[01:07] <mwhudson_> hey, can someone who's not a launchpad dev go to this page please? https://code.staging.launchpad.net/launchpad
[01:09] <stgraber> mwhudson_: done, logining in now
[01:09] <stgraber> *loging
[01:09] <stgraber> Not allowed there
[01:09] <mwhudson_> stgraber: do you still get a "not allowed here" page?
[01:09] <mwhudson_> right
[01:10] <wgrant> mwhudson_: It 403s due to ~launchpad-pqm/launchpad/devel
[01:10] <mwhudson_> did either of you get an oops id?
[01:10] <wgrant> No.
[01:10] <wgrant> It's a forbidden.
[01:10] <mwhudson_> ok
[01:10] <wgrant> I'll give you a traceback, wait a sec...
[01:10] <mwhudson_> uh
[01:10] <wgrant> IIRC it tries to access .product on the branch.
[01:10] <wgrant> Which naturally fails.
[01:10] <wgrant> Damn. No dogfood today.
[01:11] <mwhudson_> wgrant: i'm sure _you're_ not supposed to get a traceback
[01:11]  * mwhudson_ brb
[01:11] <wgrant> mwhudson_: No on production or edge, no.
[01:12] <mwhudson_> ah
[01:12] <wgrant> I'm fairly sure it's due to a ForbiddenAttribute on <Branch ~launchpad-pqm/launchpad/devel>.product, but I can't check it right now...
[01:13] <mwhudson_> wgrant: it still 403s for you, but not with a traceback?
[01:13] <wgrant> mwhudson_: Staging doesn't give mortals tracebacks either.
[01:14] <wgrant> Now, there was another project with private branches which you probably can't see... But I forget which.
[01:14] <mwhudson_> it's something to do with the development focus being private
[01:14] <wgrant> Ah yes, that's right.
[01:14] <wgrant> The TAL traceback said that.
[01:15] <wgrant> I'm sure I have a copy of it saved somewhere, but can't find it.
[01:17] <wgrant> I'd always presumed it was quite intentional...
[01:17] <mwhudson_> nope, though i can see why you might
[01:18] <mwhudson_> ah well, it's probably easy enough, though a bit tedious, to reproduce locally
[01:19] <wgrant> It was definitely relating to the template trying to render the development series' branch.
[01:19] <wgrant> So shouldn't be hard to reproduce.
[01:20] <wgrant> It's unfortunate the Forbiddens don't generate OOPSes.
[01:21] <mwhudson> they do, i think, they just aren't displayed to the user
[01:21] <wgrant> Ah.
[01:25] <matsubara> wgrant: do you see tracebacks on dogfood?
[01:26] <wgrant> matsubara: Yes. Nobody seems concerned.
[01:26] <matsubara> wgrant: are you part of some team that allows that?
[01:26] <wgrant> matsubara: No.
[01:27] <wgrant> It's a bug in the config that is known by the relevant people, I believe.
[01:27] <matsubara> strange, you shouldn't see tracebacks there. the config should be the same as lpnet/edge/staging
[01:27] <wgrant> And has been for some time.
[01:27] <matsubara> yep, I thought soyuz guys had that fixed
[01:27] <mwhudson> ah, found some oopses
[01:27]  * wgrant would of course prefer it unfixed.
[01:27] <wgrant> mwhudson: Great.
[01:28] <wgrant> I still can't find my copies.
[01:28] <mwhudson> it's a different problem, i think
[01:28] <mwhudson> i've fixed it once this cycle already :)
[01:28] <wgrant> Heh.
[01:28] <matsubara> wgrant: well, it shouldn't be open to whole world.
[01:29] <wgrant> I guess it is a bit of information leakage... a few lines of code and potentially some branch names...
[01:30] <matsubara> wgrant: yeah, that's the point. I'll talk to them. thanks for the info
[02:03] <wgrant> spiv: Aha, I see you have my g-p-m bug. Do you also see g-p-m freeze for 42.5 seconds when pulling in/out AC?
[02:04] <spiv> wgrant: don't know.  Let me find out :)
[02:05] <wgrant> spiv: The key problem is seemingly common to other models, but I've not seen anybody with the freezing problem not on a 630m.
[02:05] <wgrant> (I also know precisely why that one happens)
[02:09] <spiv> wgrant: looks like the answer is "yes"
[02:11] <spiv> wgrant: I don't know how you measure 42.5, but I did just see a delay between 12:08:08 and 12:08:51 when I run gnome-power-manager --verbose --no-daemon and remove the AC.
[02:11] <wgrant> spiv: OK, I must get a workaround for that added to g-p-m at some point.
[02:11] <spiv> Plus the OSD half-appeared and didn't redraw during that time.
[02:11] <wgrant> Right, that's what I thought.
[02:11] <wgrant> Yep.
[02:11] <wgrant> It's because it's setting the brightness level 7000 times.
[02:11] <wgrant> And sleeping 5ms between each setting.
[02:11] <wgrant> To create a nice fade.
[02:12] <wgrant> Except it expects there to be like 10 steps, not 15000.
[02:12] <spiv> Oh.  "Oops."
[02:13] <wgrant> My 'fix' is to make it just set the value if it's going to have to make more than 100 steps, but that number is arbitrary and it's a hack.
[02:13]  * spiv nods
[02:13] <spiv> A slightly nicer hack may be to just cap the maximum number of ms the total fade can take.
[02:15] <wgrant> Perhaps.
[02:15] <wgrant> Of course the ideal solution is to fix XRandR or the hardware, whichever is at fault. Probably the hardware.
[02:15] <wgrant> Dell laptops aren't meant to support setting it through that method, but it does actually work... if you set the RandR backlight property manually, the backlight will get to that value in a bit under a minute.
[02:15] <wgrant> Veeeeery slowly.
[02:16] <spiv> Which is essentially the same thing, but doing it in terms of total time will make it independent of e.g. the 5ms step delay.  Which is possibly a good idea in case someone changes the step size.
[02:16] <wgrant> Yes.
[02:17] <spiv> Nice to know there's a cluster of bugs here :)
[02:17] <wgrant> I originally filed it as one, but there are clearly at least 3.
[02:18] <wgrant> The hardware, g-p-m trusting the hardware with its 5ms delay, and the key repeating.
[02:18]  * spiv nods
[02:18] <spiv> Whatever hardy did for all those would be fine with me ;)
[02:18] <wgrant> All of which worked fine Feisty->Hardy.
[02:18] <wgrant> Indeed...
[02:22] <leonel_> hello : I've  uploaded a package to my ppa  and has 58 minutes building and the previous time took less than 5 minutes ..  is launchpad too busy right now ??
[02:23] <wgrant> Given that the rest of the buildds have been updated appropriately recently, maybe your buildd has wandered off to another world.
[02:26] <leonel_> wgrant: should I re upload ?
[02:27] <wgrant> No.
[02:27] <wgrant> Somebody with appropriate superpowers might eventually notice that something is wrong, and fix it.
[02:30] <leonel_> wgrant: thanks ..
[02:43] <wgrant> spiv: You have no further issues with Ubuntu on the 630m?
[03:00] <spiv> wgrant: not that I've noticed so far :)
[03:00] <spiv> wgrant: I haven't tried the mic port recently, I know a few releases back it didn't work.  (I have a USB headset now)
[03:01] <wgrant> I last tried the mic last UDS, and it worked.
[03:01] <wgrant> Haven't tried with 2.6.27 yet... good point.
[03:02] <spiv> I have a perhaps superstitious fear of closing the lid while suspending, because that used to cause resume to fail under hardy.
[03:02] <spiv> But I've only had intrepid installed for less than 48 hours, so my experience with suspend/resume glitches in it is pretty minimal so far :)
[03:09] <wgrant> spiv: I find it's fine to close the lid after the VT switch on suspend.
[03:10] <wgrant> But I haven't tried doing it while X is still visible for a few months...
[04:01] <Hobbsee> cprov: ping?
[04:01] <Hobbsee> or other buildd admins who have power?
[04:04] <spm> Hobbsee: I *may* be able to assist?
[04:04] <Hobbsee> spm: is there any chance of getting sbuild upgraded on the buildds?
[04:04] <persia> No.
[04:05] <Hobbsee> at some point in the nearish future?
[04:05] <Hobbsee> persia: why?
[04:05] <persia> sbuild on the buildds bears only slight resemblance to sbuild in the archive, and so requires lots of manual effort to adjust.
[04:05] <Hobbsee> persia: i realise that, but it's hitting http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=395271
[04:05] <persia> Indeed.  Bother infinity about that.
[04:05] <Hobbsee> (and other builds)
[04:06] <persia> Conceivably it would be possible to use distro sbuild, but that's a significant transition, and probably should be done near some archive-open for a new release: mind you there's the potential of breaking SRUs.
[04:06] <Hobbsee> persia: yeah, i thought it might be an infinity thing, or a lamont thing, hence the request for buildd admins with power :)
[04:07] <Hobbsee> persia: that's true.  I wasn't expecting it to be done now
[04:07] <Hobbsee> was just wondering if it would get done...say in the next couple of months or so.
[04:07] <persia> I think it's just infinity and elmo, but it might also be lamont.  In practice, I think it's really just infinity.
[04:07] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[04:07] <persia> Getting a patch to fix the bug is significantly easier than "upgrading sbuild".
[04:08] <persia> That wouldn't require such significant changes.
[04:13] <Hobbsee> oh, what the...
[04:14] <wgrant> ... wow.
[04:15] <wgrant> That's... broken.
[04:15] <Hobbsee> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/18521115/buildlog_ubuntu-intrepid-i386.mime-tools_5.426-1ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz looks kinda special.
[06:25] <lamont> persia: note that debian also doesn't use the sbuild that is in debian...
[06:27] <lamont> and yeah, versioned provides are b0rked
[06:29] <wgrant> Aren't versioned provides forbidden?
[06:29] <RAOF> Can one even specify versioned provides?
[06:29] <wgrant> I thought they were illegal.
[06:29] <lamont> RAOF: exactly
[06:30] <wgrant> I think the problem is that sbuild isn't installing something to satisfy a versioned dependency when something already provides that dependency.
[06:30] <wgrant> s/provides/Provides/
[06:30] <RAOF> Does "Provides: foo-interface >= 2.0" actually mean anything?
[06:30] <lamont> RAOF: not really
[06:30] <wgrant> That doesn't make sense.
[06:31] <wgrant> 'Provides: foo-interface 2.0' might make sense, but is not legal.
[06:31] <lamont> and not sure what the underlying issues are, but the likelihood of ubuntu (or debian, for that matter) using the sbuild from the archive in this century?  near zero.
[06:32] <lamont> for "near zero" == "small, and possibly not finite"
[06:33]  * RAOF suspects lamont means "non positive"
[06:33] <lamont> Hobbsee: and buildd == infinity, followed by elmo (who may dump it on me)
[06:33] <lamont> RAOF: no.
[06:33] <lamont> "small but finite" has a _very_ specific meaning
[06:33] <RAOF> lamont: Aah.  You're a devotee of that new-fangled non-standard analysis?
[06:34] <lamont> you mean calculus? :-)
[06:34] <RAOF> I mean calculus, but souped up to give a rigourous meaning to "dt"
[06:34] <wgrant> A negative probability? Sounds good.
[06:35] <lamont> I don't care about orders of infinity, just about whether something is infinitely small, or just slightly bigger than that.
[06:35]  * lamont has been burned by small-but-finite odds before.
[06:35] <wgrant> "I don't care about orders of infinity"
[06:35] <RAOF> And, for that matter, a rigorous meaning for the limit of the sequence "1, 2, 3, 4, ..."
[06:35] <wgrant> I had to read that a couple of times.
[06:35] <wgrant> To realise that you weren't disobeying Adam.
[06:36] <lamont> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleph
[06:36] <RAOF> lamont: Right.  Non-standard analysis allows you to say something is infinitely small, and really mean it :)
[06:36] <lamont> I also tend to not obey adam
[06:37] <lamont> RAOF: I'm an engineer.  close enough is close enough
[06:37] <lamont> like explaining to my daughter that "while dx behaves like a variable, never ever ever say that to your teacher"
[06:37] <RAOF> So when _you_ mean "infinitely small", you mean < machine epsilon? :P
[06:38] <RAOF> Unless that teacher is _really_ into analysis, in which case see "non-standard analysis", above ;)
[06:38] <lamont> RAOF: my major was EE, not that silly comp-sci crap that ignores the _WHOLE_ linear region of devices...
[06:38] <lamont> daughter is currently taking precalc and calc concurrently
[06:39]  * RAOF is not really aware what "precalc" means in this setting.
[06:39] <lamont> and first-year calc teachers tend to not believe in dx as having any meaning other than as being part of the silly format
[06:39] <lamont> trig/analyitical geometry is what they used to call precalc
[06:39] <lamont> who cares that it's a prereq
[06:40] <RAOF> Where I come from, "precalc" as in "the stuff you need to do calculus" is taught well after calculus :)
[06:40] <lamont> heh
[06:40] <lamont> yeah.  most students seem to learn their calc and post-calc in science/engineering classes
[06:40] <RAOF> By the end of honours, I was pretty much able to really do integration :)
[06:41] <lamont> anyway, bedtime for this one.
[06:41] <lamont> g'night
[06:41] <RAOF> Dream of infinitesimals!
[06:42] <lamont> RAOF: and I wish you nightmares as well. :-p
[06:42] <wgrant> Night lamont.
[06:47] <Hobbsee> lamont: ahhh
[07:30] <persia> lamont, Yeah, unless I misunderstand the sbuild used by Debain buildds is even less like distributed sbuild than ours.
[07:54] <mdke> mwhudson: done. Sorry I missed that
[09:32] <mrevell> Hi. Today I'm available to answer your questions either in here, by email or through Launchpad Answers.
[09:35]  * wgrant pesters mrevell with annoying questions.
[09:38] <mrevell> bring it on wgrant :)
[11:10] <Hobbsee> mrevell: oh, sweet!  I think I had some questions for you, too.  Now if only I can remember what they were...
[11:13] <mrevell> Hobbsee: Heh :)
[11:14] <Hobbsee> mrevell: does that mean the mailing list should come through in an even flow, rather than in bursts when someone goes thru the moderation queue now?
[11:16] <mwhudson> mdke: thanks
[11:16] <mrevell> Hobbsee: launchpad-users? Well, I'm still the person mostly moderating it right now. If people are subscribed to the list their mail shouldn't require moderation
[11:16] <Hobbsee> mrevell: i realise that - it just looks strange, when those who don't subscribe only get mails unmoderated in larger torrents
[11:18] <mrevell> Hobbsee: Right and I think that problem will go away, to an extent, once the list is hosted in Launchpad itself. The person doing community help will moderate the list at that point but also Launchpad is better at handling drive-by mailing list posts AFAIK.
[11:18] <Hobbsee> as in, launchpad is better at handling it than mailing lists?
[11:20] <mrevell> As in Launchpad's mailing lists are better at handling it than Mailman, AFAIK.
[11:21] <Hobbsee> ah, right.
[11:21] <Hobbsee> mrevell: can listadmin be used on LP lists?
[11:22] <mrevell> Hobbsee: I've never asked but I'd assume "no".
[11:22] <Hobbsee> awww
[11:22]  * Hobbsee isn't sure that's an advantage, then.
[11:22] <mrevell> barry would be able to answer that when he's around (i.e. can lists in LP use listadmin)
[11:23] <Hobbsee> speaking of which...time to unmoderate 4 lists.
[11:25] <Hobbsee> right.  done.
[11:25] <Hobbsee> show me how to do that, that quickly, in launchpad :)
[11:26] <mrevell> heh, we're always open to suggestions and, it's worth noting, that we're not claiming that Launchpad is the only place you should ever consider for hosting mailing lists :) I'm sure for some people the simplified admin and easy setup will appeal.
[11:28] <persia> mrevell, Actually, that's precisely the point : it's a less simple admin from some points of view.
[11:28] <Hobbsee> mrevell: right, so the target for launchpad lists is for those people who moderate maybe one, or possibly two lists, and want an easy setup, and don't expect much spam.
[11:28] <Hobbsee> or much stuff that will fit in the moderation queue
[11:29] <Hobbsee> persia: well, that's what I would have thought, in the moderation point.
[11:29] <persia> Given that it's very hard to audit a launchpad list as a nonmember of a given team, it's not unlikely that there will be significant moderation requirements.
[12:00] <persia> mrevell, I've forgotten exactly : why can't the google map be https?  Was that a TOS thing, or something else (I'm proxying for someone else)
[12:01] <mrevell> persia: I'm not sure on that but I *think* we're landing a fix for it on Wednesday.
[12:02] <persia> mrevell, Ooh.  Excellent news.  I'll proxy.  Thanks.
[12:16] <exarkun> Does it always take four days to import a new translation template?
[12:25] <mrevell> exarkun: It can sometimes take longer to import a translation template if it needs work by hand. danilos may be able to help if you can tell him which template it is.
[12:26] <danilos> mrevell: jtv usually handles that and better knows the status of individual templates
[12:26] <mrevell> thanks danilos
[12:26] <mrevell> exarkun: jtv is at lunch right now but should be back soon. He'll answer when he's back. If you can't wait around, please send an email to feedback@launchpad.net
[12:34] <leonel> hello :   I'm trying to backport django 1.0 from intrepid to hardy  and the build  in PPA  gets killed
[12:34] <leonel> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/18523828/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.python-django_1.0-1~ppa1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[12:35] <leonel> here the package builds fine
[12:35] <persia> leonel, It looks like it's hanging : 150 minutes with no activity is rare.
[12:36] <persia> leonel, When you build it locally, does it take > 150 minutes?  If so, is there a long pause?
[12:37] <leonel> yes too rare not a long pause  it takes a while  with some json things  but does not take too long
[12:38] <persia> leonel, I'd recommend putting some debug hinting at that point in the build to see if you can determine why it's hanging.
[12:38] <leonel> persia: thanks  I'll check that
[12:39] <leonel> persia: the kill after that time is automatic ??
[12:44] <persia> leonel, I believe so.
[12:46] <mrevell> I'll be afk for a bit to get some lunch. Ping me if you need help and I'll come back to you after my lunch.
[12:58] <exarkun> mrevell-lunch: Thanks.
[13:33] <Hobbsee> mrevell-lunch: will the podcasts eventually be transcripted?
[13:42] <leonel> persia: I've just  timed the  build  and  took 33 minutes on a  qemu  virtual host on a  Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU          4300  @ 1.80GHz host
[13:43] <mrevell> Hobbsee: It's unlikely we'll ever transcribe full episodes but if there's anything that bears repeating on the blog I'll certainly post it up there as an individual story. (Suggestions welcome, of course)
[13:49] <persia> leonel, Then something odd is happening on the buildds.  You'll need to put debug code in the build scripts, and try to understand from the logs.
[13:51] <leonel> persia:  ok tanks.
[13:52] <Hobbsee> mrevell: the UI stuff looks interesting.
[13:56] <mrevell> Hobbsee: Yeah. There'll be more about that on the blog, definitely
[13:56] <mrevell> hello matsubara
[13:56] <Hobbsee> mrevell: cool!
[13:57] <matsubara> hi there mrevell
[14:19] <jtv> exarkun: ping
[14:19] <exarkun> Hi
[14:19] <exarkun> Everything is fine.
[14:19] <exarkun> Well, actually, maybe I have some brand new questions
[14:19] <jtv> exarkun: I'm sorry for the delay, had a lot of hardware related to my internet access blow up yesterday so couldn't review templates.
[14:20] <exarkun> jtv: No apology necessary!
[14:20] <jtv> exarkun: normally I do that on Monday and at least one other time in the week.
[14:20] <exarkun> jtv: I didn't even realize there was a manual step involved in uploading translation templates.
[14:20] <jtv> exarkun: after that, the updates will be processed automatically as long as their names/paths don't change.
[14:20] <jtv> exarkun: we're planning to make that a bit clearer on the upload page.
[14:21] <jtv> exarkun: but you mentioned new questions.  :)
[14:21] <exarkun> Yea.. I'm talking to someone who wants to do translations for my project
[14:21] <exarkun> He just pointed me at <https://help.launchpad.net/Translations/YourProject#Translations groups>, perhaps that will answer my questions
[14:22] <exarkun> I think my question was going to be "how do I create a new translation group", but now I know that the answer is to file a support request.  So I guess my next question is about when it is appropriate to create a new translation group.
[14:24] <exarkun> I guess the page sort of answers that question too - "If you have specific requirements for the people who review your project's translations"
[14:24] <exarkun> My "specific requirement" is probably that the reviewers are people I know and trust to do a good job. :)
[14:26] <jtv> exarkun: that's pretty much the definition of what a translation group is for.  :-)
[14:26] <exarkun> Okay, great, I guess we'll file a support request then :)
[14:26] <jtv> exarkun: I can do it for you right now.
[14:26] <exarkun> jtv: Awesome
[14:27] <jtv> exarkun: just tell me what it should be called, and what your Launchpad login is (so I can make you the owner).
[14:28] <exarkun> "exarkun" is my launchpad login, and going with what appears to be prevailing convention, I guess the name should be "Twisted Translation Group"
[14:28] <exarkun> fantix: Hi :)
[14:28] <fantix> exarkun: hi :)
[14:29] <jtv> exarkun: to be honest there's no need for the "Translation Group" bit in there.  It'll be added where the name is displayed anyway.
[14:29] <exarkun> fantix: jtv just offered to set up the translation group
[14:29] <jtv> exarkun: in fact when I came across your template today, I _nearly_ rejected it... what did the "zh" stand for?  For a moment I thought it meant "Chinese" :-)
[14:30] <exarkun> I think that reflects the fact that the only translator we have right now is doing a chinese translation. :)
[14:30] <fantix> sorry, I should change the filename before upload ...
[14:30] <jtv> No biggie.  I can tell Launchpad to forget about the "zh" part.
[14:31] <exarkun> Cool, that sounds like it'd be a good idea.
[14:31] <jtv> That way you can also leave it out of the next version of the template you upload, and the system will see that it's an update, not a new and different template.
[14:31] <jtv> (Which is one of the main reasons why we need manual review)
[14:31]  * exarkun nods
[14:31] <fantix> ah, i see
[14:32] <jtv> exarkun, fantix: ok, group created, with exarkun set as the owner.  Now you can assign that to your project under Change Translators, and pick an access model.
[14:32] <jtv> https://translations.launchpad.net/+groups/twisted/
[14:32] <fantix> jtv: much thanks :)
[14:35] <exarkun> fantix: I set up exoweb as the chinese language team.  Can you verify I did the right thing?
[14:36] <jtv> exarkun, fantix (in neat alphabetical order): the -zh is also gone from the template name now.  Remember to remove it from your version of the templates, and all should be well.
[14:36] <fantix> exarkun: just saw that. everything is fine for me :) thanks
[14:37] <fantix> jtv: ok, I will, thanks :)
[14:37] <exarkun> jtv: right, thanks again :)
[14:37] <jtv> exarkun, fantix: you'll also want to pick an access model.  The default Open mode basically lets anyone do anything.
[14:37] <jtv> np
[14:37] <fantix> oops, I missed that point
[14:40] <exarkun> yea.. I left it on open intentionally for now, while I ponder the other possibilities
[14:40] <exarkun> structured probably makes sense
[14:41] <fantix> exarkun: that's also my suggestion
[14:42] <exarkun> structured it is :)
[14:47] <jtv> Structured is good when you're keeping an eye on the translations, so people coming in and contributing spontaneously will do some good.
[14:48] <jtv> For cases where you only care about the languages you organize in the translation group, and the other translations are "black holes," you want Restricted so that spontaneous contributions are not wasted.
[14:48] <fantix> ah, i see
[14:50] <jtv> fantix: so Structured can be a good way to "open the doors and see who comes in."
[14:51] <jtv> fantix: you'll probably become more concerned with quality later, as the effort gains momentum, and you may want to go to Restricted then.
[14:51] <jtv> On the "something beats nothing" principle.  :)
[14:51] <fantix> jtv: hopefully more would like to join at the moment :)
[14:51] <fantix> ﻿btw any differences between "Chinese" and "Simplified Chinese" in launchpad? I saw both there
[14:52] <jtv> fantix: you shouldn't see _any_ "Chinese."  It's always either Simplified Chinese or Traditional Chinese.
[14:53] <jtv> fantix: that's for the formal language designations, of course.  It's still possible that people say "Chinese" in team names etc.
[14:53] <fantix> jtv: hmm, then I probably should report a bug: https://translations.launchpad.net/+groups/twisted
[14:54] <jtv> fantix: it may be possible, but that doesn't mean it's right.  :-)
[14:56] <jtv> fantix: zh ("Chinese") should not normally show up in any listings, but the system does have a language entry for it.
[14:56] <jtv> fantix: meanwhile, I suggest you remove that translation-group entry and replace it with one for the right pick.
[14:57] <fantix> jtv: you mean replace Chinese with Simplified Chinese?
[14:58] <jtv> fantix: depending on which version of Chinese this is.
[14:58] <jtv> fantix: the UI won't let you change the language on an entry; that part is assumed fixed.
[14:58] <jtv> fantix: but otherwise, right.
[15:04] <leonel> persia: tried again the build and  now the ppa build  finished in  25 minutes ...
[15:06] <persia> leonel, successfully?
[15:07] <thekorn> intellectronica: hi, I've one API related question about the message collection of a bug: the 1st element of this collection is the description of the bug, is this intended?
[15:07] <thekorn> or a bug
[15:07] <intellectronica> thekorn: yes, that's how we store the description - it's simply the first comment
[15:12] <thekorn> intellectronica: ok, thank you
[15:24] <leonel> persia: yes
[15:25] <persia> leonel, Then you win :)
[16:48] <Rafik> hello #launchpad
[16:50] <Rafik> I noticed that adding new blueprints dot not appear in karma summary
[16:51] <Rafik> can anyone confirm that ?
[16:53] <kiko-phone> Rafik, I'm not entirely sure if we do award karma for blueprint events -- do you know mrevell?
[16:53] <mrevell> I don't know, actually, but I think intellectronica should be able to tell us if we award karma for blueprint events.
[16:54] <mrevell> Actually, I do know: we do award karma for blueprints. I have lots of blueprint-related karma
[16:54] <mrevell> Rafik: What's your Launchpad account name?
[16:54] <Rafik> ~rafik
[16:54] <Rafik> https://edge.launchpad.net/~rafik
[16:55]  * mrevell looks
[16:55] <mrevell> Rafik: You have 195 karma points for specification tracking - i.e. work with blueprints.
[16:56] <matsubara> mrevell, Rafik: we award karma for some blueprint actions, like registering a new one, linking to a bug, targeting to milestone, etc
[16:56] <Rafik> mrevell, yes, that's for an old one, I added another and it has not been updated
[16:57] <mrevell> Rafik: When did you add the blueprint? It can take 24 hours to affect your karma. Also, it's worth noting that karma awarded for older actions degrades over time.
[16:57] <Rafik> mrevell, more than 24 hours I think
[16:58] <mrevell> Rafik: On this page - https://edge.launchpad.net/~rafik/+karma - I see no trace of you registering a blueprint since September, so it seems that it hasn't counted towards your karma. Could you send me a link to the blueprint in question?
[16:58] <Rafik> matsubara, it seems that there is no award for new blueprints but only for edits
[16:59] <Rafik> mrevell, https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-arabic-website/+spec/using-loco-drupal-theme
[17:00] <Rafik> matsubara, mrevell, I added a new blueprint on September 30
[17:00] <Rafik> there only the "Edited Specification Title" in the karma summary
[17:00] <mrevell> Rafik: Yeah, I saw that in your karma log. So, perhaps you don't get karma for registering a blueprint. intellectronica can you confirm?
[17:01] <Rafik> so I think there is no award for new blueprints, but only for edits
[17:02] <matsubara> mrevell: just checked and LP should award karma for blueprint registration
[17:02] <Rafik> I don"t know if this is a bug... editing the title is awarded but not registring ?
[17:02] <Rafik> I don't make sens
[17:03] <mrevell> matsubara: I've just looked at my own karma history and it doesn't extend that far, as I've done a lot in the past few days.
[17:03] <mrevell> matsubara: but I haven't reg'd a new blueprint
[17:05] <mrevell> Rafik: Thanks for reporting this. I shall look into it further.
[17:05] <Rafik> mrevell, yw, should I file a bug or it's ok ?
[17:06] <mrevell> matsubara: Would you suggest Rafik reports a bug? It does appear that the blueprint creation hasn't shown up in his karma list.
[17:08] <matsubara> mrevell, Rafik : please do
[17:08] <Rafik> okay.
[17:08] <Rafik> thank you guys
[19:03]  * LarstiQ blinks
[19:04] <kiko> que paso lar
[19:04] <kiko> stiQ
[19:05] <LarstiQ> kiko: I probably am missing some common knowledge on operationg procedure. Community help contact is now empty in the topic?
[19:05] <kiko> LarstiQ, it's only available for 8h each day -- basically core hours for one engineer
[19:06] <kiko> I don't know who's up next but I can check
[19:06] <persia> kiko, Are questions still answered on an as-available basis during the other 128 hours a week?
[19:06] <LarstiQ> kiko: ok, makes sense then.
[19:06] <LarstiQ> persia: kiko just answered mine ;)
[19:07] <persia> Indeed, but that was a meta-question :)
[19:07] <kiko> persia, yeah, totally
[19:07] <kiko> https://help.launchpad.net/HelpRotation
[19:08] <persia> kiko, You picked the least common day of the month.  Good job :)
[19:09] <kiko> persia, I'm very unreliable!
[19:13] <LarstiQ> my, the launchpad team has grown
[20:20] <S-i-A> hi
[20:20] <S-i-A> anyone from translation team ?
[20:21] <S-i-A> how can i import language file for translation?
[20:22] <S-i-A> i have the language file as .po, can i simplay setup it?
[20:23] <S-i-A> any idea?
[20:26] <matsubara> danilos: ^
[20:27] <matsubara> S-i-A: if you don't get an answer here, I suggest you to ask a question in: https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/
[20:27] <S-i-A> matsubara: thanx
[20:27] <matsubara> np
[20:27] <S-i-A> we upload the language file
[20:28] <S-i-A> we need review  from your team.
[20:28] <S-i-A> https://translations.launchpad.net/~bardaqani/+imports
[21:36] <paolettopn> Vado via alle Tue Oct 14 22:36:38... ci si rivede alle prossime!
[22:57] <No`> hello launchpadders
[22:58] <No`> I was wondering: would it be fair to create a project... let's say: "My Talks" in Launchpad. For now, I'm uploading them in my +junk box...
[22:59] <No`> but I would like to know if it's fair to create a personal project, just for these talks branches
[22:59] <No`> (of course, the talks are all Free as in Beer and Speech)
[23:01] <beuno> No`, as long as it's free, it's fine
[23:02] <No`> beuno: well... I wouldn't upload a non-free stuff on LP, even in my Junk box
[23:02] <mtaylor> anybody have thoughts on extra metainfo fields for blueprints, like time-estimated or difficulty?
[23:02] <beuno> No`, then it's all good!
[23:03] <No`> but creating "<mynickname>-most-wanted-talks" as a "project"... I was hesitating
[23:03] <beuno> mtaylor, well, it's hard to specify something that would work across al projects
[23:03] <No`> beuno: :)
[23:03] <mtaylor> beuno: yes. that is true
[23:03] <beuno> No`, well, it does sound a bit odd
[23:03] <mtaylor> beuno: at least without having a bazillion different meta-info tags :)
[23:04] <beuno> mtaylor, that's right
[23:04] <beuno> if we could find something flexible enough, we can consider it
[23:07] <kiko> No`, I don't see a problem with it myself if it's licensed appropriately,
[23:12] <No`> kiko: they're usually licensed as CC-BY-SA (or something like this)
[23:12] <No`> including the one I'm working on, which is talking *about* Creative Commons
[23:13] <kiko> No`, BY-SA is fine, just -NC is not
[23:13] <No`> right, cool
[23:14] <No`> (dammit, I shall untick the checkbox "earn money with my talks") ;o)
[23:15] <kiko> No`, you can still earn money, you just can not discriminate :)
[23:16] <No`> ah
[23:38] <kiko> No`, are you bruno bord?
[23:39] <kiko> yes he is
[23:39] <kiko> bac, meet No` -- No`, meet bac, the disabler of your project :)
[23:39] <kiko> bac, FWIW he's already using junk branches and I think his use case is okay if kinda borderline
[23:39] <bac> hey there No`
[23:42] <bac> No`: didn't know of your discussion here.  we agree it was borderline ... i just fell on the other side.  no worries, the project has been re-activated.
[23:44] <No`> bac: oh... right... I was right when I was wondering about it, then
[23:45] <No`> I wouldn't have been mad at it, you know... It's just that junk is for... junk, and I wanted junk to be sorted more nicely
[23:46] <bac> No`: thanks for coming here to ask.  yeah, i wish +junk had a friendlier name...
[23:47] <No`> no problem...
[23:47] <bac> it was probably kiko's idea.  blame him unless we find out otherwise.  :)