[00:01] <Pici> "Some of the camera work is 'subjective,' as when his drunken perceptions ar rendered by optical distortion; at other timers, it is the camera's mobility that is evocative, as when it passes through the revolving doors that serve as a symbol of destiny."
[00:02] <Pici> From 1001 Movies You Must See Before You Die
[00:02] <Pici> And now that I've actually transcribed that, I better put it to use
[00:02] <Pici> darn you
[00:08] <Myrtti> HAHA
[00:08] <Myrtti> lol
[00:08] <Myrtti> gotcha
[00:12] <mib_ypah9w> Hello
[00:13] <TuxIc3> I am ever so curious, about LaRoza, AND HIS BAN FROM uf, IS ANYONE AT LIBERTY TO INFORM ME?
[00:13] <TuxIc3> srry for caps
[00:15] <Myrtti> uf?
[00:15] <Pici> TuxIc3: We don't generally discuss bans with people unrelated to the situation.
[00:15] <Myrtti> whats that?
[00:15] <Pici> Myrtti: #ubuntuforums I suppose.
[00:16] <mneptok> User Friendly
[00:16] <Myrtti> oh, right
[00:16] <Myrtti> the irc channel #ubuntuforums I hope
[00:16] <Myrtti> not ubuntuforums.org forums
[00:17] <Pici> We don't control the forums themselves.
[00:17] <Pici> Although some members of the IRC team may have administrative roles there.
[00:17] <Myrtti> nope we don't
[00:17] <Myrtti> TuxIc3: so...
[00:17] <Myrtti> was there anything else we can help you with?
[01:40] <S-T-E-P> salveeee
[01:40] <Flannel> S-T-E-P: How can we help you today?
[01:40] <S-T-E-P> ci sono italiani in qst chatt ?
[01:40] <Flannel> !it | S-T-E-P 
[01:56] <Flannel> That LjL guy sure gets around.
[02:12] <jrib> yeah
[02:56] <genii-around> Good evening, morning, or afternoon
[03:12] <ubot3> In #ubuntu-offtopic, snuxoll said: !hig is <reply> HIG stands for Human Interface Guidlines, you can find the GNOME HIG at http://library.gnome.org/devel/hig-book/stable/
[03:12] <Flannel> sigh.  *someone* is trolling.
[03:19] <Pici> !scope
[03:19] <genii-around> I disagree :)
[03:20] <Pici> Will anyone ever request that factoid?
[03:20] <Flannel> That's why we're removing your edit capabilities ;)
[03:20] <Flannel> Pici: No
[03:20] <Pici> Exactly
[03:20] <Pici> Maybe only if they've misspelled something eles
[03:21] <genii-around> !hid
[03:21] <genii-around> Hm
[03:31] <genii-around> I'd thought it would be something about Human Interface Devices or so
[03:34] <Flannel> here we go!
[03:34] <genii-around> Hehe
[03:55] <fryguy> is there any reason why a moderator of the channel would begin answering one of my questions, and then in the middle of the dialog stop, ignore me, accuse me of trolling, kick me from the channel, and then state that I'm not actually in need of support?
[04:01] <mneptok> fryguy: sure. one reason could be "that's true."
[04:02] <mneptok> not saying it is, but it's a good reason.
[04:02] <fryguy> it's not.  I'm in legitimate need of support, and find it appalling to be treated that way
[04:04] <nalioth> fryguy: can you roll it all up in a pastebin for us?
[04:04] <fryguy> no i can not. my client doesn't log chats, and I was kicked part way through the dialog, so I lost the beginning part of the logs
[04:05] <fryguy> I can only give the point after I was kicked.  if someone can point me to a resource that logs the main #ubuntu channel I will gladly look at that and pull from there, or some other source of a log for the channel
[04:05] <stdin> !logs
[04:06] <nalioth> we'll be happy to look at it when you get it compiled.
[04:06] <fryguy> is it acceptable if I idle here while I prepare a pastebin?
[04:06] <nalioth> the /topic says something about that
[04:07] <fryguy> ambiguous enough, i guess i shall take my chances
[04:12] <mneptok> [03:46] <fryguy> I'm trying to run gnome on a remote x server.  Someone told me I need to install an x client for gnome to run in.  What client is this and how do I install it?
[04:12] <mneptok> this is after asking essentially the same question ~5 times before that
[04:12] <fryguy> hold on one moment while i prepare the paste
[04:12] <mneptok> you were clearly goading Flannel, and denying it will insult the intelligence of anyone over the age of 12.
[04:12] <mneptok> so please, don't.
[04:17] <fryguy> http://paste.ubuntu.com/71189/
[04:31] <fryguy> so yah, consider that my formal complaint.  I am unsure why he was accusing me of trolling, I was asking a legitimate question.  He seemed to know what he was talking about.  I'm trying to leran something.  If he in fact didn't know the answer, I would have appreciated an "I don't know" instead of being kicked from the channel and accused of trolling.
[04:31]  * fryguy goes back to asking in the channel
[04:32] <Flannel> If anyone's going to take his complaint seriously, let me know and I'll post all of the relevant bits.
[04:33] <nickrud> Flannel, fryguy is a known envelope pusher, as long as I've known him.
[04:34]  * nickrud needs an editor
[04:34] <Flannel> nickrud: No, I know that, he had a run in with me around the same time you originally banned him.
[04:35] <Flannel> Considering he's currently asking a question that earlier to mentioned to someone else he "does all the time"
[04:36] <stdin> I see from my logs he came in here a to post a line of someone saying "try google" (paraphrase) then parted. obviously trying to provoke someone
[04:37] <nickrud> that's not really a troll like activity: just yesterday I brain locked on apt-get -f install. For the life of me I could not type it, although I knew what I wanted to do. It's just his supercilious attitude
[04:37] <Flannel> stdin: That's because I jumped on him the other day (original incident in recent history) for posting vertatim google queries of peoples questions
[04:37] <Flannel> (If someone says "how do I install foo" he googles "how do I install foo" and posts the page he gets back)
[04:39] <stdin> fwiw, posting a direct google search URL, rather than searching and picking the best (few) result(s), is against the guidelines: "When helping: be helpful"
[04:39] <Flannel> stdin: I know, and thats what I told him
[04:40] <stdin> is it, seemingly, one of the lease enforced guideline from what I've seen though
[04:40] <Flannel> stdin: And then he got huffity about that.  It wound up with him wanting a list of every site he could post for support.
[04:40] <Flannel> stdin: Nah, we tell people to not post bad info all the time
[04:41] <Flannel> stdin: That rule is the reason we don't allow root account enabling, *matix, etc.
[04:41] <stdin> I just mean the general guideline. eg: people doing !ask and !repeat but not helping anyone
[04:41] <Flannel> Fortunately, it's not a very common occurance, usually out of nescience instead of malice.
[04:42] <stdin> that's skating on the edge of that guideline
[04:42] <stdin> I guess it's subjective though
[04:42] <nickrud> I've got to go with stdin on that; often when I see someone give bad info I provide the right (if I know it, of course) without really calling out the bad info poster. I see others doing the same
[04:42] <Flannel> stdin: Eh, if someone is helping manage the channel, as long as they're not being a deterrent, I have no problem with it.
[04:42] <Flannel> It means the people who can help don't have to.  Akin to bug triaging by regular-folk allows the developers to fix bugs
[04:42] <stdin> Flannel: I mean often, not just once or twice when they see it
[04:43] <stdin> "bot-jockeys" I call 'em ;)
[04:43] <Flannel> stdin: Yeah, there are people who get bot happy, but I dont think theyre common
[04:43] <Flannel> nickrud: Ah, I do. Because you're (theoretically) fixing the problem in the future.
[04:43]  * nalioth looks at all the time being wasted on this <ahem>tPrRoOlBlLEM</ahem>
[04:44] <mneptok> did nalioth just fart?
[04:44] <nickrud> pftt, nalioth you got a problem with friends talking fluff?
[04:45] <Flannel> I'm fine banning him.  He is doing this just to waste time.
[04:45] <Flannel> Which is against the code of conduct.
[04:45] <Flannel> or IRC guidelines.
[04:45] <stdin> maybe introduce him to the concept of "forums"
[04:46] <stdin> I think the question he was asking would be a perfect forum thread, just seems to fit in to the "forum" category in my mind
[04:47] <Flannel> stdin: The question he's asking, he openly admitted to performing "on a daily basis"
[04:47] <Flannel> he's only asking to be difficult.
[04:47] <Flannel> (This was one of the lines he omitted from his pastebin)
[04:47] <stdin> then it's even better for a forum, all he'll need to do is reload the page daily :p
[04:49] <Flannel> Ok, I'd really like to ban him based on his continued antics in #u, anyone else have feelings about it?  One way or the other?
[04:50] <nalioth> Flannel: wait for the next episode
[05:40] <Flannel> well, at least with him in a query being annoying, hes not in #u being annoying
[05:42] <bazhang_> he has long been an envelope pusher, as far back as last summer iirc (fryguy)
[05:47] <Flannel> Mhmm
[06:03] <Flannel> Anyone been paying attention to unfo, mindrape, et al in #u?
[06:03] <Flannel> I haven't been paying attention enough to catch all of it
[06:04] <bazhang_> it seems to have died down; mindrape seems to think along the lines of fryguy-->helping makes you immune from any kind of action.
[06:05] <bazhang_> not sure about unfo redirecting folks to #ubuntu-bugs though
[06:05] <Flannel> bazhang_: Thats what it seemed like, I just wasn't sure who was the antagonist
[06:05] <bazhang_> Flannel, mostly mindrape after the initial conflagration; unfo went to -ot when so directed
[06:06] <Flannel> bazhang_: Have a timestamp on the initial stuff?  Or even a rough guess.
[06:06] <bazhang_> hang on a sec
[06:08] <Flannel> I'm inviting them ehre, since theyre going at it in -offtopic
[06:08] <bazhang_> forty minutes past the previous hour (give or take); mindrape was upset that unfo had given a google link for a latex question and called him a troll. Did not see that part
[06:08] <bazhang_> good call
[06:08] <Flannel> bazhang_: Yeah, I saw "hes a troll" but didn't see much leading up.
[06:08] <Flannel> I guess we'll just have to ask them.
[06:09] <Flannel> needhelpnoob: How can we help you today?
[06:10] <needhelpnoob> hi
[06:10] <needhelpnoob> im just lurking :D
[06:10] <bazhang_> needhelpnoob, no idling please
[06:10] <Flannel> needhelpnoob: Don't lurk here.  Thanks.
[06:10] <needhelpnoob> o
[06:10] <needhelpnoob> ok
[06:11] <needhelpnoob> cya :P
[06:11] <Flannel> sigh.
[06:11] <Flannel> kids these days
[06:12] <bazhang_> better to discuss it here.
[06:12] <Flannel> Howdy fellas.  Thanks for stopping by.
[06:12] <unfo> hey Flannel 
[06:12] <mindrape> /kb unfo from #ubuntu.  /discussion
[06:12] <Flannel> There's obviously some animosity between the two of you.
[06:12] <mindrape> if you dont /kb him then /kb me.  /discussion/discussion.  :)
[06:12] <unfo> Flannel:  mindrape alleges that I am doing bad by asking "why" questions.
[06:13] <Flannel> hold up
[06:13] <mindrape> read the log.  he is asking everybody irrelevant questions.  they want help.
[06:13] <Flannel> mindrape, unfo, hold up.
[06:13] <unfo> ok
[06:13] <mindrape> I'm not going to waste my time arguing my point against a troll... the logs speak for themselves.
[06:13] <mindrape> like I said /kb him or /kb me.
[06:13] <mindrape> <3 mindrape
[06:13] <bazhang_> this seems to revolve around recommending a google search of latex
[06:13] <Flannel> unfo: Alright, unfo, mind telling us what happened?
[06:13] <bazhang_> oh well
[06:14] <unfo> Flannel:  There are more people in #ubuntu than can be helped.  I have been sending some away, e.g. to #winehq, google, and elsewhere.
[06:15] <unfo> Flannel:  I am also asking "why" questions.  The best example is when someone asked for Microsoft Times New Roman font.  I asked them why they needed that font specifically.
[06:15] <bazhang_> unfo, sending them to -bugs is not the best move
[06:15] <unfo> bazhang_:  point taken.
[06:15] <Flannel> unfo: While asking "why" has its purpose, that's only if you're going to give better alternatives
[06:16] <Flannel> And then if they refuse/don'
[06:16] <Flannel>  /don't want the alternatives, you should honor that decision
[06:16] <unfo> Flannel:  fair.  
[06:16]  * unfo goes through scrollback and looks how he's been doing
[06:16] <Flannel> We don't expect you to be able to help everyone, and unfortunately, that means during some periods some people go unhelped for periods of time
[06:17] <Flannel> If you have real reasons for pointing them to other channels, that's fine.  And I don't see anything wrong with that.
[06:17] <Flannel> But, for instance (I haven't read the logs, so this may be completely irrelevant), if someone asks about installing LaTeX, that's obviously an Ubuntu question.
[06:17] <Flannel> Whereas using LaTeX could just as easily be elsewhere.
[06:17] <unfo> Flannel:  Installing Latex can be learned by googling though, no?
[06:17] <Flannel> unfo: you'd be better off sending them to #LaTeX
[06:18] <Flannel> unless you're giving them a specific page
[06:18] <unfo> Flannel:  you sure?
[06:18] <unfo> ah.
[06:18] <Flannel> "go google it" isn't a good response.
[06:18] <unfo> point taken.
[06:18] <Flannel> Besides the fact that it's unhelpful, it's also insulting
[06:18] <unfo> Flannel:  they did not respond to me.  Let me follow up with them now if they're still around.
[06:18] <unfo> (bazhang_: When I see a real crash, I sometimes point the person to -bugs.  And in this case I sent someone who had an installer hang there too.  Both bad ideas?)
[06:19] <Flannel> Also, once you tell them (go to #LaTeX, or here check [url] out), if they don't want to use those resources, don't pester them about it.  If they feel they need personalized support (or want their hand held) that's valid.  And it just means they'll wind up waiting for someone who *can* provide that to them
[06:19] <bazhang_> unfo, redirecting is not a good move imo; #ubuntu is the support channel
[06:19] <unfo> (The LaTex questioner is gone.)
[06:19] <Flannel> Again, I haven't read the logs, so this may not be relevant to the issues at hand.
[06:19] <unfo> bazhang_: even for crashes?
[06:19] <Flannel> unfo: -bugs isn't really a bug support channel (and its often dead anyway)
[06:20] <bazhang_> unfo, if it is for some esoteric wine thing or alsa/compiz, but -bugs folks will likely not like it
[06:21] <unfo> bazhang_:  this is for an evolution crash.  even then?
[06:21] <Flannel> unfo: If they have what you think is a bug, try searching launchpad (with them), see if they come up with anything, suggest reporting a bug, etc (they may need help reporting it)
[06:22] <unfo> Flannel:  that is very hard to do in a channel as crowded as #ubuntu.  :)
[06:22] <Flannel> Even if the bug report doesn't have all the right info (because you don't know what info may be needed), that'll be asked for when its triaged
[06:22] <Flannel> unfo: it's not really no.  I do it all the time.
[06:22] <Flannel> unfo: If you, or the person you are talking to, is having trouble keeping up, you can sidebar in #ubuntu-classroom (assuming its not being used)
[06:22] <Flannel> Its a nice low-noise room if the person reads slowly, etc.
[06:23] <unfo> Flannel:  I will try doing that.
[06:24] <bazhang_> unfo, if people want to PM, it really not your affair.
[06:24] <Flannel> unfo: I think that about covers it.  Also, if someone gets on your case in the future, feel free to bring it to our attention here (and there's no good that comes from arguing with the person).  We try and nip these things in the bud.
[06:24] <unfo> bazhang_:  isn't PM'ing heavily discouraged?
[06:24] <Flannel> We'd prefer (and you'll prefer) keeping it in the channel.
[06:25] <unfo> Flannel:  I will keep that in mind too.
[06:25] <bazhang_> unfo, if two people (after asking) wish to converse via PM then it is fine.
[06:25] <unfo> Thanks for all the suggestions.
[06:25] <unfo> bazhang_: ah.
[06:26] <unfo> shall I go now, or hang around here a few minutes more in case you have anything more to say to me?
[06:26] <Flannel> unfo: That about covers it.  Thank you for the support you do, but remember, quality over quantity ;)
[06:26] <unfo> ok.  :)
[06:27] <bazhang_> wish someone who had rights was around in -ot for Paddy_Eire
[06:35] <Flannel> sometimes I wish someone would nuke it from orbit
[06:35] <bazhang_> hehe
[06:35] <bazhang_> it has become like a low-grade version of the movie Stepbrothers
[06:38] <bazhang_> @login
[06:38] <bazhang> @login
[06:38] <bazhang> @mark virmin #ubuntu repeated offtopic and spam
[06:55] <Flannel> unfo: How can we help you?
[06:55] <unfo> i invited fryguy here.
[06:56] <Flannel> unfo: For what?
[06:56] <bazhang> unfo, there is no #ubuntu+1 (at least not for support purposes)
[06:56] <bazhang> unfo, intrepid support in #ubuntu
[06:56] <unfo> Flannel: regarding a PM.
[06:56] <unfo> bazhang: yes.
[06:56] <Flannel> unfo: He said something to you in a query? or what?
[06:57] <unfo> Flannel: yes
[06:57] <Flannel> unfo: What'd he say?
[06:57] <mindrape> be with you momentarily...
[06:57] <mindrape> got a few /msg's do state your beef and I'll get to it eventually.
[07:02] <bazhang> mindrape, stop with the offtopic in #ubuntu please
[07:02] <mindrape> bazhang: what off topic?  I'm helping people out and asking unfo to stop insulting and confusing people.
[07:02] <mindrape> [00:04] <giacomo_> hello mindrape
[07:02] <mindrape> [00:04] <mindrape> hey, how goes it?
[07:02] <mindrape> [00:04] <mindrape> so explain your problem and I'll see what I can do.
[07:02] <mindrape> [00:04] <giacomo_> I dunno, but I'm happy that somebody is listening to me :-)
[07:02] <mindrape> people feel insulted by him.
[07:03] <mindrape> his comments and constant harassment is not welcome
 giacomo_: if you'd like help /msg me... unfo will just confuse you and lead you down random paths of google links he finds that he thinks are relevant
[07:03] <mindrape> and it pisses off newcomers
[07:03] <bazhang> I wont ask again.
[07:03] <Flannel> mindrape: Alright, few things.  We don't need pastes here.  Second, I asked you here (this time) for something about *you* not about anyone else.
[07:04] <mindrape> well ask away
[07:04] <mindrape> what is it about me you would like to know?
[07:04] <mindrape> keep in mind I'm trying to help 4 people right now from #ubuntu and about 12 from #php so you are distracting people from getting answers...
[07:04] <mindrape> but fire away...
[07:04] <Flannel> mindrape: If you have an issue with someone in an Ubuntu channel, bring it to our attention.  Don't accuse them of being a troll, don't badger them back and forth.  Let the ops sort it out.
[07:05] <mindrape> bazhang was aware.
[07:05] <Flannel> mindrape: If you'd like, I can get rid of a quarter of your distractions.
[07:05] <mindrape> bazhang told us to go to -offtopic
[07:05] <mindrape> then he showed up there and told us to come here
[07:05] <mindrape> blame bazhang for not knowing how to escalate.
[07:05] <Flannel> mindrape: It shouldn't have ever been in #ubuntu in the first place.
[07:05] <mindrape> Flannel - like I've said.  I'm here to help.  If you want to ban me from #ubuntu that is your perogative.
[07:05] <mindrape> unfo shouldnt have?  I agree.
[07:06] <Flannel> mindrape: Just follow the code of conduct, and the IRC guidelines.  I can give you links to them if you'd like.
[07:06] <mindrape> Flannel - tell it to unfo.
[07:06] <Flannel> mindrape: No, you shouldn't have ever gotten started calling people trolls or telling other people to ignore them or whatever.
[07:06] <mindrape> he is the one w the issue.
[07:06] <mindrape> read the logs
[07:06] <mindrape> if you cant figure it out I dont know what to tell you
[07:06] <mindrape> he is a troll.
[07:06] <mindrape> I cant call a troll a troll?
[07:06] <Flannel> mindrape: that's not for you to decide.  And no, you can't.
[07:07] <mindrape> why not?
[07:07] <Flannel> And you can't bait a troll either, or harass them.
[07:07] <mindrape> if a person is truly trolling I have to walk on glass?
[07:07] <mindrape> I asked him repeatedly to stop.
[07:07] <mindrape> he continued.
[07:07] <mindrape> I never trolled
[07:07] <Flannel> mindrape: Just leave them alone, and let us know.
[07:07] <mindrape> [00:09] <mmap> haha, mindrape is a fag          <--- and that is allowed in #ubuntu?
[07:07] <mindrape> but I cant call a guy a troll?
[07:08] <mindrape> laugh
[07:08] <mindrape> hypocrisy at its best.
[07:08] <Flannel> mindrape: No, its not.  Which is why he's removed.
[07:08] <mindrape> anyhow... /msgs to respond to
[07:08] <Flannel> mindrape: We prefer you to keep your support in the channel.
[07:08] <Flannel> giacomo_: How can we help you today?
[07:09] <Flannel> mindrape: #ubuntu isn't a place for vigilante justice.  Let the operators know about issues, and we'll handle them.
[07:09] <giacomo_> Flannel, no no I'm just visiting how #ubuntu community is working from the top :-) you're going great, see you
[07:09] <Flannel> giacomo_: We ask people don't visit here, thanks.
[07:10] <giacomo_> Ups I didn't know, ciao
[07:12] <Flannel> mindrape: Do you understand?  disagree?  whats the story?
[07:12] <mindrape> helping people... got 5 msgs now... hold.
[07:12] <Flannel> mindrape: Again, don't do Ubuntu support in queries, please keep it in the channel.
[07:13] <mindrape> Flannel - I am getting them away from unfo...
[07:13] <mindrape> he distracts them.
[07:13] <Flannel> mindrape: Keep them in the channel.
[07:13] <mindrape> and then they dont follow up when I ask them to run commands and give me results / ouput
[07:14] <Flannel> mindrape: Let us worry about any other disturbances
[07:14] <Flannel> (you properly notify us, of course)
[07:20] <Flannel> mindrape: Do you 
[07:20] <Flannel> agree, disagree, etc?
[07:20] <mindrape> agree.
[07:20] <mindrape> busy.
[07:21] <Flannel> mindrape: So, we shouldn't have any issues in the future then?  And you'll keep your support in the channel?
[07:26] <Flannel> mindrape: Care to participate?
[07:27] <mindrape> yes
[07:27] <mindrape> leaving now... too many windows.
[07:27] <Flannel> good grief.
[07:28] <bazhang> @mark unfo mindrape #ubuntu badgering
[07:29] <Flannel> well, that took an hour longer than I had hoped
[07:29] <bazhang> it must be reaaally late there
[07:44] <bazhang> @bansearch mindrape
[08:00] <Flannel> frybye != fryguy
[08:00] <Myrtti> noted
[08:00] <Myrtti> MOIN
[08:00] <bazhang> yeah I saw that and had the exact same reaction
[08:01] <Flannel> Howdy Myrtti
[08:01] <bazhang> morning Myrtti 
[09:19] <Myrtti> going down in 6 minutes
[09:21] <christel> !
[09:36] <persia> Could someone point me at the best way to request Ubuntu IRC Team support for a new channel?
[09:41] <elkbuntu> this is a good start.
[09:42] <elkbuntu> emailing ubuntu-irc@lists.ubuntu.com is probably also a good idea.
[09:42] <elkbuntu> what is the new channel?
[09:42] <persia> #ubuntu-arm
[09:43] <persia> I'm looking at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcTeam/CreatingChannels now, but I want to make sure that the IRC Team has approrpaite access control and stuff.
[09:45] <persia> Should I be registering it directly, or should the channel owner be someone on the IRC team?
[09:45] <elkbuntu> it can be transferred at a later date
[09:45] <elkbuntu> the main thing is getting it up and protected
[09:46] <persia> OK.  So best would be to just set it up, and then ask for it to be coordinated by the IRC team by sending a mail?
[09:46] <elkbuntu> yep
[09:46] <persia> OK.  Thanks.
[09:46] <elkbuntu> set changuard on asap, for instance.
[09:47] <Hobbsee> which is fortunately documented in that link
[09:47] <persia> And what's the best way to get ubuntulog and ubottu to join?
[09:47] <elkbuntu> persia, ubuntulog is harrassing the sysadmins, ubottu is probably going to be ubot3
[09:48] <persia> ubot3 works fine.
[09:48] <ubot3> Factoid works fine. not found
[09:48] <elkbuntu> nalioth, has ubot3 the ability to take another small chan?
[09:48] <elkbuntu> sure about that? :P
[10:30] <jpds> I could put ubot5 in.
[10:31] <jpds> persia: As for ubuntulog, mail rt@ubuntu.com.
[10:31] <persia> jpds, Thanks.  I'll do that.
[10:34] <jpds> "ubot5 has joined #ubuntu-arm"
[10:35] <Myrtti> breakfast goodness: coffee, bread with piping hot melted cheese, raspberry-muffin ice cream
[10:36] <elkbuntu> right, so if tomorrow goes to plan, i get new phone, and churn to new internet provider.
[10:38] <Hobbsee> woot!
[10:38] <Hobbsee> to what?
[10:40] <persia> Is this a real internet provider, or still part of the mess that is Telstra?
[10:46] <elkbuntu> internode
[10:46] <elkbuntu> the one true provider.
[10:46] <elkbuntu> as in, check the SFD sponsors list.
[10:47] <elkbuntu> ok, why did i say sfd?
[10:47] <ikonia> what a cool named "intranode"
[10:47]  * elkbuntu headdesks
[10:47] <persia> I seem to remember them being especially good, although I've not been in the market for an Australian ISP for the past few years.
[10:47] <elkbuntu> i meant linux.conf.au
[10:48] <elkbuntu> did you used to live here?
[10:48] <Hobbsee> ahh,internode.
[10:48] <ikonia> is anyone running  uvirtbot in #ubuntu-server
[10:48] <elkbuntu> internode costs more than the cheapest, but not as much as telstra, and they have a conscience.
[10:48] <jpds> ikonia: I believe that's soren's bot.
[10:49] <elkbuntu> and, when you ring and say the word linux, the support tech doesnt respond in a hushed whisper.
[10:49] <ikonia> jpds: so I assume thats cool then
[10:49] <persia> elkbuntu, I used manage networks for multinationals in Asia-Pacific.  I don't any more, mostly so I can sleep once in a while.
[10:50] <elkbuntu> persia, we were all young and stupid, some just stupider than others, i guess :P
[10:50] <persia> Indeed :)
[10:51] <jpds> ikonia: 'Tis on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBots so I guess it is.
[10:52] <ikonia> well spotted
[10:55]  * elkbuntu goes off to play ppracer for a while
[11:08] <Myrtti> oh for gods sake
[11:08] <Myrtti> elkbuntu: http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultamatix
[11:08] <Myrtti> this is just excellent
[11:15] <ikonia> who is actually developing it now ?
[11:17] <ikonia> 7http://forumubuntusoftware.info/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1365&sid=6c9152e4d079a05f63853c57f3094f36 ...honestly
[11:22] <Myrtti> http://forumubuntusoftware.info/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1365&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=100#p20287
[11:22] <Myrtti> ;____;
[11:22] <Myrtti> that makes baby elephants cry
[11:23] <ikonia> that product makes me cry
[11:27] <Myrtti> oh, the pain
[11:29] <Myrtti> THE PAIN.
[11:31] <elkbuntu> Myrtti, the regular english version just needs translation to simple
[11:31] <Myrtti> yup
[11:32] <elkbuntu> fr too
[11:32] <elkbuntu> es too
[11:55] <ikonia> another netspliy - freenode is having a hard time at the moment
[12:00] <ikonia> @bansearch ef_cod
[12:00] <ikonia> @btlogin
[12:18] <Myrtti> I don't need a new phone I don't need a new phone I don't need a new phone I don't need a new phone
[12:19]  * ikonia has a new phone
[12:19]  * ikonia flashes it at elk
[12:20] <Myrtti> I don't need a new phone I don't need a new phone I don't need a new phone...
[12:20] <ikonia> Myrtti: which one are you craving
[12:20] <Myrtti> http://www.nokia.com/A4136001?newsid=1268601
[12:20] <Myrtti> it's not as good as N95, but...
[12:20] <Myrtti> meh.
[12:21] <Myrtti> "The Nokia E63 is expected to begin shipping in the coming weeks for an estimated retail price of EUR 199, before taxes and subsidies."
[12:21] <ikonia> quite similar to mine
[12:21] <ikonia> I've just got eh E71
[12:21] <Myrtti> OH SHUTUP
[12:21] <Myrtti> >___<
[12:21] <ikonia> that looks ok though
[12:21] <ikonia> pink too
[12:21] <Myrtti> http://blog.wired.com/gadgets/2008/07/review-nokia-e7.html
[12:22] <Dave2> Myrtti: I'll do a swap with you, then you WILL need a new phone. Problem solved.
[12:22] <Myrtti> Dave2: I can give you my 6021
[12:24] <Dave2> Myrtti: OK, even my phone's better than that
[12:24] <Myrtti> hey, don't mock up 6021
[12:24] <Myrtti> it's trusty s40 phone with bluetooth
[12:25]  * Dave2 has a somewhat battered 6230
[12:25] <Myrtti> 6233 was full of awesome goodness
[12:26] <Dave2> 6230's screen is too low-res for microFB 2 :(
[12:27] <Daviey> Ive heard of battered Cod, even battered Mars bars - but never a mobile.
[12:27] <Myrtti> Daviey: I dropped my 6233 three storeys down in a staircase. It was a bit dented afterwards.
[12:28] <Daviey> ohdear
[12:29] <Myrtti> worked fine though after I had the power button welded back to the circuitboard at the phone dealership for 16€
[12:29] <Myrtti> as I said, 6233 was full of awesome goodness.
[12:29] <Myrtti> If I hadn't had to give up my workphone when I left COSS a year ago, I'd still use it.
[12:30] <Daviey> hang on, i thought you gave me a COSS biz card
[12:30] <Myrtti> s40 goodness meant gammu and gnokii and wammu worked like a charm.
[12:30] <Myrtti> I did give you COSS biz card. I can still carry those, and I represent them in some sense.
[12:30] <Myrtti> I just don't get paid.
[12:31] <ikonia> Myrtti: interesting reviews of the E71 - I'll have to check out some of the features
[12:31] <ikonia> Myrtti to off-set your envy, gnokii is a pain with the E71
[12:31] <Myrtti> ikonia: I know, it's the same pain with N95
[12:31] <ikonia> ah, so not that much of an offset
[12:32] <Myrtti> it's because the gnokii helper app can't be installed to s60v3 phones
[12:32] <ikonia> ahhh
[12:32] <wgrant> You should all get ARM devices so you can run Jaunty on them!
[12:33] <Myrtti> wgrant: I've got 770 already, but IT'S NOT A PHONE
[12:33] <ikonia> wgrant I thought about it on the blackberry I had
[12:39] <Myrtti> ubot3` is in -offtopic, is this on purpose?
[12:39] <ubot3`> In #ubuntu-ops, Myrtti said: ubot3` is in -offtopic, is this on purpose?
[12:40] <Pici> echo echo
[12:41] <PriceChild> Yes?
[12:41] <Myrtti> PriceChild: but it also answers in there...
[12:41] <Dave2> Daviey: it was battered before I went to Scotland, too.
[12:41] <Dave2> Mmm... deep-fried battered pizza...
[12:48] <Myrtti> [14:48] < Sinnerman> !hate | gord
[12:48] <Myrtti> [14:48] < ubottu> gord: hate is a thing we don't encourage - why waste your energy
[12:48] <Myrtti> [14:48] < ubot3`> gord: hate is a thing we don't encourage - why waste your energy
[12:49] <Myrtti> I don't want to kick it from the channel
[12:49] <ikonia> mute it? 
[12:49] <Myrtti> did
[12:49] <ikonia> as a compromise
[12:49] <Pici> It is
[12:49] <ikonia> ooh
[12:50] <Pici> But !foo > bar will send 2 copies
[12:50] <Pici> One from each
[12:50] <Myrtti> yup
[12:50] <ubot3`> In #ubuntu-offtopic, Myrtti said: !foo is bar
[12:50] <Pici> I muted it as 'ubot3' the other day, but forgot about the privsmgs
[12:50] <Myrtti> !foo
[12:51] <Myrtti> ubot3`: foo
[12:51] <ubot3`> bar
[12:51] <Pici> Myrtti: its nalioth's bot, lets wait for him to do his magic
[12:51] <Myrtti> nalioth: plz could you have a look?
[12:51] <Myrtti> Pici: was just typing that :-P
[12:51] <Myrtti> magic
[12:52] <Myrtti> great minds...
[12:52] <Pici> :)
[13:04] <bazhang> argh
[13:04] <bazhang> a_ seems to be purposely obtuse
[13:05] <bazhang> @bansearch EF_Codd
[13:06] <bazhang> that name seems really familiar
 Is $69.99 a good deal for a fully loaded Gutsy Gibbon Ubuntu? It's second hand
[13:07] <LjL> bazhang: that was when?
[13:07] <bazhang> just now LjL ; am sure he is trolling
[13:07] <ikonia> he's gone
[13:07] <ikonia> he left before I could deal with him earlier
[13:07] <bazhang> he is there right now
[13:08] <ikonia> tag team
[13:08] <LjL> the logs tell nothing good about him
[13:08] <ikonia> he has another nick
[13:09] <ikonia> I'm searching for it
[13:09] <LjL> well, the very nick he's using right now tells nothing good about him
[13:09] <ikonia> ah
[13:09] <jrib> thanks ikonia
[13:09] <ikonia> jrib: I was going to get him last time with his trolling, but he left before I could
[13:09] <ikonia> don't like doing it retrospectivly
[13:09] <LjL> may i do a plea
[13:10] <ikonia> ?
[13:10] <bazhang> wat
[13:10] <ikonia> as in a "plea" request
[13:10]  * Myrtti gives LjL a lolipop
[13:10] <LjL> we have @mark, do use it when someone misbehaves but not quite enough to make you feel like kicking
[13:10] <jrib> @help mark
[13:10] <ikonia> LjL: done
[13:11] <LjL> ikonia: well in this case, you kicked anyway
[13:11] <ikonia> no - I mean "done deal"
[13:11] <LjL> ok
[13:11] <LjL> actually, how about this
[13:11] <LjL> i'd have the floodbot match for !ot | someone, !attitude | someone, etc
[13:11] <LjL> when they receive enough "bad" factoids, they log a mark entry
[13:12] <jrib> ubottu should just do that
[13:12] <jrib> oh shutup
[13:12] <ikonia> quite good, but we'd have to watch how we'd use it
[13:12] <LjL> jrib: well i don't know the ubottu code, i can do it with the floodbots
[13:13] <LjL> ikonia: of course, but think about this... if one spends the time to look at the bantracker for someone, it means that someone is already suspicious
[13:13] <ikonia> LjL, I agree with what your saying, just have to make sure it's "warrented" better
[13:13] <LjL> ikonia: so if the bt shows automatic marks about them, well there's probably more than a couple of reasons to ring alarm bells
[13:13] <jrib> LjL: right, I like the idea.  It would be better if ubottu had a clear role and the floodbots another, but you have your php fetish :o
[13:13] <LjL> ikonia: it's still just a remark in the bt, not a kick or anything
[13:14] <LjL> jrib, if stdin wants to do this, he's very welcome
[13:14] <ikonia> LjL: no , but be wrong to mark someone wrongly
[13:14] <ikonia> LjL: the principal is sound though
[13:14] <LjL> jrib: also if you want elegance, you can just think in terms that "the floodbots watch out for bad stuff" and "ubottu just gives information", this fits the scheme ;)
[13:15] <jrib> hmm
[13:15] <jrib> yes
[13:15] <LjL> ikonia, if someone gets stuff listed in !etiquette, say, 3 or 4 times, then i feel chances are *very* high they deserve being watched
[13:15] <ikonia> LjL: concur
[13:15] <LjL> ikonia: and anyway the BT logs, so someone would always check the log for what actually happened
[13:15] <ikonia> of course, just saying we'd have to be a little more aware
[13:16] <LjL> ikonia, mind, despite what @help says, it's *not* like a kick. there's a **MARK** added in the comment, one immediately sees it's just a remark
[13:17] <ikonia> yeah, I think mark is good
[13:17] <LjL> also, you'd see "floodbot1" as the fellow doing it - easily distinguishable from an actual op action
[13:23] <Pici> !clone
[13:23] <Pici> !botclone
[13:23] <Pici> Er, I knew that.
[13:24] <LjL> Pici: you sound like my father...
 <answer> "i knew that already"
[13:35] <stdin> it's very difficult in supybot to get plugins to interact, it'll probably break more than it fixed
[13:56] <LjL> stdin: ok, i'll do it with the floodbots, there's just one thing i need for that, the floodbots need to be able to login
[13:59] <ikonia> LjL: I've been thinking about your !offtopic idea, and I see a potential flaw
[13:59] <LjL> ikonia: do tell
[14:00] <bazhang> I do too
[14:00] <bazhang> I tend not to use the !trigger
[14:00] <ikonia> LjL: normally if someone is offtopic about 5 people do !offtopic | user the only way I can see dealing with this is how ubottu flooding the channel when 5 people do !trigger
[14:00] <bazhang> but just ask them to /j #ubuntu--offtopic
[14:00] <ikonia> LjL: that would = 5 offtopics against 1 guy straight away 
[14:00] <LjL> bazhang: well that's not a flaw, just a false negative, no big deal
[14:01] <bazhang> but am using the @mark LjL (starting earlier today)
[14:01] <LjL> ikonia: ok, that's true
[14:01] <bazhang> btw how to search the @mark?
[14:01] <ikonia> LjL: not unfixable, but food for though
[14:01] <bazhang> just bansearch?
[14:01] <LjL> bazhang: like any ban, the complete hostmask gets recorded
[14:01] <bazhang> @bansearch unfo
[14:01] <LjL> ikonia: not unfixable, but a bitch to fix
[14:02] <ikonia> concur
[14:02] <LjL> ikonia: i can only see two ways - one, implement timers and stuff in the floodbots, two, react on ubottu's messages and not on the triggers
[14:02] <LjL> ikonia: of course the latter would be easier, but it involves knowing what the actual factoids *say*, and that can change over time
[14:02] <ikonia> LjL yes, the latter would work, as a persistant person would get misese
[14:03] <ikonia> didn't say it was easy
[14:03] <LjL> unless...
[14:03] <stdin> LjL: seems supybot doesn't set you add users easily
[14:04] <stdin> we'd have to have someone register with the bot, then I set the hostmask
[14:04] <LjL> ikonia: unless, and this is not very elegant, we add some seemingly unimportant character or keyword to "bad" factoids
[14:04] <LjL> stdin: i can most certainly login as a floodbot
[14:04] <ikonia> LjL yes, or !! on the end
[14:04] <ikonia> rather than !
[14:05] <LjL> ikonia: not all of them have ! to begin with, though
[14:05] <ikonia> LjL: just an example
[14:05] <ikonia> a uniquer identifier
[14:05] <LjL> ikonia: for now, i was thinking of adding !offtopic, !attitude, !repeat, !patience, !language and !botabuse
[14:05] <LjL> and !caps
[14:05] <stdin> LjL: it doesn't necessarily have to be the floodbots nick that registers, just someone who the bot doesn't know
[14:05] <ikonia> LjL: those triggers seem reasonable
[14:05] <ikonia> how about o4o
[14:06] <LjL> ikonia: the floodbots are not in -ot...
[14:06] <ikonia> ah
[14:06] <LjL> ikonia: and no, they can't be without very heavy changes to the code
[14:06] <stdin> @config supybot.defaultIgnore False
[14:07] <ikonia> LjL: don't want them in there
[14:07] <bazhang> they would break
[14:08] <LjL> it's not that they would break, it's that they're made to only handle one channel
[14:08] <LjL> the whole code relies on that assumption
[14:08] <LjL> bazhang: do i @register?
[14:08] <bazhang> with all the !triggers in -ot they would surely be stressed though
[14:08] <LjL> sorry, i meant stdin
[14:08] <stdin> /msg ubottu register floodbot <somepass>
[14:09] <FloodBot> done
[14:10] <LjL> ikonia: anyway i already have a short-term timer that i use for "please don't flood", i'll see if i can re-use that one for avoiding multiple triggers
[14:10] <stdin> @config supybot.defaultIgnore True
[14:10] <ikonia> LjL yes, that was the only way I could see of getting around it
[14:10] <stdin> FloodBot: can you see if @whoami works
[14:10] <stdin> oh, @login before that
[14:10] <LjL> ikonia: if not, i can also see using a nonprintable unicode characters that looks like a space in the factoids ;)
[14:11] <LjL> [15:10:56] <FloodBot> @whoami
[14:11] <LjL> [15:10:59] <ubottu> floodbot
[14:11] <stdin> good, the bot knows who you are
[14:12] <stdin> @capability add floodbot bantracker
[14:12] <stdin> @Admin capability add floodbot bantracker
[14:12] <LjL> shall i try a test @mark?
[14:12] <stdin> sure, it should work
[14:12] <FloodBot> @mark #ubuntu-ops FloodBot This is a test
[14:13] <FloodBot> good, thanks
[14:15] <LjL> !testljl is <reply> °
[14:15] <LjL> !testljl
[14:16] <ljl2> !testljl
[14:18] <ljl2> !testljl
[14:18] <ljl2> !test
[14:18] <ljl2> !testljl
[14:19] <LjL> don't like that being treated as an extended char...
[15:27] <genii-around> Good morning, afternoon, or evening
[15:29] <Myrtti> moin
[15:29] <genii-around> Myrtti: Moin :)
[15:36] <genii> Is floodbot on vacation?
[15:41] <genii> I kept waiting in #k for it to kick in but never did
[16:14] <ikonia> whats the name of that pastebin app that you can do cat file | pastebininit or what ever it's called
[16:15] <stdin> pastebinit
[16:15] <stdin> from joining "pastebin" and "it" ;)
[16:16] <ikonia> ahh
[16:16] <ikonia> thankyou
[16:16] <stdin> :)
[16:18] <Nafallo> should be paste innit ;-)
[16:19] <ikonia> anyone seen http://pastebin.com/f1b7ed54c
[16:19] <ikonia> oops
[16:19] <ikonia> anyone seen s 2.6.25-3 kernel on 8.10 ?
[16:20] <stdin> I think that was a version during the alphas
[16:20] <ikonia> really ? I thought it always started with .27 ?
[16:20] <ikonia> even the alphas (I don't know)
[16:20] <jdong> we started with 2.626-1.2
[16:21] <jdong> 2.6.25-3... I have no idea where you'd get it from.
[16:21] <jdong> maybe one of the kernel guys keeps a PPA?
[16:21] <ikonia> this guy's box is a state with it
[16:21] <jdong> I mean, it's in kernel.ubuntu.com's git tree, but I'm not sure where else
[16:21] <ikonia> I'm trying to figure out this guys box now
[16:22] <ikonia> lets look at his sources
[16:24] <ikonia> ahh it's an EE PC
[16:24] <ikonia> EEE
[16:25] <ikonia> doesn't that have some funky distro ?
[16:25] <ikonia> ahh not is't not
[16:25] <stdin> ahh, I was thinking of .26-5 not .25
[16:25] <ikonia> I just don't know where he has got this stuff from
[16:27] <Pici> jdong: no, I'm pretty sure we started with 2.6.24 in Intrepid, concidering thats what Hardy has.
[16:27] <ikonia> Pici same way 9.04 is on 2.6.24
[16:27] <ikonia> 27 sorry
[16:27] <Pici> Indeed
[16:28] <jdong> Pici: yes but we skipped directly to 26
[16:28] <Pici> ikonia: apt-cache policy <whatever his kernel package is> may give you info
[16:29] <Pici> jdong: Ah, yes. Right.
[16:29] <ikonia> Pici it's more than just the kernel - his box is a mess
[16:29] <ikonia> Pici: just using it as an example
[16:29] <Pici> Ah
[16:29] <jdong> linux (2.6.26-1.1) intrepid; urgency=low
[16:29] <jdong> that was the first one uploaded at Intrepid.
[16:30] <jdong> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux
[16:30] <Pici> Yah yah
[16:30] <jdong> 2.6.24-16.30 -> 2.6.26-1.1
[16:34] <Pici> Ubuntu powers activate!
[16:34] <ikonia> Pici it's morphi time
[16:34] <ikonia> morphin
[16:41] <Pici> I give up
[16:41] <Pici> I'm going to lunch, sorry ikonia 
[16:41] <ikonia> ha ha
[16:54] <Myrtti> *sigh*
[16:55]  * genii sips
[18:40]  * Pici scratches his head at cw-brad 
[18:40] <ikonia> @btlogin
[18:42] <ikonia> he's still got active bans in +1 and -offtopic
[18:46] <Pici> ikonia: Did you see the wiki page he mentioned?
[18:47] <ikonia> no
[18:47] <Pici> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/CustomizationFromScratch
[18:47] <ikonia> I'm lagging on a train so I missed he odd line
[18:48] <ikonia> I'm not sure that will work
[18:48] <ikonia> it looks to be based on the LFS chroot method but random
[18:49] <ikonia> it also seems a pointless thing to do ?
[18:49] <ikonia> or am I missing the point 
[18:49] <Pici> No, it seems pointless to me as well.
[18:49] <jdong> Pici: looking at it.... I can't say anything is HARMFUL
[18:50] <jdong> Pici: but it's utterly pointless
[18:50] <jdong> in fact it does exactly what debian-installer does to begin with
[18:50] <jdong> I guess some people like to get their hands involved a bit more than others.
[18:50] <jdong> err wait that didn't sound right
[18:50] <jdong> some people like to do things manually....
[18:50] <jdong> forget it.
[18:50] <ikonia> jdong: the grub install is dangerous
[18:50] <Pici> I would think that if you wanted to try to do something like this, that you'd do it yoruself, without a how-to.
[18:51] <jdong> ikonia: heh it does overwrite system grub with that, and the menu.lst example is wrong.
[18:51] <ikonia> jdong: exactly
[18:51] <jdong> but I *HOPE* people who follow howtos like this understand enough of what they're doing to see that.
[18:51] <ikonia> jdong: give it to a new user and tell them it's "l33t" and watch them blat the system
[18:52] <Pici> And now someone is asking me in a privmsg if theres a warez channel on freenode.
[18:52] <ikonia> I'm not sure the uid's will be ok
[18:52] <jdong> ikonia: sadly you're probably right
[18:53] <LjL> Pici: cw-brad told me yesterday in a PM that he had written a wiki page. he asked me if that would make him unban him.
[18:53] <LjL> when i said no, he asked whether $20 in a paypal account to me would.
[18:53] <ikonia> that could cause an issue as he doesn't setup the admin group for the user, or the correct uid and gid's for an ubuntu system
[18:53] <ikonia> I've got a bit of an issue with this page in that it's wrong, and pointless
[18:54] <jdong> mostly pointless
[18:54] <ikonia> quite wrong though too
[18:54] <jdong> and there is no /boot/vmlinuz symlink with stock Ubuntu kernels.
[18:54] <Pici> LjL: Hes asking for help with the wiki in #ubuntu
[18:54] <jdong> and why the hell do you install casper and laptop-detect from a minimalist from-scratch config?
[18:54] <Pici> LjL: I havent said anything yet.
[18:54] <jdong> jeez just run the freaking alternate installer
[18:54] <ikonia> Pici I'll put a big warning on the top
[18:57] <LjL> genii, what were you saying about the floodbots and #k? the floodbots aren't in there...
[18:59] <genii> LjL: I thought the floodbots were in #ubuntu and #kubuntu both. A user earlier pasted his result of lshw and eventually the built-in channel flood controls got it
[18:59] <Pici> There are no built-in channel flood controls
[18:59] <LjL> was about to say
[18:59] <ikonia> warning on
[18:59] <LjL> genii, anyway no, the floodbots have never been in #k
[19:00] <genii> LjL: OK. Can we get one ? ;)
[19:00] <LjL> yes
[19:00] <LjL> but do keep in mind that a lot of the conversation that usually goes on in #k is *very* enter-intensive
[19:00] <LjL> so that would likely piss off a few people
[19:00] <genii> Hm
[19:00] <Pici> KDE users abuse the enter key
[19:01] <LjL> Pici, no, KDE users simply aren't crammed in a channel with 1500 other people
[19:02] <genii> LjL: I'm not sure how other #kubuntu ops might feel about floodbot, maybe a poll/vote first
[19:02] <LjL> i've had that request at least once before.
[19:03] <LjL> initially though, everyone agreed that they weren't necessary there
[19:03] <genii> Mostly not. But you do get the occasion  lshw dump or so :)
[19:05] <LjL> ikonia: do you think 15 seconds is a reasonable timeout for ignoring duplicate warnings-via-factoids?
[19:06] <ikonia> yup
[19:06] <ikonia> not a bad starting point
[19:09] <nalioth> i don't think there is a need for the floodbot fleet in #kubuntu 
[19:09] <LjL> nalioth: not the fleet, i'd use just one bot and disable +J
[19:12] <genii> nalioth: I'm not so sure either. It's only occasionally that the flooding gets out of control and almost always just a user that didn't know better
[19:13] <nalioth> genii: #kubuntu doesn't have near the population density of #ubuntu, so a lot of the mechanisms in #ubuntu are not necessary there
[19:14] <genii> For some reason though I thought the floodbots were pretty standard
[19:14]  * LjL chuckles
[19:15] <LjL> if there's anything in the world that isn't standard
[19:15] <Pici> genii: Have you ever seen an IRC bot written in php?
[19:15] <LjL> Pici: have you ever seen an operator permbanned from his channel?
[19:16] <Pici> LjL: A few times
[19:16] <LjL> right.
[19:17] <genii> As nalioth knows I'm not feeling great. So please excuse non-responsiveness, I'm just going listen for the computer beep if my name is flagged
[19:17] <Pici> Sorry, feel better.
[19:17] <genii> Thanks
[19:23] <PriceChild> Myrtti: i wouldn't think that's used too much, and would rather keep them both in so that someone with +o can unmute ubot3 even if they haven't access to make it join
[19:24] <nalioth> huh?
[19:24] <nalioth> did i miss something?
[19:24] <Myrtti> I don't like it being there
[19:25] <Pici> nalioth: ubot3` i #ubuntu-offtopic
[19:26] <nalioth> the netsplits are screwing up that little bot's brain
[19:26] <ikonia> been quite a few splits of late
[19:33] <nalioth> ya'll can kick ubot3 out of -offtopic when / if it finds it's way in any more
[20:07] <LjL> PriceChild, problem with that is that it makes tab completion irritating ;)
[20:09] <PriceChild> okies
[20:12] <PriceChild> Myrtti: just noticed my n95 8gb's software is about a year out of date.. :/
[21:48] <Myrtti> PriceChild: :-(
[21:49] <Myrtti> I was bored, so I reinstalled xubuntu.
[21:49] <Myrtti> I need a life.
[21:50] <Myrtti> QUICK
[21:51] <jdong> Myrtti: don't worry, that's nothing compared to what I just did out of boredom.
[21:52] <jdong> I took two dirty hip-hop song lyrics, put them in one textfile, then ran dissociated-press on them.
[21:52] <jdong> it ended up generating even more disturbing lyrics.
[21:59] <PriceChild> Not that we've used them much at all recently, but I was thinking it'd be more sense for council to be +* in whatever channels, and only ubuntuirccouncil +F, what with new council person soon and all.
[22:22] <PriceChild> well, +*-VO (and the above because of a 4 person +F limit)
[22:36] <mneptok> hrm. there's a vacant council seat?
[22:36] <mneptok> Dennis'?
[22:36] <mneptok> or what did i miss?
[22:36] <Myrtti> mneptok: yeah
[22:36] <Myrtti> can I ask a stupid question about Linux?
[22:37] <Myrtti> no, hold on
[22:37] <mneptok> the suspense!
[22:38] <Myrtti> I'm trying to figure out to which of my encrypted partitions I'm going to save the encryption keyfiles for the other two
[22:38]  * Myrtti tries to think very very very hard
[22:39] <Flannel> you could save half of each of them to the other two!
[22:40] <Myrtti> http://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/LUKS_Encrypted_Root#Exit_Install
[22:40] <Myrtti> my... brain... hurts
[22:40] <Myrtti> ow.
[22:43] <Myrtti> ow ow.
[22:43]  * Myrtti gives up
[22:45] <Myrtti> someone should write a version that would cover how to do that with ubuntu after you've installed your system using alternate disks thingie
[22:45] <Myrtti> and - it's not going to be me, because I DON'T UNDERSTAND THAT WIKI PAGE
[22:46] <Myrtti> :-<
[22:47] <Flannel> Myrtti: you mean the private homedir thing? or no?
[22:47] <Myrtti> no
[22:47] <Pici> Myrtti: I'm not too familiar with whole disk encryption, but does this help at all: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EncryptedFilesystemOnIntrepid ?
[22:48] <Myrtti> I've installed my whole system encrypted, I find it hilarious the install process asks me if I want an encrypted directory in my /home
[22:48]  * Myrtti checks the link
[22:48] <Flannel> Myrtti: No, it'd make sense.
[22:48] <Pici> Theres a whole bunch of stuff here: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EncryptedFilesystems
[22:49] <Flannel> Myrtti: The "whole OS" encryption is to prevent non-auth users from booting.  The encrypted home is to prevent that, as well as other authorized users.
[22:50] <Myrtti> Flannel: it's my laptop. I don't give my laptop to anyone else, I don't do other users than myself. But yes, I see your point.