[00:37] <vorian> wth
[00:46] <NCommander> vorian, ?
[00:46] <vorian> sorry
[00:46] <vorian> i got a weird email w/out a body
[00:47] <vorian> The Future of Linux Computing- Gnu Gnome stomps on Trolltech KDE!
[00:47] <a|wen> vorian: you are not alone on that one
[00:47]  * JontheEchidna hasn't got it
[00:47] <vorian> from dark star?
[00:49] <a|wen> vorian: exactly
[00:49] <vorian> a|wen: weird
[00:50] <a|wen> vorian: I got something similar (spam like) earlier from the same address ... i suppose it really is spam now
[00:51] <vorian> hmm
[00:51] <vorian> some people :P
[01:20] <ScottK> apachelogger: At least be a MOTU and convince jdong you know what you are doing.  Since you're core-dev, you'll be able to upload source backports if needed and that'll be good not to be the only one on the team.
[01:21] <ScottK> apachelogger: I marked in the bug.
[01:22] <apachelogger> ScottK: thanks. btw, quassel needs another FFe => bug 289291
[01:22] <ScottK> apachelogger: Read the bug.
[01:22] <ScottK> The FFe one.
[01:23] <apachelogger> ah :)
[01:23]  * apachelogger hugs ScottK
[01:42] <NCommander> apachelogger, interested in joining backports?
[01:48] <apachelogger> NCommander: yes, I have a backport setup for KDE releases anyway, so in can as well spend some time with official backports ;-)
[01:48]  * NCommander hugs apachelogger 
[01:48] <NCommander> I'm a backporter once I become an MOTU
[01:48]  * NCommander already got an ACK from jdong
[01:50] <NCommander> apachelogger, you can help upload backports :-)
[01:50] <apachelogger> you are not MOTU yet?
[01:51] <ScottK> His app is pending.
[01:51] <ScottK> apachelogger: You know how that can feel.
[01:51] <apachelogger> *nod*
[01:51] <apachelogger> I had to poke them about smarter as well
[01:52] <apachelogger> maybe one should just become more annoying with every day that passes by ;-)
[01:53] <ScottK> So am I the only one that is seriously annoyed at the Ubuntu brown I see on wiki.kubuntu.org?
[01:53] <Hobbsee> purple would be better
[01:54] <apachelogger> ScottK: we only link to /Kubuntu I think, so it's only a minor issue IMHO
[01:55] <ScottK> OK.  So I'm the only one.
[01:56] <NCommander> ScottK, yes.
[01:56] <apachelogger> ScottK: pretty much, it should be taken care of though
[01:56] <NCommander> ScottK, er, I mean, no, I am too
[01:56]  * apachelogger thinks moin needs some sensible multidomain feature in general
[01:57] <NCommander> apachelogger, well, I know one member of the team said they'd review within 30 hours, and that was yesterday
[01:58] <ScottK> All I've gotten is "Anyone who is subscribed to the page got notified and no one complained so it's fine."
[01:59] <apachelogger> mhh, stepchild treatment
[02:00]  * NCommander notes Xubuntu hasn't had a working theme ever
[02:00] <NCommander> kubuntu seems to be the ugly stepchild this entire release
[02:00] <apachelogger> true
[02:02]  * apachelogger should poke knome about a wiki theme for xubuntu
[02:02] <apachelogger> in fact, I think we should use the same with different colors :P
[02:06] <NCommander> apachelogger, you should see my desktop, it doesn't even look like Xubuntu ATM
[02:07] <ScottK> Oddly enough, mine doesn't either.
[02:07] <NCommander> ScottK, I'd be worried if Kubuntu looked like Xubuntu
[02:08] <ScottK> Sorry.  The irony flag is set here tonight.
[02:10]  * NCommander changes #kubuntu-devel mode: -i
[02:14] <ScottK> NCommander: I see you have the irony flag too.  "Here" is in my head.
[02:15]  * NCommander changes ScottK's mode: -irony
[02:16] <ScottK> NCommander: You might want to consider the alternative is worse.
[02:16] <NCommander> o_o?
[02:17] <ScottK> Yeah.  Bad day.
[02:17] <NCommander> Ouch
[02:24] <NCommander> apachelogger, http://img247.imageshack.us/img247/1748/screenshot2ht1.th.png
[02:24] <NCommander> apachelogger, that's my desktop
[02:24] <JontheEchidna> nice thumbnail ;P
[02:25] <NCommander> http://img247.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenshot2ht1.png ^- JontheEchidna
[02:25] <JontheEchidna> hmm, methinks a desktop that looked like that would drive me crazy
[02:25] <NCommander> the black on white?
[02:26] <JontheEchidna> black on black
[02:26] <JontheEchidna> no close buttons on windows
[02:26] <JontheEchidna> or minimize, etc
[02:26] <JontheEchidna> but now I am tasked to make Plasma look like that
[02:27] <NCommander> JontheEchidna, ?
[02:27] <NCommander> The buttons are all there, just a little hard to see
[02:27] <JontheEchidna> oh
[02:28] <NCommander> The Crux theme doesn't handle dark colors too well
[02:28] <ScottK> Sounds like a profile one of my kids would like.
[02:28] <ScottK> I sit down to help them and I can
[02:28] <NCommander> But all the icons are there if you look hard for them
[02:28] <ScottK> can't read a thing because the contrast is so lown
[02:28] <NCommander> I just find darker colors are easier on the eyes
[02:28] <JontheEchidna> is this gnome or xfce?
[02:28] <NCommander> Xfce
[02:28] <NCommander> Don't you see the transparent mouse bleeding through in the corner?
[02:28] <JontheEchidna> ok, I saw some gnome-y icons
[02:29] <NCommander> I'm using the GNOME icon set
[02:29] <JontheEchidna> ah, that's why :P
[02:29] <NCommander> The Xfce one bugs me for some reason
[02:29]  * NCommander has inactive windows get a slight transparency, so in the corner of my desktop I can see the Xubuntu logo 
[02:31] <NCommander> JontheEchidna, its Xfce 4.6, so I get all sorts of neat tranparency effects, its actually quite nice
[02:36] <ScottK> Would someone please look at Debian Bug #503401 and see if we care?
[02:41] <NCommander> ScottK, looks like we're affected since we have the same version as Debian
[02:47] <JontheEchidna> NCommander: http://img124.imageshack.us/my.php?image=xfceclonetg9.png
[02:47] <JontheEchidna> Locking the widgets'll get rid of all those plasma symbols on the panels btw
[02:47] <NCommander> That's sexy
[02:48] <JontheEchidna> ^_^
[02:49]  * NCommander hacks on the jaunty-ports kernel
[02:49] <JontheEchidna> heh, the color scheme didn't change all the way for Konsole
[02:49] <NCommander> my biggest grip with KDE4 is its slow as a dog without acceleration
[02:55] <JontheEchidna> my dad finds the Task Manager applet to be his biggest gripe
[02:56] <JontheEchidna> the lack of multiple rows and task grouping
[02:56] <JontheEchidna> 1-row taskmanagers don't do well with 8 xterms + FF + Thunderbird + whatever else he may be running
[02:58] <NCommander> ouch
[02:58] <NCommander> wait, xterm?
[02:58] <NCommander> ew
[02:58] <JontheEchidna> yes, he has 8 xterms plastered across 2 desktops
[02:59] <JontheEchidna> with which he does programming in vi
[02:59] <NCommander> He should at least use konsole or something else
[03:02] <JontheEchidna> His new laptop is really nice
[03:02] <JontheEchidna> Intrepid looks and runs great on it
[03:03] <JontheEchidna> He turned off desktop effects because he didn't like the tooltip previews, lol
[03:27] <NCommander> lol
[03:47] <ScottK> NCommander: Can you check out the fix then?
[03:48] <NCommander> ScottK, there isn't one for kvirc yet expect new upstream
[03:49]  * NCommander is looking to see if backporting is an option
[03:51] <NCommander> ScottK, there is a lot of "noise" in their SVN repo, finding the fix will be tricky as hell
[03:52] <ScottK> Perfect for you then.
[03:52]  * NCommander feels loved
[03:53] <NCommander> ScottK, 3.4.0 -> 3.4.2 is described as a bug-fix release
[03:53] <NCommander> It might simply be worth updating
[03:53] <ScottK> Hmmm. apachelogger: What do you think?
[03:55] <ScottK> Maybe JontheEchidna will do some testing ...
[04:00]  * NCommander just learned that things shouldn't get published into -updates until aging 7 days
[04:00] <NCommander> O_o;
[10:25] <dotancohen> Hello devs. A very critical KDE accessibility bug has been fixed, and I would like to know how soon it may be incorporated into Kubuntu? I am currently stuck on KDE 3.x because of it, and thus I will not be upgrading to Kubuntu 8.10
[10:25] <dotancohen> This is the bug: http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=165402
[10:26] <dotancohen> Was fixed in KDE SVN commit 876002
[11:01] <Arby> Riddell: apachelogger: is it worth trying to get a patch for bug 275596 in before final or shall I just wait for post release updates?
[11:05] <a|wen> Arby: if you have a package ready in a PPA or the like i'll be happy to give it some testing; then you'll at least have some 3rd party testing done also before throwing it in
[11:06] <Arby> a|wen: I haven't built a package yet, that's next on the list
[11:06] <Arby> The fix is trivial if you don't mind having a look at it
[11:07] <Arby> there's a diff attached to the bug
[11:07] <Arby> it's literally on number in the akregatorrc file
[11:08] <dotancohen> Hello devs. A very critical KDE accessibility bug has been fixed, and I would like to know how soon it may be incorporated into Kubuntu? I am currently stuck on KDE 3.x because of it, and thus I will not be upgrading to Kubuntu 8.10
[11:09] <dotancohen> This is the bug: http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=165402
[11:09] <dotancohen> Was fixed in KDE SVN commit 876002
[11:09] <a|wen> Arby: that is indeed trivial ...
[11:09] <Arby> yep :)
[11:10] <Arby> dotancohen: looking
[11:10] <a|wen> that's actually test-able without a real package ... i'll just go checking that it doesn't seem to break some panel-hiding, or whatever could have been a remote idea of putting 0 there
[11:11] <Arby> a|wen: my thinking too
[11:12] <Arby> dotancohen: do you happen to know the svn commit that fixes the bug
[11:12] <dotancohen> SVN commit 876002
[11:12] <dotancohen> Thanks
[11:12] <Arby> thanks
[11:13] <Arby> if it's included in the 4.1.3 release it should hit kubuntu when we package 4.1.3 which should be soon
[11:13] <Arby> if it's only in trunk it'll end up in 4.2
[11:13] <Arby> we might be able to backport it if necessary
[11:13] <Arby> I'll have a look
[11:15] <a|wen> Arby: exactly which file are you planning to patch?
[11:15] <Arby> a|wen: .kde/share/config/akregatorrc
[11:16] <a|wen> Arby: but that is the local configuration-file ... shouldn't you need to patch the global one
[11:16] <Arby> possibly, that's just what I found that works
[11:17]  * Arby looks for the global file
[11:17] <a|wen> Arby: /usr/share/kde4/config.kcfg/akregator.kcfg
[11:17] <dotancohen> Thanks, Arby. If I need a backport (I cannot use KDE 4 without it) should I file a bug report, or is there a prefered way>
[11:17] <dotancohen> ?
[11:18] <Arby> dotancohen: file a bug in launchpad and link it to the kde bug
[11:18] <dotancohen> Will do, thanks.
[11:18] <a|wen> Arby: there Splitter2 sizes defaults to 50,350
[11:18] <Arby> I'm not sure of the exact process but at least we've got a record of the info
[11:20] <Arby> a|wen: strange, because that's not what happens
[11:20] <a|wen> Arby: the process is that the file .kde gets written the first time ... and the info used to start the first time is gotten from the kcfg-file (IIRC)
[11:20] <Arby> except that it isn't happening
[11:21] <Arby> brb
[11:21] <a|wen> Arby: couldn't it be because of an old akregatorrc file from hardy? aren't they talking about upgrading
[11:23] <Arby> a|wen: could be, the same bug bit me after an upgrade.
[11:23] <Arby> let me look harder
[11:25] <dotancohen> Sorry to keep interupting, but here is the Launchpad bug for the KDE accesibility issue:
[11:25] <dotancohen> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/meta-kde/+bug/289440
[11:25] <dotancohen> Thanks, Arby!
[11:25] <Arby> yw
[11:26] <a|wen> Arby: got to reproduce it now :)
[11:27] <Arby> a|wen: that'll be interesting since I no longer have a kde3 system
[11:27] <Arby> VMs for the win :)
[11:27]  * Arby adds it to the todo list
[11:27] <a|wen> Arby: i can reproduce it in a fresh kde4 install (no upgrade
[11:27] <a|wen> Arby: choose viewmode combined and exit akregator ... see the akregtorrc file now it has the dreaded 0 ... open akregator again and immediately choose viewmode normal
[11:28] <a|wen> Arby: it seems to be the viewmode changes that is broken on some level
[11:28] <Arby> a|wen: right, sorry, I got confused between conversations :)
[11:30] <a|wen> Arby: hehe :)
[11:31] <Arby> a|wen: yes, you're right
[11:32] <Arby> a|wen: on switching viewmodes it isn't reading the correct default layout information
[11:33] <Arby> hmmph, that's much harder to fix
[11:33] <Arby> and well beyond my skills
[11:34] <a|wen> Arby: or it might be that it shouldn't write 0 in the first place ... when viewmode combined is used it shouldn't fiddle with the splitter 2 option at all
[11:35] <Arby> a|wen: what happens if you choose viewmode=normal then close akregator, remove akregatorrc then reopen?
[11:35] <Arby> in my case it recreates akregatorrc with the 0 in splitter 2
[11:35]  * Arby goes to make coffee, my brain hurts
[11:37] <a|wen> Arby: it works exatcly as it should here (value = 150) ... remember to let akregator close completely before deleting the akregatorrc file
[11:40] <Arby> hmm
[11:41] <Arby> ok it worked right this time, fail on my part there then
[11:43] <Arby> I think I'll build a clean intrepid vm and see what happens there
[11:45] <a|wen> Arby: sounds strange if it does that ... but on the other hand, we know there is someting wrong in the viewport code
[11:46] <Arby> a|wen: yeah, I have to assume that one was my bad :)
[11:46] <Arby> a|wen: I'll make a VM and have a look
[11:47] <Arby> if it behaves on a clean install then it's a problem caused by and upgrade somehow
[11:47] <Arby> s/and/an/
[11:47] <a|wen> Arby: i'm doing my test on a clean intrepid VM ... installed yesterday
[11:47] <Arby> ah, that answers that question then
[11:48] <a|wen> :)
[11:48] <Arby> a|wen: do you speak c++? I think someone needs to read the code
[11:48] <Arby> I can try but I don't know C
[11:48] <Arby> of any flavour
[11:49] <a|wen> Arby: me neither ... but i'm starting to learn, based on looking at kde code :)
[11:49]  * Arby attempts to read code
[12:28] <apachelogger> Arby: I have another fix for kdepim as well
[12:28] <Arby> apachelogger: it turns out I was wrong anyway
[12:28] <apachelogger> perfect :P
[12:28] <Arby> I fixed the symptom not the cause
[12:29]  * a|wen goes hiding ... for de-fixing things :P
[12:29] <Arby> I'm now deeper in the kdepim code than I'm comfortable with
[12:29] <Arby> a|wen: :P
[12:29] <Arby> in other words I have no idea what's going on
[12:31] <Arby> as a|wen correctly diagnosed the default panel sizes aren't set correctly when akregator viewmode is changed
[12:31] <apachelogger> kde svn 876002
[12:31] <apachelogger> looks playgroundish, doesn't it :P
[12:32] <Arby> apachelogger: the word playground sort of implies that yes :)
[12:32]  * apachelogger thinks we should disallow bug reports against kde-meta
[12:33] <Arby> apachelogger: with your core dev hat on when do you think that will land in kubuntu?
[12:33] <Arby> presumably 4.2 at the earliest
[12:33] <apachelogger> well
[12:33] <apachelogger> that depends partly on KDE
[12:34] <apachelogger> if they are going to include the plasmoid into 4.2, then KDE 4.2 is the latest :P
[12:34] <apachelogger> earliest would be that we create a svn snapshot of the plasmoid and deploy it via KDE 4 ppa
[12:35] <Arby> do you think it's important enough to try and backport?
[12:36] <apachelogger> IMHO we should be ashamed and kick ourselfs in the arse for the status of accessibility in 8.10
[12:36] <apachelogger> so, yes, it is
[12:36] <Arby> ok, and what would be the required steps to do that?
[12:37] <apachelogger> grab the source, try building it, hope it builds, create a snapshot package if it does build
[12:37] <apachelogger> if it does not build: create a snapshot package, and patch it to buildable state
[12:38] <Arby> I'm prepared to try the grab it and attempt build part
[12:38] <Arby> I'll need help to package it
[12:38] <Arby> and I'll definitely need help if it needs patching
[12:39] <Arby> apachelogger: am I right in thinking this would be a post release update, too close to final etc?
[12:40] <Arby> this kdepim bug is too hard for me anyway :(
[12:40] <apachelogger> Arby: no update at all
[12:40] <apachelogger> it could go to intrepid-backports
[12:40] <apachelogger> but there isn't much difference if we use that or the ppa
[12:41] <Arby> I'll give it a go then
[12:42] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: should I relocate bug 289440 to kdebase-workspace?
[12:43] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: accessibility
[12:45] <JontheEchidna> wtf, 404 when I try to edit the bug
[12:47] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: I edit0red it away
[12:47] <JontheEchidna> so bug 289418 is pretty much a wont fix since ksokoban is in the old kdegames, right?
[12:48] <JontheEchidna> I mean, technically we could do like with kdvi
[12:48] <JontheEchidna> but for just a game?
[12:49] <ScottK> apachelogger: After the new GCC upload yesterday kde4libs built on hppa, so if you could kick off more rebuilds we might get some/all of KDE build for hppa yet.
[12:50] <ScottK> I need to leave in just a few minutes, so I can't do it now, but if you could do the first few, I can do the rest later.
[12:50] <apachelogger> ScottK: do we need an ACK from ubuntu-release?
[12:50] <ScottK> apachelogger: Not for rebuilds.
[12:51] <apachelogger> okies
[12:51] <ScottK> Particularly not for hppa.
[12:51] <JontheEchidna> afk for 15 mins
[13:07] <apachelogger> stdin: bug 289052 next time please reference the bug
[13:09] <Arby> apachelogger: kbstateapplet build fails with http://paste.ubuntu.com/62870/ is this something that needs patching or something missing in my chroot?
[13:10] <Arby> never having used cmake manually before I don't really understand
[13:11] <apachelogger> possibly patching
[13:11] <apachelogger> Arby: kdebase-workspace-dev is installed?
[13:11] <Arby> checking
[13:11] <Arby> no it isn't so I'll try that first
[13:14] <Arby> apachelogger: still fails with k-w-dev installed, same error :(
[13:14]  * Arby fears having to patch this
[13:16] <apachelogger> ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
[13:16] <apachelogger> sec
[13:17] <apachelogger> Arby: you need to patch
[13:17] <Arby> I was afraid you might say that
[13:17] <apachelogger> well
[13:17] <apachelogger> nothing fancy
[13:18] <apachelogger> Arby: grab $plasmoidpackage from the archive and make your cmakelists.txt resemble the one of the package
[13:18] <apachelogger> most importantly you will need
[13:18] <apachelogger> find_package(KDE4 REQUIRED)
[13:18] <apachelogger> include (KDE4Defaults
[13:18] <apachelogger> )
[13:19] <Arby> apachelogger: by $plasmoidpackage do you mean any plasmoid package?
[13:19] <apachelogger> yus
[13:19] <apachelogger> e.g. weather
[13:20] <apachelogger> or quicklaunch
[13:20] <apachelogger> or toggle-compositing
[13:20]  * Arby looks for the corresponding package
[13:21] <Arby> apachelogger: is weather equivalent to the package kweather?
[13:22] <Arby> I barely use plasmoids, I don't like stuff on my desktop
[13:23] <apachelogger> Arby: well, the old kweather
[13:23] <JontheEchidna> I believe kweather only provides weather resources, and not an actual applet
[13:23] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: no
[13:23] <apachelogger> I am pretty sure the dataengine works independent form kweather
[13:23] <apachelogger> + I have no idea what kweather is for anyway
[13:24] <Arby> nvm I found toggle-compositing, I'll use that
[13:27] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: I think systemsettings needs to depend on kdebase-workspace-bin
[13:27] <JontheEchidna> bug 289368
[13:27] <JontheEchidna> since it's somewhat useless without kcm modules
[13:28] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: are they all in -bin?
[13:28] <JontheEchidna> I believe so
[13:28] <JontheEchidna> actually some might be in kde-window-manager
[13:28] <JontheEchidna> but if you're installing in gnome you wouldn't need those
[13:28] <apachelogger> yes
[13:28] <apachelogger> well
[13:29] <apachelogger> you could
[13:29] <apachelogger> anywho
[13:29] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: isn't there some -data package as well?
[13:29] <apachelogger> I am pretty sure that contains the actual desktop files
[13:29] <apachelogger> so unless -bin depends -data (which is likely)
[13:29] <apachelogger> we would need to make sysettings depend both
[13:30] <JontheEchidna> I see a lot of kcontrol docs in -data
[13:31] <JontheEchidna> but nothing in the way of actual kcm modules
[13:31] <JontheEchidna> hmm, we should probably talk to debian about this
[13:32] <apachelogger> pretty much
[13:34] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: kdebase-workspace-data.install line 310-335
[13:34] <apachelogger> kcm modules
[13:35] <apachelogger> Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, kdebase-workspace-data (= ${source:Version}),
[13:35] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: make syssettings depend -bin should be enough
[13:37] <JontheEchidna> so, what would the best way to notify debian be? Throw a debdiff at 'em?
[13:38] <Arby> apachelogger: the snippet you gave me worked, cmake completes without errors.
[13:38] <Arby> what happens next?
[13:38] <Arby> make?
[13:38] <apachelogger> yes
[13:38] <Arby> make goes splat
[13:39] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: yes, or you could poke ana in their irc channel
[13:39] <apachelogger> but hide from pinotree, he might still be mad at you :P
[13:40] <JontheEchidna> yes <.<
[13:40] <Arby> apachelogger: http://paste.ubuntu.com/62876/ I think I'm missing some qt dev type stuff
[13:46] <apachelogger> Arby: I think now comes the real patching :P
[13:46] <apachelogger> kdelibs5-dev should depend on libqt4-dev
[13:47] <Arby> ok fire away I'll be back in 5
[13:47] <apachelogger> ah
[13:47] <apachelogger> maybe not :P
[13:47]  * apachelogger thinks the cmake stuff is still incomplete
[13:47] <apachelogger> libqt4-dev: /usr/include/qt4/QtGui/QGraphicsLayout
[13:47] <apachelogger> clearly missing something
[13:49] <apachelogger> Arby: add
[13:49] <apachelogger> add_definitions (${QT_DEFINITIONS} ${KDE4_DEFINITIONS})
[13:49] <apachelogger> include_directories (${CMAKE_SOURCE_DIR} ${CMAKE_BINARY_DIR} ${KDE4_INCLUDES})
[13:49] <apachelogger> directly following the other stuff you added
[13:52] <Arby> apachelogger: cmake output http://paste.ubuntu.com/62882/
[13:52] <Arby> does that look sane to you?
[13:53] <Arby> make says yes \o/. I think
[13:54] <Arby> make output http://paste.ubuntu.com/62883/
[13:54] <Arby> nothing obviously wrong but then I'm a neophyte
[13:56] <Arby> make install seems to complete
[13:56]  * Arby wonders how one launches a plasmoid from inside a chroot
[13:59] <apachelogger> Arby: if you setup you chroot to access your X you can use plasmoidviewer NAMEOFPLASMOID
[13:59] <apachelogger> otherwise you are boned
[14:00] <Arby> apachelogger: I'm just doing exactly that
[14:00] <Arby> I found the right bit of techbase
[14:01] <ScottK-palm> apachelogger: Got it sorted now?
[14:02] <apachelogger> ScottK-palm: EBS for -runtime in 2 hours
[14:04] <ScottK-palm> Cool. We probably won't get the whole stack at this point, but it's progress.
[14:08] <apachelogger> ScottK-palm: if hppa wasn't so slow, it certainly would be an advantage ;-)
[14:09] <ScottK-palm> Yeah. For a while hppa was FTBFS most things so it kept up well.
[14:10] <ScottK-palm> You might look ahead and see if there are non-kde depends that need a retry too.
[14:12]  * ScottK-palm would look, but it's pretty tough through the phone.
[14:19] <apachelogger> ScottK-palm: will do
[14:23] <ScottK-palm> Back later.
[14:32] <smarter> is bug #276224 supposed to be fixed?
[14:33] <Arby> apachelogger: I think I broke the applet
[14:33] <smarter> cause I just got hit by i
[14:33] <smarter> *it
[14:33] <apachelogger> \o/
[14:33] <Arby> apachelogger: plasmoidviewer shows an empty black frame
[14:33] <Arby> and the terminal shows findServiceByDesktopPath:  not found
[14:33] <apachelogger> smarter: how exactly would that be caused by kubuntu-kde4-meta?
[14:33] <smarter> no idea
[14:33] <smarter> I'm on Intrepid
[14:33] <smarter> but I just started Kate and got these messages
[14:33] <apachelogger> kbuildsycoca4
[14:34] <Arby> already did that but I'll try again
[14:34] <smarter> no luck
[14:34] <apachelogger> kbuildsycoca4 --noincremental
[14:34] <apachelogger> smarter: anywho
[14:34] <apachelogger> wrong package
[14:34] <apachelogger> clearly skim/scim related
[14:35] <smarter> 00A0C0T0I0O0N0 0d0o0n0'0t0 0r0e0m0e0m0b0e0r0 0i0n0s0t0a0l0l0i0n0g0 0s0c0i0m0 0s0t0u0f0f0 0r0e0c0e0n0t0l0y00
[14:35] <apachelogger> it is shipped by default
[14:35] <Arby> apachelogger: same result, could it be because it's inside a chroot?
[14:35] <apachelogger> and IIRC there is some conflict with skim and scim-bridge-qt*
[14:35] <smarter> apachelogger: wasn't that fixed by a pacth or something?
[14:35] <apachelogger> Arby: possibly
[14:35] <smarter> *patch
[14:35] <smarter> yes, but I didn't have this bug until recently
[14:35] <apachelogger> Arby: just make a package and try it on your regular system
[14:36] <apachelogger> smarter: well, I ain't know anything about tha scim
[14:36]  * Arby googles how to build packages with cmake
[14:39] <smarter> OMG
[14:39] <smarter> ps aux|grep scim-panel-gtk|wc -l
[14:39] <smarter> 161
[14:39] <smarter> WTF is this thing doing?
[14:41] <smarter> grr, I killed them, then started kate again and it restarted scim with 12 processes
[14:42] <smarter> apachelogger: do you have scim installed?
[14:42] <apachelogger> no
[14:42] <apachelogger> boah
[14:42] <apachelogger> ah
[14:42] <apachelogger> ASEFJagb
[14:42] <apachelogger> stupid konqueror
[14:42] <apachelogger> stupid shortcut thingies
[14:42]  * apachelogger switches to windows
[14:42] <smarter> :P
[14:43] <smarter> could you reinstall kubuntu-desktop and see if scim is screwing your system?
[14:43] <smarter> I don't think we can release a Kubuntu where every app takes 5 seconds more than on other distros to start.
[14:45] <smarter> "Failed to allocate the agent. Exitting...
[14:45] <smarter> especially with misspelled error messages :P
[14:46] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: ^
[14:46]  * apachelogger isn't going to reboot again
[14:50] <smarter> If skim(or scim-panel-kde) is started, there is no more delay at startup
[14:51] <apachelogger> kde Bug 170435
[14:51] <smarter> I believe this is due to latest scim-bridge update
[14:51] <smarter> which disable the patch which fixed that
[14:52] <smarter> and which was uploaded 4 days ago
[14:52] <smarter> (thanks to the guy who did that :P)
[14:52] <smarter> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+source/scim-bridge/0.4.14-2ubuntu4
[14:54] <apachelogger> smarter: poke him in the eye
[14:54] <smarter> yup
[14:54] <smarter> he changed the patch to check for "which scim-helper"
[14:54] <smarter> except the binary scim-helper doesn't exist...
[14:55] <apachelogger> nice
[15:00] <smarter> grr, arne is /away
[15:01] <smarter> if he doesn't show up this evening, we have to revert the change to 50_check_scim_binary.dpatch
[15:01] <smarter> I can confirm that with -0ubuntu3 it works fine
[15:01] <smarter> * -2ubuntu3
[15:02] <a|wen> smarter: 50_... patch is disabled entirely says the changelog
[15:02] <smarter> oh, right
[15:03] <apachelogger> Arby: please be more cautious with marking bugs as triaged, usually you would only go for triaged if the bug is forwarded and accepted by upstream, or for a crash, if a usable and up-to-date backtrace is available and the bug is forwarded
[15:03] <a|wen> smarter: it seems Riddell's change broke some gtk stuff ... so the patch probably needs to be changed to not break gtk stuff and be re-enabled
[15:03] <smarter> we should probably revert to -2ubuntu2 state
[15:03] <Arby> apachelogger: which bug?
[15:03] <smarter> Riddell: could you please look at this? It's a pretty serious issue
[15:04] <apachelogger> Arby: any
[15:04] <apachelogger> Arby: in this case bug 177566
[15:04] <apachelogger> triaged should only be used when all possibly important information is aggregated
[15:06] <Arby> I thought it was once the new backtrace was supplied. the misunderstanding is how much information is enough
[15:06] <Arby> I was advised to ask for a backtrace with kdepim-dbg installed
[15:06] <Arby> and that's what we got
[15:06] <Arby> anyway, point noted
[15:12] <Arby> apachelogger: what would be the appropriate version number for an svn snapshot of this kbapplet?
[15:24] <apachelogger> Arby: 0.0+svn$SVNREVISON
[15:24] <Arby> thanks
[15:25] <Arby> apachelogger: 0.0+svn876002 is it -0ubuntu1 or -0ubuntu0?
[15:26] <Arby> I vaguely remember something about ubuntu1 meaning it already exists in debian or something
[15:26] <apachelogger> nono :P
[15:26] <apachelogger> -1 would be if the package goes to debian
[15:26] <apachelogger> for that matter, if you base a package upon the debian package it would be -1ubuntu1
[15:27] <apachelogger> or -5ubuntu1 if debian already got 5 revision before the ubuntu1
[15:27] <apachelogger> if the package is not basd on one from debian it is 0ubuntu1
[15:28] <Arby> thanks, I think I've got all the bits now, I'll attempt to debuild
[15:32] <smarter> 00A0C0T0I0O0N0 0t0h0i0n0k0s0 000.010~0s0v0n080x0x0x0x0 0i0s0 0p0r0e0t0t0i0e0r0 0t0h0a0n0 000.000+0s0v0n0x0x0x0 0:0P00
[15:32] <rgreening> g'day all
[15:35] <txwikinger> o/ rgreening
[15:41]  * Arby does the working plasmoid dance :D
[15:42] <Arby> apachelogger: to my great surprise it actually works
[15:42] <Arby> now what :)
[15:42] <apachelogger> coolio
[15:42] <apachelogger> Arby: create a bzr branch so I can take a look :P
[15:42] <Arby> instructions? :P
[15:43] <apachelogger> ~google ubuntu wiki bzr maintainer how to
[15:43] <kubotu> Results for ubuntu wiki bzr maintainer how to: 1. BzrMaintainerHowto - Ubuntu Wiki: http://www.google.comhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/BzrMaintainerHowto | 2. Bzr - Ubuntu Wiki: http://www.google.comhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bzr | 3. DCT/Workflow - Ubuntu Wiki: http://www.google.comhttps://wiki.kubuntu.org/DCT/Workflow
[15:43] <apachelogger> uh
[15:43] <apachelogger> parsing is broken
[15:43] <apachelogger> \o/
[15:44]  * Arby reads
[15:50] <apachelogger> woah
[15:50] <apachelogger> Arby++
[15:50]  * apachelogger clicks through all the kdepim crashyness
[15:50] <Arby> apachelogger: :) I'm not even done yet.
[15:51] <Arby> there are another 50 ish bugs still 'new'
[15:51] <apachelogger> the god thing about apport is that it marks bugs as private, so I don't have to actually take a look at them :P
[15:52] <Arby> until I go through an dmake them all public :P
[15:52] <Arby> apachelogger: for this applet, do you want me to put the whole source in bzr or just the packaging?
[15:55] <apachelogger> Arby: up to you, but for the latter you will need to add a get-orig-source target with a fixed revision number
[15:55] <apachelogger> that said, you need a get-orig-source target anyway :P
[15:56] <Arby> ok, I don't have one so lets fix that first :)
[15:56] <Arby> what file does it live in and what should it be?
[16:01] <apachelogger> debian/rules
[16:01] <apachelogger> ~google ubuntu wiki get-orig-source cvs example
[16:01] <kubotu> Results for ubuntu wiki get-orig-source cvs example: 1. PackagingGuide/Examples/ChangingTheOrigTarball - Ubuntu Wiki: http://www.google.comhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Examples/ChangingTheOrigTarball | 2. PackagingGuide/Basic - Ubuntu Wiki: http://www.google.comhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Basic
[16:01] <kubotu> 3. MOTU/School/PackagingWithoutCompiling - Ubuntu Wiki: http://www.google.comhttps://wiki.edubuntu.org/MOTU/School/PackagingWithoutCompiling
[16:01] <apachelogger> Arby: you just need to change it to SVN syntax I guess
[16:02] <apachelogger> svn co -r REVSION svn://anonsvn.kde.org....
[16:05] <smarter> 00A0C0T0I0O0N0 0t0e0s0t00
[16:05] <smarter> ^ do you see garbage here?
[16:06] <apachelogger> no
[16:06] <apachelogger> though if we would consider you as garbage.... :P
[16:06] <smarter> pffrt :P
[16:06] <smarter> cjwatson says I output strange character when using /me
[16:06] <smarter> could you look on #ubuntu-devel?
[16:07] <a|wen> smarter: I see garbage
[16:07] <JontheEchidna> I see garbage too
[16:07] <smarter> so, it's probably Quassel fault
[16:07]  * a|wen uses kde3 konversation
[16:08] <smarter> since apachelogger use quassel
[16:08]  * JontheEchidna uses konversaton too
[16:08] <apachelogger> possibly
[16:08] <smarter> (and I do too)
[16:08] <apachelogger> smarter: might be some interaction problem between the client and the core
[16:08] <rgreening> konversation here, and it's garbage to me 2
[16:08] <smarter> apachelogger: try putting a /me
[16:21] <Arby> apachelogger: I'm looking at packaging only branches on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BzrMaintainerHowto
[16:22] <Arby> do I need to make the changes to CMakeLists into a patch?
[16:22] <apachelogger> Arby: please
[16:22] <Arby> ok
[16:22] <apachelogger> Arby: in general, only avoid a patch if you have a uber important reason to do so
[16:24] <JontheEchidna> deleting 1000 mails takes a long time
[16:35] <jussio1> oh great, seems my system is somewhat screwed. is there a way to turn off desktop effects from the command line?
[16:36] <jussio1> I cant click anything in a window - it just tries to pick the window up as if Id clicked on the title bar.
[16:37] <JontheEchidna> jussio1: edit ~/.kde/share/config/kwinrc
[16:37] <JontheEchidna> in the compositing section set enabled=false
[16:37] <jussio1> JontheEchidna: ok, Ill give that a shot
[16:38] <apachelogger> hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
[16:38] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: maybe we should jaunty with a script to deactivate the effects from a terminal?
[16:39] <JontheEchidna> maybe
[16:39] <apachelogger> oh
[16:39] <apachelogger> yet fancier
[16:39] <apachelogger> make kdm detect if effects are turned on
[16:40] <apachelogger> and show some special menu to deactivate it while startkde is on the works
[16:40] <apachelogger> ...show the menu in kdm ... but deactivate effects while startkde is working... ;-)
[16:50] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna++
[16:50] <apachelogger> kill em stopd buggies
[16:55] <apachelogger> rgreening: bug 289402 bug 289402 and bug 289402
[16:56] <rgreening> apachelogger: hmm... strange...
[16:56] <apachelogger> why?
[16:56] <rgreening> does it build on x86
[16:56] <apachelogger> rgreening: think about it
[16:57] <apachelogger> lpia and hppa didn'tbuild for some time
[16:57] <apachelogger> so there is one of these packages missing
[16:57] <apachelogger> preventing the build of the other
[16:57] <apachelogger> so you can't build workspace because there is no bindings, and you can't build bindings because there is no workspace, because there is no workspace, because there is no bindings...
[16:58] <rgreening> I understand circular deps
[16:58] <apachelogger> then do something!
[16:58]  * apachelogger shudders
[16:58] <rgreening> lol
[16:58] <rgreening> you drinking again
[16:58] <rgreening> :)
[16:58] <apachelogger> no
[16:59] <apachelogger> that is just horrible and evil and frighten
[16:59] <rgreening> I'll look into it. see if I can figure out why they are busted.
[16:59] <rgreening> hehe
[16:59] <apachelogger> rgreening: well, the dep needs to be resolved
[16:59] <apachelogger> rgreening: does the python stuff in workspace actually depend on bindings?
[17:00] <rgreening> hmm... kdebase-workspace-4.1.2-0ubuntu11 built everythin g fine...
[17:00] <rgreening> so, must be an issue with recent changes in 0ubuntu12
[17:01] <apachelogger> no :P
[17:01] <apachelogger> dood, take a minute and think about it
[17:01] <apachelogger> if workspace really depends on bindings there is a _gigantic_ problem
[17:01] <apachelogger> say the API in bindings changes
[17:01] <apachelogger> then workspace wouldn't compile because of the incompatible API
[17:01] <rgreening> I understand that.
[17:01]  * rgreening thinks you misunderstand me
[17:01] <rgreening> :)
[17:01] <apachelogger> no
[17:01] <apachelogger> I know that i386 and stuff built fine
[17:02] <apachelogger> but it won't when jaunty opens
[17:02] <apachelogger> it only builds right now because there is already a kdebindings to use as build-dep
[17:03] <rgreening> hmm... let me get the source and have a look at the control files.
[17:04] <rgreening> hmmm... ok, so the python-kde4-dev in kdebase-workspace is causing the circular dep
[17:04] <rgreening> (I think)... 1 sec...
[17:05] <NCommander> apachelogger, hppa didn't build because bindings was hosed due to lack of mono on that architecture
[17:05] <apachelogger> rgreening: yes
[17:05] <rgreening> hmm....
[17:05] <apachelogger> rgreening: I doubt it is necessary though
[17:05]  * rgreening think's it may have been due to plasma python
[17:06] <apachelogger> no no
[17:06] <rgreening> and may be required... no t sure though.
[17:06] <apachelogger> workspace is only allowed to depend on kdelibs (and runtime on runtime)
[17:06] <jason-> slt
[17:06] <rgreening> I see that now
[17:06] <rgreening> brb
[17:06] <apachelogger> rgreening: upstream would have the dep issue as well ;-)
[17:08] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: are you going to fix bug 289368 ?
[17:08] <rgreening> ok, apachelogger, how can I verify (easiest)
[17:08] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: I'll talk with debiain right now
[17:09] <rgreening> _Sime_: you around?
[17:09] <apachelogger> rgreening: apt-cache show python-kde4-dev | grep Depends
[17:09] <apachelogger> Depends: python-qt4, python-kde4 (= 4:4.1.2-0ubuntu2)
[17:09] <apachelogger> apt-cache show python-kde4 | grep Depends
[17:09] <apachelogger> Depends: kdebase-runtime (>= 4:4.1.2), kdelibs5 (>= 4:4.1.2), libc6 (>= 2.3.4), libphonon4 (>> 4:4.2.0), libqt4-network (>= 4.4.3), libqt4-svg (>= 4.4.3), libqt4-xml (>= 4.4.3), libqtcore4 (>= 4.4.3), libqtgui4 (>= 4.4.3), libsoprano4 (>= 2.1), libstdc++6 (>= 4.1.1), phonon (>> 4:4.2.0), python2.5 (>= 2.5), python-qt4 (>= 4.3-2ubuntu7.1)
[17:09] <apachelogger> rgreening: try replacing the dep on python-kde4 with python-qt4 and python2.5
[17:10] <apachelogger> in theory it should be building then
[17:10] <apachelogger> rgreening: *the dep on python-kde4-dev even
[17:10] <rgreening> Ok, I'll have a look at it.
[17:10] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: okies
[17:10] <rgreening> yep
[17:13] <Arby> has anybody come across this before? If I run bzr+ssh://rbirnie@bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/kbstate-applet/ubuntu
[17:13] <Arby> I get
[17:13] <Arby> Permission denied (publickey).
[17:13] <Arby> bzr: ERROR: Connection closed: please check connectivity and permissions (and try -Dhpss if further diagnosis is required)
[17:13] <Arby> but my public key is already in launchpad
[17:17] <NCommander> Arby, probably a stupid question, but are you a core developer?
[17:17] <Arby> no, I'm trying to follow the instructions on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BzrMaintainerHowto
[17:18] <Arby> under pushing the first version
[17:20] <apachelogger> Arby: push to kubuntu-members
[17:20] <apachelogger> you can only push to ubuntu-dev if you are a core dev :P
[17:20] <Arby> that really isn't clear on the wiki :/
[17:21] <apachelogger> well, it is a bit outdated
[17:21] <apachelogger> doesn't talk about the fancy bzr stuff
[17:21] <JontheEchidna> ^heh, the entire wiki or the bzr stuff?
[17:21] <apachelogger> the wiki
[17:21] <apachelogger> and the bzr stuff
[17:21] <Arby> bzr push bzr+ssh://rbirnie@bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/kbstate-applet/ubuntu gives the same error
[17:21] <apachelogger> documentation is mostly meant to be out-of-date round here :P
[17:21]  * apachelogger runs
[17:22] <apachelogger> Arby: you are kubuntu member, aren't you?
[17:22] <Arby> I think so
[17:22]  * Arby checks
[17:22] <apachelogger> Oo
[17:22] <apachelogger> lol
[17:23] <Arby> actually, possible not. I'm in ~kubuntu-members-kde4 but not ~kubuntu-members it seems
[17:23]  * Arby thinks launchpad has too many teams
[17:24] <apachelogger> oh my god
[17:24] <Arby> but then I'm easily confused
[17:24] <Arby> which is probably why I'm not member yet :)
[17:24] <apachelogger> that is a) unfortunate b) fixable c) not good
[17:25] <apachelogger> Riddell: we need to do a arby-needs-to-become-member meeting
[17:25] <jjesse>  if you are part of kuubntu-members-kde4 aren't you a part of kubuntu-members or is it the oposite?
[17:25] <Arby> no idea
[17:25] <apachelogger> jjesse: oposite I think
[17:25] <apachelogger> Arby: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Membership
[17:25] <Arby> apachelogger: that requires an 'arby has to write a wiki page first'
[17:26] <apachelogger> well
[17:26] <apachelogger> first
[17:26] <apachelogger> bzr push
[17:26] <Arby> which requires overcoming arby is a lazy sod :P
[17:26] <apachelogger> Arby: ~YOURLPID/+junk/kbstate-applet-ubuntu
[17:26] <apachelogger> that should be working
[17:26] <Arby> let me try
[17:26] <apachelogger> then I can create a branch in kubuntu-members
[17:27] <smarter> 收安如
[17:28] <apachelogger> \o/
[17:28]  * smarter had to install chinese to test fscking scim
[17:28]  * apachelogger goes smokering
[17:28] <apachelogger> smarter: write a blog post about how to do that
[17:28] <apachelogger> I didn't quite figure out
[17:28] <smarter> apachelogger: qt-language-selector is your friend
[17:28] <smarter> it works
[17:29] <apachelogger> smarter: well, what then?
[17:29] <smarter> except you have to manually set the input method by right-clicking on a text field --> IM --> scim-bridge
[17:29] <smarter> but that only works with Qt apps, and not every Qt app
[17:29] <smarter> (Kate doesn't provide this option)
[17:29] <smarter> but I don't care
[17:29]  * smarter goes removing all that stuff
[17:30]  * Arby curses launchpad to the pitof hades
[17:30] <smarter> oh f*ck
[17:30] <smarter> now qt-language-selector is in chinese
[17:30] <smarter> and I've no idea what I should remove
[17:31] <JontheEchidna> \o/
[17:31] <smarter> sudo qt-language-selector --mode=uninstall KDE_LANG=fr_FR LANG=fr_FR.UTF-8 LANGUAGE=fr_FR doesn't work :/
[17:33] <smarter> it works with the env variable before the qt-language-selector \o/
[17:35] <JontheEchidna> python/pyqt/pykde likes to eat command line args
[17:35] <JontheEchidna> very fiddly
[18:22] <Arby> apachelogger: I finally overcame the battle with bzr
[18:22] <Arby> apachelogger: the branch is at https://code.launchpad.net/~rbirnie/kbstate-applet/kbstate-applet
[18:22] <Arby> I'm sure there are things wrong with it
[18:22] <Arby> now I need to go eat something
[18:23] <Arby> and hope my head stops pounding
[18:43] <apachelogger> rgreening: so what to do about the dep issue?
[18:44] <rgreening> I'l fix it tonight. I have some other duties calling now...
[18:44] <apachelogger> tonight is hopefully not too late tonight :S
[18:45] <apachelogger> Arby: THIS_SHOULD_GO_TO_UNSTABLE = 1 isn't required for 2 months
[18:45] <apachelogger> Arby: the get orig source target is wrong, rules is missing a final newline
[18:45] <rgreening> well, how late is too late apachelogger?
[18:46] <apachelogger> post 23:59 UTC I'd say
[18:46] <rgreening> ~time
[18:46] <kubotu> rgreening: America - St Johns - Sun Oct 26 16:16 NDT
[18:46] <apachelogger> the earlier we get this fixed, the better
[18:46] <rgreening> ~time apachelogger
[18:46] <kubotu> Europe - Vienna - Sun Oct 26 19:46 CET
[18:47] <apachelogger> ~time UTC
[18:47] <kubotu> UTC is an unknown time.
[18:47] <apachelogger> omg!
[18:47] <rgreening> lol
[18:47] <apachelogger> ~time GMT
[18:47] <kubotu> GMT is an unknown time.
[18:47] <apachelogger> -.-
[18:47] <apachelogger> @time UTC
[18:47] <rgreening> so, within the next 5 hours?
[18:47] <apachelogger> pretty much
[18:48] <apachelogger> Arby: control is missing final newline as well :P
[18:48] <rgreening> hmm... might be tight... will give it a go shortly
[18:48] <apachelogger> Arby: you can dump the homepage line from control
[18:49] <apachelogger> Arby: svn url in copyright exceeds 80 chars
[18:49] <apachelogger> rgreening: I can start a build with python-qt4/python2.5 instead of -kde4-dev
[18:49] <rgreening> sure...
[18:49] <apachelogger> Arby: indention for the license in debian/copyrigt would be nice
[18:50] <rgreening> not sure if it's correct. Not sure my dep was necessary either...
[18:50] <rgreening> I have to review again
[18:50] <rgreening> my brain is fried at the moment (migraine)
[18:52] <apachelogger> Arby: standard naming for pasmoids is plasmoid-$NAME
[18:52] <smarter> I think we should (temporarily) RM kepas from the archive
[18:52] <apachelogger> smarter: how so?
[18:53] <smarter> it stills crashes plasma if you create a server --> click on monitor server $foo in the menu --> close the monitor window
[18:53] <apachelogger> smarter: also with latest svn?
[18:53] <smarter> nothing new in latest svn
[18:54] <apachelogger> nice
[18:54] <apachelogger> smarter: file a removal request
[18:54] <smarter> just updated .desktop
[18:54] <smarter> apachelogger: I'll try to fix the bug first
[18:54] <smarter> it's really strange
[18:54] <smarter> it doesn't exactly crashes, it quits when it shouldn't
[18:54] <smarter> and take plasma with it
[18:54] <smarter> or more exactly, plasma doesn't like that and crashes
[18:56]  * apachelogger finds it way too stupid that plasmoids can crash plasma
[19:03] <rgreening> apachelogger: wrt dep issue, is it sufficient to remove the dep on the source and leave on the binary package? Or is that part broken as well?
[19:04] <apachelogger> well, only if the patch gets removed
[19:04] <apachelogger> otherwise it would FTBFS I guess
[19:05] <rgreening> hmm... I need to def think about it some more... took some meds for the headache, lets see how I fare in an hour...
[19:09] <rgreening> apachelogger: test building a possible fix for circ dep now... I'll let you know...
[19:10] <apachelogger> rgreening: what is the possible fix?
[19:10] <rgreening> I made some changes to the dep as you suggested. Let me test...
[19:10] <apachelogger> ok
[19:16] <rgreening> apachelogger: the CMakeLists.txt wants PyKDE4, which I believe comes from kde4bindings.. correct?
[19:17] <apachelogger> yes
[19:17]  * apachelogger poke _Sime_
[19:17] <rgreening> apachelogger: yeah... I will. ty
[19:18] <apachelogger> ScottK: -runtime is almost built (debhelping right now)
[19:18] <ScottK> Excellent.
[19:18] <ScottK> What's next?
[19:18] <apachelogger> workspace
[19:19] <apachelogger> EBS in 7 hours
[19:19] <ScottK> How long ago did you retry it?
[19:19] <ScottK> That's the last one before you can kick them all off, right?
[19:19] <apachelogger> about the same time I triggered runtime
[19:19] <apachelogger> ScottK: yes
[19:20] <apachelogger> hppa      28 builds waiting in queue
[19:20] <apachelogger> :S
[19:20] <ScottK> OK.  Then I'd say go ahead and retry the rest to get them in queue.
[19:20] <apachelogger> ok
[19:21] <rgreening> apachelogger: maybe we should disable the python plasma patch for the time being... as much as I hate to say it.
[19:21] <apachelogger> oh right
[19:21] <rgreening> apachelogger: thoughts?
[19:21] <apachelogger> ScottK: -workspace will FTBFS
[19:22] <ScottK> Oh.  Why?
[19:22] <apachelogger> rgreening: it certainly blocks ScottK's effort to get HPPA built
[19:22] <rgreening> circ dep
[19:22] <apachelogger> ScottK: it circular depends bindings
[19:22] <rgreening> yeah. let's remove it
[19:22] <ScottK> Urgh.
[19:23] <apachelogger> rgreening: would we need to revert the stuff in kde4bindings as well?
[19:23] <rgreening> no
[19:23] <apachelogger> ok
[19:23] <rgreening> it's a plugin factory.. can be used by anything.
[19:23] <rgreening> :)
[19:23] <rgreening> so, let me see about a diff...
[19:24] <rgreening> apachelogger: how do you mark in the control file to not build a package (besides commenting it out)
[19:24] <apachelogger> commenting out
[19:24] <apachelogger> or removing
[19:25] <ScottK> It's to late to do another upload for Intrepid.
[19:25] <rgreening> ok. didn't know if there was a nice directive to not build
[19:25] <ScottK> We'll just have to let it go and look at SRU.
[19:25] <rgreening> ?
[19:25] <rgreening> too late to fix the circ dep build
[19:25] <ScottK> Yes.
[19:25] <rgreening> oh dam
[19:26] <apachelogger> ScottK: are the langpacks fixed yet?
[19:26] <ScottK> It's already built on all archs except hppa, right?
[19:26] <apachelogger> ScottK: failed on LPIA as well
[19:26] <ScottK> Dunno how it came out.  The source pacakges are building now.
[19:26] <Arby> apachelogger: are you happy with plasmoid-applet-kbstate as a name or do you prefer plasmoid-kbstate?
[19:26] <ScottK> Early word was 'better'.
[19:26] <rgreening> Arby: -applet- is standard
[19:26] <apachelogger> Arby: no, it is redundant :P
[19:27] <ScottK> Right, but a new source upload now would suck up a large amount of buildd time on all archs.
[19:27] <rgreening> -applet- and -dataengine- are standard
[19:27] <ScottK> Circular build-dep is worth fixing, but do it post release in an SRU now.
[19:27] <Arby> fine, I'm not bothered either way
[19:27] <apachelogger> rgreening: they are not
[19:27] <apachelogger> rgreening: apt-cache search plasmoid-
[19:27] <apachelogger> ScottK: ok with me
[19:27] <Arby> plasmoid-kbstate it is
[19:27] <rgreening> apachelogger: from what I see, it's what they are using.
[19:28] <apachelogger> but not we
[19:28] <rgreening> oh wait, is this the applet or the package?
[19:28] <apachelogger> rgreening: still up to discussion with debian
[19:28] <rgreening> package, doesn't matter. I was thinking the applet name once installed
[19:28] <apachelogger> but IIRC the tendence is to stick applet and dataengine together
[19:29] <rgreening> anyway, what should I do then with kdebase-workspace
[19:29] <apachelogger> nothing
[19:29] <apachelogger> leave it alone
[19:29] <rgreening> ok
[19:29] <rgreening> will do
[19:29] <apachelogger> rgreening: I will target the circ dep for intrepid-updates and assign you, we definitely need to talk with _Sime_
[19:30] <rgreening> I agree.
[19:30] <apachelogger> the fact that the cmakelists suggest that KDE has a circ dep itself
[19:30] <rgreening> Sounds like a plan.
[19:30] <rgreening> apachelogger: I think it may need to be moved from workspace... just not sure how yet.
[19:31] <rgreening> _Sime_ should be able to offer suggestions/assistance (maybe doesn't realize there is a circ dep)
[19:33] <apachelogger> rgreening: fiddled with the bug, now get some rest :)
[19:33] <apachelogger> rgreening++ for working with migraine ;-)
[19:33] <rgreening> If only my headache would go away
[19:33] <rgreening> lol
[19:33] <rgreening> ty
[19:35] <ScottK> BTW, if you get a good fix for the circular build-dep it can be uploaded to intrepid-proposed now.  It'll get accepted just after release.
[19:36]  * apachelogger couldn't think of one 
[19:36] <rgreening> thanks ScottK: I'll try a few things. My fallback plan is to remove the patch altogether (though it's my last resort).
[19:38] <ScottK> If it's not resolvable without removing the patch, it might be good to chat with upstream about what goes where so we aren't similarly screwed in 4.2.
[19:39] <rgreening> _Sime_ will be the one who needs to know
[19:39] <apachelogger> ScottK: please take a look at bug 281487
[19:40] <ScottK> Sure.
[19:41] <ScottK> apachelogger: Mine is working last I checked, but I'll investigate.
[19:43] <apachelogger> works for me as well
[19:46] <Arby> apachelogger: I've changed everything you mentioned except the get-orig-source line because I don't know what the answer is
[19:46] <apachelogger> ~google ubuntu wiki get-orig-source cvs example
[19:46] <kubotu> Results for ubuntu wiki get-orig-source cvs example: 1. PackagingGuide/Examples/ChangingTheOrigTarball - Ubuntu Wiki: http://www.google.comhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Examples/ChangingTheOrigTarball | 2. PackagingGuide/Basic - Ubuntu Wiki: http://www.google.comhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Basic
[19:46] <kubotu> 3. MOTU/School/PackagingWithoutCompiling - Ubuntu Wiki: http://www.google.comhttps://wiki.edubuntu.org/MOTU/School/PackagingWithoutCompiling
[19:46] <apachelogger> Arby: first result
[19:46] <Arby> apachelogger: I read that earlier, I don't understand it
[19:47] <Arby> do I need to write a command that builds .orig.tar.gz
[19:47] <Arby> from the svn checkout
[19:47] <apachelogger> yes
[19:47] <apachelogger> see the last example
[19:47] <Arby> let me play a bit
[19:47] <apachelogger> Arby: you basically need to a svn co && tar czf && rm -rf
[19:48] <apachelogger> in fact I guess you can just copy the last example and replace the first 2 lines with your svn one and changes the other stuff to fit your case
[19:48] <Arby> I'll work at it, give me a while
[19:48] <apachelogger> sure
[19:54] <Arby> apachelogger: am I getting close http://paste.ubuntu.com/62971/
[19:54] <smarter> svn export, not co
[19:54] <smarter> or you get the .svn
[19:54] <Arby> thanks
[19:54] <smarter> (see some of my packages for good examples :])
[19:55] <Arby> smarter: such as?
[19:55] <smarter> (like guidance-power-manager)
[19:55] <apachelogger> pfff
[19:55]  * apachelogger larts smarter
[19:55]  * smarter hides
[19:55] <apachelogger> Arby: what's with the ; \ stuff?
[19:55] <smarter> (which has both get-orig-source and -svn)
[19:55] <smarter> or kvkbd for something which only has -svn
[19:56] <apachelogger> Arby: anway, I supposed it should be working, not very dynamic, but working ;-)
[19:56] <Arby> apachelogger: the ;\ stuff is in the example
[19:56] <Arby> and what's wrong with it
[19:56] <apachelogger> hm
[19:56] <Arby> I'd rather learn to do it right now
[19:57] <apachelogger> Arby: just not needed ;-)
[19:57]  * smarter thinks he should create a bzr branch with his get-orig-stuff and includes them in all his packages
[19:57] <Arby> if I start doing it wrong I'll keep doing it wrong for ever
[19:57] <apachelogger> smarter: lolz
[19:57] <Arby> (that's how my brain works)
[19:57] <apachelogger> hm
[19:57] <apachelogger> just imagine if ubuntu development was like Arby's brain :P
[19:57] <smarter> hehe
[19:57] <apachelogger> BIG trouble
[19:58] <smarter> In fact, I think that cdbs should include a get-orig-source.mk
[19:58] <smarter> which does some magic stuff
[19:58] <apachelogger> smarter: you could write a fancy wiki page GetOrigSourceDoneProperlyForKDE
[19:58] <smarter> and let you change some variables
[19:58] <Arby> my brain is overloaded and slightly broken, this is not news :)
[19:58] <Arby> moving on
[19:58] <apachelogger> smarter: there are so many different use cases
[19:58] <smarter> apachelogger: well, for KDE you just need to know the svn url
[19:59] <apachelogger> doesn't matter
[19:59] <apachelogger> explain the lines and stuff
[19:59] <apachelogger> the current page is crap IMHO
[19:59] <smarter> yup
[19:59] <apachelogger> you are not really learning anything
[19:59] <smarter> and I'm still not sure about that DEBIAN_DIR := $(shell echo ${MAKEFILE_LIST} | awk '{print $$1}' | xargs dirname )
[20:00] <smarter> I put it in my scripts, but I don't understand why it would be needed
[20:00] <apachelogger> shouldn't
[20:00] <apachelogger> that var should be defined by debhelper (or cdbs)
[20:00] <apachelogger> one of the 2 at least
[20:00] <smarter> and it's only used for cd ${DEBIAN_DIR}/..
[20:01] <smarter> which is probably equivalent to cd ${CURDIR}
[20:01] <apachelogger> yus
[20:01] <apachelogger> though
[20:01] <apachelogger> it might not in some cases :P
[20:01] <smarter> but I don't know in what case curdir is not the current dir :P
[20:01] <smarter> yup
[20:01] <apachelogger> CURDIR shoudl always be CURDIR otherwise it's a bug IMHO
[20:02] <smarter> cdbs seems to rely on CURDIR having debian/ inside
[20:03] <smarter> hmm, looks like it's not defined by dh nor cmake
[20:03] <smarter> probably a make stuff
[20:04] <Arby> apachelogger: any further comments before I push this branch again
[20:04] <Arby> ?
[20:04] <apachelogger> Arby: not yet
[20:05] <apachelogger> oh
[20:05] <apachelogger> ohhh!
[20:05]  * Arby runs for it
[20:06] <apachelogger> Arby: trunk/KDE/kdelibs/COPYING
[20:06] <apachelogger> please svn co that file inside the source directory
[20:06] <apachelogger> otherwise the licensing is incomplete
[20:07] <Arby> so that needs to be part of the orig.tar.gz?
[20:07] <ScottK> apachelogger: pinentry-qt4 works fine for me (I checked that's where the alternative was pointing to and I do not have pinentry-qt installed at all).
[20:07] <apachelogger> Arby: yes, you will need to modify the get-orig-source accordingly ;-)
[20:09] <apachelogger> hm
[20:09] <apachelogger> ScottK: the gpg.conf txwikinger attached says no-use-agent
[20:09] <apachelogger> line 203
[20:10] <apachelogger> could that be the problem?
[20:14] <xerosis> does anyone know if kcm_display is around in intrepid?
[20:20] <Arby> apachelogger: how does this look http://paste.ubuntu.com/62982/ ?
[20:21] <apachelogger> Arby: did you try it? ;-)
[20:21] <Arby> I tried all the steps individually
[20:21] <Arby> not as a bundle
[20:22] <apachelogger> Arby: make -f debian/rules get-orig-source
[20:23] <Arby> make: Nothing to be done for `get-orig-source'.
[20:25] <apachelogger> Arby: lines within any target need to start with a tab, not whitespaces
[20:25]  * Arby changes the settings in kate
[20:30] <Arby> apachelogger: the make command still returns Nothing to be done
[20:31] <apachelogger> well, commit and push I will take a look
[20:32]  * Arby goes to wrestle with bzr again
[20:32] <apachelogger> huh? Oo
[20:32] <ScottK> apachelogger: Then it shouldn't use an agent at all.  Yes.
[20:34] <Arby> arrgh
[20:34]  * Arby realises what he was doing wrong
[20:35] <Arby> too many copies of the debian directory lying around :)
[20:35] <Arby> changed the wrong one
[20:35] <Arby> make works now
[20:35]  * Arby smacks himself round the head
[20:41] <ScottK> apachelogger: I think we ought to look at 289630 for an early SRU
[20:46] <apachelogger> ScottK: then we would have to do that for almost every package
[20:48] <ScottK> apachelogger: Is there a metapackage we could do it with?
[20:49] <apachelogger> ScottK: no, that is the problem, it would be taken care of by kubuntu-desktop
[20:49] <apachelogger> that dood didn't have it installed, so the upgrade didn't work properly
[20:50] <ScottK> Ah.
[20:50] <apachelogger> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bugs/289611
[20:50] <ScottK> Maybe we need a release note that says make sure you have the metapackage installed before you upgrade?
[20:51] <apachelogger> ScottK: can't hurt I guess
[20:54] <Arby> apachelogger: changes pushed
[20:56] <claydoh> apachelogger: I was just noticing that bug report. folks Getting pretty feisty in launchpad lately :(
[20:58] <apachelogger> claydoh: that is what you get for spending time on bug triage :P
[20:58] <claydoh> i don't know how you 2 do it, to be honest
[20:59] <claydoh> but I don't have the knowledge you do, not yet at least
[21:00] <claydoh> I got enough of that from kubunntu-users
[21:08] <ScottK> apachelogger: I have to head out.  Would you either also affects release-notes and add a proposed note or find someone to do it?
[21:09] <apachelogger> sure
[21:13] <apachelogger> claydoh: I love how they talk about "we" as in "we, Kubuntu" on kubuntu-users
[21:13]  * JontheEchidna is glad he doesn't read kubuntu-users
[21:14] <apachelogger> and how parts of the "we" give wrong informations
[21:14] <apachelogger> lovely :D
[21:14] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kubuntu-users/2008-October/thread.html
[21:14] <apachelogger> read the beta thread
[21:14] <apachelogger> fun stuff :D
[21:14] <Riddell> evening all
[21:15] <Riddell> apachelogger: Arby isn't a member?
[21:15] <apachelogger> Riddell: nope
[21:15] <apachelogger> also found it hard to believe
[21:15] <apachelogger> ha!
[21:15] <apachelogger> I've already shot this poor argument down 3 days ago.  It is not up to the
[21:15] <apachelogger> KUbuntu developers to force people to test software.  It is up to them to
[21:15] <apachelogger> provide a stable platform for their users.
[21:16] <apachelogger> that made me smile ... like this => :)
[21:16] <Arby> so spending the rest of the evening writing a wiki page might be a good idea then :)
[21:16] <apachelogger> Arby: yus
[21:17] <Arby> already started :D
[21:17] <jussi01> Arby: Ill cheer for youi :D
[21:18] <Arby> jussi01: I'll hold you to that :)
[21:18] <jussi01> Arby: no probs :)
[21:19] <apachelogger> "Software doesn't break just because it is old."
[21:19] <apachelogger> ok
[21:19] <apachelogger> the dood who wrote that just became a n00b
[21:19] <claydoh> apachelogger: I know. Treat you guys like you are some big mega-conglomerate OS-mongers high in some tall glass skyscraper
[21:19] <JontheEchidna> that steve dude is a noob
[21:20] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: doesn't rant like one
[21:20] <apachelogger> claydoh: I wish we were ;-)
[21:20] <apachelogger> Riddell: are our langpacks fixed yet?
[21:20] <claydoh> I may have   to nlog on the subject
[21:20] <claydoh> er blog
[21:21] <Riddell> apachelogger: I believe they're currently building
[21:21] <apachelogger> Riddell: wasn't ETA 20UTC?
[21:21]  * apachelogger notes that it once was 13 UTC ;-)
[21:24] <apachelogger> claydoh: there is a good chance most of the noise will fade once 8.10 is out
[21:24] <claydoh> not on the mailing list, they hold a grudge forever :/
[21:25] <claydoh> but I agree, once its out it will all be good :)
[21:26] <claydoh> it already has in kubuntuforums. they actually read and learn in there
[21:26] <apachelogger> claydoh: if not, we should consider creating some policy about it, looking at the amount of mails dedicated to KDE 3 vs. KDE 4 I don't think kubuntu-users is of much use anymore
[21:27] <claydoh> hmm
[21:29] <claydoh> dangerous, but maybe necessary
[21:30] <JontheEchidna> I'd just go "LOL TOO LATE" for the lulz
[21:31] <claydoh> but really im k-u, it is only about 6 people doing most of the posting on any given subject anyway
[21:31] <apachelogger> claydoh: I don't see the danger, we could just create some mailing list on launchpad kubuntu-discussion and tell them that any further discussion about whether "we" should have switched to KDE 4 or not is to be done there
[21:31] <Riddell> apachelogger: could I be a member of kubuntu-experimental?
[21:31] <apachelogger> Riddell: sure, just a sec
[21:32] <claydoh> apachelogger: I see
[21:32] <JontheEchidna> wtf, why are they talking about XP crashes?
[21:33] <apachelogger> Riddell: made you admin
[21:33] <Riddell> ooh, I'm special
[21:34] <apachelogger> of course you are :)
[21:38] <vorian> :o
[21:38] <vorian> admin
[21:48] <Riddell> apachelogger: he's uploading the language packs, did you test?
[21:50] <Arby> anything obviously missing from https://wiki.kubuntu.org/RichardBirnie
[21:54] <apachelogger> Riddell: better than before, still a lot of in-your-face untranslated strings though
[21:54] <apachelogger> might be caused by conflict between lp and kde po import I'd guess
[21:54] <Riddell> that wouldn't leave things untranslated
[21:55] <apachelogger> Riddell: well, it would turn them fuzzy, wouldn't it?
[21:56] <Riddell> apachelogger: shouldn't do
[21:56] <apachelogger> hum
[21:57] <apachelogger> Riddell: for some reason there are untranslated strings :(
[21:58] <apachelogger> kmail's view menu only got 3 translated strings
[21:58] <Riddell> french has some too
[22:01] <apachelogger> Riddell: not just some for german, half of dolphin's menubar items are still untranslated
[22:02] <apachelogger> konqueror is mostly complete, except for the "go to" menu
[22:03] <apachelogger> plasma seems to be pretty much complete
[22:04] <apachelogger> the generic KCM buttons are untranslated
[22:04]  * JontheEchidna likes the new oxygen scrollbars: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_zDPqioLuxns/SQSLu7XLiiI/AAAAAAAAAD0/uXk8U5E8BHU/s1600-h/tooltips.png
[22:08] <apachelogger> Riddell: ok, I think the mostly untranslated dolphin menu is the most annoying
[22:09] <apachelogger> there are a couple of untranslated ones in the games, but nothing grave, and I doubt anyone would read mails without internet, meaning without upgrading
[22:29] <apachelogger> Arby: I'd add some personal informatin to the wiki page as well
[22:29] <Arby> ok
[22:29] <ScottK-palm> Looks like the .de lang pack is built.  Did anyone check it yet?
[22:30] <apachelogger> ScottK-palm: it's not 100%, dolphin and kmail menu items are still pretty untranslated, everything else looks good
[22:31] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: due to a Qt caching issue I have them in 4.1 as well :P
[22:31] <JontheEchidna> nice :P
[22:31] <ScottK-palm> Not horrible then.  Way better than it might have been.
[22:33] <apachelogger> ScottK-palm: yeah, dolphin is a bit concerning, but since most stuff is translated, I think we are in pretty good shape
[22:34] <apachelogger> Arby: Vcs-bzr shouldn't have been removed from control ;-)
[22:35] <Arby> I thought I did that.
[22:35]  * Arby checks again
[22:35] <Arby> oh wait hang on
[22:35] <Arby> I removed it because it was wrong
[22:35] <apachelogger> fix it then :P
[22:35]  * Arby fixes it
[22:35] <ScottK-palm> I still don't see what dolphin does that konqueror doesn't. There's a good alternative.
[22:36] <apachelogger> ScottK-palm: we don't use konqueror by default as file manger
[22:36] <apachelogger> I am concerned about the out-of-box usability
[22:37] <apachelogger> Arby: why odes it depend on kde-window-manager? first line of description could use a whitespace, the following lines of description should only start with one whitespace
[22:38] <Arby> apachelogger: I lifted the packaging from another plasmoid, forgot to remove that dep
[22:39] <apachelogger> Arby: rules is still missing a final newline, get-orig-source is not working properly ... one thing about rules: everytime you start a newline, the directory get reset to the primary source dir, so in case of the COPYING stuff you would actually need the ; \ magic
[22:40] <apachelogger> Arby: usually you would want to document the patch, and what it is doing/why it is needed in debian/changelog ... looking good otherwise
[22:40] <Arby> apachelogger: what is get-orig-source doing wrong, it worked for me.
[22:41] <apachelogger> -(~/src/bzr/kbstate-applet:$)-> ls
[22:41] <apachelogger> COPYING  debian  plasmoid-kbstate_0.0+svn876002.orig.tar.gz
[22:41] <apachelogger> Arby: notice something? ;-)
[22:42] <Arby> COPYING is not where it ought to be?
[22:42] <apachelogger> exactly
[22:43] <ScottK-palm> We probably ought to consider release noting some lang pack stuff.
[22:43] <apachelogger> Arby: the cause is that rules resets the direct with every new command, so cd DIR is only going to work if you make it one command ... i.e. cd DIR; svn co blah
[22:44] <Arby> ok
[22:44]  * Arby tinkers some more
[22:45] <ScottK-palm> See you later.
[22:48] <apachelogger> Arby: please add your membership candidature to https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Meetings
[22:49] <apachelogger> ~topic replace 3 4 days to go!
[22:52] <Arby> apachelogger: do I need to add it under agenda as well as under candidates?
[22:53] <apachelogger> Arby: no, only candidates
[22:53] <Arby> ok
[22:53] <Arby> done
[23:16] <Arby> apachelogger: I think I've got it this time, pushed revision 3
[23:21]  * a|wen just tested his @kubuntu.org address ... wonders why it doesn't work