[00:07] <Riddell> hugs to rgreening and a|wen for testing!
[00:07] <Riddell> and whoever adder1972 is
[00:07] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: My 14 year old daughter is doing a dist-upgrade test for us.
[00:08] <Riddell> hugs to ScottK-laptop's daughter!
[00:08] <ScottK-laptop> Riddell: She could follow the instructions just fine and she's not very technical.
[00:08] <rgreening> np. still doing more.. just waiting fer dl to complete on DVD and CD
[00:08] <rgreening> gj Riddell on the clear/concide docs
[00:09]  * a|wen hugs rgreening, Riddell, ScottK-laptop's daughter :)
[00:09] <ScottK-laptop> a|wen: You stay away from my daughter.
[00:09]  * ScottK-laptop doesn't allow that sort of thing.
[00:09] <ScottK-laptop> ;-)
[00:12]  * a|wen is scout troop leader for kids that age ... they deserve a hug when they do something good :P
[00:12] <a|wen> ScottK-laptop: and dist-upgrade testing surely is in that category :)
[00:13] <ScottK-laptop> That's abusive parenting.  Different issue.
[00:13] <a|wen> haha
[00:14] <ScottK-laptop> If launchpad is serving unsigned .dsc files, that's a problem, right?
[00:14] <ScottK-laptop> Someone tell me if they see a gpg signature on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/dapper/+source/spamassassin/3.1.3-1ubuntu1~dapper1/+files/spamassassin_3.1.3-1ubuntu1~dapper1.dsc
[00:16] <JontheEchidna> that looks pretty much like plaintext to me
[00:16] <ScottK-laptop> OK.
[00:17] <a|wen> at least it is sent over a SSL connection with proper certificates
[00:19] <ScottK-laptop> Actually it isn't.
[00:19] <ScottK-laptop> That link will redirect to launchpadlibrarian which is http.
[00:20] <a|wen> oh ... that's bad then
[00:20]  * a|wen thinks he should be notified by that by kate
[00:34] <a|wen> hmm; opening a http link from konversation doesn't work on a fresh 8.10 install ... after installing firefox opening links now works (they open in firefox)
[00:41] <Riddell> how strange
[00:42] <a|wen> Riddell: seems ScottK know it as well, bug 271598
[00:45]  * NCommander needs someone to beat me
[00:45] <NCommander> I broke KDE on lpia :-/
[00:46] <NCommander> ScottK, you floating around
[00:47] <NCommander> wait
[00:47] <NCommander> WOOO
[00:47] <txwikinger2> Where die the cube effect go?
[00:47] <txwikinger2> did
[00:47] <NCommander> I'm not responsible for the kde4bindings FTBFS!
[00:48] <JontheEchidna> txwikinger2: patch was causing regressions so it was reverted
[00:48] <txwikinger2> Ah
[00:48] <JontheEchidna> yeah :(
[00:49] <NCommander> JontheEchidna, well, at least I determined I didn't break the lpia KDE (Soyuz did that on its own)
[00:50] <JontheEchidna> hehe
[00:50]  * Hobbsee glares at the uni
[00:50] <txwikinger2> What's wrong with the Uni?
[00:50] <Hobbsee> looks like they've put in a harder firewall
[00:51] <Hobbsee> looks like they're only allowing 80, 443, and 22 only inside uni
[00:51] <txwikinger2> A firewall is just an invitation for circumvention
[00:52] <Hobbsee> that's true
[00:52] <a|wen> Hobbsee: ssh -D is your friend then
[00:52] <Hobbsee> but I can't even ping outside the uni...
[00:52] <txwikinger> well.. stopping ping is easy
[00:53] <Hobbsee> a|wen: how exactly do I use that?
[00:54] <a|wen> Hobbsee: "ssh -D 8080 example.com" ... you now have a socks proxy on localhost:8080 through your ssh-connection
[00:54] <txwikinger> you can also an ajax ssh aplication
[00:55] <txwikinger> run
[00:55] <Hobbsee> a|wen: but, what port do i use to get into the example?
[00:55] <txwikinger> the one that goes through the Uni proxy
[00:55] <Hobbsee> so 80 or 443.  right.
[00:56] <txwikinger> Or are you saying that they allow no surfing outside the uni anymore?
[00:56] <a|wen> Hobbsee: start by issuing the command (replacing example.com with whatever your server outside uni is called) ... now open interned settings, tick socks proxy and write "localhost:8080"
[00:57] <a|wen> s/interned/internet/
[00:57] <Hobbsee> txwikinger: they only do on 80 and 443.
[00:58] <a|wen> Hobbsee: oh ... the ssh -D only solves your problem if port 22 is open
[00:58] <Hobbsee> a|wen: that's what I thought.
[00:58] <txwikinger> Well, you need to have a server outside that runs sshd on port 80
[00:59] <txwikinger> or 443
[00:59] <txwikinger> that's how I did it before
[00:59] <txwikinger> or that has a firewall that does the reverse translation
[00:59] <Hobbsee> txwikinger: do i need to do anything special if i put it on 443?
[01:00] <txwikinger> No
[01:00] <txwikinger> You can configure sshd on any port
[01:00] <txwikinger> As usual, only root can allocate ports <1000
[01:00] <txwikinger> but that is the same as 22
[01:01] <Hobbsee> still no dice.
[01:01] <Hobbsee> debug1: Connecting to hobbsee.com [64.62.190.244] port 443.
[01:02] <txwikinger> what is running on that port on hobbsee.com?
[01:03] <Hobbsee> txwikinger: sshd, it should be.
[01:03] <txwikinger> and you do ssh -p 443 <username>@hobbsee.com ?
[01:04] <Hobbsee> txwikinger: yes
[01:04] <txwikinger> well.. that should usually work
[01:04] <Hobbsee> that's what I would have thought.
[01:04] <a|wen> Hobbsee: you changed /etc/ssh/sshd_config and not /etc/ssh/ssh_config right?
[01:05] <Hobbsee> a|wen: yes.
[01:05] <txwikinger> and restarted it
[01:05] <Hobbsee> yees
[01:05] <txwikinger> :)
[01:05] <Hobbsee> :)
[01:06] <Hobbsee> oh, i suck.
[01:06] <txwikinger> Am I allowed to test it with my sniffer on?
[01:06]  * txwikinger does not ping other peoples machines without permission
[01:06]  * Hobbsee pokes a hole in the firewall
[01:10] <Hobbsee> i win.  Thanks guys!
[01:10] <txwikinger> you are welcome
[01:11] <Hobbsee> so I can tunnel over 443.
[01:11] <Hobbsee> ahhh, nice konversation :)
[01:12] <a|wen> no problem
[01:12] <Hobbsee> for future reference, sudo ssh -p443  -fND 3456 user@host.com works.
[01:13] <a|wen> :)
[01:14]  * Hobbsee has an evil thought
[01:14] <Hobbsee> now that i've proxied out...perhaps time to rsync the iso's again?  :)
[01:15] <txwikinger> Hehe
[01:15] <a|wen> remember it should be the dvd iso ;)
[01:16] <NCommander> how goes things Hobbsee
[01:16] <Hobbsee> NCommander: well, now thta i've managed to poke a hole thru the arcane uni firewall, which has got even *more* restricted before, pretty good.
[01:17] <a|wen> no more testing for me now ... goodnight everyone
[01:19] <rgreening> nite
[01:19] <rgreening> :)
[01:19] <txwikinger> o/ rgreening
[01:20] <rgreening> 'lo
[01:20] <rgreening> :P
[01:21] <txwikinger> why :p?
[01:22] <rgreening> no reason. just being funny ..
[01:22] <txwikinger> Ah :)
[01:22] <rgreening> \o
[01:23]  * rgreening is giving his hard drive a workout installing/testing these iso's
[01:24] <Riddell> anyone got any windows machines?  wubi needs testing
[01:24]  * txwikinger wonders what a windows machine is :)
[01:24]  * txwikinger has only one laptop atm
[01:25]  * rgreening windows free since '93
[01:25] <rgreening> :)
[01:25] <txwikinger> Where is MooDoo when you need him
[01:25] <txwikinger> probably sleeping
[01:27] <rgreening> 2.7 of 3.6 Gig dl of DVD...
[01:27]  * txwikinger does not even try that
[01:27] <rgreening> lol
[01:27] <txwikinger> I have only 50kB/s atm
[01:28] <rgreening> 8Mbps at home (Cable Internet)
[01:28] <txwikinger> It is cable here too
[01:28] <txwikinger> 500kbps or so
[01:29] <txwikinger> I need to get my own place again :D
[01:29] <rgreening> I'm gettin 300-400KB on the DVD
[01:30] <txwikinger> I think you can get mobile Internet here with 2Mbps
[01:30] <rgreening> that not bad
[01:30] <txwikinger> and fixed up to 18Mbps or so
[03:26] <nixternal> oi, got a presentation on saturday introducing ibex to chicago...there is a lot of info on Ubuntu 8.10, but not for Kubuntu 8.10
[03:26] <nixternal> GNOME does much better marketing oriented release notes than KDE does I noticed
[03:26] <rgreening> heh
[03:27] <rgreening> we need writers/marketing doods
[03:32] <nixternal> I am one of the writers, but I think the marketing people control the release notes
[03:32] <nixternal> remember, devs != marketers...that's the problem with FLOSS
[03:51]  * rgreening should have said weneed ""more""
[03:51] <rgreening> :)
[03:59] <nixternal> hehe
[03:59] <ScottK-laptop> "Ubuntu Cruft Cleaner - Now 98% more efficient"
[04:03] <vorian> my head asplode
[04:06] <rgreening> :)
[04:06]  * rgreening still testing iso's... iso sore...
[04:17]  * ScottK-laptop finally got the kid's computer booted in Intrepid.
[04:17] <ScottK-laptop> Thanks NCommander.
[04:17] <NCommander> ScottK-laptop, I highly recommend you never turn that machine off :-P
[04:17] <ScottK-laptop> Of course I had to cannabalize the LCD monitor from my wife's computer to do it.
[04:18] <ScottK-laptop> Yeah, well never ship a new kernel and I'll never reboot it.
[04:18] <ScottK-laptop> So I cranked the resolution down.  Now I'll switch back.
[04:19] <NCommander> rofl
[04:19] <ScottK-laptop> You promised me a boot option to fix this ....
[04:20] <NCommander> possible
[04:20] <NCommander> I don't know of any offhand
[04:21] <ScottK-laptop> OK, well I either plugged the monitor back in or bent a bunch of pins.  I'll know in a minute
[04:22] <ScottK-laptop> NCommander: There's a BIOS option for hard disk pre-delay.  Does cranking that up help here?
[04:25] <ScottK-laptop> And how is it usplash knows enough to determine the right display mode, but X doesn't?
[04:27] <ScottK-laptop> It's back to display out of range again after the reboot.
[04:27]  * ScottK-laptop reads man xrandr
[04:30] <ScottK-laptop> Urgh
[04:31] <ScottK-laptop> xrandr only works when you're in the running X session.
[04:31]  * ScottK-laptop is running short on ideas.
[04:35] <ScottK-laptop> NCommander: Monitor specs say Max Resolution - 1600 x 1200 / 75 Hz
[04:37] <NCommander> ScottK, it reads it from a config file
[04:37] <NCommander> ScottK, you might need to manually hack your xorg file
[04:37] <ScottK-laptop> Urgh.
[04:37] <ScottK-laptop> But I don wanna
[04:39] <ScottK-laptop> Once it boots again I'll look through the old ones and see if anything seems appealing.
[04:39]  * NCommander nods
[04:40] <nixternal> ScottK-laptop: boot into safe mode, go into system settings, and then advanced, and then services...uncheck that randr crap
[04:40] <NCommander> You probably need to set the resolution
[04:40] <nixternal> that fixed my issues this week
[04:40] <nixternal> krandr == shit
[04:40] <ScottK-laptop> nixternal: What did you install instead?
[04:40] <nixternal> I just disabled randr monitor checking in system settings and my monitor came back to life
[04:40] <rgreening> intel vid cards rule in Linux
[04:40] <nixternal> that they do :)
[04:41] <rgreening> never an issuew 4 me
[04:41] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: That's what I've got.
[04:41] <nixternal> I had one, but that was a krandr issue
[04:41] <rgreening> bizarre
[04:41] <rgreening> amy xorg error
[04:41] <nixternal> krandr couldn't configure itself to save its own ass
[04:41] <ScottK-laptop> nixternal: I can't get into a kdm session to do that without switching monitors.
[04:42] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: I've been throught reconfiguring
[04:42] <nixternal> ScottK-laptop: you can't even set a bogus modeline in xorg.conf to let you in?
[04:42] <rgreening> oh, is it a855 gm or older?
[04:42] <ScottK-laptop> D945
[04:42] <rgreening> hmm.. should auto fine
[04:43] <nixternal> ScottK-laptop: grep 'kcmrandrrc_display_applyonstartup' ~/.kde/share/config
[04:43] <nixternal> does it return true or false?
[04:43] <ScottK-laptop> Auto's fine with the LCD off my wife's computer.  Not with the monitor that's normally on it.
[04:43] <ScottK-laptop> nixternal: Will check
[04:43] <rgreening> oh..nthatd edid
[04:43] <nixternal> yowsers, what does that say? :)
[04:43] <rgreening> thats edid probing. disable it
[04:44] <ScottK-laptop> nixternal: False
[04:44] <nixternal> hrmm
[04:45] <rgreening> Tomb Raider Anniversary rox... oh Laura...
[04:46] <ScottK-laptop> Well none of the old xorg.conf's laying around do anything other than specif keyboard.
[04:47] <ScottK-laptop> specif/specify
[04:48] <nixternal> see if the kcmrandrrc [Screen...] lines are commented out in ~/.kde/share/config/startupconfig
[04:49] <nixternal> it is one of them damn randr settings..has to be
[04:49] <nixternal> mine are commented out in startupconfig....if that doesn't help, then boot up with the lcd and then try disabling that setting in system settings (re: my blog for details as well)
[04:49] <ScottK-laptop> those are all commented out
[04:49]  * nixternal crashes
[04:49] <nixternal> lovely
[04:51] <nixternal> ooh, ScottK-laptop try killing kded4 and then trying
[04:51] <ScottK-laptop> Switching to the LCD now.
[04:51] <nixternal> oh :)
[04:52] <nixternal> alrighty, good luck on that...I am going to bed...have a stupid awards banquet to go to tomorrow night
[04:52] <ScottK-laptop> Bah.
[04:52] <ScottK-laptop> Sleep is for the weak.
[04:52] <rgreening> 42in Laura Croft oh my
[04:52] <nixternal> that it is, and I am damn weak
[05:36] <Greenery> did kubuntu update their xv video driver recently? cause when i play video on dragon player, it show black spots all over it
[09:32] <davmor2> Riddell: you know the wubi install that failed was that on you intel gfx system?
[09:35] <Riddell> davmor2: no, ati machine
[09:35] <Riddell> davmor2: have you tried it?
[09:40] <Riddell> davmor2: it's very likely down to the lack of disk space, but I need someone to confirm that
[10:34] <Riddell> nixternal: lastfm tells me you're listening to severed fifth :)
[10:53] <Riddell> kwwii: seen http://www.andreasn.se/blog/?p=88 ?
[10:59] <kwwii> Riddell: that is somewhat silly
[10:59] <kwwii> picking certain icons which just so happen to fit is not reality either
[10:59] <kwwii> and how many large tango icons are there? and why are they not in the same theme?
[10:59] <kwwii> I could go on and on
[11:00] <kwwii> seems like andreas is trying to justify his fear away
[11:26] <nixternal> Riddell: always listening to severed fifth :)
[11:27] <nixternal> just updated rockbox on my sansa, uploading my new tunes...getting ready for a busy day at work
[11:51] <seele> hmm.. can you guys start gwenview by clicking on an icon?
[11:52] <seele> "KDEInit could not launch '/usr/lib/kde4/bin/gwenview'"
[11:53] <seele> it looks like gwenview is in /usr/bin/
[12:15] <Nightrose> jcastro: http://pastebin.com/m46404696 <- wanted to give gwibber a try :/
[12:17] <rgreening> lol. no svg
[12:33] <rgreening> ~topic
[12:33] <kubotu> incorrect usage, ask for help using 'kubotu: help topic'
[12:33] <rgreening> kubotu: help topic
[12:33] <kubotu> topic add(at)|prepend|del(ete)|replace|sep(arator)|learn|restore|clear|set|undo: manipulate the topic of the current channel; use topic <#channel> <command> for private addressing
[12:35] <rgreening> ~topic set "Welcome to the Kubuntu developers channel | https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuUDSJauntySpecs | Only 2 days left! | Test test! http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/build/kubuntu/all"
[12:35] <kubotu> rgreening, you don't have 'topic' permissions here
[12:35] <rgreening> dam
[12:35] <rgreening> lol
[12:35] <rgreening> Riddell/apachelogger... I though someone said we weren't elitist .. lol
[12:36] <rgreening> :)
[12:38]  * Hobbsee wonders what was wrong with /topic
[12:42] <ScottK> rgreening: That's just the bot discriminating.  You can change it as Hobbsee says.
[12:42] <rgreening> oh. lol
[12:42] <rgreening> ah-hah
[12:42] <rgreening> ty.
[12:42] <rgreening> :)
[12:42] <ScottK> Now, in return, please fix my kernel problems ...
[12:42]  * rgreening hugs hobbsee
[12:43]  * rgreening slaps ScottK
[12:43]  * rgreening ducks
[12:43] <rgreening> ScottK: what kernel prob
[12:43] <ScottK-laptop> Fortunately I'm over here.
[12:44] <rgreening> codeweavers is taking a pounding today...
[12:44] <echidnaman> This is my kernel problem: bug 267295
[12:44] <rgreening> looking..
[12:46] <ScottK-laptop> Mine is Bug 290153
[12:46] <ScottK-laptop> Looks like I put it on the wrong package though.
[12:47]  * Hobbsee hugs rgreening back :)
[12:48] <rgreening> o/
[12:48] <usr> Hi! I am at Kubuntu 8.10 RC+, and I remember that in the Kubuntu wiki was wrote: Kubuntu 8.10 will come with KPackageKit, but it comes with Adept. Why?
[12:50] <JontheEchidna> usr: nobody said it would come with kpackagekit, at most it was said that we would look in to using it
[12:50] <ScottK-laptop> IIRC it's available if one wants it.
[12:50] <JontheEchidna> yeah, that's true too
[12:51] <usr> ok, JontheEchidna. Thank you :-)
[12:51] <mornfall> usr: Ah, you have mailed me right?
[12:51] <usr> yes, mornfall
[12:52] <ScottK-laptop> .kde only gets touched if a user has logged in, so if I'm going to revert to Hardy, the only user that's screwed is the one I've used, right?
[12:52] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: your bug. could be a pci routing issue. have you tried moving the card to a different slot or enabling some of the apic/pci work-arounds...simply disabling the pci card seems to point in that direction. especially the preempt crash line. If the pci code is hung up, preemp could crash (I think)
[12:53] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: should be correct. yep
[12:53] <ScottK-laptop> Thanks.
[12:53] <rgreening> np. looking at your bug now...
[12:53] <ScottK-laptop> Thanks.
[12:53] <mornfall> usr: Well, to reply here -- I'm not interested in PackageKit. I find it to be fundamentally flawed and I don't want to throw any time on it.
[12:54] <mornfall> Yes, people are trying to come up with ways to make things like searching through slow, crappy dbus interfaces work, but that's something I'd just rather avoid.
[12:54]  * rgreening hugs mornfall * thanks for all the work on Adept * +++++mornfall
[12:54] <jjesse> well tell me how you really feel about it :)
[12:54]  * JontheEchidna wonders how "set" got in the chan topic
[12:54]  * rgreening hides...
[12:55] <JontheEchidna> :P
[12:55] <rgreening> JontheEchidna: my fault
[12:55] <rgreening> lol
[12:55] <rgreening> diff between ~topic and /topic... never removed the "set" from ~topic command
[12:56] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: did this only happen once? or every boot?
[12:57] <ScottK-laptop> Every boot
[12:57] <ScottK-laptop> Except if I boot a hardy live CD, it's fine
[12:57] <ScottK-laptop> Intrepid live CD has the same problem.
[12:57] <rgreening> strange brew indeed
[12:57] <ScottK-laptop> yeah.
[12:58] <rgreening> is it a SATA I or II drive
[13:00] <rgreening> do you have raid or lvm or encryption? or just regular ext3
[13:00] <rgreening> ScottK: ^
[13:00] <ScottK-laptop> SATA I I'm pretty sure (it's ~almost 2 years old.
[13:01] <ScottK-laptop> Regular ext3
[13:01] <rgreening> lots seem to have the issue, but all with lvm/raid
[13:01] <usr> ok, mornfall: thank you you for your answer. Adept 2.0 was slow, but 3.0 is very good, their search filter is very fast. Now it is even faster than synaptic. I think that you are doing a great work with Adept 3.0.
[13:01] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: If you remember the Intel boards that wouldn't work in Linux for a while because Intel planned to ship with no ATA at all and slapped a Jmicron ATA controller on at the last minute?
[13:01] <ScottK-laptop> This is one of those.
[13:01] <rgreening> lol
[13:02] <rgreening> check the old hardy kernel and see if a patch existed for it. maybe it wasn't applied for the new tree... and should be
[13:03] <ScottK-laptop> OK.  Got network.
[13:03] <ScottK-laptop> Actually it was an issue back in Gutsy, IIRC.  In Hardy it's fine.
[13:04] <usr> mornfall: thank yo
[13:04] <usr> 	
[13:04] <usr> thanks for giving us a better alternative to synaptic
[13:04] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: I wonder if jmicron module isn't in initramfs. can you see if it is?
[13:05] <mornfall> Glad to be of help.
[13:05] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: or isn't loading...
[13:05] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: It's the SATA one it can't find.
[13:05] <ScottK-laptop> It's a timing issue somehow because if I wait a minute or two and exit initramfs, the boot is fine.
[13:06] <rgreening> yeah, cause something is probing and forcing the right module ot load. might need to force it manually/sooner... or add a rootdelay
[13:07] <ScottK-laptop> OK. If rootdelay does what it sounds like, that sounds workable.
[13:07] <rgreening> try rootdelay=40 on kernel line
[13:07] <rgreening> from bug 278176
[13:09] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: maybe we should add rootdelay to the failsafe kernel line for future...
[13:10] <ScottK-laptop> OK.
[13:10] <rgreening> let me know if it works...
[13:10] <ScottK-laptop> I'd appreciate it if a German speaker would look at https://answers.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/11004 and see if maybe it's relevant to my problem.
[13:12] <ScottK-laptop> It's been a long time since I had to look at menu.lst
[13:13] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: I looked over that bug... I didn't see anything that stood out...
[13:14] <ScottK-laptop> OK.  Thanks.  It was one of the very few hits on D945
[13:14] <rgreening> but I dun speak it... just looked for the commands, errors and other english bits to decipher...
[13:14] <rgreening> :)
[13:15] <ScottK-laptop> So where do I put rootdelay?
[13:15] <rgreening> rebooting?
[13:15] <rgreening> ah, on the kernel line. try before the quiet
[13:15] <ScottK-laptop> OK
[13:15]  * rgreening crosses fingers
[13:16]  * ScottK-laptop reboots
[13:19] <ScottK-laptop> Nope
[13:19] <rgreening> dam
[13:19] <rgreening> I even crossed my toes
[13:20] <rgreening> and eyes
[13:20] <rgreening> :)
[13:20]  * ScottK-laptop will try 300 just to see if the idea is feasible.
[13:21] <rgreening> lol
[13:21] <rgreening> go spartans go...
[13:23] <ScottK-laptop> Got network automatically on that boot, so that problem is solved.
[13:23] <rgreening> 30 worked?
[13:23] <rgreening> 300?
[13:24] <rgreening> if so, try 60. I think that was one of the suggestions in that bug I ref'd
[13:24] <ScottK-laptop> Waiting now.
[13:24] <ScottK-laptop> BIOS takes a LONG time on this box.
[13:25] <rgreening> brb
[13:25] <ScottK-laptop> Intel D945 was not a good choice.
[13:27] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: 300 worked
[13:29]  * ScottK-laptop tries 60
[13:33] <ScottK-laptop> Nope
[13:33] <rgreening> hehe
[13:34] <rgreening> ok, so, SATA or jmicron module is loaded to late... which is why a longer delay is required,.,.
[13:35] <rgreening> at least you have a work around, just need to report to initramfs dev to look at
[13:36] <ScottK-laptop> So it's an initramfs bug and not a kernel bug?
[13:36] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: ^^
[13:37]  * ScottK-laptop tries 90
[13:37] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: I would suggest...
[13:37] <ScottK-laptop> You suggest it's an initramfs bug?
[13:37] <rgreening> possibly. Try an older initramfs and do the update-initramfs -u with an older one and see if it works.
[13:38] <ScottK-laptop> Seems scary.
[13:38] <rgreening> :)
[13:38] <rgreening> but we devs deal in scary all the time
[13:38] <rgreening> and its halloween
[13:40] <ScottK-laptop> I think for this morning, I'll be happy with rootdelay= some right number.
[13:41]  * ScottK-laptop hands NCommander some rootdelay=
[13:41] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: 90 works.  Thanks for the help.
[13:42] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: np
[13:42] <NCommander> Ah, so that was it
[13:42] <rgreening> update the bug and assign initramsf to it.
[13:42] <ScottK-laptop> OK.  Well it's a work around.
[13:42] <rgreening> see if they can reason why the delay is necessary
[13:42] <ScottK-laptop> I'm also going to release note it.
[13:43] <rgreening> don't send money, just crispy cream donuts... their icing is crack
[13:44] <ScottK-laptop> yeah.
[13:48] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: What package does initramfs live in?
[13:49] <ScottK-laptop> Busybox?
[13:49] <rgreening> 1 se c
[13:49] <rgreening> yes
[13:49] <ScottK-laptop> Thanks
[13:51] <rgreening> dpkg -L busybox-initramfs
[13:51] <rgreening> I think that's the correct one.
[13:56] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: might want to add initramfs-tools too
[13:57] <ScottK-laptop> I started there.  That one doesn't exist in Intrepid.
[13:57] <rgreening> what?
[13:57] <rgreening> dpkg -S initramfs-tools
[13:58] <apachelogger> rgreening: we are not, kubotu is
[13:59] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: Nevermind.  I can't use Launchpad.  But we all knew that.
[13:59] <rgreening> lol
[14:03] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: anything in /etc/modprobe.d/initramfs
[14:03]  * ScottK-laptop looks
[14:03] <ScottK-laptop> File doesn't exist
[14:03] <rgreening> ok. nothing blacklisted
[14:04] <rgreening> I think the problem is initramfs-tools on further looking.
[14:05] <ScottK-laptop> OK.  Added that one.
[14:05] <ScottK-laptop> Eventually something will stick.
[14:05] <rgreening> lol
[14:06]  * ScottK-laptop moves on to https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DebuggingXAutoconfiguration
[14:06]  * rgreening thinks ScottK-laptop needs to download an older  initramfs-tools and update with that one
[14:08]  * jjesse is glad his upgrade to intrepid was as painful
[14:09] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: It boots.  I'm happy.  Currently it only displays with the LCD off my wife's computer.  She gets back in town tomorrow ...
[14:09] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: you should fix your HTML engine
[14:09] <rgreening> I never seem to have any reall problems (other than the wireless hiccups during alpha)
[14:09] <ScottK-laptop> This is the first time in a long time I've had any trouble.
[14:09] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: :)
[14:10] <rgreening> ScottK-laptop: do you get and .xsession-errors or kdm.log or Xorg.0.log with an indication of what is detected/failed?
[14:10] <rgreening> you should pastebin them for me... I'll look
[14:10] <ScottK-laptop> Just starting to look.  OK.
[14:12] <ScottK2> I'm multiplying
[14:13] <jjesse> or cloning yourself?
[14:14] <rgreening> Riddell: in the OEM GUI install, should we not link the Add/Remove or Adept in the folderview? and maybe have a quickstart readme on how OEM's can install/customize/brand (or a link to such docs)? Too late for Intrepid, but what about Jaunty
[14:15] <jjesse> rgreening: propose a blueprint?
[14:16] <rgreening> yeah, will likely do that. I need to know what currently exists for OEM's. Then I'll gladly do up a spec.
[14:18] <ScottK2> I think my problem is that the graphics card will do more than the monitor and X is auto configuring based on just the card.
[14:24] <apachelogger> ryanakca: can we somehow get rid of the sidebar for the release news?
[14:24] <apachelogger> looks pretty supid
[14:25] <apachelogger> maybe create a special content type and do some magic stuff to not display the left region for that type at all?
[14:26] <ryanakca> apachelogger: on the left side? What would happen if a user thinks ``Oh, this is really cool, I want it'' while reading the release news but can't find the prominent download button
[14:26] <apachelogger> then we add a download button
[14:27] <Riddell> rgreening: seems sensible
[14:29] <ryanakca> apachelogger: ok. and, got carried away with other things, before I stick on the planet, any objections to http://blog.ryanak.ca/archives/uncategorized/13 ?
[14:30] <apachelogger> ryanakca: 404 is a bit 404 :P
[14:31] <ryanakca> apachelogger: gah, *unticks the private box*... try again
[14:31] <apachelogger> hm
[14:32] <apachelogger> ryanakca: you are aware that we will end up with loads of nerdwork? ;-)
[14:32] <apachelogger> ryanakca: looking good otherwise
[14:32] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: the news needs some structure
[14:33] <apachelogger> http://www.kubuntu.org/news/8.04-release
[14:33] <rgreening> Riddell: should I blueprint this up? A more fleshed out OEM spec... and is there any OEM docs out there for Kubuntu (or Ubuntu)?
[14:33] <ryanakca> apachelogger: yes. doesn't mean we need to take it all, and if they use [Kubuntu Intrepid], it's good advertising :)
[14:34] <apachelogger> ryanakca: I doubt the advertisyness of nerdwork :P
[14:34]  * apachelogger has a unique POV on nerdwork vs. artwork anyway
[14:36] <jjesse> how do you add a screenshot to a wiki? never uploaded an image before
[14:36] <jjesse> was going to upload my dekstop on my dell mini 9
[14:37] <ryanakca> apachelogger: there, fixed it up, better?
[14:44] <ScottK2> rgreening: It looks like the video driver is reporting back nothing about the display and so if the display can automatically cope, it's OK ...  otherwise, not.
[14:44] <nixternal> !info linux-image
[14:44] <nixternal> !info gcc
[14:44] <apachelogger> ryanakca: yus
[14:45] <rgreening> ScottK2: hmm... can you test the bad monitor on another system, see if problem follows monitor (could be we need to add it to the monitor db/list for detection)
[15:04] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: bug 211674 that actually sounds more like software-prop crashes which causes as crash in adept
[15:19] <Riddell> rgreening: sounds like a UDS topic
[15:23] <nixternal> are we gonna do some hacking at UDS in between the partying?
[15:24]  * apachelogger giggles about the "partying"
[15:25] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: nah, a bad sources.list crashes adept
[15:25] <Riddell> it's time best used for discussion rather than hacking
[15:25] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: immediately?
[15:26] <JontheEchidna> back when I tested it, it would crash when reading state
[15:26] <apachelogger> nixternal: bug 242614
[15:26] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: well, then this a 2 layer problem
[15:26] <rgreening> Riddell: where should I doc it then, if we want to add for UDS topic? LP Blueprint or elsewhere?
[15:26] <nixternal> apachelogger: I can't do anything about that right now....at work
[15:27] <apachelogger> nixternal: note it on your todo :P
[15:27] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: software-prop should only write valid sources.list and adept shouldn't crash on them
[15:27] <JontheEchidna> brb, resetting router
[15:28] <apachelogger> Arby: for bugs fixed for KDE 4.1.3 please set intrepid-updates as milestone
[15:31] <Riddell> rgreening: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/KubuntuUDSJauntySpecs
[15:31] <rgreening> ty. I'll add it to the list.
[15:36] <rgreening> Riddell: done
[15:48] <apachelogger> kde bug 53397
[16:23] <rgreening> good bug. hah
[16:58] <rgreening> Riddell: for Jaunty, would it be beneficial to extend update-notifier-kde right-click menu for About, Help, and possibly show the dist/devel upgrade options (maybe via an advanced popup) to allow users to access the upgrade that way? Maybe make a persistant version of the icon for the systray?
[17:03] <jtechidna> rgreening: ideally we would be able to make it into a plasmoid, I'd think
[17:03] <jtechidna> sorta like the new device notifier but one that displays updatable packages maybe?
[17:03] <jtechidna> with clickly-pushy buttons to open up adept :D
[17:05] <Riddell> rgreening: I think it does have a menu option
[17:05] <rgreening> right-click exists, but not populated with anything other than name and exit
[17:06] <rgreening> that's what I was thinking we could extend...
[17:06] <rgreening> if you like the idea, I'll add it to the spec
[17:06] <Riddell> go ahead
[17:07] <rgreening> k. cool.
[17:07] <nixternal> hrmm, is there an issue with kubuntu and dvd's?
[17:12] <Riddell> nixternal: works for me
[17:15] <jcastro> nixternal: last chance for openweek sessions!
[17:15] <jcastro> I know you want one!
[17:20] <KDesk> 9.04 will use KDE 4.2? Then KDE 4.2 will have Extenders, Extenders could be used as a notify method. http://commit-digest.org/issues/2008-09-07/
[17:38] <Riddell> jcastro: you didn't convince apachelogger to teach us all ruby?
[17:39] <jcastro> hah
[17:47] <ScottK-laptop> rgreening: I picked the "Go to #ubuntu-x and beg for help from bryce" approach.
[17:47] <rgreening> lol
[17:48] <rgreening> -1 apachelogger for no ruby
[17:48]  * rgreening ducks
[17:48] <ScottK-laptop> jcastro: Just sign him up and if he claims he doesn't remember signing up, tell him you suspect he was drunk when he did it.
[17:49] <jcastro> good idea
[17:49] <ArkoldThos> anyone getting crashes when burning at k3b :S?
[17:49] <ArkoldThos> at intrepid
[17:50] <rgreening> +1 ScottK-laptop for being devious
[17:51]  * ScottK-laptop has had a boss who was uncertain of his memory.  That can be made to  work for you.
[17:52] <ScottK-laptop> gotta run.  See you all later.
[17:54] <txwikinger> hi jcastro
[17:55] <jcastro> hi txwikinger
[18:13] <nixternal> jcastro: when is openweek?
[18:13] <jcastro> 3-7 nov
[18:13] <jcastro> nixternal: right after release
[18:16] <nixternal> unless I can do an openweek session at 19:00 or later CST, I won't be able to do one since I am at work
[18:18] <jcastro> dang
[18:22] <jcastro> Nightrose: https://edge.launchpad.net/~jorge/+archive for intrepid and hardy, testing on kubuntu appreciated, if it doesn't blow people's stuff up I'll put those up in the official PPA.
[18:29] <Nightrose> jcastro: if you only changed the dep nothing should blow up here ;-)
[18:29] <jcastro> Nightrose: you'd be surprised the things I can break.
[18:29] <Nightrose> haha
[18:29] <Nightrose> food now - will try testing it later
[18:30] <jcastro> I'll let it bake in there for a while, get some feedback and push it up probably later in the day
[18:30]  * jcastro nods
[18:39] <Arby> does anybody have an nvidia card and use kontact calendars regularly?
[18:39] <Arby> if so have you seen anything resembling bug 258611?
[18:40] <Arby> I can't reproduce it and no idea what might cause it
[18:46] <rgreening> software mouse rather than hardware?
[18:47] <rgreening> nm. just read the bug. bad description... lol
[18:53] <rgreening> Arby: I have intel vid here. Can't reproduce. Could it be related to compositing/shadows under KDE or Compiz? e.g. one of the plugins causing an issue?
[18:54] <Arby> rgreening: not sure about visual effects, I was wondering of it was an X or graphics problem but then other apps don't do it.
[18:54] <Arby> s/of/if
[18:56] <rgreening> Arby: It's still possible it's in other apps, just not as noticeable. I posted a comment anyway. Get some additional details from the reporters
[18:56] <Arby> thanks
[18:58] <rgreening> I have seen noticable slowdown on my intel with shadow/transparancy both enabled. I have disabled both, and it's all good.
[18:58] <rgreening> could be reasonable to assume they have these on and it could be part of the issue.
[19:01] <Arby> maybe I'm crediting the user with too much intelligence :)
[19:01] <Arby> I'd take it as a given to turn those off
[19:06] <rgreening> cardinal rule #1...
[19:06] <rgreening> ~facts about assume
[19:06] <kubotu> [13/13] rule #1 of tech support - never assume as it makes an 'ass' out of 'u' & 'me'
[19:06] <rgreening> hah
[19:10] <Arby> heard it before :)
[19:11] <Arby> anybody know at what point ktimetracker replaced Karm?
[19:11] <Arby> start of 4.x?
[19:11] <rgreening> dunno
[19:12]  * Arby pokes around in launchpad
[19:14] <Arby> seems to appear around 4.1
[19:15] <jtechidna> that was when kdepim was introduced, so it makes sense
[19:23] <Arby> here's a fun one :) bug 198458
[19:23] <Arby> I'm with the user, where to start?
[19:24] <Arby> is that really kdepim's fault, and is it a KDE bug at all or should I blame virtualbox?
[19:43] <a|wen> Arby: testing the same within a new virtualbox and see if it changes things could possibly discard kdepim if it works
[19:44] <Arby> a|wen: I have no idea how to configure the sort of network setup he describes
[19:47] <a|wen> Arby: oh ... it is a rather old bug also, so i would consider it reasonable to ask if the same thing happens when using hardy (or newer) as either host or guest or both
[19:48] <Arby> fair enough
[19:52] <JontheEchidna> yeah, the ping-and-hope-they-don't-respond trick works everytime! ;D
[19:52] <JontheEchidna> except when it doesn't, then, sucks to be the triager
[19:52] <JontheEchidna> :P
[19:56] <a|wen> luckily it is often fixed in the new version; and if it isn't SRU worthy you are done ...
[19:58] <Arby> JontheEchidna: I've done many bugs that way.
[19:58] <Arby> every triager learns it sooner or later :)
[19:58] <JontheEchidna> oh yes, KDE4 is great about not qualifying for an SRU :D
[19:59] <JontheEchidna> of course people get mad when they learn that KDE4 doesn't suck as much as their preconcieved peeves make it out to be
[19:59] <JontheEchidna> and then yell at you to fix it in KDE3
[20:00] <Arby> a|wen: does bug 163737 sound like anything you've come across already?
[20:01] <a|wen> Arby: nope, that's a new one ;)
[20:02] <Arby> this would be an example where the ping and hope trick fails then :)
[20:03] <Arby> a) I don't what ldap actually is, b) I have no means of testing it
[20:03]  * Arby looks in the wiki
[20:04] <smarter> you don't what ldap is? you totally it! :P
[20:04] <a|wen> Arby: i would try testing agains another SSL/https remote resource ... is not unlikely a generic problem with not getting a popup for non-validated certificates
[20:05] <xerosis> I'm almost certain I have the same setup at work and I get the popup
[20:06] <Arby> smarter: in my world ldap is 'somebody elses problem'
[20:06] <Arby> until now
[20:06] <smarter> in my world, ldap is a boring acronym for something that looks boring :p
[20:07] <Arby> a|wen: thanks I can ask them to check that
[20:07] <a|wen> xerosis: is there a deny and "do not show this anymore" option?
[20:08] <xerosis> a|wen: I think there is
[20:09] <a|wen> Arby: then i might be, that they just hit that one ^^
[20:09] <Arby> the thought did cross my mind
[20:09] <Arby> is there a way to undo that
[20:09] <Arby> ?
[20:10] <a|wen> Arby: it is probably stored in some file somewhere in the .kde directory
[20:11] <Arby> I thought it might be
[20:11]  * Arby digs a bit
[20:39] <smarter> Arby: grep for "[Notification Messages]" in the *rc file of the app where you ticked the don't ask me anymore
[20:39] <Arby> smarter thanks for the hint, I suppose it would be kmail or kontact
[22:13] <Arby> nixternal: ping
[22:13] <Arby> nixternal: do you mind if I close bug 75416, reporter says bug is no longer present.
[22:14] <Arby> just trying to tidy up kdepim bugs and that one's assigned to you.
[22:31] <larsivi> Hi!
[22:32] <larsivi> will the upgrade from hardy to intrepid also migrate my mail accounts?
[22:32] <ScottK-laptop> larsivi: Hardy KDE3 or Hardy KDE4?
[22:32] <larsivi> ScottK-laptop: kde3
[22:32] <ScottK-laptop> Yes then.
[22:33] <ScottK-laptop> Quote of the day from my 14 year old that I helped upgrade to Intrepid yesterday:
[22:33] <larsivi> ok - that was the main reason for me not going for kde4 earlier
[22:33] <ScottK-laptop> "Dad, guess what?  I figured out widgets.  They are SO cool!"
[22:33] <larsivi> plus some kopete/xmpp issue ...
[22:34] <JontheEchidna> ScottK-laptop: heh
[22:34] <Arby> plasma, kool for kids :)
[22:34] <Arby> sorry *whince*
[22:35] <jussi01> ScottK: hehehe, nice
[22:38] <a|wen> widgets ARE cool ... /me just found the drag-and-drop of picture to generate picture frames with them :)