=== asac_ is now known as asac [02:10] someone know how to find out what was installed in an upgrade? [02:10] i upgraded when i left for work this morning and it has killed my wireless on aspire one [02:10] and i want to track down what did it [02:11] * ian_brasil looks through apt docs [02:12] ian_brasil: dpkg has a log in /var/log [02:55] StevenK: thx [05:08] cool, Urban Terror work on aspire one, but fps is not playable, and i set everything to low already... any tweaks? 360 fps in glxgears [08:47] Does netbook have a channel yet? [08:47] http://i35.tinypic.com/inbix2.png [08:47] I'm one window-picker-applet feature away from perfection [08:50] ethana2@gmail.com [08:50] ..i think i'll restart my X session to see if it'll help pidgin with the facebookchat plugin .deb I just installed [09:17] anyone awake? [09:18] smp4488, Lots of people. [09:18] ahh i havent talked to you in a while whats up? [09:19] RC just released. It's time for agressive testing to identify if there are any remaining release-critical issues before the images go for mastering. [09:19] really! are they up for download? [09:21] http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/810rc [09:21] sweetness [09:22] now that a full ubuntu image right? [09:27] Well, there's lots of flavours of Ubuntu. MID and Mobile are on the download page. These are live USB images. Test them as you like, or install them if you like. [09:27] If you find any bugs, please file them. It helps a lot to improve it. [09:29] can i load the live usb images into the moblin image creator? [09:30] I don't think so. [09:31] hmm [09:31] You might be able to, but it probably requires significant modification of moblin image creator. [09:31] Will the MID flavour fun on x86? [09:31] moblin image creator is no longer used by either Ubuntu MID or Ubuntu Mobile, and the images certainly weren't tested with it. [09:32] so what are you all using now? [09:33] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Mobile/HowTo/ImageCreation [09:33] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Mobile/HowTo/ImageModification is probably more interesting if you're just looking for small changes. [09:34] im downloading the images now and i will test tonight and let you know [09:34] this project looks better and better everyday [09:37] who knows may be i will pull my touch screen out of my car to test further [09:38] touch screen support was one of the things that should be better for this image. There's still work to be done, and some stuff that didn't make intrepid, but I suspect you'll find it to be supported. [09:39] what are you all looking at as far as gps? [09:39] I don't know that anyone is chasing GPS specifically for the mobile flavours (and my GPS USB key doesn't seem to work). [09:40] I've heard good things about gpsdrive, but the interface seems to take up a lot of pixels. [09:40] i will probably give that a look tonight [09:40] Any suggestions or testing or integration patches would be welcome, although I suspect it would be ideal to have a solution that worked well for both laptops and smaller stuff. [09:40] Thanks! [09:40] which flavour would you reccomend for a car pc? 1.2 ghz processor, 1 G of RAM? [09:43] i have looked into navit also but had problems with my gps reciever also [09:44] I'd probably suggest Mobile for a carpc, because of work to make it work with touch-interfaces, combined with fairly robust support for additional applications. [09:44] sounds good i will let you know [09:45] MID does touch well, but it expects applications to work with hildon, and represents a slightly different philosophy about things, so adding arbitrary packages doesn't always have the expected results. [09:48] superm1: ping [09:49] davmor2, You might have more luck in #ubuntu-devel :) [10:02] sorry my internet went down for a sec [10:07] how quick do you think i can get this to boot? [10:08] well when i say "this" i meant mobile [10:08] I don't know if anyone has done any boot-time testing. Should be able to get it down to 30-40 seconds easily. More than that probably requires a bit of work. [10:08] im thinking compact flash [10:11] In my experience, /boot on CF only saved a couple seconds over disk. === exaltia is now known as Exaltia === doko_ is now known as doko [10:51] how to disable windows auto-maximize and return normal captions to them? [10:52] mm s/captions/titles+menus [10:57] * pururu uses area of effect "rise of the dead" spell level 3 [10:58] and openarena is slow on aspire one [11:01] any optimizations for xorg beyond EXA ? this thing dosnt make any difference, probably just enabled by default === asac__ is now known as asac [11:08] pururu, -mid or -mobile ? [11:08] mobile [11:09] go to applications->system->settings->sessions and uncheck devilspie in the list, on next login your windows wont automaximize anymore [11:09] (and have decorations) [11:09] cool thanks [11:17] ogra_: so the browser uses the minefield icon in the taskbar :/ [11:17] btw, wpa works oob here on Q^1 [11:17] midbrowser menu still missing, i forget how to bring preferences dialog [11:17] pururu, f4 i think [11:17] yes f4 is menu [11:18] thanks [11:18] we'll likely go with fennec or firefox with grab'n drag plugin in jaunty [11:18] \o/ [11:23] lool: please check the commits after -4.8 at http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=ubuntu/ubuntu-intrepid-lpia.git;a=shortlog [11:23] lool: I am picking up relevant config changes from base kernel too [11:23] lool: this is the rebased tree btw (rebased to -7.14 base) [11:24] * asac installs fennec on Q1 [11:25] :) [11:26] ogra_: i have to say that the ubuntu image is quite nice [11:26] ogra_: only big issue imo is the window taskbar [11:26] thats not right that way for sure ;) [11:26] you cannot read anything because of space constriants [11:26] also when hittin the X in right top corner while having keyboard open will just close the app you had open [11:26] (which is not what users expect) [11:27] * persia is also confused by the keyboard, and doesn't use it. [11:27] hehe [11:27] yeah. well it happened now three times: typed with great pain ... then closed the app instead of the keyboard [11:28] tripling the pain when you notice that you just closed what you typed :/ [11:28] yeah, cellwriter needs some love for jaunty but i the end its just a matter of adapting your habit [11:29] you will only do that once or twice, then you start using the cellwriter icon to expand/collapse ;) [11:29] ogra_: we should use fennec right away now ;) [11:29] location bar is confusing a bit ... yeah. but not really bad [11:29] asac, if you get that past slangasek i'm willing to change the seeds :) [11:30] at least not worse than the side window panel and the keyboard [11:30] though i'd prefer a dumbed down FF UI with grab'n drag [11:30] ogra_: slangasek ... better not. he didnt even let plain mobile 3G data in 4 days ago [11:30] e.g. provider info updates [11:30] would you guys hate it if we switched to vesafb module? base kernel already did the switch. [11:31] well ... he finally did it, but he didnt say: "approved", but ... no. data shouldnt land that late [11:31] note that most of the devices mobile is run on ship with vista by default ... at least thats what i learned about UMPCs [11:31] so there is really no point to have to ship fennec [11:31] ogra_: ok. but that gives us a chance to convince them [11:31] e.g. just be far better and even the vista addicts will understand [11:31] fully functional FF is surely better [11:31] persia: seeing any problem with uvesafb? would switching to vesafb at this stage be desirable? [11:31] ogra_: yeah. lets also reduce the font size [11:31] to 6pt [11:32] yeah [11:32] ok ... so enough live stuff. how do i install? [11:32] asac: Mobile, or mid? [11:32] mobile [11:32] asac: There's an Install icon on the desktop [11:32] i am running the live session [11:32] * asac closes his mobile terminal ;) [11:33] amitk-afk, There were a number of users who complained that uvesafb completely failed to work for them. Unless you want the headache of tracking it, I'd recommend aligning with mainline as much as possible. [11:33] asac: :-) [11:33] the install icon appears in tasklist ... then disappears (apparently because it takes too long) ... 5 seconds later the installer starts [11:33] yeah [11:33] get a faster USB key :P === amitk-afk is now known as amitk [11:34] hmm ... somehow it looks like half of the window is hidden under the panel [11:34] It isn't [11:34] (which isnt true, its just a visual pretention) [11:34] StevenK: yes. it just looks that way and might cause confusion (like for me) [11:34] i should look like its in-front not in back imo [11:34] persia: I'm all for it, pushed the config changes enabling vesafb as module. just wanted to make sure it would be ok to switch to vesafb by default [11:34] That's because mozilla sourcecode has eaten your retinas [11:35] or a tiny border where you can see abit of the desktop color in between [11:35] asac, thats because of compiz and its shadows [11:36] i might revisit that for jaunty [11:36] hmm this timezone selector is unusable with a stylus [11:36] actually i would have loved to use maximus, but that only works with metacity [11:36] Try it with a tiny screen [11:36] hehe selected Berlin and the map now show the arctis ;) [11:38] install started [11:39] play a round of aisle riot then :) [11:39] takes 15min [11:39] hehe === ogra_ is now known as ogra [11:39] we really have to find something better for the window selector [11:39] the desktop looks so neat [11:40] but that thing really dominates the first impression [11:40] well, i was planning to hack up wnck applet to show big icons and no text [11:40] with a gconf key [11:40] ogra: big==? [11:40] like the panel iconS? [11:40] adapted to the panel size [11:40] That sounds a lot better. The selector on the left is non-ideal for several sorts of uses. [11:41] the sidepanel is 80px ... the icons should at least be 60x60 [11:41] the current prob is that wnck expands the first button to full panel size, thats odd [11:42] the buttons should have a fixed size and not shrink with the amount of apps [11:42] ogra: its a deficieny of the gnome panel [11:42] they never understood how to display entries in vertical panels [11:42] well, wnck applet ... [11:42] like they always grow verticalls [11:42] y [11:42] other applets do it right [11:42] i would love to use a side panel on my main desktop, but i dont want the elements scale vertically [11:43] they should just stack and expand horizontally [11:43] yeah [11:44] for intrepid i wanted to go mainly with unchanged gnome and get enough feedback for proper jaunty changes [11:44] ogra: sure. this is a gnome bug imo [11:44] but wnck applet is definately on my list [11:44] either nobody cares about side panels for window tasks or the folks thinking that this way is the right way are on crac [11:44] k [11:44] amitk: What should I check in http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=ubuntu/ubuntu-intrepid-lpia.git exactly? You mean this is ready for sponsoring? [11:45] but then maybe its my obligation to fix this finally - i have been waiting for that since 2.4 or something [11:45] asac, i'll care in jaunty [11:46] beating upstream with cluebats :) [11:46] ogra: the window task list in gnome? [11:46] that would be so great [11:46] i can easily read 40 windows if its vertical and properly [11:46] yeah [11:46] at the bottom its unusable for everything > 10 windows (on a large screen) [11:47] not if you set it to grouping mode [11:47] ogra: grouping mode is even worse [11:47] which we should have on by default imho [11:47] i want to see _all_ windows with their title readable [11:47] grouping just requires another click [11:47] but i understand people that like grouping more [11:48] for me the windows on the task list should be stacked and not grouped, but ordered by application ... so that all ffox windows are directly next to each other [11:48] yeah [11:48] lool: no. I am just pushing every commit I make to fix configs after rebasing. [11:48] but well ;) ... next cycle i will just overtake the desktop experience team [11:49] that brought to us this great log out experience :) [11:49] amitk: Ok; you're just asking for early review, and will call for sponsoring later AIUI? [11:49] lool: specifically, look at the config changes - tcp, ath5k, vesafb [11:49] asac, haha [11:49] lool: correct. to avoid any surprises [11:50] * lool pulls [11:50] lool: all configs changes are in line with base kernel. I didn't bother to turn on ext4 though [11:50] ext4 is on o_O [11:50] ?? [11:50] CONFLICT CONFLICT CONFLICT blah :-( [11:51] brave ... [11:51] hmm ... what is this "mine" thing in the tray [11:51] hmm a second volume switcher? [11:52] lool: just look at the web interface [11:52] oh i its brigthness ;) [11:52] ogra: it is on in base kernel [11:52] asac, lol [11:52] I've just used git reset --hard origin [11:52] asac, i was wondering what you were talking about before ... [11:53] amitk: Good thing that you're prefixing tags with LPIA now [11:53] lool: yeah, it was getting confusing for me. [11:53] Well it was required since you were importing a tree with the same version numbers for the source package, but pointing at different objects [11:54] Hmm [11:54] I think I invented a new way to make me grab useless stuff, crap [11:56] amitk: I take it that the config changes you're doing are mirrored on the corresponding linux config changes? [11:56] lool: yes, except for ext4. Didn't bother with it for lpia [11:56] I'd still argue that I can't review properly what changed between lpia uploads, but what you did since the last linux uploads looks ok [11:57] amitk: was vesafb enabled in RC. [11:57] ogra: cant you add the fta PPA to seeds ;) [11:57] s/.$/.? [11:57] I mean in linux in RC [11:57] lool: rebasing kills that history unfortunately. After this upload, no more rebases - only merges [11:57] asac, haha, i doubt the image builders would like that [11:57] lool: yes, vesafb is default in RC [11:58] Ok [11:58] amitk: So what I see is that you a) rebased b) fiddled lpia tree maintenance scripts c) mirrored most config changes which happened in linux; I'm fine with this [11:59] good. Lets see what the test build says. [11:59] amitk: Do you push to ppa? [11:59] Ah no, I guess it's slow [11:59] lool: no, local build [11:59] drumrolls ... "restarting now ..." [12:03] 89..90..91 degrees! [12:06] oh no ... i installed fennec and now its gone after install :( [12:06] thought livecd would keep what i install there [12:11] ogra: so the password i used during install doesnt allow me to sudo su :( [12:11] huh ? [12:11] it should [12:11] in fact it doesnt work at all [12:11] typoed ? [12:11] most likely. but i am almost 100% sure that i typed "test" [12:12] works fine here [12:12] i use sudo all day on mobile [12:12] asac, Nope. It's an intentional feature that user changes to the live session are dropped on install. [12:12] heh [12:12] persia: err. i was asked for a password in the installer [12:12] that isnt there anymore :( [12:12] and its not empty [12:12] (like it was in the live session) [12:12] persia: so what is the default password? is there any? [12:12] no [12:13] mobile just creates an ubiquity user [12:13] persia: oh. i think you referred to fennec from above [12:13] with the credentials you give it during install [12:13] *sigh* ... one more install then [12:14] is it using the user you created ? [12:14] asac, That's bug #287857 [12:14] Launchpad bug 287857 in kourou "Ubiquity prompting for step 5 in --automatic mode on Ubuntu MID RC image" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/287857 [12:14] persia, mobile .... [12:14] asac, Just don't enter a password. [12:14] asac, or are you testing mid now ? [12:14] ok [12:14] no mobile [12:15] persia: i cannot not enter a password [12:15] persia: Mobile asks for the username [12:15] the installer doesnt enable the next button [12:15] mobile should work exactly as desktop [12:15] Oh, right. any password should work. [12:15] persia: it doesnt here [12:15] persia: i used "test" [12:15] and now i cannot become root anymore [12:15] * persia is very confused [12:15] well ... not anymore.. i cannot become root at all [12:16] doing a new install [12:16] now [12:16] ok ... doing nothing, but hitting the "install" [12:17] i can only emphasize that the timezon selector is broken ;) [12:18] ok ... entire disk ;) [12:19] ok i think i know what was going on [12:19] this stupid Q1 num lock thing [12:20] triple checked that its not on ... installing ;) [12:20] lets see in 15 minutes [12:20] heh [12:21] * ogra is relieved [12:44] hmmm plenty crashes [12:44] * asac upgrades [12:45] it it known that the Q1 cursors dont work, but "up" is F1? (-> Help) [12:45] cursor-keys [12:46] too bad that Q1 has no 3g ;) [12:51] ogra: http://www.sofaraway.org/ubuntu/tmp/cool.gif ;) [12:56] asac, whats that ? [12:56] ogra: ffox3 ;) [12:56] err 3.1 [12:56] heh [12:56] -moz-transform CSS style [12:56] * ogra wonders about the usecase :) [12:57] if you have a really broken sight, use ff 3.1, it can fix up your strabismus :) [12:57] ogra: not sure ... animated html elements? [12:57] err 3d html elements i mean [12:57] but its not really 3d ... just transformed [12:57] yeah [12:58] not actualy useful for text elements [12:58] but might open intresting opportunities for non text [12:59] ogra: i think its a bug that the location bar disappears sometimes here in fennec when scrolling vertically [12:59] also those folks should _stop_ thinking that mac style is the world [13:00] this grey is just ugly imo ... similar ugly as the mac ffox [13:00] yeah [13:00] http://cybernetnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/06/firefox-3-themes.jpg [13:01] mac is the worst imo [13:02] wow, they all have that ugly button layount now ? [13:02] only linux doesnt [13:02] We win :) [13:04] yeah === davmor2 is now known as davmor2_lunch [13:11] asac, is there any way to tell NM to look for a network connection on startup if its not configured yet ? [13:11] i think it does that on the liveCD ... it doesnt seem to in the mobile image [13:12] i have to click the icon an select a network manually before installing [13:37] ogra: which essid should NM use? [13:37] if there are many? [13:37] (which is the usual case nowadays) [13:37] the one with the strongest signal ? no idea [13:38] i just know it did try to connect by default in former releases [13:38] asac: I don't think it's easy; what I mentionned instead is that ubiquity should poke about network status if it likes to use the net and NM says there's none at this point [13:38] currenty the installer is unhappy if there is no net [13:38] Perhaps not ubiquity itself, but the underlying screen/whatever [13:38] we dont have a ship seed on the images so we dont have langpacks locally [13:39] lool: right. the installer should honour online/offline status [13:39] which means it relies on having a connection up [13:39] I don't think we can expect NM to connect to random nets [13:39] exposed by NM [13:39] asac: Yup [13:39] it could also present its own AP selector [13:39] and start the connection through dbus [13:39] i would like an option in the face of the user if it doesnt have a connection up [13:39] lots of things possible ;) [13:39] its easy to miss that you are not connected atm [13:40] i should dump firefox and go for NM only ;) [13:40] heh [13:40] NM installer wizard ;) [13:40] lool: i think mvo said that the he is working on online/offline for 9.04 [13:44] Excellent [13:47] is the usb image writeable? [13:48] smp4488_, no but you cn install packages to it [13:48] *can [13:48] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MobileTeam/Mobile/HowTo/ImageModification [13:49] well, or do other things ... the script gives you a writabe mode inside the image [13:49] StevenK: -4.9 kernel is usual location for upload. ABI bump due to xfs ignored. [13:49] lool: ogra: ^ [13:49] so anything i do booted from the usb cant be saved [13:49] amitk: \o/ ! [13:49] amitk: noted [13:50] amitk: StevenK is jumping on sponsoring [13:51] amitk: The .orig is still uploading? [13:51] Ah, yes [13:51] I don't need it [13:52] StevenK: yeah... sorry I delete it by mistake. Then realised that you _might_ need it. [13:54] amitk: Uploaded [14:17] YEAH \o/ [14:18] StevenK: Can you kick a daily image build when it's ready? === crevette_ is now known as crevette [14:19] lool: Probably not, since that will likely be 2am [14:22] * ogra will do that [14:22] lool, i assume that doesnt include fixed traslations yet ? [14:22] ogra: Perhaps check if it's ok with release team [14:22] will do [14:22] ogra: You mean kourou updates? [14:22] yeah [14:22] kourou wasn't uploaded yet AFAIK [14:23] * ogra suspects just importing xdg.Locale might help [14:23] fiddling with that atm [14:23] I don't think I even had to do that [14:23] err, so is it fixed ? [14:26] I'm installing in French [14:26] ok, i'll stop poking that then [14:34] hello there [14:34] I've got a question: I've got an Eee-PC [14:35] what shold I do to fully enable functions and eventually fix problems after a fresh installation? [14:35] im getting a kernel panic with mobile usb: not syncing vfs [14:35] should* [14:37] elegos, There's some EeePC docs on the wiki, but I'm not sure how much they are based on Mobile vs. Desktop. What's not working? [14:38] smp4488, That's unexpected. At what point in the cycle? [14:39] I get translated .desktop names in kourou after an install in French [14:39] Perhaps I didn't install the langpacks due to network issues last time [14:39] Hurrah! [14:40] persia: dunno, the computer is of my girlfriend and, having troubles with ubuntu-eee, I wanted to find her an alternative [14:40] I'll invalid that bug [14:40] elegos, Hrm. Most of it should just work. I've heard of issues with WiFi on some models, where installing linux-backports-modules was a workaround. [14:40] lool: \o/ [14:41] lool: The other two bugs are fixed locally [14:41] Anyone have an Eee who could help elegos with understanding what might not work? [14:41] StevenK: The %k and %i as well? [14:41] Cause I was about to test my fixes [14:41] persia: what about EeePC 701 with Atheros card? [14:41] lool: Yes [14:42] You added a lambda? [14:42] lool: I'm plotting crashing, but I can push my branch [14:42] Please push; we need to get these changes uploaded and approved ASAP [14:42] (and tested evidently) [14:42] ogra, Do you know if the 701 was one of those that needed lbm? [14:43] persia, popey had to install lbm on a 700 iirc [14:43] lool: This is untested stuff [14:43] what is LBM? [14:43] linux backports modules [14:43] a package [14:43] ok [14:43] elegos, it is in the image in the /debs dir [14:44] you can install it manually after an installation [14:44] and what about tweaks needed by a standard 8.04 installation? [14:44] oh, you talk about standard [14:44] * ogra thought he talked about mobile [14:44] yes I know [14:44] I'm speaking about the differences [14:44] no idea about standard ... [14:45] mobile uses a different desktop layout and themeing [14:45] i.e. graphics card boosted, shutdown issue (not shutdowing), Atheros WiFi card [14:45] (madwifi drivers) [14:45] the athreos card will be handled by lbm [14:45] i'm not aware o any shutdown issues [14:45] *of [14:45] since the eee has a intel 965 graphics card it should just work === davmor2_lunch is now known as davmor2 [14:46] I know about this project: http://www.array.org/ubuntu/index.html [14:46] just try out the mobile image, its a live image [14:46] since now it handles a custom kernel for eeePC [14:46] ok [14:46] you can test if it works from USB key [14:46]