[00:01] erk. so you've really gone to mac! [00:02] * jdong whistles innocently on that note too... [00:02] Yeah. It's not terrible. I never thought I would though. [00:02] But it's nice to now only be a part-time geek. [00:03] I know, I thought I'd hate not having to kill/restart pulse, watch flickering movies, have fast user switching bring up green-and-red blinking blocks all over the screen... [00:03] now I lost my train of thought *ducks* [00:03] It's not all bad though jdong. [00:04] no no, there's things I love deeply about both OSes [00:04] and I end up booting between them several times a day :) [00:04] KDE4 really raised the bar on sexy simplicity and functionality on the desktop. [00:05] Also, OSX is still running on a core of Free Software. It's a really neat way to do Unix. [00:05] not to mention you can get most of the FOSS you want on OS X. [00:05] Oh yeah. [00:05] it's a pretty normal gcc-toolchain UNIX machine [00:06] I just wish that Darwin were actually usable outside of OSX. [00:06] puredarwin is working on that again. [00:06] I wanted to give it a shot over thanksgiving. [00:06] Yeah, but they've got an awful lot of catch-up. [00:06] Especially on the #1 impediment to Free Software: hardware interfaces. [00:06] absolutely [00:07] Apple never really released a full bootable stack for 10.5 [00:07] Have any of you actually put up a visual keyboard and watched it while you're typing? [00:07] It's kinda crazy. [00:07] heh [00:10] Ack, I've gotta go, time to play with my kid. I'll be back in a few hours. Later for now. [00:12] ok, so I've worked out that this is the kde3 khtml, not the kde4 one [00:12] I can't find any cmake files in the kdelibs4-dev package, do they live elsewhere, or was kde3 not cmake? [00:12] kde3 was autotools all the way [00:13] cmake was a blessing of kde4 [00:13] kubotu: chat about for cmake [00:13] for cmake that is too late for Intrepid, especially since the rest of 4.2, but my history doesn't go back and check the bzr import if you can remove that pesky windowpreview class and get their bloody nose now [00:14] kubotu: chat about thank the [00:14] thank the almighty mark shuttleworth for cmake [00:14] heh [00:14] so what generates configure.in out of configure.in.in? [00:28] it's ok, I think I've tracked it down === jjesse_ is now known as jjesse [02:24] seele: thanks [02:25] np === santiago-ve is now known as foursixnine === foursixnine is now known as santiago-ve [03:29] !info digikam-kde4 [03:29] Package digikam-kde4 does not exist in intrepid [03:31] what happened to that? [03:34] yuriy: is it not still in the members repo? [03:35] !info digikam-kde4 kubuntu-members-kde4 [03:35] Package digikam-kde4 does not exist in kubuntu-members-kde4 [03:35] maybe not... [03:52] So what do you do [03:52] if when you update a package suddenly there aren't any files in a specific package? [03:53] like if there was a -dev package with like 3 C header files, and then all of that moved to libplasma where it belonged [03:54] Would you just leave it be? Maybe make it a binary transitional package to the main package? Remove the binary package completely and set a conflict/replace on it? [03:56] yuriy: the betas started depending on kde 4.2 so we removed it from the archives as to not have an old beta in intrepid final [04:35] JontheEchidna, hola === mcasadevall is now known as NCommander [04:36] JontheEchidna: hi === robotgee1 is now known as robotgeek [05:04] look out, JontheEchidna is talking tohimself again... [05:05] * JontheEchidna grabs an alcoholic beverage [05:05] kubotu chat about an alcoholic beverage [05:05] incorrect usage, ask for help using 'kubotu: help chat' [05:05] kubotu chat about alcoholic beverage [05:05] I can't :( [05:05] kubotu chat [05:06] I used to have more than just complain on a live CD BEFORE you stumbled upon the debian package gets kicked/replaced [05:10] That statement makes little sense... [05:10] And I don't think I'm too drunk to read yet. [05:10] It's a markov-chain type AI [05:10] Though I'm working on solving that problem. [05:11] Ah. That sounds like it's something that I AM too drunk to understand at the moment. [05:11] it records everything in the chat, and then chats about it when you tell it to [05:11] kubotu: chat [05:11] oh dear [05:11] kubotu: chat [05:11] I need to do Unix. [05:11] kubotu: chat [05:11] sorry Kookies [05:12] Humor may vary(tm) [05:12] Hah [05:12] Using Unix as a euphemism for excreting waste.... classic. [05:35] o_o; [05:37] Trop graphique? [05:49] what's the planned date for 4.2 in intrepid? [05:50] I believe there's already a group with packages on LP for that. [05:50] !KDE4.2 [05:50] Sorry, I don't know anything about KDE4.2 [05:50] !4.2 [05:50] Sorry, I don't know anything about 4.2 [05:54] ah, okay [05:54] was just curious [05:55] !neon [05:55] The Neon Project provides daily Amarok and KDE 4 trunk builds as packages for Kubuntu | See http://amarok.kde.org/wiki/User:Apachelogger/Project_Neon and http://amarok.kde.org/wiki/User:Apachelogger/Project_Neon/KDE for more [06:01] Eh, I try to avoid using nightlies on my desktop, too great a potential for issues === KingDread is now known as DreadKnight [06:53] i never get any new stuff from neon, not sure why [06:54] i am confused [08:34] Ashex, I've got a link somewhere [08:35] Trouble, for info on the 4.2 release to supported repos? [08:35] Yea. Neon's build of KDE 4.2 beta is alright for looking at 4.2, but it's not ready to replace KDE 4.1.x [08:36] There are no applications on the application menu for a start [08:36] http://kubuntuforums.net/forums/index.php?topic=3099595.0 [08:36] In short packages for Intrepid will be put in to the kubuntu-experimental PPA [08:37] I'm waiting eagerly for the beta to appear in the PPA :) [08:37] The Kubuntu devs are pretty speedy [08:38] In the past they've released something less than two days are KDE is released [08:38] Mostly one day [08:38] excellent [08:38] Indeed! [08:38] I'll just wait a few days then [08:38] KDE 4.1 has been pretty rubbish [08:39] Yeah, I made some noise on launchpad for awhile [08:39] Good man :) [08:39] I read up on things and figured I'd wait for at least 4.2 before I started filing bugs [08:39] The task bar has been pretty useless for me without multiple row layout [08:39] er, filing usability bugs and the like [08:39] That's one of my biggest gripes [08:40] along with the lack of the "quicklaunch" applet [08:40] Yea, so many things missing *sigh* [08:41] Still if the KDE team had to get 4.0 and 4.1 out there with missing functionality to gain support then so be it. [08:41] Has hopefully resulted in a better product now it's starting to mature a little [08:41] my only real concern is that there's been a dangerous amount of blurring of the line between dev ready and user ready [08:42] Oh and Kopete doesn't have MSN support in the Neon builds. I'm hoping this is only the Neon build and not the beta in general [08:42] I think 4.0 was only really intended for developers so they could move applications to it [08:42] Ashex, I agree with you there [08:42] Playing a risky game [08:43] Kopete has support for msn in stable, so it should be in 4.2.1 [08:44] You don't think MSN support will be in the final 4.2.0 release? [08:44] er, that's what I meant [08:44] in my head x.x.1 means beta 1 for some reason [08:45] Oh cool [08:45] http://mattr.info:8080/blog/2008/11/15/new-msn-plugin-for-kopete/ [08:45] It will be nice to see Kopete using the latest protocol! [08:46] excellent [08:46] I need to move back over to kopete [08:46] I stopped using it in hardy because of a bug that caused it to crash [08:46] which reminds me, I need to close that bug [08:46] If he put it in to trunk on the 15th Nov, then I'd expect to see it in the betas, unless there is a problem :( [08:47] The trunk was frozen on the 18th Nov [08:48] or the 17th [08:48] yeah, it should be in [08:48] "I have installed them a few hours ago. They work nicely, but you have to bear in mind that Kopete does not have MSN support out of the box because libmsn (on which now it depends for Messenger support) is not packaged yet AFAIK." [08:48] Poop :( [08:49] Oh well [08:49] Just have to be patient ;-) [08:49] eh, drop it in /usr/local/lib for now I guess [09:08] oh cool, told the system to shutdown. KDE decided to shtudown and leave everything else running [10:21] oh hai === _neversfelde is now known as neversfelde [11:50] apachelogger: OMG OMG OMG OMG [11:50] apachelogger: I have sound in NEON!!!!! [11:50] apachelogger: whatever you did: *kiss* [11:50] awww [11:50] * Nightrose sends email to the neon list [12:00] * jussi01 waves [12:21] Nightrose: I told you, [12:21] batman took care of it [12:21] ;-) [12:25] hm [12:26] nixternal: you mc people now do micro meetings? :P [12:27] hey all [12:27] apachelogger: what is the status of kde4.2 beta1 packages for kubuntu ? [12:28] WIP [12:28] apachelogger: I'll have my appartment, and therefore internet connection in 3 weeks, so I can't really work in the meantime [12:28] apachelogger: oki [12:28] apachelogger: I'll be probably a lot more usefull in one month.... [12:29] apachelogger: will that be dedicated ppa ? backports ? [12:29] Tonio_: jaunty [12:29] we didn't even start intrepid yet [12:29] but if, when we finished the intrepid packages they are going to appear in the kubuntu-experimental PPA [12:31] oki [12:42] !info openbabel jaunty [12:42] openbabel (source: openbabel): Chemical toolbox utilities. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.2.0-2 (jaunty), package size 107 kB, installed size 464 kB [12:43] !info libgps-dev [12:43] !info libgps-dev jaunty [12:43] libgps-dev (source: gpsd): C library for communicating with GPS devices (development files). In component universe, is optional. Version 2.37-4 (intrepid), package size 124 kB, installed size 368 kB [12:43] libgps-dev (source: gpsd): C library for communicating with GPS devices (development files). In component universe, is optional. Version 2.37-6 (jaunty), package size 125 kB, installed size 368 kB [12:44] JontheEchidna: a) do we have MIRs for those b) if not, does Arby file them? c) if not, we at least need reports about the missing functionallity [12:44] !info libopenbabel-dev jaunty [12:44] libopenbabel-dev (source: openbabel): Chemical toolbox library (development files). In component main, is optional. Version 2.2.0-2 (jaunty), package size 121 kB, installed size 696 kB [12:44] weird that is [13:00] anyone wanna get started with development? [13:01] of? [13:02] anything [13:02] mostly Kubuntu I guess :P [13:03] oh [13:05] apachelogger: sure, getting started would be nice (;) [13:06] I keep telling that to myself [13:06] I gave up here already [13:06] * apachelogger is wondering if vorian will ever come back [13:08] hm, back in the days I spent my time adding crappy software to the archives [13:08] now I am spending it removing crappy software [13:24] * jussi01 huggles apachelogger [13:28] apachelogger: VistaUser wants to get started with development... [13:28] yah [13:28] Any motus around that can ack bug 301083? [13:28] Launchpad bug 301083 in plasmoid-lancelot "Request for removal from archive (plasmoid-lancelot)" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/301083 [13:29] ...unless apachelogger has already done so, lol [13:30] JontheEchidna explain VistaUser how to get started with development :P [13:31] kaider-kde4 => kdesdk (move dummy package + file package removal request [13:31] huh lol [13:32] hm, probably sounds easier than it is [13:32] maybe [13:32] VistaUser: So, you want to get started with development [13:32] yah [13:32] JontheEchidna: getting started towards that particular task [13:32] gettinga dummy package, adding it to kdesdk filing a package removal request [13:32] never did it before but always had an intrest in how lines of letters and numbers can make a prog [13:33] What we do here is take KDE or KDE-related software and make sure that our users get it in the best way possible [13:33] oo [13:33] sounds cool [13:33] yup [13:34] To do that we take the source code that the various developers distribute [13:34] oo kk [13:34] And add instructions to the source that we call "packaging" [13:34] kk [13:34] also known as mindraping [13:35] This packaging tells us how the program is to be built, installed, and divided into binary packages [13:35] so u take a source code and u just add to it ? [13:35] Well, you don't add to it willy-nilly [13:35] lol [13:35] In most cases the work has been done for us [13:35] k [13:35] by previous developers [13:36] ok [13:36] But sometimes our packaging has bugs in it [13:36] how do u get rid of bugs? [13:36] VistaUser: Ubuntu is mostly distributing and packaging, not *that* much development. They do fix the occassional bug, etc. but they tend to not write the software in the first place (with exceptions). [13:37] * JontheEchidna treis to find the list of junior jobs [13:37] ooo [13:37] VistaUser: It depends on the bug [13:38] ok [13:38] * JontheEchidna tries to find a good easy one [13:38] lol [13:38] But yeah, mainly we fix packaging bugs, update software packaging for new versions of software [13:39] And we also create packaging for new software not yet in *buntu [13:39] oo [13:39] JontheEchidna: I just posted you a junior job :P [13:40] thats cool vut i dont know python that well [13:40] the really cool people use ruby anyway [13:40] lol [13:40] is it harder to learn then python lol [13:41] apachelogger: so what is up with kaider-kde4? [13:41] it is a transitional package [13:41] or rather... it is a source package creating _only_ a transitional package to lokalize [13:42] so the transitional package should be moved to kdesdk [13:42] it is in kdesdk according to apt-cache show [13:42] and then the kaider-kde4 source should be kicked out of the archives [13:42] JontheEchidna: then we just need a package removal request [13:42] ok [13:42] idk what u guys talking about but it sounds intresting lol [13:43] VistaUser: in KDE4 a localization program called "kaider" got it's name changed to "lokalize" [13:43] ooooo [13:43] okie dokie [13:44] some say KDE4 is to buggy [13:44] This isn't a bug so much as just routine maintenence [13:44] ooo [13:44] Anyway, for KDE 4.0 it was released on its own, as kaider-kde4 [13:44] can u guys fix? [13:45] but then its name got changed to lokalize in KDE 4.1 [13:45] ooo [13:45] so we still have the source for the old kaider-kde4 lying around in the archives [13:45] ok [13:45] What we need to do is to tell the archive admins to delete the old source package [13:46] i am bgoing to try and create my own bot [13:46] By filing a request for removal bug report [13:46] oo [13:46] Here is one I filed for a plasmoid that used to have its own separate package but now is part of kdeplasma-addons: bug 301083 [13:46] Launchpad bug 301083 in plasmoid-lancelot "Request for removal from archive (plasmoid-lancelot)" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/301083 [13:47] oo [13:47] You would file a similar report, with the reason being that kaider was renamed lokalize and put inside the kdesdk KDE module [13:48] and that shouldnt have happened? [13:48] what shouldn't had happened? [13:48] *have [13:48] kaider being put in the kdesdk KDE module [13:49] Oh, it's perfectly fine for software to change its name and move around [13:49] ooo kk [13:49] The bug tracker is just a formal way for us to tell the archive admins to remove the source package [13:49] ooo ok [13:53] what type of ubuntu or linux or w/e u guys running [13:53] !u [13:53] Unless you're Dutch or Flemish, or a government officer, the letter 'U' is not a pronoun. If you want to be taken more seriously, please bother to type out the extra letters in "you". The same goes for "are", "why", "because", "anyone", and so on.. [13:54] * vvinet snicker [13:55] lol [13:55] What type of ubuntu or linux "you" guys running [13:55] Kubuntu of course? [13:55] :P [13:55] ok [13:56] i am trying to try out all of the ubuntus out there and see which fits me best [13:56] What are YOU running, VistaUser? [13:56] ubuntu [13:56] VistaUser: That is a strange question to ask in a channel reserved for kubuntu developers. [13:57] lol i know i am tryintg to get drivers and stuff for kubuntu [13:57] cause i had a hard time with ubuntu seeing if drivers are compatible with kubuntu [13:57] o_O [13:58] The drivers are exactly the same [13:58] o really lol [13:58] yes [13:58] i guess i can upgrade [13:58] VistaUser: The difference between kubuntu and ubuntu is in one package (plus its dependencies). The base and thus the drivers needed is identical. [13:59] oo kk [13:59] VistaUser: for other ways you can help Kubuntu (not necessarily through packaging, see here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingKubuntu [13:59] i learned alot today just by switching OS [13:59] VistaUser: So if you want to try kubuntu: "sudo aptitude install kubuntu-desktop" and then change the desktop environment to start in the login screen. [14:00] thats all i have to do [14:00] too simple? :) [14:00] kind of [14:00] i thought i had to burn an ISO [14:01] brb i am going to upgrade lol [14:03] this is the first time i stayed up passed my bedtime [14:03] VistaUser: kubuntu, ubuntu, xubuntu, edubuntu, etc. all share the same base with more or less bells and whistles added. So you can even have all of them installed at the same time and switch between them. [14:03] like partitioning the hard drive? [14:04] or install all and go between them [14:06] what is default display manager??? gdm or kdm [14:06] you choose [14:06] oo kk [14:07] gdm is from gnome kdm from kde but they do the same thing [14:07] oo kk [14:08] k i am guessing i have to restart after i move to kbuntu? [14:09] nah, just log out and choose KDE as your session type [14:09] crtl + alt + backspace? [14:10] just select logout normally [14:10] brb [14:10] oo ok lol [14:15] ok am i in right channel [14:19] when is available kde 4.2 beta1 for intrepid? [14:21] r0uzic: So far it is not fully available for jaunty:-( [14:22] hunger: any beta? :( [14:23] r0uzic: I think the beta is partially available. Only kdelibs/kdepimlibs/kdebase afaict though. [14:23] at least the kdeutils and stuff still are based on kde 4.1.x in my aptitude. [14:23] oks, thanks hunger [14:25] hunger [14:40] anyone there that can help me install KDE4.1 [14:45] VistaUser: If you are on intrepid then I already gave you all the commands needed. [14:45] really [14:46] even to get to KDE [14:46] VistaUser: Log out, check for menu/setup or similar buttons on the login screen and select session type KDE there. [14:47] ooo [14:47] ok ty [14:47] i didnt know thats what i was supposed to do [14:47] i thought i can just log in [14:48] VistaUser: You can "switch user" with the system menu in grome. [14:48] kk [14:48] VistaUser: That should give you a new login prompt without logging out. [14:48] ok [14:48] VistaUser: But that is actually a topic more suited for the non-developer channel:-) [14:49] lol\ [14:49] i know u guys inly ones active [14:49] i should go to bed its 5 in the morning [14:55] !info libspeex-dev [14:55] libspeex-dev (source: speex): The Speex codec library development files. In component main, is optional. Version 1.2~beta4-2 (intrepid), package size 68 kB, installed size 236 kB [15:46] apachelogger: 'oi! [15:52] Sime: you around? [16:01] anyone know how to add contextmenu items to a KSystemTrayIcon in pykde/pyqt? I can't seem to get it figured out [16:16] Tm_T: oh? [16:17] rgreening: take a look at power-manager-guidance I'd do [16:19] apachelogger: ok, I'll have a peek... [16:52] apachelogger: thanks. that example helped a lot. [16:56] What is up with the kde 4.2 beta update for jaunty? Did it get stuck? [17:26] apachelogger: we have meetings every wednesday [17:26] nixternal: where are these meetings hold? [17:27] hunger: very slow progress [17:27] apachelogger: on IRC now...we used to do them on Skype [17:27] oh dear... how open :P [17:27] you get the raw log when it is over :p [18:04] is there a fix anywhere for the evil "corrupt icons in the plasma system tray" bug? [18:05] Sime: supposedly it's fixed in KDE 4.2, otherwise you can switch virtual terminals [18:06] works like a charm here in neon [18:06] so should be fine in trunk [18:06] and on intrepid? [18:06] the vt-switch trick is the only workaround [18:07] vt-switch has no effect here. [18:07] my desktop machine works fine. [18:07] the aspire 1 doesn't. [18:11] hmm [18:11] is the whole icon corrupted or just the background? [18:19] got the same here (intrepid + 4.1.3) ... background corrupted, and vt-switch doesn't change anything [18:45] apachelogger: gethotnewstuff works or not work in neon-kde? [18:47] dunno [18:51] apachelogger: ok, then I'd say "no" [18:51] Tm_T: I will be awaiting your problem analysis then :P [18:52] 1741.52 < natschil> Half-Left : I have kde 4.2 beta from the neon repos for ubuntu, but the get hot new stuff feature doesn't work [18:52] apachelogger: I live in trunk, so cannot say about neon [18:53] Tm_T: well, knowing what could cause the nonworking would already be a lot [18:53] apachelogger: I cannot say (:) [18:53] 1745.55 < natschil> it has never worked with neon before, but I thought that it had been disabled or something, but now with beta it still doesn't work, so Im slowly suspecting something is wrong [18:54] I'm only a messenger [18:54] Tm_T: same here [18:54] heh [18:55] well, someone gotta do an investigation [18:55] apachelogger: i am fixing parley for you right now ;-) [18:55] recompiling currently [18:55] to see if everything is ok [18:58] JontheEchidna: all of the icons are corrupt. (random bits of other images etc) [18:58] Sime: I don't think there's anything can be done about it, Plasma people blame it all on X (probably fairly) [18:59] and it just depends on your X drivers and if X is in a good or bad mood that day [18:59] it is kind of a showstopper here. [18:59] we can't change the plasma visual to plain RGB or something? [19:00] not in 4.1 as far as I know [19:19] Plasma shouldn't use argb visuals if desktop effects are off [20:00] Nightrose++ [20:00] :) [20:02] waaaaaaaaaaaaaah [20:02] 4.2 got a pacman clone [20:02] ! [20:02] hooray \o/ [20:02] and a robots clone! [20:03] now all that is left is space invaders ;-) [20:05] hi === bastian_ is now known as OculusAquilae [20:06] how are kde 4.2 beta 1 packages going? [20:06] 4.2 beta1? [20:06] is it time already? [20:07] apachelogger: http://kde.org/announcements/announce-4.2-beta1.php [20:07] omg [20:07] OculusAquilae: oh wells, it's not of any use anyway [20:08] apachelogger: ??? [20:08] *shrug* [20:08]