| fta_ | yep | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| === fta_ is now known as fta | ||
| mconnor | nspr_flags_by_pkg_config_hack | 00:00 |
| mconnor | is there an upstream bug, or a better explanation of what that's trying to fix? | 00:00 |
| fta | mconnor, it is needed because our tarball for firefox 3.0 is not full, it doesn't have nspr sources | 00:03 |
| mconnor | you guys and your wacky tarball | 00:03 |
| fta | mconnor, the goal is to have less bits to upload, it's 10M vs 40M for the full one | 00:06 |
| mconnor | what all do you take out? | 00:06 |
| mconnor | that seems like you're tossing a lot of code out of the tarball | 00:07 |
| fta | hold on | 00:07 |
| mconnor | I wish you could just point at the mozilla tarball + your patches... seems like it'd be saner than anything | 00:07 |
| mconnor | oh, yeah, are you guys pulling the know your rights patch in 3.0.5? | 00:08 |
| fta | http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/mozilla-devscripts/mozilla-devscripts/annotate/head:/src/mozclient/patches/xulbrowser_target.patch | 00:11 |
| fta | i guess, with 3.0.5, our know-your-rights patch will conflict so it will probably go away | 00:12 |
| mconnor | oh, right, because you build the app package separate from the xulrunner package | 00:12 |
| mconnor | it'll definitely conflict :) | 00:12 |
| mconnor | hmm | 00:14 |
| mconnor | the don't depend on NSPR sources, couldn't you copy that file from the nspr location when building the source tarball? | 00:15 |
| mconnor | I'm mildly worried about us making changes to the original that you don't pick up | 00:16 |
| fta | everything is possible | 00:17 |
| mconnor | yeah | 00:17 |
| mconnor | I know | 00:17 |
| mconnor | I'm just treating this like I treat code reviews | 00:18 |
| mconnor | if there's a potential for stuff to go wrong, it will almost certainly go wrong | 00:18 |
| fta | the point here is that when system nspr is requested, configure should not depend on the in-source version of nspr-config, even if it's in the tree, it may have diverged from the real system libs/headers | 00:18 |
| mconnor | fta: the patch means that configure depends on a specific version of make-system-wrappers.pl from the time of patch creation | 00:34 |
| mconnor | I'm not sure how that's better | 00:34 |
| mconnor | mmm | 00:44 |
| mconnor | fta: what are the jemalloc patches doing? | 00:56 |
| fta | are they still applied ? | 00:58 |
| mconnor | oh, I missed that they're commented out of the series patch | 01:00 |
| mconnor | ok! | 01:00 |
| mconnor | s/series patch/series file/ | 01:00 |
| fta | i should clean that up | 01:01 |
| mconnor | bz436133_att322801.patch should be replaced with the patch that landed on 3.1 :P | 01:01 |
| mconnor | man, this default prefs patch is weird | 01:58 |
| mconnor | uh. | 05:52 |
| mconnor | fta / asac : I am confused by how/if part of one of these patches works... | 05:55 |
| mconnor | oh, nm | 05:57 |
| mconnor | man I hate this code | 05:57 |
| asac | mconnor: ok i am back from leave. | 09:57 |
| asac | mconnor: have to catch up on mail and stuff and then will focus on getting the patches upstreamed to bugs | 09:59 |
| === fta_ is now known as fta | ||
| asac | fta: wanna take a look at one or two extensions from gnomefreak ;) | 10:51 |
| asac | i think he asked for a merge of firegpg | 10:51 |
| asac | and has two more new packages in pipeline | 10:51 |
| asac | @time | 14:38 |
| ubottu | Current time in Etc/UTC: November 24 2008, 14:38:22 - Next meeting: Server Team in 1 day | 14:38 |
| asac | @time central | 14:39 |
| ubottu | Current time in Canada/Central: November 24 2008, 08:39:01 - Next meeting: Server Team in 1 day | 14:39 |
| asac | @time US/central | 14:39 |
| ubottu | Current time in US/Central: November 24 2008, 08:39:08 - Next meeting: Server Team in 1 day | 14:39 |
| asac | @time | 14:59 |
| ubottu | Current time in Etc/UTC: November 24 2008, 14:59:21 - Next meeting: Server Team in 1 day | 14:59 |
| mconnor | asac: http://people.mozilla.com/~mconnor/trademark-review/Ubuntu/Round%201/ | 16:20 |
| mconnor | asac: the "3.0 only" are stuff we have or should upstream | 16:21 |
| mconnor | the "Needs Discssion" we should talk about :) | 16:21 |
| [reed] | mconnor: #16 is wrong on your list | 16:42 |
| [reed] | the prefs are in Firefox's prefs upstream | 16:42 |
| [reed] | not in Toolkit's | 16:43 |
| [reed] | that's the problem | 16:43 |
| fta2 | damn, i can't send emails using my corporate address using thunderbird (or evolution), while i can with mutt. | 16:45 |
| fta2 | smtp+auth with tb and evo, NOK. evo with sendmail, NOK. mutt with sendmail, OK. | 16:46 |
| mconnor | [reed]: mmm, I hate how that's split | 16:53 |
| mconnor | we need that toolkit prefs file | 16:53 |
| [reed] | you just hate XULRunner | 16:54 |
| [reed] | ;) | 16:54 |
| mconnor | I hate that its something everyone's hacking around stuff | 16:55 |
| [reed] | instead of filing upstream? | 16:55 |
| [reed] | I agree with you there | 16:55 |
| mconnor | it made me sad that only like 1/3 of things were filed | 16:55 |
| mconnor | and that you'd been the one to file them :_/ | 16:55 |
| mconnor | I mean, this is like 18 months of not bothering... | 16:56 |
| mconnor | as for 16, well | 16:57 |
| mconnor | does it need its own prefs file? | 16:57 |
| mconnor | because, well | 16:57 |
| [reed] | yeah | 16:57 |
| [reed] | well | 16:57 |
| [reed] | we should split out anything in toolkit to a separate prefs file | 16:57 |
| [reed] | right now, all our apps have to duplicate the same prefs | 16:57 |
| mconnor | I said that, what, four minutes ago? | 16:58 |
| mconnor | why are you repeating my bitching? :P | 16:58 |
| [reed] | I didn't see where you said something like "all our apps have to duplicate the same prefs" | 16:58 |
| mconnor | [reed]: I said we need to do the toolkit prefs file | 17:07 |
| mconnor | and, no, we can just stick stuff in all.js | 17:07 |
| mconnor | that's the current standard | 17:07 |
| [reed] | we do have non-toolkit apps | 17:07 |
| [reed] | they might not appreciate that | 17:08 |
| mconnor | why? | 17:09 |
| mconnor | you think a few dozen prefs in all.js will impact those embeddors? | 17:09 |
| [reed] | I dunno | 17:10 |
| [reed] | maybe? | 17:10 |
| mconnor | it'd be cleaner, but meh | 17:10 |
| [reed] | I'll concede I'm making this up as I go. | 17:10 |
| mconnor | don't do that | 17:10 |
| mconnor | there's been enough of that to date :P | 17:10 |
| [reed] | I blame you. | 17:11 |
| [reed] | anyway | 17:11 |
| [reed] | :) | 17:11 |
| [reed] | so, are you coming to UDS? :P | 17:11 |
| mconnor | don't think so | 17:11 |
| [reed] | sad | 17:12 |
| mconnor | eh | 17:12 |
| mconnor | where's the next one? | 17:12 |
| [reed] | no idea... will be announced on Friday of this one | 17:12 |
| mconnor | ah | 17:12 |
| mconnor | I just don't want to travel any more this year | 17:12 |
| mconnor | my 40k miles of flying was my limit | 17:13 |
| fta2 | you're not local ? | 17:13 |
| [reed] | hey, I've done 25k this year, not including this upcoming trip | 17:13 |
| [reed] | :) | 17:13 |
| [reed] | Thanks Mozilla and Canonical for footing my travel bills! :) | 17:14 |
| [reed] | fta2: he's Toronto-based | 17:14 |
| fta2 | oh | 17:14 |
| [reed] | all the Mikes save one are Toronto-based | 17:14 |
| [reed] | I don't think we have any Mikes in MV now | 17:15 |
| mconnor | mmm | 17:15 |
| mconnor | Mikael Rogers? | 17:15 |
| [reed] | oh, true | 17:15 |
| [reed] | but he doesn't go by Mike, afaik | 17:15 |
| [reed] | could be wrong | 17:15 |
| * fta2 is throwing thunderbird 3 and evolution through the window | 17:15 | |
| mconnor | 3? | 17:16 |
| mconnor | bold | 17:16 |
| fta2 | 3 & 2, all the same | 17:16 |
| [reed] | [10:45:33AM] <fta2> damn, i can't send emails using my corporate address using thunderbird (or evolution), while i can with mutt. | 17:16 |
| [reed] | [10:46:54AM] <fta2> smtp+auth with tb and evo, NOK. evo with sendmail, NOK. mutt with sendmail, OK. | 17:16 |
| fta2 | out | 17:16 |
| [reed] | France Telecom doesn't like open source. | 17:16 |
| [reed] | ;) | 17:16 |
| mconnor | [reed]: why'd you repaste that? | 17:16 |
| mconnor | I was just noting that trusting your mail to Tb3 is bold :) | 17:17 |
| [reed] | ah | 17:17 |
| [reed] | ok | 17:17 |
| fta2 | i trust ff3.1 for the web | 17:17 |
| mconnor | yeah, but that's different | 17:17 |
| mconnor | if I nuke my mail, I can't do my job really | 17:18 |
| fta2 | all the same to me. and i have logs, backups and even copies of my corporate emails. | 17:20 |
| fta2 | i'm going back to mutt for now | 17:21 |
| fta2 | now i remember why i've been using it exclusively since 1996 | 17:21 |
| mconnor | hehe | 17:22 |
| [reed] | I personally use Sylpheed, as I'm dependent on a GUI-based mail client for some reason... though, Sylpheed is about the only thing that can handle my mail | 17:22 |
| [reed] | Thunderbird fails miserably | 17:22 |
| [reed] | considering the amount of e-mail I get faily | 17:23 |
| [reed] | daily | 17:23 |
| mconnor | isn't your quantity of mail faily regardless of your mail client? ;) | 17:27 |
| fta2 | 99.5% of my incoming emails are spam. thanks to greylist/spamd/spamassassin/clamav, i'm just getting ~5% of spam at the end, 5% of 200~300 emails a day, 2/3 of mailing lists & bug tickets. procmail sorts those out, mutt can easily manage the rest. | 17:28 |
| fta2 | asac, the new cairo is in. the next upload of xul will fail to build miserably | 17:30 |
| fta2 | assuming 3.0 has the same problem as 3.1 | 17:31 |
| === stevel_ is now known as stevel | ||
| huayra | hi | 18:59 |
| huayra | asac | 18:59 |
| huayra | as I was saying | 18:59 |
| asac | hi huayra | 18:59 |
| huayra | I am interested in getting the swahili translation for ff3 going | 18:59 |
| huayra | I got resources and time for this | 18:59 |
| huayra | resources as in company backing | 18:59 |
| huayra | and I have a friend who is going to work with me on this | 19:00 |
| asac | oh cool | 19:00 |
| huayra | my question is if it is better to use rosetta or to go the l10n patrh? | 19:00 |
| asac | is there an official team for that language somewhere? | 19:00 |
| huayra | there is one, but they have not done anything since 1.0.3 | 19:00 |
| huayra | at least nothing is been released | 19:00 |
| huayra | a mozilla team | 19:00 |
| asac | huayra: have you tried to talk to them? | 19:01 |
| huayra | I have contact with the lead, yes, but it seems to be lots of fractions in that team and nothing constructive coming out | 19:01 |
| huayra | https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=300754 | 19:01 |
| ubottu | Mozilla bug 300754 in Registration & Management "[sw-TZ] Kiswahili Firefox localization (Kilinux Team)" [Normal,Assigned] | 19:01 |
| asac | huayra: if the team is somewhat active, it doesnt make much sense to use rosetta. unless the current team would be willing to do that | 19:02 |
| asac | huayra: how do they maintain their translations? | 19:02 |
| mconnor | huayra: you should email l10n@mozilla.com and sethb@mozilla.com for help getting things unbusted, IMO | 19:02 |
| huayra | basically no release has been done since 1.0.3 | 19:02 |
| asac | do they have an (outdated) repository or something? | 19:02 |
| huayra | that's ages ago | 19:02 |
| huayra | yeah, I have a link, let me find it | 19:03 |
| asac | huayra: do what mconnor said. once you know that you can take over the lead you can choose the tool you use to edit the stuff | 19:03 |
| mconnor | there's a number of good translation tools for Mozilla | 19:03 |
| asac | i think a requirement is to have a complete translation | 19:03 |
| mconnor | yes, that is a requirement for being shipped as official, for obvious reasons | 19:04 |
| huayra | what should we use if we want the ubuntu community to contribute but also make upstream happy? | 19:04 |
| asac | huayra: rosetta as a tool would helpful if you want to tap the ubuntu translator community | 19:04 |
| asac | which sounds reasonable if the language is not a "major" one (excuse this word ;)) | 19:04 |
| mconnor | mmm | 19:05 |
| mconnor | I don't know why you'd translate for Ubuntu only | 19:05 |
| asac | mconnor: well | 19:05 |
| huayra | but, if we want to make anyone happy and probably find a "framework" for such *minor* languages | 19:05 |
| huayra | ? | 19:05 |
| asac | mconnor: we have lots of translators | 19:05 |
| asac | mconnor: they all use rosetta. so if you put things in there it gets automatically done ... e.g. you dont need to build your own community | 19:05 |
| mconnor | asac: that's not really an answer to "why translate only for Ubuntu" | 19:06 |
| huayra | I want to translate for everyone, not only Ubuntu, but rosetta (lp translations) has its adventages | 19:06 |
| huayra | so how can we get momentum and make everyone happy? | 19:06 |
| mconnor | huayra: Axel and Seth can help here | 19:06 |
| asac | mconnor: most likely a matter of interest | 19:06 |
| huayra | I want a translated ff3 in all platforms and tap the ubuntu community for its momentum too in the effort | 19:06 |
| asac | mconnor: people just have to focus on something | 19:07 |
| asac | like you focus on firefox | 19:07 |
| mconnor | they're trying in the bug to resolve things, give them a shout, see what they can do | 19:07 |
| huayra | they have been discussing since 2005. I want some real work done | 19:07 |
| huayra | not just talking | 19:07 |
| * mconnor sighs | 19:07 | |
| huayra | I am to use resources so I want results | 19:08 |
| mconnor | yes, because that localization team is being weird | 19:08 |
| mconnor | I'm not asking you to talk to to the existing team | 19:08 |
| huayra | if that means a one man show in rosetta so be it | 19:08 |
| asac | mconnor: the idea is to do translations in rosetta and find a way to get that shoved over to "official" tree | 19:08 |
| huayra | but how can we fix things? | 19:08 |
| mconnor | I'm asking you to ask Seth and Axel for help | 19:08 |
| huayra | we have contact with the team | 19:08 |
| mconnor | because that's their job | 19:08 |
| asac | huayra: yeah. talk to them ... about requirements and stuff | 19:08 |
| huayra | I am just asking you guys that know the real deal to find a solution | 19:08 |
| huayra | ok | 19:09 |
| mconnor | huayra: reading the bug, they've laid everything out | 19:09 |
| huayra | I will then talk to Seth and Axel | 19:09 |
| mconnor | the existing "team" doesn't seem to be doing anything | 19:09 |
| asac | huayra: from rosetta point of view it would be interesting to get input on the exact formatting they require the translations to be done | 19:09 |
| huayra | yeah, I noticed that | 19:09 |
| huayra | they just own the team, but no progress is been done | 19:09 |
| mconnor | so talk to them about restarting with a new team | 19:09 |
| mconnor | they == who? | 19:09 |
| mconnor | Seth and Axel are the l10n drivers for Mozilla, they coordinate l10n across all locales | 19:10 |
| huayra | I was thinking of the team, not of S & A ;) | 19:10 |
| huayra | so in conclusion | 19:10 |
| asac | mconnor: they == Seth + Axel (and mozilla in general) | 19:10 |
| asac | (if you asked for my they ;)) | 19:11 |
| huayra | is it possible to use rosetta and still get a usable translation for the upstream mozilla guys, or not? | 19:11 |
| asac | huayra: it is possible. if there are things that need to be fixed, we will certainly do that | 19:11 |
| huayra | isn't rosetta just handling the PO files anyway? | 19:11 |
| asac | its quite important for us to make things suitable for that | 19:11 |
| asac | huayra: firefox doesnt have po files | 19:12 |
| mconnor | heh | 19:12 |
| huayra | ok | 19:12 |
| huayra | I reckon I will just talk to Axel and Seth and find out | 19:12 |
| mconnor | ok | 19:12 |
| huayra | thank you very much guys | 19:13 |
| asac | huayra: its using xpi ... which is why its a bit more difficult. but rosetta has (beta) support for that. its just that we need more real-life | 19:13 |
| asac | to streamline stuff ;) | 19:13 |
| huayra | so this could be a nice opportunity? | 19:13 |
| asac | huayra: welcome | 19:13 |
| asac | huayra: for sure. | 19:13 |
| huayra | I mean to test the xpi support? | 19:13 |
| asac | huayra: right. | 19:14 |
| mconnor | er | 19:14 |
| huayra | ok, interesting | 19:14 |
| mconnor | it uses XPI for langpacks, yeah | 19:14 |
| mconnor | but that's the package format, not the output format | 19:14 |
| asac | mconnor: yeah. thats understood. its used as a synonym here. | 19:15 |
| huayra | yeah, xpi like in add-ons files | 19:15 |
| mconnor | as long as it outputs something that matches the in-tree format so we can get it upstream, great | 19:15 |
| huayra | so, what do we do? | 19:15 |
| mconnor | huayra: that's your call | 19:15 |
| mconnor | huayra: talk to the experts though :) | 19:15 |
| huayra | shall I try to get thing s working with the team and see if we vcan use rosetta, or just import the whole thing from mozilla when the translation in their terms is done? | 19:16 |
| asac | huayra: first sort out the admin stuff. then review the tools available on the market and decide | 19:16 |
| huayra | what are thos e tools? | 19:16 |
| mconnor | huayra: Axel and Seth can give better recommendations | 19:16 |
| huayra | can you maybe point me to the tools that are used by other localization teams please | 19:17 |
| huayra | ok | 19:17 |
| huayra | where do I find those guys? | 19:17 |
| huayra | #mozilla ? | 19:17 |
| mconnor | I'd email them | 19:18 |
| mconnor | and they're not likely on freenode | 19:18 |
| mconnor | sethb@mozilla.com and l10n@mozilla.com | 19:18 |
| mconnor | Axel's in Germany, Seth's in California | 19:18 |
| huayra | thnks so much :) | 19:19 |
| asac | omg ... my mailqueue was down again :( | 19:19 |
| asac | thats scary when you dont know which mails didnt go out for how long :( | 19:19 |
| huayra | do you guys know how many string FF3 has? | 19:32 |
| asac | huayra: i can look ;) | 19:33 |
| mconnor | asac: focus on looking at the big set of patches I have issues with, please :) | 19:33 |
| mconnor | huayra: around 2k, at last check | 19:33 |
| asac | 1893 messages + 3821 messages | 19:34 |
| mconnor | 5k? | 19:34 |
| mconnor | 6k? | 19:34 |
| asac | yeah | 19:34 |
| mconnor | huh | 19:34 |
| mconnor | maybe | 19:34 |
| mconnor | I don't remember it being that high | 19:34 |
| mconnor | but I don't translate :) | 19:35 |
| mconnor | asac: you saw my link? | 19:35 |
| asac | mconnor: yes. | 19:35 |
| asac | mconnor: i will start to push bugs tomorrow. 2h a day ... should be just a few days. | 19:36 |
| asac | mconnor: needs discussion should then be done in bugs | 19:36 |
| asac | mconnor: good enough? | 19:37 |
| asac | mconnor: [reed] already pointed out that 16 is required to move some classifier settings to toolkit | 19:37 |
| mconnor | asac: there's better ways to do that than adding another file to parse, fwiw | 19:40 |
| huayra | so 3800 strings? | 19:41 |
| huayra | or just 2k? | 19:41 |
| huayra | kind of fell off the conversation... ;) | 19:41 |
| asac | huayra: 3800 (toolkit) + 1600 (browser) | 19:42 |
| asac | er 1800 | 19:42 |
| huayra | asac excuse my ignorance. I want FF3 translated and all translators speak English. Do I need to strictly translate just 1600 or do I need the toolkit translated as well? | 19:43 |
| asac | huayra: toolkit is required | 19:44 |
| huayra | so 5400 strings is the translation requirement? | 19:44 |
| asac | yes about that amount | 19:44 |
| huayra | thx | 19:44 |
| huayra | :) | 19:44 |
| asac | 5600 | 19:44 |
| armin76 | lol | 19:46 |
| mconnor | asac: filing upstream bugs is the good first step, yeah | 19:47 |
| mconnor | asac: some of this stuff is, well, unnecessary | 19:47 |
| mconnor | asac: my biggest question was that in a couple of the patches you changed stuff inside of OSX #ifdefs, what was up there? | 19:49 |
| asac | mconnor: most likely i tried to make the patch complete ... if that completely doesnt make sense for OSX i was just wrong ;) | 19:50 |
| mconnor | asac: also, having a patch start with "supposedly this does X" is not ever something I want to see | 19:51 |
| mconnor | ever | 19:51 |
| mconnor | either it works or it doesn't :P | 19:51 |
| asac | mconnor: which patch is that? | 19:51 |
| asac | the debian compatibility thing? | 19:51 |
| mconnor | yeah | 19:52 |
| asac | mconnor: i wanted to write "i hate debian for this" there ;) ... and ended up with a more political wording. | 19:54 |
| asac | mconnor: the patch obviously works ... otherwise it wouldnt be in there ;) | 19:54 |
| mconnor | why take it then? | 19:54 |
| asac | mconnor: background: we packaged xulrunner 1.9 and firefox 3.0 more than 6 month before debian did it. | 19:54 |
| asac | mconnor: then they started to make life miserable by doing some slightly different decisions | 19:55 |
| mconnor | asac: so, fun fact | 19:55 |
| asac | mconnor: problem is that when debian says we install stuff at place X ... then all the packages that we automatically sync would either not work | 19:56 |
| asac | or we would have to maintain a diff for them | 19:56 |
| mconnor | man | 19:56 |
| mconnor | you guys should stop depending on Debian | 19:56 |
| asac | mconnor: and thats what debian guy did ;) | 19:56 |
| mconnor | would make life so much easier | 19:56 |
| asac | mconnor: after he noticed that i work for canonical :) | 19:56 |
| asac | mconnor: previously debian xulrunner (1.8) had a patch system ... for 1.9 he eliminated that and now maintains stuff in a private git archive | 19:57 |
| mconnor | man | 19:57 |
| asac | mconnor: so when i want to understand what they did i have to look at the monolithic diff.gz | 19:57 |
| mconnor | I'm having flashbacks | 19:57 |
| mconnor | to the monolithic firefox-1.5 diff | 19:58 |
| mconnor | :P | 19:58 |
| asac | mconnor: firefox 3 is still monolithic. but thats eric as you might remember | 19:58 |
| asac | mike agreed for ages that we want individual patches | 19:58 |
| asac | until i started on ubuntu ;) | 19:58 |
| mconnor | man... | 19:58 |
| mconnor | those guys | 19:58 |
| mconnor | so Mike has a private git repo, with a monolithic diff | 19:59 |
| mconnor | and Eric has a private SVN repo, or something, with a monolithic diff | 19:59 |
| asac | mconnor: yeah ;) | 19:59 |
| asac | mconnor: i think eric has a public git now | 19:59 |
| asac | ;) | 19:59 |
| mconnor | quality software practices there | 19:59 |
| mconnor | lots of transparency | 19:59 |
| * mconnor mumbles something about openssl under his breath | 20:00 | |
| asac | mconnor: eric doesnt understand. mike does, but wants to pretend he doesnt understand :) | 20:00 |
| asac | mconnor: yeah. definitly a good example that we need to be much more skeptical about what debian does | 20:00 |
| asac | mconnor: of course its somehow unique. the majority of debian folks are quite good | 20:01 |
| directhex | pkg-mono are nice! | 20:01 |
| asac | problem is that they are no team players | 20:01 |
| asac | everybody focusses on his pet-package | 20:01 |
| mconnor | asac: yeah, I've noticed | 20:01 |
| mconnor | and they think they're experts | 20:01 |
| asac | and only cares about other things when it becomes a pain to locally workaround | 20:01 |
| mconnor | that's my real worry with downstream | 20:02 |
| mconnor | especially with mozilla, where we have too many dark corners | 20:02 |
| mconnor | its just not sane to assume that 1-2 maintainers will know the right way to implement something | 20:03 |
| mconnor | "Just because it works, doesn't mean its the right solution." | 20:03 |
| mconnor | and stuff where you're adding features that only work in Ubuntu is sadmaking | 20:04 |
| wiki | fta: Hi | 21:09 |
| fta | wiki, hi | 21:16 |
| wiki | the patches in the debian/patches dir,how are they made ?using quilt ? | 21:16 |
| fta | quilt new my_new_patch.patch | 21:19 |
| fta | quilt add mozilla/some/file1 | 21:19 |
| fta | quilt add mozilla/some/file2 | 21:19 |
| fta | quilt diff | 21:19 |
| fta | quilt refresh | 21:19 |
| fta | that's the basics | 21:19 |
| wiki | :) | 21:20 |
| wiki | fta: we released spicebird on 21st | 21:20 |
| fta | excellent | 21:21 |
| fta | of course, you need to edit your files *after* the corresponding add and *before* the refresh | 21:23 |
| wiki | fta: once i upload the files in lp via dput ,they get built themselves ? | 21:26 |
| fta | do you mean in a ppa ? | 21:26 |
| wiki | yeah | 21:26 |
| fta | then yes | 21:27 |
| wiki | fta: how long do these virtual monsters take ?40~45 minutes ? | 21:40 |
| paran | hi. I have for my personal use patched the flashplugin-nonfree package to download and install the new naitive 64bit plugin on amd64. | 21:47 |
| paran | i will send my patch to bug 299146, but what do you think would be a good version number? | 21:48 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 299146 in flashplugin-nonfree "flashplugin-nonfree on amd64 should use pure 64 bit plugin" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/299146 | 21:48 |
| paran | right now I use 10.0.12.36ubuntu2~10.0.d20.7 (where 10.0.d20.7 is the amd64 version) | 21:48 |
| asac | wiki: they start to build quite instantly | 21:51 |
| asac | wiki: then the take the time they need and then it takes about 30 minutes until you can access the .debs | 21:52 |
| wiki | asac: cool | 21:52 |
| asac | paran: we will discuss during UDS how to properly package stuff up | 21:52 |
| asac | paran: we still want the nspluginwrapper option as we also use that for i386 to prevent crashes of core firefox | 21:52 |
| wiki | asac: we use ccache and disctcc on dual core debian etch with j8 flags to build our moz builds. It takes around 10 minutes :) | 21:53 |
| asac | wiki: if its more or less a full mozilla the builds usually take 25-30 minutes | 21:54 |
| asac | if you do more... add something on top ;) | 21:54 |
| wiki | asac: to make a deb for hardy,will it be called a backport ? | 21:55 |
| paran | asac: you mean use nspluginwrapper for all plugins on al arches then? | 21:56 |
| wiki | what if I mention as hardy in the changelog ,how will ppa interpret it ? | 21:56 |
| asac | paran: yes ... (optional for user) | 21:56 |
| asac | paran: so when amd64 is final we will not use nspluginwrapper for cross-arch ... only for out-of-process stuff | 21:57 |
| asac | paran: but what we want in the long run will be discussed during UDS | 21:57 |
| asac | (and how to achive that) | 21:57 |
| asac | paran: so atm if you install flashplugin-nonfree and have nspluginwrapper installed on i386 it will use nspluginwrapper | 21:57 |
| paran | asac: ok. if you do that then please make it on a per plugin basis. the current code always uses nspluginwrapper if it is installed | 21:58 |
| asac | if you dont have nspluginwrapper it will not use it | 21:58 |
| asac | paran: thats one of the points that is not yet clear | 21:58 |
| paran | asac: I will want naitive flash, but might need the wrapper for other 32bit only plugins | 21:58 |
| asac | paran: any ideas how the user is supposed to manage that? | 21:58 |
| asac | we will discuss, but getting more ideas up-front will be helpful i guess | 21:59 |
| paran | you could install both wrapped and unwrapped as alternatives | 22:00 |
| paran | so you could use update-alternative to select | 22:00 |
| paran | asac: I will put the nspluginwrapper code I ripped out back into my package. :) did you have any idea about the version name? | 22:03 |
| asac | paran: depends on where this will end up | 22:04 |
| asac | paran: update-alternative has to die imo :) | 22:04 |
| asac | paran: but the idea of having both installed is nice | 22:04 |
| paran | asac: hehe, why? I think alternatives is really useful, once you learn how to use it. | 22:08 |
| paran | asac: I just want to put some sort of sane version number before I send the patch in. | 22:09 |
| paran | even if you decide to change how stuff work some of my (small) patch might be usefull, like downloading different tarballs dependin on arch | 22:11 |
| asac | paran: we dont need alternatives anymore. you can currently pick one out of many available plugins in ubufox ... this will hopefully later go into the main firefox UI | 22:13 |
| asac | paran: like: http://people.ubuntu.com/~asac/tmp/alt1.png | 22:13 |
| asac | paran: http://people.ubuntu.com/~asac/tmp/alt2.png | 22:13 |
| asac | paran: we would get two entries there for adobe: 1) adobe (native) 2) adobe (nspluginwrapped) | 22:14 |
| paran | asac: that would be nice. | 22:17 |
| asac | paran: yeah. i like it too. only problem we have to sort is that when you install nspluginwrapper post-mortem we would have to wrap already installed plugins too | 22:18 |
| asac | but that can be done quite diligently i think | 22:18 |
| asac | (currently the wrapped stuff is only generated when you install flash after nspluginwrapper) | 22:19 |
| paran | yeah, I know :) | 22:19 |
| paran | however I would recommend keeping the alternatives link in addition to ubufox. there are other browsers that would need that | 22:19 |
| asac | paran: not sure. its really just clutter. konqueror does that on their own anyway | 22:20 |
| asac | epiphany is a use-case agreed | 22:20 |
| asac | but then ... thats a missing feature in epiphany i guess and in the long run it will use nspluginwrapper | 22:20 |
| asac | err | 22:21 |
| asac | it will use webkit ;) | 22:21 |
| asac | thats what i wanted to say | 22:21 |
| asac | but well | 22:21 |
| asac | alternatives dont hurt for this mechanism | 22:21 |
| asac | its just that they regularly break on users system | 22:21 |
| paran | would have been better if it were more integrated with dpkg, is is easy to mess it up with postinst/prerm scripts | 22:29 |
| asac | paran: maybe. but dpkg is from hell ... so fixing that there isnt easy either ;) | 22:32 |
| paran | anyway, please don't remove the alternative for plugins unless you at least get the plugin chooser into the "normal" firefox package. | 22:32 |
| asac | paran: also even if you do it right, alternatives have strange behaviour | 22:32 |
| asac | for instance if you --remove the last option it will remember that you selected nothing and when -install a new alternative it will not select the only one that exists then. | 22:32 |
| paran | I don't install ubufox because it pulls in a ton of gnome stuff | 22:32 |
| asac | paran: thats a different issue | 22:33 |
| asac | apturl needs to be fixed | 22:33 |
| asac | but yeah | 22:33 |
| asac | but as i said. this stuff is so cool that it belongs in the main firefox UI anyway | 22:33 |
| paran | :) | 22:35 |
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