[00:00] <chrisccoulson> jrib - i can build pywebkitgtk with that debdiff
[00:00] <jrib> chrisccoulson: thanks, I'll troubleshoot here then
[00:00] <bdmurray> no they are different I was just wondering if the bug should affect another package too
[00:00] <chrisccoulson> which stage are you having difficulty with? building the source package or building the binary with pbuilder?
[00:01] <hggdh> charlie-tca, you got a +1 from me.
[00:01] <charlie-tca> Thanks. I didn't know I was even visible
[00:01] <hggdh> :-) everybody is visible
[00:02] <hggdh> bdmurray, I quickly tested bug 217900, but did not have time to keep on. It is reproducible on both exo-eject and gnome-eject.
[00:04] <bdmurray> hmm
[00:05] <charlie-tca> I never tested gnome-eject, since the original report was for exo-eject
[00:06] <bdmurray> Okay, I read comment 6 as you had tested gnome-eject
[00:06] <jrib> chrisccoulson: getting errors on debuild -us -uc.  I'll try in pbuilder.  if you want to look: http://pastebin.com/f1b5e014c
[00:07] <chrisccoulson> jrib - that will try to build the binary package outside of the clean pbuilder environment, with no build dependency handling (I think)
[00:07] <chrisccoulson> try 'debuild -S -us -uc' to build just the source package
[00:08] <chrisccoulson> then use pbuilder to build the binary package from the source package you just created
[00:08] <jrib> chrisccoulson: that works fine
[00:09] <hggdh> bdmurray, the question is if gnome-eject or exo-eject are expected to open the empty tray (theoretically they are to be used to eject a CD/DVD from the tray)
[00:09] <james_w> it will have build-dependencies installed, it will bail out if you don;t
[00:09] <james_w> the error you are seeing there is something funky with libtool I believe.
[00:10] <james_w> it's a problem with a certain version of libtool or something
[00:17] <jrib> chrisccoulson, james_w: fails in pbuilder for me as well with the same errors.  Does pbuilder save logs of builds somewhere by the way?
[00:18] <james_w> jrib: there's a --logfile option, but not by default
[00:18] <chrisccoulson> you beat me to it;)
[00:19] <jrib> chrisccoulson: you did it in an intrepid pbuilder?
[00:20] <chrisccoulson> intrepid-amd64
[00:20] <chrisccoulson> what are you trying it in?
[00:20] <jrib> amd64 here as well, hrmm
[00:20] <jrib> same
[00:20] <jrib> let me start over and tell you exactly what I do
[00:25] <jrib> of course it now builds.  thanks james_w and chrisccoulson
[00:25] <chrisccoulson> thats good ;)
[00:26] <jrib> chrisccoulson: can you tell me if doing 'debuild -us -uc' fails for you?
[00:26] <jrib> instead of pbuilder
[00:27] <chrisccoulson> yeah, it fails for me but due to unmet build deps
[00:27] <jrib> I did apt-get build-deps though
[01:13] <azimout> i asked about this about a week ago: should we get cracking on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/feisty/+bugs ???
[01:31] <calc> 2 bugs to 90% bugwatched :)
[01:32] <greg-g> wow
[01:38] <calc> now if i could just get my overall upstream bug percentage to 90% ;-)
[01:55] <Bit_Breaker> hello
[01:55] <Bit_Breaker> i did an update and now i have to versions in my boot screen \
[01:55] <Bit_Breaker> how do i fix
[01:56] <Bit_Breaker> sry ubuntu-bugs wrong IM
[01:58] <charlie-tca> Bit_Breaker: it's okay to have more than one version. Normally the top one is the latest update.
[01:58] <charlie-tca> The system will automatically select that one when it boots
[01:59] <Bit_Breaker> ok.. i see whats happening now
[02:00] <Bit_Breaker> it lags some times. when i boot to 2.6-24-21
[02:01] <Bit_Breaker> er *24
[02:03] <Woody86> Is there anything else I can help out with for bugs besides  triage? I'm not finding any bugs I can duplicate :(
[02:06] <csilk> NEed some advice: I'm packaging a new app. the app has a 'bug' which causes a compilation error udner the newer versions of GCC, upstream advise (in their install instructions) that users add 2 lines of code to the top of a C++ source file. If I do this in the package do I just note that in the changelog or is modifying the code a big no no?
[02:07] <csilk> .. sorry, should of been in motu chan
[02:07] <calc> yipee hit 90% now and it turned green
[02:08] <hggdh> Woody86, you can see if all necessary data is in, for example; you can find bugs without packages, and assign the correct packages to them
[02:08] <hggdh> etc
[02:38] <Woody86> is this even a bug?? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-meta/+bug/275777
[02:38] <Woody86> sounds like a suggestion to me
[02:40] <greg-g> Woody86: there are a couple of issues raised in that bug.  But one of them is a valid request: enable the use of web-based email applications as the user default choice
[02:41] <Woody86> oh, but that's still considered a bug greg-g?
[02:41] <greg-g> it is a feature request, so yes.
[02:41] <Woody86> ah i see
[02:41] <Woody86> thx :)
[02:41] <greg-g> so, where should that bug be assigned then?
[02:41] <greg-g> Woody86: it isn't an Ubuntu-meta bug
[02:42] <Woody86> huh?
[02:43] <greg-g> Woody86: it is reported against the "ubuntu-meta" package, but that is not what the bug should be reported against
[02:43] <Woody86> oh, well how do you change that?
[02:43] <Woody86> and change it to what?
[02:44] <greg-g> Woody86: there are some tips on this page for figuring that out: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage
[02:45] <greg-g> a good way is using that command line argument about half-way down the page
[02:45] <Woody86> greg-g -  ah, ok, thx
[02:45] <greg-g> so, opening up the preferred applications dialog and running that command gives me:
[02:45] <greg-g> WM_CLASS(STRING) = "gnome-default-applications-properties", "Gnome-default-applications-properties"
[02:47] <greg-g> then, typing "dpkg -S gnome-default-applications-properties" in the command line gives me:
[02:47] <greg-g> gnome-control-center: /usr/bin/gnome-default-applications-properties
[02:47] <greg-g> which is the package you should report it against
[02:47] <greg-g> does this makes sense?
[02:48] <Woody86> greg-g -  as clear as mud :)
[02:48] <Woody86> you'll have to be gentle, this is my first time
[02:48] <greg-g> did you try it
[02:48] <greg-g> ok, starting over :)
[02:49] <greg-g> where do you think they set this type of information, the default application? (this requires some pre-knowledge)
[02:50] <Woody86> no idea
[02:51] <greg-g> well, you go to System -> Preferences -> Preferred Applications
[02:51] <greg-g> that opens up the dialog where you can set your, Preferred Application
[02:51] <greg-g> for various tasks
[02:51] <Woody86> ah ok
[02:51] <Woody86> i thought you were talking about something on the bug report
[02:51] <Woody86> ok ok
[02:52] <greg-g> so, we need to figure out which package provides that functionality, which is what the wiki page tries to help with: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage
[02:52] <greg-g> this is for the bug report, they are trying to set an online app as their preferred application, right?
[02:52] <Woody86> yeah
[02:52] <greg-g> cool.
[02:52] <Awsoonn> wrt: bug 241920, do you know anythign of a python programming ebook being included in the default ubuntu install someplace?
[02:53] <greg-g> Woody86: so, we figured out which dialog gives us this option, now using that Find Program Executable part will gives us a bit more information: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage#Find%20the%20program%20executable
[02:53] <greg-g> so, with that dialog still open, we copy the line "xprop | grep WM_CLASS" into a terminal
[02:54] <greg-g> that will gives us a cross hairs which we then click on that dialog.
[02:54] <Woody86> ok
[02:54] <Woody86> :)
[02:55] <Woody86> so gnome-default-applications-properties?
[02:56] <greg-g> correct, that is the executable.  But there is one more step, sadly.  We want the package name for that executable (the reason they are not the same is a question for a later date)
[02:56] <Woody86> WOOT!
[02:56] <greg-g> one way of finding the package is typing "dpkg -S dpkg -S gnome-default-applications-properties" into the terminal
[02:57] <greg-g> erm, just "dpkg -S gnome-default-applications-properties"
[02:57] <Woody86> greg-g -  ok
[02:57] <charlie-tca> Awsoonn: Yes, is not included in the packages anymore?
[02:57] <greg-g> Woody86: so, after entering that command, which package do you think provides the functionality?
[02:57] <Awsoonn> charlie-tca: I was just surprised to see it exists, let anoe is on teh default install
[02:58] <charlie-tca> Awsoonn: It used to install to /usr/share/diveintopython, I think
[02:58] <Woody86> greg-g -  gnome-control-center?
[02:58] <greg-g> correct.
[02:58] <Woody86> WOOT!
[02:58] <greg-g> :)
[02:58] <Woody86> you kick butt!
[02:58] <Woody86> here's $5!----------------->$5
[02:59] <greg-g> now... this bug report is EXTRA EXTRA fun because they decided to report 3 separate issues in one report, which is a no-no
[02:59] <charlie-tca> Don't know what version does default install for the book
[02:59] <Woody86> alright, my first bug correction :)
[02:59] <Bit_Breaker> :-)
[02:59] <Woody86> ok, so we can break it apart?
[02:59] <Bit_Breaker> Yay!!
[02:59] <Awsoonn> is there a way to see what packages depend/recommend/suggest a package?
[03:00] <greg-g> Woody86: yeah, and unfortunately that means reporting two new bugs, there is no automatic way of doing it.
[03:00] <Bit_Breaker> ok i want to help to :-[
[03:00] <charlie-tca> apt-cache package, i think
[03:00] <greg-g> Woody86: what I normally do is ask the original bug reporter to do that, as they are the ones interested in to fixing the issue.
[03:00] <Woody86> ok
[03:00] <greg-g> Woody86: so, we can edit the description to just refer to one bug, the prefer applications one.
[03:01] <greg-g> Woody86: which basically means just deleting those last two sentences.  You can do this by clicking on the "update description" link
[03:02] <greg-g> Woody86: let me know when you have edited the description
[03:02] <charlie-tca> Awsoonn: apt-cache showpkg package_name
[03:02] <Woody86> ok
[03:02] <Woody86> one sec...
[03:02] <greg-g> no problem
[03:03] <Awsoonn> found it, it is direct depend of ubuntu-desktop...
[03:04] <charlie-tca> why...?
[03:04] <Awsoonn> that be it. I wonder why that is in the default install indeed.
[03:05] <charlie-tca> Looks like it to me.
[03:05] <Woody86> greg-g -  so just delete the last 2 items he mentioned, and then respond asking him to make seperate posts for seperate bugs?
[03:06] <greg-g> correct, and ask nicely :)
[03:06] <Woody86> and change it from ubuntu-meta to gnome-control-center?
[03:06] <greg-g> correct!
[03:06] <greg-g> Woody86: you've got it!
[03:06] <Woody86> ok just wanted to make sure before I go hacking it up :)
[03:07] <greg-g> of course, always good to ask.
[03:09] <greg-g> Woody86: I also forgot a step, when you are done, it would be good to change the title of the bug to something more meaningful as well. Something like "Allow webapps as preferred applications"
[03:10] <greg-g> Woody86: you can do that by clicking on that same description edit link
[03:11] <Woody86> how do I move it to gnome-control-center?
[03:12] <greg-g> Woody86: to do that you click on the drop down arrow next to the current package name "ubuntu-meta" and next to that input box there is a "Choose..." link.  Click that, enter gnome-control-center, and it should provide you the option.
[03:14] <Woody86> Woo Hooo!
[03:14] <Woody86> worked like a dream :D
[03:14] <Woody86> thanks greg-g!
[03:15] <greg-g> Woody86: thank YOU for helping and taking the time to learn how to do more advanced things.
[03:16] <greg-g> looks great Woody86.
[03:16] <Woody86> greg-g -  no, thank YOU for helping and taking the time to teach more advanced things :)
[03:16] <Woody86> tyvm, I had a good teacher, what can I say??
[03:17] <greg-g> :)
[03:17] <Woody86> now I'm gonna try to hunt down some more :D
[03:17] <greg-g> Woody86: do you want to go even deeper? There is one more step that could help out this bug tremendously.
[03:17] <Woody86> post 2 new ones?
[03:17] <greg-g> nope.
[03:17] <Woody86> ?
[03:18] <Woody86> what can I do?
[03:18] <greg-g> Since this is a feature request and it isn't something that the Ubuntu developers will work on (they are a small group of people) it should instead be reported to the "upstream" developers of the software, the people who are more likely able to add the feature.
[03:19] <Woody86> greg-g -  ok, report it to them?
[03:20] <greg-g> yep, so, the upstream project for this package is GNOME, which you can guess from the package name
[03:20] <Woody86> ok
[03:20] <greg-g> they have a bug tracker at http://bugzilla.gnome.org/
[03:21] <Woody86> greg-g -  register with their site?
[03:22] <greg-g> if you wish. however, a good thing to do first, to save effort, is just to see if it is already reported there, which doesn't require a login
[03:22] <Woody86> ok, so just search for it?
[03:22] <greg-g> yep
[03:23] <greg-g> Woody86: one way is to click on "Product Summary" on that main page and in the drop-down list find gnome-control-center.  Then you can limit your search just to that package.
[03:24] <Woody86> ah! :)
[03:26] <Woody86> I'm not seeing anything....
[03:27] <greg-g> Woody86: yep, neither am I.
[03:27] <greg-g> Unless you really want to, I can report this there since I already have a login.  Then I'll show you how you can link it to the Launchpad bug.
[03:28] <Woody86> eh, I might as well sign up for an account, in case I need to do this again
[03:28] <greg-g> ok
[03:28] <greg-g> sure thing
[03:28] <Woody86> at least I can go through registration while I've got you here
[03:28] <greg-g> yep
[03:30] <Woody86> ok, im in :)
[03:31] <greg-g> alrighty, go ahead and start the process by clicking on that "New BUg" link
[03:31] <Woody86> file the bug under Usability or Feature Request?
[03:31] <greg-g> Feature request
[03:31] <Woody86> ok, and this goes under Desktop? Productivity?...
[03:31] <Woody86> Other?
[03:32] <greg-g> Desktop, then in the list below that you should be able to find gnome-control-center
[03:32] <Woody86> ok
[03:32] <Woody86> ok and then preferred applications...
[03:33] <greg-g> yep
[03:33] <Woody86> version selection? unspecified?
[03:33] <greg-g> 2.24.x
[03:34] <Woody86> ok
[03:34] <greg-g> that is what is shipping with Intrepid (what I'm using)
[03:34] <Woody86> ah, ok
[03:34] <greg-g> so, here is the part where I can give you some advice style wise
[03:34] <Woody86> ok
[03:35] <greg-g> if you look at http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=527754 you can see the general style for how to enter the information
[03:35] <greg-g> the title is the title from LP, the descriptin includes that line "Originally opened in LP....." and then a separator, then the description copied from LP
[03:36] <greg-g> Woody86: and it is best to convert your bug URL to that short version, http://launchpad.net/bugs/<bugnumber>
[03:36] <Woody86> ok
[03:36] <Woody86> so just copy the title, specify where it came from, and copy over the body?
[03:37] <greg-g> yep
[03:37] <Woody86> ok...
[03:37] <greg-g> go ahead and paste the link for the new bug when you are done.
[03:39] <Woody86> should i use the simple guide, or the advanced one?
[03:40] <greg-g> Woody86: I thought you were already in the middle of the simple guide?
[03:40] <greg-g> unless I am misunderstanding the question
[03:40] <Woody86> ok, ok, nevermind, I saw your "[Enhancement,New] thing and I thought there was more to put in
[03:41] <greg-g> Woody86: so is it reported now?
[03:42] <Woody86> yeah, let me find the link here...
[03:42] <Woody86> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=557346
[03:43] <greg-g> looks good.
[03:43] <Woody86> yup, that's me :D
[03:43] <Woody86> thank you very much :D
[03:43] <greg-g> now, to link the two.
[03:43] <greg-g> last step, I promise! :)
[03:43] <Woody86> haha
[03:44] <greg-g> back on the Launchpad bug report
[03:44] <Woody86> ok
[03:44] <greg-g> there is the "Also affects project" link with the green plus next to it
[03:44] <greg-g> click on that
[03:44] <Woody86> ok
[03:44] <Woody86> post link there?
[03:44] <greg-g> yep
[03:45] <Woody86> ok :)
[03:45] <greg-g> then, you can leave a comment saying "Thank you for your bug report. This bug has been reported to the developers of the software. You can track it and make comments here: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=557346"
[03:45] <greg-g> and, YOU'RE DONE!
[03:46] <Woody86> Allright!! :D
[03:46] <Woody86> my first bug edit, and upstream!!
[03:46] <greg-g> that was a great example to work with
[03:46] <Woody86> Thank you VERY much for taking the time to walk me through all of this
[03:46] <greg-g> you're welcome
[03:47] <greg-g> Woody86: no you know a LOT of the different steps to effectively move a bug around so that it is looked at by the best possible people.
[03:47] <greg-g> s/no/now/
[03:48] <Woody86> :D
[03:48] <Woody86> now I get to hunt down more!
[03:48] <greg-g> awesome!
[03:48] <greg-g> thanks for helpin!
[03:48] <greg-g> +g
[03:48] <Woody86> I'm definately going to have to ask for those terminal inputs when I come to that point :D
[03:49] <Woody86> to pull up the program info
[03:49]  * charlie-tca gives greg-g a big hug for that
[03:49] <Woody86> yes, thank you very much greg-g!
[03:49] <greg-g> charlie-tca: thanks :)
[03:49] <greg-g> Woody86: the best place to hunt for information on how to do things is this link: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/KnowledgeBase
[03:50] <greg-g> on there it links to the Find the Right Package bug, which has that command to find the package name
[03:50] <greg-g> gah, "Find the Right Package PAGE" not bug.... I'm getting tired I guess :)
[03:51] <Woody86> hah
[03:51] <Woody86> ok, thanks again
[03:51] <Woody86> i just made a new folder of bookmarks for bugging :D
[03:51] <greg-g> no worries.
[03:51] <greg-g> well done, thats the attitude! :)
[03:57] <Woody86> ok, well while I'm picking your brains... :)
[03:58] <Woody86> would this one be considered a meta package? and would I need to have him make seperate bug reports for each topic?...
[03:58] <Woody86> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-meta/+bug/223436
[03:59] <Woody86> oh, and on the last one I just did, am I supposed to mark it Green?
[04:03] <greg-g> Woody86: the one you sent upstream? heck yeah set that one as green, and put your name next to it, you deserve that credit
[04:03] <Woody86> yeah, Derreck got it :(
[04:05] <greg-g> I might be missing something, but he iddn't do anything for that bug, feel free to replace his name with yours
[04:06] <greg-g> nope, I'm not missing anything, he didn't.
[04:07] <Woody86> I tried, it still came up as his name?
[04:09] <Woody86> is it supposed to be assigned to me?
[04:09] <greg-g> Woody86: I changed it to "Woody86" feel free to change it to your wiki name or something else, if you wish.
[04:09] <greg-g> Woody86: yep, you did the work.
[04:09] <greg-g> oh, assigned?
[04:09] <greg-g> what do you mean assigned? where?
[04:09] <greg-g> in Launchpad no, just subscribe to the bug.  Assigned is for the person actively working on fixing the issue.
[04:10] <Woody86> but am I supposed to set it to Triaged, and then assign it to me? or jus mark it as triaged, and my name will come up?
[04:10] <Woody86> ok
[04:10] <Woody86> how did you change that?
[04:10] <greg-g> on the wiki page? it is a wiki, I just edited it :)
[04:12] <Woody86> where did you change it though? inside the bug report?
[04:12] <greg-g> If you are referring to the name on the wiki page, I changed the wiki page.
[04:13] <greg-g> if you are logged in to the wiki, at the top of the page there is an "Edit" link
[04:14] <Woody86> ah!!
[04:14] <Woody86> ok,
[04:14] <Woody86> i'm not logged in! haha
[04:14] <Woody86> i was really confused for a min there, sorry about that
[04:14] <greg-g> heh, no worries.
[04:16] <greg-g> Awsoonn: are you actively working on a fix for the diveintopython bug?
[04:35] <Woody86> other than hunting down bugs, what are other ways I could help out Ubuntu? I don't have any programming experience, either.
[04:35] <Woody86> don't worry, I'm not giving up on bugs! I'm just curious :)
[04:35] <persia> Woody86, You could help test the release candidates.
[04:36] <Woody86> persia -  like what? I have 8.10 installed already
[04:36] <persia> Woody86, Also, lots of bugs don't need a programmer : they may just be spelling mistakes, grammar mistakes, missing a .desktop file, missing a manpage, etc.  You could probably prepare fixes for any of those, and send them upstream.
[04:37] <persia> Woody86, Look at iso.qa.ubuntu.com for information about testing the release candidates.
[04:37] <Woody86> persia -  dont worry! I'm not giving up on bugs! :D I'm just curious what else is out there as well
[04:38] <persia> Also, just using Ubuntu, and finding more bugs is helpful : especially if you can describe the bug clearly : often we get bug reports like "gstreamer is broken" which isn't very helpful.
[04:38] <Woody86> haha
[04:39] <persia> Aside from bug work, testing, and development, there is community work : helping get the local community interested in Ubuntu, and getting it installed in more homes, offices, and factories.
[04:39] <persia> There's documentation : making sure that Ubuntu has useful help files, and instructions for completing most common tasks.
[04:41] <Woody86> Oh, I've been trying to get locals to come onboard the Ubuntu Train - I've got 4 so far :)
[04:42] <Woody86> persia - ok, thanks for the info!
[04:42] <persia> Woody86, Thanks for helping out.
[04:43] <Woody86> persia -  you don't have to thank me, I would be ecstatic if the entire world was open-source
[07:10] <dholbach> good morning
[08:07] <CarlFK> ﻿https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dvgrab/+bug/287391  anything else I can supply?
[10:45] <waldenasta> #nicksetup
[10:47] <azimout> good morning, everyone
[10:47] <azimout> i have made a mistake about question #47276
[10:47] <azimout> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/47276
[10:48] <azimout> what do you think i should do about it?
[11:01] <azimout> anyone?
[11:04] <thekorn> azimout: what went wrong about this question?
[11:11] <azimout> i misunderstood what the reporter was asking, and converted to question
[11:12] <azimout> in fact, it seems the reporter is right, new icons and artwork in general were promised for intrepid
[11:13] <Treenaks> azimout: there's new background artwork!
[11:17] <thekorn> azimout:first, as Treenaks said, there is some new artwork,
[11:17] <thekorn> and second, such bugs would always be "won't fix", IMO
[11:18] <Treenaks> there are better icons in the default GTK theme, imho
[11:18] <thekorn> so nothing to really care about
[11:21] <azimout> ok, thanx you guys...
[11:34] <danage> asac: i can try the patch but i have no idea how to make network manager and compile that in. if there are instructions i can probably do it (they don't need to be super basic)
[11:51] <asac> danping me again in 10 minutes ;)
[11:51] <asac> hmm ... gone
[12:32] <Awsoonn> wrt bug 241920: I'm not sure where to escalate this bug further. I assigned it to the release team but I'm not too sure that was the right call.
[12:33] <Awsoonn> mark +1'd it
[12:35] <Hobbsee> Awsoonn: not much.  It's not really a release blocker (unless things really go oversized)
[12:35] <Hobbsee> Awsoonn: and usually if you nominate it for intrepid, it'll get put on the radra - there was no need to assign to the release team.
[12:36] <Awsoonn> fair enough, I really didn't know the process is all. :D
[12:36] <Awsoonn> thnx Hobbsee~
[12:37] <Hobbsee> Awsoonn: right. it got found
[12:38] <Awsoonn> but indeed since it's not a blocker, I'd feel better waiting untill jaunty, should I nominate for 'later'?
[12:39] <Hobbsee> well, people can always renominate.  I wouldn't bother changing it now - it's already been picked up on
[12:39] <seb128> dunno what bug you are speaking about but there is no need to abuse the nominations system for things which are not blockers
[12:40] <Hobbsee> seb128: i thought importance > high & nominated was for blockers
[12:40] <Hobbsee> sorry, >= high
[12:40] <seb128> right, but was is the point of nominating non blockers?
[12:40] <Hobbsee> whereas "nominated for intrepid" meant "things that would be good to fix, in interpid"
[12:41] <Hobbsee> because it's not a critical blocker, but it would be useful to do forintrepid.
[12:41] <seb128> you can use that, for desktop bugs we usually use the milestone for that though
[12:41]  * Hobbsee looks forthe wikipage summarising it all
[12:42] <seb128> I don't like nominations
[12:42] <Awsoonn> why is that seb128?
[12:42] <seb128> there is lot of users nominations everything
[12:43] <Hobbsee> they can't actually nominate now - they can only request a nomination, whichsomeone from ~ubuntu-dev can accept or decline.
[12:43] <seb128> right
[12:43] <seb128> I decline a lot of those
[12:43] <seb128> users tend to thing any bug which annoy them should be nominated
[12:43]  * Hobbsee examines https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RCBugTargetting for the final answer
[12:43] <seb128> and suggest for nomination ton of small issues
[12:44] <copyofjohan> bug 147464
[12:44] <Hobbsee> To indicate that a bug should be fixed prior to the final release, the bug should be nominated using the "nominate for release" option in Launchpad. Use of milestone targeting is not required except in cases where delivery of the bugfix is relevant to the success of the milestone release; release-criticality of bugs is instead identified by being nominated (and accepted) for the release and being marked with an importance of "high" or above.
[12:44] <Hobbsee> excellent.  I didn't remember incorrectly.
[12:45] <Hobbsee> Awsoonn: ^ is the Release Manager given procedure on what to do w.r.t nomination, milestoning, etc.
[12:45] <Hobbsee> (see the wiki page for full info)
[12:46] <Awsoonn> right on
[12:46] <Hobbsee> which would make a nominate for intrepid, wishlist importance, an appropriate measure for that bug.
[12:47] <Hobbsee> (and unassigned)
[12:47] <Hobbsee> oh, interesting, you can undo targets.
[12:49] <seb128> Hobbsee: nominating wishlist makes no sense, we are too busy fighting blockers, nobody will look at those before intrepid, that just give extra work to those accepting or refusing those
[12:49] <Hobbsee> seb128: they already have.  This particular bug is on removing diveintopython for the regular install
[12:55]  * Hobbsee goes to do a bit more work on low-hanging fruit for the release.
[12:56]  * wgrant eats the bananas.
[12:57] <Treenaks> Hobbsee: I was wondering.. is there a list of low-hanging fruit, or is it a case of looking at the entire bug list?
[12:58] <Hobbsee> Treenaks: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+bugs is what i'm currently looking at.  Other ones to look at are previous milestones where stuff didn't get done, and the 8.04 milestone
[12:58] <copyofjohan> bug 147464
[12:59] <Hobbsee> copyofjohan: yes, it's a bug.  Yes, we saw it the first time.  No, itwon't be fixed for release.
[12:59] <copyofjohan> I really want to help solving this bug, but I dont know how. Anyone an idea?
[13:00] <jibel> Treenaks: Take a look at http://daniel.holba.ch/harvest/ . This may help you to find low hanging fruits
[13:00] <Hobbsee> jibel: does that show release-type stuff?
[13:00] <Hobbsee> james_w: did you test that rrdtool patch?
[13:01] <Hobbsee> james_w: (I presume you did, just checking)
[13:01] <james_w> not really
[13:02] <james_w> I was more trusting that it was correct
[13:03] <Hobbsee> james_w: hrm, i wonder how checkable it is
[13:03] <Hobbsee> although no one's reported any fallout from debian, i see.
[13:03] <james_w> yeah, I wasn't sure how to trigger it
[13:03] <copyofjohan> Hobbsee: yes, I know, sorry but thats so anoying and Im so frustrated about this... Btw Im not really interested in a solution for intrepid but for hardy. I like the LTS releases...
[13:04] <Hobbsee> james_w: sponsored in, we'll see if steve wants it in after the RC.
[13:04] <james_w> thanks Hobbsee
[13:05] <Hobbsee> james_w: you're welcome.  And great work on the sponsorship queue, by the way!  I noticed it when I did various ubuntu stuff over the weekend.
[13:05] <james_w> thanks
[13:16] <jibel> Hobbsee: AFAIK harvest doesn't show release-type stuff :( To sad in this release time . Maybe dholbach knows a hack to do that.
[13:16] <Hobbsee> jibel: darn
[13:18] <lfaraone> morgs: do you have a spare intrepid box you don't mind giving me ssh to?
[13:18] <lfaraone> oops, wrong window.
[13:54] <lirel> hi, a bug i filed was marked as invalid, the comment says it would be a duplicate, but i can see no link to the original one, where can i follow this one up? (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-terminal/+bug/287198)
[14:23] <azimout> in fact, it has not been marked as a duplicate of another bug, and i cannot find a matching vte bug...
[14:26] <lirel> will i be marked as spammer if i reopening this bug?
[14:26] <lirel> *reopen
[14:33] <lirel> well it looks like u've done this.. thx
[14:35] <karooga> hi, i'm struggling to get ldap + tls to play nicely together.  Anyone had success with this?
[16:11] <bucket529> Could somebody please change bug 287415 from 'Undecided' to 'Wishlist'?
[16:11] <bucket529> It's a packaging request
[16:13] <james_w> bucket529: done
[16:14] <james_w> could you ask them to provide a source package rather than a binary one, and encourage them to approach the Xubuntu team with their idea
[16:28] <bucket529> james_w: Thanks and will do.
[16:29] <azimout> i would like someone from bugcontrol to take a look at bug 280805, please?
[16:36] <james_w> azimout: hi, why bugcontrol?
[16:40] <azimout> hi james. i am only in bugcontrol since yesterday, and i intend to mark this as priority=high, but wanted to get a second opinion first...
[16:47] <james_w> aha
[16:48] <james_w> I'm not sure about High, I would have gone for Medium
[16:48] <james_w> it's up to you though, you are in bugcontrol :-)
[16:48] <james_w> congratulations by the way
[16:50] <azimout> thanx
[16:52] <azimout> my reasoning is:
[16:52] <azimout> # A problem with an essential hardware component (disk controller, laptop built-in wireless, video card, keyboard, mouse)
[16:52] <azimout> # Has a moderate impact on a large portion of Ubuntu users (estimated)
[16:52] <azimout> (from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance)
[16:54] <azimout> anyways, i'll go for triaged-medium, and see how it goes...
[16:56] <azimout> i was also considering priority=high because it can potentially fry the graphics chips...
[17:22] <jcastro> bdmurray: Plenty of time for QA sessions!: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOpenWeek
[17:29] <bdmurray> jcastro: isn't there a request list somewhere?
[17:30] <bucket529> need a mentor on bug 216267 to help me craft a useful response
[17:31] <jcastro> bdmurray: yeah, the /Prep list but now we have the schedule approved so you can slot yourself in to an open spot
[17:31] <jcastro> bdmurray: just make sure you have a description at the bottom
[17:33] <bucket529> I'm trying to figure out if it's Alsa, PulseAudio, or some crazy driver issue
[17:48] <calc> i need access to 287642 asap who do i ask to process apport crash bugs faster?
[17:48] <chrisccoulson> bug 287642
[17:48] <chrisccoulson> i can't access it either
[17:48] <bdmurray> calc: pitti or the reporter
[17:48] <calc> ah i got subscribed now
[17:49] <calc> bdmurray: ok :)
[17:49] <calc> i got the reporter to add me
[17:49] <calc> of course now i have to wait for it to be retraced, lol :)
[17:49] <calc> but i can see it as soon as it is done
[17:50] <calc> hmm no new interesting patches for 2.4.1 yet that might fix a crash
[17:50] <calc> er since the upload i did anyway
[18:07] <calc> jcastro: oh yea i got OOo over 90% upstream now :)
[18:08] <jcastro> calc: I just noticed this morning!
[18:44] <mrooney> asac: are you aware of any issues with nm not connecting to the highest signal network when multiple of the same SSIDs are present?
[19:10] <asac> mrooney: define "higest signal" network
[19:11] <asac> mrooney: NM tries a best effort base, but will not just switch to anything bettter ... it needs to be considerably better
[19:11] <asac> also "highest" signal isnt always best afaik
[19:14] <mrooney> asac: well I am getting a discrepancy in Intrepid but not in Hardy, let me show you
[19:22] <mrooney> asac: http://img512.imageshack.us/my.php?image=discrepancywh7.png
[19:22] <mrooney> I think they are showing strengths of two different access points with the same SSID
[19:23] <mrooney> asac: after a restart into hardy in the exact same location, I get http://img522.imageshack.us/my.php?image=hardygj6.png
[19:25] <mrooney> and in Intrepid it takes a long time to connect, like it is connecting to the really low signal one, even though there is a better one available, and it shows a higher signal in the tray
[19:27] <asac> mrooney: well. most likely the strength you see in list is returned in the scan result
[19:28] <asac> and the one you say on the tray is what you can get from a connected device
[19:30] <mrooney> asac: interesting, it seems to be the opposite, but you would probably know a lot better than I would
[19:31] <mrooney> ie the lower the "scan" signal, the slower the network is, the longer it takes to connect, et cetera, regardless of the tray signal
[19:31] <mrooney> and again these issues only occur with a network where there multiple access points with the same SSID in Intrepid, otherwise they match
[19:32] <asac> mrooney: no i have no clue what that happens in particular here
[19:32] <asac> mrooney: was just a guess
[19:32] <asac> mrooney: why you think its not a problem with the scan results? those come from wpasupplicant and not from iwlist scan
[19:34] <mrooney> Well, if I can't get a good signal in Intrepid I can restart to Hardy and it seems to get better
[19:34] <mrooney> and the only thing that changes is the scan strength (dramatically), the tray strength is the same
[19:34] <asac> mrooney: dont see anything that contradicts what i said in what you said ;)
[19:35] <asac> anyway. if you want this to be properly triaged file a bug. if such a bug exist polish bug summary and description and subscribe me ... set to triaged or confirmed or something
[19:36] <mrooney> okay, will do!
[19:36] <mrooney> I guess from I am saying, it seems like the scan signal is the one being used, not the tray signal
[19:37] <mrooney> whereas you are suggesting it is the other way, correct?
[19:51] <bdmurray> bug 287640
[19:55] <bdmurray> look at the attachments ;)
[19:58] <thekorn> hehe
[20:00] <persia> What do we do with those?  Should they be rejected out of hand, or passed upstream and marked invalid for Ubuntu?
[20:02] <bdmurray> I think rejected out of hand since it is on Windows.
[20:02] <persia> Makes sense.  Unless someone else already is, I'll reject and point the submitter at upstream.
[20:03] <bdmurray> I'm kind of curious how they ended up filing the bug where they did.
[20:03] <persia> The reputation of the bug squad is so great that people want to get good triage for all their bugs?
[20:04] <bdmurray> lol
[20:07] <persia> Of course, that might not be the right response, judging from http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-920920.html
[20:27] <mrooney> yeah wow, that is doubly Invalid, Firefox 3.1 AND Windows
[20:34] <persia> mrooney, Well, we're guessing Windows based on visual appearance alone, which may not be correct.  Firefox 3.1 is available from https://launchpad.net/~mozillateam/+archive which is a conceivable software source (mind you, that is 3.1a2, and the reporter is 3.1b1, so this is getting a little stretched).
[20:38] <mrooney> persia: yeah, but even then it is still Invalid isn't it, you can't file bugs for PPA packages, with few exceptions
[20:38] <mrooney> unless that is one of the exceptions
[20:39] <sdh> so a bunch of Xorg config has moved to HAL
[20:39] <sdh> where does one configure it?
[20:39] <persia> Personally, I think the only reason for the exceptions is because LP doesn't accept bugs against PPAs.  I think all PPA bugs are invalid.  I'm not sure if the mozillateam PPA is an exception, but I suspect it isn't, as it often gets bleeding edge stuff.
[20:40] <persia> sdh, xorg.conf
[20:40] <sdh> persia: really? my upgrade to ibex has broken my middle moues button in X and left me with a bunch of # commented out by update-manager, HAL is now used lines
[20:42] <persia> sdh, Most of xorg.conf is no longer required.  If you need it, put it back.
[20:43] <sdh> persia: tried that with the mouse section, and restarted X. no dice.
[20:43] <sdh> persia: i find the comment quite unhelpful, but that's probably due to my ignorance of HAL
[20:43] <persia> sdh, Have you tried seeking support in #ubuntu+1 ?
[20:44] <sdh> persia: oops, i was thinking this was #ubuntu, i made an off by one error in irssi ;-)
[20:44] <sdh> i thought it was quiet!
[20:44] <sdh> cheers
[20:44] <persia> actually, that's a good point.  The comment isn't very informative, and few who routinely change xorg.conf understand .fdi files, or how HAL works.  It's probably worth filing a bug in update-manager requesting a pointer to better documentation.
[20:45] <sdh> i'm happy to file a bug against it, do you think update-manager is the right place for such a bug?
[20:45] <persia> sdh, Were this #ubuntu or #ubuntu+1, someone would probably have been more helpful :)
[20:45] <persia> I think so.  I think update-manager is the thing that changes your xorg.conf
[20:45]  * persia may be mistaken
[20:46] <sdh> what's the difference between #ubuntu and #ubuntu+1 btw, is the latter just there because the former is so busy? :)
[20:46] <persia> #ubuntu is for general support.  #ubuntu+1 is a discussion forum for people who upgraded before release and broke their systems.  Sometimes hints are shared, and the moreso as release nears.
[20:47] <sdh> thanks ;>
[20:47] <sdh> makes sense!
[20:47] <persia> sdh, Be warned that #ubuntu+1 is a fairly relaxed channel, and there's not the same sort of focused support that you might see in #ubuntu.
[20:47] <sdh> that works for me
[20:48] <sdh> i tend not to seek support so im happy to just chat about it ;>
[22:08] <angusthefuzz> could someone mentor me with bug 287639 would that be considered an idea to improve ubuntu?  (I am a new bugsquad member)
[22:11] <bdmurray> angusthefuzz: what do you mean by an idea to improve ubuntu?
[22:12] <persia> angusthefuzz, What do you think are the correct values for package, status, and importance?
[22:12] <angusthefuzz> bdmurray: I am trying to triage, I was thinking about the default comment about an idea to improve ubuntu: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses#An%20idea%20to%20improve%20Ubuntu
[22:13] <angusthefuzz> bdmurray: yes, i recognize that visual elements are in the eye of the beholder
[22:13] <angusthefuzz> bdmurray: I just needed some guidance on how we handle these types of things
[22:13] <bdmurray> angusthefuzz: This isn't an idea of great scope so I don't think brainstorm applies.
[22:13] <charlie-tca> but also in the resolution.
[22:14] <angusthefuzz> bdmurray: in terms of package, i would assign it to the theme, I think the bar is more narrow with the livecd theme, as some of it is taken up by shadow
[22:14] <persia> Yeah.  Brainstorm is useful for big things.  Look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance to see the bit about small things.
[22:14] <persia> livecd uses the same theme as the default install.
[22:15] <bdmurray> It looks the same to me, as the reporter, on an installed system.
[22:15] <angusthefuzz> persia: sorry, i do realize that, it looks the same to me as well, i mispoke
[22:17] <angusthefuzz> would the importance be low, as it is cosmetic, or is it a wishlist?
[22:18] <bdmurray> I think Low is appropriate
[22:18] <persia> angusthefuzz, That's precisely the sort of judgement left to the triager.  If it's large cosmetic or usability cosmetic, Low is usually better.  If it's not important, Wishlist is usually better.
[22:18] <persia> bdmurray, You think it's that ugly?
[22:18]  * persia isn't sure
[22:19] <bdmurray> Well, because it is a theme / art bug I'd use the higher of the two suggested
[22:20] <persia> Makes sense.  In a bug against e.g. xchat, this might be wishlist, but when against ubuntu-theme it gets Low?
[22:20] <bdmurray> Or all icons should be green would be wishlist
[22:20] <angusthefuzz> i just wanted to make sure there wasnt a policy about triaging visual bugs, because it really depends on who does the initial triage
[22:21] <bdmurray> angusthefuzz: No there isn't a special policy for that
[22:23] <angusthefuzz> thanks for the teaching (I actually cant set importance yet)
[22:25] <chrisccoulson> can anyone access https://bugs.freedesktop.org?
[22:26] <bdmurray> chrisccoulson: its not seeming like it to me
[22:26] <chrisccoulson> ah, so its not just me. i don't know whether thats a good thing or not!
[22:27] <chrisccoulson> it's been down for a good half an hour or so
[22:27] <bdmurray> angusthefuzz: did you assign that bug to a package?
[22:27] <angusthefuzz> bdmurray: I chose gnome-art
[22:28] <angusthefuzz> bdmurray: i also set it to confirmed
[22:28] <bdmurray> gnome-art is a package in universe
[22:29] <angusthefuzz> bdmurray: is that a problem?
[22:30] <bdmurray> well, it wouldn't be installed on a live cd
[22:30] <persia> angusthefuzz, gnome-art isn't the package that provides those icons.
[22:30] <angusthefuzz> bdmurray: thats a good point!
[22:30] <persia> bdmurray, There are universe packages on some liveCDs.
[22:30] <angusthefuzz> bdmurray: the problem, does continue to exist after being installed
[22:30] <james_w> chrisccoulson: hey, are you sending them a patch for that consolekit bug?
[22:31] <chrisccoulson> i wasn't actually. i was going to send them a mesa bug
[22:31] <chrisccoulson> do you mean the string-fix bug?
[22:31] <james_w> yeah
[22:32] <chrisccoulson> i haven't done a patch for it yet
[22:32] <bdmurray> persia: it was the Ubuntu Intrepid daily live but you are right
[22:32] <angusthefuzz> bdmurray: would it be better to choose the human theme?
[22:32] <bdmurray> persia: what do you think a good way to find the right package would be?
[22:33] <persia> bdmurray, Well, I don't know how to do it from zero knowledge.
[22:33] <persia> Actually, maybe I do.
[22:33] <persia> First check which theme is being used in the theme manager.
[22:34] <persia> Then search for that theme name in /usr/share/themes
[22:34] <persia> Then run dpkg -S against /usr/share/themes/${theme-name}/${some file}
[22:35] <persia> angusthefuzz, Does that procedure work?  If not, I'll either inject knowledge, or try to improve the procedure.
[22:35] <angusthefuzz> persia: that procedure sounds rock solid
[22:35] <Woody86> I had a simple bug here: https://launchpad.net/bugs/164297 and was wondering if I should mark it "Fix Released" or "Fix Committed"?
[22:37] <persia> Woody86, Is it fixed?
[22:37] <persia> Woody86, Has the version of the package with the fix been published?
[22:37] <Woody86> persia - Well it was just a change in settings
[22:39] <angusthefuzz> persia: your procedure worked, thanks for the help
[22:39] <persia> Woody86, Yes, but the simplicity of a bug is not related to whether it has been fixed.
[22:39] <persia> angusthefuzz, No problem.  I'm glad it worked.  Which package was it?
[22:40] <Woody86> persia -  so what should I do with this one?
[22:41] <persia> Woody86, Well, is it fixed?
[22:42] <bdmurray> jcastro: I'm trying to link a package to an upstream project but I need the 'series' now?
[22:42] <angusthefuzz> persia: human-theme
[22:43] <Woody86> persia -  Well, he had asked how to stop his screen from changing colors on startup between the GDM screen and his desktop. I suggested changing his background colors to black, and he said that worked?
[22:43] <Woody86> is that considered a fix, or would the actual package need to be changed in some way?
[22:44] <persia> Woody86, Do you think that it changing colours is a bug that should be fixed for everyone, or do you think that it was an issue only for that user?
[22:45] <Woody86> persia -  Well I had the same issue, and did this on my computer, so it's probably more universal
[22:46] <Woody86> would this be something worth sending upstream to Gnome?
[22:47] <persia> No, it's more likely an issue with the Ubuntu themes than with the GNOME environment.
[22:47] <jcastro> bdmurray: known bug, it's annoying.
[22:47] <jcastro> bdmurray: I'm sicking gmb on it
[22:48] <bdmurray> jcastro: okay, thanks
[22:48] <Woody86> persia -  then should I just mark it as confirmed, and leave it be?
[22:49] <jcastro> bdmurray: I love it when you click on the thing for searching a series and you get pages and pages of worthless numbers
[22:49] <jcastro> 1.2.4.5/trunk, etc.
[22:50] <bdmurray> and then it ended up oopsing on me
[22:50] <persia> Woody86, The package is wrong : it needs to be set to the right package.  If it's gdm and the desktop, it's two packages.
[22:51] <bdmurray> angusthefuzz: thanks for helping out with that bug
[22:52] <Woody86> persia -  would it be gdm-themes and ?
[22:53] <persia> Woody86, 19 minutes ago I posted a procedure for finding the package for the theme for a given environment.  Try that.  Let me know if it doesn't work.
[22:53] <persia> (and yes, gdm-themes would be the other package)
[22:53] <Woody86> persia -  Thank you very much :D
[22:54] <Woody86> persia -  oh, and how do I add another thing under "affects"?
[22:55] <bdmurray> Woody86: click "also affects distributton"
[22:55] <persia> Also affects distribution.  Select Ubuntu.  Enter the pacakge name.
[22:55] <Woody86> bdmurray -  ah, thank you
[22:56] <bdmurray> wow, I made a portmanteau
[23:06] <Woody86> persia -  What if this bug isn't affected by a certain theme? What if all themes do it?
[23:07] <Woody86> I'm pretty sure the screen will change colors for any ubuntu theme?
[23:09] <Woody86> it just depends on ... aha! brain-idea
[23:10] <persia> Woody86, I think you've got it now :)
[23:12] <Woody86> persia -  would it be gnome-appearance-properties? since that's where you can change the background color?
[23:13] <chrisccoulson> james_w - i've attached a patch to bug 287723. i didn't prepare a debdiff, as I think you've got another patch to get in as well haven't you?
[23:14] <persia> Woody86, Well, it depends on whether you think the bug is with the tool to change colors, or the package that sets the initial colour.
[23:15] <Woody86> damn
[23:15] <Woody86> persia -  well what sets the inital color? What makes it that tan color by default?
[23:16] <Woody86> the background color doesn't change when you change themes?
[23:16] <james_w> chrisccoulson: yeah, I'll talk to pitti about rolling that in, otherwise it will be an SRU I imagine.
[23:16] <james_w> chrisccoulson: thanks for the patch
[23:16] <chrisccoulson> you're welcome. it was not much work:)
[23:16] <Woody86> persia -  although it does change when you change wallpapers :(
[23:17] <persia> Woody86, I'm not sure.  Maybe someone else knows (it's always best to ask questions generally).  Maybe it needs some investigation.
[23:21] <Woody86> Does anyone know what package is responsible for selecting the default color for different backgrounds?
[23:21] <Woody86> persia -  Where can I try to investigate this?
[23:28] <Woody86> ok, I think this might just be a gdm-themes bug. I just set my background color to yellow under the ubuntu themes, and it didn't display it, so I'm thinking it just displays the GDM background
[23:32] <Woody86> I switched my login window background to yellow now, and I'm going to reboot to test it out
[23:35] <Woody86> yup, I was mistaken in my original anlysis, it is just the Login Window background that displays :) so it's only gdm-themes, correct?
[23:40] <Woody86> how can I mark myself as the Triager on a bug?
[23:40] <persia> It happens automatically when you adjust things.  Check the Activity log.
[23:41] <hggdh> Woody86, just add your name under "Assigned to"
[23:42] <hggdh> click on the down arrow on the status field, and make the change there
[23:42] <Woody86> persia -  it doesn't say anything under activity log about adding me as the triager
[23:42] <Woody86> hggdh -  isn't that for who is working on the bug? not the triager?
[23:43] <persia> Woody86, There's no special "triager" mark.  Each person's contributions to each bug are documented in the Activity log or in the comment history.
[23:43] <Woody86> ah, is it just in the Hug Days, that a triager is listed?
[23:44] <hggdh> Woody86, you put yourself in as the assigned person if you are going to work the bug until triaged (or resolved)
[23:45] <hggdh> this tells other triagers/maintainers that someone is already working the bug, and we then do not need to worry about it
[23:45] <persia> Yeah.  If you're working on a bug, definitely assign yourself.  Remember to unassign yourself if you can't push it any farther, and it's still not done.
[23:46] <Woody86> well I had sent it to the right people, but I have no clue on how to fix a bug, so I don't think I'll list myself as Assigned To
[23:47] <greg-g> right, assigned is ONLY for the person FIXING the bug.  NOT triaging.  if only triaging, simply subscribe
[23:47] <hggdh> greg-g this is news
[23:48] <greg-g> hggdh: it changed over 6 months ago
[23:48]  * Woody86 bows before greg-g! Thanks again! :)
[23:48] <greg-g> hggdh: it used to be that you assinged youself, but now that you can subscribe to a bug, you do that instead.
[23:48] <Woody86> now I've got 2 bugs triaged :)
[23:48] <greg-g> well done Woody86 :)
[23:48] <chrisccoulson> greg-g / hggdh - there are still exceptions to the rule
[23:49] <Woody86> greg-g - tyvm :) it's not great, but it's a start :)
[23:49] <chrisccoulson> eg, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeamBugPolicies#Incomplete%20means%20assign%20to%20yourself
[23:49] <greg-g> chrisccoulson: right, there are some exceptions, but the rule is to only subscribe, not assign.
[23:49] <hggdh> ah, this sounds more like what I knew...
[23:49] <greg-g> just like there are exceptions about what status a bug should be for certain projects
[23:50] <greg-g> but, remember folks, in general "subscribe, don't assign"
[23:50] <greg-g> :)
[23:51] <bdmurray> chrisccoulson: that might be out of date
[23:51] <hggdh> the whole point on assignment is "this person is working on this bug."
[23:51] <greg-g> hggdh: yes, not triaging. a slight, but important, distinction :)
[23:51] <chrisccoulson> ah, ok. i still assign myself to kernel bugs i triage, based on that guide
[23:51] <hggdh> NOW I am rather confused
[23:51] <chrisccoulson> me too!
[23:52] <hggdh> greg-g, a distinction not reflected in the docs...
[23:52] <greg-g> hggdh: yes, "working on" not "triaging". a slight, but important, distinction :)
[23:52] <greg-g> it is.
[23:53] <greg-g> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToTriage#Improving%20a%20bug%20report
[23:53] <hggdh> quoting the page -- while bdmurray does not change i ;-) "If you are working on triaging a bug report, and it requires more information, the bug should be assigned to yourself."
[23:53] <greg-g> hggdh: which page? the kernel policies? that is, as bdmurray said, probably out of date.
[23:53] <greg-g> look at the HowToTriage page, the general guide on all things triaging :)
[23:53] <hggdh> right
[23:54] <hggdh> mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa
[23:54] <greg-g> I'm talking about the general rule here, not kernel specific ;)
[23:54] <persia> greg-g, I think it depends on the depth of triage.  If I'm working a bug and trying to reproduce, etc. and it takes me a few days (because it's one of those especially annoying ones), I'll assign myself.  For quick coverage, there's little point.
[23:54] <greg-g> hggdh: no worries, just wanting to make sure everyone is on the same page, so to speak
[23:54] <hggdh> (not that I even assign myself on triage work)
[23:55] <hggdh> s/even/ever/
[23:55] <greg-g> persia: assigning vs. subscribing makes no effective change in how the bug is handled in that case though, you aren't working on a fix.  If someone like me comes along as sees that you (specifically you, persia) is assigned to it, I'm going to skip it as I assume it is triaged and you are working on the fix; as per that guide above.
[23:56] <persia> greg-g, Which is why I assign myself to the rare bug that I'm digging deeply, even if I'm not sure that I'll produce the final fix.
[23:57] <greg-g> anyways, didn't mean to steal the attention here, only meant to clarify/remind people about the guideline :)
[23:57] <persia> For most bugs, I'll just try to reproduce, and update the status, maybe add some logs, etc.  To these, I subscribe.  It's only when it's a *lot* of work, and I specifically want to warn people off until it gets in better shape that I assign myself.
[23:57] <greg-g> persia: sure, I see that point, if it is one of those really hard to triage bugs that take more than "please give me these logs.." I can see it.
[23:58] <greg-g> that the is key, you're warning people off :)
[23:58] <persia> greg-g, Right.  "Please give me these logs" doesn't need assignment.
[23:58]  * greg-g nods
[23:58] <greg-g> glad we're in agreement, back to figuring out dinner :)
[23:58] <persia> The primary idea is to avoid duplication of effort.  The rest is just window dressing.
[23:59] <hggdh> persia, +1
[23:59] <greg-g> exactly.