] <jussi01> Got a quick bug confirmation if someone can help? In adept, when you upgrade, try viewing the package being upgraded, then clicking the "more" link at the end of the description. does it work? (it doesnt for me)
[08:15] <apachelogger> oh my
[08:16] <apachelogger> jtechidna: did you have to go there again
[08:16]  * apachelogger senses an inbalance in the karma
[08:17] <apachelogger> something in my network stack is broken
[08:17] <apachelogger> it can't connect to certain ips anymore
[08:18] <Jucato> apachelogger: nah. history just repeating itself after 1 year :)
[08:18] <apachelogger> we are stuck in a loop
[08:18] <apachelogger> omg!
[08:19] <apachelogger> evolution looks different I guess
[08:19] <Jucato> we'll see if october 2009 will have the same thing :)
[08:22] <apachelogger> hm, quassel needs a go to DATE and TIME feature
[08:22] <apachelogger> scrolling backlog in #kubuntu is highly unefficient
[08:22] <_StefanS_> morning
[08:22]  * davmor2 trips apachelogger so he falls outta the loop
[08:23] <apachelogger> good morning _StefanS_
[08:23] <apachelogger> davmor2: ey! don't mess with the loop!
[08:23] <apachelogger> I guess it is caused by bouncing karma anyway
[08:24] <Jucato> yo _StefanS_!! long time :)
[08:25] <Jucato> apachelogger: can't you Ctrl+F in Quassel then find based on timestamp?
[08:25] <_StefanS_> Jucatohh!
[08:25] <Jucato> :D
[08:25] <apachelogger> Riddell: btw, neon will switch to intrepid about a week before release
[08:25] <_StefanS_> Jucato: indeed... ! hows the c++ coding treating you ?
[08:25] <apachelogger> Jucato: no
[08:26] <apachelogger> Jucato: most of the backlog is at the server, so the client would require an interface to directly query the log without going through the whole view the log in my buffer stack thing
[08:27] <Jucato> aah
[08:29]  * apachelogger just had the most awesome ida
[08:29] <apachelogger> *idea
[08:29] <Jucato> I thought IDE :)
[08:29] <apachelogger> Sput: we shall all reunite with debian and go to war against MS, now that their economy is failing they are weak and vulnerable
[08:29] <apachelogger> we could take WD
[08:29] <apachelogger> once and for all
[08:29]  * _StefanS_ wonders why source for kdebluetooth has unresolved dependencies
[08:30] <Jucato> _StefanS_: C++ is treating me fine.. C didnt :)
[08:30] <Jucato> actually I need to review my C++ because of 5 months of C :P
[08:30]  * apachelogger shudders because of C
[08:30]  * apachelogger also shudders because of 192 unread mails aggregated in 12 hours
[08:30] <Jucato> heheh it was a Principles of Programming class...
[08:30] <Jucato> using Turbo C :)
[08:31] <_StefanS_> good to hear, unfortunately I have not been doing much coding related
[08:32] <Jucato> _StefanS_: neither have I. the past weeks spent outisde of class was spent on UserBase :)
[08:33] <apachelogger> you know, I always tell people to go check the userbase, and I haven't been there since it was named userbase :S
[08:33] <Jucato> heheh
[08:34]  * Jucato hopes that one day it will become as great at ubuntu's community docs...
[08:35] <_StefanS_> Jucato: could you try to do a apt-get source kdebluetooth, and then try to retrieve the build-deps for it?
[08:35] <Jucato> _StefanS_: I'm not on intrepid. coz I can't enable desktop effects on intrepid, I decided to go back to hardy :)
[08:36] <apachelogger> Jucato: as long as it stays more understandible ;-)
[08:36] <Jucato> hahah :)
[08:36] <apachelogger> oh and as long as it doens't break login for almost 3 months :P
[08:37] <Jucato> um...
[08:37] <Jucato> it breaks login daily :)
[08:38] <apachelogger> nice :D
[08:38] <Jucato> I'll have to ask danimo about it. it's terribly annoying
[08:38] <_StefanS_> Jucato: uhm ok, I will just try it off an iso instead I might have corrupted my own installation (very likely)
[08:38] <Jucato> _StefanS_: ok. sorry :/
[08:39] <apachelogger> _StefanS_: looks pretty right to me
[08:40] <_StefanS_> apachelogger: does yours download ppa1 named packages?
[08:40] <apachelogger> nope
[08:40] <_StefanS_> apachelogger: I might have some screwup there i think
[08:40] <_StefanS_> ah.
[08:40] <apachelogger> _StefanS_: what packages in particular?
[08:41] <_StefanS_> 2secs
[08:41]  * apachelogger gets grumpy because he can't connect to his media server
[08:42] <_StefanS_> apachelogger: kdebluetooth requires kdebase-workspace-dev, but it has deps on libstrigiqtdbusclient (ibstrigiqtdbusclient-dev: Depends: libstrigiqtdbusclient0 (= 0.5.11-1) but 0.5.11-1ubuntu0~hardy0~ppa1 is to be installed)
[08:43] <apachelogger> ohh
[08:43] <apachelogger> yeah
[08:43] <apachelogger> we should fix that
[08:43] <_StefanS_> not sure if kdebase-workspace-dev is still a valid package
[08:43] <apachelogger> _StefanS_: I think it doesn't really matter if strigi is the hardy or the intrepid version
[08:43] <apachelogger> at least not for compiling
[08:43] <apachelogger> anyway
[08:43]  * apachelogger is wondering how to fix that
[08:44] <_StefanS_> so the build requirements is just wrong in kdebase-workspace-dev ?
[08:44] <apachelogger> _StefanS_: sudo apt-get install libstrigiqtdbusclient0=0.5.11-1
[08:44] <apachelogger> well, no
[08:44] <apachelogger> the strigi version in the hardy ppa > the strigi version in intrepid
[08:44] <_StefanS_> trying that now
[08:44] <_StefanS_> ah
[08:45] <_StefanS_> oh my it worked
[08:45] <apachelogger> Riddell: I guess we should just do a rebuild as ubuntu1 to supersed the ppa version ^
[08:48]  * apachelogger just fixed his routing table and is all happy about the access to his media server \o/
[08:50]  * _StefanS_ wonders where all the virtual machines went..
[08:50] <_StefanS_> ick.
[08:51] <apachelogger> hehe, I was wondering that yesterday, then I noticed I was logged in as wrong user ;-)
[08:53] <_StefanS_> :)
[08:53] <_StefanS_> I used to have a rhel4 installation with oracle on it.. I must have forgot a backup somewhere because its just gone.
[08:53] <_StefanS_> eww
[09:32] <yao_ziyuan> there may be a bug in kdm: if i lock screen and wait for the screen to turn black, after a while the Oxygen welcome screen will flash in and out periodically
[09:36] <apachelogger> yao_ziyuan: report a bug
[09:39] <_StefanS_> apachelogger: the bluetooth issue currently, is it kdebluetooth or solid that arent compatible with the latest api changes?
[09:40] <_StefanS_> looks to me that solid does recognize blueZ
[09:41] <apachelogger> _StefanS_: *shrug* Riddell and ScottK would know
[09:41] <_StefanS_> apachelogger: uhm ok
[09:41] <apachelogger> but AFAIK it's solid, at least they were talking about backporting solid 4.2 yesterday
[09:44] <_StefanS_> apachelogger: ok, maybe thats the way to go then..
[09:44] <_StefanS_> Riddell: any comments ? ^
[09:45]  * apachelogger notes that the backports from 4.2 included so far are not promising good quality of solid-bluze :P
[09:45] <_StefanS_> ick..
[09:46] <_StefanS_> not much hope it seems
[09:55] <apachelogger> kde rev 866736
[09:57] <apachelogger> kde bug 171870
[09:58]  * apachelogger switches to core-dev mode and fixes kde4libs
[10:04] <apachelogger> -(~/src/deb/libs/kde4libs-4.1.2:$)-> quilt import -p3 ../kubuntu_900_fix_kdedglobalaccel_crashes.diff
[10:04] <apachelogger> Importing patch ../kubuntu_900_fix_kdedglobalaccel_crashes.diff (stored as kubuntu_900_fix_kdedglobalaccel_crashes.diff)
[10:04] <apachelogger> I love quilt
[11:09] <ScottK> apachelogger: I think superm1 was looking at patching our current solid.
[11:09] <ScottK> He fixed kdebluetooth yesterday.
[11:12] <Riddell> ScottK: I'll be impressed if he manages that.  where's his kdebluetooth patch?
[11:14] <Riddell> apachelogger: which ppa has the strigi with version > intrepid?
[11:18] <ScottK> Riddell: He uploaded it.  It's at least not crashing.
[11:19] <ScottK> Not working though.
[11:19] <ScottK> Riddell: I have the impression he's quite familiar with the API changes, so maybe he has a shot at it.
[11:27] <Riddell> and now wired networking is broken with network manager?
[11:32] <ScottK> Not 100% broken
[11:32] <Riddell> ScottK: how is it broken then?
[11:32] <ScottK> rgreening is the expert on that one though.
[11:32] <ScottK> Testing right now.
[11:32] <Riddell> rgreening: what have you discovered?
[11:33] <Riddell> it doen't work for me :(
[11:33] <ScottK> Riddell: Then Bug #280919 is what you'll want.
[11:41] <apachelogger> Riddell: kde4
[11:50] <apachelogger> oh well
[11:51] <apachelogger> now I hate apparmor and network-manager
[11:51]  * apachelogger fixes his route again
[11:59] <Riddell> oh well, my ethernet is broken, nothing to do with network-manager for me
[12:09] <Riddell> apachelogger: I agree uploading the strigi build with bumped version is the thing to do
[12:52] <Riddell> apachelogger: that quilt import command, where does it put the patch?
[13:10] <apachelogger> Riddell: the patch directory
[13:10] <apachelogger> I usually ln -s debian/patches
[13:10] <apachelogger> and remove it when I am doing
[13:12] <apachelogger> *done even
[13:17] <Riddell> apachelogger: oh aye, there it is
[13:24] <apachelogger> Nightrose: what to write about amarok2 b2?
[13:24] <Nightrose> apachelogger: for which page?
[13:24] <apachelogger> kubuntu
[13:25] <Nightrose> switch to mysqle, librivox, lots of other bugfixes, near final release of 2.0
[13:26]  * apachelogger senses copynpaste
[13:49] <apachelogger> Nightrose: http://www.kubuntu.org/node/49
[13:51]  * apachelogger demands one-click-install
[13:52] <Nightrose> apachelogger: :*
[13:52] <apachelogger> \o/
[13:53] <apachelogger> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Repositories/Kubuntu needs an update
[13:59] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: irt bug 280355, do you think KDE is going to implement a fake effect for non-compositing?
[14:03] <rgreening> good day all
[14:03] <JontheEchidna> good morning
[14:04] <rgreening> Riddell: For some reason it stopped working right after install of the n-m updates. However this am, it seems I can connect (though I haven't rebooted - I suspended and connected to a new wored connect ok). I need to reboot to verify if still broken.
[14:04] <rgreening> Riddell: koffice2 done. Will send diff shortly.
[14:13] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: no, and I think it doens't make any sense
[14:13] <apachelogger> either absolutely fancy or not fancy at all
[14:13] <apachelogger> looks much worse with fake fade
[14:14] <apachelogger> we had that in KDE 3, made always feel dizzy
[14:14] <apachelogger> +me somewhere
[14:15] <rgreening> Hobbsee: koffice2 wasn't bad - just long to compile :)
[14:17] <Hobbsee> rgreening: that's the usual bad thing about it, yes :)
[14:17] <Hobbsee> rgreening: that, and it takes ages to recompile, if it breaks at the end.
[14:17] <Hobbsee> although, ccache certainly helps.
[14:18] <rgreening> Hobbsee: apachelogger pointed me to pbuilder-hooks. That helps ALOT. as when it broke, I got dropped to a shell and was able to fix/proceed from where it died. Thanks apachelogger.
[14:19] <apachelogger> you're welcome :)
[14:19] <Hobbsee> rgreening: that's true :)
[14:19] <rgreening> I'll never leave /home without it.
[14:20] <rgreening> ok... so what needs doing next?
[14:21] <apachelogger> Riddell: bug 278634 ... how did KDE 3 handle that?
[14:22] <apachelogger> Riddell: bug 281218 also looks like fun
[14:25] <apachelogger> wth
[14:26] <apachelogger> kde4libs_4.1.2-0ubuntu4.dsc: Version older than that in the archive. 4:4.1.2-0ubuntu4 <= 4:4.1.2-0ubuntu5
[14:26]  * apachelogger kicks konqueror
[14:26] <apachelogger> hm
[14:27]  * apachelogger is wondering how Riddell got from ubuntu3 to ubuntu5 :P
[14:27] <rgreening> are we reverting the kwin_branch patch? Cause my screen updates are abysmal
[14:27] <apachelogger> again?
[14:28] <apachelogger> rgreening: are you sure it's caused by the kwin patch?
[14:29] <rgreening> Well, it was gone when it was removed. It was back when re-added. I can make a manual build and try again just to re-verify... but I'mm 99 and 44/100's % certain.
[14:29] <rgreening> :)
[14:30] <rgreening> JontheEchidna was seeing it also. Jon?
[14:30] <JontheEchidna> yeah, I was seeing it
[14:30]  * apachelogger needs to poke jr, but jr is never around :S
[14:31]  * apachelogger thinks jr and jonny boy just stole his upload :P
[14:31] <apachelogger> rgreening, JontheEchidna: prepare a debdiff and give it some testing
[14:31] <JontheEchidna> oh yeah, I did to a kde4libs upload last nigh
[14:31] <JontheEchidna> s/to/do
[14:32] <JontheEchidna> not to say that I actually uploaded it either :P
[14:32] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: bug 281088
[14:32] <Riddell> hmm, seems I didn't upload ubuntu4
[14:32] <apachelogger> since when does kded4 live in runtime?
[14:32] <apachelogger> Riddell: you did, but I think you immediately superseded it
[14:32] <rgreening> more like Rum time
[14:32] <apachelogger> or you didn't upload it individually and just built on top of it
[14:32] <apachelogger> eitherway, cups and kded crash fixed
[14:33] <apachelogger> rgreening: kded4 might be slightly unstable but I really wouldn't claim that it is an alcoholic
[14:33] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: whoa, it's in kde4libs
[14:33] <JontheEchidna> my bad
[14:34] <Riddell> apachelogger: on https://launchpad.net/bugs/278634 KDE uses translations if kdelibs4.mo is installed
[14:35] <rgreening> apachelogger: maybe it's all the repaints, cause I'm swaying like a drunk trying to move windows to make them refresh
[14:36] <apachelogger> Riddell: hm, makes sense I guess
[14:36] <apachelogger> rgreening: sounds like some fun time ;-)
[14:38] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: bug 239645
[14:38] <apachelogger> won't fix, invalid, reassign, burn compiz?
[14:41]  * JontheEchidna was afk, laundry
[14:41] <JontheEchidna> All of the above!
[14:42] <apachelogger> Can't connect to the database.
[14:42] <apachelogger> bko is getting more broken everyday
[14:43] <apachelogger> I have great hope that bugzilla eventually explodes and somone comes up with a more usable bts :P
[14:47] <apachelogger> Nightrose: did I mention that the amarok2 playlist in combination with dynamic playlists is a lot too slow for my liking?
[14:48] <Nightrose> apachelogger: huh?
[14:48] <Nightrose> works ok here
[14:49] <apachelogger> it works, but at no reasonable speed :P
[14:51] <blizzz> apachelogger: will amarok 1.4 be default in intrepid?
[14:51] <apachelogger> yes
[14:51] <blizzz> ty
[14:52] <apachelogger> if ubuntu doesn't break something underlying
[14:52] <apachelogger> xine didn't break in a long time, about time again
[15:03] <rgreening> Python 2.6 is out... are we including in Intrepid? or leaving for now?
[15:04] <ScottK> Leaving it.
[15:04] <apachelogger> we are too close to release to mess with that kind of stuff
[15:05] <ScottK> There are python 3.0 packages though
[15:06] <txwikinger> bad, bad, bad intrepid ... :)
[15:10] <ScottK> rgreening: Did you see the information wanted in the knetworkmanager bug?
[15:11] <rgreening> not yet. I'll reboot and try from scratch and update bug.
[15:11] <ScottK> OK.
[15:15] <txwikinger> I presume it is normal that kubuntu intrepid starts without any networks enabled :)
[15:16] <Riddell> seems to be the norm for knetworkmanager 0.7
[15:20] <txwikinger> very odd usage of the middle scroll button in KDE4
[15:20] <txwikinger> that is probably an xorg problem
[15:20] <Riddell> what is?
[15:21] <txwikinger> well.. I used to be able to scroll with it on the laptop
[15:21] <txwikinger> No it is the middle button but only for down
[15:21] <txwikinger> Now
[15:22] <ScottK> Riddell: What does it mean with knetworkmanager shows me a little green globe instead of a regular icon (wireless network is up and running)?
[15:25] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: Please look at your triaging of Bug 145337 again.  He says in the bug it works with guidance.
[15:26] <txwikinger> According to my e-mails, I made a couple of billion $s today again :D
[15:26] <Riddell> ScottK: that usually means it thinks the network isn't connected
[15:26] <ScottK> Riddell: The tooltip says wlan0 is active and there's a checkmark next to the ap in the u/i.
[15:27] <ScottK> Weird
[15:28] <ScottK> So I deactivated the connection and reactivated it and I get the regular strength bars back.
[15:28] <Riddell> phew
[15:29] <ScottK> Riddell: I suspect it's activated, but not by that instance of k-nm.  I'd just restarted X so it seems it's not recognizing a pre-existing connection completely.
[15:29] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: got a debdiff for kwin yet?
[15:31] <rgreening> ScottK: works for me now. weird... maybe a stale resolve.conf entry or something...
[15:31] <txwikinger> My knetworkmanager is not even running
[15:31] <apachelogger> Riddell: any reason we wouldn't want KDM to prefer the user image resource over the administrator's? ... for bug 280746
[15:31] <rgreening> I have the vpn and resolvconf package. I'm going to remove them and try some more testing
[15:32]  * jussi01 hugs JontheEchidna - every bug I seem to report you hit! :D
[15:34] <Riddell> apachelogger: not that I know of
[15:34] <apachelogger> ok
[15:34] <apachelogger> testbuilding
[15:35] <apachelogger> Riddell: btw, did you try the window background color I suggested?
[15:37] <rgreening> txwikinger: do you get any errors to indicate whats happening with knm
[15:37] <Riddell> apachelogger: no I don't think I saw that
[15:38] <apachelogger> Riddell: #E9E8E8
[15:39] <apachelogger> it's pretty much inbetween oxygen and the current window background color
[15:39] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: nope, haven't done anything with it yet
[15:39] <txwikinger> rgreening: It say in the popup-menu "NetworkManager is not running"
[15:40] <txwikinger> I have not gotten to a deeper analysis
[15:40] <txwikinger> Where should I look?
[15:40] <Riddell> apachelogger: good with me, want to put it in k-d-s or shall I?
[15:40] <apachelogger> Riddell: please do if you have time
[15:41]  * apachelogger is trying to reproduce a weird kdm issue
[15:43] <rgreening> ScottK: it's weird. My net works fine now...
[15:44] <rgreening> hrm
[16:00]  * rgreening is going to remove the kwin_branch pach from his kdebase-workspace and pin it! The repaint issue is beyond annoying for me
[16:01] <Riddell> I've not been getting that, I wonder if it only happens after a suspend
[16:08] <rgreening> Nope. I just clean booted and got it happening
[16:09] <rgreening> Maybe it's Intel/Mesa related. Anyone else with an Intel GM
[16:09] <apachelogger> Riddell: jtv now closed the rosetta affect of bug 278634
[16:09]  * apachelogger is getting confused
[16:10]  * _gunni_ has an intel gma 3100 ... whats the topic?
[16:10] <rgreening> _gunni_: do you see any repaint issues?
[16:10] <apachelogger> rgreening: doesn't happen here
[16:10] <apachelogger> then again I didn't supsend :P
[16:10] <rgreening> I see it from a clean boot
[16:11] <_gunni_> rgreening: You mean like stripes and glitches on window painting? Yes.
[16:11] <rgreening> Ok, so its not just me
[16:11] <_gunni_> I see them on intel and nvidia
[16:11]  * rgreening looks for ScottK.. ditch the wiki, it's not only me
[16:11]  * apachelogger only gets an uber glitched desktop from time to time
[16:11] <_gunni_> I filed a bug about that, dont know if in launchpad or kde ... i will have a look
[16:12] <rgreening> I can reproduce it. move a bunch of window foreground to back ground or min/max and it will happen
[16:12] <rgreening> Before the kwin_branch patch, it never happened. ever.
[16:12] <_gunni_> rgreening: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=169106
[16:12] <apachelogger> indeed
[16:12] <apachelogger> very reproducible
[16:12] <apachelogger> not as random as I thought
[16:14] <_gunni_> rgreening: For me it seems like on heavy load its more visible. i.e. open some programs quick, and the odd rendering is more visible, because it stays longer
[16:14] <rgreening> _gunni_: I get that too. but the bug I am talking about is different (though maybe related).
[16:15] <rgreening> before the patch, I got what was in that bug, but only on opening new windows/menus. and appears a corruption. What I am seeing now is a pure repain issue (no corruption). THe repaint/refresh is simply not happening
[16:16] <rgreening> apachelogger: so, you see the repaint (delayed repaint) issue correct?
[16:16] <_gunni_> rgreening: a ok, then its different, but for me the corruption is still there
[16:16] <apachelogger> rgreening: on the desktop, yes
[16:16] <rgreening> I still get the corruption, but it's an upstream issue. the repaint is purely ours.
[16:16] <rgreening> and appears with the kwin_branch patch.
[16:19] <ScottK> Riddell: Is there some kind of build-prep I need to run for a new Guidance release?
[16:21] <Riddell> ScottK: there's a new guidance release?
[16:21] <Riddell> it's python, shouldn't be any build-prep
[16:21] <ScottK> Riddell: 4.1.2 never got uploaded.
[16:21] <ScottK> OK.  I'll go figure out what other brain-dead thing I did then.
[16:21] <ScottK> Thanks.
[16:22] <ScottK> I've got that and rgreening's die nice if hal is absent patch.
[16:22] <rgreening> Riddell: I'm testing a rebuild of kdebase-workspace without kwin branch.
[16:22] <rgreening> Riddell: If that fixes, we need to look at backing it out or looking for a """"real"""" fix
[16:23] <rgreening> oh, and Riddell, you get the koffice2 for upload?
[16:23] <Riddell> rgreening: you'll need to edit the .install files since there's a few files that patch adds (debuild -nc is your friend for restarting the build without a clean)
[16:23] <rgreening> yep. done
[16:23] <rgreening> :)
[16:23] <Riddell> rgreening: I agree about backing it out (unfortunately)
[16:23] <rgreening> Im ahead of that one
[16:23] <Riddell> rgreening: yes, in my inbox, it's not out until next week so I guess we shouldn't upload it until then
[16:24] <rgreening> Riddell: me 2. I may look at modding it after I remove it to test
[16:24] <Riddell> or maybe upload to kubuntu-experimental, but I'm not a member of that
[16:24] <rgreening> Riddell: I may be able to pull out the cube and add that to current without all the other stuff they changed
[16:25] <JontheEchidna> rgreening: if you remove the kwin branch could you re-add the tooltip previews in a different branch? It just requires uncommenting the window preview stuff in cmakelists
[16:25] <JontheEchidna> *different patch
[16:25] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: wait.. there's something in the kwin branch patch for the tooltips?
[16:26] <JontheEchidna> well, sorta
[16:26] <JontheEchidna> I uncommented the window-preview-on-tooltips effect in cmakelists.txt
[16:26] <rgreening> and that's in the kwin_branch patch
[16:27] <JontheEchidna> yeah, thinking back it wasn't that smart of a move...
[16:27] <rgreening> nope
[16:27] <JontheEchidna> should have been a separate patch applied after the kwin_branch one
[16:27] <rgreening> should of patch it after
[16:27] <JontheEchidna> yeah
[16:27] <rgreening> :)
[16:27] <rgreening> ok, I'll deal with that
[16:27] <rgreening> :P
[16:27] <JontheEchidna> thanks ^^
[16:27] <rgreening> np
[16:29] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: do you have an exact diff for what you added to it?
[16:29] <rgreening> just want to make sure I get it all
[16:29]  * JontheEchidna looks
[16:30] <rgreening> that would be cool
[16:30] <rgreening> :)
[16:30] <rgreening> brb
[16:33] <JontheEchidna> rgreening: basically this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/56023/
[16:33] <JontheEchidna> then add
[16:33] <JontheEchidna> usr/share/kde4/services/kwin/taskbarthumbnail.desktop
[16:33] <JontheEchidna> to kde-window-manager.install
[16:45] <rgreening> k.
[16:45] <rgreening> ty
[16:50] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: would it be best to add that to the plasma tooltip patch?
[16:50]  * rgreening thinks so
[16:50] <JontheEchidna> that would make sense
[16:50]  * rgreening says "make it so number one"
[16:50] <rgreening> :)
[16:57] <ScottK> Would one of you KDE ninjas please look at Klamav and figure why it disappeared out of the K menu (or maybe it's just me)?
[16:58]  * rgreening whips out nunchucks and bonks ScottK on the head and exclaims "now who needs a wiki"
[16:59] <ScottK> rgreening: Is it there for you?
[16:59] <txwikinger> rgreening: Where can I find information about problems of knetworkmanager?
[16:59] <rgreening> 1 sec.. let me install
[16:59] <rgreening> txwikinger: well, it's a SuSE developed app...
[17:00]  * txwikinger thought he uses Kubuntu :D
[17:00] <rgreening> yeah... but the community shares everything. It's like a big communal cesspool of code (tm) (c) rgreening
[17:01] <Riddell> ryanakca: did the shop page disappear from the kubuntu website?
[17:01] <rgreening> kubotu: fact It's like a big communal cesspool of code (tm) (c) rgreening
[17:01] <kubotu> incorrect usage, ask for help using 'kubotu: help fact'
[17:01] <rgreening> kubotu help fact
[17:01] <kubotu> factoids plugin: learn that <factoid>, forget that <factoids>, facts about <words>
[17:01] <rgreening> kubotu: learn that It's like a big communal cesspool of code (tm) (c) rgreening
[17:01] <kubotu> okay, learned fact #11: It's like a big communal cesspool of code (tm) (c) rgreening
[17:02] <rgreening> :)
[17:03] <rgreening> ScottK: installing Klamav now
[17:03] <ScottK> rgreening: Need to work on your guidance-power-manager patch.  Before, if it started when hal was around and hal went away for a while it'd keep going OK.  Now it raises your new error and dies.
[17:04] <ScottK> Actually raises a traceback and somehow survived, but apport gets excited and wants to report it.
[17:04] <rgreening> lol
[17:04] <rgreening> can you play with it? I've got kdebase-workspace on my current plate...
[17:04] <smarter> poor apport, he doesn't have a lot of things to report so he tries to catches everything :P
[17:05] <ScottK> rgreening: Not until possibly tonight.
[17:07] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: http://paste.ubuntu.com/56034/
[17:07] <rgreening> ScottK: klamav not showing up for me either
[17:07] <ScottK> OK.  Would you mind having a look at the package.
[17:08] <ScottK> It showed up in Hardy and I don't think I changed it.
[17:08] <bdgraue> i'm still affected by https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/amarok-kde4/+bug/262725  even with the experimental ppa package :(
[17:10] <rgreening> ScottK: sure
[17:12] <ScottK> Thanks.
[17:15] <rgreening> ScottK: could the ';' at the end here cause issues? Categories=Qt;KDE;Application;System;
[17:16] <ScottK> No idea.
[17:17] <smarter> nop
[17:17] <smarter> ";" at the end is compulsatory with the fd.o spec
[17:17] <smarter> try desktop-file-validate foo.desktop to see if something is wrong
[17:20] <ScottK-laptop> Well desktop-file-validate is pretty grumpy about it.
[17:20] <Riddell> I don't know if "Application" is right
[17:20] <Riddell> the ; at the end if required
[17:33] <ScottK> Application is apparently deprecated.
[17:33] <ScottK> I've repaired it some and I'm trying a test build now.
[17:33] <ScottK> Riddell: I went ahead and uploaded guidance 4.1.2 since it was late and we need to do more work on the HAL crash patch.
[17:33] <ScottK> smarter: ^^
[17:36] <smarter> ok
[17:38] <ScottK> smarter: I uploaded your bzr /debian unchanged.  If it needs to be tagged or something, please go ahead.
[17:38] <smarter> shouldn't be needed
[17:38] <ScottK> OK.  Didn't know how you did it.
[17:43] <seele> hum.. are there still problems with network manager in the beta?
[17:48] <apachelogger> rgreening: so, what to do with los kwin patchos?
[17:50] <ScottK> seele: Some are currently having trouble with wired, but wireless seems pretty good.
[17:50] <seele> ScottK: hmm.. i'm having trouble with wireless on this dell.  i dunon if it is network manager or the driver though
[17:50] <seele> getting like 8b/sec
[17:51] <ScottK> What wireless adapter?
[17:51] <ScottK> Also do you have linux-restricted-modules installed?  Some Dell wireless stuff got moved there.
[17:56] <Riddell> ScottK: thanks
[17:57] <seele> hum.. where's the ui that gives you all the hardware details? i forget what it's called
[17:58] <Riddell> ScottK: thanks
[17:58] <ScottK> seele: type lspci in Konsole and look for the one called wireless or network or something relatively obvious
[18:00] <seele> intel 3945/ABG
[18:01] <seele> ScottK: and linux-restriced-modules are installed
[18:10]  * txwikinger fixed touchpad problem
[18:15] <rgreening> wow.. my office network died. Finally came back... :)
[18:16] <apachelogger> nice
[18:16] <txwikinger> And?
[18:16] <apachelogger> rgreening: what to do with kwin?
[18:17] <txwikinger> I just had an graphical error in Konq
[18:18] <seele> ugh.. i give up
[18:18] <rgreening> apachelogger: regarding kdebase-workspace? I'm fixing it. Reverting the kwin branch
[18:18] <seele> what's the point in me testing anything if i can't get the information necessary for bug reports
[18:18] <rgreening> will submit diff shortly
[18:18] <seele> too hard
[18:18] <apachelogger> rgreening: ok, poke when you have the debdiff
[18:18] <rgreening> aye-aye
[18:19] <rgreening> kubotu learn that rgreening loves pbuilder-hooks
[18:19] <kubotu> okay, learned fact #12: rgreening loves pbuilder-hooks
[18:21] <rgreening> dpkg-buildpackage -us -uc -nc is my friend
[18:23] <seele> hum.. crashed notifications on startup too
[18:23] <seele> didn't get that with the other computer
[18:23] <kubotu> didn't get in the groin
[18:24] <apachelogger> exactly
[18:24] <apachelogger> what is a groin?
[18:24] <ScottK> seele: We've got a few of those.
[18:24] <kubotu> what is the way i want, they revert back to Hardy, but running 'kicker' would always bring back the standard panel, that's pretty crappy
[18:24] <apachelogger> ~markov disable
[18:24] <kubotu> sure
[18:24] <ScottK> apachelogger: It's a rather private area of the body.
[18:25] <apachelogger> ah
[18:25] <apachelogger> uh
[18:25] <apachelogger> kubotu: where did you catch that?
[18:25] <apachelogger> very weird
[18:42] <ScottK> Gotta love the title for Debian Bug #501813
[18:43] <JontheEchidna> the font is so pointy you might poke your eyes out?
[18:43] <JontheEchidna> :P
[19:58] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: bug 281327
[19:58] <apachelogger> valid or not?
[19:58] <apachelogger> there is a setting
[19:58] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: wishlist at best, I'd say
[19:59]  * apachelogger thinks warnings should never ever have a don't ask again setting
[20:00] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: well, do something with it
[20:01] <apachelogger> I would close it as won't fix with above reason
[20:01] <apachelogger> especially since there is a setting
[20:01] <JontheEchidna> k
[20:27] <ryanakca> Riddell: I didn't remove it... did it get ported over?
[22:35] <ScottK> What mechanism auto-starts guidance-power-manager?
[22:38] <Riddell> ryanakca: I don't know, you did the porting :)
[22:38] <Riddell> ScottK: /usr/share/autostart/guidance-power-manager.desktop
[22:39] <ScottK> Riddell: Thanks.
[22:39] <ScottK> OK. That's yet another autostart mechanism.
[22:39] <ScottK> Didn't know about that one.
[22:39] <Riddell> it's the original one
[22:41] <ryanakca> Riddell: I guess it did disappear then...
[22:42] <Riddell> oh well
[22:42] <Riddell> I don't mind especially, a shop requested to be on it is all
[22:44] <ryanakca> Riddell: if you have a copy tucked away somewhere I can get it ported after supper
[22:44] <Riddell> I don't
[22:45] <Riddell> google knows all though http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:Hejwh28ATz4J:www.kubuntu.org/shops.php+http://www.kubuntu.org/shop.php&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1
[22:45] <Riddell> they would need to be checked for current relevance though
[22:46] <ryanakca> Riddell: ok, thanks, I'll look through the links too
[23:39] <ScottK> apachelogger or Riddell: Who do we have here that understands solid best (any volunteers)?
[23:40] <ScottK> It seems superm1 has the bluetooth API changes reasonably well understood and if someone who understands solid could work with him we might be able to bang out at least some bluetooth before release.
[23:42] <ScottK> superm1: I've asked if anyone is familiar with solid and can help out.  No answer yet (not the best time of day for the question).
[23:43] <Riddell> ScottK: ervin?
[23:43] <Riddell> he's the solid msater
[23:43] <ScottK> Riddell: You tell me?  I just package this stuff up.
[23:43] <Riddell> and tpatzig is the solid kdebluetooth master
[23:44] <ScottK> Well neither of them are here.
[23:44] <ScottK> So I guess we wait?
[23:44] <superm1> taptzig is the one that I fired that email off to ScottK
[23:44] <ScottK> OK.  Did you get anything back?
[23:44] <superm1> no.  that's the one you were CC'ed on
[23:44] <Riddell> neither sits on this channel, you'd need to ask on #kdebluetooth or elsewhere
[23:45] <ScottK> OK.  Well that's a pretty empty channel.
[23:45] <ScottK> Riddell: Is there anyone here that's done some work on solid?
[23:45] <Riddell> nope
[23:46] <Riddell> wstevenson comes to mind too, he does network manager with solid, but he's not online
[23:46] <ScottK> superm1: OK.  I was hoping he'd just forgotten to CC me on a reply.
[23:46] <superm1> Riddell, i talked to him and he pointed me at tpatzig too