[00:06] <directhex> sistpoty, can i suggest people offer to help with lenny RC bugs? nothing's gonna impact jaunty development more than a stagnant debian
[00:07] <emgent> hello
[00:13] <sistpoty> directhex: I won't hinder you to do so ;)
[00:13] <directhex> sistpoty, i meant as part of your mail, but i guess i'm a bit late
[00:14] <directhex> anyway, bedtime pour moi
[00:14] <sistpoty> directhex: sorry, mail already sent
[00:15]  * sistpoty also goes to bed... gn8 everyone
[02:31] <yowwww> anyone help with the libGL.so.1 cannot be overwritten nvidia issue? 32 bit system
[02:37] <gouki> What's the variable for packager name? It keeps using the username, instead of my full name.
[02:57] <Elbrus> gouki: set DEBFULLNAME=<FULL NAME> in the environment
[02:57] <gouki> Elbrus, thank you very much!
[02:59] <Elbrus> gouki: you might also want to set DEBEMAIL and DEBSIGN_KEYID
[03:03] <gouki> Very helpful indeed Elbrus. Both set. Thank you.
[03:05] <Elbrus> your welcome
[03:05] <Elbrus> s/your/you're
[03:08] <ScottK> Wahoo.  Launchpad.  Now improved with even mor slowness.
[03:08] <ScottK> mor/more
[03:08] <gouki> Heheh
[03:22] <ScottK> Would someone please hunt down shirish (see -devel-discuss) and explain how ridiculous it is to put a license statement in every email you send.
[03:22] <ScottK> Please before I find myself violating the CoC.
[03:22] <Milyardo> :)
[03:23] <Milyardo> I thought that too when I read his email
[03:30] <ScottK> I really should just killfile him.
[03:37]  * StevenK stops reading -devel-discuss before he gets more depressed by shirish
[03:39]  * ScottK adds a new rule to his Kmail.
[03:39]  * StevenK finds himself a little disappointed the startup sound didn't change for intrepid
[03:42]  * ScottK finds himself disappointed he can't find his car keys.
[03:43] <Milyardo> Did anyone else besides me respond to Mark Ellse?
[03:46] <jdong> why did shirish reply to himself and just quote his entire message?
[03:46] <jdong> is that like thread bumping in mailing list world?
[03:48] <wgrant> jdong: I was wondering that, then realised it was shirish.
[03:48] <jdong> wgrant: heh 10 hour 37 minutes in between too. That's no accidental double-click on send.
[03:48] <wgrant> Oh.
[03:50] <wgrant> Hmm.
[03:50] <wgrant> ~20% of the failed builds from Intrepid that have so far been retried in Jaunty have built fine.
[03:50] <wgrant> Unfortunate that we didn't have a mass give-back near the end of Intrepid.
[04:02] <superm1> jdong, did your /var/lib/bluetooth transition over from hardy to intrepid?
[04:02] <superm1> jdong, i'm doing the upgrade right now, and didn't even consider that scenario - what happens...
[04:04] <jdong> superm1: I never tried it with hardy
[04:04] <jdong> superm1: I started fresh at Intrepid, it should be fine
[04:04] <jdong> the format looks identical to me
[04:04] <superm1> jdong, well i figure for most people it's not a big deal if it doesn't, but i *really* dont want to repair my keyboard :)
[04:04] <jdong> superm1: haha, repair is the right word :D
[04:05] <superm1> jdong, funny how re-pair and repair are both applicable here.  that and i dont even remember if the mouse was trouble too pairing
[04:05] <jdong> superm1: the mouse is bliss
[04:05] <jdong> no trouble at all
[04:06] <jdong> but the keyboard.... I sure hope for your sake there's no repair involved!
[04:13] <Hobbsee> ScottK: shirish is usually variable in his level of cluelessness.  I'll hunt him down again (i've had reasonable success the last few times i've done it)
[04:13] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Depends on how you define success.  He's still breathing.
[04:14] <Hobbsee> ScottK: well, defining success in most other ways would be violating the code of conduct.
[04:14] <ScottK> wgrant: hppa?
[04:14] <Hobbsee> besides, he does get more clueful / less objectionable occasionally.
[04:14] <ScottK> It got a fixed libc and gcc very near the end.
[04:14] <ScottK> Hobbsee: If you say so.  He invited someone to join him on linked-in via debian-devel ML earlier this week.
[04:15] <Hobbsee> ScottK: ouch.
[04:15] <Hobbsee> ScottK: okay, so make that *very* occasionally.
[04:16] <ScottK> He's the only person I still remember individually who was on my list of reasons why I gave up user ML.
[04:17] <wgrant> ScottK: And  lpia and powerpc...
[04:18] <ScottK> OK.  Well I'm not suprised at all about hppa.
[04:18] <ScottK> Through much of the later part of the dev cycle there were enough hppa FTBFS that the hppa buildd's actually kept up.
[04:19] <wgrant> Yeah...
[04:21] <Hobbsee> urgh, why am i browsing u-d-d now?
[04:24] <Hobbsee> man...there's madness on this list
[04:24] <Hobbsee> and surprisingly, i'ts not from shirish.
[04:25] <ScottK> Yeah.  I'm considering giving it up.
[04:25] <ScottK> Hobbsee: Which madness in particular?
[04:25] <Hobbsee> i gave it up long ago, i'm just looking at the archives.
[04:26] <Hobbsee> ScottK: Vincenzo Ciancia seems to be the main offender.  At this point, the "Deleting an alpha iso for the safety of users hardware" thread
[04:26] <wgrant> But the lack of Midnight Commander is what is holding Ubuntu back from taking over the desktop!
[04:26] <superm1> jdong, nope, they both look to have tried hard, but didn't come through :(
[04:26] <ScottK> Ah.  I remember that.
[04:26] <jdong> superm1: that's what she s... I mean.. err... did you back up /var/lib/bluetooth?
[04:27] <ScottK> wgrant: Oddly enough my welcoming call to do the actual work involved in getting it on the CD seems to have ended that thread.
[04:27] <wgrant> ScottK: I noticed...
[04:27] <superm1> jdong, yeah, but not gonna do a lot of good at this point
[04:27] <Hobbsee> wgrant: and the lack of inverse searches for dvi in ubuntu...which apparently uses kde now.
[04:27] <superm1> i'll play the repairing game i guess :(
[04:27] <jdong> superm1: ouch.
[04:28] <Hobbsee> ScottK: that's normal.
[04:28] <jdong> superm1: remember that after pairing you need to edit did separately to inject the right id :)
[04:28] <Hobbsee> ScottK: you mean the devs won't just drop everyhing to fix what users want, OMGNOW?
[04:28] <ScottK> Hobbsee: I actually fixed that one.  I did some Googling and found a real constituency for it.
[04:28] <Hobbsee> i saw that.   and apparently ubuntu's (which doesn't use kdvi) is much better for users as a result.
[04:29] <wgrant> Hobbsee: The inverse searching was a legitimate issue.
[04:29] <ScottK> Hobbsee: It's in Universe, so arguably it's for either.
[04:30] <Hobbsee> well, it starts with a k :P
[04:30] <ScottK> So does Kompozer.
[04:30] <ScottK> ;-)
[04:31] <wgrant> But Kompozer is Mozilla-based.
[04:31] <wgrant> So it is known to be insane.
[04:31] <ScottK> Yes, well.
[04:31]  * ScottK just lasted an entire hour and 10 minutes in #kubuntu.
[04:32] <ScottK> Of course I was out of the house picking up teenager #2 from a party for most of that.
[04:32] <wgrant> Heh.
[04:35] <superm1> jdong, wooohoo.  8th try :)
[04:36] <jdong> superm1: how do you get so lucky?
[04:36] <jdong> superm1: I freaking spent all of last week on this
[04:36] <superm1> jdong, it probably helps that this is the same machine it "was" paired with before
[04:40] <ScottK> Ooh.  Good press for .au: http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/10/31/australia.residency.denied.ap/index.html?eref=rss_topstories
[04:40] <Hobbsee> how is that good press?
[04:41] <ScottK> Sarcasm.
[04:41] <Hobbsee> ah, yes.
[04:41] <Hobbsee> ScottK: you should see the proposed filtering legislation.
[04:41] <ScottK> I saw something about that.
[04:41] <wgrant> We love you, Senator Conroy.
[04:42] <Hobbsee> wgrant: yes, and will filter your internet experience so it only allows you access to about 10 sites, just to see how you like it - 10 sites we define.
[04:43]  * ScottK decides that he's had too much alcohol to know if further comment is appropriate.
[04:43] <wgrant> ScottK: Always!
[04:44] <ScottK> I might take that seriously if I didn't ~ know how old you are.
[04:44] <Hobbsee> heh
[04:45] <wgrant> Heh.
[04:45] <wgrant> ScottK: Have a bit more alcohol and file some bugs with 2000-word paragraphs. They're always lots of fun.
[04:46] <ScottK> Nah.  I'm pretty happy with things computerish.
[04:47] <superm1> jdong, i think i spoke too soon... did buttons 1-3 on your mouse not go over nicely?
[04:47] <superm1> (the keyboard works great though)
[04:47] <wgrant> You know, you could just not get broken hardware.
[04:47] <superm1> that would make life easy ya know :)
[04:48] <ScottK> superm1: We're getting questions about when kdebluetooth will be fixed.  Do you have any notion of the timeline?
[04:48] <Hobbsee> i found it interesting to note how much of this stuff actually does attribute to bad hardware.
[04:48] <jdong> superm1: they went wine for me
[04:48]  * wgrant takes a deep breath and joins #ubuntu to see what everybody is complaining about with 8.10.
[04:48] <Hobbsee> wgrant: you'll regret it.
[04:48] <jdong> wgrant: WAAH PULSE SKYPE FLASH
[04:48] <jdong> *ducks*
[04:48] <Hobbsee> wgrant: forums might be quicker
[04:49] <jdong> I think I summed it up pretty well :D
[04:49] <Hobbsee> jdong: you forgot 'firefox' in there, to go with the flash.
[04:49] <superm1> ScottK, hopefully in the next two weeks provided things keep going smoothly
[04:49] <wgrant> Hobbsee: The forums are painful.
[04:49] <Hobbsee> jdong: oh, and 'midnight commander isn't by default!!!'
[04:49] <wgrant> jdong: I'm expecting more WAAAH TOUCHPAD RESOLUTION TABLET
[04:49] <Hobbsee> wgrant: you've been there/
[04:49] <wgrant> Hobbsee: Yes.
[04:49] <jdong> wgrant: xorg.conf, refresh rate, etc :)
[04:49] <Hobbsee> ouch
[05:03] <ScottK> superm1: Thanks.
[05:05] <ScottK> NCommander: Welcome.
[05:06] <ScottK> NCommander: It looks like a bzr backport is needed.
[05:06] <NCommander> uh oh
[05:06] <NCommander> can we just get away with backporting bzr-svN?
[05:06] <ScottK> NCommander: No.  It needs the newer bzr.
[05:07] <ScottK> So it's backport bzr or patch bzr-svn into submission.
[05:08] <ScottK> NCommander: I'm guessing there are enough bzr fanboys around you can get help.
[05:08] <NCommander> well
[05:08] <NCommander> On the plus side, the guy who wanted the bzr backport will be happy
[05:12] <ScottK> Good night all.
[05:41] <wgrant> Oh dear god.
[05:41] <wgrant> Ultimate Edition is being advertised by some users on ubuntuforums.
[05:42] <ajmitch> you're surprised?
[05:42] <wgrant> I would have thought somebody would have killed them all.
[05:43] <ajmitch> no, because all these things are popular
[05:44] <wgrant> I hoped UE itself would die after Canonical made them remove Ubuntu from the name.
[05:44] <wgrant> Then there's the guy who is suggesting that people move to Linux Mint because it has Firefox 3.0.3.
[05:45] <ajmitch> now that's intelligence
[05:46] <wgrant> I really should avoid ubuntuforums... but once I get there I can't leave without attempting to correct the misinformation...
[05:47] <ajmitch> "I can't go to bed yet, someone is _wrong_ on the internet!"
[05:47] <wgrant> Heh.
[05:48] <ajmitch> xkcd, ever a fount of wisdom for our age
[05:48] <wgrant> It has an answer for almost everything.
[05:49] <wgrant> The office next to mine at uni has its walls plastered with what could well be every xkcd comic.
[05:50]  * NCommander running tackles wgrant 
[05:50]  * wgrant is crushed.
[05:50]  * NCommander pulls out dpkg-bicyclepump
[05:50]  * NCommander sticks one end in wgrant and starts inflating on the pump
[05:51] <wgrant> It's Bicycle Repair Man!
[05:51]  * NCommander inflates
[07:31] <tbielawa> hellooo
[09:21] <elvis> only MOTU's allowed here?!
[09:21] <laga> no
[09:22] <elvis> you a MOTU?
[09:22] <laga> no, just a lazy MOTU hopeful
[09:22] <wgrant> laga: You can stop being lazy in a couple of days and fix Jaunty.
[09:22]  * wgrant cracks the whip.
[09:23] <laga> oh crap, i promised to do thirty merges
[09:23] <laga> but hey, i have lots of free time between moving and (hopefully) starting a new job :)
[09:23] <elvis> whats Jaunty?
[09:24] <laga> elvis: the new ubuntu release, due next year
[09:25] <pochu> laga: 30!? I only have to do 3 by now
[09:25] <laga> pochu: i lost a bet, kinda.
[09:25] <pochu> but one of them is wxwidgets... if we counted binary packages, I'd win :-)
[09:26] <pochu> emgent: we want jaunty now!! ;-) http://thc.emanuele-gentili.com/utu/
[09:26] <laga> oh neat, 14 packages for me
[09:26] <elvis> Ubuntu devel only involves packaging and patching, and no app dev?
[09:29] <pochu> elvis: mostly packaging and patching, but there are some applications developed by Ubuntu
[09:29] <pochu> e.g. ubiquity and update-manager
[09:31] <ziroday> and jockey
[09:40] <wgrant> And upstart.
[09:40] <wgrant> And modifications to existing apps.
[09:42] <elvis> any work for a c/c++/python programmer in dev team...
[09:56] <pochu> elvis: if you want to contribute, update-manager, gnome-app-install, ubiquity and jockey are written in python, and update-notifier in C++ IIRC. If you are looking for an employment, http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employment/ may interest you
[09:58] <elvis> how do i get to know more about contributing to update-manager, gnome-app-install, ubiquity and jockey...
[10:02] <ziroday> elvis: you can contact the project authors. You might also want to ask in #ubuntu-devel and read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment#Starting%20points
[10:03] <pochu> elvis: for ubiquity you can ask in #ubuntu-installer
[11:04] <elvis> thanks people
[11:10] <slomo> siretart: ping? ffmpeg in experimental has broken dependencies for the -dev packages... something needs libraw1394-dev, libtheora-dev and libvorbis-dev because of some pkg-config file... please fix ;)
[11:12] <pochu> hi slomo :)
[11:12] <slomo> hi pochu :)
[11:21] <siretart> slomo: ok
[11:21] <siretart> hi slomo!
[11:21] <siretart> slomo: do you follow pkg-multimedia?
[11:22] <slomo> siretart: sometimes, depends on how much free time i have :) it was already discussed there?
[11:24] <siretart> slomo: I'm currently waiting for Diego's visibility patch to get committed and then update the package
[11:24] <siretart> that was discussed ther.
[11:26] <slomo> and then the dependencies inside the pkg-config file are not needed anymore because the symbols are invisible?
[11:26] <siretart> I don't understand that comment
[11:27] <siretart> that change does not touch any .pc files
[11:28] <slomo> why are the dependencies in the pc file needed? does some header actually include/use stuff of libtheora and friends?
[11:29] <siretart> I would expect so, (haven't checked that bit yet)
[11:30] <slomo> ok, well... the dependencies should be added :) shall i file a bug so it doesn't get lost?
[11:31] <siretart> yes. bonus points for proper explanation of the issue. I don't understand the problem yet, but that needs to go upstram
[11:32] <siretart> and least that's my impression
[11:32] <slomo> siretart: nope, it's a package dependency problem... some pc files requires libtheora and the corresponding -dev package doesn't depend on libtheora
[11:34] <siretart> slomo: let's continue that discussion in the bug report. OK?
[11:34] <slomo> siretart: sure
[12:12] <RainCT> Does someone agree that bug #231611 should be Invalid?
[12:14] <pochu> RainCT: indeed, it's up to the Debian maintainer to choose how he wants to modify the upstream source
[12:15] <pochu> so it's not a bug, and shouldn't be forwarded
[12:21] <RainCT> pochu: that's what I think, too. I'll close it then :)
[13:27] <emgent> pochu: ehehe correct. I will update UTU :-)
[13:54] <emgent> Jaunty is in utu. :-)
[14:07] <DktrKranz> ScottK, re bug 291476, I'm unable to reproduce it, maybe I haven't understand steps to reproduce the bug.
[14:08] <ScottK> DktrKranz: I expect that the user has some other issue, but since I don't run Gnome, I can't say what.
[14:08] <ScottK> clamtk doesn't support on access file scanning, so I've no idea what can be happening.
[14:09] <ScottK> DktrKranz: I'd encourage you to engage with the user to try and find out what the actual bug is.
[14:09] <DktrKranz> I'm unable to run clamtk from nautilus or from GNOME panel, nor to reach such an option in clamtk itself
[14:10] <ScottK> DktrKranz: I've no idea what's actually going on in that bug.  I'd say either mark it invalid and move on or work with the user to get more info.
[14:12] <DktrKranz> I asked user to provide a more detailed description or attach a screenshot, just to make sure I'm in the right direction
[14:13] <ScottK> Great.  Thanks.
[14:14] <ScottK> DktrKranz: What are your thoughts on SRU to fix Bug 285793 and Bug 290691?  I've asked upstream for input on the proposed patch for the latter.
[14:22] <pochu> emgent: cool, thanks!
[14:22] <pochu> can has jaunty upload?
[14:22] <emgent> pochu: np :)
[14:22] <pochu> if I upload something now, I'll be the third most uploader to Jaunty :P
[14:23] <emgent> hehehe
[14:31] <DktrKranz> pochu, I don't thing, they will be on unapproved for a while, so no uploads at all for now ;)
[14:31] <DktrKranz> *think
[14:36] <DktrKranz> ScottK, no issues for the first bug, I'm unsure for the second one because upstream seems not to agree to work around on mnemosyne
[14:37] <ScottK> DktrKranz: What I just got off list from him was "It look OK to me. In fact, I'll also add it to the 1.x codebase."
[14:38] <ScottK> I think it was more he wasn't going to sort through it since he'
[14:38] <DktrKranz> but attached patch seems good enought to deserve some testing
[14:38] <ScottK> is focused on developing the new version.
[14:38] <ScottK> I think since upstream has said he's going to incorporate the patch, we should be reasonably happy.
[14:38]  * ScottK goes to mark that in the bug.
[14:38]  * DktrKranz agrees
[14:40] <DktrKranz> anyway, I'm mostly fine with it, it should not break anything and should be easily reproducible
[14:41]  * ScottK makes an SRU.
[14:43] <DktrKranz> thanks
[14:45] <ScottK> Actually it's later than I thought and I need to run out, but I'll do it later.
[15:31] <Elbrus> On oct 26, it was decided here that bug 275688 should be SRU. To me (but I might not see specific things) nothing has happened on it sinse. Can/should I provide more help? Maybe rename the bug to show that it contains a license issue?
[15:50] <csilk> lol
[15:50] <csilk> in #ubuntu some guy is complaining about wmv files not playing in firefox
[15:51] <csilk> he messaged me with a link to the file not playing
[15:51] <csilk> it's a porn site/video
[15:51] <csilk> possible troll?
[15:51] <csilk> I now give up voluntary tech support
[15:52] <homy> Hello! My question is not exactly motu-related, but maybe you can help me anyways.
[15:52] <laga> reminds me of that bug report in the fedora tracker.. the bug report contained some saucy file names ;)
[15:53] <homy> How do you cross-compile gtk/gtkmm/cairomm apps for windows?
[15:53] <homy> I tried http://blog.heuristicdesign.co.uk/archives/2007/07/01/cross-compiling-gtkmm-applications-to-windows/, but it didn't work out for me.
[15:55] <pochu> homy: try asking in #win32 on GimpNet
[15:56] <homy> pochu: what server is GimpNet?
[15:56] <pochu> homy: irc.gimp.org
[15:57] <homy> thanks.
[16:07] <homy> pochu: nobody answering :)
[16:10] <AnAnt> Hello, I think that initrd image (in Intrepid) does not start console-setup script, is there a way I can verify that ? and to which package should I submit a bug report ?
[17:32] <karooga> Hi.  Is anyone available to revu my package?
[17:33]  * RainCT may be in a while
[17:36] <karooga> thanks RainCT. :-)
[17:37] <csilk> karooga, out of curiosity, is it a new package or an update?
[17:38] <RainCT> csilk: only new packages need to go through REVU
[17:38] <csilk> I guess that answers my question
[17:38] <karooga> csilk: new package
[17:39] <csilk> RainCT,  what's the process for getting an update into the repo then?
[17:40] <pochu> csilk: file a bug and attach the diff.gz, then subscribe ubuntu-{universe,main}-sponsors
[17:40] <RainCT> csilk: just file a bug on Launchpad and attach the .diff.gz
[17:40] <pochu> (depending whether the package is on main or universe)
[17:40] <csilk> Ok cool, thanks for the info
[17:41] <soc> hi
[17:42] <karooga> pochu: is there any specific mailing lists I should join if I'm hoping to be a maintainer?
[17:42] <soc> i just wanted to ask, if there is maybe a packaging problem with kile
[17:42] <soc> kile (kde3) wants to install konsole (kde4) that can't be right, can it?
[17:43] <soc> i assume people renamed konsole-kde4 to konsole and forgot to fix the package dependency of kile ...
[17:47] <pochu> karooga: there is motu-mentors if you are new to packaging and want to ask questions. ubuntu-motu would be interesting, too
[17:47] <pochu> karooga: but you aren't forced to join them if you don't want
[17:47] <karooga> pochu: are they high volume?
[17:48] <pochu> karooga: 112 messages in ubuntu-motu on October, and 12 in ubuntu-motu-mentors
[17:53] <RainCT> karooga: I have to leave but will look later at it
[17:54] <karooga> RainCT: thanks muchly. Do you need a link?
[19:01] <bdrung> what do i have to do, if i want to update the standards version from 3.7.3 to 3.8.0?
[19:01] <crimsun> make sure the source package is compliant with the latter version of Policy
[19:06] <bdrung> how do i know what was changed?
[19:07] <crimsun> the changelogs for debian-policy and ubuntu-policy should be helpful there
[19:07] <bdrung> is there a possibility to read the changelogs online?
[19:09] <crimsun> aptitude changelog {debian,ubuntu}-policy
[19:10] <jdong> grumble ok it's not alsa's fault... something else in kernelland is hanging everything for 0.1-0.2secs every few minutes
[19:10] <jdong> that's a job for latencytop, correct?
[19:10] <crimsun> jdong: yes, it can help
[19:11] <jdong> alright, time to do some sleuthing
[19:11] <crimsun> bdrung: also, http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/d/debian-policy/debian-policy_3.8.0.1ubuntu2/changelog and http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/u/ubuntu-policy/ubuntu-policy_3.8.0.1ubuntu4/changelog, respectively
[19:13] <bdrung> thx
[19:38] <pochu> bdrung: you can see what changed between 3.7.3 and 3.8.0 in /usr/share/doc/debian-policy/upgrading-checklist.txt.gz in the debian-policy package
[19:43] <bdrung> pochu: thx
[20:06] <slomo> siretart: ffmpeg bug is filed now, i hope that's enough information now ;) sorry for being not very verbose this morning
[20:10] <slomo> siretart: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=504220
[22:11] <Volans22> Hi all! :) Can I ask here for a problem at boot time after intrepid upgrade with encrypted root partition?
[22:12] <csilk> Volans22, general support is in #ubuntu
[22:14] <Volans22> csilk: I know, but I think that is a possible bug because LUKS ask me for the passphrase twice and the 2nd time it say that is not correct
[22:14] <Volans22> (twice for the same partition)
[22:15] <csilk> Volans22, Ok, I'd still ask in #ubuntu as someone else may have an answer for you, if you genuinely think you have found a bug you can report it at bugs.ubuntu.com
[22:20] <Volans22> ok csilk, I will ask there, I was thinking that asking here and maybe directly siretart (the cryptsetup package maintainer) would be simpler, but if you prefer to not talk about that here no problem
[22:22] <marcin_ant> hi all
[22:22] <marcin_ant> could someone explain me what does this warning mean? "This package has a Debian revision number but there does not seem to be
[22:22] <marcin_ant> an appropriate original tar file or .orig directory in the parent directory;" ?
[22:24] <marcin_ant> I'm trying to follow maint-guide but really don't understand how to handle directories in non-native upstream tarballs
[22:24] <marcin_ant> could someone help me with this warning?
[22:25] <csilk> marcin_ant, can you paste the debian/changelog file at paste.ubuntu.com
[22:28] <marcin_ant> csilk: why debian/changelog? it's initial release of non-native upstream....
[22:28] <marcin_ant> csilk: there is nothing in changelog
[22:28] <csilk> marcin_ant, is your error a lintian generated error?
[22:29] <jdong> crimsun: any clues on Assertion 'pthread_setspecific(t->key, userdata) == 0' failed at pulsecore/thread-posix.c:194, function pa_tls_set()?
[22:29] <marcin_ant> csilk: yes
[22:29] <jdong> crimsun: seems like UT2004 triggers it, mentioned in bug 219281
[22:30] <csilk> marcin_ant, I don't understand why the changelog would be empty?
[22:32] <marcin_ant> csilk: oh it's not empty it just has single entry * Initial release
[22:32] <Elbrus> marcin_ant: I assume you are trying to make a package for the first time?
[22:32] <csilk> marcin_ant,  I was more interested in the version numbers
[22:32] <csilk> such as
[22:32] <csilk> 1ubuntu or 0ubuntu
[22:33] <Elbrus> marcin_ant: to get rid of this warning make sure that there is a file package_version.orig.tar.gz
[22:33] <Elbrus> marcin_ant: mind the underscore, in the directory below your package directory
[22:35] <Elbrus> marcin_ant: I am packaging winff-0.43 (directory) and I have a winff_0.43.orig.tar.gz in the same directory as the winff-0.43 directory
[22:35] <marcin_ant> csilk: 0ubuntu1
[22:36] <csilk> Elbrus, where the error said he has a debian revision number I was wondering whether he hadn't changed the default dhmake value of 1ubuntu to 0ubuntu
[22:36] <csilk> ahh looks like he has
[22:36] <csilk> yeah in that case you just need the orig.tar.gz as the error states
[22:36] <csilk> I guess a "debain revision number" just means any revision number then rather than something that's come from the debian repo
[22:37] <RainCT> re
[22:38] <csilk> marcin_ant,  you need to cd to the tarball you unpacked at the beginning of the process and do : cp softwareapp-1.2.tar.gz softwareapp_1.2.orig.tar.gz
[22:40] <marcin_ant> csilk: right and this is a problem I really don't understand
[22:41] <marcin_ant> csilk: what should I do if inside of tarball there is no directory like softwareapp-1.2 ?
[22:41] <csilk> that was supposed to be variable -_-
[22:41] <marcin_ant> csilk: but instead of I got some random files in / and few subdirectories ?
[22:41] <csilk> marcin_ant, you need to make a copy of the original upstream tarball and include that with your package
[22:42] <csilk> and it has to be named like   APPNAME_VERSIONNUMBER.orig.tar,gz
[22:42] <marcin_ant> csilk: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete says that wrong directory layout is not a reason to modify original tarball
[22:43] <radix> hey guys, can anyone tell me how debuild decides that a package is a native debian package?
[22:43] <csilk> marcin_ant, this won't modify the original tarball, your just making a copy of it
[22:43] <radix> I am having trouble packaging this piece of software. it's released as a .zip and it has a date-based version number with dashes in it. :P
[22:44] <marcin_ant> csilk: you don't understand me - I'll try to explain
[22:44] <marcin_ant> csilk: let's say I got Blabla.tar.gz = upstream
[22:44] <csilk> ok
[22:45] <marcin_ant> csilk: and I want to create ubuntu-blabla package from this upstream
[22:45] <marcin_ant> csilk: so I follow guide and I do:
[22:45] <marcin_ant> csilk: mkdir ~/ubuntu-blabla
[22:46] <marcin_ant> csilk: cd ~/ubuntu-blabla
[22:46] <marcin_ant> csilk: wget http://www.example.com/Blabla.tar.gz
[22:47] <marcin_ant> csilk: cp Blabla.tar.gz ubuntu-blabla_1.0.0.orig.tar.gz
[22:48] <marcin_ant> csilk: ok until now - right?
[22:48] <csilk> marcin_ant, you shouldnt get the lintain error you pasted if you made the orif.tar.gz
[22:48] <csilk> *lintian
[22:48] <marcin_ant> csilk: so, I tar zxvf ubuntu-blabla_1.0.0.orig.tar.gz
[22:48] <csilk> ok you can stop showing me what you did now
[22:49] <marcin_ant> csilk: but there is no subdirectory inside Blabla.tar.gz vel ubuntu-blabla_1.0.0.tar.gz
[22:49] <marcin_ant> csilk: so where should I create debian dir?
[22:50] <csilk> marcin_ant, dh_make will create the debian dir for you in /ubuntu-blabla
[22:50] <marcin_ant> csilk: if I will create ~/ubuntu-blabla/debian then I will get this error because orig.tar.gz is expected in _parent_
[22:50] <csilk> correct
[22:50] <marcin_ant> csilk: "This package has a Debian revision number but there does not seem to be
[22:50] <marcin_ant>  an appropriate original tar file or .orig directory in the parent directory;"
[22:51] <marcin_ant> csilk: so the only way to get rid of this warning is to modify original tarball and create subdirectory in it
[22:51] <marcin_ant> csilk: right?
[22:51] <csilk> no
[22:52] <marcin_ant> csilk: because I should got something like this: ~/ubuntu-blabla/ubuntu-blabla-1.0.0/debian
[22:52] <csilk> correct
[22:53] <csilk> and the orig in generallu in ubuntu-blabla
[22:53] <marcin_ant> csilk: and my upstream tarball should be in ~/ubuntu-blabla renamed to orig
[22:53] <csilk> yes
[22:53] <marcin_ant> csilk: and it should unpack sources to ~/ubuntu-blabla/ubuntu-blabla-1.0.0
[22:54] <marcin_ant> csilk: but to do this it should have this dir inside tarball - but there is no such directory in upstream
[22:55] <csilk> marcin_ant, you're actually confusing me know.. Give me 3 mins I'm going to very quicky make a dirty package to see if I get the same problem as you
[22:55] <csilk> **NOW
[22:56] <RainCT> what's the problem?
[22:57] <csilk> marcin_ant, the orig should be in /blabla along with blabla.tar.gz
[22:57] <csilk> simple
[22:58] <marcin_ant> csilk: ok and where should sources go?
[22:58] <csilk> in the unpacked dir
[22:58] <marcin_ant> csilk: and where should be /debian in this structure?
[22:58] <csilk> oh wait
[22:58] <csilk> what?
[22:58] <csilk> -_-
[22:58] <csilk> you claim to have read the compelte guide
[22:58] <csilk> ?
[22:59] <marcin_ant> csilk: and this is a problem
[22:59] <csilk> why don't I have this problem?
[23:00] <marcin_ant> csilk: complete guide says that: If you are packaging your own software, or the software is not available as a tar.gz file, you can create the required .tar.gz from an unpacked source directory with a command like the following:
[23:00] <marcin_ant> tar czf hello-2.1.1.tar.gz hello-2.1.1
[23:00] <radix> csilk: I think the problem is that the upstream tarball does not organize all of its files into a directory, but rather has them at the root of the tarball
[23:00] <marcin_ant> radix: exactly!
[23:00] <radix> at least that's my impression from when marcin said "<marcin_ant> csilk: what should I do if inside of tarball there is no directory like softwareapp-1.2 ?"
[23:01] <csilk> I must of glazed over that ^
[23:01] <radix> as it happens, I'm having a vaguely similar problem, so I'd like to hear the solution as well.
[23:02] <marcin_ant> csilk: and what now ;) ?
[23:03] <csilk> marcin_ant,  link to tarball please
[23:05] <marcin_ant> csilk: well if you want something simple you could just tar some random files yourself
[23:06] <marcin_ant> csilk: but I'm trying to package for example something like this http://plone.org/products/archetypes/releases/1.5/Archetypes-1.5.9.tar.gz
[23:06] <csilk> hmm sorry for not understanding you earlier, probably something to do with my impaitience today, marcin_ant you could contact upstream and request a dir layout change, alot of the time upstream are quite responsive when you tell them you are packaging for ubuntu repo
[23:07] <csilk> *impatience
[23:07] <marcin_ant> csilk: it has a bunch of directories in / of tarball each subdirectory contains files for different deb
[23:08] <marcin_ant> csilk: well maybe it's a kind of solution - but for me it's just a workaround
[23:09] <marcin_ant> csilk: because Guide should describe such cases
[23:09] <csilk> Yes it is, personally I think the policy on not changing dir layout yourself in this case needs reviewing
[23:09] <csilk> marcin_ant, you could be a rebel and just change the dir layout anyway then submit the new tar.gz as a patch upstream
[23:11] <marcin_ant> csilk: and provide some real solution - not just "The following are not reasons to change the original tarball: * Wrong Directory Layout "
[23:12] <marcin_ant> csilk: :-)
[23:13] <csilk> marcin_ant, yes, I'll mention is on the mailing list, I think the policy should be changed for this specific purpose and some provision introduced as sometimes upstream wont accept pactches nor will they make the requested changes, personally all the upstream devs I've ever contacted have been more than willing to make small changes in order to get their app into the ubuntu repo
[23:13] <csilk> **it
[23:13] <csilk> but some people can be funny, it's a kind of "don't tell me how to make my software" kind of arogance
[23:15] <marcin_ant> csilk: well another thing is that there are packages that are orphaned for years
[23:15] <marcin_ant> csilk: I mean upstream applications
[23:15] <csilk> marcin_ant,  I think packages like that aren't really wanted in the repo
[23:15] <ScottK> You can use debian/rules to put files where they need to be in the binary packages.  No need to re-arrange the source tarball to accomplish that.
[23:15] <marcin_ant> csilk: there are libraries that are needed in ubuntu but they are few years old and they are not developed anymore
[23:16] <RainCT> ubottu: are you alive?
[23:16] <csilk> marcin_ant,  yeah that is true, it's not an ideal situation
[23:16] <RainCT> bug #135864
[23:16] <csilk> ScottK, is that documented anywhere?
[23:17] <marcin_ant> csilk: thank you anyway :)
[23:17] <RainCT> csilk: just use dh_install/install/cp/mv
[23:17] <ScottK> I'm sure it is.  I've on idea where, but debian/rules is just a make file.  Bend it to your will.
[23:17] <ScottK> on/no
[23:18] <RainCT> crap, 15 minutes a package review and now I delete it :'(
[23:20] <marcin_ant> csilk: ??
 on/no
[23:21] <csilk> ^ignore
[23:21] <RainCT> csilk: "I've on idea" -> "I've no idea"
[23:21] <csilk> yeah i know
[23:21] <csilk> didnt mean to paste that
[23:43] <sistpoty> oh, cool... kvirc seems to be compatible between unstable and intrepid (unlike the rest of kde *g*)
[23:46] <ricosecada> I know that the Ubuntu desktop edition is based upon the Debian unstable branch, but what branch of Debian is the Ubuntu server edition based upon?
[23:47] <RainCT> Hi ricosecada. Upon the same.
[23:47] <RainCT> ricosecada: All of Ubuntu (Desktop/Server, Kubuntu, Edubuntu..) is actually in the same repository and many packages are shared between them all
[23:48] <ricosecada> RainCT, Thanks! :-)
[23:49] <RainCT> np
[23:50] <ricosecada> Doesn't that make the server edition a rather "buggy" system (please forgive me, but I come from a Debian "point of view" trying to understand whats Ubuntu does different regarding dev)
[23:51] <sistpoty> actually unstable is quite stable, despite its name ;)
[23:52] <jdong> unstable refers to how fast things change
[23:52] <jdong> not how many times it crashes
[23:52] <sistpoty> also, after some time in the development cycle (DebianImportFreeze), we don't sync just any new version from debian blindly any longer, but these are subject to manual reviews instead
[23:53] <ricosecada> I see
[23:53] <jdong> right. Ubuntu is based off Debian Unstable  the same way Debian releases are based off Debian unstable.
[23:53] <RainCT> ricosecada: well, packages are massively importe from Debian at the start of the cycle but after that only when a developer request them (and some months before release we enter "Feature Freeze" and no new versions are not allowed anymore), so there is a stabilization process
[23:54] <ricosecada> So one could argue that Debian stable is in no way "safer" than Debian unstable?
[23:55] <sistpoty> dear exim, please don't try to send me a mail via remote smtp, that says, that you don't support remote smtp with your configuration. Thanks, stefan.
[23:55] <ricosecada> What I understand is that debian stable is based upon unstable (skipping testing here), but a lot of bugs has been fixed.
[23:55] <jdong> ricosecada: well I think one should argue that deriving a distribution off debian unstable doesn't say much about its final stability.
[23:55] <gouki> I'm trying to sign a package with debsign, but it's not using my key, even though I changed DEBSIGN_KEYID. Any ideas?
[23:55] <sistpoty> well, actually debian stable is quite solid, since the freeze period (where packages no longer migrate from unstable to testing, but only after a manual review) is much longer
[23:56] <jdong> ricosecada: both Debian and Ubuntu have a period of stopping the influx of changes for a period before release (freezing) and focusing on stamping out bugs
[23:57] <ricosecada> Ah, okay.. so the debian freezing is just a longer freeze and perhaps, but not for sure, more bugs are caught.
[23:57] <ricosecada> RainCT, good point
[23:57] <ricosecada> Sorry, I meant jdong
[23:57] <jdong> ricosecada: indeed, Debian freezes for a much longer time and tries much harder to stamp out ALL the bugs.
[23:57] <cyphermox> gouki: the latest changelog entry author maybe?
[23:58] <gouki> cyphermox, exactly.
[23:58] <jdong> ricosecada: whether that's worth delaying your release X (months, years, etc) is a matter that there will never be 100% agreement on
[23:58] <jdong> that is ultimately why we have both Ubuntu and Debian :)
[23:58] <cyphermox> gouki: i see. did you run dch -i ?
[23:58] <gouki> No. Let me read about it, cyphermox
[23:58] <RainCT> sistpoty: lol
[23:59] <ricosecada> Thanks a lot! :-) I finally get it now! jdong, your explanation was very helpful!
[23:59] <jdong> ricosecada: no problems, glad to be able to help :)