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=== ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Current meeting: Ubuntu Mobile Team Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 04 Dec 13:00: Desktop Team | 04 Dec 14:00: Ubuntu Java | 15 Dec 19:00: LoCo Council | 16 Dec 01:00: Forum Council | 16 Dec 11:00: Community Council | ||
rochdi | Hi | 12:42 |
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=== ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Current meeting: Desktop Team Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 04 Dec 14:00: Ubuntu Java | 15 Dec 19:00: LoCo Council | 16 Dec 01:00: Forum Council | 16 Dec 11:00: Community Council | ||
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Koon | who's here for the Java meeting ? | 14:00 |
=== ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Current meeting: Ubuntu Java Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 15 Dec 19:00: LoCo Council | 16 Dec 01:00: Forum Council | 16 Dec 11:00: Community Council | ||
* robilad waves | 14:00 | |
persia | o/ | 14:00 |
* Koon pings slytherin | 14:01 | |
Koon | o/ | 14:02 |
Koon | #startmeeting | 14:02 |
MootBot | Meeting started at 08:02. The chair is Koon. | 14:02 |
MootBot | Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] | 14:02 |
Koon | Nothing special except Roadmap review on the Agenda | 14:03 |
Koon | [TOPIC] Java on the server stack | 14:03 |
MootBot | New Topic: Java on the server stack | 14:03 |
Koon | robilad: any progress to report ? | 14:03 |
robilad | Koon: I am just unclawing myself from a heap of mail | 14:04 |
robilad | so no, not really. | 14:04 |
robilad | glassfish v3 just got released a while ago | 14:04 |
robilad | so I asked around for the source code tarball | 14:05 |
persia | I noticed https://blueprints.launchpad.net/glassfish/+spec/server-j2ee-container is scheduled for UDS, which might be interesting | 14:05 |
robilad | got a description of the tags to use to check it out | 14:05 |
robilad | it uses maven extensively to build | 14:05 |
Koon | persia: interesting yes, I'll try to join remotely that one | 14:06 |
robilad | (like pretty much anything else out there) | 14:06 |
Koon | robilad: any clue on the final number of external JARs needed ? | 14:06 |
robilad | and I haven't been able to find the time to rebuild the final release and count them yet. | 14:06 |
Koon | maven should no longer be an obstacle, but library packaging will sure be | 14:07 |
robilad | ah, great! | 14:07 |
Koon | robilad: are you coming at UDS ? | 14:07 |
robilad | I missed that completely, sorry. | 14:07 |
robilad | unfortunately, no - I'llbe presenting at devoxx next week in belgium | 14:07 |
robilad | but I'll try to join in remotely | 14:08 |
Koon | ok, anything else to report on that front ? | 14:08 |
robilad | I know that joe darcy (openjdk) was planning to come over, I don't know who'll be there from glassfish, etc. | 14:08 |
Koon | At least Abhijit, apparently. | 14:09 |
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robilad | not from me - I saw there was some progress on the blueprints, and I need to look at them. | 14:09 |
robilad | cool | 14:09 |
Koon | [TOPIC] Move to universe | 14:09 |
robilad | then I'll get in touch with him. | 14:09 |
MootBot | New Topic: Move to universe | 14:09 |
Koon | slytherin: ^ | 14:09 |
slytherin | We have progressed slowly on that front in last week. But we should have major progress this week if jboss gets built. | 14:10 |
slytherin | once jboss is built all the jboss packages will move to universe. | 14:10 |
Koon | slytherin: good, one more contender for the J2EE space :) | 14:11 |
robilad | nice! | 14:11 |
slytherin | Koon: right, it tool two release cycles for this contender to enter the race. :-P | 14:11 |
Koon | note that I was contacted by the Geronimo devs that would really want to be in too | 14:11 |
slytherin | Koon: Nice. Tell them not to use maven for building. :-D | 14:12 |
Koon | but their build system heavily relies on Maven + lots and lots of JARs | 14:12 |
persia | So we'll have three J2EE containers? | 14:12 |
Koon | so it's a LOT of work to package | 14:12 |
Koon | and in the end it might even not work, since they expressely test a specific combination of those 3rd party jars | 14:13 |
Koon | persia: at that point we have 0.9 | 14:13 |
Koon | th rest is just talk | 14:14 |
Koon | slytherin: anything else on that front ? | 14:14 |
slytherin | Koon: Not much. Will be filing bug for libjogl-java today and worldwind eventually. | 14:14 |
Koon | ok | 14:15 |
Koon | [TOPIC] Maven build support | 14:15 |
MootBot | New Topic: Maven build support | 14:15 |
Koon | Lots of progress on that front. | 14:15 |
* robilad looks forward to hearing all about it | 14:16 | |
Koon | Ludovic Claude basically started to implement tools | 14:16 |
Koon | remember that we settled for a system where we rebuild the maven repo at build-time using symlinks to the real system JARs | 14:16 |
Koon | Ludovic created tools to help in that process | 14:17 |
robilad | nice - that's what maven-helper does? | 14:17 |
Koon | mvn-go-offline downloads all dependencies | 14:17 |
Koon | mvn-debianize walks through those dependencies and asks where they should point in the filesystem | 14:17 |
Koon | that builds a maven-depmap.xml file that you ship in debian/ | 14:18 |
Koon | then in debian/rules: | 14:18 |
Koon | (first you add maven-helper in your build-deps) | 14:18 |
Koon | mh_prepare_repo reconstructs the POM files and the symlink | 14:19 |
Koon | mh_mvn calls mvn with the right options | 14:19 |
Koon | mh_clean cleans up | 14:19 |
robilad | very cool | 14:19 |
Koon | I updated the spec accordingly | 14:19 |
robilad | thanks | 14:19 |
Koon | yes, he did a great job | 14:19 |
Koon | now he started packaging the missing libraries | 14:19 |
Koon | those that every maven build will use | 14:20 |
Koon | he needs help in that area, since he is missing debian packaging experience | 14:20 |
slytherin | just some heads up, Ludovic contacted me about sponsorship/review/help for the packaging. I hope to find some time this weekend. | 14:20 |
Koon | slytherin: that's great ! | 14:21 |
Koon | so this is showing good progress | 14:21 |
robilad | that's really cool - it's in ludovic's PPA? | 14:22 |
Koon | The spec contains pointers to current work | 14:22 |
Koon | the mh_tools are in his PPA | 14:22 |
Koon | (maven-helper) | 14:22 |
robilad | ok, thanks! | 14:23 |
Koon | the mvn-* tools are installed manually | 14:23 |
Koon | since we are missing a few JARs | 14:23 |
Koon | any other question on that topic ? | 14:23 |
slytherin | none form my side | 14:24 |
Koon | [TOPIC] Kill Sun Java 5 | 14:24 |
MootBot | New Topic: Kill Sun Java 5 | 14:24 |
persia | Perhaps "retire" might be a better word? | 14:24 |
Koon | slytherin: ^ | 14:25 |
slytherin | I haven't found time to draft a spec. | 14:25 |
Koon | I've talked about it in the server team, and we might want to keep Java 5 around, as an option | 14:26 |
Koon | but we should definitely make sure all software works with openjdk6 | 14:26 |
Koon | and doesn't require an older version | 14:26 |
slytherin | Koon: Anything specific that does not work with Java 6? | 14:27 |
persia | So perhaps the main thrust of the effort should be on removing the requirement for 1.4 and 5, but not actually removing them? | 14:27 |
Koon | slytherin: as an example, I used to build Tomcat6 at Java 6 bytecode level | 14:27 |
Koon | and I received several requests to build at Java 5 | 14:27 |
Koon | because some people have application code that doesn't work well in java 6 | 14:28 |
slytherin | Koon: But you can do that with java 6 as well. You don't need java 5 for building at source level 5 | 14:28 |
Koon | or wasn't certified for it | 14:28 |
Koon | they want to run Tomcat6 with a Java 5 jre | 14:28 |
slytherin | ok. | 14:28 |
Koon | (I still build with openjdk-6) | 14:28 |
slytherin | I am fine with keeping it around if we are going to migrate all rdepends. | 14:28 |
Koon | yes, that needs to be done | 14:29 |
slytherin | But then we will have to remove it at start of next cycle so that no Debian packages with java 5 as build dep land in Ubuntu. | 14:29 |
persia | Might also be interesting to update the long description to suggest users try a newer JRE | 14:29 |
Koon | persia: is it an acceptable usage of long descriptions ? | 14:30 |
Koon | "DON'T USE ME" :) | 14:31 |
persia | Well, "This package represents an older implementation. Most users will be better served by A or B" | 14:31 |
Koon | slytherin: maybe integrate that in the retire spec ^ | 14:33 |
slytherin | Koon: sure | 14:33 |
Koon | ok, anything else on that ? | 14:34 |
slytherin | nope | 14:35 |
Koon | [TOPIC] Open discussion | 14:35 |
MootBot | New Topic: Open discussion | 14:35 |
persia | I noticed https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/java-for-jaunty yesterday, which might be interesting, although most of us are only attending via VoIP. | 14:35 |
robilad | the major thing for 7 on sun's side will be the new modules system to be used to split the jdk into ideas akin to those we bounced around here | 14:36 |
Koon | which track is it on ? | 14:36 |
persia | I suspect foundations, but base that entirely on the identity of the assignee | 14:37 |
Koon | Thursday, 3pm | 14:37 |
robilad | mr posted a series of blogs describing the ideas behind it: http://blogs.sun.com/mr/entry/massive_monolithic_jdk , http://blogs.sun.com/mr/entry/packaging_java_code , http://blogs.sun.com/mr/entry/modular_java_platform and http://blogs.sun.com/mr/entry/jigsaw | 14:38 |
persia | That's 23:00 UTC? | 14:38 |
Koon | persia: I think so | 14:38 |
robilad | also mentions early 2010 for delivering 7. | 14:39 |
Koon | server-j2ee-container wasn't accepted for a UDS session | 14:39 |
persia | Well, that's not entirely bad, as we've already some plans for those directions, not documented in that spec. | 14:40 |
Koon | robilad: interesting pointers, thx | 14:41 |
Koon | anything else to add ? | 14:41 |
robilad | nothing from my side. | 14:41 |
robilad | more on that next week, once I've had a chance to digest it all. | 14:42 |
Koon | [TOPIC] Next meeting | 14:42 |
MootBot | New Topic: Next meeting | 14:42 |
Koon | With UDS next week, do we skip the team meeting ? | 14:42 |
persia | Are enough of us going to UDS that we're blocked? Meeting is at 6:00am in the UDS timezone. | 14:43 |
persia | Alternately, are we expecting to be sufficiently distracted by other things that we're not expecting progress for next week? | 14:44 |
slytherin | can anyone please point me to UDS schedule and the listening arrangement? | 14:44 |
Koon | slytherin: it's dificult to see if you don't register as attending | 14:44 |
persia | Has it been posted? Usually happens only a couple days in advance (although I'm still behind on email) | 14:44 |
Koon | it's still a moving target | 14:45 |
slytherin | Ok. I thought it was already posted. | 14:45 |
slytherin | I believe we should have meeting next week to keep watch on maven progress at least. | 14:45 |
Koon | yes. | 14:45 |
Koon | next week, same time, same place | 14:45 |
Koon | ? | 14:45 |
slytherin | right | 14:46 |
Koon | slytherin: I'm interested in getting the listening details too, when I have them I'll forward to you. | 14:46 |
persia | I'm good for that. | 14:46 |
slytherin | Koon: sure | 14:46 |
persia | The details are usually put on the UDS wiki page, and often sent to ubuntu-devel@ | 14:46 |
Koon | ok, have a great week, and persia, have a good UDS trip. | 14:47 |
Koon | #endmeeting | 14:47 |
MootBot | Meeting finished at 08:47. | 14:47 |
Koon | persia, slytherin: one of you can chair next week ? | 14:48 |
slytherin | Koon: I can. | 14:48 |
persia | slytherin, Let me know if something comes up, as I'm also available. | 14:48 |
Koon | slytherin: great. Since my wife can give birth anytime, I prefer to delegate. | 14:48 |
robilad | all the best! | 14:49 |
slytherin | Koon: all the best. :-) | 14:49 |
slytherin | persia: Sure | 14:49 |
Koon | thx! | 14:51 |
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=== ubottu changed the topic of #ubuntu-meeting to: Calendar: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event | Logs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/ | 15 Dec 19:00: LoCo Council | 16 Dec 01:00: Forum Council | 16 Dec 11:00: Community Council |
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