[01:26] <csilk> anybody getting "please try again" messages from lp when loading pages?
[01:26] <beuno> csilk, while navigating through branches?
[01:26] <csilk> yeah
[01:28] <beuno> which URL?
[01:29] <csilk> It's working now, but http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~vcs-imports/tangocms/trunk-imported was giving me the problem
[01:29] <beuno> mwhudson, is LH's server acting up again?
[01:30] <beuno> we had to restart it today already
[01:30] <mwhudson_> it's using a bunch o ram
[01:31] <beuno> a big bunch or a small bunch?
[01:32] <mtaylor> anybody around who can tell me how to make lp:~mordred/drizzle/codestyle stop being --1.6 and go back to --pack-0.92
[01:32] <mtaylor> ?
[01:32] <beuno> hrm
[01:33] <beuno> downgrading formats...
[01:33] <mtaylor> I tried just doing push --overwrite
[01:33] <beuno> mtaylor, is it a big branch?
[01:33] <mtaylor> but that didn't seem to believe me
[01:33] <beuno> I mean, is deleting and re-pushing a big deal?
[01:33] <mtaylor> beuno: not at all
[01:33] <mtaylor> beuno: how do I delete it?
[01:33] <spiv> mtaylor: "bzr upgrade --pack-0.92 lp:~mordred/drizzle/codestyle", IIRC.
[01:33] <beuno> there ya go
[01:34] <mtaylor> $ bzr upgrade --pack-0.92 lp:~mordred/drizzle/codestyle
[01:34] <mtaylor> starting upgrade of bzr+ssh://mordred@bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Emordred/drizzle/codestyle/
[01:34] <mtaylor> making backup of tree history
[01:34] <mtaylor> bzr: ERROR: File exists: '/srv/bazaar.launchpad.net/push-branches/00/00/3e/1f/backup.bzr'
[01:34] <beuno> also, to delete, next time, there's a red button next to the title
[01:34] <beuno> click that
[01:34] <mtaylor> aha!
[01:34] <beuno> I already have a change for that
[01:34] <mtaylor> hehe. well, deleting it in launchpad will be a bit of a problem
[01:34] <beuno> so it's easier to find  :)
[01:35] <mtaylor> it's got subscriptions, merge proposals, bugs and two blueprints associated with it
[01:35] <beuno> ah, it will be a problem
[01:35] <spiv> mtaylor: connec to sftp://mordred@bazaar.launchpad.net/~mordred/drizzle/codestyle with an SFTP client (e.g. nautilus) and delete the old backup.bzr directory.
[01:35] <spiv> jml: ^ this conversation my be of interest
[01:36] <beuno> yeah, someone should file a bug
[01:36] <beuno> someone == not me
[01:36] <mtaylor> spiv:
[01:36] <mtaylor> sftp> rmdir ~mordred/drizzle/codestyle/backup.bzr
[01:36] <mtaylor> Couldn't remove directory: Failure
[01:36] <mtaylor> sftp> rm ~mordred/drizzle/codestyle/backup.bzr
[01:36] <mtaylor> Removing /~mordred/drizzle/codestyle/backup.bzr
[01:36] <mtaylor> Couldn't delete file: Failure
[01:36] <mwhudson_> use lftp
[01:36] <mwhudson_> the openssh sftp client sucks donkey balls
[01:37] <mtaylor> mwhudson_: how do I make lftp grok my ssh keys?
[01:37] <mtaylor> oh, nm
[01:37] <mwhudson_> mtaylor: it looks in the same places as openssh afaik
[01:38] <mwhudson_> mtaylor: if it's being really slow i can probably do it from a machine in the DC
[01:38] <mtaylor> mwhudson_: I don't think it's connecting... it asked me for a password when I started
[01:38] <mwhudson_> hmm
[01:38] <mwhudson_> oh
[01:39]  * mtaylor is being thwarted!
[01:39] <mwhudson_> lftp does that
[01:39] <mwhudson_> mtaylor: just enter an empty password
[01:39] <mwhudson_> i think it'll connect fine
[01:39] <mtaylor> trying
[01:41] <mtaylor> nope.
[01:41] <mtaylor> no dice
[01:41] <mtaylor> also can't connect using nautilus
[01:42] <mtaylor> why isn't push --overwrite working /
[01:42] <mtaylor> ?
[01:42] <mwhudson_> because push --overwrite probably doesn't do what you think it does (the name is confusing)
[01:43] <mtaylor> lovely
[01:43] <spiv> The "--overwrite" option means "make the remote branch's tip revision be mine, even if my local branch is older or has divergent history."
[01:43] <mtaylor> ahhh
[01:43] <spiv> It doesn't literally mean "overwrite the files blindly" :)
[01:43] <mtaylor> well, that makes sense given its current behavior at least
[01:43] <mwhudson_> it just means that you can push a revision which doesn't have the tip revision in it's ancestry
[01:43] <spiv> mwhudson_: and push an older tip
[01:44] <mwhudson_> ah yes
[01:44] <mwhudson_> mtaylor: anyway, _i_ can log in with lftp, want me to rm -rf backup.bzr ?
[01:44] <mtaylor> mwhudson_: well... if you have the power, I sure wouldn't mind you killing ~mordred/drizzle/codestyle/backup.bzr... cause it sure isn't working for me
[01:44] <mtaylor> yes please
[01:44] <mwhudson_> ok
[01:45] <mwhudson_> mtaylor: done
[01:45] <mtaylor> alrighty... now lets see if this downgrade will work
[01:45] <mtaylor> aha. it's looking promising...
[01:46] <spiv> mwhudson_: is there any work planned to make repeated format changes less painful?
[01:47] <mwhudson_> spiv: i guess we haven't thought about the repeated change aspect
[01:47] <mwhudson_> mtaylor: i can do that in-DC for you as well if you want
[01:47]  * mtaylor admits he might be one of those abusing-users
[01:47] <mwhudson_> (though not now you've started i guess)
[01:47] <mtaylor> mwhudson_: yeah... it's ok if it takes a little while
[01:47] <lifeless> mtaylor: hai
[01:47] <mtaylor> hai lifeless
[01:47] <beuno> mtaylor, "stress testers"
[01:47] <lifeless> mtaylor: I have a new format in development :P
[01:48] <mtaylor> beuno: yes! that's it
[01:48] <mtaylor> lifeless: would you like for me to migrate back and forth to and from it?
[01:48] <lifeless> mtaylor: mysql takes 14+GB in it at the moment :>
[01:48] <mtaylor> I seem to be doing that
[01:48] <mtaylor> ooh
[01:48] <lifeless> mtaylor: not just yet
[01:48] <mwhudson> mtaylor: if i was going to take offence, it's what you guys do to loggerhead :)
[01:48] <lifeless> mtaylor: but if you want to keep tabs on the work and play when time perhaps that would rock
[01:48] <mtaylor> lifeless: absolutely!
[01:49] <mtaylor> mwhudson: again... we "stress test" it :)
[01:49] <lifeless> mtaylor: commits in mysql are about 50% faster in it at the moment
[01:49] <beuno> mtaylor, if you're even around London, you can hear the server screeching from miles away
[01:49] <mtaylor> hahaha
[01:49] <mwhudson> mtaylor: are you using stacking at all yet?
[01:49] <mtaylor> mwhudson: haven't tried it with mysql branches yet
[01:50] <mwhudson> k
[01:50] <mtaylor> mwhudson: I was just trying it out on drizzle, but there it actually mde things slower
[01:50] <mtaylor> which wasn't _quite_ what I was expecting
[01:50] <mwhudson> huh
[01:50] <mwhudson> how big is a drizzle branch these days?
[01:51] <mtaylor> well, branch without repo is 47M
[01:51] <mtaylor> repo is 42M
[01:51] <lifeless> slim
[01:51] <lifeless> fresh import ?
[01:52] <mwhudson> mtaylor: when you say slower, you mean slower to push?
[01:52] <mtaylor> yeah - when we forked, we killed all the mysql history and started fresh from rev 1
[01:52] <mtaylor> mwhudson: I mean slower to branch
[01:53] <mtaylor> mwhudson: although I really need to sit down and do some more methodical testing
[01:53] <mtaylor> mwhudson: it's entirely possible that I just had something large running in the background and didnt' notice :)
[01:53] <mwhudson> oh, well i guess that's not so surprising, you have to open two branches
[01:53] <mwhudson> and do a bit more revision graph yoga i guess
[01:54] <mtaylor> mwhudson: and in this case, the branches are pretty small anyway, so the network access might just make it a net loss
[01:54] <mwhudson> well, i would have thought that it would still make pushing a heap faster
[01:54] <mwhudson> depends how many new branches you make i guess
[01:56] <mtaylor> I fully expect it to be quicker on mysql branches though
[01:56] <mwhudson> um yes
[01:56] <mwhudson> :)
[01:56] <mwhudson> if it's not, i'm giving up and moving to a farm...
[01:58] <thumper> mtaylor: when you branch, do you branch from LP or locally?
[01:58] <thumper> mtaylor: the way we tend to work is to have a local shared repo (in 1.6 format)
[01:59] <thumper> mtaylor: and branch into that, and push back to LP creating stacked branches
[01:59] <thumper> mtaylor: that way we get fast local branching and fast pushing to LP
[01:59] <mtaylor> well, I work exactly the same, except fo r the words "creating stacked branches"
[01:59] <thumper> mtaylor: I'm surprised than that you are getting slower branching
[02:00] <mtaylor> so, I think what I did was:
[02:00] <mtaylor> bzr branch --stacked lp:drizzle new_branch
[02:00] <mtaylor> locally
[02:00] <thumper> ah, why?
[02:00] <mtaylor> because I wasn't sure if I could do the stacking just on the launchpad push
[02:00] <thumper> just curious
[02:01] <thumper> hmm
[02:01] <mtaylor> ahhhh... pok
[02:01] <mtaylor> ok
[02:01] <thumper> that might explain some stacked mysql branches I had seen before we had the autostacking working for them
[02:01] <mwhudson> oh
[02:01] <mwhudson> that's rather different
[02:02] <mtaylor> so how does autostacking work on launchpad?
[02:02] <mtaylor> I just push, and it it's in 1.6 format, launchpad figures it out and does the right thing?
[02:02] <thumper> when you push a branch to LP, LP checks to see if there is a development focus branch
[02:02] <thumper> if your branch and repo format is 1.6 it will stack your branch on the dev focus automagically
[02:02] <mwhudson> mtaylor: it's more that launchpad gives a hint to the client
[02:02] <thumper> right
[02:03] <thumper> the bzr client gets told that the suggested stacked branch is X
[02:03] <thumper> and unless told otherwise, it uses that
[02:04] <thumper> once format 1.6 is the default (hopefully RSN) this will be blogged about more
[02:04] <mtaylor> ok. cool
[02:04] <thumper> as right now you need to do `bzr upgrade --1.6`
[02:05] <thumper> mtaylor: so... in theory, if you have a local shared repo in 1.6 format, with a branch in 1.6 format for mysql or drizzle, and push to LP, it will be stacked (as long as you have bzr 1.7 or later)
[02:05] <thumper> lots of caveats right now
[02:05] <mtaylor> thumper: and then when I branch it, I get a full branch, right? the stacking is just lp side?
[02:05] <thumper> right
[02:05] <mtaylor> ok. makes sense
[02:06] <thumper> so branching into a shared repo just does the right thing
[02:07] <mtaylor> sweet
[02:07] <mtaylor> that's even better than I was imagining before
[02:07] <thumper> we aim to please
[02:07] <thumper> (even if we sometimes miss the target)
[02:07] <mtaylor> well, one of us ran in to a bug with 1.7 and running out of memory when doing a diff...
[02:07] <thumper> ouch
[02:07] <mtaylor> so I can't upgrade all of drizzle yet... but it sounds like once that's sorted
[02:07] <mtaylor> we'll want to jump on this
[02:07] <thumper> 1.8 is out RSN
[02:08] <thumper> mtaylor: was a bug filed about the diff memory problem?
[02:09] <mtaylor> yeah. it's a known bug apparently
[02:10] <thumper> mtaylor: I was wondering so I could see if it was fixed for 1.8
[02:13] <mtaylor> thumper: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/280132
[02:14] <thumper> mtaylor: hmm... given jam's comment, it would be interesting to see if you still get this with 1.8
[02:15] <mtaylor> I'm hoping not
[02:16] <mtaylor> gah!
[02:16] <mtaylor> bzr: ERROR: Cannot convert to format <class 'bzrlib.branch.BzrBranchFormat6'>.
[02:16] <mtaylor> mwhudson: ^^
[02:16] <mwhudson> uh
[02:17] <mwhudson> mtaylor: what were you trying to do?
[02:17] <mtaylor> $ bzr upgrade --pack-0.92 lp:~mordred/drizzle/codestyle
[02:17] <mtaylor> from --1.6
[02:18] <mwhudson> uh, might be a bzr bug?
[02:19] <thumper> mtaylor: remind me why you are downgrading the format?
[02:19] <mtaylor> thumper: because of 280132 ...
[02:20] <mtaylor> thumper: the guy I work with can't pull my branch, because he had to downgrade bzr on his box
[02:20] <mtaylor> BUT... I think I've got a workaround
[02:20] <thumper> mtaylor: what did he downgrade to?
[02:20] <thumper> bzr 1.6 can read these
[02:20] <mtaylor> hrm.
[02:20] <thumper> or...
[02:20] <thumper> he could try upgrading to 1.8...
[02:21]  * thumper looks to see if it is out
[02:22] <mtaylor> thumper: so, I made a branch of this into a pack-0.92 branch locally
[02:23] <thumper> ok
[02:23] <mtaylor> thumper: and I'm going to push that to another location so that he can pull from it for now
[02:23]  * thumper nods
[02:23] <mtaylor> thumper: then I can also keep playing with 1.6 myself :)
[02:23] <thumper> :)
[02:26] <mtaylor> thumper: um...
[02:26] <thumper> mtaylor: yess....
[02:26] <mtaylor> thumper: I had a branch that was 0.92 format and pushed it
[02:26] <mtaylor> and it made it a 1.6 stacked branch on launchpad
[02:27] <thumper> hmm...
[02:27] <spiv> wgrant: this brightness key bug gets weirder and weirder.
[02:27] <thumper> mtaylor: which one?
[02:27] <mtaylor> is that because my shared repo is 1.6?
[02:27] <mtaylor> lp:~mordred/drizzle/devel
[02:27] <spiv> wgrant: Somehow it's gotten things into a state where my windows and cursor keys are mapped to nonsense
[02:27] <mtaylor> the stacked branch part was reall neat though
[02:27] <thumper> mtaylor: it isn't 1.6 and stacked
[02:27] <mtaylor> thumper: it's not?
[02:28] <mtaylor> e$ bzr push lp:~mordred/drizzle/devel
[02:28] <mtaylor> Using default stacking branch /~drizzle-developers/drizzle/development at bzr+ssh://mordred@bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Emordred/drizzle/
[02:28] <mtaylor> Created new branch.
[02:28] <thumper> mtaylor: it didn't use that
[02:28] <mtaylor> heh
[02:28] <thumper> mtaylor: I'm not sure why it said it did
[02:28] <wgrant> spiv: You are incredible. I reattached my screen for the first time in 3 hours just 20 seconds after you mentioned me...
[02:28] <wgrant> spiv: What does xev say?
[02:28] <thumper> I think it is just telling you that there is a default branch for you
[02:28] <spiv> wgrant: win == End, Down == KP_Enter, left == Henkan_Mode, up == Katakana, right == Muhenkan !
[02:28] <thumper> mtaylor: if you look at the page https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mordred/drizzle/devel
[02:29] <thumper> mtaylor: it says branch format 6 and packs
[02:29] <spiv> wgrant: on the plus side
[02:29] <mtaylor> thumper: so it does
[02:29] <thumper> mtaylor: stacked is branch format 7 and something else
[02:29] <wgrant> spiv: Uhm, wow. Does an X restart fix it? What is your keyboard model set to in System->Preferences->Keyboard (model, not layout).
[02:29] <spiv> wgrant: it appears that when this happened the 7000 key repeats stopped ;)
[02:29] <thumper> mtaylor: also it will say "Stacked on: ~drizzle-developers/drizzle/development" if it is stacked
[02:29] <mtaylor> sexy
[02:30] <wgrant> spiv: It seems that the key repeated is a hardware quirk that isn't being worked around by the kernel.
[02:30] <spiv> wgrant: I seemed to have been triggered by absent-mindedly hitting the brightness up/down key combos.
[02:30] <wgrant> Hmmmm.
[02:30] <spiv> The keyboard model claims to be Generic 105-key (Intl) PC
[02:31] <wgrant> Ermmm.
[02:31] <wgrant> It should be "Generic evdev-managed" or similar.
[02:31] <wgrant> Hmm.
[02:31] <wgrant> Maybe GNOME 2.24 got smarter than that.
[02:32] <wgrant> Because mine works either way now.
[02:32] <wgrant> Have you tried restarting X to see if you reproduce the strange keymappings?
[02:32] <spiv> Well, switching it to that makes no apparent difference.
[02:32] <spiv> I haven't yet, will try shortly.
[02:32] <spiv> Happily, afaik, only those 5 keys are confused.
[02:33] <spiv> So I can still kinda get work done...
[02:35] <spiv> Yep, logging out and logging back into gdm fixes it.
[02:36] <wgrant> Grr.
[02:36] <wgrant> Is it reproducible?
[02:36] <spiv> Well, it's happened to me twice.
[02:37] <spiv> The first time I foolishly put it down random weirdness because I was about to reboot for new kernel package anyway.
[02:38] <spiv> But I can't seem to trigger it on demand.
[02:38] <wgrant> Hm. I've never seen it.
[02:48] <spiv> The new behaviour where the brightness sometimes slowly fades (so slowly I don't realise it's happening until I think "hang on, the screen wasn't dim 2 minutes ago") even while I'm using it... that's also weird.
[02:49] <wgrant> Right, I know why that happens, and it happened for a while early in Hardy.
[02:50] <spiv> Ok, and now the Alt key just got stuck on.
[02:50] <spiv> I had to kill X to get sanity back.
[02:50] <spiv> (Again, life was fine in a text VT though)
[02:50] <spiv> I'm not having a good half-hour!
[02:50] <wgrant> g-p-m attempts to set the brightness first through X, and then through hal if X refuses. Dell laptops need the hal method, but for some reason the 630m confused X into saying that it can set the brightness from 0-15000.
[02:50] <spiv> I should probably take the hint and go to lunch...
[02:51] <wgrant> Changing the brightness through X works, but very slowly.
[02:51] <wgrant> AIUI it shouldn't work at all, but it does.
[02:51] <wgrant> I'm planning to look at that over the weekend.
[02:51] <spiv> wgrant: I'm very glad to hear that :)
[04:17] <_Andrew> one of the packages in my ppa disappeared
[04:18] <_Andrew> It's still in the repo but not on my archives page.. mmm
[04:25] <thumper> _Andrew: has it been "overwritten" with a later version?
[04:25] <_Andrew> Yeah, I think that's what happened.
[04:25] <_Andrew> false alarm
[06:47] <lifeless> mtaylor: is drizzle a clean import of the same code?
[06:47] <mtaylor> lifeless: yes. it started off that way ... well, brian has already deleted a lot before he did the first import
[06:47] <lifeless> mtaylor: righto
[06:48] <lifeless> mtaylor: drizzle might be something good to play with my repository branch's dev formats on
[06:48] <mtaylor> lifeless: absolutely. we have a _much_ smaller history :)
[06:48] <lifeless> it converts ~ 1 revision every 0.8 seconds on my little lappy
[06:48] <mtaylor> well... we have 500... so that would only be ~8 minutes, no?
[06:49] <lifeless> yah
[06:49] <lifeless> 54K takes a day+
[06:50] <lifeless> right now, commit is probably faster on this format
[06:50] <mtaylor> awesome
[06:50] <mtaylor> well, we're fans of speed
[06:50] <lifeless> note that its not in mainline; the format may change pull to pull :>
[06:50] <mtaylor> :) I was guessing that might be the case...
[06:51] <lifeless> so if it barfs just revert back to a previous pull
[06:51] <mtaylor> where's the tree?
[06:51] <lifeless> or simply test and mail me good/bad :>
[06:51] <lifeless> people.ubuntu.com/~robertc/baz2.0/repository
[06:51] <lifeless> you may find this plugin http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lifeless/+junk/bzr-repodetails useful
[06:52] <lifeless> (it needs that repository branch)
[08:38] <bugabundo_work> will some one please kill LP #183685. install a filter or something that captures "unsubscribe" emails and sent and auto-reply to the user explaining how to get out of the bug via email and LP web interface, PLEASE?
[08:40] <wgrant> unsubscribe
[08:41] <bugabundo_work> eheh very fine wgrant
[08:41] <bugabundo_work> have you even got to the trouble to read that page?
[08:41] <wgrant> I have.
[08:41] <bugabundo_work> or count how many people sent unsubscribe there ?
[08:42] <wgrant> I wonder if we should file a bug on malone, and get all bug triagers to ask to unsubscribe from it.
[10:13] <wgrant> bigjools: You'll make a lot of people very happy if you make PPA upload permissions separate.
[10:13] <bigjools> wgrant: no kidding :)
[10:14] <wgrant> Once you've that and multiple PPAs per Person, it'll all be a lot more sensible and usable.
[10:14] <bugabundo_work> yeah
[10:14] <bugabundo_work> it would be great...
[10:15] <bugabundo_work> no need to have lots of extra stuff that one doesn't need to install just to test a package
[10:15] <wgrant> Precisely.
[10:16] <bugabundo_work> but would it work as "virtual" ppa? or does the user need to create a real PPA?
[12:18] <bugabundo_work> who is in charge today of LP help?
[13:53] <ahasenack> is there a way to search for bugs that are not attached to any milestone?
[13:53] <ahasenack> so far it seems I have to list them all, and then order by milestone and go to the end
[13:54] <Hobbsee> ahasenack: don't think so.
[16:43] <maestrolinux> http://s2.ar.bitefight.org/c.php?uid=19732
[19:25] <mtaylor> lifeless: $ bzr info
[19:25] <mtaylor> Unable to load plugin 'repodetails' from '/home/mtaylor/.bazaar/plugins'
[19:25] <mtaylor> if I make a series, is there a way to delete it later?
[19:26] <kiko-phone> mtaylor, any admin can do it -- what's the series?
[19:27] <mtaylor> kiko-phone: haven't made it yet... just wanted to know if it was undoable
[19:27] <mtaylor> kiko-phone: thanks
[19:31] <beuno> mtaylor, you should have a traceback for that plugin failing to load in ~/.bzr.log
[19:32] <mtaylor> beuno: indeed...
[19:32] <mtaylor> lifeless: http://pastebin.com/m39aa93a9
[19:32] <mtaylor> beuno: I installed a new plugin lifeless is working on
[19:33] <beuno> mtaylor, very nice of you
[19:33] <beuno> didn't that have to go with this other bzr branch as well?
[19:34] <mtaylor> beuno: well, it's a new branch format, so I was going to try upgrading a branch to it
[19:34] <rockstar> mtaylor, #bzr might be a better venue for that.
[19:34] <mtaylor> crappit
[19:34] <mtaylor> rockstar: you're right. sorry
[19:34] <rockstar> lifeless probably doesn't wake up for anthoer six hours or so.
[19:35] <beuno> and, well, it's going to be saturday for him  :)
[19:35] <rockstar> Oh yeah, it will be.
[19:35] <rockstar> beuno, this being in London thing has be all screwed up.  :)
[19:39] <Kaivalagi> hi all
[19:40] <Kaivalagi> simple question, why does it take so long for a "published" package to actually be available?
[19:42] <Kaivalagi> It is usually at least 20 minutes before a published package shows up available through librarian...
[19:43] <rick_h_> well, just guessing here...but if it's anything like the server farm where I work. Syncs happen on occassion and need time to get to each box in the farm
[19:46] <Kaivalagi> See what you're saying, a simple scheduled copy of the completed build only comes around every 20 minutes, something like that. If that is the case the status shouldn't be "published" until it is published :) should be "built". I can't grumble about a free service though can I, thanks
[19:47] <rockstar> Kaivalagi, well, it may be available in the package, but the Release file hasn't added it, so apt/aptitude/synaptic/whatever hasn't found it.
[19:48] <rockstar> You can still download the package from the web interface, so it's technically "published."
[19:48]  * rockstar rationalizes
[19:49] <Kaivalagi> fair enough, thanks guys
[23:37]  * Hobbsee beats Rinchen with a rubber chicken
[23:37] <Rinchen> owie
[23:38] <Hobbsee> Rinchen: please don't use "today" in mails.
[23:38] <Rinchen> ok, I'll use "now!" instead
[23:38] <Hobbsee> hehe.  right, so it is now?
[23:38] <Rinchen> yes
[23:38] <Hobbsee> oh
[23:38] <Rinchen> but it's a good point
[23:39] <Hobbsee> by my reckoning, it should be tomorrow.  I think.
[23:39] <Hobbsee> or at least, +23 hours or something.
[23:39] <Rinchen> it's about 22:39 UTC currently
[23:39] <Hobbsee> "today", "tomorrow", etc, are very relatives
[23:39] <Hobbsee> ahhh
[23:39] <Hobbsee> hm, so none of the clocks are showing UTC time.
[23:41] <Rinchen> well, my intrepid gnome clock shows London as 23:40 BST +7
[23:41] <Rinchen> instead of +1
[23:41] <kiko> and I'm still at millbank. good grief
[23:42] <wgrant> Why are we given just an hour's notice of LP upgrades like this? It's somewhat inconvenient.
[23:42] <Nafallo> Rinchen: +7 from where you are.
[23:42] <Hobbsee> wgrant: because no one else is *possibly* going to be using launchpad at midnight, UTC time.  Didn't you know?
[23:42] <Rinchen> Nafallo, ah! right of course... that wasn't very obivous
[23:42] <Nafallo> kiko: good view :-)
[23:42] <Nafallo> Rinchen: was to me ;-)
[23:42] <Hobbsee> wgrant: (probably a critical immediate fix, too)
[23:43]  * Hobbsee adds a special UTC field to gnome-clock.
[23:43] <kiko> wgrant, well, stuff took a while to land
[23:43] <Nafallo> stuff like kiko in Millbank? ;-)
[23:43] <kiko> heh
[23:44] <kiko> I'm taking a while to take off
[23:44] <kiko> Hobbsee, wgrant: it's back up fwiw
[23:44] <Hobbsee> kiko: \o/
[23:44] <wgrant> kiko: Excellent.
[23:45] <Hobbsee> Rinchen: at least "now" is universal in all timezones :)
[23:45] <Rinchen> Hobbsee, yes except it's dependent upon when you receive the email, much like "today"
[23:45] <Rinchen> email delayed or you read it tonight...well...
[23:46] <Hobbsee> Rinchen: well, that's true.
[23:46] <Rinchen> I'll do better next time.
[23:46] <Hobbsee> Rinchen: you can usually see the received time, so if your email doesn't suck, it should be fine :)
[23:46] <Hobbsee> cool
[23:46] <wgrant> Unless you're using Exchange, you can see the date of transmission.
[23:47] <wgrant> When slangasek announces that Intrepid is frozen, one doesn't assume that it freezes when one reads it.
[23:47] <Nafallo> wgrant: you suggest sending the notification when things are back up? :-)
[23:48] <wgrant> Nafallo: ... not quite.
[23:48] <Nafallo> wgrant: "Launchpad was down for maintenance at ..." :-P
[23:48] <Rinchen> Ideally I'd like Launchpad to display something to alert users of anticipated downtime.
[23:48] <Rinchen> We have some ideas on how to do that.
[23:48] <wgrant> It did for 2.1.10...
[23:49] <Nafallo> Rinchen: it did for my +builds :-)
[23:49] <wgrant> Just not very far in advance.
[23:49] <Nafallo> wgrant: 15 minutes is PLENTY of time ;-)
[23:49] <wgrant> Can you not schedule a supplementary rollout for +2 days, or do you roll it out as soon as the fixes are landed?
[23:50] <Rinchen> wgrant, Hobbsee - you'll want to be following this:  https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/launchpad-foundations/+spec/read-only-launchpad
[23:50] <kiko> wgrant, uhhh, what do you mean?
[23:50] <wgrant> Rinchen: I've been subscribed for a long time now.
[23:50] <kiko> we do rollouts because we actually have to -- edge won't update until we actually roll out all DB patches!
[23:51] <kiko> it's not like we actually want to do them you know :)
[23:51] <Hobbsee> Rinchen: ah yes, i've heard about that.
[23:52] <wgrant> kiko: So the purpose of this rollout wasn't just cherrypicking critical fixes, but some DB patches for 2.1.11?
[23:52] <kiko> wgrant, well, it's always both
[23:52] <wgrant> Ahh.
[23:52] <wgrant> I wasn't aware of the latter bit.
[23:52] <Nafallo> let's put it this way. kiko haven't left the office yet, and it's 8 minutes to midnight ;-)
[23:53] <kiko> we often don't do re-rollouts though
[23:53] <Nafallo> srsly :-P
[23:53] <kiko> but sometimes we do
[23:53] <Rinchen> kiko, 3 piece suite, bracers, and a red tie.
[23:53] <Rinchen> kiko, for Sunday
[23:54] <kiko> ai, that will be expensive
[23:54] <Rinchen> Grey suit, red tie
[23:54]  * Nafallo thinks kiko will be sleeping on the printer tonight :-)
[23:54] <kiko> I will arrange tomorrow
[23:55] <Rinchen> Nafallo, please remind kiko about when the Tube stops running :-)  He's almost to Taxi time.
[23:55] <Rinchen> I want to see mrevell's tux and bowler personally
[23:55] <Nafallo> Rinchen: lol. he can haz bike.
[23:55] <Nafallo> Rinchen: not the usual hotel?
[23:55] <Rinchen> Nafallo, near paddington this time
[23:55] <kiko> I need to take some box back to the hotel, hmm
[23:55] <Nafallo> Rinchen: FAIL
[23:55] <kiko> anyway, outta here!
[23:56]  * wgrant wonders what is happening on Sunday.
[23:56]  * Nafallo thought he was late out from "his office" :-P
[23:56] <Rinchen> Kiko is having the Launchpad team over for a formal dress-up party.
[23:56] <Nafallo> but that was several hours ago.
[23:56] <Hobbsee> pics or it didn't happen!
[23:56] <Rinchen> He's testing his management skills.
[23:56] <Rinchen> Have you ever tried to get folks like us to dress up?
[23:56] <wgrant> Nafallo: I think you have one of the better-connected offices.
[23:56] <Rinchen> Dress up usually means the good t-shirts and the jeans without holes
[23:57] <Hobbsee> hah
[23:57] <wgrant> Heh.
[23:57] <Nafallo> 21:03 [FreeNode] -!- You have been marked as being away
[23:57] <Hobbsee> and this is why i like free software...
[23:57]  * kiko waves
[23:57] <wgrant> Bye kiko!
[23:57] <Nafallo> wgrant: hehe. could say that ;-)
[23:57] <Nafallo> wgrant: uncountable amounts of gigs flowing through that building :-P
[23:58]  * wgrant sneaks some extra Ethernet cables in.
[23:59] <Nafallo> reminds me...
[23:59] <Nafallo> I should get a fibre card for my laptop.
[23:59] <Rinchen> I swear the static electricity at the Canonical office in London is due to the mega-amps on the gazillion wifi nodes.
[23:59] <Nafallo> Rinchen: ey! it's only four.
[23:59] <Rinchen> ssshhh!